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I'm currently debating buying WidgetLocker, but I'm a bit skeptical since I'm not sure how bad it will lag with my current sleep profile. Can any WidgetLocker users possibly shed some light if they think it will lag on my phone? I'll put my profiles below.
Code:
Temp > 38.6C, Priority: 100, 480 max 160 min, ondemand
Charging/Full, Priority: 75, 710 max 245 min, ondemand
Battery < 25%, Priority: 50 ,480 max 245 min, ondemand
Screen Off, Priority: 25, 245 max 160 min, ondemand
If my sleep profile would make it lag, would bumping it up to 245 max 245 min help any?
Profile recommendations are welcome as well if theres anything that could be done to improve performance without sapping an excessive amount of battery. I have noticed my phone lags waking up sometimes and occasionally just when it's being used.
I would put your sleep profile at either the 2nd or 3rd highest priority - either right after the overtemp profile, or after the "on charger/full" profile.
my profiles usually look something like this (ordered from highest to lowest priority) :
- temperature (can have more than one; highest (over-)temp has highest priority)
- charging/full
- screen off
- battery (can have more than one; lowest battery % has highest priority)
- battery < 101% (this is the sort of like the "off charger, not overtemp, screen on state)
If the "screen off" profile has a higher priority than all the battery conditions, then all the "battery" conditions certainly can only be effective when the screen is on. (Note that the way you have it now, your < 25% battery condition always "wins" over the screen-off profile)
Also, note that your profiles don't contain anything matching the "off charger, 25% < battery < 101%" condition as they stand - what is controlling that, the default profile?
I'm not sure that there are big gains to be had by ratcheting down the min/max cpu frequency for low battery conditions: when you have the display on, it could well be drawing more power than the CPU - so, if your goal is to save battery, it would make sense to have whatever it is you want "computed" to show up on the screen as quickly as possible - so that you can shut the screen off that much quicker.
For the same reason, if most of the time the phone is on you are just "staring at the screen", and nothing is going on in the background, allowing the rate governor to drop to a low frequency saves you only a little bit (if the screen is really the dominant juice-user in that scenario.)
My GSB v1.6 Eris reports using only 2-3 % overnight - it's screen off profile is set to 160/245 - and I seem to be using the "interactive" governor on all profiles ... but I also use Toggle2G with a 10-minute sleep onset delay.
( Probably that means that I don't get email notifications as soon as I could, but that doesn't bother me much - I get them as soon as I unsleep the phone. If you are the type of person that needs to look at their phone every time your facebook updates, then Toggle2G perhaps isn't for you.)
I can't prove it, but so long as you don't peg your CPU minimum frequency too high, and rely on the rate governor to do it's job, most power savings are likely to come from managing the radio state and the screen brightness.
bftb0
What percentages do u recommend bftb0
Sent from my Ginger Tazz using Tapatalk
bftb0 said:
I would put your sleep profile at either the 2nd or 3rd highest priority - either right after the overtemp profile, or after the "on charger/full" profile.
my profiles usually look something like this (ordered from highest to lowest priority) :
- temperature (can have more than one; highest (over-)temp has highest priority)
- charging/full
- screen off
- battery (can have more than one; lowest battery % has highest priority)
- battery < 101% (this is the sort of like the "off charger, not overtemp, screen on state)
If the "screen off" profile has a higher priority than all the battery conditions, then all the "battery" conditions certainly can only be effective when the screen is on. (Note that the way you have it now, your < 25% battery condition always "wins" over the screen-off profile)
Also, note that your profiles don't contain anything matching the "off charger, 25% < battery < 101%" condition as they stand - what is controlling that, the default profile?
I'm not sure that there are big gains to be had by ratcheting down the min/max cpu frequency for low battery conditions: when you have the display on, it could well be drawing more power than the CPU - so, if your goal is to save battery, it would make sense to have whatever it is you want "computed" to show up on the screen as quickly as possible - so that you can shut the screen off that much quicker.
For the same reason, if most of the time the phone is on you are just "staring at the screen", and nothing is going on in the background, allowing the rate governor to drop to a low frequency saves you only a little bit (if the screen is really the dominant juice-user in that scenario.)
My GSB v1.6 Eris reports using only 2-3 % overnight - it's screen off profile is set to 160/245 - and I seem to be using the "interactive" governor on all profiles ... but I also use Toggle2G with a 10-minute sleep onset delay.
( Probably that means that I don't get email notifications as soon as I could, but that doesn't bother me much - I get them as soon as I unsleep the phone. If you are the type of person that needs to look at their phone every time your facebook updates, then Toggle2G perhaps isn't for you.)
I can't prove it, but so long as you don't peg your CPU minimum frequency too high, and rely on the rate governor to do it's job, most power savings are likely to come from managing the radio state and the screen brightness.
bftb0
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never a post that isn't enlightening from you.
Yes my default clock profile (710 max 160 min, might bump it up to 245 min) is the one managing the clock rate when the phone is off the charger. As for Toggle2G that might not be a bad idea, I keep my phone on Airplane Mode most of the time I'm at school (horrible signal = battery draining out the wazoo) but it might not be a bad idea to have for when I'm not at school. Of course I'm not sure I would need it though since I have an extended battery, maybe something to experiment with.
As for profiles, something like this?
Code:
Temp > 38.6C, Priority: 100, 480 max 160 min, ondemand
Screen Off, Priority: 75, 245 max 160 min, ondemand
Charging/Full, Priority: 50 ,710 max 245 min, ondemand
Battery < 25%, Priority: 25, 480 max 245 min, ondemand
If you are already using Airplane Mode because of poor signal conditions, Toggle2G won't help much - the battery will drain just looking for voice/1xRTT service (not to mention 3G). I have a pretty good signal where my phone spends most of it's time, including overnight ( -70 dBm to -80 dBm )
ToastPwnz said:
As for profiles, something like this?
