Related
HI,
realise the pocket pc software are quite expensive... Anyone want to share their license copy, games, utility etc. I guess all can benefit right?... Rather we all purchase on our own.
Or may be we can all chip in to buy.... We can use services like Paypal to remittance money to each other.
Me interested in the Age of Empires Gold Edition. Anyone got a full license one. Nyditot Virtual Display 3.01 ?...
Warezzzz
I'm just speaking for myself here...
I have no major moral objections against copying copyrighted software, but I can also see the point of software companies trying to make a buck. I even co-own a small software company that will be trying to make a buck soon. But please believe me when I say that this is not the reason I'm posting this message.
I would hate to see warez being traded on this system. I've seen what frequent warez trading does to the atmosphere of communities like ours. Before long, professional traders will post requests. People will offer to pay for stuff, warez ftp server addresses 'for-the-day' will be posted, etc. etc. etc.
There's plenty of good forums on Usenet that have plenty of (alt.binaries.)warez posted to them. They have much less good productive atmosphere to waste and they work well.
Omigosh...
Well I don't think warezing software is something terribly wrong (it's not a theft usually), but if somebody likes the software, he should buy it. However, nobody can expect a 18 year old czech student to spend 80 bucks for SSH client he uses once a week.
I think those who use software to make money (companies, managers etc...) should buy the software. Those who just "play" with software and install and deinstall applications 5 times a day can get a warez copy. But if I find a great piece of soft I want to keep (forever), I buy it.
(I don't buy software, I'm a poor student and the software fee doesn't repay itself).
And another thing... I would never trade software here - in public, in a tech forum with guest access...
If you can afford an XDA and the phone contracts that go with it, you can afford the software - most programs are only 10-15 USD. A few like AoE are more, and I can tell you worth the extra money.
Regards
Tim
Basically, i find it rather amusing the comments given. Anyway, my intention is not to spread the so called 'piracy'. The intention was to share files with your so called neighhours. If you think my sharing for example DVD - THe spider man to let the neighhour watch or use, then the whole world must be pracitising that, even your neighhouhood video store is spread 'piracy'. I mean people can always rent it and duplicate at their home right?......
Furthmore, forum is more less like a obtaining information, sharing etc. That's why I use the words like sharing. Wanna to charge those sharing information. If you think this kind actions is bad, I think this forum shall stop hacking the XDA stuff..
I got my new 02 XDA 64MB at US$500 only.... Spend so much $$$ on electronic stuff for what?........ Earniing money is not an easy task. and for you info only a few program is US$10/= Most are more that U$20/=. IF you get 10 how much will it be, and the money is only for 1 version. don;t forget the accessories thats comes with it. If you think u have extra $$$ to spend on this software. Share with it someone who is not as rich as u.
there is loads of free stuff out there if you want it a forum like this is brillant for info but there is a wide range of others out there
My two cents in what seems to become a long thread.
First to answer mac's orignal question. I can't help you (currently :lol: )
In response to XDA developer Peter Poelman's response I want to submit that in order to keep this forum alive we certainly don't need the professional traders.
As for software licensing. I have been/am on both sides. User and author. It's annoying if people just copy whatever they like, especially if they make a lot of money with it.
My justification so far has been. I use 'evaluation copies' for 2 or 3 weeks or so and if it is still in use I buy the software. Is it legal? Probably not? Is this wrong? Probably yes, but I can sleep at night.
We all invent 'our rules' for the world. If you want to be safe, stick with the rules. If not just be prepared to have your [email protected]# kicked every now and then.
Although I sympathise with the argument of being a student, etc etc, that doesn't justify it (nor do my own 'rules' do that). What would you charge someone with 5 children and being a single parent?
And most of the times there are alternatives. For instance in the windows space there is a lot of free software around and some of them are real jewels. If you are curious: www.nonags.com.
Industry responds with free software containing banners and adds, we all hate them, install cracks/patches to get rid of them. Wake up guys. They give it away for free and still we whine. (yes, I hate adds and banners to and I kill them whenever possible). I think we shouldn't whine about initiatives like Palladium if we copying everything we can get our hands on.
Overall my advise is: don't use THIS forum for conducting that behaviour and for the rest live and let live. In my opinion its a forum for undertanding the XDA and its technology. I don't even have one yet ( :evil: ) but I have learned a lot already. One could argue about some of the things tht could be done with the XDA (un-simlocking of accidently locked phones) but it's mainly discussing the device, software and accessoiries.
Being nosy is not a crime.
Having knowledge is not a crime.
But using knowledge could be a crime.
And even the first 2 can be a crime depending on where you live.
Pfffffffffft, I must be PMS'ing. Sorry people :wink:
Robert
I think games should be paid for....
but as far as tools etc goes I think it would be fair to follow the GPL...
You pay for what you make money with.
I'm a frequent visitor to alt.binaries....pocketpc and I've probaly downloaded 700mb or so in pocketpc warez since I bought my XDA...
I have an easynews account which archives newsgroup posts from the last 30 days.
That software I downloaded because I thought it looked interesting; not because it was there. Out of those god knows how many programs I have 12 programs that I keep on my xda at all times... these I have registered:
Battery Pack 2003 <<< really good
Resco Explorer 2003
Lextionary <<< prolly the best dictionary tool
Snails
Marble Worlds
Diamond Mine <<< addictive as hell
Speedball 2 << we love the Amiga !!
Pocket C64 <speaks for itself>
Dockware
Small menu <<< damn good btw
Rhinostats
Truefax
The others I played with for a while and then dumped because they were errr CRAP ? or there were other better alternatives (atleast in the power monitoring area)
Diamond mine I downloaded months ago... and only registered yesterday.
I dont believe in buying stuff I dont need.. and downloading them gives me more time to decide whither I'm going to keep it... or fire it onto a DVDRW and forget about it after a month.
I also have a wares copy of Autocad Studio Max 5 on my computer... $5k to buy in the shops...
most people dont learn this program at Uni (atleast the good ones anyways). Most of them pick up a copy when they are in their early teens and continue to learn with it till they master the techniques. After doing so they go to Uni and get the bit of paper... later on they get a job with a company which has bought a license to the application.
Autocad arent missing out on my license... I'd have never considering paying the $5,000 in the first place.
Some people say that 3D Animation is a craft. I've known people who have been 'learning' it for the past 7 years. Where would Autocad get its budding new business licenses if the 3D warez market dried up and only the large software houses could afford them?
Games are different, you cant make money from them.
I bought StarScape the other day for the PC.
http://www.moonpod.com/English/about_ss.php
download the demo and give it a go
I normaly run games in 1600x1200 or above... but the fact this runs in 640x480 makes no difference.
You might also want to check this site out for some more quality game play... and best of all they are free 8)
http://www.tierraentertainment.com/ (reworked kings Quest I&II)
http://www.back2roots.org/ (shtuff from eons ago)
games from the era of when gaming had gameplay, hand drawn graphics and not just a billion polygons fired at it.
