No Offense to Anyone in particular but I've been seeing Alot of threads Knocking Developers Roms... Now in My Opinion the Only way Anyone has the Right to say Anything is... If you can Cook your Own Rom up! Until then, Give them a Break guys there doing it for Free for Everyone to use!!!
good point. Many think rom development is like washing a car..little bit of this little bit of that..dry off. First build the damn car, test to make sure it runs...then wash it..and poeple still tell you the car is dirty!!! sheesh...
I have never personally knocked someone's work, but one problem I see are ROM "chefs". Not only do they know nothing about Android's framework, but don't know any programming language enough to write their own code. They are taking bits and pieces of other peoples work and pasting in, and calling it theirs', and calling it new. Hence the term chef. That really doesn't add anything to the community, it is also unethical in my opinion.
Testified.
PMGRANDS said:
No Offense to Anyone in particular but I've been seeing Alot of threads Knocking Developers Roms... Now in My Opinion the Only way Anyone has the Right to say Anything is... If you can Cook your Own Rom up! Until then, Give them a Break guys there doing it for Free for Everyone to use!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk
Sad Panda said:
I have never personally knocked someone's work, but one problem I see are ROM "chefs". Not only do they know nothing about Android's framework, but don't know any programming language enough to write their own code. They are taking bits and pieces of other peoples work and pasting in, and calling it theirs', and calling it new. Hence the term chef. That really doesn't add anything to the community, it is also unethical in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This. Most of the XDA twelve year olds don't know that. The OP of their favorite colored ROM is a god like "developer" to them, when in reality they are just wizards at cut, copy, paste, zip, unzip, ASCII images, ****ty changelogs, etc...
I said most though, not all. And I agree, they all put hard work into it, so appreciate it or just stay quiet and move on.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
Agreed
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
Couldn't agree more.
Sent from my infected Eternity EVO 3D using xda premium
Sad Panda said:
I have never personally knocked someone's work, but one problem I see are ROM "chefs". Not only do they know nothing about Android's framework, but don't know any programming language enough to write their own code. They are taking bits and pieces of other peoples work and pasting in, and calling it theirs', and calling it new. Hence the term chef. That really doesn't add anything to the community, it is also unethical in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I gotta agree with this. There's very little "development" happening, and a lot of "cooking" happening. We need to have two separate sections. One for actual home grown roms, and one for things made in a kitchen.
I don't eat copypasta
I'm okay with some of the cooks as they add another element to let users find more combinations of roms bc not all the ones hard dev'd have everything you want or sometimes you would like to add a certain customization from another rom.
Now as long as proper credit is given in the OP all is good. Android is open source and sharing moss is what its all about. I personally don't think you should even ask to use polar mode long as u give the proper credit to them to begin with.
The issue I have is when people cook a ROM and then give zero credit to anyone claiming they did everything.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
PMGRANDS said:
No Offense to Anyone in particular but I've been seeing Alot of threads Knocking Developers Roms... Now in My Opinion the Only way Anyone has the Right to say Anything is... If you can Cook your Own Rom up! Until then, Give them a Break guys there doing it for Free for Everyone to use!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well its hard to say good rom to someone if their rom is buggy. We have to post feedback and let them know if there's any bugs. Not to be harsh and say your rom sucks but to say this, this and this doesn't work.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
gmfeny said:
Well its hard to say good rom to someone if their rom is buggy. We have to post feedback and let them know if there's any bugs. Not to be harsh and say your rom sucks but to say this, this and this doesn't work.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agree. this is another reason why chefs are kinda annoying. they can't really provide support on a rom because they didnt make it. and with all those things pasted in it's harder to find whats making the problem.
ummm... i haven't seen one thread on here created to specifically slam or complain about a rom.
BUT that being said, i still have seen a lot of complaining about other crap... it gets old. there is no purpose in starting a thread simply to complain. it contributes nothing to anybody else.
crpercodani said:
I don't eat copypasta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahaha
sgt. slaughter said:
I'm okay with some of the cooks as they add another element to let users find more combinations of roms bc not all the ones hard dev'd have everything you want or sometimes you would like to add a certain customization from another rom.
Now as long as proper credit is given in the OP all is good. Android is open source and sharing moss is what its all about. I personally don't think you should even ask to use polar mode long as u give the proper credit to them to begin with.
The issue I have is when people cook a ROM and then give zero credit to anyone claiming they did everything.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I agree. Open source is fantastic, and frankly as I see it nearly everything should be open source. But like you said just because we develop something and open the source to be read, used, improved, etc does not mean it is at all ok to call it yours, or take my license agreement, or source citing out so you can be the cool developer who took features from 5 roms to give people what they want. That is no different than stealing my patio furniture that is left out and I let other people sit in, ****ing bastards!
The thing with open source, if I can use an analogy to describe my thoughts and personal feelings:
Scientists will study and develop experiments that help prove something or develop a new technological process, or invent something new will keep things to themselves during the initial startup but soon after the entire community knows what they are working on, their journals are made public, their papers are published to be critiqued, reviewed, improved upon. Sources are always made to stay, and credit is given and kept through every part, and every future discovery. If we didn't have this technological advances would be slow as balls.
efan3719 said:
agree. this is another reason why chefs are kinda annoying. they can't really provide support on a rom because they didnt make it. and with all those things pasted in it's harder to find whats making the problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Another perfect point. How do you support and fix bugs if it isn't yours and have no idea what you are doing?
cobraboy85 said:
ummm... i haven't seen one thread on here created to specifically slam or complain about a rom.
BUT that being said, i still have seen a lot of complaining about other crap... it gets old. there is no purpose in starting a thread simply to complain. it contributes nothing to anybody else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats what I Meant...
Not that people actually start a Thread to Bash a ROM, but they Might as Well after Reading there Posts! Lol...
crpercodani said:
I don't eat copypasta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Avatar makes the post...
PMGRANDS said:
No Offense to Anyone in particular but I've been seeing Alot of threads Knocking Developers Roms... Now in My Opinion the Only way Anyone has the Right to say Anything is... If you can Cook your Own Rom up! Until then, Give them a Break guys there doing it for Free for Everyone to use!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't kid yourself. All it takes is roughly 20 minutes to set up and build your first ROM. It requires no skill, no college degree, and no unearthly talent. Virtually anyone could do it.
While it does take a bit more knowledge to port things over, the end result is always lackluster and very much lacks in the "I_need_a_working_stable_phone_where_all_things_included_with_it_actually_work_as_described" category. There's nothing more annoying than needing your phone at a particular time only to discover that one of a few things are happening:
-your phone has managed to lock up
-your phone is in the middle of a random reboot
-your phone has a missing feature that doesn't work because of the ROM you're using
I suppose all the ridiculous disclaimers (who's seriously going to go after a person for not having one?) try and warn you, but the cute taglines trump the disclaimer anyway.
There are few development projects going on. However, there are plenty of "let me try and frankenROM a bunch of crap together, throw it into a cute thread with a tagline indicating that it's a work in progress and that there are nightlies."
Judging by the number of replies these threads get, you can deduct the following:
-the average person on XDA doesn't have a smartphone for it to work properly.
-the average person on XDA enjoys interacting with other people on a thread even though it's mainly a bunch of back and forth replies that are limited to such wording as "yeah, ___ is broken for me too", " _insert_app_here doesn't work properly and fcs a lot"
I don't know about you, but I'm not the average XDA person and I most definitely enjoy having a working phone, so with that said--Stock ROM with modifications is all that's required to satisfy me.
To be honest, there isn't anything exciting going on aside from chad's kernel development.
This is not directed at any one person, and the true developers know that this isn't about them. Quite frankly, we need this type of work going on because it pushes the envelope and tells companies like HTC that we won't settle for less and know damn well that it's possible to push our phones further than they would have us think. Which is why sometimes, HTC gets caught with their pants down and are forced to give in. EVO 4G fps fix anyone? So I do appreciate all types of work that goes on here at XDA. But there will always be a small percentage that are in it for the internet fame (and they seem to get it quite frequently) and really bring nothing to the table except a bringing together of various other people's works.
freeza said:
Don't kid yourself. All it takes is roughly 20 minutes to set up and build your first ROM. It requires no skill, no college degree, and no unearthly talent. Virtually anyone could do it.
While it does take a bit more knowledge to port things over, the end result is always lackluster and very much lacks in the "I_need_a_working_stable_phone_where_all_things_included_with_it_actually_work_as_described" category. There's nothing more annoying than needing your phone at a particular time only to discover that one of a few things are happening:
-your phone has managed to lock up
-your phone is in the middle of a random reboot
-your phone has a missing feature that doesn't work because of the ROM you're using
I suppose all the ridiculous disclaimers (who's seriously going to go after a person for not having one?) try and warn you, but the cute taglines trump the disclaimer anyway.
There are few development projects going on. However, there are plenty of "let me try and frankenROM a bunch of crap together, throw it into a cute thread with a tagline indicating that it's a work in progress and that there are nightlies."
Judging by the number of replies these threads get, you can deduct the following:
-the average person on XDA doesn't have a smartphone for it to work properly.