Code:
Temp > 38.6C, Priority: 100, 480 max 160 min, ondemand
Screen Off, Priority: 75, 245 max 160 min, ondemand
Charging/Full, Priority: 50 ,710 max 245 min, ondemand
Battery < 25%, Priority: 25, 480 max 245 min, ondemand
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems OK. I have a couple of battery profiles where I slowly drop the max frequency, and make the default condition explicit by using a "battery < 101%" profile, as in:
Pr Min/Max Governor Condition
90 245/480 interactive Temp > 50.0 C *audible alarm
80 245/604 interactive Temp > 45.2 C
70 528/710 interactive Charging
60 160/245 interactive Screen Off
50 160/480 interactive Battery < 15%
40 160/528 interactive Battery < 25%
30 245/604 interactive Battery < 40%
20 480/710 interactive Battery < 67%
10 480/729 interactive Battery < 101%
I'm not sure this really produces much effect in terms of battery savings, though - for instance, it runs counter to my suggestion (above) that it might actually hurt to slow things down with reduced battery reserve because you just end up with the screen on longer.
I'll also mention that for a period of time I was actually convinced that using setCPU was causing random freeze-ups when used with certain combinations of the CFS kernel, governor choice, and min frequency - and so I didn't even have it installed on my phone. I only recently put setCPU back on my phone because I was noticing that CPUboost settings did not seem to be sticking even within the same session (perhaps I was misinterpreting something, I'm not sure). No random freeze-ups lately.
Because some of the things which actually drain the battery - cell radio, screen time on & brightness, 3G activity level, etc., are so highly variable, I'm not sure that any of the reports on this forum (including mine) can be regarded as particularly meaningful. It takes real dedication to the task (creating reproducible signal conditions and compute/activity workloads) to be able to produce quality data about battery usage. Most folks need to use their phones throughout the day (moving continuously from place to place with widely varying signal levels), so they can't set their phones aside to do such things; their usage is not repeatable, so it is hard to believe them, whether they are saying "great battery life", or "battery life sucks!".
Heck, even at night, when my phone isn't "doing anything", (which you would think would be sort of "reproducible") if I move it 8 inches one way or another on the nightstand, my signal level can change by 10 dBm. That means that if I don't use Airplane Mode overnight, it is really not too meaningful to compare "configuration X" to "configuration Y" on successive nights - because the battery usage by the radio is not reproducible.
I guess the bottom line is - if you can get a full day out of the phone, be happy with that; it's just about what the phone was designed to do.
bftb0
bftb0 said:
If you are already using Airplane Mode because of poor signal conditions, Toggle2G won't help much - the battery will drain just looking for voice/1xRTT service (not to mention 3G). I have a pretty good signal where my phone spends most of it's time, including overnight ( -70 dBm to -80 dBm )
Seems OK. I have a couple of battery profiles where I slowly drop the max frequency, and make the default condition explicit by using a "battery < 101%" profile, as in:
Pr Min/Max Governor Condition
90 245/480 interactive Temp > 50.0 C *audible alarm
80 245/604 interactive Temp > 45.2 C
70 528/710 interactive Charging
60 160/245 interactive Screen Off
50 160/480 interactive Battery < 15%
40 160/528 interactive Battery < 25%
30 245/604 interactive Battery < 40%
20 480/710 interactive Battery < 67%
10 480/729 interactive Battery < 101%
I'm not sure this really produces much effect in terms of battery savings, though - for instance, it runs counter to my suggestion (above) that it might actually hurt to slow things down with reduced battery reserve because you just end up with the screen on longer.
I'll also mention that for a period of time I was actually convinced that using setCPU was causing random freeze-ups when used with certain combinations of the CFS kernel, governor choice, and min frequency - and so I didn't even have it installed on my phone. I only recently put setCPU back on my phone because I was noticing that CPUboost settings did not seem to be sticking even within the same session (perhaps I was misinterpreting something, I'm not sure). No random freeze-ups lately.
Because some of the things which actually drain the battery - cell radio, screen time on & brightness, 3G activity level, etc., are so highly variable, I'm not sure that any of the reports on this forum (including mine) can be regarded as particularly meaningful. It takes real dedication to the task (creating reproducible signal conditions and compute/activity workloads) to be able to produce quality data about battery usage. Most folks need to use their phones throughout the day (moving continuously from place to place with widely varying signal levels), so they can't set their phones aside to do such things; their usage is not repeatable, so it is hard to believe them, whether they are saying "great battery life", or "battery life sucks!".
Heck, even at night, when my phone isn't "doing anything", (which you would think would be sort of "reproducible") if I move it 8 inches one way or another on the nightstand, my signal level can change by 10 dBm. That means that if I don't use Airplane Mode overnight, it is really not too meaningful to compare "configuration X" to "configuration Y" on successive nights - because the battery usage by the radio is not reproducible.
I guess the bottom line is - if you can get a full day out of the phone, be happy with that; it's just about what the phone was designed to do.
bftb0
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hm, I might try those profiles with a few tweaks, or I might just end up bumping up my screen off profile in terms of priority, not sure yet.
Another question, what do you suggest as far as governors go? I seem to have the most success with ondemand, but I've never tried interactive. I learned the hard way that smartass lags my phone horribly, not sure why.
With my extended battery, I've gone roughly 65 hours total uptime with about 45% battery left with moderate use. I guess I should be proud of that.
ToastPwnz said:
I'm currently debating buying WidgetLocker, but I'm a bit skeptical since I'm not sure how bad it will lag with my current sleep profile. Can any WidgetLocker users possibly shed some light if they think it will lag on my phone? I'll put my profiles below.
Code:
Temp > 38.6C, Priority: 100, 480 max 160 min, ondemand
Charging/Full, Priority: 75, 710 max 245 min, ondemand
Battery < 25%, Priority: 50 ,480 max 245 min, ondemand
Screen Off, Priority: 25, 245 max 160 min, ondemand
If my sleep profile would make it lag, would bumping it up to 245 max 245 min help any?
Profile recommendations are welcome as well if theres anything that could be done to improve performance without sapping an excessive amount of battery. I have noticed my phone lags waking up sometimes and occasionally just when it's being used.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow you actually set a max of 480 for merely being over 38.6C??? I think that's a bit extreme. Other than that your profiles aren't that different than what I use (using Conap's CPUBoost tool, what are you using?).
I love WidgetLocker, and yes it's one of the only two apps I've actually purchased. Lag or not I wouldn't trade it.