Strange comment from a 3D artist.
software
hi mac
try bear share there is loads of software on there i dont think we should trade games on here i used to use another site for my nokia communicator and it started to trade software and now it gives very little free and has turned into a business venture about selling software and not the product which it was originally meant to help promote amongst fellow users
Well, we'll be relasing a game soon aswell and i would like to think that if people download the demo and they are happy with it, that they would then go on to buy the full version. Its not like the average pocket pc game costs a fortune.
The way I look at it is if people dont buy software, people will stop writing it, I have purchased many games/apps, and am glad i supported the writers of such software. As a result newer and better versions are released, i prime example is Battery Bar along with Journal Bar, fantastic bit of software.
Ok, I have a great plan (this might have been discussed already) but here's my suggestion:
All Rom developers should charge for their work. I'm thinking maybe 3-5 dollars. and if its still in Work in Progress we can still be charged but don't charge for upgrades. This way the out of work developers can get something for their hard work. I just create images and that takes time. I can't even imagine how much time is spent on the roms.
Believe me I would pay for all you guys roms. Donations are great but not enough to inspire to create more roms or even spend time on them. I don't know if this is possible but you guys deserve a lot more credit.
thats my feelings on this issue.
I agree with you in principle, but it kind of defeats the purpose of open source and XDA, doesn't it?
johnny quest said:
Ok, I have a great plan (this might have been discussed already) but here's my suggestion:
All Rom developers should charge for their work. I'm thinking maybe 3-5 dollars. and if its still in Work in Progress we can still be charged but don't charge for upgrades. This way the out of work developers can get something for their hard work. I just create images and that takes time. I can't even imagine how much time is spent on the roms.
Believe me I would pay for all you guys roms. Donations are great but not enough to inspire to create more roms or even spend time on them. I don't know if this is possible but you guys deserve a lot more credit.
thats my feelings on this issue.
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That's a flattering sentiment but does rather contradict the core principles behind open source in general. If not for its openness and freely available source I doubt you would see the level of progress there has been in the android community.
I'm sure the devs themselves will chime in. Just my two friendly cents
Sent from my CM7 Tazz using XDA App
its not Necessary but its a nice gesture i dont want anyone feeling obligated ,, times are hard for everyone ,, but thank you
i don't know if you've noticed but most devs have a 'buy me a beer' link where you can donate if you wish. i know if i had a job i'd be donating $20 at a time or so depending on how much i was getting paid. until then its nice to know that even though i can't pay, i can still get the best. Google > Apple. it's not always about the money.
ILikeBubbles said:
i don't know if you've noticed but most devs have a 'buy me a beer' link where you can donate if you wish. i know if i had a job i'd be donating $20 at a time or so depending on how much i was getting paid. until then its nice to know that even though i can't pay, i can still get the best. Google > Apple. it's not always about the money.
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In most cases everything always comes down to money. Unless your living with your parents still or your younger then it's one thing but still at the end of the day most things come down to money.
I'll agree with you on Google > Apple
I own a Iphone4 and the Droid Eris and I still like the Eris hands down no matter what even though the Iphone4 runs everything very smooth the concept of android is far better than most apple users can ever be able to dream about.
Cheatman1 said:
In most cases everything always comes down to money. Unless your living with your parents still or your younger then it's one thing but still at the end of the day most things come down to money.
I'll agree with you on Google > Apple
I own a Iphone4 and the Droid Eris and I still like the Eris hands down no matter what even though the Iphone4 runs everything very smooth the concept of android is far better than most apple users can ever be able to dream about.
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dear god that signature quote made my brain hurt just trying to read it.
Haha your signature is great. It made me laugh pretty hard.
And as for this discussion, I don't think they can MANDATE you pay for anything. Like it has been said, its open source and if people want to donate they will. I wish I had a job so I can donate, and as soon as I get one I know I will be. But for now I'm enjoying the work these guys are doing, and hope it continues.
I mean, we're getting Gingerbread on the Eris thanks to the devs here. That's two versions more than what the Eris was thought to get. That to me is incredible.
Oh yeah, I forgot about the open source. the donate link is nice to have and I am guilty of not using that to show appreciation. I will use it more frequently. The Eris is great but I'm stuck not able to load certain apps because it requires a higher than 2.1 version. I'm up for an update and looking into the Thunderbolt most likely. Hopefully there will be a thread on this phone for Roms in the future.
I agree, there should be a way for ROM makers to get paid for their time. Likely, its illegal or a breach of some sort of contract/agreement/gobbledygook somewhere.
The developer for my favorite Eris ROM's, Tazz is having back issues and can't work, so this very issue is very relevant. I make sure and send him donations whenever possible.
For now, just send your favorite ROM devs donations through the links provided.
It's nice idea that you guys want to give back but honestly if deving was a paid gig I don't think you would have as good as results. I do it myself cause I tinker by nature and like to help other people. You will get a better end product if you have a dev that does this cause he likes it and not just cause he want to make money. Look at the number of useless apps on the market cause people just want to make money. Nothing wrong with making money and I myself sell apps but roms are a different ballgame. Plus rom dev's rarely write code of their own except for the cyanogenmod team. We all use the source available to us or other peoples work. Plus if you got paid for your rom you wouldn't want competition so who would share their work. If work was not shared in this community then android would not be what it is....
GPL violation anyone?
You'd have to include the source code with said paid work, and post said paid work's source code publicly, not disallowing anyone from modifying it or redistributing it. Wouldn't last long.
Plus, if the devs charged, then the CM team would charge them, and the google would charge then......... it would end up being way more than 3-5 bucks.
jadesdan said:
Plus, if the devs charged, then the CM team would charge them, and the google would charge then......... it would end up being way more than 3-5 bucks.
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+1
We'd have to throw some cash at the Hero devs too lol, and pretty much everyone that helped them,and on and on
Sent from my GSBv1.2 using XDA App
Good intentions! I am glad some people still think of the devs.
I have donated in the past, and will continue to do so. We are running GB on an Eris now! Without the devs, we would all be on Cupcake and hating it.
I'd like to take a second to thank the devs and the COMMUNITY as well. I have received lots of help here from regular joe's like me that are just looking for the latest and greatest, as well as the devs that make the magic happen.
We should all thank our lucky stars that we have been provided a place to share ideas, get help and help Android and other platforms evolve into new, fascinating and useful apps/OS's.
Thanks to the WHOLE community! I would pay each and every one of you if I could!
If you like something like this enough, why not do it for free? Especially in this kind of work.
There is not a single thing in open source licenses which prohibits people from charging for services rendered; it is a complete misrepresentation - and frankly a disservice to the Open Source community - to state that open source means "no money involved".
Open Source licenses only prohibit distribution of derivative works without also providing source code. As an example, it would be completely legal for someone to set up a paid web site where there is a charge to download the Linux source trees. In this (ridiculous) example, what is being paid for is the service - the license is satisfied because you are providing the source code.
Having said all that, note that "all of android" is not open source; in particular, the Google Apps, (HTC Sense, Motoblur, etc) and certain hardware-specific libraries are proprietary goods - even so-called "Pure AOSP" dev ROMs contain a small number of vendor libraries, which are technically illegal to redistribute.