-the average person on XDA enjoys interacting with other people on a thread even though it's mainly a bunch of back and forth replies that are limited to such wording as "yeah, ___ is broken for me too", " _insert_app_here doesn't work properly and fcs a lot"
I don't know about you, but I'm not the average XDA person and I most definitely enjoy having a working phone, so with that said--Stock ROM with modifications is all that's required to satisfy me.
To be honest, there isn't anything exciting going on aside from chad's kernel development.
This is not directed at any one person, and the true developers know that this isn't about them. Quite frankly, we need this type of work going on because it pushes the envelope and tells companies like HTC that we won't settle for less and know damn well that it's possible to push our phones further than they would have us think. Which is why sometimes, HTC gets caught with their pants down and are forced to give in. EVO 4G fps fix anyone? So I do appreciate all types of work that goes on here at XDA. But there will always be a small percentage that are in it for the internet fame (and they seem to get it quite frequently) and really bring nothing to the table except a bringing together of various other people's works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Testify!!!!!
Related
I'm a XDA lover
i love to flash ROMs
I'm greatfull to all the wonderful Chefs/developers/users/co-members at XDA
(mostly for the Raphael Forums as thats what i use-99% of times.)
But recently i've noticed that the Forums and developments here on this Forum is not SO lively and ACtive as it used to be i wonder why should that be the case...
I remember the time that there used to be ROM releases every other day but ow its come down to once or twice a week...and sometimes even longer...I've no grudge against any of the Chefs i'm totally aware of the fact that ROM Development ETC takes heck lot of time and effort ...But i feel that its not about the time its about the passion with which people respond to these ROMs they have kind of got dispassionate towards the ROMs and take it for granted and don't appreciate the work of the Chef...
I could be wrong absolutely wrong but this is what i feel.
I'm really sorry if you don't think so...
But i feel we should be greatfull to the DEvelopers/Chefs/Co-members here at XDA they are the ones who help us.
We should not take them for granted.
We should help a person who is in problem rather than thinking that someone else will ofcourse help him/her.
If we are good to people then only people will be good to us.
If we appreciate and praise a Chefs/developers Work then only he/she will be motivated to give us all something even better the next time otherwise he will feel he is just wasting time.
Show respect and regard people XDA is a wonderful place for all of us.
Thank you.
Please feel free to express your opinions.
I'm sorry if some one doesn't agree with me or dislikes this post.
This is not meant to offend anyone.
Thank you everyone.
To MODS: Please let this be here i need an opinion. But if it offends you or is unappropriate its upto all you wonderful people.
I've been coming here for a few years, and it seems as something gets more popular, the more it seems the people involved are less appreciative. I see a LOT of "dang, it's taking you forever to build this rom" or "it's got a bug and sucks, why can't you fix it" and that type of mentality. but on the flip side, some people draw that type of person. I've been using RRE roms for a long time. and while I've seen a few people piss in aruppenthal's post toasties, for the most part, most of the people who use his roms are very appreciative, and supportive.
I know some people won't agree with me, and I'll probably piss off a few people, but when you get this many people in 1 place, you are ALWAYS going to have dipsh!ts and idiots and the like. I mean we're talking about 250k active accounts here. think about a superbowl game.. 30-50k people and there are tons that get arrested, or beaten down cause they're drunk and stupid (or obnoxious) or whatever. I think we're doing exceptionally good here. a TON of people and most of them are nice, supportive and stuff.
Me? I love this board. it's what I consider home. (thanks ryan.)
I agree with u but what did u make so upset my friend. Its true that we have some a..holes in xda. But as jaguar says, u will always have them somewhere.
I still think the raphael area is still in pretty good shape, with helping people and being greatfull to the cooks.
Schnizelbrain
P.S. And if u really whant to thank the chefs/Devs, donate.
mr.jaguar said:
I've been coming here for a few years, and it seems as something gets more popular, the more it seems the people involved are less appreciative. I see a LOT of "dang, it's taking you forever to build this rom" or "it's got a bug and sucks, why can't you fix it" and that type of mentality. but on the flip side, some people draw that type of person. I've been using RRE roms for a long time. and while I've seen a few people piss in aruppenthal's post toasties, for the most part, most of the people who use his roms are very appreciative, and supportive.
I know some people won't agree with me, and I'll probably piss off a few people, but when you get this many people in 1 place, you are ALWAYS going to have dipsh!ts and idiots and the like. I mean we're talking about 250k active accounts here. think about a superbowl game.. 30-50k people and there are tons that get arrested, or beaten down cause they're drunk and stupid (or obnoxious) or whatever. I think we're doing exceptionally good here. a TON of people and most of them are nice, supportive and stuff.
Me? I love this board. it's what I consider home. (thanks ryan.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally agree.
mr.jaguar said:
I've been coming here for a few years, and it seems as something gets more popular, the more it seems the people involved are less appreciative. I see a LOT of "dang, it's taking you forever to build this rom" or "it's got a bug and sucks, why can't you fix it" and that type of mentality. but on the flip side, some people draw that type of person. I've been using RRE roms for a long time. and while I've seen a few people piss in aruppenthal's post toasties, for the most part, most of the people who use his roms are very appreciative, and supportive.
I know some people won't agree with me, and I'll probably piss off a few people, but when you get this many people in 1 place, you are ALWAYS going to have dipsh!ts and idiots and the like. I mean we're talking about 250k active accounts here. think about a superbowl game.. 30-50k people and there are tons that get arrested, or beaten down cause they're drunk and stupid (or obnoxious) or whatever. I think we're doing exceptionally good here. a TON of people and most of them are nice, supportive and stuff.
Me? I love this board. it's what I consider home. (thanks ryan.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree ! Even i love this and is my home...true nothing can be done but if people read this thread perhaps they would think twice before flaming or criticizing peoples efforts ! And making fun of them.
schnitzelbrain said:
I agree with u but what did u make so upset my friend. Its true that we have some a..holes in xda. But as jaguar says, u will always have them somewhere.
I still think the raphael area is still in pretty good shape, with helping people and being greatfull to the cooks.
Schnizelbrain
P.S. And if u really whant to thank the chefs/Devs, donate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What makes me upset are some of the posts i read by few Bugf**kers !
They insult the ROM the forums the chefs ! And its sad to share space with such jerks !
And
Schnizelbrain I'm a minor i'm just 16 years old... if i had a credit card or i was earning i would hundred pecent donate to these lovely people ....
Gentox said:
I totally agree.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad you agree.
See the poll one person voted saying he doesn't care. He/She is just interested in resources ! These are the ungrateful lot of people which i hate to share space with on the forum....if you use the resources appreciate them thank the people who work their asses of so that we can have cool stuff on our phones ! If not donate just write a thanks message for them aprreciate their work...
But all these people will do is use everything here and then crib that this lacks this and you lack this !
Theses people suck !
A sorry to all the MODS but i felt lke showing a little respect to all the co-members/developers/chefs on XDA and try to educate the flamers and idiots of XDA !
Glad there are still lots of good people around
Thank you all.
Other
I think the board activity is representative of a normal product life cycle.
There was growth and a lot of development as people flocked to the Raphael.
Now, we are in a decline as the next generation of devices are coming out.
Big words , What has to be taken into account is that a lot of the chefs are moving on the newer devices, like Topaz, rhodium and HD2. This is a cycle, this has happened to the Kaiser forums as well but that's still active as well. Now the time has come for fresher chefs to cook their ROMs and grow. Where there is a need there shall be new ROMs. I actually think the kaiser forums are more stable nowadays but I could be wrong.
On a side note I cooked and then gave it a rest because of the the amount of work it worked out to be to make sure new changes wouldn't affect stability. Aside from the work it is to create a kitchen and find the newest\best packages. The testing process it fairly intensive. I don't think any good chef can whip up a ROM from scratch with in less than two days of hard labour, and that's if their experienced.
Appreciation threads are always welcome I think
12
gunshy73 said:
I think the board activity is representative of a normal product life cycle.
There was growth and a lot of development as people flocked to the Raphael.
Now, we are in a decline as the next generation of devices are coming out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But that doesn't give anyone a license to insult/disregard anyone's efforts even if they are not as expected.
12aon said:
Big words , What has to be taken into account is that a lot of the chefs are moving on the newer devices, like Topaz, rhodium and HD2. This is a cycle, this has happened to the Kaiser forums as well but that's still active as well. Now the time has come for fresher chefs to cook their ROMs and grow. Where there is a need there shall be new ROMs. I actually think the kaiser forums are more stable nowadays but I could be wrong.
On a side note I cooked and then gave it a rest because of the the amount of work it worked out to be to make sure new changes wouldn't affect stability. Aside from the work it is to create a kitchen and find the newest\best packages. The testing process it fairly intensive. I don't think any good chef can whip up a ROM from scratch with in less than two days of hard labour, and that's if their experienced.
Appreciation threads are always welcome I think
12
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WOW great to get a thumbs up from a MOD ! Sir its true but still old forums or new forums good/bad/old/new-chefs/developers we all need to appreciate each other's efforts and work..
Then only XDA will continue the way it has otherwise it will someday become a paid portal with a limited number of civilized members..
hpe the 300 people who viewed this thread will realise the importance of patience, apreciation, and understanding...
I'm just trying to tell people to be human to others who are helping you as strangers ! [/SIZE]
Anyways keep posting and voting Thanks to all.