The only "issue" (not necessarily WL's fault) is that using the Theme Chooser under GB ROMs, at least with the Speedometer Battery theme, definitely causes WL to lose what widgets are on it between reboots, although not always every reboot, but most of them.
It's confirmed that the solution is to not use Theme Chooser, at least with the Speedometer Battery theme. I don't know for sure if other themes cause it as well, but it's easily reversed (go back to the stock theme) if it does.
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
Wow you actually set a max of 480 for merely being over 38.6C??? I think that's a bit extreme. Other than that your profiles aren't that different than what I use (using Conap's CPUBoost tool, what are you using?).
I love WidgetLocker, and yes it's one of the only two apps I've actually purchased. Lag or not I wouldn't trade it.
The only "issue" (not necessarily WL's fault) is that using the Theme Chooser under GB ROMs, at least with the Speedometer Battery theme, definitely causes WL to lose what widgets are on it between reboots, although not always every reboot, but most of them.
It's confirmed that the solution is to not use Theme Chooser, at least with the Speedometer Battery theme. I don't know for sure if other themes cause it as well, but it's easily reversed (go back to the stock theme) if it does.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm still using SetCPU.
Yes I do knock it down that far, my phone heats up like crazy while I'm at school (terrible signal) and once it reaches 100F I could use the phone as a hand warmer and if I take off the back I can smell burning plastic. Maybe thats normal for the Eris, but I use it just as a precautionary measure.
ToastPwnz said:
Another question, what do you suggest as far as governors go? I seem to have the most success with ondemand, but I've never tried interactive. I learned the hard way that smartass lags my phone horribly, not sure why.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't spent much time trying to figure out the "best" governor - I tend to use either "ondemand" or "interactive" without giving it too much thought. I tried smartass for a while, and remember being not happy with it for some reason or another; but I don't remember what those reasons were. ( It might have been nothing more than "choppiness" of scrolling behaviors. )
bftb0 said:
I haven't spent much time trying to figure out the "best" governor - I tend to use either "ondemand" or "interactive" without giving it too much thought. I tried smartass for a while, and remember being not happy with it for some reason or another; but I don't remember what those reasons were. ( It might have been nothing more than "choppiness" of scrolling behaviors. )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now my curiosity is getting the best of me. Whats the difference between ondemand and interactive? (Sorry for all my questions <.<)
ToastPwnz said:
Now my curiosity is getting the best of me. Whats the difference between ondemand and interactive? (Sorry for all my questions <.<)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know for sure...
... but I can tell you that the exact answer to your question is right here.
bftb0 said:
I don't know for sure...
... but I can tell you that the exact answer to your question is right here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hidden within that garbled mess.
I kid, I think I found the explanation you had in mind, and from what I can find the only major difference is that interactive is more aggressive then ondemand. I'm not sure if I should take that governor for a test run or not, I do notice that my phone lags when waking up occasionally. It kind of sounds like switching to interactive might help that.
ToastPwnz said:
I'm still using SetCPU.
Yes I do knock it down that far, my phone heats up like crazy while I'm at school (terrible signal) and once it reaches 100F I could use the phone as a hand warmer and if I take off the back I can smell burning plastic. Maybe thats normal for the Eris, but I use it just as a precautionary measure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You probably have your reasons, but when you're at school, why don't you put it in Airplane mode and just take it off it between classes to check emails and such? Save your battery and the heat of your Eris a bunch.
Or do you and you just use the temperature profile as a fallback in case you forget to put it back in Airplane mode?
roirraW "edor" ehT said:
You probably have your reasons, but when you're at school, why don't you put it in Airplane mode and just take it off it between classes to check emails and such? Save your battery and the heat of your Eris a bunch.
Or do you and you just use the temperature profile as a fallback in case you forget to put it back in Airplane mode?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are quite correct sir. That and my I bump my phone occasionally, and I think two days ago it turned on and I didn't notice, and when I checked it I noticed over the course of about 2-3 hours it lost 14% and was at around 95ish F.
I do keep it in Airplane Mode when I'm not using it (and it's off as well), but the profile is pretty much just a precautionary measure.
I got 12% battery drain in 17 hours, standby. I'm not a pro at android but I might give a little tut. on how to save battery life to the max. Atleast, it works for my P500 so it should work for you & for any other android device as well.
Uninstall every unnecessary app, including system apps (those apps, that does not mess up with the system stability - If you uninstall Email app, you will not solve your problems with Gmail app).. same with Messaging. That said, leave as minimum apps in the background as you can. App killer does not solve this problem, it just closes bg apps - they restart after some time. I'm using ATK (Advanced Task Killer), It usually kills 1 - 3 apps, so.. I have a minimum of apps running in the bg.
Basic stuff.. turn off your 3G, wifi, bg sync, gps when not in use. If you need to check your email, use 2G network only option, not 3G. Use 2G always when you don't need 3G speed. Screen brightness is not that important if you set it to anywhere below 70%. It should not drain the battery that fast.
Setcpu - profiles - governors--
My profiles are as follows
Charging - 480min - 748max
Battery <90% - 245min - 600max
Battery <70% - 245min - 600max (U can live with one profile for the battery, I have 2 in case I want to change the 2nd profile)
Screen off - 122min - 245max -- This is what saves my battery in standby.
The governors are ondemand for usage & conservative for screen off.
I'm using Void.echo rom with tapps & gapps modules, uninstalled everything I don't need.
I hope this helps If anyone has a better idea on how to save battery life, please share yours as well.