I suspect that the legitimate owners of those goods turn a blind eye to small amounts of infringement because they can not monetize their legal actions (no blood from a turnip, etc); but also note that when infringement achieves a certain scale (as it did with CM and Google), they will certainly step in - the issue there has little to do with money; it's more about a legal principle of loss of rights due to failure to defend those rights in the face of significant infringement.
Charging people when you are infringing is a pretty sure way to get the attention of the infringed party.
bftb0
I use KaosFroyo on my Eris; I appreciate all of the work that has gone into it, and I have kicked some $$ back to Kaos for his efforts. That said, officially charging for ROMs sounds like a big mess for a bunch of reasons.
First off, how do you actually enforce it? Are we gonna set up some kind of ecommerce website? Do billing and customer service? It'll generate a bunch of tedious work that has nothing to do with actual ROM development, and paying someone else to do it would probably soak up all of the money. And are you going to sue and go after people who pirate it? But if you don't enforce it, then you pretty much have what you have now.
There's also the different expectations for a paid product. Right now, if some newbie can't figure something out and keeps posting stupid questions without reading the FAQ, then people can tell him to STFU/read the FAQ/release the Kraken/etc because it's a free product being developed by guys in their spare time that doesn't earn them much money. Start charging for it and you change that whole equation around - you now have to hold the newbies' hands or they'll scream for a refund and cause all sorts of trouble if they don't get it. Not to mention the liability - we know every now and then phones get bricked and data gets lost doing this stuff. If it's a paid product, then there may be legal liability for that in some markets. Who's gonna sort that out? Expensive lawyers?
Plus the other objections brought up regarding copyright/licensing of the proprietary libraries that are being used to make these ROMs.
Put it all together, and the current system seems like it's the best solution, even though the devs may not be getting as much money as they really deserve. So throw a few more bucks in the bucket for your favorite ROM.
bftb0 said:
There is not a single thing in open source licenses which prohibits people from charging for services rendered; it is a complete misrepresentation - and frankly a disservice to the Open Source community - to state that open source means "no money involved".
Open Source licenses only prohibit distribution of derivative works without also providing source code. As an example, it would be completely legal for someone to set up a paid web site where there is a charge to download the Linux source trees. In this (ridiculous) example, what is being paid for is the service - the license is satisfied because you are providing the source code.
Having said all that, note that "all of android" is not open source; in particular, the Google Apps, (HTC Sense, Motoblur, etc) and certain hardware-specific libraries are proprietary goods - even so-called "Pure AOSP" dev ROMs contain a small number of vendor libraries, which are technically illegal to redistribute.
I suspect that the legitimate owners of those goods turn a blind eye to small amounts of infringement because they can not monetize their legal actions (no blood from a turnip, etc); but also note that when infringement achieves a certain scale (as it did with CM and Google), they will certainly step in - the issue there has little to do with money; it's more about a legal principle of loss of rights due to failure to defend those rights in the face of significant infringement.
Charging people when you are infringing is a pretty sure way to get the attention of the infringed party.
bftb0
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Click to collapse
Conap said:
It's nice idea that you guys want to give back but honestly if deving was a paid gig I don't think you would have as good as results. I do it myself cause I tinker by nature and like to help other people. You will get a better end product if you have a dev that does this cause he likes it and not just cause he want to make money. Look at the number of useless apps on the market cause people just want to make money. Nothing wrong with making money and I myself sell apps but roms are a different ballgame. Plus rom dev's rarely write code of their own except for the cyanogenmod team. We all use the source available to us or other peoples work. Plus if you got paid for your rom you wouldn't want competition so who would share their work. If work was not shared in this community then android would not be what it is....
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Click to collapse
IMHO, though there are many excellent views and points regarding all this posted in this thread, and the original intention was interesting, these two answers are the overall most complete and pertinent.
Way to go, guys!
ufmace said:
I use KaosFroyo on my Eris; I appreciate all of the work that has gone into it, and I have kicked some $$ back to Kaos for his efforts. That said, officially charging for ROMs sounds like a big mess for a bunch of reasons.
First off, how do you actually enforce it? Are we gonna set up some kind of ecommerce website? Do billing and customer service? It'll generate a bunch of tedious work that has nothing to do with actual ROM development, and paying someone else to do it would probably soak up all of the money. And are you going to sue and go after people who pirate it? But if you don't enforce it, then you pretty much have what you have now.
There's also the different expectations for a paid product. Right now, if some newbie can't figure something out and keeps posting stupid questions without reading the FAQ, then people can tell him to STFU/read the FAQ/release the Kraken/etc because it's a free product being developed by guys in their spare time that doesn't earn them much money. Start charging for it and you change that whole equation around - you now have to hold the newbies' hands or they'll scream for a refund and cause all sorts of trouble if they don't get it. Not to mention the liability - we know every now and then phones get bricked and data gets lost doing this stuff. If it's a paid product, then there may be legal liability for that in some markets. Who's gonna sort that out? Expensive lawyers?
Plus the other objections brought up regarding copyright/licensing of the proprietary libraries that are being used to make these ROMs.
Put it all together, and the current system seems like it's the best solution, even though the devs may not be getting as much money as they really deserve. So throw a few more bucks in the bucket for your favorite ROM.
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Click to collapse
This was a pretty damn good answer, too, if you don't mind me saying.
Hey guys,
I really need to rant a little bit now.
This thread is for everyone creating all those "kill ASUS on facebook/twitter/blog sites" threads.
I really understand your angryness about the initial issues with the Prime, but has anyone of you guys ever thought about that you are doing huge damage to both ASUS and yourself with those hate campaigns?
Best example: "Lets spread information about minor software problems all over the web and its major blog sites"
This is ridicioulus guys... Seriously, ASUS really can't fix for example the serialnumber issue within 3 days...
They need to find out what's wrong first. After that they need to fix the problem. After fixing the testing follows.
All this needs time. And spreading rather unprofessional information all around the web won't speed this up at all.
But now to the main part of my rant: the damage being done to us, the owners of the Prime.
Do you guys really think you are doing anything good with those social attacks?
In fact you are driving many people away from the Prime for reasons which are seriously non-issues.
Lets re-think about the issues and ASUS reactions:
GPS issue: ASUS confirmed, that this might be a hardware problem,
it seems they are starting a bonus program for the ones not happy with the GPS (either 6 more months of warranty or a full refund)
This is actually really embarassing for them, but I couldn't think of any better method to solve this issue
(we are talking about realistic methods here, giving you a free TF700 is not realistic)
The Wifi issue: Well actually we do not know much about this.
ASUS told us it's not a hardware issue, rather an issue of specific batches with wrong firmware. We will see in the future what they can do here
The Wifi/BT issue: As several members found out this is a real non-issue. Speed drops appear across all devices and platforms when using BT and Wifi together. Nothing really to complain about here
Random lockups and reboots and unknown serial number issue: ASUS is aware of these problems, already got fixes and is testing these fixes right now.
Nobody else tests fixes with real customers in a public forum. Thats' great!
Now lets talk about that damage I am always talking about:
Here the facts:
Reporting minor software issue (GPS and Wifi aside here) definitely leads to a smaller customer base for the Prime
Major news sites falsely reported the serial number problem as a hardware problem, leading to confused users which do not want to buy this tablet
Smaller userbases always lead to less support, both from the company and also from our own developers.
