Hello everyone,
Getting my G2 tomorrow ad was wondering what's best to do for the initial charge ?
What did you all do and how do you find your battery because of it ?
Cheers James
hi there mate
I did a 3-4 hour charge until the battery was fully charged...the orange led charge thing goes green and its fine then
right now im managing to get a day with heavy use, which is good
Thanks immya
Any other advice please ?
I atcually do the same. But i repeat the process of fully charge and discharge the phone completly about 2-3 times. So the battery gets well trained. I repeat ist about every 2 months. I know it should not be relevant with those new batteries, but i found out it is, and the battery last longer.
jut my 2 cents
Cheers,
Chaos42
it's 2009, just charge it and use it.
when i got mine the battery was ~1/3 full, i charged it till ~2/3, then had to leave and completed the initial charge like two hours later, all works fine, getting somewhat between 4 hours and 3 days of usage.
chaos42 said:
I atcually do the same. But i repeat the process of fully charge and discharge the phone completly about 2-3 times. So the battery gets well trained. I repeat ist about every 2 months. I know it should not be relevant with those new batteries, but i found out it is, and the battery last longer.
jut my 2 cents
Cheers,
Chaos42
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Hey chaos42
What do you mean should not be relevent with the new batteries ?
Is there some sort of new batteries with the newer phones ?
Thanks
James
no, what i meant was what immya just said. that with the modern Li-Ion batteries you should not worry to much about how and when to charge. I just wanted to add that even it is 2009 i observed a far better battery lifecycle and stamina when you try to take care of your batterie. and charge it as decribed. that's my experience. at least for the initial 2-3 charges.
cheers,
chaos42
not that i am trying to discredit you here (in fact i would be very interested in such numbers myself), but did you do any tests or comparable setups to check the difference? because if we are talking about "a feeling" that you have this is IMHO not really relevant data. i would like to see two identical phones in a (at least) similar environment, performing the same tasks the same amount of time a day, and with that getting different runtimes on the battery for a period of a few weeks. these two phones don't need to be heros necessarily, as long as they have the same type of battery and can produce comparable results, but as long as this doesn't happen i myself rely on the tone on li-ion batterys in general. which is (and i am not able to quote or prove this): they are robust in terms of regular charging, and worrying about wearing the batterys in or training them isn't worth the effort. again no discredit here, but as long as no comparison has taken place there is effectively no data to analyze... just too much variables.
jameslfc5 said:
Hey chaos42
What do you mean should not be relevent with the new batteries ?
Is there some sort of new batteries with the newer phones ?
Thanks
James
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NiCad batteries work best when fully discharged before re-charging otherwise you get what is called the memory effect. If you are in the habit of topping up before being fully discharged the better 'remembers' how much you let it drain before charging it and then get's the idea somehow that this is what its capacity is and goes flat at the point that it 'expects' to be recharged.
NiMH batteries are much less prone to memory effect. They are the ones that need the 16 hour first charge then subsequent charges are shorter.
Li-Ion - lithium to its friends - are not supposed to suffer any memory effect at all. You are supposed to be able to top up as and when you want without any detrimental effects.
None of the above batteries will last forever and will need replacing after 2 or 3 years of daily use.
TheBrit said:
NiCad batteries work best when fully discharged before re-charging otherwise you get what is called the memory effect. If you are in the habit of topping up before being fully discharged the better 'remembers' how much you let it drain before charging it and then get's the idea somehow that this is what its capacity is and goes flat at the point that it 'expects' to be recharged.
NiMH batteries are much less prone to memory effect. They are the ones that need the 16 hour first charge then subsequent charges are shorter.
Li-Ion - lithium to its friends - are not supposed to suffer any memory effect at all. You are supposed to be able to top up as and when you want without any detrimental effects.
None of the above batteries will last forever and will need replacing after 2 or 3 years of daily use.
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Absolutely spot on!
These days batteries do not require dishcharging fully before recharging. Even if the person in the phone shop says "ensure you charge it for 12-14 hours before you use it", this doesn't matter - once the battery is fully charged, it stops charging itself anyway - even if you leave it plugged into a charger!
Same as what's being said already.
To add, it's even better to keep your lithium battery topped. Fully discharging them is actually bad for a lithium battery. Full discharge and heat is what's bad for a lithium battery.
