After the 4.4.3 AT&T Update, is switching runtime from Dalvik to ART more recommended than before the update? In other words, will you see more benefits and less downsides to switching?
I've read posts about switching the runtime from Dalvik to ART before the update and some have said they switched back to Dalvik due to some performance issues and some app incompatibility. Has this changed at all after the update?
Its still not 100% stable and some apps do not like it at all...this is why its not the default runtime yet, possibly in "L" but for now its still buggy imo and not much if any better than dalvik runtimes
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I find that when I flash my phone, with lets say the latest synergy, my phone will work amazingly well. Very snappy, with no lag. After a few days of use, no matter what Rom I'm on, the phone becomes less responsive, and i notice a much greater deal of lag and delays.
My phone is pretty active. It runs K9 Mail, and Touchdown Exchange. Both apps together most likely see nearly 250-500 e-mails a day. I have both set to delete mail more than 2 months old. You can see my other apps here: http://www.appbrain.com/user/DeMiNe0/apps-on-the-pg86100
I'm assuming the slowdown is caused by the numerous caches on the phone. If I clear my caches everything tends to speed back up for a few days. Is this normal for Android? I'm assuming it is(Atleast for HTC Devices), as I had this issue with my OG Evo too. Are there apps that will manage your cache so that this issue happens less often? It's just a pain having to dump my caches and then waiting 15-20 minutes for the phone to restart.
DeMiNe0 said:
I find that when I flash my phone, with lets say the latest synergy, my phone will work amazingly well. Very snappy, with no lag. After a few days of use, no matter what Rom I'm on, the phone becomes less responsive, and i notice a much greater deal of lag and delays.
My phone is pretty active. It runs K9 Mail, and Touchdown Exchange. Both apps together most likely see nearly 250-500 e-mails a day. I have both set to delete mail more than 2 months old. You can see my other apps here: http://www.appbrain.com/user/DeMiNe0/apps-on-the-pg86100
I'm assuming the slowdown is caused by the numerous caches on the phone. If I clear my caches everything tends to speed back up for a few days. Is this normal for Android? I'm assuming it is(Atleast for HTC Devices), as I had this issue with my OG Evo too. Are there apps that will manage your cache so that this issue happens less often? It's just a pain having to dump my caches and then waiting 15-20 minutes for the phone to restart.
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Out of curiosity, when you say clear your caches, what specifically are you referring to clearing? i.e. which directories?
There is definitely an issue with some android applications storing large amounts of data in their /data/data directories. Not sure there is any type of quota or limits on them either. I know I've seen the browser cache accumulate many files.
Also, in agreement and support to your observations with both the EVO and EVO 3D, HTC Sense doesn't seem to contain the most optimal code or procedures. I know when I ran CM7 (based off AOSP) on my EVO, the base OS was a lot smoother and quicker than the base HTC Sense.
As a possible solution, I think I've seen a few applications on the Market under the term wipe/clean/clear cache but I haven't tried any of them. I have thought about creating an application to fulfil this function but there seemed to be enough on the Market so I scratched the idea.
Always good to know somebody else has the same observations! Hope some of the feedback helps!
DeMiNe0 said:
I find that when I flash my phone, with lets say the latest synergy, my phone will work amazingly well. Very snappy, with no lag. After a few days of use, no matter what Rom I'm on, the phone becomes less responsive, and i notice a much greater deal of lag and delays.
My phone is pretty active. It runs K9 Mail, and Touchdown Exchange. Both apps together most likely see nearly 250-500 e-mails a day. I have both set to delete mail more than 2 months old. You can see my other apps here: http://www.appbrain.com/user/DeMiNe0/apps-on-the-pg86100
I'm assuming the slowdown is caused by the numerous caches on the phone. If I clear my caches everything tends to speed back up for a few days. Is this normal for Android? I'm assuming it is(Atleast for HTC Devices), as I had this issue with my OG Evo too. Are there apps that will manage your cache so that this issue happens less often? It's just a pain having to dump my caches and then waiting 15-20 minutes for the phone to restart.
