I'm trying to decided between the Galaxy Nexus and the Droid 4.
I'm assuming Droid4 and RAZR will have the same exact hardware and therefore be pretty much interchangeable ROM wise. Is this correct?
If that is the case I'm heavily leaning toward the Droid 4 but it depends on 2 things.
1. With the "removable back", the battery being accessible without removing glued on case components(just screws)
2. The developer support for the RAZR/Droid4 being sizable despite the locked bootloader.
Thoughts?
The developer support is still growing and I think we will be satisfied in the end. But is not a nexus though.
There are some things happening already, for example someone have been able too boot ICS.
Also the bootloader will be unlocked when Moto releases ICS.
pajn said:
Also the bootloader will be unlocked when Moto releases ICS.
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This is confirmed officially even on Verizon? If so the Droid 4 wins me over hands down.
Natolx said:
This is confirmed officially even on Verizon? If so the Droid 4 wins me over hands down.
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No, I'm sorry didn't think of Veri.
Moto said that they would unlock the bootloader if the operator is okay with it. So it's up to Verizon, and what I have heard they probably won't allow it.
pajn said:
No, I'm sorry didn't think of Veri.
Moto said that they would unlock the bootloader if the operator is okay with it. So it's up to Verizon, and what I have heard they probably won't allow it.
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After doing some brief research on this, I read that the unlock tool that is released with the ICS update abroad will "probably" allow developers to unlock the Verizon RAZR. Is this actually likely?
Natolx said:
After doing some brief research on this, I read that the unlock tool that is released with the ICS update abroad will "probably" allow developers to unlock the Verizon RAZR. Is this actually likely?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Likely? Probably not, but it might be possible for a dev to reverse engineer or figure it out...
Lots of IFs, but with Safestrap out now and devs working on roms, after we get FXZ or SBF, we will have a great device with lots of options for ROMs.
1. IIRC, the Droid 4 will also lack a removable battery.
2. ICS might not be released until May or June. By then the Razr will be an "old" phone, so it might not really take off with developers if it does not build momentum in the next 2-3 months while it is still "new."
-but from the looks of it the development of the Razr seems to be really starting to take off.
3. In terms of user base, the one thing that really helped the Razr was the 1 cent Amazon Wireless deal. It was the top phone available on Verizon at the time, so I'm sure that built a good base of users- but maybe not the type of users who develop ROMs.
tk76 said:
1. IIRC, the Droid 4 will also lack a removable battery.
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The Droid 4, there is some question as to whether the phone will have a removable battery or not.
The test units were not sent with the case removal tool that was seen on the spec sheet that was released today.
I haven't seen a new confirmation on the removable battery yet, and Motorola never confirmed anything on this front.
tk76 said:
2. ICS might not be released until May or June. By then the Razr will be an "old" phone, so it might not really take off with developers if it does not build momentum in the next 2-3 months while it is still "new."
-but from the looks of it the development of the Razr seems to be really starting to take off.
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That is of course IF - and this is a big IF, the Razr's bootloader gets unlocked before that. And judging by what I have seen, it doesn't take that long if the phone is a flagship phone... Correct me if I am wrong
armanatz said:
That is of course IF - and this is a big IF, the Razr's bootloader gets unlocked before that. And judging by what I have seen, it doesn't take that long if the phone is a flagship phone... Correct me if I am wrong
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The boatloader won't get unlocked. You'll see a workaround, like a 2nd-init, or something along those lines, but Verizon won't allow unlocked boatloaders, and Motorola is going to comply with Verizon's desire to keep the boatloader in lockdown.
That won't stop development, and ASOP ROM's which is what Droid Th3ory is working on, an ASOP ICS port.
mhhh but the Atrix have unlocked bootloader, why only that moto have that luck?
Atrix is on at&t. The carrier designates whether the boatloader stays locked or not. It isn't moto's decision.
garlick2 said:
Atrix is on at&t. The carrier designates whether the boatloader stays locked or not. It isn't moto's decision.
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Except for the Galaxy Nexus...
So vzw allows the GNex unlocked but locks the Moto phones? Why?
quadjacks said:
So vzw allows the GNex unlocked but locks the Moto phones? Why?
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Very good question. Why don't you ask them? It would be interesting to hear their reply.
Well it looks like dev on this phone is dead!
I mean they have already released ICS 4.0.2 for the vzw GN and we ain't got **** yet!!
Looks like I'm going to have give this phone the wifey and go get me a GN.
Don't get me wrong I love the phone but no dev spt is a bummer!
...What are you talking about. The Nexus shipped with ICS in the first place, of course it got it before we did. And it got 4.0.2 update 2 hours later straight from Google. That has nothing to do with Dev support.