"Why is XDA-Raphael Rom Development section ungrateful?"
Unfortunately, nobody will visit this place if was happy with his phone.
So the facts are:
1) Everyone has a hope for better image (software)
2) The hardware has also many disadvantages
Even if the chefs make perfect images, the phone+software will be under the general
expectation of the users.
Personaly, i beleived the advertisements and the reviews of this phone and
i gave 600 euros to buy it. I am cheated
rafailo said:
"Why is XDA-Raphael Rom Development section ungrateful?"
Unfortunately, nobody will visit this place if was happy with his phone.
So the facts are:
1) Everyone has a hope for better image (software)
2) The hardware has also many disadvantages
Even if the chefs make perfect images, the phone+software will be under the general
expectation of the users.
Personaly, i beleived the advertisements and the reviews of this phone and
i gave 600 euros to buy it. I am cheated
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But again that is NO EXCUSE TO BE RUDE T PEOPLE HERE THEY NEVER FORCED YOU TO BUY ANY DEVICE THEY ARE JUST HELPING YOU.
There is no valid reason in the world to be rude to anyone else here !
rafailo said:
this phone and
i gave 600 euros to buy it. I am cheated
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you yell at the mechanic who is working on your car just because you bought a lemon? NO.
Do you take it up with the person from which you purchased the care? YES.
You seem to forget that XDA is not responsible for the design and marketing of HTC products. They are simply trying to get the most out of their devices.
If you are so greatly upset by the device, go get an iphone and quit complaining.
I agree with you my friend.
I moved over from KAISER to this one recently. I too have noticed the hostility of the people in this community. Often you read something in this line.....You should have read the back 20 pages before posting your question..........You should search before posting your question......... People should realise that people may not have all the time in the world to read as much as others.........Some people are more computer competent than others...........We have different abilities. We should all try and make each other valued.
Thank you all who contribute daily to make this community a pleasant place to be.
Please do not let the flame dies.
Great To get some support !
noonereallycares said:
Do you yell at the mechanic who is working on your car just because you bought a lemon? NO.
Do you take it up with the person from which you purchased the care? YES.
You seem to forget that XDA is not responsible for the design and marketing of HTC products. They are simply trying to get the most out of their devices.
If you are so greatly upset by the device, go get an iphone and quit complaining.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These kind of people won't even be happy with the best phone in the world forget the iphone or anything....! Thank you for the support ! These type of people have to understand That Its not a developers/chefs fault that the App is not working ! He/She are trying their best to make it work ! But still they want everything to work fine. !
hummy15 said:
I moved over from KAISER to this one recently. I too have noticed the hostility of the people in this community. Often you read something in this line.....You should have read the back 20 pages before posting your question..........You should search before posting your question......... People should realise that people may not have all the time in the world to read as much as others.........Some people are more computer competent than others...........We have different abilities. We should all try and make each other valued.
Thank you all who contribute daily to make this community a pleasant place to be.
Please do not let the flame dies.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a lot buddy ! I'm glas 65% of you agree with me and maybe the 11% somewhere inside their heart do agree...but the other 24% are the people who i hope will learn something and hopefully appreciate the efforts work and dedication of the developers/chefs here.
But the people who Say that they don't care and just want resources are the ones who should be ashamed of themselves they are very ungrateful....
I hope that the 715 odd people who have read some of this thread realised something if not exactly what i wanted them to realise and hopefully will be better next time they post on any Forum.
Thank you all.
XDA Forever !
Keep Voting ! we need to improve the "Sour Grapes" At XDA.
having problems with your glasses?
Please write in the common text size. Thx
faeArai said:
having problems with your glasses?
Please write in the common text size. Thx
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Click to collapse
My thoughts exactly. I find this poster's posts annoying because of that.
The site is as it has been in the lifelines of devices. New devices come out, and people move on to the next best thing. I think it is rare that there is griping - though it happens everywhere. The OP might be misinterpreting excitement to see new things in new builds for griping.
faeArai said:
having problems with your glasses?
Please write in the common text size. Thx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Done that I didn't realise it would irritate some people. I just wanted to hilight the text.
Bimboy said:
My thoughts exactly. I find this poster's posts annoying because of that.
The site is as it has been in the lifelines of devices. New devices come out, and people move on to the next best thing. I think it is rare that there is griping - though it happens everywhere. The OP might be misinterpreting excitement to see new things in new builds for griping.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ahh ! What exactly do you mean ? I'm dumb could yo please explain in simple terms in straight forward language Without going around in circles....
Thank you
madnish30 said:
Ahh ! What exactly do you mean ? I'm dumb could yo please explain in simple terms in straight forward language Without going around in circles....
Thank you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mean that most people are passionate here about seeing what's next, and what is tweaked on new builds. I flash multiple times a week still, and love to see what I will find on a new build.
I check here multiple times a day for new things to appear. I can see people getting vocal about wanting to see new cool things. "Where's build 23085!!!" is what I am thinking, but not to piss anybody off or push people. Rather,to want to simply get my hands on it to play.
Also, complainers complain. 99.99% of people are fine with things, but the couple of schmucks complaining may make it appear that most people are ungrateful.
Bimboy said:
I mean that most people are passionate here about seeing what's next, and what is tweaked on new builds. I flash multiple times a week still, and love to see what I will find on a new build.
I check here multiple times a day for new things to appear. I can see people getting vocal about wanting to see new cool things. "Where's build 23085!!!" is what I am thinking, but not to piss anybody off or push people. Rather,to want to simply get my hands on it to play.
Also, complainers complain. 99.99% of people are fine with things, but the couple of schmucks complaining may make it appear that most people are ungrateful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah ! I see.
Sir i agree with you mostly on that.
Indeed newer ROMs and latest developments excite most of the people on this community, But I feel most of those people who download these ROMs/Programs/Developments and are so called "Flash-junkies" are taking things for granted as in i mean if they see a build 23081 they will try it maybe say its good, but it lacks this this and this... And then after a little while say please do this is 23085 please do this and this this are taking the fact for granted that the chef for sure will write a 23085 build without appreciating the effort he put in the 23081 build
In simple terms i mean is that they JUST demand with little or no apprecition of any sorts (i'm not saying that nobody appreciated anybody i'm saying this trend has crept in ....and there are a bunch of such people---> like the 4 people who said "they don't care about appreciation, they just want appreciation ! " that in my view is pretty ridiculous and then the Chefs should sell their ROMs rather than make it availible for anyone and everyone !
Anyways thats my way of showing appreciation and respect.
Maybe this will improve some people NOT that i'm trying to be a "Gandhi" and bring about a revolution at XDA. All I'm doing is just giving a matter a thought which might change the views of others.
Again i repeat NOT to offend/hurt anyone.
If you don't agree with me its absolutely ok.
Thank you all. Keep voting and posting your opinions.
Bimboy said:
I mean that most people are passionate here about seeing what's next, and what is tweaked on new builds. I flash multiple times a week still, and love to see what I will find on a new build.
I check here multiple times a day for new things to appear. I can see people getting vocal about wanting to see new cool things. "Where's build 23085!!!" is what I am thinking, but not to piss anybody off or push people. Rather,to want to simply get my hands on it to play.
Also, complainers complain. 99.99% of people are fine with things, but the couple of schmucks complaining may make it appear that most people are ungrateful.
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Amen to that! That's exactly my opinion.
faeArai said:
Amen to that! That's exactly my opinion.
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I agree but 99.9% is according to me increasing at a rapid rate.
Even tho I don't have the device and there is not a recovery yet, I am already working hard on a rom for all of you Fascinate people :] Just check back on this post every so often for the release. I will probably release it when Koush releases his recovery for the Fascinate. Pretty much what this is going to do is de-bloat your phone, fully deodex it and other little things here and there. If you want more roms like this for the Fascinate please donate and buy me one here.
Check back here for updates :]
Very cool! Were your other roms froyo?
I have no problem donating to you. I'm just waiting for a recovery to come along first.
Sent while on the go using Tapatalk.
So this rom wont have froyo?
steeeler said:
Very cool! Were your other roms froyo?
I have no problem donating to you. I'm just waiting for a recovery to come along first.
Sent while on the go using Tapatalk.
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Yeah my other roms were froyo. This wont be froyo yet, I am just going to play around with the system folder for the first 2 releases. Then comes the fun :]
Pretty much a second post of your other "please give me money"... Great that you want to develop a ROM but I am sure I'm not the only one to think you are really just fishing for some money (unlike a lot of other ROM developers who do GREAT work without even asking for a dime)
Isn't the whole "pay me now for work later" something we all learned at a young age never worked out well?
Matt, if you want to do something useful, besides shuffle some icons around and rename system files, come help work out the kernel / source compilation issue(s). Once that's done we'll still have to develop the recovery.
There's no point even discussing custom roms without a custom recovery.
Until then, this is like paying full price for a pre-order for a device that hasn't even been announced.
IMO, this thread should be locked at this point.
wstcoaster07 said:
Pretty much a second post of your other "please give me money"... Great that you want to develop a ROM but I am sure I'm not the only one to think you are really just fishing for some money (unlike a lot of other ROM developers who do GREAT work without even asking for a dime)
Isn't the whole "pay me now for work later" something we all learned at a young age never worked out well?
