Related
I am now loving CM7, running great with Glitch's kernel, and enjoying learning the nuances and differences in the phone now.
I am pleased that we can do nightlies and such via Rom Manager, but there is some confusion in my mind with regard to using Rom Manager to do much of anything right now.
It seems from all my reading and experimenting that we have very specific versions of CWM for use with our various kernels and roms. It is also clear that we are not to use the three finger salute to get into CWM - and I have not tried to do so due to being told not to - only get threre from ADB or the power menu (reboot>recovery)
But if I try to use Rom Manaver to even look around, it states that I need to have CWM installed to use the features. But as I understand it, I do have CWM installed, and Rom Manager is unaware of that fact...
So - my question (long way to get there, I know, sorry, I am long winded) is do we essentially have 2 CWM's on phone now? One that is accessed from the three finger salute and will not play with CM7, and another from the power menu or ADB that does play with CM7?
Is it safe to let Rom Manager install its own version and still have access to the 'correct' version for US (meaning Fascinate users, not all CM7 users...) to use in CM7?
I'm guessing this is like when people had to apply update.zip from stock recovery, but would love to clarify the confusion in my head - I can;t be the only thick skull-ed user out here wondering about this...
A question I now have as well since I just installed CM7. Rom Manager shows no clockwork mod recovery installed, then when prompted asks for either Captivate MTD, Vibrant MTD or Galaxy Si9000 mtd.
I only have the 3 finger recovery or ask it to reboot via Rom Manager. I miss the long press of the power button to give me all those choices I used to have.
M00NEY said:
I am now loving CM7, running great with Glitch's kernel, and enjoying learning the nuances and differences in the phone now.
I am pleased that we can do nightlies and such via Rom Manager, but there is some confusion in my mind with regard to using Rom Manager to do much of anything right now.
It seems from all my reading and experimenting that we have very specific versions of CWM for use with our various kernels and roms. It is also clear that we are not to use the three finger salute to get into CWM - and I have not tried to do so due to being told not to - only get threre from ADB or the power menu (reboot>recovery)
But if I try to use Rom Manaver to even look around, it states that I need to have CWM installed to use the features. But as I understand it, I do have CWM installed, and Rom Manager is unaware of that fact...
So - my question (long way to get there, I know, sorry, I am long winded) is do we essentially have 2 CWM's on phone now? One that is accessed from the three finger salute and will not play with CM7, and another from the power menu or ADB that does play with CM7?
Is it safe to let Rom Manager install its own version and still have access to the 'correct' version for US (meaning Fascinate users, not all CM7 users...) to use in CM7?
I'm guessing this is like when people had to apply update.zip from stock recovery, but would love to clarify the confusion in my head - I can;t be the only thick skull-ed user out here wondering about this...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rom manager is completely useless to us until nightlies start. You can use it to fix permissions but that's about it. Rom manager recognizes our kernel as the mtd kernel and the captivate, vibrant and galaxy s are the only mtd roms officially supported by RM. However, very soon, you will see fascinatemtd added to that list. Go ahead and use RM flash clockworkmod recovery. Even though you flash it in RM, it will use the recovery that you are already using.....so nothing to worry about.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App
Thanks. Just learned from a user on another forum that hitting reboot in the power menu gives a submenu of recovery and reboot. So now I no longer have to depend on the 3 fingers. Looking forward to the ROM manager update to allow us nightlies.
kidserious said:
Go ahead and use RM flash clockworkmod recovery. Even though you flash it in RM, it will use the recovery that you are already using.....so nothing to worry about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sincerely appreciate this explanation. You sir, impress me each and every day with your patience<>knowledge.
(I used the thanks button, but I wanna personally thank you kidserious!)
So I have tenfar's CWM on my phone right now, but I've heard a bit about ROM Manager, and it seems easier to use. I'm wondering what if any drawbacks it has over what I'm using.
CWMs
Tenfar's works with latest OTA 4.5.91, but your mileage will vary with the ROM Manager. As far as I can tell Rom Manager does not work unless you have an unlocked bootloader. I have installed both and tried to use Rom Manager and it has never worked for me. Tenfar on the other hand works flawlessly and as described. I'd go with Tenfar over Rom Manager because Tenfar's works with locked bootloaders and honestly I don't think Rom Manager works at all, unless your boot loader is unlocked. Then you might have some luck. Rom Manager also wants you to pay money for it.