And naturally, since it's a Nexus device, it's gonna get ages more dev support than any other phone. But we are getting places ourselves. DroidTh3ory released RAZRX two days ago. He's working on ICS right now. We got Safestrap 2 days ago. Once we get the FXZ files we're probably going to get like 200x the support we're getting right now. Not to mention the Nexus' hardware which is composed of fantastic innards, but a plastic, easy-to-chip case, normal glass screen with minimal scratch resistance, & a weak radio.
It boggles me how you can say dev support is dead with all of the stuff that's LITERALLY happened in the past two days.
quadjacks said:
So vzw allows the GNex unlocked but locks the Moto phones? Why?
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Click to collapse
I posted this somewhere else, there's really 2 reasons for this:
1) Google required that the Nexus come "open".
2) In the agreement to carry the phone, essentially Samsung & Google have taken over support for the phone, to the point where the contract, while through Verizon, is actually supported by Google, and therefore they can dictate the bootloader.
That's what I could gather from reading up on how the Nexus came to be a Verizon phone. There were some pretty heavy negotiations here, and Verizon didn't want Sprint to get the phone, and couldn't stand to have another Iphone/Att&t exclusive situation happen again.
Now, for Moto, they are already heavily tied to Verizon, and so they have no leverage for getting their devices to be released as open.
They even were first (I believe) to start saying they wanted open phones, back when the xoom was released. They made a statement that by late 2011 they were going to release all their phones with unlocked bootloaders like the xoom was......that didn't happen because Verizon threatened to pull the phones if they did that.
Verizon even forced HTC to remove it's bootloader unlock tool on the web, if I'm not mistaken.
So it's really not Moto's fault, it's Verizon's, and the Nexus is going to be the way it is because Google has control, not Verizon.
yeah except the nexus ships locked and is unlockable through adb.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using XDA App
So what you're saying is we'll get a ICS Rom from developers long before any Verizon update to ICS.....right? Because waiting till June is absurd! This phone is just too friggin good to not get some attention......is my opin,anyway....
Related
Hello all, I'm currently using a Nexus One on T-Mo but am probably going to jump back to Sprint here soon. I had been looking to get the Evo3D, but fear that it's going to be locked down as the Thuderbolt was. I understand you guy were able to gain root on the Thunderbolt recently, but only because you got an engineering something or other, I don't remember exactly. My question here is, what would the chances have been of the phone being rooted the normal brute force way. Would we have been looking at possibly months or more, or was it just a matter of days. I ask cause if the Evo3D is going to be locked down and may take months or more to crack, I may just go with the Nexus S for now.
Well it looks like HTCs phones are going to be locked up tight. Not really sure about the EVO3D but I wouldn't be surprised if it had a locked bootloader etc.
ERIFNOMI said:
Well it looks like HTCs phones are going to be locked up tight. Not really sure about the EVO3D but I wouldn't be surprised if it had a locked bootloader etc.
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Yeah... HTC makes me sad all day for locking their bootloaders, samsung is looking more and more attractive. Sammy's phones don't even put up a fight, sometimes getting root before they're even released to general public
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
PaganAng3l said:
Yeah... HTC makes me sad all day for locking their bootloaders, samsung is looking more and more attractive. Sammy's phones don't even put up a fight, sometimes getting root before they're even released to general public
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
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Cause the TB wasn't rooted before it came out right?
Samsung is looking attractive just because they don't lock their bootloaders? What kind of logic is that? Look at the Galaxy series, those phones were crap, full of lag, horrible GPS, etc.
Yes and our GPS works flawlessly
wakestrong said:
Yes and our GPS works flawlessly
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Mine sure does. A thousand times better than my Facinate did.
Sent from my BAMF ADR6400L using XDA Premium App
g00s3y said:
Cause the TB wasn't rooted before it came out right?
Samsung is looking attractive just because they don't lock their bootloaders? What kind of logic is that? Look at the Galaxy series, those phones were crap, full of lag, horrible GPS, etc.
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Click to collapse
Ah, where to begin I'm guessing that you misunderstood what I said, or maybe I worded it wrong. In my previous post I was merely making a gross generalization. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love HTC for their build quality and the fact that my G2 (being over a year old) STILL puts up a decent fight against new devices. What I meant was that given a choice I will always support a manufacturer that keeps their devices unlocked (like samsung). Yes, samsung has had some pretty dismal failures in the phone department, but what about the Nexus S 4G? Not to mention the fact that according to a few websites, they seem to be learning from their mistakes and putting out great devices recently (matter of opinion though). I can't really see how my logic is flawed for wanting MY device to have an unlocked bootloader, it's just a standard I'm developing. As far as the thunderbolt getting root before release.... stuff happens unexpectedly and I'm glad the TB got root so soon. Newer HTC devices however are looking at much better lockups on their bootloaders though and I would rather not have to risk a brick to flash my heart out. But these are all my own opinions, you have yours but these are mine.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
PaganAng3l said:
Ah, where to begin I'm guessing that you misunderstood what I said, or maybe I worded it wrong. In my previous post I was merely making a gross generalization. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love HTC for their build quality and the fact that my G2 (being over a year old) STILL puts up a decent fight against new devices. What I meant was that given a choice I will always support a manufacturer that keeps their devices unlocked (like samsung). Yes, samsung has had some pretty dismal failures in the phone department, but what about the Nexus S 4G? Not to mention the fact that according to a few websites, they seem to be learning from their mistakes and putting out great devices recently (matter of opinion though). I can't really see how my logic is flawed for wanting MY device to have an unlocked bootloader, it's just a standard I'm developing. As far as the thunderbolt getting root before release.... stuff happens unexpectedly and I'm glad the TB got root so soon. Newer HTC devices however are looking at much better lockups on their bootloaders though and I would rather not have to risk a brick to flash my heart out. But these are all my own opinions, you have yours but these are mine.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
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I was just referring to the first "Galaxy" set that came out. The S 4G, S II, and their releases this year have been stellar. But neither of those are on VZW . I would snatch up the SII in a second if it was on VZW.