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God damn, I'm not fishing for money. What the hell. Wow....I am trying to work on a rom for when the damn recovery comes out and people are giving me ****? I am trying to help what the hell. Wow.
namebrandon said:
Matt, if you want to do something useful, besides shuffle some icons around and rename system files, come help work out the kernel / source compilation issue(s). Once that's done we'll still have to develop the recovery.
There's no point even discussing custom roms without a custom recovery.
Until then, this is like paying full price for a pre-order for a device that hasn't even been announced.
IMO, this thread should be locked at this point.
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Actually I do a lot more than that so dont be a ass. I am actually going to work on the kernel **** -_- Damn.
wstcoaster07 said:
Pretty much a second post of your other "please give me money"... Great that you want to develop a ROM but I am sure I'm not the only one to think you are really just fishing for some money (unlike a lot of other ROM developers who do GREAT work without even asking for a dime)
Isn't the whole "pay me now for work later" something we all learned at a young age never worked out well?
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Have you even seen his past work? Obviously you haven't, because if you had, you would know Matt is sure to do some great work. It's pretty hard to develop a ROM for a phone he doesn't have though, hence, he's asking for donations.
If you don't have the means to donate that's not a problem - no one is expecting you to of course, but don't give a developer **** because he wants to make this phone better.
Matt4542 said:
Actually I do a lot more than that so dont be a ass. I am actually going to work on the kernel **** -_- Damn.
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I agree cut the man some slack im sure he does great work and he said he would release it AFTER a custom recovery is out. Keep doing what you're doing dont let what some people are saying bother you.
Pandemic187 said:
Have you even seen his past work? Obviously you haven't, because if you had, you would know Matt is sure to do some great work. It's pretty hard to develop a ROM for a phone he doesn't have though, hence, he's asking for donations.
If you don't have the means to donate that's not a problem - no one is expecting you to of course, but don't give a developer **** because he wants to make this phone better.
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I did not mean for this and the other thread to turn into a flame war. I just know that in the android community, a lot of users have been burned by donating to "devs" (chefs) and then the "dev" bails.
The work he has done on the Droid 2 does seem to be good for that phone, and thats what that phone needs. The fascinate though, is a different beast. More power to him if he wants to help. But begging for people to help him buy a phone before we even have a means to install his roms leaves a cheap taste in my mouth.
I want to thank any dev that has interest in developing / cooking up roms for the phone, as people will enjoy their phone more. I just ask that said devs wait for people to finish developing a simple and safe way to install the rom. I released a rom for the fascinate last week that had most of the bloatware removed, but the only way to flash it is by odin, not a preferred / safe way to flash the rom.
Just hold your horses. we will have a recovery soon, and like i said in the other thread, then you can do what you want with your money. But i assure you, we will have a lot in store for the users once that hurdle is passed.
Umm... get donations from the d1 and d2 work that you've already done, buy a Fascinate, create ROMs for that, and THEN (if it's a halfway decent job) people will donate without you even needing to ask them. Why ask people to pay for something that you haven't even done yet but then reassure them it'll happen because of your other work? If what you did with the d1/2 is good then shouldn't you be able to get donations from that? I'm not accusing you of trying to scam people I'm just telling you what seems to make the most sense.
I agree with everyone else why not use the donations from your other devices to get the Fascinate then when you make a rom that is as amazing as you say people will donate and you will come out on top. Yes I have seen your work as I have had several droids and my wife has a droid2. Have you seen Cyanogen's work? Or how about the other cooks? Why should we buy you a phone and not them? I have donated to lots of cooks but never before a product was available and not even a promise of first beta tests or anything, no deadline? Come on, man! Like the other member said would you pay mercedes (we have all seen there work ) money to build a factory on the promise that when it is done being built they will give you a car that may or may not be to your liking. I have to say your other roms werent my taste but they were very good. Having said that I am looking forward to donating once roms are available, nothing personal I have nothing against your screen name which is really all I see it just has to do with my own preference.
On another note I remember when this actually resembled an open source community (i.e. the linux community) I googled your name and every single forum there is something with you asking for donations, I understand you have to call them donations because of the license but lets face it you are selling products. Thats not really what opensource is about.
Sorry for the rant everyone, no hard feelings
erasmogjr said:
I agree with everyone else why not use the donations from your other devices to get the Fascinate then when you make a rom that is as amazing as you say people will donate and you will come out on top. Yes I have seen your work as I have had several droids and my wife has a droid2. Have you seen Cyanogen's work? Or how about the other cooks? Why should we buy you a phone and not them? I have donated to lots of cooks but never before a product was available and not even a promise of first beta tests or anything, no deadline? Come on, man! Like the other member said would you pay mercedes (we have all seen there work ) money to build a factory on the promise that when it is done being built they will give you a car that may or may not be to your liking. I have to say your other roms werent my taste but they were very good. Having said that I am looking forward to donating once roms are available, nothing personal I have nothing against your screen name which is really all I see it just has to do with my own preference.
On another note I remember when this actually resembled an open source community (i.e. the linux community) I googled your name and every single forum there is something with you asking for donations, I understand you have to call them donations because of the license but lets face it you are selling products. Thats not really what opensource is about.
Sorry for the rant everyone, no hard feelings
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Are you serious? I only started asking for donations like a week or two ago and I have been developing roms for a few months.
I'm just excited we're close to seeing some dev work. I wholeheartedly believe in donation as a support system for development. I do not however donate to theory.
I will be throwing some paypal love once I see some good dev work on here.
Matt4542 said:
Are you serious? I only started asking for donations like a week or two ago and I have been developing roms for a few months.
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Matt, Don't take this the wrong way. I do think you're a good and honest developer based on comments i've read on the ROM you've done on Droid. I've been around this forum for a long time and have given my hard earned cash to many worthy developers and others. Donations typically are to support a website, finance a developer for his time, and/or buy hardware needed, etc... This forum has changed a bit in the last decade and some here may not understand how this all works. We do this as either an investment or a reward. Reputation is everything though. And that is why some here are hammering you.
Since you're new to us, if you don't mind, introduce yourself, tell us your skillsets, tell us what you bring to the table? Alot of us are tech heads and would appreciate that.
This website changed once Android became popular. The WinMo community was smaller and calmer. Android has blown everything up.
orateam said:
Matt, Don't take this the wrong way. I do think you're a good and honest developer based on comments i've read on the ROM you've done on Droid. I've been around this forum for a long time and have given my hard earned cash to many worthy developers and others. Donations typically are to support a website, finance a developer for his time, and/or buy hardware needed, etc... This forum has changed a bit in the last decade and some here may not understand how this all works. We do this as either an investment or a reward. Reputation is everything though. And that is why some here are hammering you.
Since you're new to us, if you don't mind, introduce yourself, tell us your skillsets, tell us what you bring to the table? Alot of us are tech heads and would appreciate that.
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ludeboy said:
This website changed once Android became popular. The WinMo community was smaller and calmer. Android has blown everything up.
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eh, i remember a lot of drama going on in the CDMA forums all the time. We had chefs that would rip off of other chefs and claim it as their own just to get more donations / money for their "work"
I have never asked for donations, as the work i do is to better my own phone so why not help everyone else? I just started posting a link to make a donation to world vision in my new posts, because if people are willing to donate, why not have them donate to a great cause?
fallingup said:
I have never asked for donations, as the work i do is to better my own phone so why not help everyone else? I just started posting a link to make a donation to world vision in my new posts, because if people are willing to donate, why not have them donate to a great cause?
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The good ol pocket PC days. Trying to make WinMo 5 act like a reasonable touchscreen interface. I remember using the kitchens to experiment and make my own custom ROM's. We all made windows CE registry tweaks to do all kinds of things. Windows was easier to program for. I had many custom programs that i openly shared directly with users (M$ didn't like us sharing). I hope Android users get that this is simply a labor of love for us hobbyists. If i wanted a phone i wouldn't customize much but had a lot of features, i'd stay with the iPhone. I've been playing with APPDeveloper to get my feet wet, and soon will have some custom programs myself once i get off it and transfer to eclipse coding.
development fascinate
Matt..
How much will it take for you to get a phone to use for development? now that we have a recovery available......
Okay, so someone from Samsung is going to be callig me soon. I assume it's related to #NeverAgain.
What would you guys want to know, or tell, samsung?
If I agree (maybe even if I do not) I will ask them.
EDIT - UPDATE:
Okay, I have finished the call. I hit on every topic from this thread/my twitter. I am very limited with what I can say RIGHT NOW though. I do feel that (& hopefully) shortly a lot of good will come from all of this.
I am NOT willing to throw my hands in the air and yell "hooray," but the Olive Branch is absolutely extended and this has the potential to be a huge win for the community, and Samsung.
I do feel this is less a PR move and more that our collective voice was heard. I really hope that is the case anyway. Still a little ways to go.... but I have to applaud them for their efforts so far, even though everything else they've done to this point has been a let down in my eyes.
I hate I solicited your Q's, and am unable to give answers... just wanted to let you guys know what I could say, and that I left the call a bit optimistic, hope that helps some.
Why the lack of support for us vibrant owners? What did we do besides buy millions of your phones?