For a nice reference, check this: http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/lithium-ion-battery.htm
(the life and death part is what might interest you)
On a more interesting note. A long long time ago I got a MDA Compact aka Qtek s100. And there was a lot of debate here on the forums about the initial charge. In the manual it was stated that you should charge it for like 12 hours or something the first time. Then people obviously also said that was bull, because it had a lithium battery.
But! As for WM2003 it didn't save it's whole registry etc on the ROM but in the RAM. Once the battery was dead, bang! hard reset right there.
So they included a little NiMH battery in the s100 that would keep the RAM 'alive'. And that was the reason it needed such a long first charge, for the NiMH cell.
And for some reason a lot of manufacturers take an 'old' manual text for the first charge of a battery. Although that doesn't happen that often anymore. Especially in the beginning a lot of instructions of how to use a lithium battery were just plain wrong. And they put NiMH or even NiCad instruction in there!
Edit, some instructions as found here (http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm). Talks about laptops, but it's the same nonetheless.
Avoid frequent full discharges because this puts additional strain on the battery. Several partial discharges with frequent recharges are better for lithium-ion than one deep one. Recharging a partially charged lithium-ion does not cause harm because there is no memory. (In this respect, lithium-ion differs from nickel-based batteries.) Short battery life in a laptop is mainly cause by heat rather than charge / discharge patterns.
Batteries with fuel gauge (laptops) should be calibrated by applying a deliberate full discharge once every 30 charges. Running the pack down in the equipment does this. If ignored, the fuel gauge will become increasingly less accurate and in some cases cut off the device prematurely.
Keep the lithium-ion battery cool. Avoid a hot car. For prolonged storage, keep the battery at a 40% charge level.
Consider removing the battery from a laptop when running on fixed power. (Some laptop manufacturers are concerned about dust and moisture accumulating inside the battery casing.)
Avoid purchasing spare lithium-ion batteries for later use. Observe manufacturing dates. Do not buy old stock, even if sold at clearance prices.
If you have a spare lithium-ion battery, use one to the fullest and keep the other cool by placing it in the refrigerator. Do not freeze the battery. For best results, store the battery at 40% state-of-charge.
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Related
Why "deep battery cycling" or "conditioning," is bad for your battery
In summary, "conditioning" your battery is only good for calibrating the tools which predict how long your battery will last.
I.e. people seem to be recommending that new phones should be completely discharged a few times and then fully recharged. In some cases, people are recommending that the phones be left discharged for long periods of time before recharging. THIS IS A BAD IDEA AND WILL NOT HELP BATTERY LIFE.
Again, you can do this to calibrate the battery monitor, but this will not help the battery itself.
Here's a quote from wikipedia *since I am a new user I can't directly link but go to en(DOT)wikipedia(DOT)org/wiki/Li-ion_battery
Like many rechargeable batteries, lithium-ion batteries should be charged early and often. However, if they are not used for a long time, they should be brought to a charge level of around 40%–60%
Lithium-ion batteries should not be frequently discharged fully and recharged ("deep-cycled"), but this may be necessary after about every 30th recharge to recalibrate any electronic charge monitor (e.g. a battery meter). This allows the monitoring electronics to more accurately estimate battery charge.[27] This has nothing to do with the memory effect.
Li-ion batteries should never be depleted to below their minimum voltage, 2.4 V to 3.0 V per cell.
Li-ion batteries should be kept cool. Ideally they are stored in a refrigerator. Aging will take its toll much faster at high temperatures. The high temperatures found in cars cause lithium-ion batteries to degrade rapidly.
Li-ion batteries should not be frozen [50] (most lithium-ion battery electrolytes freeze at approximately −40 °C; however, this is much colder than the lowest temperature reached by household freezers).
Li-ion batteries should be bought only when needed, because the aging process begins as soon as the battery is manufactured.[27]
When using a notebook computer running from fixed line power over extended periods, consider removing the battery[51] and storing it in a cool place so that it is not affected by the heat produced by the computer.
Hope this helps someone.
Thank you DarkDvr, wikipedia credits to him
Also, feel free to read up at batteryuniversity(DOT)com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
*again, this is my first post so it wont let me link directly.