ROM Manager is incompatible with Tenfar's version of CWM, and the one that it'll install has issues with wiping data and cache. This makes it somewhat useless until thats fixed.
CancerJesus said:
So I have tenfar's CWM on my phone right now, but I've heard a bit about ROM Manager, and it seems easier to use. I'm wondering what if any drawbacks it has over what I'm using.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what is hard about Tenfar's CWM?????....i have never found an issue with his CWM...it makes a perfect backup, perfect restore, flash roms....flash add-ons...never had a single problem...
Nothing is hard about it, but from what I understand about ROM Manager, you simply click the ROM you want to flash and next thing you know, it's flashed... I also forget to hold down the volume rocker sometimes which is a pain in the ass (although that's my own dumb fault)
I would have to agree. I used ROM Manager on my N1 for a long time and I would just jump from ROM to ROM for the fun of it but using the "manual" method (eg. Tenfar's) it kind of makes me want to stick with a ROM for extended periods of time.
Don't get me wrong, there is nothing "hard" about using Tenfar's CWM or anything like that, it's just a preferential thing.
Jotokun said:
ROM Manager is incompatible with Tenfar's version of CWM, and the one that it'll install has issues with wiping data and cache. This makes it somewhat useless until thats fixed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doesn't make it useless. You just fastboot -w when using ROM Manager.
Have an AT&T Galaxy S2 running CM9 nightly 6/21, and have Rom Manager premium.
When I run the "Flash Clockwork Mod Recovery" i see 5 options, the first is "Samsung AT&T GalaxyS2" and the last is "Samsung GalaxyS2 (SGH-I777).
Well, I am on AT&T, and I have the SGH-I777 which I thought was only AT&T, so not sure which is which. Why are there two? Which is right?
But read on...
If I flash the first then Rom Manager says I have 5.0.2.6.
If I flash the last then Rom Manager says I have 5.8.1.8.
After flashing either one, when I boot into recovery (with the power button) the version running is 5.5.0.4, at least that's what it says at the top.
So I looked at the web site, and decided to try downloading from there the touch version showing as file Recovery-Clockwork-touch-5.8.1.5-GalaxyS2ATT.zip. I flashed it in CWM. When it flashes for that point in time it goes into a touch version. If I reboot, I'm back to 5.0.2.6.
No matter what I flash, I end up with 5.0.2.6. That's not bad, it works, I never have trouble installing CM9 versions either manual downloads or Rom Manager invoked installs.
But what's going on -- isn't doing the update of CWM supposed to, when I boot into recovery, show that version?
I've tried a bunch of different searches, and cannot find anything specifically about flashing CWM not working, at least not in this vein. And I can't find anywhere that distinguishes why there are two almost identical CWM's out there, but very different versions (and no, not talking about touch vs. non-touch -- talking about the way they are labeled above for this phone).
I think rom manager does it weird by flashing another recovery on top of what you already have so you then have two different ones on your phone. Another reason not to use it.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using Tapatalk 2
I've never used ROM Manager to do anything on this phone but manage backups but mine reads the same way. It tells me I have that 5.8 version installed when I'm actually running 5.5.0.4 that came with my roms kernel.
Basically don't use Rom Manager. The GS2 does things differently than most phones concerning recovery and Rom Manager can't work with it.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
http://download2.clockworkmod.com/recoveries/recovery-clockwork-5.8.1.8-i777.zip
I found this but havent tried it yet.
So what is the right way to change recovery versions? Or should one not?
This version I presume came from when I rooted, long ago? There is not on in cm9's install right?
If you're running CM9 just leave it alone. There's no need to update it. The only way to change it is to switch kernels or build your own. Recovery doesn't live in its own space on this phone like it does for every other device, its part of the kernel on the GS2.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
Slavestate said:
If you're running CM9 just leave it alone. There's no need to update it. The only way to change it is to switch kernels or build your own. Recovery doesn't live in its own space on this phone like it does for every other device, its part of the kernel on the GS2.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you.