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D using XDA App
PaganAng3l said:
Ah, where to begin I'm guessing that you misunderstood what I said, or maybe I worded it wrong. In my previous post I was merely making a gross generalization. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love HTC for their build quality and the fact that my G2 (being over a year old) STILL puts up a decent fight against new devices. What I meant was that given a choice I will always support a manufacturer that keeps their devices unlocked (like samsung). Yes, samsung has had some pretty dismal failures in the phone department, but what about the Nexus S 4G? Not to mention the fact that according to a few websites, they seem to be learning from their mistakes and putting out great devices recently (matter of opinion though). I can't really see how my logic is flawed for wanting MY device to have an unlocked bootloader, it's just a standard I'm developing. As far as the thunderbolt getting root before release.... stuff happens unexpectedly and I'm glad the TB got root so soon. Newer HTC devices however are looking at much better lockups on their bootloaders though and I would rather not have to risk a brick to flash my heart out. But these are all my own opinions, you have yours but these are mine.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
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Click to collapse
I'm in the same boat. I'm not going to buy a phone that's locked up tight. HTC better learn real quick that there are a lot of people like this. I was going to buy a honeycomb tablet if they came out with one because based on their phones I figured it would be pretty open. Now it looks like I'll have to go elsewhere. Maybe since a tablet won't be tied to a carrier they'll be more relaxed. I hope anyway...
ERIFNOMI said:
I'm in the same boat. I'm not going to buy a phone that's locked up tight. HTC better learn real quick that there are a lot of people like this. I was going to buy a honeycomb tablet if they came out with one because based on their phones I figured it would be pretty open. Now it looks like I'll have to go elsewhere. Maybe since a tablet won't be tied to a carrier they'll be more relaxed. I hope anyway...
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Click to collapse
I hear you. Some company will eventually embrace modders and devs, I just wanted it to be HTC. Oh well, sad day
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
It seems we've gone a bit off topic. I have been reading all the comments and have learned that Sammy isn't doing what HTC is starting to do with locking their bootloaders, something I didn't know before this thread, good to know. But the question I presented hasn't really been answered yet. How long, rough gestimation, would it take to crack the bootloader of the new phones HTC is coming out with. Are we talking weeks or months or more. I know this a question that can't be easily answered with a specific answer, but I'm looking more for how likely they are to be cracked in a timely manner. I'm not a hacker, cracker or code breaker so I really don't even know where to begin with trying to answer this question, hence why I put it forth here, on the forum of a phone that was locked and got unlocked hoping a dev could give me some info on weather getting the forthcoming Evo3D is a good idea for someone who want's to root the phone. I am however leaning back towards the Nexus s 4G because of this thread, but since money won't allow that at the moment, I'm exploring my options until the time I can afford a new phone.
The thunderbolt was rooted becuase we reverted to an older leaked rom which allowed us to bypass the whole signed bootloader. (I think) You might want to look into the incredible s which was released several months ago and has yet to me cracked. The security measures taken to lock down the G2 are not the same as the ones used on newer HTC devices. I don't think we'll be seeing any permanent root access HTC in a long time. Months at the very least.
Sent from The Republic of Texas
ddgarcia05 said:
The thunderbolt was rooted becuase we reverted to an older leaked rom which allowed us to bypass the whole signed bootloader. (I think) You might want to look into the incredible s which was released several months ago and has yet to me cracked. The security measures taken to lock down the G2 are not the same as the ones used on newer HTC devices. I don't think we'll be seeing any permanent root access HTC in a long time. Months at the very least.
Sent from The Republic of Texas
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Thank you, that was exactly what I was looking for. Sad news indeed. I'm guessing the Nexus S 4G is where I'm headed then, unless a Galaxy S 2 is slated to come out on sprint anytime soon that is. I'd really like to get a root-able, dual core, high resolution, bad ass phone if I'm going to be upgrading from my N1.
garfnodie said:
Thank you, that was exactly what I was looking for. Sad news indeed. I'm guessing the Nexus S 4G is where I'm headed then, unless a Galaxy S 2 is slated to come out on sprint anytime soon that is. I'd really like to get a root-able, dual core, high resolution, bad ass phone if I'm going to be upgrading from my N1.