Thanks for your post, but actually most background apps don't drain battery. I have made lots of experiments (removing system aps, preventing autorun etc., and I don't see any major difference in battery life. So now, I'm on stock 2.2 and I'm now at 80% after almost 30h use: about 20 min talk, 10-15 min wi-fi (mail), 10-15 min EDGE. The latter by the way drains battery more than wi-fi. So instead of messing with system apps I recommend putting the phone in airplane mode during the night and as mentioned in the above post - not using 3G when not needed (EDGE has decent speed).
thats the why linux works !!! use all the memory u possibly can...These Microsoft *****es have changed the way computers were supposed to be used not reinstalling windows and other crapware all the time..Switch to Debian while its still time
And i use these settings
screen off 245-245 powersave (otherwise phone gets hot Its summer in india)
600-245 ondemand otherwise
kopchev said:
Thanks for your post, but actually most background apps don't drain battery. I have made lots of experiments (removing system aps, preventing autorun etc., and I don't see any major difference in battery life. So now, I'm on stock 2.2 and I'm now at 80% after almost 30h use: about 20 min talk, 10-15 min wi-fi (mail), 10-15 min EDGE. The latter by the way drains battery more than wi-fi. So instead of messing with system apps I recommend putting the phone in airplane mode during the night and as mentioned in the above post - not using 3G when not needed (EDGE has decent speed).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If there are many apps running in the bg, phone runs out of ram, so it tries to free up some space constantly. I think that drains battery, not the apps themselves. As well as the more cpu power is used, the faster it drains battery. Airplane mode shuts off any connection, so either that or you could just shut down the phone during night. Hmm you could tell me how to prevent app autorun, i have not looked into that.
btw juicedefender does wonders with the phones battery i had a 2% percent over night normal mode (not airplane) no 3g/Edge/Wifi/Bluetooth active and just sleeping
sarfaraz1989 said:
thats the why linux works !!! use all the memory u possibly can...These Microsoft *****es have changed the way computers were supposed to be used not reinstalling windows and other crapware all the time..Switch to Debian while its still time
And i use these settings
screen off 245-245 powersave (otherwise phone gets hot Its summer in india)
600-245 ondemand otherwise
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True about windows & linux hehe. You havent tried 122-245mhz on screen off? Ofcouse, it lags even when i receive an sms, it's something like this - the screen turns on, then after 2 sec. i hear a notification, then after 1 sec. i see the sms but that does not make any problems for me, it's extreme powersaving
I don't get the point of airplane mode while you're sleeping.
If you don't want to get calls while sleeping, shouldn't it be better if you turn off the phone?
I had a good experience with JuiceDefender until now too. Last night my phone was 100% and no airplane mode while sleeping. It drained only 3%.
SoundTone said:
If there are many apps running in the bg, phone runs out of ram, so it tries to free up some space constantly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From what I've read, Android doesn't swap. It'll just kill the background apps on it's own. I don't think there even is a swap unless you root, rom and create one on your uSD.
rapharias said:
I don't get the point of airplane mode while you're sleeping.
If you don't want to get calls while sleeping, shouldn't it be better if you turn off the phone?
I had a good experience with JuiceDefender until now too. Last night my phone was 100% and no airplane mode while sleeping. It drained only 3%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's more convenient, because the on/off process is quite slow...in contrast - airplane mode on/off is 3-4 secs. In airplane mode you can still use wi-fi. Last night the battery drained only 1%
i read somewhere that changing the CPU speed doesnt change the voltage, thus it does not affect battery life... anyone can confirm this???
As far as I can remember from school, a logic gate uses more power when switching, thus a higher frequency would also mean higher power drain (higher frequency = more switching of the logic gates), without voltage modification.
Voltage is changed in order to keep stability - higher voltage means a more stable logic signal, and a faster switching gate, and thus people reccomend using a higher voltage for higher frequencies/lower voltage for lower frequencies.
Thus, a CPU with so many logic gates does not operate just like a simple resistor. In fact it is worse, because when you use higher voltage AND higher frequency power drain is increased much more.
On the other hand, most modern CPU's simply deactivate CPU regions when idling, so, in case of our hardware (constant voltage) there should not be such a great difference when idling (most of the CPU is powered down). The only thing is for the phone to be REALLY idling (no background tasks eating too much of the CPU when screen off).
Basically, what this means is that if you want extreme power saving use a governor with 128MHz minimum and have as few background services as possible (or at least the ones that are there should be optimized for the least CPU usage).
Now I use the standard governor (248 - 600) and I thing my idle power drain is OK.
I guess I will test a governor that is plain 600MHz and one wit 320 or 480 as a minimum, in order to see if power drain is higher when using a lower lag configuration.
And, just as a guess, if background tasks are triggered by timers, a governor with just 600MHz (or 320 - 600 or 380 - 600?) could (just a wild guess) mean that background tasks take less time to execute, and leave the CPU to si more in IDLE mode, causing a very similar power drain as an extreme power saving governor. But this is just a guess, i have not tested it yet. And it also depends on what apps you have (what the apps do when phone is sleeping).
Basically, my best advice would be to watch the apps (after you install a new app, wait for a night to see if the new app causes a higher drain; if it does, search for another app that does the same thing)
spaic said:
As far as I can remember from school, a logic gate uses more power when switching, thus a higher frequency would also mean higher power drain (higher frequency = more switching of the logic gates), without voltage modification.
Voltage is changed in order to keep stability - higher voltage means a more stable logic signal, and a faster switching gate, and thus people reccomend using a higher voltage for higher frequencies/lower voltage for lower frequencies.
Thus, a CPU with so many logic gates does not operate just like a simple resistor. In fact it is worse, because when you use higher voltage AND higher frequency power drain is increased much more.
On the other hand, most modern CPU's simply deactivate CPU regions when idling, so, in case of our hardware (constant voltage) there should not be such a great difference when idling (most of the CPU is powered down). The only thing is for the phone to be REALLY idling (no background tasks eating too much of the CPU when screen off).
Basically, what this means is that if you want extreme power saving use a governor with 128MHz minimum and have as few background services as possible (or at least the ones that are there should be optimized for the least CPU usage).
Now I use the standard governor (248 - 600) and I thing my idle power drain is OK.
I guess I will test a governor that is plain 600MHz and one wit 320 or 480 as a minimum, in order to see if power drain is higher when using a lower lag configuration.
And, just as a guess, if background tasks are triggered by timers, a governor with just 600MHz (or 320 - 600 or 380 - 600?) could (just a wild guess) mean that background tasks take less time to execute, and leave the CPU to si more in IDLE mode, causing a very similar power drain as an extreme power saving governor. But this is just a guess, i have not tested it yet. And it also depends on what apps you have (what the apps do when phone is sleeping).