Less company support means that we will get less often and lower quality updates for our Prime. The device will be abandonned much faster than devices with large customer bases
Less dev support means less innovating new features from our side, less custom ROMs, less custom kernels, in fact the smaller the userbase the faster the Prime development will go dead
Think of the HTC HD2: the ultimate development phone. Its rather big userbase lead to incredible development. They have everything on that phone: Win 6.x, WP 7, Android 2.x and 4.x, real Linux... Smaller userbases ultimately lead to worse device development
I guess it's already too late, the damage being done by you and the major blog sites is irreparable.
Non tech-focused customers who read Engadget won't get a Prime now.
But these non-tech focused guys are the imporatn part of a customer base.
We tech guys here are always a very minor part of a device's customer base.
Ah and by the way: If you buy a product directly after launch, you have to expect those kind of problems.
I haven't seen any product launch in the last years which had not initial problems and issues. No matter if tablet or phones, HTC or Samsung...
ASUS is always one of the first (the first?) major companies, providing support on xda-developers. That is nothing usual for big companies like ASUS.
Give them credit for this move.
I hope someone actually read that text...
I completely agree, thanks for this post. However the problem is it are mostly people who haven't even bought the Prime are *****ing the most.
I couldn't agree more, *****ing about the problem isn't gonna get anything solved. If you have problems try to help, that way things can get fixed more quickly and then everyone (or at least most) can be happy.
read it and agree, there are issues but the support from Asus on this forums is great.
Srsly? Do you have like Stockholm-Syndrome?
Asus threw an unfinishied product on the market.
They can't fix the SN issue in 3 days? Well, I didn't have such issues with my 4 other android devices. Maybe the should have been testing it.
Of course it is embarassing for Asus, but this is clearly not our fault. We fulfilled our part with odering and paying for a tablet. Rest is up to them.
While I agree that a free TF700 or such things would be impossible, the GPS problem is clearly a sign there has be no/not enough testing.
All the problems you are stating would have been showing due to Asus product testing, again. This is completely THEIR fault and they have to deal with it now.
You think we need to stop reporting errors to make the prime look better and they can sell more?
Dude, seriously. Do you buy a brand new car and when you have issues, you just shut up so the store can sell some more?
I'd really love to love my Prime, but with all those obvious mistakes Asus made, I can't.
The problem with what you are doing is: If you support Asus now, other companies will see it's ok to sell faulty products, and the next generation of tablets could have big issues as well.
You need to say what's wrong for anybody to hear. Or would you like to buy a product and then find out later that it's full of bugs? But nobody tould you because it wouldn't be nice for the company?
Do you think Asus will decrease support if less people are bying it?
Again, this wouldn't be nice, but it's completely in the hands of Asus.
It's a big company and they shouldn't have trouble emplyoing a few guys for support. If not, the save money on the wrong thing. Don't make (Non-)Buyers responsible for this.
No matter what other companies do, bringing an untested product to the market is not acceptable and that is the feedback Asus is getting now.
And no, you don't have to expect those "kind of problems".
When I buy a 600€-Tablet, I expect a full working one, and not in 3 months but NOW. I didn't have problems with my Optimus 2x or Iconia A500.
It's a big difference wether the company is fixing issues or improves the quality with updates.
And another point on Asus working with the community: It's nice they are on XDA, but... I remember there was...is... a locked and encrypted bootloader?
Yeah, right. Asus completely locked the Prime and only promised to make an unlock tool after giant social network ****storms.
Is this "working" with the community? Why didn't they look at HTC and provided an unlock tool from the beginning? Asus is only giving in because they are afraid of more bad attention. And that seems to be the only way for the community to be heard.
Just my 2c.
pintness
I think peoples persistence on forums have forced ASUS to look harder at the problem but never the less they are doing something and its a real credit to them that Gary Key is active on our forums now. I think in this modern age ASUS have took a brave step and one that they should be praised for.
We are all upset about the problems but we need to give ASUS fair time to address them. We have all had a rant but now its time to work with ASUS and give them as much information as possible, this is the only way we all get what we want, loyal happy customers and a fantastic product with new and exciting products on the horizon.
Cut them a bit of slack.
Dear Diamondback,
Damage to ASUS with those hate campaigns? I am sorry, but I am not going to speak well of a company that releases devices with as many problems that I have paid for. If I end up buying a broken device, I will be disappointed. They did not let these devices through proper quality control and we are suffering from it.
Serial number issue should have never happened. WiFi issue should have never happened. GPS should have never happened. These problems can be caught in quality control, but they didn't because they rushed the device to the market before holidays and did not test it long enough beforehand.
Yes, a lot of new devices have tech problems. Difference being that while I have been part of many tech launches as an early adopter in the past, I have never seen a launch that has this many critical problems and this amount of returned devices. Even I had to return a device because the keyboard just did not work and I've never had to do it before in my life.
As for damage to 'us', your points are irrelevant. Social media attacks are important, because they make ASUS more aware of these situations and react quicker. Let's be honest here, ASUS PR has been horrible throughout the Transformer Prime launch. It is only thanks to their customer support and engineers in this forum that we get some information out of ASUS.
I will not 'lie' and say that TF201 is a great device. It is really really good, but if you want to be sure and want a better all-round device then I will suggest people to get an iPad 2 and I will not tell my friends that this device does not have flaws just because this will increase ASUS sales and public image.
These social media attacks are important because ASUS will hopefully try to do better in the future, because a company cannot survive many of these clusterfraks in a row.
If ASUS will 'abandon the device' quicker because people are critical about it, then so be it. It will only make it clear to me not to buy ASUS products in the future, since it is exactly when there are problems, where support is needed. Not providing this will lose them even more customers in the future.
And trust me when I say this, Transformer Prime will never be a popular device in a way iPad, Galaxy Tab or Kindle Fire are popular. It will sell more than the original Transformer, but it will be very little known outside tech circles. Most of my friends don't even know that there is such a thing as TF101, let alone TF201.
How can ASUS change that? Not disappointing early adopters. It is the most crucial thing about products release, since early adopters are the most passionate customers. At the moment though many of us are with flawed screens, weak WiFi, non-existent GPS, devices without serial numbers and countless of other issues that will really hold us back from speaking well about the product we have paid a lot of money for.
ASUS can really change all that by letting devices actually go through quality control and testing. Many of the problems with Prime were detected in just the first days of use by us or the reviewers. ASUS can spare to delay the release by a week to provide additional testing for a fixed amount of devices.
Will they do it in the future? Who knows, unlikely. This device was rushed to the market to get as much sales as possible, ASUS did not care about us, the customers, they cared about their sales.
And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.
pintness said:
Srsly? Do you have like Stockholm-Syndrome?
[...]
Just my 2c.
pintness
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
kristovaher said:
Dead Diamondback,
[...]
And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You both are not getting my point. Instead of going to the media you should report your errors to ASUS.
No matter how incompetent their customer support is on the phone, the errors will reach the developers anyway.
Nobody told you to praise the Prime. I just said that overpainting the issue won't help anyone. Not even you.