This is the first time I rooted my phone and I used step 6 on this link in your forum http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1238070 . Everything went fine but I then downloaded rom manager and when I select flash clockworkmod it only gives me the choice of choosing the samsung epic4g or the samsung galaxyS i9000. It does not give me the option of choosing the fascinate. I selected the i9000 but stopped there because I figured that I should try to fix this situation and be able to select the fascinate, before I move foward. Please help me move foward so I will be able to put a rom on my phone. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
lucash312 said:
This is the first time I rooted my phone and I used step 6 on this link in your forum http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1238070 . Everything went fine but I then downloaded rom manager and when I select flash clockworkmod it only gives me the choice of choosing the samsung epic4g or the samsung galaxyS i9000. It does not give me the option of choosing the fascinate. I selected the i9000 but stopped there because I figured that I should try to fix this situation and be able to select the fascinate, before I move foward. Please help me move foward so I will be able to put a rom on my phone. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
rom manager is useless for the fascinate...
I also ran into this issue. If your CWM is not "sticky" (it goes to System Recovery <3e> when you reboot recovery), you must flash the appropriate version of CWM with ODIN before a ROM flash. (CWM ALL.tar for bml roms [anything that is not cm7, MIUI, or ICS] or cwm4_fixed_for_cm7.tar for MTD ROM's [cm7, MIUI, or ICS])
MultipleMonomials said:
I also ran into this issue. If your CWM is not "sticky" (it goes to System Recovery <3e> when you reboot recovery), you must flash the appropriate version of CWM with ODIN before a ROM flash. (CWM ALL.tar for bml roms [anything that is not cm7, MIUI, or ICS] or cwm4_fixed_for_cm7.tar for MTD ROM's [cm7, MIUI, or ICS])
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
if the op would of followed the guides instructions correctly, he would not of ran into that issue in the first place...
droidstyle said:
rom manager is useless for the fascinate...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But if that's the case, why does Koushik make a ROM for the fascinate and have it available on his site?
(Does the Epic4G simply represent all CDMA phones, and the i9000 GSM? Don't see why that would matter anyway tho)
(I can't post a direct &#% link yet, but it's on his website.
This makes absolutely no sense!? He's got ROMs up there for just about every Android phone on the market, all to be used with ROM Manager.
I wanted to install it via Odin but naturally that would be too simple: it's a zip file and Odin won't recognize anything but tar and 2 others formats.
You can flash any .zip ROM with CWM. There's no need for ROM Manager. BTW, you can post a link if you uncheck "parse links in text automatically."
Nymblz said:
But if that's the case, why does Koushik make a ROM for the fascinate and have it available on his site?
(Does the Epic4G simply represent all CDMA phones, and the i9000 GSM? Don't see why that would matter anyway tho)
(I can't post a direct &#% link yet, but it's on his website.
This makes absolutely no sense!? He's got ROMs up there for just about every Android phone on the market, all to be used with ROM Manager.
I wanted to install it via Odin but naturally that would be too simple: it's a zip file and Odin won't recognize anything but tar and 2 others formats.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
all you need to do is boot into cwm recovery via the power menu and flash away. the problem with rom manager on the fascinate is getting into the right recovery...causes more problems than its worth on this device. make sense yet? probably not since you have not been down this road yet, but many of us have. so take the advice given or dont and learn the hard way.
Honestly, I am trying to take the advice given but not all of it fit my situation.
I'm definitely something of a noob to Android (Not to linux or IT though). I've had my phone for all of a month and rooted it only days ago.
It's all starting to come together, finally. It's tricky for a noob because there are so many different versions of the phone hardware, versions of Android, this or that kernel that only works with these ROMs, old/newer versions of those, old posts and advice, newer posts with adjusted advice.. etc.. It's been a week long crash course!
Anyhoo, I couldn't flash/upgrade CWM because it didn't stick from the original Odin install. When I rebooted, I'd always return to the stock <3e> recovery. Even after two more installs of CWM via Odin.