Click to expand...
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I've been reading around about this (disappointing) news of HTC's lockdown using signed bootloaders, etc. and from what I have read, it seems like the crackers have indicated they are going to have a helluva time. A few tweets from jcase's twiiter page (whose opinions I personally value, YMMV):
If you want root, don't buy an yet to be rooted phone
[email protected] signed recovery, signed kernel, signed hboot, and write protection. won't buy [email protected] devices like that
HTC now MORE dev unfriendly than Motorola.
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Looks pretty dreary for new HTC phones.
Droid, which has signed bootloader, is still locked, and it's pretty long on the market. It's a matter of years, if not eternity. It's f***ing hard to crack those keys.
What I don't understand is why HTC is doing this. You might think that it's the carriers pressuring them, but if Sammy, Sony Erricson, and Moto are or are soon going to be releasing phone without locked bootloaders, why does HTC feel the need to start now when they haven't in the past?
garfnodie said:
What I don't understand is why HTC is doing this. You might think that it's the carriers pressuring them, but if Sammy, Sony Erricson, and Moto are or are soon going to be releasing phone without locked bootloaders, why does HTC feel the need to start now when they haven't in the past?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a pretty simple answer. Money.
mbh87 said:
It's a pretty simple answer. Money.
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How does a locked bootloader equal money?
garfnodie said:
How does a locked bootloader equal money?
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Click to collapse
Easy, keeps people using htc products, and makes us pay for tethering. Also makes sure that they know what ruu you're using.... Sucks
Edit: or whatever manufacturer made your device
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Easy, keeps people using htc products
Click to expand...
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How
and makes us pay for tethering.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The carriers have already shown that they can detect unofficial tethering
Also makes sure that they know what ruu you're using
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Click to collapse
Why does it matter?
I believe that the 6 week deadline from the official release of ICS source code is nearing up. So, if Motorola is true to its word, we should hear soon about its plans about ICS. And I sure hope those plans include the X2... What is your take on this (I know this question was asked a million times before, but the charm of asking it for the million and oneth time is just something different! )
Come on Moto! Don't disappoint me!
I believe the source is out already. Also IMO we wont ever see official ICS
motcher41 said:
I believe the source is out already. Also IMO we wont ever see official ICS
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Click to collapse
I meant the 6 week deadline that Motorola said they need from the time the source is out to let us know what phones are getting upgraded.
And it will be really unfair for Motorola to not release ICS on this phone that is not even an year old when Samsung and LG are promising that they will upgrade at least all the phones released in 2011 and even more.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1414221
This post was saying someone recently looked it up. So far it's all the newest ones (ie. Bionic, Raze) and they'll "update" us later on the others they may add.
litetaker said:
I meant the 6 week deadline that Motorola said they need from the time the source is out to let us know what phones are getting upgraded.
And it will be really unfair for Motorola to not release ICS on this phone that is not even an year old when Samsung and LG are promising that they will upgrade at least all the phones released in 2011 and even more.
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Click to collapse
When I was at Verizon on Monday the rep said our phone was a model on its way out. I personally think with moto rolling new phones and tablets out like crazy the X2 will be left behind.
Not to "Rock the Boat" but here is my views....
uhh hmm....
...We have a Droid x2 which was released May 26th 2011(if memory serves well). The device has been released for 7 months; halfway to a YEAR OLD! Now, with that said, I personally think that we WILL receive android 4.0. Due to the recent release of the Milestone x2, why would motorola release the device instead of pushing a different Milestone device? It currently OFFICIALLY supports 2.3.6 firmware and it was only released less than a month ago. So I think our chances are good to get it. Maybe not as soon as other devices, but EVENTUALLY we should get the release.
Call it false hopes or whatever may be, fact is MOTOROLA is a business. Why release a mirrored device(Milestone x2) if only to give 2 more updates? Along with the fact of hurting their image as a company with a dead device?
Next to this, I personally don't care!!! lol I personally think the x2 is a great device once you ROM it to whichever you want or at least debloat the stock. You don't even "need" the Init scripts if you are a casual user to keep the phone up to speed as of the 2.3.5 update for the Dx2. Once we got the 2.3.5 leak, I ran stock on my main phone for like a month as I progressed my ROM to that firmware. We as the x2 community are getting more development done now than we have in the past; regardless of what others think. Yes, the development seems slow, but how many devs do you see working on this device?
This isn't an argument about mods or ROMs, but we have some nice devs working on this phone. Next to that, "who needs ICS?" I imagine it will be faster, smoother, cooler than GB. But after 2 months have passed, users will start to complain that JellyBean(<<<<Thats the 5.0 or w/e firmware) isn't coming quick enough.