Good read. Al though, this is XDA after all and you will be flamed for using wikipedia as as a source. Just giving you heads up.
Lejjvi said:
Good read. Al though, this is XDA after all and you will be flamed for using wikipedia as as a source. Just giving you heads up.
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"battery conditioning" is only bad if you do it all the time and drain it completely dead often...
Lithium ion batteries don't really need this...
And should only be done if you think you have faulty battery stats due to flahing new software or roms....
We all know this and the people that don't now know.. thanks op for informing the uninformed!
sent from a 3devo
You need to condition it for the phones software as well... Otherwise it will shut off before the battery is actually dead. But yes, you shouldn't do it all the time.
People confuse why I needs to be done is all.
Yeah, should change the title. It's misleading.
Sent from my HTC Evo 3D.
there is a diffrence between a deep cycle and a normal cycle.they are only resistant to developing a memory.
Yes, I know this xda, but this after reading some of the multiple battery life threads it seemed like there was some misinformation floating around. I mean, I know batteries are the cheapest part of the phone and easy to replace, but still. No point in going through all the trouble of multiple deep cycles when it actually does harm to the battery.
Also, I wonder what the people with 2 batteries do, and how this affects the battery meter. Or, if you switch to a higher capacity battery. At what point does the unit recalibrate itself?
I notice that there's a warning message when the phone is fully charged, advising you to disconnect the charger. I usually leave my phone charging every night, meaning that it's still connected to the charger for hours after it's fully charged. I'm pretty sure that the S2 has "smart" charging, but would the overnight charging damage the battery by exposing it to unnecessary heat for this extended period?
No it shouldn't. Like you said the phone has the ability to shut off the charge when the battery reaches 100%.
I've been charging mine all night for most nights out of the past 3-4 months and it's fine.
That warning is essentially Samsung's attempt to give you a green consciousness, since leaving the charger connected to the wall draws a trickle of current. Sammy figures that millions of people following those instructions to the letter will help save the planet.
It will reduce your batteries life, leaving it on the charger. Will it does stop charging it then drains to 99% then tops it up, which over time uses up the recharge cycles and will reduce the time until it can't hold a charge.
Lithium ion battery doesn't have recharge cycle.
jzmtl said:
Lithium ion battery doesn't have recharge cycle.
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Exactly. This was true until Litium Ion batteries came the norm in handsets.
Nowadays its just to be seen as being 'green'
That is strange since this site devoted to teaching about batteries makes it seem like they do. But also reading it says that being at a constant full charge is more damaging then cycling the battery.
That is in the second paragraph under the "Depth of discharge" chart on this site
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
With the frequency cellphone batteries are charge/discharged, they crap out after two years anyway, and unlike some other fruity product it takes us 10 seconds to plop in a new one, so don't worry about it.
Even if it damaged your battery the effect wouldn't come noticeable before a long time I think. And in case the battery does get damaged, you can always replace it, that's one of the nice things about this phone, if you compare it for example to an iphone.
tomascunill said:
...And in case the battery does get damaged, you can always replace it, that's one of the nice things about this phone, if you compare it for example to an iphone.
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exactly why i didn't buy an iphone
The only things really damaging your battery are:
- excessive heat
- heavy use while charging
- turning on the phone over and over after it turned itself off on it's own due to low battery
there are more, for sure, but just to name a few.
I always charge my phones over night and my HD2's battery is as good as ever after 2 years. My SGS2's battery is still the same, and I still thing that when the battery is full there are no discharge/recharge cycles but something like a suspend mode in the charger.
To get the best battery life, when should I charge my phone? When the phone almost runs out of juice, or whenever I can (below 80%) ? Please help!
Deep discharges are bad, but so is spending lots of time at maximum charge.
I'd consider charging around when you hit 80% if it's convenient, but if you're expecting to be on battery for a while soon, top off whenever you want.
Discharging to 5-15% is bad for your battery longterm.
So to get the best battery, I should charge when it is $80 right?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA App
kvl19 said:
So to get the best battery, I should charge when it is $80 right?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA App
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There's no hard fast rule about 'exactly' when you should recharge it. Simply try and keep the phone from running < 20% a lot and never keep it always charged at 100%. If you get in the habit of charging in the 30-80% range, that would be best.