Basically, my best advice would be to watch the apps (after you install a new app, wait for a night to see if the new app causes a higher drain; if it does, search for another app that does the same thing)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know about CPU's as much as u, but simple logical thinking helps here.. Low frequency + minimum of bg tasks = great power saving, I have now used the phone for 36hours without charge, 61% battery left. That is not only idling, i write about 50 to 150 sms a day & use the phone for other stuff too. So, those governors & frequencies i mentioned earlier in this post, helps a lot.
fransisco.franco thinks otherwise read the his post that contains the link to his rom devoid.francov6(ROM is cool btw and unfortunately i have a slow sdcard )
I think the first post is by far the best I have seen so far.
Sent from my LG-P500 using Tapatalk
Wow, only 1% all night?
I'll take a deeper look at your tips!
I use devoid.franco with franco.kernel v12. From all ROMs I've isntalled, it's the best: great performance and long battery life.
I get 5% battery drain in 7:30 hours (at night), without doing anything special, without running a custom ROM and without uninstalling apps. I just make sure GPS, Bluetooth, WiFi and data are off before going to bed.
Does anyone underclock? I only do it in certain situations. Do you see it as beneficial? Why or why not?
Sent from my Galaxy S2
EDIT: My settings are attached as a screenshot. My device is underclocked 50% of the time.
In my opinion and from personal use, I don't find underclocking to really be beneficial. I never really saw any better battery life. On the same note, I never really found overclocking and undervolting to be extremely beneficial either. It's like the gains aren't worth the time to tweak everything.
Undervolting, yes. Limiting clock speeds, and setting governer to conservative, yes. I say 1ghz is the best spot without losing much performance, and I get 2 days of battery life (sometimes) compared to the one day before... Stock kernel, you aren't going to see much of a difference because you can't undervolt...
I keep my phone at 800max 200min on conservative with a 85% up and 20% down threshold. I don't even see the phone slow down at 800 plus it saves some battery!
I force underclock when I'm in a situation where I KNOW the clock should never ramp up (Screen-off I set to 500) as a "safety measure" to prevent surprises.
I also may force underclock to 800 when running Navigation once my vehicle dock comes in - since we can't crank our charge current up.
Entropy512 said:
I force underclock when I'm in a situation where I KNOW the clock should never ramp up (Screen-off I set to 500) as a "safety measure" to prevent surprises.
I also may force underclock to 800 when running Navigation once my vehicle dock comes in - since we can't crank our charge current up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My screen off is set to this also (200-500, conservative). You can use Tasker to change frequencies for specific apps automatically.
Hi Guys,
I am a noob here. I have never used a android phone before, not even a iPhone - so basically no smart phones.My first smart/android phone would be Nexus 4 which would be coming tomorrow.
I have been reading threads to understand andriod architecture and believe have understood to certain extent.
I have a question in clocking the CPUs and Voting.
As I understand, we have 3 states -Max, Min and Sleep for a single CPU core
Max - The frequency (clock speed) which CPU executes or maximum speed which CPU sends signals to its components and get the response back. This would be used when the system is on - which means when user is doing some process.. like texting, video chat, gaming (this case GPU is also involved) etc.
Min - This would be for background process when the user/phone is idle - that when screen is off (eq - gmail sync, facebook sync etc..)
Sleep - Screen off and no background process , the core will be in sleep.
And the battery level will be directly propotional to speed of CPU with respect to the volting.
Now lets say there is a single core processor in a phone which can clock upto 1.5GZ. and the stock kernel comes up with Max - 1.3GZ and MIN -0.5 GHZ.
Question is abt overclocking minimum frequency
1. why not overclock the Mn frequency to 1.3Ghz? because the backgroundprocess would be fast and phone/core will be sleeping after that,
which means process consumes more battery at that particular time but overall baterry should be efficient as there would be more sleeping time.
2. About volting, so far I have not seen min and max volting. So is there only one voltage/power drawn for max and min CPU speeds by CPU?
Please correct me if any of my statements is wrong.
Appreciate your help,
Thanks,
Franklin B.
Overclocking the minimum frequency to 1.3ghz would probably decrease your processor's life if you use your phone too much but I have been actually increasing my phone even 200mhz more than it was in stock ROMs, i've been using my device for more than 2 years and it still works perfectly. Finally, it all depends on how much your phone is good.
I also decreased the cpu min and max frequency when phone sleeps to 256 mhz which decreased a lot battery consumption.
Hope i helped !
Don't forget the THANKS button
1.you can but your battery life will be drastically reduced! There is a good amount of time after the screen is off and before the phone sleeps! So if over clock the min to 1.3Ghz, the processor will be running at 1.3Ghz till it goes to sleep! But if that's what you want you can do that!
2 . I'm not so sure about this topic either but I think the processor operates at a particular voltage and I could be wrong!
Sent from my GT-P3100 using Tapatalk 2
Thank you Guys
Franklin Bernard said:
1. why not overclock the Mn frequency to 1.3Ghz? because the backgroundprocess would be fast and phone/core will be sleeping after that,
which means process consumes more battery at that particular time but overall baterry should be efficient as there would be more sleeping time.
2. About volting, so far I have not seen min and max volting. So is there only one voltage/power drawn for max and min CPU speeds by CPU?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, I received your PM. I agree with the guys about the heat issues, longevity, and battery life etc. The answer to your question #2 will help you better understand things.
In all kernels, there are frequency/voltage scaling tables. For every frequency step (clock speed) in the table, it corresponds to a specific voltage. It gets a bit more complicated than this of course, but that is the basic way things are setup in the kernel. The higher the frequency, the higher the voltage is required to be to keep the CPU (or GPU, bus, RAM etc.) stable at a given clock speed. The more voltage, the more current, and the more heat is generated. The longer you stay at higher clock speeds/voltages, the better the cooling system you need to have. Supply regulators are defined to feed the core and rail voltages so that the processor can live in a happy environment no matter what it is being asked to.