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No effing way it should take that long to reboot. Are you on a custom ROM? Most of them boot in a minute or two. When you wipe in recovery the ONLY one you should wipe is cache, and NOT dalvik. Also, there are a few good root apps that wipe your app caches from the OS, no reboot required. Two come to mind - "cache cleaner" "cachemate". Try those, or wipe just cache in recovery not dalvik, should boot really fast.
Edit : the app "fast reboot" may help too, if it's just a bunch of open processes in your OS. It closes all of them and restarts them, without an actual reboot. You could also try a root app for memory management, like "autokiller", etc.
Wondering if anyone else has encountered massive lagging, outright freezing, and even complete rebooting, when using one of the more recent roms/kernels with JIT enabled?
Wanting to use the latest and greatest roms, I've been all but frustrated by the above behaviour.
"This never used to happen!!" ... "Why is Google Navigator forcing my phone to reboot!?" ... "Why is the CPU being pegged at 100% just by unlocking the screen!?!?"... and so on and so forth, you get the idea.
Despairing after the same behavior with yet another rom/kernel combo, I just happened to glance and see a "Disable JIT" option and - being a linux/systems guy and knowing what a JIT does - thought "what the heck let's try this", and promptly disabled the JIT and rebooted.
Picture a scene where the dark clouds opened up revealing sun rays and angelic music, as my phone suddenly started behaving as it should!
So. Anyone else with an SO-01B and experiencing similar? Try disabling the JIT, and please let me know how you got on.
psyphah said:
Wondering if anyone else has encountered massive lagging, outright freezing, and even complete rebooting, when using one of the more recent roms/kernels with JIT enabled?
Wanting to use the latest and greatest roms, I've been all but frustrated by the above behaviour.
"This never used to happen!!" ... "Why is Google Navigator forcing my phone to reboot!?" ... "Why is the CPU being pegged at 100% just by unlocking the screen!?!?"... and so on and so forth, you get the idea.
Despairing after the same behavior with yet another rom/kernel combo, I just happened to glance and see a "Disable JIT" option and - being a linux/systems guy and knowing what a JIT does - thought "what the heck let's try this", and promptly disabled the JIT and rebooted.
Picture a scene where the dark clouds opened up revealing sun rays and angelic music, as my phone suddenly started behaving as it should!
So. Anyone else with an SO-01B and experiencing similar? Try disabling the JIT, and please let me know how you got on.
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Ohhh, what ROM are you using? In 2.3.3 you dont need JIT, because it is already enabled Even if you try to install it on 2.3.3 system will not boot or boot with extreme lags.
HeliumX10 said:
Ohhh, what ROM are you using? In 2.3.3 you dont need JIT, because it is already enabled Even if you try to install it on 2.3.3 system will not boot or boot with extreme lags.
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Oh yes, I know - I'm not installing JIT manually - it's on by default in the rom I currently testing, which is;
Rom : FeraLab v20 Final
Kernel : 2.6.29-FeraKernel-v2.7
Android version : 2.3.9
Baseband : 2.1.71
So, like I mentioned earlier, I disabled JIT on that setup.
Whilst it gets rid of the lags and freezes in general, unfortunately, Google Navigator still caused reboots of the SO-01B. It's a real show-stopper for me.
I'm about to wipe and install with a different rom. I'll report back my findings.
Regards.
Remember that you need to clean dalvik cache when you change anything about JIT. Eventually cache partition format and full wipe.
But, disabling JIT is complete nonsense. It has been developed to run apps faster and more natively. Thats why every android before 2.2 was laggy and there were tons of methods how to enable JIT on older systems. And thats why it is enabled by default on 2.3´and later systems.
So if you have some lags, they are surely NOT caused by JIT. Try to clean your system, dalvik cache and make full wipe. Remember also few minutes to settle every ROM is needed.
HeliumX10 said:
Remember that you need to clean dalvik cache when you change anything about JIT. Eventually cache partition format and full wipe.
But, disabling JIT is complete nonsense. It has been developed to run apps faster and more natively. Thats why every android before 2.2 was laggy and there were tons of methods how to enable JIT on older systems. And thats why it is enabled by default on 2.3´and later systems.