You will need to be as clear as possible... hard to yell lack of support when froyo and source are available now. Granted it was slow and done terribly.. both the misleading deadlines AND the lack of an OTA.
Gingerbread or at least 2.2.1
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
s15274n said:
You will need to be as clear as possible... hard to yell lack of support when froyo and source are available now. Granted it was slow and done terribly.. both the misleading deadlines AND the lack of an OTA.
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Ok. Why the delay on froyo? Also why not an OTA update? Just seemed like the threw us a bone to shut us up with the kies update?
Tell them we need an easy way to get our problems through.. Some type out forum or a public way to brainstorm ideas.. Maybe you can get a job out of this..
Rfs has to go.. It cripples the device.. Ext4 has been proven a better file system.. An aosp build that we choose to flash if wanted.. Maybe through kies.. A metal back we can buy to give our phones that weight we always wanted..
Awesome, plese keep the good ideas going...
How about a definitive answer on the choice of rfs over ext4?
I know we have ext4 on our own, but im just curious as to why they made the decision in the first place.
Anything else? Call is happening shortly.
why don't we have the drivers source? Also will we be getting gingerbread?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
neotoky said:
why don't we have the drivers source? Also will we be getting gingerbread?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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Yeah, driver source was on my list, though I think I know the answer.
I'll report back. Keep adding.
neotoky said:
why don't we have the drivers source? Also will we be getting gingerbread?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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I think that's the question most people are gonna want an answer to. Something tells me they aren't going to be able to tell you much, but Ill hold out hope.
We at XDA are a completely different type of customer. We like good specs, but we also like to be able to tinker with our phones. Currently, HTC is the most XDA friendly. If Samsung gave us the tools we needed, wed have no reason to switch up phones. We already have some of the best hardware, we just want great software to go with it.
Ask them if they are in a service business and not just a hardware business any more. As soon as they started provided hardware that needs updates, they need to provide those updates to keep their customers happy.
Also ask them if they are planning on inviting the XDA developers to their development tree so that we don't have to get leaked source code but can get it straight from Samsung. Maybe if we sign a waver that we take responsibility for our own actions. To be adults.
Also ask if they are going to allow critical feedback on their website of their devices and not censor them to only accept good feedback?
please tell these Nazis to make an option for the incoming call volume delay. it drives me nuts
OP updated. Sorry but I was asked to not share a lot of what we discussed, and I will listen to that demand.
I will say I feel like this is a potentially great thing. Here is hoping that all parties can find a mutual ground and we will all benefit.
s15274n said:
OP updated. Sorry but I was asked to not share a lot of what we discussed, and I will listen to that demand.
I will say I feel like this is a potentially great thing. Here is hoping that all parties can find a mutual ground and we will all benefit.
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I understand that you can't reveal anything, but Id say if the guy that spearheaded the NeverAgain campaign is satisfied with the conversation, things should be much brighter in the future.
I see that SGS variants are the first Android devices that brought Samsung a major success in smartphone battles, and obviously they were not ready to deal with all sorts of demands. I am happy to see them reaching out to their customers and to see a work in progress.
thegreatcity said:
... if the guy that spearheaded the NeverAgain campaign is satisfied with the conversation, things should be much brighter in the future.
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I'm cautiously optimistic. This could easily dissolve into nothing, or it could be a genuine game changer. The ball is in Samsung's court, but others will have a large impact on the outcome too (no names).
s15274n said:
OP updated. Sorry but I was asked to not share a lot of what we discussed, and I will listen to that demand.
I will say I feel like this is a potentially great thing. Here is hoping that all parties can find a mutual ground and we will all benefit.
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Ok since they have chosen you to discuss....... That is nice of them,
BUT, WHEN is this going to happen? This is the third or forth iteration of "Dangling the carrot" telling us something wonderful is coming........
Did you ask about the time line ?
I realize this post may not make me popular, but this community isn't about popularity so much as it is about working together as a community, for the community.
I had a post ready on my phone, but for some reason the xda or tapatalk app sometimes puts my phone in a boot loop.. anyways:
As best as I can tell, we have one solid developer(no offense to anyone else if they are deving) who is working with source. One person working on ICS, and putting out roms for our pleasure. Xboarder, it is awesome that you are able and willing to put the time and work into this phone like you have, and I thank you.
I am curious about one thing though: Is xboarder opposed to working with others?
This is in no way to stir up trouble, but I have seen multiple posts of problems between revolution(and maybe others?) and xboarder. I would have posted this in that thread, but it is locked I am assuming because of those problems. This thread is not about blame, it is to point out that who is at fault doesn't matter. If another developer was considering this device they aren't going to try to see who is at fault, they will assume that neither party works well with others.
It is admirable that someone so young(xboarder) is able to step up and do what many people older than him cannot, developing and working on projects like he has.. but is seems like people handle him with kid gloves(pun NOT intended), perhaps out of fear they will lose the only developer currently working with our device, but this is an opportunity for xboarder or anyone else to develop professionally. It is one thing to be able to do something by yourself, from the ground up, but our ability to work with others while utilizing the skills we would have by ourselves is something extremely desired in the professional world, or is valuable in life itself.
XDA is a community, each of us contributing our experiences and what we have learned with each other, that is what creates progress. Some contribute financially, some trouble shoot, some test, some develop, but consciously or not we are all working together to some degree. This is the ideal.
Most devices that have a working ICS build have more than one person, sometimes teams of people, working on the project together. They check each other's work, offer knowledge, divide the workload.. many could work individually, but in almost all cases the final product is better by working collaboratively.
An adult trait that many adults don't have, is the ability to turn the other cheek. Or to reach out to others for help. To overlook offenses. Don't deny xboarder the chance to step up professionally. Give him the opportunity to learn how to pick and choose his battles, to share glory, to learn and teach others by letting him do it on his own.
Xboarder, please don't take anything I've said offensively, but if you can, consider it objectively. You probably haven't had the chance to work with others on a large group project, to collaborate. Maybe revolution(I don't know if he is a dev or who is at fault, etc) or others have been an ass, but don't let that stop you from working with them or others to put together a better product. To free up your resources to do something for yourself, or your own side projects..
I hope no one will flame, blame, or otherwise take this thread as a chance to cause chaos or get upset. I have worked with others collaboratively, people I do like and people I don't, and it is an important thing when you are dealing with projects of this magnitude. That is why you don't see many working ICS builds being created alone, or at the least, you see people building upon other people's work.. because that is what open source is all about. I have worked as a consultant for businesses, trying to figure out what happens in the infrastructure that may be keeping it from a higher level of success.. and that is what I am offering here, a possible insight into what could help this entire community make more progress, helping each person who makes their own contributions however they can. Damn this post got long, I can only hope that it might lead to something productive.
Let me just start by saying that X is one of the very few developers that actually owns the device. And in an even rarer case, he owns one with S-Off. This in itself means that he's able to develop for the Amaze a lot easier than other developers.
I don't think he has a problem working with others, it's just that the pickings are slim. It's hard to find people to work with if you're the only one with the device that has S-Off. Also, the lack of S-Off on the majority of the devices only turns developers away from the Amaze, which is a real shame and a failure on HTC's part
From what I see around the forums, X doesn't seem like he has a problem working with others, in fact, all evidence goes to support that he encourages other developers to pick up on the Amaze development (bounty threads, etc). X is already doing a fantastic job and I know his work will only be even better as more developers join the Amaze community, we just have to be patient.
i work with others that know there info etc preludedrew nrgz but revoultion is just trying be like a want a be person you know. People that dont know anything and just try to act like they do. I hate that kind of person and i have posted before about asking for etas and you might not all know but i had rev on gtalk for a while till he started trash talking me and keep asking for etas like every otherday. I think you would get tierd of that too so then i deleted him. It takes to much time to teacher a person all that i know im still learning as i go and talk to other devs such as faux123, nrgz, preludedrew, etc. I like working with people that are better then me so i learn i all ready have a private team im working with on ics and it will be posted else where and no more betas becuase of people like rev asking and asking. and has stolen mine and others work in the past.
I think you guys have heard this sang, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. I have given rev a bunch of chances to learn and show him how to develop the right way. and it always ends in a bad way.
also most other phones have aosp something to work of libs kernels etc. Im doing this all from the ground up no cm help no nada. We have to make all the stuff on our own aosp kernel etc. not easy todo
I might just take a break all this drama stuff is like high school and post my stuff else where or keep it until its ready
adslee said:
Let me just start by saying that X is one of the very few developers that actually owns the device. And in an even rarer case, he owns one with S-Off. This in itself means that he's able to develop for the Amaze a lot easier than other developers.
I don't think he has a problem working with others, it's just that the pickings are slim. It's hard to find people to work with if you're the only one with the device that has S-Off. Also, the lack of S-Off on the majority of the devices only turns developers away from the Amaze, which is a real shame and a failure on HTC's part
From what I see around the forums, X doesn't seem like he has a problem working with others, in fact, all evidence goes to support that he encourages other developers to pick up on the Amaze development (bounty threads, etc). X is already doing a fantastic job and I know his work will only be even better as more developers join the Amaze community, we just have to be patient.