As far as power consumption, it's all about getting a unit of work done in a timely/efficient fashion using the least amount of power consumption. If the phone is sleeping, the word "timely" takes on a different meaning so then it is mostly concerned with power consumption and getting the background tasks completed effectively without having the phone experience the sleep of death (SOD). What you are talking about is the theory of "race to sleep" so that the work can be done quickly and the phone can go back to sleep where it uses the least amount of power (clocks actually turn off during deep sleep and cores are turned off). However, there is a happy medium to this theory and heat and battery consumption are the main enemies. Heat can also rob efficiency, more current is required when a circuit heats up. The more a phone wakes up to do syncs for email, apps, social networking, missed calls etc., that work can stack up throughout the day. The question comes down to how can the device get this work done using the least power and keep the device cool. On the N4, the lowest frequencies can use ~700-800mV per core while the highest frequencies can use ~1100mV. There is a drastic difference in the amount of heat generation between this range.
I think this should give you the general idea and maybe more that you wanted to know! Here are some links to check out if you are interested. Google and you will find many many more articles and research papers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltage_and_frequency_scaling
http://atrak.usc.edu/~massoud/Talks/Pedram-dvfs-Taiwan05.pdf
Thanks a ton !!!
For you gamers out there
Finally I solved the thermal throttling problem in this lovely device.
BEWARE **YOUR PHONE WILL HEAT MORE**
first using your root explorer go to system/etc, you will find 3 files related to thermal throttling:
1. thermal-engine-8996-normal.conf
2. thermal-engine-8996-perf.conf
3. thermal-engine.conf
These files related to the configuration in the settings->power manager->power plan.
If you chose performance then your phone will use the perf.conf
If you chose Smart power-save your phone will use normal.conf
Edit:
After further investigation it seems that no matter what setting I choose the file that is active always the normal.conf.
perf.conf seems not affecting anything at all. Needs futher investigation.
That is the mechanic, now for the fun part:
Open the file you wish to edit using text editor.
The key is in these two sections
Code:
[SKIN_CPU_MONITOR]
#algo_type monitor
sampling 1000
sensor emmc_therm
thresholds 59000 62000
thresholds_clr 56000 60000
actions cluster0+cluster1 cluster0+cluster1
action_info 1400000+1700000 1500000+1824000
override 5000
[SKIN_GPU_MONITOR]
#algo_type monitor
sampling 1000
sensor emmc_therm
thresholds 41000 42000
thresholds_clr 39000 40000
actions gpu gpu
action_info 510000000 401800000
override 5000
As you can see the values above are a little bit different from yours, it's because I already change a bit.
The parts you should take consideration are thresholds, thresholds_clr, actions, and action_info.
Thresholds means in what temperature the device should throttle
Thresholds_clr means in what temperature the device will stop throttling
Actions mean which item to be throttled
Cluster0 = Little CPU
Cluster1 = Big CPU
GPU = GPU
so for example above
thresholds 59000
thresholds_clr 56000
actions cluster0+cluster1
action_info 1400000+1700000
Means it will start throttling at 59 celcius and stop throttling at56 celcius, the item to be throttled are little CPU which become 1400 mhz and big CPU which become 1700 mhz
You can add many parameters just by using spaces like example above.
Okay, hope it helps. If you confuse, just use my values above and unleash the 60fps beast. Muahahaha
Edit:
This is my current setting
Code:
[SKIN_CPU_MONITOR]
#algo_type monitor
sampling 1000
sensor tsens_tz_sensor11
thresholds 48000 50000
thresholds_clr 45000 49000
actions cluster0+cluster1 cluster0+cluster1
action_info 1500000+1824000 1400000+1700000
override 5000
Instead of emmc thermostat I use tsens_tz_sensor11 which is the temperature of the CPU core itself, I think it is better
Finally someone make magisk module for this (thanks nfsmw_gr), not yet tried it myself though
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=76793058&postcount=14
I've already moved on to stock b01 oreo rom, now it is located in /system/vendor/etc/thermal-engine.conf
Here is my current config
Code:
[SKIN_CHG_LIMIT]
algo_type monitor
sampling 1000
sensor emmc_therm
thresholds 39000 41000
thresholds_clr 38000 40000
actions battery battery
action_info 1 2
[SKIN_CPU_MONITOR_NORMAL]
algo_type monitor
sampling 1000
sensor emmc_therm
thresholds 36000 39000 42000
thresholds_clr 35000 38000 41000
actions cluster0+cluster1 cluster0+cluster1 cluster0+cluster1
action_info 1500000+1824000 1400000+1700000 1300000+1438000
override 5000
[SKIN_GPU_MONITOR_NORMAL]
algo_type monitor
sampling 1000
sensor emmc_therm
thresholds 41000 42000
thresholds_clr 39000 40000
actions gpu gpu
action_info 510000000 401800000
override 5000
Thank you so much.
Is this valid for destroying the phone without voiding the warranty?
aLexzkter said:
Is this valid for destroying the phone without voiding the warranty?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol, I'm pretty sure there's a failsafe for temps
You'd probably want to also undervolt if you are removing thermal throttling to give yourself a little more headroom. Hellsgate kernel supports undervolting
Been doing similar for months and mentioned about it a few times in various places.
I don't think using the CPU temperature sensor is suitable for throttling as it peaks largely and fluctuates rapidly with corresponding load. The reason emmc_therm (quiet_therm in AOSP ROMs) is probably used for a suitable consistent reading. The related default temperature throttles need to be adjusted to reflect the changed sensor and it's nature. What will happen on your config is sudden throttling on CPU load that will unthrottle rapidly when load is decreased but the battery/device isn't likely any cooler.
Btw on AOSP I can't get any changes to stay after rebooting with disemmcwp system writable too. I'm guessing the kernel or something regenerates the defined values at startup. I found having the file modified through a Magisk module works however.
Sent from my Xperia Z3C using XDA Labs
I know this sounds super lazy but can this possibly be made into a magisk module for convenience for and for ease of enabling/disabling
dalebaxter01 said:
I know this sounds super lazy but can this possibly be made into a magisk module for convenience for and for ease of enabling/disabling
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would like this as well if it's not much hassle.
dalebaxter01 said:
I know this sounds super lazy but can this possibly be made into a magisk module for convenience for and for ease of enabling/disabling
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
put your changed file into this template https://forum.xda-developers.com/mi-5/how-to/how-to-disable-thermal-throttling-t3636574
Infy_AsiX said:
Been doing similar for months and mentioned about it a few times in various places.