So if you have some lags, they are surely NOT caused by JIT. Try to clean your system, dalvik cache and make full wipe. Remember also few minutes to settle every ROM is needed.
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I know you're giving good advice here, and I know I've only posted in the forums 4 times (5 now), but please believe me, I'm no noob.
I know exactly what the JIT is. I perform the clean&wipe operations on system,dalvik,etc, on every new install, and when I get problems. I also give the installation a decent settling down time.
None of this appears to have any effect to make this phone operate in a stable condition, except disabling JIT. And that's basic phone operation - calls, Tweetcaster Pro, Opera mini, G+, and a few others - the phone works nicely when JIT is off, and lags/freezes/sometimes reboots when JIT is on.
What really murders the phone, though, is any app which uses the GPS extensively - Google Maps works fine right up until I try to use Navigation - then boom! Phone freezes and eventually reboots.
I mentioned I was going to try different firmware, well I did.
Firmware : ThGo2 v16.0d with Th kernel
Android version : 2.3.3
kernel version : 2.6.29-n1
Baseband : 2.1.71
Interestingly enough, this firmware reports my phone to be a SO-01C instead of a B.
This firmware actually works far worse than the others I've tried.
There is, of course, another possibility that the SO-01B hardware itself is faulty, or has become faulty during the time I've had the phone - I'm not discounting that either.
Limiting the CPU speed in an attempt to stop possibly overheating of some kind didn't help either.
In the meantime, I'm going to try using a lower numbered baseband version, and I'll even try using some earlier firmware.
I'll report my findings back here.
But anyway - thanks for your input too
Regards
Thanks for posting your experiences here, psyphah. I have an old SO-01B that I am using in WiFi-only mode (rooted too) that I'd like to change the ROM on. Gingerbread would be a lot better than the stock docomo ROM I'm running if ICS is not ever going to happen and run well on this phone.
I look forward to hearing more about what you've chosen.
I HAVE BEEN USING ART ANDROID RUNTIME FOR THE PAST TWO DAYS, IT MOSTLY WORKS WELL . NOT SURE HOW MUCH BATTERY IT SAVES BUT IT SEEMS SMOOTH AND THE BATTERY SEEMS TO DO AT LEAST AS WELL AS WHEN ON DALVIK I KNOW ART IS IN BETA AND SOME APPS DONT WORK WITH IT IE TITANIUM /WHATS APP ETC. i NOTICED THAT ALSO PRIVACY MODE DOES NOT WORK EITHER. JUST WANTED TO BRING IT TO ANYONES ATTENTION THAT WOULD LIKE TO KNOW. ALSO TWICE MY PHONE JUST SEEMED TO FREEZE FOR A FEW MINUTES. PROBABLY FROM ART AS IT NEVER DID THAT BEFORE. SO ANYWAY MAYBE ART WILL BE MORE FEASIBLE WHEN 4.4.3 IS RELEASED IN A MONTH OR TWO. IM LOOKING FORWARD TO IT AS IT SEEMS TO BE MORE EFFICIENT.
I THINK YOUR CAPSLOCK KEY IS STUCK
I've heard that the ART in Z2 is still Open-Beta stage. So I need your few words about this stuff, desperately.
Apparently, most of my games are not compatible with ART. So what will happen if I change the runtime? Remains the status quo, slows them down or even ruins my game? Also, the same question for all Apps that does not know what ART is.
My device has been root for some time. How's that be affected by ART? Will any problems occur?
And, ART_Is it really THAT GOOD?
Silverylos said:
I've heard that the ART in Z2 is still Open-Beta stage. So I need your few words about this stuff, desperately.
Apparently, most of my games are not compatible with ART. So what will happen if I change the runtime? Remains the status quo, slows them down or even ruins my game? Also, the same question for all Apps that does not know what ART is.
My device has been root for some time. How's that be affected by ART? Will any problems occur?
And, ART_Is it really THAT GOOD?