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Well, I am new to the device, I've only had mine for a few weeks though I have been following the forums for nearly 2 months.. even with the workarounds that the members of the community bear the burden of, s-off still keeps developers away that much? Many devs I have talked to develop or contribute to devices they don't have.. as long as at least one developer has the device, or they have adequate testers, they seem happy to contribute to the code(I am talking about compiling/building like xboarder is doing with ICS).
I don't want to sound like this post was because I am impatient, but when I read the ICS thread earlier I was bothered by how immediate things escalated, and that the thread got closed over something that seems so petty.
I've worked with a lot of these devices, I've read quite a few forums, and even some of the crappier devices seem to have several teams of devs, and I am failing to see why a device as beefy and awesome as this one hasn't attracted at least a few more.
I saw a bounty thread earlier, and the very fact that people are willing to contribute is one of the factors that made me wonder at the lack of devs here.. I bought this phone because it is simply the best device out there, and I would like to do whatever I can to facilitate the growth and development of our part of the forums. Not having s-off may be a turn off to developing as much as you say it is, but I know several devs that could contribute to the code of any device without ever having it in their hand..
Perhaps the problem is that the members are publicizing enough the need that is here, the contributions of the members in this area would be more than enough to support a much larger number of devs, and that alone I would think would draw some out..
xboarder56 said:
i work with others that know there info etc preludedrew nrgz but revoultion is just trying be like a want a be person you know. People that dont know anything and just try to act like they do. I hate that kind of person and i have posted before about asking for etas and you might not all know but i had rev on gtalk for a while till he started trash talking me and keep asking for etas like every otherday. I think you would get tierd of that too so then i deleted him. It takes to much time to teacher a person all that i know im still learning as i go and talk to other devs such as faux123, nrgz, preludedrew, etc. I like working with people that are better then me so i learn i all ready have a private team im working with on ics and it will be posted else where and no more betas becuase of people like rev asking and asking. and has stolen mine and others work in the past.
I think you guys have heard this sang, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. I have given rev a bunch of chances to learn and show him how to develop the right way. and it always ends in a bad way.
also most other phones have aosp something to work of libs kernels etc. Im doing this all from the ground up no cm help no nada. We have to make all the stuff on our own aosp kernel etc. not easy todo
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I totally understand, and I hope you take what I said constructively, not negatively. I'm not one of those people that ask for ETAs, I may not be a developer, but I definitely have a good idea of how much time and effort goes into it.. if I had more time(college is a succubus) I could dedicate to anything, I would be trying to make my own contributions.
Revolution may be a total asshat(and I'm thinking he probably is), but if someone were to stumble across your dealings with him without doing the research, they might come to a conclusion about you that isn't accurate at all.
I guess I would ask you, have you reached out to any developers that currently aren't contributing to ask if they are willing to assist? When working with pure code like you are in the ICS build, some could make good contributions without ever having the device in their hands..
I know HTC isn't making this easy, nor are some of the people in the community who show their lack of patience.. but the basis of me starting this thread was because I understand the value of working collaboratively, and I know it isn't always easy to organize-- but in a sense that is one of my knacks, I am a professional facilitator. That also may be why I have been going to college the last four years, it isn't the easiest thing to market(without a degree), but it DOES have its uses..
Silentbtdeadly said:
Well, I am new to the device, I've only had mine for a few weeks though I have been following the forums for nearly 2 months.. even with the workarounds that the members of the community bear the burden of, s-off still keeps developers away that much? Many devs I have talked to develop or contribute to devices they don't have.. as long as at least one developer has the device, or they have adequate testers, they seem happy to contribute to the code(I am talking about compiling/building like xboarder is doing with ICS).
I don't want to sound like this post was because I am impatient, but when I read the ICS thread earlier I was bothered by how immediate things escalated, and that the thread got closed over something that seems so petty.
I've worked with a lot of these devices, I've read quite a few forums, and even some of the crappier devices seem to have several teams of devs, and I am failing to see why a device as beefy and awesome as this one hasn't attracted at least a few more.
I saw a bounty thread earlier, and the very fact that people are willing to contribute is one of the factors that made me wonder at the lack of devs here.. I bought this phone because it is simply the best device out there, and I would like to do whatever I can to facilitate the growth and development of our part of the forums. Not having s-off may be a turn off to developing as much as you say it is, but I know several devs that could contribute to the code of any device without ever having it in their hand..
Perhaps the problem is that the members are publicizing enough the need that is here, the contributions of the members in this area would be more than enough to support a much larger number of devs, and that alone I would think would draw some out..
I totally understand, and I hope you take what I said constructively, not negatively. I'm not one of those people that ask for ETAs, I may not be a developer, but I definitely have a good idea of how much time and effort goes into it.. if I had more time(college is a succubus) I could dedicate to anything, I would be trying to make my own contributions.
Revolution may be a total asshat(and I'm thinking he probably is), but if someone were to stumble across your dealings with him without doing the research, they might come to a conclusion about you that isn't accurate at all.
I guess I would ask you, have you reached out to any developers that currently aren't contributing to ask if they are willing to assist? When working with pure code like you are in the ICS build, some could make good contributions without ever having the device in their hands..
I know HTC isn't making this easy, nor are some of the people in the community who show their lack of patience.. but the basis of me starting this thread was because I understand the value of working collaboratively, and I know it isn't always easy to organize-- but in a sense that is one of my knacks, I am a professional facilitator. That also may be why I have been going to college the last four years, it isn't the easiest thing to market(without a degree), but it DOES have its uses..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nope i got a group all ready working with privatly on this
I don't know much about what's going on behind the (Devs) scene - things between Xboarder56 and CM team, between Xboarder56 and Revolution but based on the facts that I've seen, Xboarder56 did a wonderful job. All the noob tools, Roms - especially his supports. He updates his Rom immediately after someone found a bug, heck, he was so fast at supporting and updating that I am - as an end user, seems to be tired to trying to keep up with his releases.
Based on what I've read in the forum, Revolution is an a**hole - period! And if I were a Mod he would be forever banned due to the fact of kept asking ETA alone - not to mention the bad intention to provoked Xboarder56.
There is a mutual benefits between Dev and end users. If you are a good Dev with a lot of followers, you will become popular and that will helps with your career (i.e Steve Kondik and Samsung). Devs built Rom not just for fun, they also built up their porfolio/resume if they wanted a good job in hi-tech field and a good reputation when putting their app on the Market.
On a personal point of view, I don't care if there is only one Dev in the Amaze forum because without many of them I still be able to get ICS when it's due from Tmobile. Flashing custom Rom is more like a hobby to many of us here and if I don't have their support I still be fine with my phone - using Stock
Another thing needs to be point out and one may not agreed with me but a Stock Rom is always better than any custom Rom. I means looks at Motorola's announcement just a few days ago when they are looking for testers for their soon to be update software, they are looking for one thousand tester and when a Mfg. released their final product, they usually testing it for months before.
As with us? Every time when we flashed a new Rom we tend to check on some basic function as wifi, tethering, bluetooth, gps and stuff like that and we were testing it for a few minutes - until it crashed or bootloop a day later. We rarely have a chance a test the Rom while doing multi-task with hundreds of apps on different environtments, i.g using GPS while listening to Music on a trip and taking/receiving phone calls while another party on hold at the other end and at the same time googling for a nearby restaurant, ect ... How many of us doing such intensive test on our beloved new Rom for a long period of time? I'm doubtful.
To top it off. More Devs? Great! I appreciates their effort and I am thankful. I will consider a donation if I think the Dev is devoting to his work and fully support his followers and deserved his rewards. If there is none? I either continuing using my phone with Stock and after a few months, Ebaying it or throw it on my local Craigslist and buy another phone - happily ever after! If there is a single Dev out there thinking that us users would have no where to go to without their work. They are wrong!
Mutual beneficial is the name of this game. Without users and testers - Dev is nothing but a desperate wannabe tech-guy looking for a job without a good looking porfolio/resume. No chance to practice and/or testing your product. Without Devs, users would have no fun and his phone purchasing cycle will be shorter hence carriers and Mfg. can sell more phones! That's about it!
Enough ranting and my appologies for those who hates long post.
Followed amaze forums since xboarder was first rooting it.
Wonderful job.
Keep up the development.it will make you grow as a person.
Just cut off the negative people.
Binary seems to actually moderate these threads,which I don't see much of on xda.
Xboarder...I chose the amaze because you are here.
That revolution character is laughable.I have a few devices,and he's popped up in a few,and basically been shunned.its his fault(for getting shunned).
But remember,like in football...
The ref calls the foul on the Guy who responds,not the one who commits the foul in the first place.
You're good at what you do.
Keep doing it.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
sunlaw2 said:
Followed amaze forums since xboarder was first rooting it.
Wonderful job.
Keep up the development.it will make you grow as a person.
Just cut off the negative people.
Binary seems to actually moderate these threads,which I don't see much of on xda.
Xboarder...I chose the amaze because you are here.
That revolution character is laughable.I have a few devices,and he's popped up in a few,and basically been shunned.its his fault(for getting shunned).
But remember,like in football...
The ref calls the foul on the Guy who responds,not the one who commits the foul in the first place.
You're good at what you do.