I don't think using the CPU temperature sensor is suitable for throttling as it peaks largely and fluctuates rapidly with corresponding load. The reason emmc_therm (quiet_therm in AOSP ROMs) is probably used for a suitable consistent reading. The related default temperature throttles need to be adjusted to reflect the changed sensor and it's nature. What will happen on your config is sudden throttling on CPU load that will unthrottle rapidly when load is decreased but the battery/device isn't likely any cooler.
Btw on AOSP I can't get any changes to stay after rebooting with disemmcwp system writable too. I'm guessing the kernel or something regenerates the defined values at startup. I found having the file modified through a Magisk module works however.
Sent from my Xperia Z3C using XDA Labs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, this is also what I found. At first I just looked at which temp is the highest and use that sensor for the trigger. But then when I use cpu-z to observe the reading, I found that emmc_therm is the most consistent and not fluctuate drastically so much. Therefore I'm back using emmc_therm right now
Seeing this thread gives me flashback in the Android M days where a xposed module was needed to disable a system task killer that would kill my games if they used too much battery once I turn off screen _-_
Never again will I use my phone gaming while overheating message comes up.
It almost killed my phone, not turning on and charging. I had to disassemble the phone and remove the battery to make it charge again.
otaconremo said:
Never again will I use my phone gaming while overheating message comes up.
It almost killed my phone, not turning on and charging. I had to disassemble the phone and remove the battery to make it charge again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should always keep your eyes on the temp. My rule of thumb is under 55 degree is ok, above that is no no. If your games always reach above 55 then you should re-tweak your thermal config.
Use dev check pro to observe the temp, though it doesn't have widget for emmc_therm only the cpu therm, you can still see what's going on under the screen
Okay, so after reading through the comments I made a magisk module for myself to test, using the template from the Mi 5 thread.
I modified all 3 files to be sure it works (my device boots so yeah, try it and let me know).
Also made a copy of the modded files at /system/etc to cover all scenarios because in the ROM I run the files are located in /system/vendor/etc, not in /system/etc as in the OP .
It shouldn't affect anything I think.
Anyway without stalling you'll find the file attached at the bottom, as always you flash at your own risk, have a nice day!
(P.S. If this is ok I'll put it on my thread with my Jojoc mod.)
otaconremo said:
Never again will I use my phone gaming while overheating message comes up.
It almost killed my phone, not turning on and charging. I had to disassemble the phone and remove the battery to make it charge again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No idea how you got that. I've never seen a overheating message on stock N or RR-O. I've gotten the device to overheat shutdown plenty of times after increasing the secondary CPU throttle (hasn't been described here) from 95degC to 105degC. Even on fan with enough load at maximum frequencies the CPU temp can spike to the presumedly 120degC Qualcomm shutdown (dropping one step on big cores is fine). This secondary throttle behaves differently by interrupting performance and unthrottling rapidly. Still boots fine after. I've yet to try if undervolting will allow that final big frequency step, on fan, increased to 105degC, no secondary throttle and no shutdowm.
I'd guess instead your battery voltage dropped too severely low being old degraded and too high a current draw, requiring a reset of the battery PCB or something.
iyancoolbgt said:
You should always keep your eyes on the temp. My rule of thumb is under 55 degree is ok, above that is no no. If your games always reach above 55 then you should re-tweak your thermal config.
Use dev check pro to observe the temp, though it doesn't have widget for emmc_therm only the cpu therm, you can still see what's going on under the screen
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
55 isn't high at all for a CPU. You mean floating monitor overlay? It can select two custom temperatures to show on the dashboard and float monitor. The only real concern is battery temp. Other components are designed and rated to handle high temperatures. FWIW I've been running around 100degC CPU, keeping battery <50degC on fan with battery voltage limited to 3.85V for several months playing various high end games at maximum performance without notable ill effect. Well except that constant heat on the battery even at the safe low voltage will cause degradation, unavoidable cost for higher performance on a phone.
nfsmw_gr said:
Okay, so after reading through the comments I made a magisk module for myself to test, using the template from the Mi 5 thread.
I modified all 3 files to be sure it works (my device boots so yeah, try it and let me know).
Also made a copy of the modded files at /system/etc to cover all scenarios because in the ROM I run the files are located in /system/vendor/etc, not in /system/etc as in the OP .
It shouldn't affect anything I think.
Anyway without stalling you'll find the file attached at the bottom, as always you flash at your own risk, have a nice day!
(P.S. If this is ok I'll put it on my thread with my Jojoc mod.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That location sounds like how it was when I tried AEX-O. Don't know if anything's changed there but no files could affect ROM thermal throttling on it then. The files there are different too, maybe generic Sd820 config or something, whereas RR-O uses the same sensors, values and config as stock N. I did also try the stock config modded to AEX but still no go. The only file with effect where it works is the -normal.conf.
Infy_AsiX said:
No idea how you got that. I've never seen a overheating message on stock N or RR-O. I've gotten the device to overheat shutdown plenty of times after increasing the secondary CPU throttle (hasn't been described here) from 95degC to 105degC. Even on fan with enough load at maximum frequencies the CPU temp can spike to the presumedly 120degC Qualcomm shutdown (dropping one step on big cores is fine). This secondary throttle behaves differently by interrupting performance and unthrottling rapidly. Still boots fine after. I've yet to try if undervolting will allow that final big frequency step, on fan, increased to 105degC, no secondary throttle and no shutdowm.
I'd guess instead your battery voltage dropped too severely low being old degraded and too high a current draw, requiring a reset of the battery PCB or something.
55 isn't high at all for a CPU. You mean floating monitor overlay? It can select two custom temperatures to show on the dashboard and float monitor. The only real concern is battery temp. Other components are designed and rated to handle high temperatures. FWIW I've been running around 100degC CPU, keeping battery <50degC on fan with battery voltage limited to 3.85V for several months playing various high end games at maximum performance without notable ill effect. Well except that constant heat on the battery even at the safe low voltage will cause degradation, unavoidable cost for higher performance on a phone.