In the end, we are "stuck" with this phone regardless of leaks, mods, or updates. Enjoy what you have and hopefully someone will come along and give us what we want.
-Peperm1nt
I could care less if we ever get ics. Some people always want the next big thing which always has issues when first releases.
As for the milestone x2 sprint just dropped the lg optimus s and straight talk picked it up as the lg optimus precedent. Same phone. Smaller carriers always get devices or a version of the later after they are on the way out the big boys lineup. Milestone x2 are probably what Verizon didn't want from moto when the decided to drop the line. Its not really up to moto what updates we get its more up to Verizon to give it the ok. If the store I went to is correct and Verizon is dropping the device Verizon wont push anymore updates our way. Just saying
(This is just my opinion)
Im perfectly happy with the x2 and I am thankful for the devs we have. I donate when I can afford it and hope even though some of them have other devices will continue to help the x2 with smoother and smoother gb roms.
Thanks!
Sent from my DROID X2 using xda premium
+1 to motcher
I'm not good, but learning. The other devs are doing good with the device and I honestly think we have nothing to complain about. If you want ics, go elsewhere or port it over. When we get 2nd init FULLY working, I plan on trying to do it myself.
But honestly, we don't need it....just saying.
Tapin' the Talk on my Droid xSquared
Peperm1nt said:
+1 to motcher
I'm not good, but learning. The other devs are doing good with the device and I honestly think we have nothing to complain about. If you want ics, go elsewhere or port it over. When we get 2nd init FULLY working, I plan on trying to do it myself.
But honestly, we don't need it....just saying.
Tapin' the Talk on my Droid xSquared
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Click to collapse
Im no dev either but past experience on other devices. With a new kernel from moto to have it ramped up or an unlocked bootloader I think ics would not be quick. It would be laggy and severely lower performance. If you wanna port it I think best you'll get to run good as a lite version of ics. Droid eris has gb but its not complete. Devs had to remove parts to make it runnable since the device specs were just not made for it. Kinda like our 512mb of ram....bonehead move by moto.
Hell I have windows 7 on my netbook which was designed for xp....same deal as ics on a phone made to run gb really well. It might run but its not gonna be awesome just like 7 on my netbook. In my opinion.
I just hope mastafunk and the crew have success in get cm running. That's our future on this phone.
Sent from my DROID X2 using xda premium
Motorola wont officially update DX2 to ICS, there will probably be a leaked version (which will be awesome for the devs), but they wont update it to ICS due to "inadequate hardware." That statement isn't necessarily false either. While AOSP ICS wont. Have any problem running on only 512mb of RAM, what wont run on 512mb of RAM is AOSP ICS and MOTOBLOAT
So the d3 wont receive ICS? I think its more than enough to run ICS at AOSP, and with BLUR, I'm sure it would suffice. Our phone runs really smooth with a stock 2.3.5 build. RAM has "no effect" on a linux kernel. The way it is designed you SHOULD only have 20mb or so of RAM available to get the "speed" of quickload of different apps. Apps always run in the background once they are loaded and when the foreground app calls for resources it "locks" apps out of RAM and freezes an image to memory for a load when the foreground app closes or enough space opens in the RAM and then resumes the process. The "lag" comes from too many apps calling for resources at a time, that is why you have redraws and that is also why Moto put the task manager app to kill processes after 2 minutes of idle.
When ever Motorola starts pushing the ICS update for the xoom is most likely when we would get the notice of our phone getting it or not only because the fact that the xoom is using the same hardware that the x2 is using but just a different kernel and ram, I am hoping for the update tho so we can finally us our dual core processor properly since gingerbread limits this
Sent from my DROID X2 using XDA App
They really need to unlock the boot loader. Considering HTC is unlocking the bootloaders on various phones under Verizon means that Motorola shouldn't be using the excuse "well, Verizon won't allow it". If they do, that's crap. Then why is HTC allowed to do it?
http://www.xda-developers.com/andro...gn=Feed:+xda-developers/ShsH+(xda-developers)
I think if this happens, ICS will definitely be ported over easily.
iBolski said:
They really need to unlock the boot loader. Considering HTC is unlocking the bootloaders on various phones under Verizon means that Motorola shouldn't be using the excuse "well, Verizon won't allow it". If they do, that's crap. Then why is HTC allowed to do it?
http://www.xda-developers.com/andro...gn=Feed:+xda-developers/ShsH+(xda-developers)
I think if this happens, ICS will definitely be ported over easily.
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Click to collapse
It's not Moto that won't unlock it, it's Verizon not allowing them to. Moto is their baby, they want full control over it.
Ignore this post
cheesebeard said:
It's not Moto that won't unlock it, it's Verizon not allowing them to. Moto is their baby, they want full control over it.