ASUS will fix the software problems. And the GPS issue got kinda resolved too. If you are not happy with it, return it.
I am pretty sure there will be other countries than UK and Taiwan with this move.
And yes you can't fix software errors in that scale in 3 days. Just deal with it. That's how software development works.
Oh and I hope that "Dead Diamondback" was a typo.... Otherwise, get off here troll
You haven't mentioned the dock issues lots of us are getting. My dock keyboard only works about 20% of the time I connect it. There is at least 30 or 40 users on here with the same issue, and about double that on the transformerforums site. This may not be a lot but I'm sure a lot of US owners don't own the dock where as is Europe you have to buy it as standard. ASUS support haven't been overly helpful - wait for the ICS upgrade and try a wipe - done that and it still doesn't work - no further update from ASUS. I'm having to send my tablet and dock back and hope the next one works fine - any issues with the new one and I'll be getting a refund.
kristovaher said:
Dead Diamondback,
Damage to ASUS with those hate campaigns? I am sorry, but I am not going to speak well of a company that releases devices with as many problems that I have paid for. If I end up buying a broken device, I will be disappointed. They did not let these devices through proper quality control and we are suffering from it.
Serial number issue should have never happened. WiFi issue should have never happened. GPS should have never happened. These problems can be caught in quality control, but they didn't because they rushed the device to the market before holidays and did not test it long enough beforehand.
Yes, a lot of new devices have tech problems. Difference being that while I have been part of many tech launches as an early adopter in the past, I have never seen a launch that has this many critical problems and this amount of returned devices. Even I had to return a device because the keyboard just did not work and I've never had to do it before in my life.
As for damage to 'us', your points are irrelevant. Social media attacks are important, because they make ASUS more aware of these situations and react quicker. Let's be honest here, ASUS PR has been horrible throughout the Transformer Prime launch. It is only thanks to their customer support and engineers in this forum that we get some information out of ASUS.
I will not 'lie' and say that TF201 is a great device. It is really really good, but if you want to be sure and want a better all-round device then I will suggest people to get an iPad 2 and I will not tell my friends that this device does not have flaws just because this will increase ASUS sales and public image.
These social media attacks are important because ASUS will hopefully try to do better in the future, because a company cannot survive many of these clusterfraks in a row.
If ASUS will 'abandon the device' quicker because people are critical about it, then so be it. It will only make it clear to me not to buy ASUS products in the future, since it is exactly when there are problems, where support is needed. Not providing this will lose them even more customers in the future.
And trust me when I say this, Transformer Prime will never be a popular device in a way iPad, Galaxy Tab or Kindle Fire are popular. It will sell more than the original Transformer, but it will be very little known outside tech circles. Most of my friends don't even know that there is such a thing as TF101, let alone TF201.
How can ASUS change that? Not disappointing early adopters. It is the most crucial thing about products release, since early adopters are the most passionate customers. At the moment though many of us are with flawed screens, weak WiFi, non-existent GPS, devices without serial numbers and countless of other issues that will really hold us back from speaking well about the product we have paid a lot of money for.
ASUS can really change all that by letting devices actually go through quality control and testing. Many of the problems with Prime were detected in just the first days of use by us or the reviewers. ASUS can spare to delay the release by a week to provide additional testing for a fixed amount of devices.
Will they do it in the future? Who knows, unlikely. This device was rushed to the market to get as much sales as possible, ASUS did not care about us, the customers, they cared about their sales.
And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.
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Click to collapse
GDI read the ****ing OP's first post. He did not ask you to kiss Asus' feet. He did not ask you to say false POSITIVE things about the Prime. He did not tell you to disregard Asus' mistakes. He simply asked you to vent your frustration and give your CONSTRUCTIVE feedback to the appropriate recipient: ASUS.
BTW you have my thanks OP.
kaiserpc said:
You haven't mentioned the dock issues lots of us are getting. My dock keyboard only works about 20% of the time I connect it. There is at least 30 or 40 users on here with the same issue, and about double that on the transformerforums site. This may not be a lot but I'm sure a lot of US owners don't own the dock where as is Europe you have to buy it as standard. ASUS support haven't been overly helpful - wait for the ICS upgrade and try a wipe - done that and it still doesn't work - no further update from ASUS. I'm having to send my tablet and dock back and hope the next one works fine - any issues with the new one and I'll be getting a refund.
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Hm, seems I missed that. My german dock works perfectly. What's the issue exactly?
But still, ASUS is a big company, they can't just find, fix, test, and make an announcement in 3 days...
It reminds me of the launch of the HTC Desire HD, Back then it seemed as though the first couple of batches that made it into customers hands had not been properly tested and manufacturing QC was absolutely terrible.
GPS issues were rife, cases didn't fit together properly, screens were loose with dust underneath them. Then of course there was the screen bleed, stuck pixels and countless other problems.
I remember it well as I was one of the first people on this forum to receive my DHD and I spent countless hours sitting watching IRC channels for root to be achieved.
Now then after that short history lesson, here is the point of my story. There was a lot of complaining about these issues here on the forum, but what most people did was either accept the fact that this was an early batch and realised that as an early adopter these things are to be expected, or they sent them back. End of story.
There was no smeer campaign, nothing. Just people being adult about the situation and that's that.
Thanks for listening.
Doktaphex said:
It reminds me of the launch of the HTC Desire HD, Back then it seemed as though the first couple of batches that made it into customers hands had not been properly tested and manufacturing QC was absolutely terrible.
[...]
Thanks for listening.
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Click to collapse
Same here, I think I got one of the first good batches
Nobody started a big ****storm back then and everything is fine today. The Desire HD is still a very good device and it was one of the top sold devices from HTC.
HTC sorted out all problems.
Agree
I actually agree with everything you said diamondback.
I personally love my prime, but i have a couple of issues here and there. Nothing that wont get fixed in the long run. I have a moan here and there, But i still show my support to a brilliant device.
And another thing i have never seen is a compnay actually showing their dedication to fixing the problems like asus. For god sake people they actually have a rep on here talking to people and providing inside information that actually could help. And again in garys posts people are attacking them there.
I really those people who are attacking asus shoulld either:
1. Suck it up and shut up and wait for a fix
2. Sell there device or take it back for a refund and shut up about it.
I know its not the best path, but you have to give a company some time for actually fix these issues. It doesnt happen over night, they ar'nt robots!
Rant over
---------- Post added at 11:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 AM ----------
Diamondback said:
Same here, I think I got one of the first good batches
Nobody started a big ****storm back then and everything is fine today. The Desire HD is still a very good device and it was one of the top sold devices from HTC.
HTC sorted out all problems.
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its funny because i have a DHD, i got one of the bad batches and still using it this day. Although HTC's repair team didnt do anything when i sent it back in. 3 days before my warrenty ran out. But that was a GPS issue for me. And im not really that bothered about it to be fair.
I personally love my phone, ive modded it so many times now ive lost count.
Just remember...Man with hand in pocket feel cocky all day
But aren't we pushing for double-standards here?
Because it would be a ****storm all around if Apple releases a product that has even a single critical flaw. Such as iPhone 4 antennagate. People pay a lot for Apple for quality, they don't expect such problems and Apple has very, very few issues like that with their product launches.