Keep doing it.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks! It's difficult to find balance between the forum and my personal life but I do what I can. Also keep in mind that I moderate more forums here on XDA at the same time as do a lot of forum moderators. So if you don't see them in other forums frequently then use the report post feature and report the thread. Your FSM will be alerted to investigate the reported issue.
sunlaw2 said:
But remember,like in football...
The ref calls the foul on the Guy who responds,not the one who commits the foul in the first place.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Umm....shouldn't the ref call the foul on the guy who actually committed the foul in the first place? Just sayin.
Silentbtdeadly said:
I realize this post may not make me popular, but this community isn't about popularity so much as it is about working together as a community, for the community.
I had a post ready on my phone, but for some reason the xda or tapatalk app sometimes puts my phone in a boot loop.. anyways:
As best as I can tell, we have one solid developer(no offense to anyone else if they are deving) who is working with source. One person working on ICS, and putting out roms for our pleasure. Xboarder, it is awesome that you are able and willing to put the time and work into this phone like you have, and I thank you.
I am curious about one thing though: Is xboarder opposed to working with others?
This is in no way to stir up trouble, but I have seen multiple posts of problems between revolution(and maybe others?) and xboarder. I would have posted this in that thread, but it is locked I am assuming because of those problems. This thread is not about blame, it is to point out that who is at fault doesn't matter. If another developer was considering this device they aren't going to try to see who is at fault, they will assume that neither party works well with others.
It is admirable that someone so young(xboarder) is able to step up and do what many people older than him cannot, developing and working on projects like he has.. but is seems like people handle him with kid gloves(pun NOT intended), perhaps out of fear they will lose the only developer currently working with our device, but this is an opportunity for xboarder or anyone else to develop professionally. It is one thing to be able to do something by yourself, from the ground up, but our ability to work with others while utilizing the skills we would have by ourselves is something extremely desired in the professional world, or is valuable in life itself.
XDA is a community, each of us contributing our experiences and what we have learned with each other, that is what creates progress. Some contribute financially, some trouble shoot, some test, some develop, but consciously or not we are all working together to some degree. This is the ideal.
Most devices that have a working ICS build have more than one person, sometimes teams of people, working on the project together. They check each other's work, offer knowledge, divide the workload.. many could work individually, but in almost all cases the final product is better by working collaboratively.
An adult trait that many adults don't have, is the ability to turn the other cheek. Or to reach out to others for help. To overlook offenses. Don't deny xboarder the chance to step up professionally. Give him the opportunity to learn how to pick and choose his battles, to share glory, to learn and teach others by letting him do it on his own.
Xboarder, please don't take anything I've said offensively, but if you can, consider it objectively. You probably haven't had the chance to work with others on a large group project, to collaborate. Maybe revolution(I don't know if he is a dev or who is at fault, etc) or others have been an ass, but don't let that stop you from working with them or others to put together a better product. To free up your resources to do something for yourself, or your own side projects..
I hope no one will flame, blame, or otherwise take this thread as a chance to cause chaos or get upset. I have worked with others collaboratively, people I do like and people I don't, and it is an important thing when you are dealing with projects of this magnitude. That is why you don't see many working ICS builds being created alone, or at the least, you see people building upon other people's work.. because that is what open source is all about. I have worked as a consultant for businesses, trying to figure out what happens in the infrastructure that may be keeping it from a higher level of success.. and that is what I am offering here, a possible insight into what could help this entire community make more progress, helping each person who makes their own contributions however they can. Damn this post got long, I can only hope that it might lead to something productive.
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Click to collapse
I totally see where you are coming from. In reality their are people who will intentionally get under you skin any way they can. Even as an adult it still happens. But if theirs anything that I learned in flight school its that you can run into the wind you have to turn into and face it. The thing you push against lifts you up. Team work is crucial in any thing you do really. That's what being a community is about, working together not being divided. I have seen the things revolution has done and in reality he is one of the ones who won't go far. I mean all of this out of respect, but with a device so scares but great that is a reason we should help on another. If HTC won't help then it looks like its up to us. We need to work together and stop being a pain in the ass toward one another. Like I said I'm not blaming anyone its all out of respect.
To be fair.revolution has 500 something thanks.
But if someone persists in annoying others,soliciting donations for bogus "development",etc...
Just let the moderators handle it.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
sunlaw2 said:
To be fair.revolution has 500 something thanks.
But if someone persists in annoying others,soliciting donations for bogus "development",etc...
Just let the moderators handle it.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
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Click to collapse
500thanks out of 1500total posts meaning 67% of the time he talks bullsh$t
Sent from my HTC_Amaze_4G using xda premium
sunlaw2 said:
To be fair.revolution has 500 something thanks.
But if someone persists in annoying others,soliciting donations for bogus "development",etc...
Just let the moderators handle it.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My thanks to post ratio isn't as high, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. Maybe he will have something to offer, probably not.
If binary sees this, feel free to close the post, xboarder clearly said where he is with other devs, so there isn't much more that needs to be said.
Silentbtdeadly said:
My thanks to post ratio isn't as high, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. Maybe he will have something to offer, probably not.
If binary sees this, feel free to close the post, xboarder clearly said where he is with other devs, so there isn't much more that needs to be said.
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Click to collapse
Thread closed per OP request.
Just a quick note of thanks to OaT for his superior builds and the sadness he's now discontinued them .
I was first in line of the hungry hoards who insatiably devoured every mouthwatering release - from LnT_Beats to Linaro experimental builds, and to my shame never got a word of thanks or feedback out to the master chef! Unfortunately this pattern of general behaviour I believe contributed to the demise of this coveted build.
I tried a number of times to feedback on OaT's threads but was blocked by forum rules (hadn't hit the 10 x post threshold) and frustrated by this it was easy not to make the effort and feedback on this fine ROM. Apologies for this!
Nevertheless, OaT releases won't be forgotten, and my sincere thanks for his superb efforts on a thoroughly enjoyable and expert release.
Cheers,
P
I'm going to get eaten alive for saying this, but I think the whole quitting due to not receiving thanks was a bit childish... He knew people liked his ROM, mostly by the number of people he knew downloaded his ROM... If he wanted to quit for personal reasons then whatever, that's all good, it's his life. Just, I don't really get the importance of a thank you button on a message board.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Certain people just get a rush out of being able to show other devs how many "thanks" they have. It's the same as like-whores on facebook.
He wanted feedback on the ROM as well, not just thanks.
bananagranola said:
He wanted feedback on the ROM as well, not just thanks.
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Click to collapse
What bananagranola just said is the biggest reason the man pulled the ROM.... Just as most users here are too lazy to search before asking questions... they're too lazy to fulfill the development request for feedback so he can make the ROM that THEY like using better... and those same people whining about the links being pulled are the same ones that conveniently forget to remember that's why he pulled links... not for the THANKS but for THEIR lack of ability to provide a simple request
For anyone with several devices can see... this is happening all over xda... the devs are tiring of the leeches that download and then simply whine and complain when things aren't all roses with their devices
Sent from my AOKP M6 TouchPad using TapaTalk 2
cdzo72 said:
What bananagranola just said is the biggest reason the man pulled the ROM.... Just as most users here are too lazy to search before asking questions... they're too lazy to fulfill the development request for feedback so he can make the ROM that THEY like using better... and those same people whining about the links being pulled are the same ones that conveniently forget to remember that's why he pulled links... not for the THANKS but for THEIR lack of ability to provide a simple request
For anyone with several devices can see... this is happening all over xda... the devs are tiring of the leeches that download and then simply whine and complain when things aren't all roses with their devices
Sent from my AOKP M6 TouchPad using TapaTalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I said my thanks, and never complained. I didn't provide much feedback, because to me, it just felt like complaining and I knew I didn't have that right. Oh well, water under the bridge now... RIP touchpad for now. These days remind me of when bumblebee stopped supporting lg v500. Development died for months and I ended up selling the thing due to it.
Sent from my aokp_tenderloin using xda app-developers app
If this thread turns into a big arguing pit, I'll close this too. Please keep your posts civil and don't start arguments.
Noellenchris
Is the TP on its last Android leg?
It doesn't bear discussion as to the "why" OaT took down the ROM. It was a personal decision made by an individual for whatever rationale he/she determined was in their best interest to have a happy life. I have to respect that if I want others to respect my discussion and decisions as well. Many thanks for the time and effort that OaT put forward, but I'm not sure where to go from here.
The TouchPad isn't going to move forward. It's a static technology that HP as a manufacturer isn't going to come back to. At least not in its current incarnation. HP is coming back to the tablet world - just not at this moment, and not with WebOS. If you read the news, HP will be back in this space with Win 8 and tablets in the future.
Tech doesn't stand still, and as people's interests change on a non-standard / open sourced product - it's lifecycle is only determined by the people able to move it forward, and the demand people are placing on a limited supply item.
Reading the writing on the walls, the HP TouchPad is reaching the end of its (Android) life - for better or worse. Now it's up to those of us who own the TouchPad to determine just how long to hang onto it before moving on. Do you settle on a latest release of CM9, or hope that someone pushes CM10 forward and gets audio, HD video and all the other bells and whistles to the point of CM9? (Let's just all assume the camera is the great white whale for devs.)
It's only after the death of an artist that the world mourns their contributions. With OaT dropping out - I don't know where to put my focus. I don't know which devs are still around working diligently on CM10 versus the crew working on CM9.