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Click to collapse
Ibolski has a point I think the other manufacturers just told Verizon to go f*** themselves and unlocked them. After all isn't on the verge of being illegal to lock us out. After all there is nothing illegal about doing anything we want to our phones. They are in essence not allowing us full ownership of our paid for devices
Sent from my DROID X2 using xda premium
Too many false returns can be the Blame for that. Moto has to take responsibility for a broken device if Verizon were to allow that to happen.
Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk
Peperm1nt said:
Too many false returns can be the Blame for that. Moto has to take responsibility for a broken device if Verizon were to allow that to happen.
Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
Im just saying the other companies don't seem to have an issue with it. Besides its near impossible even if you don't know what your doing to completely wreck a phone by flashing especially a moto. If your on a forum flashing roms then there is more then likely a sticky showing how to fix your phone easily with an sbf. If there is a lot of broken device returns blame moto for that....I know a lot of moto phones I have got in the past were released with blatant obvious bugs. I know other companies do this two. So its not just moto. Im sure more phones are returned for those reason then because the bootloader was unlocked
Look at it this way...is moto going to.get more or less returns cuz of a locked boot....id say more cuz people are gonna try to change it and with a locked boot its more difficult to do so.
Oh and every manufacturer not just moto has to take responsibility for the broken devices....so the others don't see an issue just a moto excuse
Sent from my DROID X2 using xda premium
never thought of it that way.
motcher41 said:
Im just saying the other companies don't seem to have an issue with it. Besides its near impossible even if you don't know what your doing to completely wreck a phone by flashing especially a moto. If your on a forum flashing roms then there is more then likely a sticky showing how to fix your phone easily with an sbf. If there is a lot of broken device returns blame moto for that....I know a lot of moto phones I have got in the past were released with blatant obvious bugs. I know other companies do this two. So its not just moto. Im sure more phones are returned for those reason then because the bootloader was unlocked
Look at it this way...is moto going to.get more or less returns cuz of a locked boot....id say more cuz people are gonna try to change it and with a locked boot its more difficult to do so.
Oh and every manufacturer not just moto has to take responsibility for the broken devices....so the others don't see an issue just a moto excuse
Sent from my DROID X2 using xda premium
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Click to collapse
I recently signed a petition on Change.org about Verizon's 2$ charge. And Verizon backed off (oh no! Correlation != Causation!) . Hmm... so what about a similar petition addressing Verizon/Moto.. I know it is laughable, but majority of Verizon customers must be Moto customers as most high end Verizon devices are Moto's. Sooo... what say? Can't hurt.
I'm really pissed at Moto for locking this bootloader while other manufs go ahead and unlock theirs. Seems we're screwed! I've got a couple days yet before I lose the ability to return this thing and am stuck with a very developer UNfriendly device for the next couple years. What to do? I'm not a huge ROM'er but I definately like to tweak and I don't like to envision everyone getting toys/tweaks/tricks on their HTC's,LG's,Sammys,etc etc while us poor souls on the Moto side get screwed over. I'm on the ledge....pull me off or push me over! Need help deciding...does this thing have a future or in two years will I be BEGGING for a chance to upgrade?
I have a Droid Charge with unlocked bootloader and it still gets no development. I still thoroughly enjoy the phone though. Of the phones on the market, the razr is the one I like best. Moto knows how to make a smooth fast phone with great reception.
If you're a rom junkie, go for the nexus. However if you're patient enough, keep waiting with us till the bootloader gets unlocked and enjoy the full potencial of the Razr.
You should do a side by side comparison of the RAZR next to any other phone... that's what I did before buying my RAZR... I like having a removable SD card and HDMI out... the battery could sway you but I think with the maxx coming out someone will produce an after market cover, after all the battery isn't soldered in like the iphone is... I personally love the quality of Motorola phones... as far as development goes, I wouldn't let the locked bootloader get to you, I had my DroidX for 2 years with a locked bootloader and I still had quite a few roms to flash, doesn't anyone remember 2nd init? I'm sure the RAZR devs will find a way around the stupid bootloader... in the meantime everyone get into operation mosh, and let big red and Motorola know we mean business... I love my RAZR, I personally have a lot of faith in this product, I'm actually looking into learning how to develop for android just because I want to help anyone who takes up the torch to develop for this awesome device
Sent from my RAZR running RAZRX 1.1
Nitro is working on Eclipse. Once that gets released, you will be glad you kept the razr.
pieman13 said:
Nitro is working on Eclipse. Once that gets released, you will be glad you kept the razr.
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Click to collapse
Can I ask what eclipse is? I'm kind of having the same feelings as the OP. I'm looking for a reason to keep my razr, but some of the other devices are calling for me.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
Semseddin said:
If you're a rom junkie, go for the nexus. However if you're patient enough, keep waiting with us till the bootloader gets unlocked and enjoy the full potencial of the Razr.