Basically throw out the old mentality of always using it as much as possible before recharging as lithium batteries simply don't work like the old nicad batteries from years past.
This phone uses a Li-Ion battery, and these batteries do NOT have any kind of "memory." Charge it whenever you want to. However, it's not really good to always keep it "topped off." (Deep discharges are also not good.)
If you are going to store the battery, drop it to 75%-50% charged first.
There are some things to consider, however:
If the phone's power circuit bypasses the battery when the battery is fully charge (instead of constantly pulling power from the battery while the battery is recharging), then leaving the phone plugged in is better than constant charge/discharge cycles. Based on the fact that this phone will work properly with NO battery attached when plugged in, this is probably a true statement (but I can't know for sure.)
Second, the phone itself might like to see the battery charged/discharged once in a while to calibrate the battery monitoring circuitry. (You never calibrate a li-ion battery - only the circuitry that monitors the battery.)
Here's a link with some interesting information:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Take care
Gary
Got it. Thanks for all your information
A small note to add why you shouldn't 'keep' it above 80% (constant top offs and being left on the charger). In general when above 80% it's been found that lithium ion batteries have a 'higher state of activity'.
What that does to the battery is what it sounds like. Higher state of activity means higher wear and overall shorter lifespan.
That wear is easily seen in laptops. Many people have the habit of leaving them always plugged in while using and through the night, so they're always 'ready to go'. People who consistently do this to their laptops usually find after 1 year the battery life is noticeably shorter, 1 1/2 years 50% or so of 'new' capacity, and after 2 years looking at replacing the battery.
And I usually find a cheap deal on eBay for them, plus $50-75 for me. At least phone batteries are a bit cheaper.
Sent from my páhhōniē
This question seems a little (a lot) odd. because naturally we want our battery to get fully charged to get the most stamina out of it.
but i read a while ago that for Li-Io batteries the most efficient charge range are 10%-90% so basically that means the full charge -discharge cycles aren't good for the battery but harmful as it cause them to die faster..
anyway i considered this reading as a good theory until i bought a sony vaio laptop which had a battery preservation feature (it limits the maximal charge to 80% or 50% depending on the option) and for more that a year and a half my battery still performed well (less than 4% degradation) so i thought this was a real deal after all.
still the use cases for a laptop and smartphone are vastly different (the laptop can sit with 50% charge just fine since it will be on charge most of the time while the smartphone has to get the maximum amount of energy to last without a charger)
so is there (or can it be made) an app that can limit the charge (to 80% or 90%)
any help is really welcome
That sounds like an odd theory..
well it sure is
but i read it out a battery maker sheet
if i could find the link i will post it
here's a paper that's not the same as the one i read one year ago
but it hold essentially the same information
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
A partial discharge reduces stress and prolongs battery life
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If at all possible, avoid full discharges and charge the battery more often between uses. Partial discharge on Li-ion is fine; there is no memory and the battery does not need periodic full discharge cycles
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Lithium-ion suffers from stress when exposed to heat, so does keeping a cell at a high charge voltage
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==> this is the critical information for me: it means that it's not good to get the battery charge to 100% & more to keep at this level; that's why most phones prompt you to remove your charger after full charge
i hope this gets a little bit interesting for suspicious people..
This thread could be of interest: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1257497
Has anyone checked the ROG phone "Battery health" on AccuBattery Pro? Mine is showing Estimated Capacity as 3,548 mAh, Design Capacity 4,000 mAh. I completely discharged then charged to 100% as calibration. Brand new phone.
Mine is showing 3,531mAh after around a week of usage.
Someone should report this on the Asus forums
mine also show 3500mah after 2.5 weeks of use
I have posted this issue on ASUS's Forum
https://www.asus.com/zentalk/thread-249329-1-1.html
Please feel free to add your battery capacity screenshots on their forum so we have a reference for the future
Mine's at 3462 after a little over a month. With a health of 87%
OK, then. We shouldn't be concerned. The proper way to measure battery is more complicated than what AccuBattery does (the proper way involves measuring battery discharge at a controlled rate). Since many of us are getting similar readings on AccuBattery, it's probably that AccuBattery's method isn't accurate.