On the other hand we have ASUS who releases a product that has GPS that cannot be used, has weak WiFi range (+ broken WiFi on early US units), weak quality control on screen, keyboard and software issues with crashes and inability to update. Transformer Prime has more early adoption issues than iPhone's and iPad's have had in total.
Apple has set the standard, so when we end up paying a lot of money and face this many problems, being publicly critical about it makes sense. Sure you could say that ASUS is small compared to Apple, but if they want to compete with Apple they simply have to do better. If they release a device that is as flawed, it is not just bad for customers, but Android in general. I remember giving excuses to people who used my HTC Desire back in the day that had a multitouch screen that was not multitouch and it was obvious that it is a lesser device. I will feel just as bad when someone tries to use GPS on my Prime and is confused that it doesn't work and so on, because they -expect- the device to function.
Pat on the back and 'better next time' just doesn't cut it, since many of us will be using the device for more than a year. This is not a startup world, ASUS has been in the business for years, they are ambitious with their claims of having created the best tablet, if they cannot live up to it, they deserve the criticism.
They are a big boy and will hopefully do better next time. Market demands it. Otherwise someone else will simply create better devices and wins over the customers that ASUS has. ASUS is unique in that it offers an innovative keyboard dock with Prime, if it becomes popular then competition will increase and I'll gladly jump ship to manufacturer that has a better history with product launches.
Thank you OP for IMHO a needed and well thought out post.
I completely agree with OP post. People that are unsatisfied can easily return device and move on. But no, instead they love to hang around a nag like women with each other. I can tell most polls made here in thisbsection was made to make the Prime look bad. But guess what, it backfired. Most, if not all polls here show in favor of the Prime in a positive light. Don't believe me, just take a look. Of all the people that voted in them, its always 77-85% or more people that are happy with devices, or defect free or etc...
Although the smear campaigns might hurt a little, the ball is already rolling. Even the negative people not going to be able to stop developement. We already have a good number of developers doing alot of great things without bootloader unlocked yet. We have other major developers just waiting to hit the ground running once unlocking tool is available. Its almost surreal sometimes reading the issues some people have. As from 12/22 my device has worked great everyday and have really been enjoying it. Its really sad how some people try to nitpick every single little thing.
If you are unsatisfied with device, do like moderator Jerdog said. Which was get rid of device then, whine somewhere else, AND GO AWAY! Developers not going to want to hear your sob stories. Just imagine once custom roms start being made. Are those same people going to whine all the time after an early build is built n has some issues to be fixed?
Another thing also, some people are plain stupid. They smear n attack Asus for the Prime yet they talk of getting the new A-700. Dumb move. This new device hasn't even been proven tl be better then the Prime and won't be out for 4-5 months at the earliest. People just assume its better because it has a plastic strip across the back. Nothing can be assumed. This hasn't been thouroughly tested or reviewed by major tech sites to say its better. Which a mini test of sorts showed it wasn't, as far as wireless goes. To me. Asus is a great company because I received a great product. If people are to stupid to just return device instead of crying up here online, then that's on them. As they clearly have seen the people that love their devices way outnumber those who don't. sand ususally its the same people always complaining. That's why I've stopped trying to combat them in the threads really. I just report the post or thread, if its unreasonable. This has been working as several complaining threads already have been shut down. Even moderator tired of all the whining.
Just carry your a$$ somewhere else if you don't like your device. Plain n simple!
kristovaher said:
On the other hand we have ASUS who releases a product that has GPS that cannot be used, has weak WiFi range (+ broken WiFi on early US units), weak quality control on screen, keyboard and software issues with crashes and inability to update. Transformer Prime has more early adoption issues than iPhone's and iPad's have had in total.
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Click to collapse
I've had NONE of the issues you mentioned. The only thing I can't confirm that works 100% is the GPS since I did not buy this tablet to use as a primary GPS unit! I have a phone that does that and is more PORTABLE since it fits in my pants pocket. Last I tried using the GPS, it locked on my exact location in less than a minute. But really, I didn't really care, I only tested it because of all the damn *****ing on this forum.
So yes, I am a proud owner of a Prime with a "functioning" GPS, STANDARD wifi range, a VIVID screen, operational keyboard dock, no software issues, and updated with ICS.
First, OP, this isn’t just about Asus. What you’re saying in your post is that to protect the image and viability of a product (any product), people should suck up what they’re handed and deal with problems quietly in a way that benefits the manufacturer. That way, the product’s image will be protected. That’s great for current owners looking to reinforce their purchase and to grow the user base, but what about people that haven’t yet purchased the product? Hide defects and issues from them so they can figure it out themselves? If Acer hoses the A700 launch, would you give the same advice to their board? This goes against the principles of XDA.
Back to the Prime. Many of the issues discussed here caused people to say the Prime wasn’t right for them and either returned them or passed. Would you deprive them of that knowledge beforehand to further your personal agenda? Did you sign the “unlock the bootloader” petition? If so, then you’re being somewhat hypocritical.
Manufacturers need to be held accountable for their decisions. In Asus’ case, the choice of a metal back cover, claiming “GPS” when there wasn’t, racing the Prime to market with inadequate testing, and the random QC issues were all self-inflicted. Following your guidance, if this was kept quiet and didn’t impact sales, what incentive would they have going forward to sweat the details and deliver high quality products starting with unit number one?
Any “damage done to the Prime” was done in meeting rooms in Taiwan long before anyone here had a Prime in their hands. And h/w and s/w aside, hopefully Asus learned from this that customers aren’t sheep and willing to accept what they’re given and in the future will provide more frequent, accurate, and consistent communication before and after they launch a product. It’s terrific that after the damage was done Gary Key’s been proactive in cleaning up the mess and Asus offered a six-month warranty extension. Let’s give them an “A” for that. They get an “F” for how they managed the launch, communication, some of their design choices, and initial QC. So, at best, they’ve earned a “C.” If they’re a learning organization, let’s see what they do with the TF700. If it’s a repeat of the Prime, then God help them. And if the TF700 is everything the Prime should have been, that’s what’s going to cause the problems you outlined to happen, not the *****ing.
My friends that bought (and returned) Prime’s are pissed. Anyone trying to get one before the holidays went through flaming hoops and invested a lot of time and energy that they won’t get back via a “refund.” They’ll never purchase an Asus product again and are telling everyone they know about their experience. So even if everyone on XDA follows your advice, the damage will continue long after the postings stop. And it should because that’s what keeps manufacturers in check.
How are the beta testers doing today? Are you feeling like you paid $500+ to beta test the prime for Asus/Nvidia/Google? Well me too!!
At this point, I have been through several firmwares that have both broken and fixed specific issues that I have run into. I just want things to get resolved with every new update, that is not the case currently.
I am terribly frustrated after giving my beautiful prime to my dad to see how amazing this tablet is, only to have him give it back a few minutes later after several things he tried either crashed, or did not respond to input at all!
This is not the first time I have given it to someone who wanted to be wowed-- and wasn't!!!
After trying really hard to remain an Asus fan through all of this, I am starting to feel like just an unpaid beta tester.