--McBean
bananagranola said:
He wanted feedback on the ROM as well, not just thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cdzo72 said:
What bananagranola just said is the biggest reason the man pulled the ROM.... Just as most users here are too lazy to search before asking questions... they're too lazy to fulfill the development request for feedback so he can make the ROM that THEY like using better... and those same people whining about the links being pulled are the same ones that conveniently forget to remember that's why he pulled links... not for the THANKS but for THEIR lack of ability to provide a simple request
For anyone with several devices can see... this is happening all over xda... the devs are tiring of the leeches that download and then simply whine and complain when things aren't all roses with their devices
Sent from my AOKP M6 TouchPad using TapaTalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll try to make it official and clear here. The primary reason for me discontinuing development and pulling the links was the lack of feedback on the new Beats Audio in the new LnTBA. I don't have the hifi sound equipment to test that, and with 60 year old ears that are only able to hear middle range sounds, I'm not sure even if I did I would be able to tell if the new BA was an improvement or not.
The lack of feedback when specifically asked for, even initially when I asked for testers when I began to consider publishing the ROM, has been a real disappointment. In fact I initially expanded my testers list from ~20 to ~40 because of people asking me to 'please' let them test and 'promising' feedback. In the end I got at most a handful of thoughtful responses.
So in this last round where I requested feedback on LnTBA, I set the bar pretty low the day I posted it; I told myself if I only got 1 response when the download count reached 100 or more that would be enough, understanding that not everyone flashes as soon as they download. Ultimately there were ~250 downloads of LnTBA within ~24 hours of it being posted. Still, there was not one response, "none, zero, nada"!
In regards to the lack of folks hitting the "thanks" button, it should be obvious that if that were the real reason to discontinue development I would have stopped publishing the ROMs long ago.
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
O.a.T. said:
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OaT, that's awesome!
I do respect your decision to pull your ROMs due to lack of feedback. It goes back to something I say almost every day... If I don't know there's a problem, I can't fix it. I'm trying to get my 10 posts in so, hopefully, when/if you do make another release, I am able to provide input in the dev forum.
O.a.T. said:
I'll try to make it official and clear here. The primary reason for me discontinuing development and pulling the links was the lack of feedback on the new Beats Audio in the new LnTBA. I don't have the hifi sound equipment to test that, and with 60 year old ears that are only able to hear middle range sounds, I'm not sure even if I did I would be able to tell if the new BA was an improvement or not.
The lack of feedback when specifically asked for, even initially when I asked for testers when I began to consider publishing the ROM, has been a real disappointment. In fact I initially expanded my testers list from ~20 to ~40 because of people asking me to 'please' let them test and 'promising' feedback. In the end I got at most a handful of thoughtful responses.
So in this last round where I requested feedback on LnTBA, I set the bar pretty low the day I posted it; I told myself if I only got 1 response when the download count reached 100 or more that would be enough, understanding that not everyone flashes as soon as they download. Ultimately there were ~250 downloads of LnTBA within ~24 hours of it being posted. Still, there was not one response, "none, zero, nada"!
In regards to the lack of folks hitting the "thanks" button, it should be obvious that if that were the real reason to discontinue development I would have stopped publishing the ROMs long ago.
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is unbelievably great news. Many people like your Roms and have great experiances with them. As you said I don't flash right away. i dont have alot of time to play with my touchpad so when I get around to it, all the issues that I have seen are usually already posted. Plus I'm not a heavy user of so I dont see many of the issues.
As far as Beats Audio, I've only flashed it on my LG revolution and it made it worse. Otherwise if a Rom has it in it for the touchpad I haven't noticed. I also don't use audio that much. I'm basically explaining that I do like your ROMs but i think my feedback might not make an impact.
OaT the TP God
O.a.T. said:
I'll try to make it official and clear here. The primary reason for me discontinuing development and pulling the links was the lack of feedback on the new Beats Audio in the new LnTBA. I don't have the hifi sound equipment to test that, and with 60 year old ears that are only able to hear middle range sounds, I'm not sure even if I did I would be able to tell if the new BA was an improvement or not.
The lack of feedback when specifically asked for, even initially when I asked for testers when I began to consider publishing the ROM, has been a real disappointment. In fact I initially expanded my testers list from ~20 to ~40 because of people asking me to 'please' let them test and 'promising' feedback. In the end I got at most a handful of thoughtful responses.
So in this last round where I requested feedback on LnTBA, I set the bar pretty low the day I posted it; I told myself if I only got 1 response when the download count reached 100 or more that would be enough, understanding that not everyone flashes as soon as they download. Ultimately there were ~250 downloads of LnTBA within ~24 hours of it being posted. Still, there was not one response, "none, zero, nada"!
In regards to the lack of folks hitting the "thanks" button, it should be obvious that if that were the real reason to discontinue development I would have stopped publishing the ROMs long ago.
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OaT,
I was out of town during that release (in Alaska, no internet), and I don't use BA at all, ever. I think it's a gimmick. I will say that your 829 build is amazing, and probably the best OS I have used on any tablet ever.
I don't agree with your decision to pull all your roms. It IS your decision, but I know hundreds of TP users out there (most probably lurkers that don't even post on XDA) have benefited from your superior roms, and it seems like helping people in the future (or even just currently) would be the "right" thing to do.
Thank you for:
A) Your roms
B) The explanation of your sudden disappearance
C) Giving us some hope for the future
D) Continuing your development
I can understand your frustrations about testers. Doing a bunch of work and not getting feedback can be a real drag. I'll try to be more vocal in the future. Hell, I'll start right now.
The 829 build is GREAT. The battery lasts forever. I have been getting occasional FCs here and there, in particular the holo launcher is DOA on this build. Apex works great (as usual), I don't really like GO launcher. I think it's kind of a mess. This is my daily driver now because the battery is so much better than the 819 JB build. Google Now voice input doesn't work at all for me (using OaT gapps 429). The rest of Google Now works great.
Feel free to let me know if you need more testing with something specific, but don't expect it too quickly. I'm married, new baby, play in a band, and have a full time IT job. I will get to it late at night on Thursdays or Sunday afternoon though, if I can.
Rhy
I for one am guilty as charged in the "no feedback" issue, my bad. I've used and enjoyed your roms and most definitely should have participated in helping squash the bugs. Sorry buddy. On another note though, the stupid rom is just so damn solid I really had nothing to say I would kinda feel like a whiner if I mentioned the occasional fc. I am still amazed that this old webos tablet can even run android, let alone run it well.
Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk 2
ItsDon said:
I for one am guilty as charged in the "no feedback" issue, my bad. I've used and enjoyed your roms and most definitely should have participated in helping squash the bugs. Sorry buddy. On another note though, the stupid rom is just so damn solid I really had nothing to say I would kinda feel like a whiner if I mentioned the occasional fc. I am still amazed that this old webos tablet can even run android, let alone run it well.
Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
Have to echo ItsDon. I don't feedback much either because the thing works so damn well. Thanks again OaT.
OaT, your ROM is the best.
Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk 2
As for me, I am a newb for xda, not a lurker, and couldn't post feedback on the dev section til I got the requirements done. Something like that.
Sent from my YP-G70 using xda app-developers app
hanjosep said:
As for me, I am a newb for xda, not a lurker, and couldn't post feedback on the dev section til I got the requirements done. Something like that.
Sent from my YP-G70 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I. for one, could not leave feedback because I didn't have enough posts. They should remove this requirement from the forum because I think many people can't leave feedback because of this requirement. Some people (including myself) don't like posting random comments to increase their posts and want to get to the point.
Regardless, thanks for everything you've done so far OaT.
Sad to see that on a weekend when I don't check up on OAT thread I miss out on an update. As far as beats feedback goes off the top of my head I ran with the beats build of 7/06 and 7/29. Before that I ran the standard version of 6/03. On a whim I switched over to the non beats version of 7/29 and never looked back. I believe I stuck to the standard version of 7/29 because overall audio clarity seemed to be better on the standard. Easiest way for me to say that is at equal volume the standard seemed louder? Again this was from memory, the testing was conducting in the best setting, and I wasn't trying that hard. In all honesty I think what I was trying to see if there would be a significant difference between the two and if there was I would keep my preferred version. Since I'm running the 7/29 non beats still I assume I found no significant difference. I would like to add that I found no difference even in webos with beats on or off.
This is too little too late, but this has been my personal experience. I used Audio Technica CKS77 iems. Thank you for all you have done OAT, your light n tasty philosophy was something I really appreciated when I was looking at roms and was what made pick your rom first. I never bothered to try the rest
Legion021 said:
I. for one, could not leave feedback because I didn't have enough posts. They should remove this requirement from the forum because I think many people can't leave feedback because of this requirement. Some people (including myself) don't like posting random comments to increase their posts and want to get to the point.
Regardless, thanks for everything you've done so far OaT.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I second that. And the "thanks" button does not show until you make your first post. I went crazy trying to find it.
It's just sad that I never cared for oat's roms until now that he disappeared. I also don't think it's fair that a small portion of people were able to download the latest build and others were not. In case someone has the latest build and it didn't break any rules and disrespect the developer then please share.
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2