I used the cwm-recovery-all.tar in your guide, Droidstyle. (great job BTW)
I followed the directions in Section 6 to the letter. I even printed it out and highlighted key sections.
So you see, I was in a catch-22; I needed CWM to flash CWM? Odin was my only option at that point.
Then I read on another thread here about renaming the /system/recovery-from-boot.p script, and installing CWM once more.
That worked, so now I can finally boot into CWM recovery like a happy man. (I also tried a more specific version of CWM for good measure: cwm4-bml-i500.tar, not really sure if that made a difference)
So I made my first real nandroid backup last night.
Next on my list is a new kernel. Still deciding between KGB, lean, and whatever else is out there.
I still don't get the whole mess with ROM Manager though. I agree with you, DS, I just don't get why he'd have zips for every phone under the sun but his own app doesn't seem to allow them to be used. It's bizarre. The latest reviews on the market are not flattering either.
Nymblz said:
It's tricky for a noob because there are so many different versions of the phone hardware
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are on the Samsung Fascinate. If it is Verizon then it is model number i500. If it doesnt say Fascinate or i500 it isn't for your device and you don't need to worry about it. If you flash something that isn't stated as being for the i500 or VERIZON Fascinate then you will have a lovely new temporary paper weight.
Nymblz said:
Anyhoo, I couldn't flash/upgrade CWM because it didn't stick from the original Odin install. When I rebooted, I'd always return to the stock <3e> recovery. Even after two more installs of CWM via Odin.
I used the cwm-recovery-all.tar in your guide, Droidstyle. (great job BTW)
I followed the directions in Section 6 to the letter. I even printed it out and highlighted key sections.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You couldn't have followed it to the letter because it is a well known fact that if you boot up with a stock kernel still flashed it will replace your recovery. Droidstyle certainly knows this and certainly accounted for it in his guide. So, you need to either boot directly into CWM or flash a non-stock kernel prior to rebooting the phone.
Nymblz said:
Then I read on another thread here about renaming the /system/recovery-from-boot.p script, and installing CWM once more.
That worked, so now I can finally boot into CWM recovery like a happy man. (I also tried a more specific version of CWM for good measure: cwm4-bml-i500.tar, not really sure if that made a difference)
So I made my first real nandroid backup last night.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah it sounds like that will work...not the most elegant way to take care of it...but it sounds like it would be okay.
Nymblz said:
Next on my list is a new kernel. Still deciding between KGB, lean, and whatever else is out there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We already talked about the kernel situation. Consider Geewiz if you want something thats all-in-one and pretty much impossible to mess up. KGB is good. Leankernel always gave me the best battery life but YMMV.
Nymblz said:
I still don't get the whole mess with ROM Manager though. I agree with you, DS, I just don't get why he'd have zips for every phone under the sun but his own app doesn't seem to allow them to be used. It's bizarre. The latest reviews on the market are not flattering either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He showed no interest in helping the devs here get ROM manager working (again) on the phone. If you gave him money, blame him for not providing the support and resources to get it working on this phone. Some people are umm...."lacking in people skills."
Oh, and as great as the Gingerbread ROMs are...the mtd ICS roms blow them out of the water
I have confirmed that I have root access and that my bootloader is unlocked
I have tried flashing CWM recovery via rom manager and various img files found throughout this site and others.
Despite this, when I boot into cwm I get the android guy with the yellow ball
If I hit vol up and down I get only a few options:
Bgackup and restore, reboot, apply update, whipe data factory reset, whipe cache partition.
No advanced (this is one I've seen mentioned but didn't see on my device)
But as long as I got that far, I went through the steps to install CM9.
I whiped data then cache
Applied the CM9 zip
then rebooted
When my phone came back on I still have moto gingerbread and it just wants me to relogin to blur and sign in to google.
Also tried Another SD card with the same results. CWM couldn't see any zips on the cards after reentering cwm after a reboot. Reformatting the cards and trying again produced the same results.
What am I missing here? I've followed and refollowed letter by letter with all the guides I've been seen.
Thanks for any help and I apologize for any newb stuff as this is my first attempt at android roms.
Well it looks like this is magically solved now.