I know that Asus is trying really hard to make it's prime the device it was promised to be but I am getting less convinced by the day that we will ever get this.
I am not claiming that Asus is entirely at fault, but ultimately, it is their product and their decisions to use the hardware and software that they did- as well as to make those components work together properly.
I WANT TO KNOW WHAT I GET FOR BEING A BETA TESTER!!!
We should all be asking this question of Asus at this point. Even those of us who have had decent experiences with the prime have still run into issues....
(yes, even demandarin has had issues despite professing his undying admiration)
Get a refund...
Sounds like you have a defective tablet. Your post is unlikely to be well accepted for two reasons. The first is that you're not disclosing what you've done to resolve this issue for yourself. The second is that you've only come here to complain rather than obtain help for yourself.
Aye, really didn't need another thread about a four month running old joke.
Yes, a lot about the Prime's life up to now has sucked ridiculously hard and there are some very obvious issues with ASUS in general. But they haven't abandoned anyone (maybe Italy and Greek with the GPS dongle) and, as mentioned, you'd likely succeed in getting a refund if you're really not happy with the device; then you really almost did get to beta test for ASUS because you've used the hell out of the device and come out no poorer for having the opportunity after returning it to them.
Good luck with your Prime adventures, sorry it's not working out as well for you as it is me. Yes I experience some issues (especially when I'm dumb enough to blindly update), but nothing so far has stopped this thing from wow'ing everyone around me.
Cappurnikus said:
Sounds like you have a defective tablet. Your post is unlikely to be well accepted for two reasons. The first is that you're not disclosing what you've done to resolve this issue for yourself. The second is that you've only come here to complain rather than obtain help for yourself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I want to know how it is possible that the tablet is defective when everyone(even those who say they have no other issues) have issues still. And I have been here since the launch trying to get help for my poor prime(mostly reading the helpful posts since I don't have a lot of time to post myself).
As for issues, I will cite the games that will no longer work properly after the .21 update, also the touchscreen issues(without root and calibration), and the overall lack of real system stability, force closes, browser freezes, stutters when opening apps, browser scrolling is crappy at best. Wifi--- should I even mention the fact that no prime I have ever worked with maintained a reliable wifi connection. Frequent forget/re-learn or disconnect/reconnect required to get it back!!
Maybe coming off a fresh reset, it is snappy, but it lags after using it for a small period of time. I have used 6 primes at this point from b-c up to #3 and none of them were without these issues.
In addition to all of that, I was looking forward to unlocking (not partial unlocking) and anticipation of some rom play. I refuse to unlock, obviously unlocking without allowing the proper recovery methods is not wise at this point.
I don't want to find out that my favorite hardware maker is not up to the task, and had some renewed faith with the GPS dongle, but I am really having a hard time. I love the prime in idea, but the device itself has not lived up to the promises and I just want them to do something more than an ugly add on to an otherwise beautiful device to resolve the months of frustration that so many have had. It does address the GPS issue, and I appreciate that they did address it, BUT that does not make up for the other issues that even the good primes have.
Show me a "good" prime and I will show you why it has issues, and you will be sad too. I have done this with 2 different owners who said theirs were "perfect". They were just not using the device to do the same things and assumed everything was working properly.
If you don't want to "Beta test" a product that costs so damn much, shut the **** up and buy products that have already been on the market for enough _years_ (and I mean like > 5) to be fully beta tested instead of something shiny and new.
Guess what? This isn't an Original Droid or a G1, it's a new device. Live with it or return it for a refund 'cuz this isn't a place for whining.
Now back to your regularlly scheduled beta tests....
Spidey-- apparently you don't have a very good grasp on what a beta tester is, and the cost was never the issue-- it was that there was a cost at all to beta test a product!!!
Beta Tester: someone who tests a product before it is released. Product testers help companies identify weak points in their products which could cause consumer frustration, and they also identify specific issues which need to be corrected before a product can be released. Typically, beta testers test several incarnations of a product, until it is deemed ready for release. Most commonly, beta testers work with electronics and software.
SURE SOUNDS LIKE ASUS NEEDED SOME OF THOSE GUYS... and never found them until they released the device to US, the unwitting consumers.
To be clear, I would not have minded being one of those beta testers, but we should not have had to pay so damn much for that honor.
btw spidey, stfu? really? Is it really that under your skin?
jordanmw said:
How are the beta testers doing today? Are you feeling like you paid $500+ to beta test the prime for Asus/Nvidia/Google? Well me too!!
At this point, I have been through several firmwares that have both broken and fixed specific issues that I have run into. I just want things to get resolved with every new update, that is not the case currently.
I am terribly frustrated after giving my beautiful prime to my dad to see how amazing this tablet is, only to have him give it back a few minutes later after several things he tried either crashed, or did not respond to input at all!
This is not the first time I have given it to someone who wanted to be wowed-- and wasn't!!!
After trying really hard to remain an Asus fan through all of this, I am starting to feel like just an unpaid beta tester.
I know that Asus is trying really hard to make it's prime the device it was promised to be but I am getting less convinced by the day that we will ever get this.
I am not claiming that Asus is entirely at fault, but ultimately, it is their product and their decisions to use the hardware and software that they did- as well as to make those components work together properly.
I WANT TO KNOW WHAT I GET FOR BEING A BETA TESTER!!!
We should all be asking this question of Asus at this point. Even those of us who have had decent experiences with the prime have still run into issues....
(yes, even demandarin has had issues despite professing his undying admiration)
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Click to collapse
Jordanmw, I know how you feel. I was feeling the same way when I had my prime. Just return it pal you'll feel much better with no regrets. I'm done after trying two but major props to you for sticking with them and went through six (6) and still not satisfied.
ps. these fanboy's I'm telling you, LMFAO.
Crazy, my tablet and the three friends who also bought one all work perfectly!
theoner1 said:
Jordanmw, I know how you feel. I was feeling the same way when I had my prime. Just return it pal you'll feel much better with no regrets. I'm done after trying two but major props to you for sticking with them and went through six (6) and still not satisfied.
ps. these fanboy's I'm telling you, LMFAO.
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Click to collapse
I am actually a fanboy myself, that is why this is so frustrating for me. I did not RMA 6 times or anything but had 6 different ones, each for a week at a time- used as my personal tablet. It was for work-- I still have my personal one that I bought back in the beginning of Feb. C0 serial. That is the one that I bought for myself and all the others are being used by company users. Two of those have been RMA'd for different reasons and came back with the exact same issues that they were sent for.
Cool story Bro!
Okay, we really don't need another one of these...
OP, please search the forum first. There are plenty of other threads where you could have expressed your feelings.
Closed before this produces any serious issues among the users.
No.. this isn't actually a post about the Prime's problems... it's actually about how companies handle things when they screw up. A lot of people here seemed genuinely grateful for what Asus did postfacto... I'm not one of them because my bar is set higher. I expect more from the companies I buy from - well, when it's a $500 tablet anyway.
Here's an example of where the bar SHOULD be set.