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Click to collapse
The only thing the locked bootloader prevents different kennels from being used. There are two or three roms out now plus a deodexed or two that you install with the bootstrap.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using xda premium
I can tell you this. I tried out the Nexus for about a week, and took it back. While I LOVE ICS, the phone itself SUCKS. Esp next to the Razr. Slower, horrible battery life, cheap feel, lackluster camera...I could go on and on. I am pissed off too but it is still the best option out there so far.
Sorry for this extremely newb question. This is my first dabble in the Android world, I've always been an iPhone user since moving from dumb to smart phone.
I've been using the Arctic ROM for last couple of weeks and the latest version makes me never want to go back to the stock Rogers ROM. Now here's the question - given that even without an unlocked bootloader, one can still relatively easily flash a new ROM using CWM, what's this big deal about unlocked bootloader. Also what's special about this ever so elusive custom kernel that has been mentioned?
One of the biggest problems I'm seeing with the locked BL bs is that it appears to be scaring away developers who would rather go the easier route and develop on a unlocked machine. Yea you might get it to work on the Razr but it takes steps A-B-C-D-E and who knows how much more for the devs to get it working as opposed to A and B with a ULBL. Look around...we've got very very little in the way of development or ROMS....
If ROM'ing is really important to you, you really ought to get a GNex. Even if the bootloader does get unlocked (which is up in the air, since Moto's broken that promise in the past), there will be far more development for the GNex.
I got the RAZR for the killer hardware and the smooth user experience. I don't know that I'll ROM this even if they do unlock the bootloader, and I was a ROM junkie on my OG Droid.
ICS is rolling out to the Motorola Xoom tablet this weekend. The RAZR may be only a week or two away from getting ICS with a hardware accelerated GUI. That aside, it's a great phone - terrific reception, loud speakerphone, excellent voice quality. You really want to give up all that?
Oh, and a new thread just broke: The poster says he was contacted by the FCC and they are charging VZW with violations for having a locked bootloader. Hmmm...
larrygeary said:
ICS is rolling out to the Motorola Xoom tablet this weekend. The RAZR may be only a week or two away from getting ICS with a hardware accelerated GUI. That aside, it's a great phone - terrific reception, loud speakerphone, excellent voice quality. You really want to give up all that?
Oh, and a new thread just broke: The poster says he was contacted by the FCC and they are charging VZW with violations for having a locked bootloader. Hmmm...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I pray that you are right. Though I love this phone more than any other phone I've had before (HD2, HD7, Sensation, G2X, Bionic), it's killing me that I can't mess around with it. I paid top dollar for this prostitute. And I want to do whatever I feel like to her, regardless of what her pimp says.
Any word if the ICS update to the Xoom this weekend may have unlocked their bootloader? I know this was the thought and hopes of some for the ICS upgrade coming to the RAZR.
emiliobadillio said:
Any word if the ICS update to the Xoom this weekend may have unlocked their bootloader? I know this was the thought and hopes of some for the ICS upgrade coming to the RAZR.
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Click to collapse
Sorry, I have no info on that.
the xoom already had an unlocked bootloader from the last update from what I can tell as on the motodev website, there is a file to relock it if needed
larrygeary said:
ICS is rolling out to the Motorola Xoom tablet this weekend. The RAZR may be only a week or two away from getting ICS with a hardware accelerated GUI. That aside, it's a great phone - terrific reception, loud speakerphone, excellent voice quality. You really want to give up all that?
Oh, and a new thread just broke: The poster says he was contacted by the FCC and they are charging VZW with violations for having a locked bootloader. Hmmm...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is correct, no BS on my end because I have no reason to make something like that up. I was contacted and it doesnt mean its going to gappen right away.
Sporttster said:
I'm really pissed at Moto for locking this bootloader while other manufs go ahead and unlock theirs. Seems we're screwed! I've got a couple days yet before I lose the ability to return this thing and am stuck with a very developer UNfriendly device for the next couple years. What to do? I'm not a huge ROM'er but I definately like to tweak and I don't like to envision everyone getting toys/tweaks/tricks on their HTC's,LG's,Sammys,etc etc while us poor souls on the Moto side get screwed over. I'm on the ledge....pull me off or push me over! Need help deciding...does this thing have a future or in two years will I be BEGGING for a chance to upgrade?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Best price including shipment to Malaysia?
Just saw kholks post on Motodev's forums. He got his dev ed. Razr but the bootloader is still locked....
ETA: Link http://community.developer.motorola.com/t5/Bootloader/Motorola-RAZR-Developers-Edition-Can-t-unlock-the-bootloader/td-p/23102
got556 said:
Just saw kholks post on Motodev's forums. He got his dev ed. Razr but the bootloader is still locked....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And to note also, "fastboot oem unlock" won't unlock its bootloader!
mattlgroff said:
And to note also, "fastboot oem unlock" won't unlock its bootloader!
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Click to collapse
It just went from motofail to motoFAILLLLLLL
lol motofail
What the actual F*** ?!??? What the hell was the point of the developer edition if the boot loader isn't unlocked straight off?