After TWRP failed earlier I decided to go back into fastboot and did a erase recovery, reboot, then reflash twrp
Then tried booting into it and it worked!
So I went back into fastboot and flashed cwm instead since I'd prefer the non touch recovery.
Thanks for all the tips
Please remember to post questions in the Q&A forum.
I honestly don't know what's wrong. It looks like your doing everything properly.
seem like you're not with CWM installed on your device..
try to put another one like TWRP and see what happens
You are certain your bootloader is unlocked? (you see "unlocked" on the Moto splash screen)
First, try to fix permissions from Rom Manager.
If that doesn't work fastboot flash the most recent recovery. Go here and get the latest version.
I would advise against using ROM manager. It's been known to cause many issues.
ravilov said:
I would advise against using ROM manager. It's been known to cause many issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh ravilov, you and your crazy stories. I've been using Rom Manager since the day I rooted my phone. Never had one problem (well, except for the way koush does the premium license).
Make sure you're choosing "install zip from SD card" not "install update from SD card".
LÄvLab / HostileSlothRecords
ravilov said:
I would advise against using ROM manager. It's been known to cause many issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ROM Manager is perfectly fine for fixing permissions.
upndwn4par said:
Oh ravilov, you and your crazy stories. I've been using Rom Manager since the day I rooted my phone. Never had one problem (well, except for the way koush does the premium license).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was reportedly the culprit of randomly appearing ".nomedia" files on some ROMs. After that I don't think I'd want to trust it.
Some people also had problems installing stuff through it, no matter what they tried. Once they switched to cmd/fastboot/manual install, everything worked fine.
So I'm not exactly pulling stuff out of my butt here.
I also don't really like it personally, I always remove it if it comes bundled with a ROM. But that's just me. To each their own. If it's working fine for you, by all means keep using it.
ravilov said:
It was reportedly the culprit of randomly appearing ".nomedia" files on some ROMs. After that I don't think I'd want to trust it.
Some people also had problems installing stuff through it, no matter what they tried. Once they switched to cmd/fastboot/manual install, everything worked fine.
So I'm not exactly pulling stuff out of my butt here.
I also don't really like it personally, I always remove it if it comes bundled with a ROM. But that's just me. To each their own. If it's working fine for you, by all means keep using it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I remember correctly, that was for epinter's and joker's CM10 ROMs. And it was never even close to proven that CWM was the culprit. Doesn't make sense that CWM is to blame for suddenly doing random stuff. Especially since both of those ROMs have had serious media issues since day one.
Anyway, I'm not saying that CWM is perfect - it's not. But RomRacers recovery is unsupported, and I try to never use unsupported software. TWRP is nice, but I don't like touch recoveries and old CWM backups are useless. Anyway, to each his own.
upndwn4par said:
If I remember correctly, that was for epinter's and joker's CM10 ROMs. And it was never even close to proven that CWM was the culprit. Doesn't make sense that CWM is to blame for suddenly doing random stuff. Especially since both of those ROMs have had serious media issues since day one.
Anyway, I'm not saying that CWM is perfect - it's not. But RomRacers recovery is unsupported, and I try to never use unsupported software. TWRP is nice, but I don't like touch recoveries and old CWM backups are useless. Anyway, to each his own.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Um...
I'm talking about ROM manager, not CWM. CWM is great, I'm using it too (well, I'm using RomRacer's recovery which is CWM-based).
I don't mind using older and possibly unsupported software if it's this stable and works without any problems and glitches.
I'm going to assume that was a typo and you really meant ROM manager.
But yeah, ".nomedia" files don't appear out of nowhere. People were unable to find their media files and they were indeed blaming the ROM for doing that. Then someone realized it's due to some ".nomedia" files being created randomly. Then people were deleting all such files but the files would appear again. And then someone noticed removing ROM manager made the madness stop. Now I will admit this is not proof enough, but it really seems very likely that ROM manager was to blame. I think nobody had any problems with media files since.
Oh, and as for the problem OP is mentioning... No, this is not related to ".nomedia" files, and frankly I have no idea what's going on there... :dunno:
ravilov said:
Um...