A month or so ago, Google announced the Q - basically their version of the Roku or the AppleTV. Thing is, while it's innovative design, it kind of sucked at being an actual Internet appliance. Google admitted the Q was shipped too soon and had significant problems. They halted production.. and here's the kicker - everyone will get a free replacement. They don't even have to return the original. And if you preordered and haven't gotten yours, you get a free one.
Here's the letter they sent out:
We have an important update about your Nexus Q pre-order.
When we announced Nexus Q at Google I/O, we gave away devices to attendees for an early preview. The industrial design and hardware were met with great enthusiasm. We also heard initial feedback from users that they want Nexus Q to do even more than it does today. In response, we have decided to postpone the consumer launch of Nexus Q while we work on making it even better.
To thank you for your early interest, we'd like to extend the Nexus Q preview to our pre-order customers and send you a free device. If you had other items in your order, your credit card will be charged for those items only.
Your Nexus Q will be on its way soon and you will receive a notification and tracking number from Google Play when it ships.
The Nexus Q Team
So, they're giving away free replacements for everyone who has one - who got them for FREE... and everyone who preordered... also gets one for free.
They certainly didn't need to do this. Most people understood that the problems with the Q were relatively minor and most could be fixed with software upgrades... not to mention, the people who got theirs at Google IO didn't actually pay for them. Not an issue - not even a discussion point - Google wants to make sure you stay loyal and stick with them. Anything to make the customer happy. No attempt to try and gloss over the problem or shirk responsibility.
THAT'S customer service, amigos. No screwing around with buckshee hacks. No 'we didn't mean it when we said you have a GPS..'
That's the bar we should set and demand.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/7/31/3207482/nexus-q-consumer-launch-delayed
PS: You'll notice I'm here telling you how great Google is rather than being out there telling others how great Asus is? That's why it's important to encourage customer loyalty... And I don't even HAVE a Q (not available in this country).
TheWerewolf said:
Nice story about google giving away expensive devices for free...
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Click to collapse
To be fair to ASUS, Google is a $207Billion company with almost $40B a year in revenue. The future of the company is hardly riding on them making a profit on their Nexus Q, heck it could be that no one's job is even riding on it given their business situation. Asus on the other hand is like a $6B company in US funds. Google could absorb financial hits that would completely BK or force massive layoffs at many other companies (like ASUS) without blinking. I think ASUS blew it with their QA on recent units but they have made some effort to try to set things right.
You can demand and expect completely-out-of-touch-with-the-rest-of-the-industry replacement/recall policies but you'll probably disappointed most of your life. Even mighty Apple told people they were holding their phones wrong when Antennagate hit. It probably makes more sense to learn your lesson and just move on.
To be honest, I think the world has enough/too many $100B+ companies already.
TheWerewolf said:
No.. this isn't actually a post about the Prime's problems... it's actually about how companies handle things when they screw up. A lot of people here seemed genuinely grateful for what Asus did postfacto... I'm not one of them because my bar is set higher. I expect more from the companies I buy from - well, when it's a $500 tablet anyway.
Here's an example of where the bar SHOULD be set.
A month or so ago, Google announced the Q - basically their version of the Roku or the AppleTV. Thing is, while it's innovative design, it kind of sucked at being an actual Internet appliance. Google admitted the Q was shipped too soon and had significant problems. They halted production.. and here's the kicker - everyone will get a free replacement. They don't even have to return the original. And if you preordered and haven't gotten yours, you get a free one.
Here's the letter they sent out:
We have an important update about your Nexus Q pre-order.
When we announced Nexus Q at Google I/O, we gave away devices to attendees for an early preview. The industrial design and hardware were met with great enthusiasm. We also heard initial feedback from users that they want Nexus Q to do even more than it does today. In response, we have decided to postpone the consumer launch of Nexus Q while we work on making it even better.
To thank you for your early interest, we'd like to extend the Nexus Q preview to our pre-order customers and send you a free device. If you had other items in your order, your credit card will be charged for those items only.
Your Nexus Q will be on its way soon and you will receive a notification and tracking number from Google Play when it ships.
The Nexus Q Team
So, they're giving away free replacements for everyone who has one - who got them for FREE... and everyone who preordered... also gets one for free.
They certainly didn't need to do this. Most people understood that the problems with the Q were relatively minor and most could be fixed with software upgrades... not to mention, the people who got theirs at Google IO didn't actually pay for them. Not an issue - not even a discussion point - Google wants to make sure you stay loyal and stick with them. Anything to make the customer happy. No attempt to try and gloss over the problem or shirk responsibility.
THAT'S customer service, amigos. No screwing around with buckshee hacks. No 'we didn't mean it when we said you have a GPS..'
That's the bar we should set and demand.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/7/31/3207482/nexus-q-consumer-launch-delayed
PS: You'll notice I'm here telling you how great Google is rather than being out there telling others how great Asus is? That's why it's important to encourage customer loyalty... And I don't even HAVE a Q (not available in this country).
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Well said! In my opinion they would gain a stronger customer base.
zenaxe said:
To be fair to ASUS, Google is a $207Billion company with almost $40B a year in revenue. The future of the company is hardly riding on them making a profit on their Nexus Q, heck it could be that no one's job is even riding on it given their business situation. Asus on the other hand is like a $6B company in US funds. Google could absorb financial hits that would completely BK or force massive layoffs at many other companies (like ASUS) without blinking. I think ASUS blew it with their QA on recent units but they have made some effort to try to set things right.
You can demand and expect completely-out-of-touch-with-the-rest-of-the-industry replacement/recall policies but you'll probably disappointed most of your life. Even mighty Apple told people they were holding their phones wrong when Antennagate hit. It probably makes more sense to learn your lesson and just move on.
To be honest, I think the world has enough/too many $100B+ companies already.
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Yeah, I would never expect a smaller company like ASUS to be able to do something like this. But, the Prime really is such a mess in my eyes that it would take something drastic to get me to buy another ASUS product. When you have a seemingly pretty faulty device combined with the absolute horrid customer support (19 days now they've had mine, still waiting for parts) you lose me as a customer. Granted, I also have a faulty ASUS motherboard in my computer, so I have another reason to never buy from them again since that's 2 for 2 of the ASUS products I've ever owned having issues.
If things are better on the Infinity as far as GPS, wifi, blu tooth, build quality (like rear cameras not breaking), then ASUS should just bite the bullet and kill the TF201 and give at least early adopters a trade in. That's what it would take to make me happy, and even then they would still have a huge problem with their repair service. But, at least I would have a better chance of not ever having to deal with them.
This would never happen with Asus not because of money but simply because they don't give a f*ck about their customers.
wifesabitch said:
This would never happen with Asus not because of money but simply because they don't give a f*ck about their customers.
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That's honestly how I feel, and I feel that way 100% because of their terrible customer support. I understand things go wrong especially in this fairly new market of Android tablets. That's the time for your customer service to shine. Instead, they show us how much they care about us by having the worst service I've ever heard of.
ASUS Customer service in not. They could give a rat ask about problems with the Prime.
It is not a matter of how big Google is versus Asus. It is simply doing what is right. The Prime is junk. Asus knows it is junk. Fix it, or replace it.
We paid $500 for this tablet and anyone with any common sense would expect value for their money.