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The ART in android 4.4 kitkat is no where near ART in android L. The ART in 4.4 kitkat is in an early stage, but it should speed up app animations (just a tad) and battery life should be improved (still, just a tad). Apart from those nice changes, it also makes booting the phone take longer. If you almost never turn your phone off all the way or reboot it, that shouldn't matter. But ART in android L improves battery a LOT and speeds things up a good amount. As for apps that don't work with ART? I know there are lists you can find out there where people have tested lots of apps so they should be able to tell you basically which apps don't work. I'm using dalvik right now because I need Xposed Installer and BusyBox which both do not work with ART (as far as I know). Anyways, you can switch to ART, try it out, and if too many apps won't work, just switch back to dalvik. All of your apps should work if you switch back to dalvik. ART has no lingering effects if you switch back.
EDIT: Also, when I say an app won't work with ART, that means that the app simply won't work at all. It will simply crash and you'll go right back to the home screen. Any app that does work, should be the same as an app in dalvik but it might shave a couple milliseconds off from how long the app takes to launch. But it's basically an all or nothing as to whether the app will work or not with ART. It either doesn't work at ALL or it works the same/better.
Silverylos said:
And, ART_Is it really THAT GOOD?
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It's not a question of wether or not it's good, from L, as i understand it, it will be the default runtime.
ghostofcain said:
It's not a question of wether or not it's good, from L, as i understand it, it will be the default runtime.
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The Z2 doesn't have android L, or any L-based roms. I assume he was asking if the ART in kitkat was good.
Android 5.0 is far from finished and so is Art Runtime/Compiler
and it is surely worth the wait
Instead of apps being compiled every time you open the app that being how dalvik vm works. the apps are already compiled from when they were installed.
this lowers app opening time
lowers risk of bugs in apps during run time
generaly more free space in system partitions
frees up some ram but this is app dependant
- saves some battery
overal lower system load cpu mostly
faster booting times potentialy
no need to deodex to mod, simply clear your cache and app compile output cache
art runtime is certainly much better than dalvik
Has anyone tested ART after the latest update from Verizon? I haven't tried it but was wondering if may be it was fixed in the latest update. I know it wasn't in the release notes.
Krusej23 said:
Has anyone tested ART after the latest update from Verizon? I haven't tried it but was wondering if may be it was fixed in the latest update. I know it wasn't in the release notes.
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I tried it VERY BRIEFLY, and experienced no problems.
Alright, I will give it another shot. I had problems with it when I first got the phone.
I tried and had phone freeze. Had to pull battery and switch back to dalvik
spydersilk said:
I tried and had phone freeze. Had to pull battery and switch back to dalvik
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It was better with the old one. I was able to run smoothly with freezing apps. But the new one started freezing even after freezing most of the LG and Verizon unused apps.
Stupid question here. What is the supposed benefit of ART?
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droidiac13 said:
Stupid question here. What is the supposed benefit of ART?
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LOL! Not a stupid question at all. Here's the quick and dirty from a google search:
ART vs Dalvik / AOT vs JIT
Android apps are deployed in Dalvik bytecode, which is portable, unlike native code. In order to be able to run the app on a device, the code has to be compiled to machine code.
Dalvik is based on JIT (just in time) compilation. It means that each time you run an app, the part of the code required for its execution is going to be translated (compiled) to machine code at that moment. As you progress through the app, additional code is going to be compiled and cached, so that the system can reuse the code while the app is running. Since JIT compiles only a part of the code, it has a smaller memory footprint and uses less physical space on the device.
ART, on the other hand, compiles the intermediate language, Dalvik bytecode, into a system-dependent binary. The whole code of the app will be pre-compiled during install (once), thus removing the lag that we see when we open an app on our device. With no need for JIT compilation, the code should execute much faster.
Except for the potential speed increase, the use of ART can provide an important secondary benefit. As ART runs app machine code directly (native execution), it doesn't hit the CPU as hard as just-in-time code compiling on Dalvik. Less CPU usage results in less battery drain, which is a big plus for portable devices in general.
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Now for what it's worth, I ran ART on almost every custom 4.4.4 ROM for the RAZR/RAZR Maxx and simply did not see much difference. This of course could have been due to phone limitations.
Hope this helps!
Thanks man!
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I switched to ART on Friday and had a bunch of problems like before.