I'm talking about ROM manager, not CWM. CWM is great, I'm using it too (well, I'm using RomRacer's recovery which is CWM-based).
I don't mind using older and possibly unsupported software if it's this stable and works without any problems and glitches.
I'm going to assume that was a typo and you really meant ROM manager.
But yeah, ".nomedia" files don't appear out of nowhere. People were unable to find their media files and they were indeed blaming the ROM for doing that. Then someone realized it's due to some ".nomedia" files being created randomly. Then people were deleting all such files but the files would appear again. And then someone noticed removing ROM manager made the madness stop. Now I will admit this is not proof enough, but it really seems very likely that ROM manager was to blame. I think nobody had any problems with media files since.
Oh, and as for the problem OP is mentioning... No, this is not related to ".nomedia" files, and frankly I have no idea what's going on there... :dunno:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, you know what I meant. :cyclops:
I still think it is more likely that the ROM made RM go wacky than the other way around. Especially with the history of JB ROM media issues.
ravilov said:
Um...
I'm talking about ROM manager, not CWM. CWM is great, I'm using it too (well, I'm using RomRacer's recovery which is CWM-based).
I don't mind using older and possibly unsupported software if it's this stable and works without any problems and glitches.
I'm going to assume that was a typo and you really meant ROM manager.
But yeah, ".nomedia" files don't appear out of nowhere. People were unable to find their media files and they were indeed blaming the ROM for doing that. Then someone realized it's due to some ".nomedia" files being created randomly. Then people were deleting all such files but the files would appear again. And then someone noticed removing ROM manager made the madness stop. Now I will admit this is not proof enough, but it really seems very likely that ROM manager was to blame. I think nobody had any problems with media files since.
Oh, and as for the problem OP is mentioning... No, this is not related to ".nomedia" files, and frankly I have no idea what's going on there... :dunno:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I remember this happening when rom manager updated. Then a few days later they put another update distinctly saying "fixed problem of rom manager adding .nomedia to internal and external sd" so yes rav is right that rom manager was the culprit THEN. However that being said, I had tried a jb rom (can't remember which) that added those .nomedia files to my internal and external so you both could be correct in your assumptions.
EDIT: in the changelog for ROM manger here https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.koushikdutta.rommanager it shows that it did place those .nomedia files.
Yes, I am certain that my phone is unlocked or at least I think I am since it says "unlocked" in the corner when I turn it on
I didn't want to sign back into everything quite yet so I haven't been able to try the rom manager fix permissions thing yet.
I flashed the TWRP recovery instead of the CWM one and got the same result when booting into the recovery so I assume that neither CWM or TWRP was successfully installed.
Shouldn't flashing these with fastboot get them in there? (technically tried installing from rom manager once too)
drsatan316 said:
Yes, I am certain that my phone is unlocked or at least I think I am since it says "unlocked" in the corner when I turn it on
I didn't want to sign back into everything quite yet so I haven't been able to try the rom manager fix permissions thing yet.
I flashed the TWRP recovery instead of the CWM one and got the same result when booting into the recovery so I assume that neither CWM or TWRP was successfully installed.
Shouldn't flashing these with fastboot get them in there? (technically tried installing from rom manager once too)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, fastboot should be installing recovery properly.
I see three possibilities:
1) Something happened during the unlock process, so despite seeing "unlocked" you are not fully unlocked.
2) Fastboot is not writing recovery recursively
3) You have a hardware problem
I would try the following first:
1) Check to make sure you have the correct drivers installed on your PC and you have the most recent version of fastboot
2) Erase recovery with fastboot
3) Re-flash recovery with fastboot
Next I would try unlocking your bootloader again
Did you ever solve your problem?
Yes I got it working now.
TWRP booted after I did a fastboot erase and reflashed the recovery.
So I then reflashed CWM and that booted.
When I actually went to install a ROM a few days later it didn't boot again so I reflashed and ran the recovery on the next reboot OK again.
I was able to successfully get Joker's CM10 flahsed and running.
Not sure why I'd have to reflash every time I want to run the recovery but I think that that isn't a big deal for me anymore as this was just a test and this is no longer my primary device.
Thank you all for the help