MichaelCaditz said:
OK, then. We shouldn't be concerned. The proper way to measure battery is more complicated than what AccuBattery does (the proper way involves measuring battery discharge at a controlled rate). Since many of us are getting similar readings on AccuBattery, it's probably that AccuBattery's method isn't accurate.
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Same here: 3536 mAh 88% health with Accubattery first charge out of the box after discharging to 15% following first power up.
Either Accubattery has a problem with our phone, or Asus is ripping us off.
If the batteries were bad, we'd all have different readings.
I am guessing the AI charging might affect the measurement from AccuBattery. However I also don't think the battery capacity is full 4000 mAh. My last phone from Motorola has a 3000 mAh battery on the spec chart, but the battery itself prints 2810 / 3000 mAh (min/typ). From the ROG phone tear down videos, this battery isn't marked though.
From the asus zen forum the only solution the person provided was to bring the device to a service center to get it tested
I maybe wrong however with batteries these days it only ever uses a percentage so that there is redundancy for failure and to preserve the battery life.
iStasis said:
I maybe wrong however with batteries these days it only ever uses a percentage so that there is redundancy for failure and to preserve the battery life.
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Samsung does that. Note 9 is 4000mah but Accubattery says 3800mah on new phones. Every one of them.
Power reserve to not kill the battery early.
Anyway, 3500 mAh seems like one heck of a left over reserve.
Our batteries should last 5 years at least
Same "problem" here, but maybe it is because program has small amount of gathered data about battery usage. I did full discharge and full recharge yesterday, and goz about 3567mAh, but ill try to calibrate battery and use measuring app for longer time to get more accurate results.
Ps: I am using only slow charger to avoid overheating to eliminate battery damaging when recharging
I have not checked my ROG Phone in any 3rd party apps as I have not had a reason to question the 4,000 MAH
It is not a problem, lithium ion battery deteriorate faster if kept fully charge all the time or when discharged to low. Since most people have the bad habit to plug their phone all the time and keep them full for a prolonged period of time, oem have to be creative to fight this. Some will show your battery is charged at 100% while in reality its only charged at 90% .That is what your program most likely reading.
lithium ion should only be charged at 100% before you leave the house, i tend to keep mine between 50 and 90 usually . With quick charge there is no reason to keep a phone plug overnight, 10-20 min before leaving the house is plenty.
I have turned on AI for battery charging and as soon as my Battery reaches 100 it stops charging which is good enough for me to have faith in the charging technology in the phone and battery capacity.
I do leave mine plugged in over night however with the right equipment to check its hard to get a good understanding of whats happening. Theres inbuilt battery health tools so i would always advise using these and going through the features of this over 3rd party jank applications and trust them. Its the only tools Asus are going to support in any diagnostic troubleshooting.
Hi guys, I am returning after some time of usage and charging. After some charging cycles I have to admit my battery capacity is "increasing" - well better say, it is getting used to be charged properly. Now I passed 7 full charging cycles, but after 3rd one every next charge had more mA. I started at 3479mAh with full battery, now I ended with 3711mAh - hope it gets even better (I'll be glad for at least 3800, but who knows?). Everytime I tried to charge only when I was below 3%.
I have to say I am using slow charger with 5V and 400mA current. Battery checker from mobile manager was not detecting any issue with this way of charging nor AccuBattery Pro. I also know, that batteries shall be charged only about 80% of its capacity, but I am still sceptical about that rest 20% so I am charging to max everytime.
Hope I helped...
...another time passed and I am back with another results. After a lot chrging cycles I am stuck at between 3500-3700mAh of total capacity. I was searching around whole internet and found out, that phone manufacturers are "decreasing" battery capacity with SW at 90% of total capacity to prolong battery life and avoid battery wear, because everytime you charge the phone, you think you are charging to 100%, but in real you are charging to 90% only - rest of 10% is "hidden" to save your battery life - due to my calculations and testing it might be true. Anybody else had something different, so we can compare it?
I've just started cycling with accubattery will post when I get some solid data but seems battery has lost some capacity already only had it since November 5
Hellindros said:
I've just started cycling with accubattery will post when I get some solid data but seems battery has lost some capacity already only had it since November 5
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Heres mine so far only a few cycle's in but I've lost quite a bit capacity