That location sounds like how it was when I tried AEX-O. Don't know if anything's changed there but no files could affect ROM thermal throttling on it then. The files there are different too, maybe generic Sd820 config or something, whereas RR-O uses the same sensors, values and config as stock N. I did also try the stock config modded to AEX but still no go. The only file with effect where it works is the -normal.conf.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mind sharing your own config?
Infy_AsiX said:
No idea how you got that. I've never seen a overheating message on stock N or RR-O. I've gotten the device to overheat shutdown plenty of times after increasing the secondary CPU throttle (hasn't been described here) from 95degC to 105degC. Even on fan with enough load at maximum frequencies the CPU temp can spike to the presumedly 120degC Qualcomm shutdown (dropping one step on big cores is fine). This secondary throttle behaves differently by interrupting performance and unthrottling rapidly. Still boots fine after. I've yet to try if undervolting will allow that final big frequency step, on fan, increased to 105degC, no secondary throttle and no shutdowm.
I'd guess instead your battery voltage dropped too severely low being old degraded and too high a current draw, requiring a reset of the battery PCB or something.
55 isn't high at all for a CPU. You mean floating monitor overlay? It can select two custom temperatures to show on the dashboard and float monitor. The only real concern is battery temp. Other components are designed and rated to handle high temperatures. FWIW I've been running around 100degC CPU, keeping battery <50degC on fan with battery voltage limited to 3.85V for several months playing various high end games at maximum performance without notable ill effect. Well except that constant heat on the battery even at the safe low voltage will cause degradation, unavoidable cost for higher performance on a phone.
That location sounds like how it was when I tried AEX-O. Don't know if anything's changed there but no files could affect ROM thermal throttling on it then. The files there are different too, maybe generic Sd820 config or something, whereas RR-O uses the same sensors, values and config as stock N. I did also try the stock config modded to AEX but still no go. The only file with effect where it works is the -normal.conf.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe my battery is too degraded already. That only happens when my batt is below 20% and I was still gaming. That's why I'm very careful already when I'm getting lowbat. Btw, I'm using stock chinese mf5 version. The overheating message is from the Mi-Assistant app (Power Manager).
nfsmw_gr said:
Mind sharing your own config?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did awhile back but I guess it's a little scattered across posts. I was about to edit in another paragraph with more info but I'll put it here now instead. I'll consider cleaning up the new stuff to share, performance profiles is just a varied collection of performance levels.
I've setup various CPU GPU performance profiles to switch between using Tasker. From testing, the highest I'd go without a fan is 1600/1800 big and 1300 small. With a constant load at these frequencies the battery will still hit up to around 50degC, matching the much higher perf allowed with a fan.
Here's a tidbit to get y'all thinking about environmental impact on heat. Stock Daydream sets a Sustainable Performance mode that uses all cores at 1200MHz. In the Daydream Headset V1, the back of the phone actually has an air gap behind it because of raised nubs inside the headset. Yet with all this the battery can rather easily heat to over 55degC after a few dozen minutes. The headset v2 has a built in heatsink, with minor improvement apparently. Also on an off-topic note, that Sustained Performance mode gets stuck to on after using Daydream on stock N. Things no one notices unless you actually monitor
---------- Post added at 10:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:09 PM ----------
otaconremo said:
I believe my battery is too degraded already. That only happens when my batt is below 20% and I was still gaming. That's why I'm very careful already when I'm getting lowbat. Btw, I'm using stock chinese mf5 version. The overheating message is from the Mi-Assistant app (Power Manager).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah sounds like my guess about an undervolted degraded battery. Oh I had that frozen so never got that alert. I'd assume it occurs when battery is 55degC or so, that's when Daydream alerts too for example.
Infy_AsiX said:
No idea how you got that. I've never seen a overheating message on stock N or RR-O. I've gotten the device to overheat shutdown plenty of times after increasing the secondary CPU throttle (hasn't been described here) from 95degC to 105degC. Even on fan with enough load at maximum frequencies the CPU temp can spike to the presumedly 120degC Qualcomm shutdown (dropping one step on big cores is fine). This secondary throttle behaves differently by interrupting performance and unthrottling rapidly. Still boots fine after. I've yet to try if undervolting will allow that final big frequency step, on fan, increased to 105degC, no secondary throttle and no shutdowm.
I'd guess instead your battery voltage dropped too severely low being old degraded and too high a current draw, requiring a reset of the battery PCB or something.
55 isn't high at all for a CPU. You mean floating monitor overlay? It can select two custom temperatures to show on the dashboard and float monitor. The only real concern is battery temp. Other components are designed and rated to handle high temperatures. FWIW I've been running around 100degC CPU, keeping battery <50degC on fan with battery voltage limited to 3.85V for several months playing various high end games at maximum performance without notable ill effect. Well except that constant heat on the battery even at the safe low voltage will cause degradation, unavoidable cost for higher performance on a phone.
That location sounds like how it was when I tried AEX-O. Don't know if anything's changed there but no files could affect ROM thermal throttling on it then. The files there are different too, maybe generic Sd820 config or something, whereas RR-O uses the same sensors, values and config as stock N. I did also try the stock config modded to AEX but still no go. The only file with effect where it works is the -normal.conf.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe I'm just too cautious But still, too much heat makes my hands really not comfortable.
I know we can customize which temperature to show, but no emmc_therm unfortunately. Reading your comment make me thinking, if the real concern is the battery temp, then why not using it as the trigger for the thermal config? It is listed as 'battery' in cpu-z list of thermal sensors. It means that we can use it right?
nfsmw_gr said:
Okay, so after reading through the comments I made a magisk module for myself to test, using the template from the Mi 5 thread.
I modified all 3 files to be sure it works (my device boots so yeah, try it and let me know).
Also made a copy of the modded files at /system/etc to cover all scenarios because in the ROM I run the files are located in /system/vendor/etc, not in /system/etc as in the OP .
It shouldn't affect anything I think.
Anyway without stalling you'll find the file attached at the bottom, as always you flash at your own risk, have a nice day!
(P.S. If this is ok I'll put it on my thread with my Jojoc mod.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, that's so cool. I'll put it on the first post