Huey85 said:
What the actual F*** ?!??? What the hell was the point of the developer edition if the boot loader isn't unlocked straight off?
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Click to collapse
Exactly...between this and US versions of Razr ICS release date. I'm done with Moto after this Razr is sold...but I'm probably kiddin myself b/c I love the build quality and radios of Moto's phones...but c'mon Moto, you're killin us.
got556 said:
between this and US versions of Razr ICS release date. I'm done with Moto after this Razr is sold...but I'm probably kiddin myself b/c I love the build quality and radios of Moto's phones...but c'mon Moto, you're killin us.
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Agreed. Audio and build quality is far superior to Samsung and the latest HTC's I have seen add of late. But thus bootloader business is ****ed up and unacceptable you loyal Motorola customers
I think you summed up motorola perfectly: ****ED UP AND UNACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR. I would hope that some google executive is on the ball enough be monitoring threads like this as it is the premier mobile device development site on earth. so please keep that in mind dear google excecutive: ****ED UP AND UNACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR. please also discuss at your next meeting and Change The Behavior. thank you.
Now they say....
"hey guys. We're working on getting the files updated on our website. Stay tuned and thanks for your patience."
Moto and to all it may concern,
We loyal Motorola customers (check my sig if you don't believe my loyalty to Motorola), have been waiting...clinging to our last hopes, that your words bear some weight or meaning to your repeated empty promises.
We were told unlocked bootloaders by the end of 2011, didn't happen and we are well into 2012. We were told ICS soon for our Razrs. CDMA Razrs are looking at the earliest Q3 of 2012 or later. While essentially every other manufacturers flagship phone(s) has or will have some version of Android 4.0. And now..you slap us in the face not once but twice with the Dev Edition Droid Razr.
The first slap was thinking this "Dev Edition" would shut us up, satisfy our hunger for being able to truly develop on the Razr. Then you kick us while we're down by releasing this clusterfuck of an idea all the while STILL LOCKING THE BOOTLOADER. Then when you're called out on it, you have the ****ing balls to say, oops sorry about that guys, we're working on it.
So essentially kholk is holding onto a regular $6-700 Droid Razr with no ****ing warranty what so ever. My middle finger is extended to you Motorola and my pants are dropped just waiting for my "bootloader" to hit the back of your ****ing throats.
If Moto is working on a fix to unlock the RAZR Dev edition bootloader, could that mean the fix could somehow be applied to the regular RAZR? That would be interesting.
Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk
Sparkimus said:
If Moto is working on a fix to unlock the RAZR Dev edition bootloader, could that mean the fix could somehow be applied to the regular RAZR? That would be interesting.
Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
This is a very good point. What if the fix is something akin to HTC's unlock system for their phones bootloaders? Bare with me because it's been a hot minute since I was on a Motorola phone, but do Motorola phones have to deal with S-Off bullcrap? Because if they were able to provide keys to unlock the bootloader and y'all don't have to deal with S-Off, then wouldn't this be the perfect solution?
Sent from my HTC Evo 3D using xda premium
I am hoping that is the case. But here is what I am guessing is really going on.
The phone is like a regular locked down Razr, but the Dev Edition doesn't have the e-fuse chip to lock it. They probably just put the stock files on it. Instead it's locked through some other way, until Moto can make a blurgastic bootloader unlock utility for the Dev Edition.
W/ that said I'm hope I'm very wrong about that guess.
I'm forwarding this thread to Motorola
Xperia x10(Feralabs Rom) After trying all roms it was my Fav.
Now on the RAZR.
I see you Drinking that ¥Hateraid¥
Hi
any progress here??? Because on forums.motorola.com they link to this:
developer.motorola.com/products/bootloader/
and pretend like everything is OK.
Sent from my XT910 using xda premium
For your reading(bashing) pleasure... Motorola Blog
M is at it again.. babbling excuse after excuse..
? It's stated that ICS will come out in Q2 so what is your problem?
eyriiii said:
? It's stated that ICS will come out in Q2 so what is your problem?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't foresee the unlockable boot loader thing... At least not until this thing became older. Yes, ICS is coming but will we be happy?
For an unlocked bl
U already have Moto RAZR dev edition
Visit my channel on youtube
youtube.com/Therazrguy
Q2 is going to be end. When will update coming out? Only thing i want is ICS with unlock BL as moto promise before. If they never unlock BL, time to say good bye moto for Summy GS3.
Sent from my XT910 using Tapatalk 2
LOL of the first comment!
News at 10: Motorola making up bull**** excuses to avoid updating devices
News at 11: most of the devices Motorola is making excuses not to update to ICS area already running ICS and doing it FASTER then GB, making Motorola's excuses invalid
News at 12: majority of developers happy do to Motorola's work for them, requesting the promised bootloader unlock, yet again
News at ****all: Motorola making more excuses to drop more devices (even those already "planned" to get the update) from the ICS update list, and even more excuses to not release the bootloader unlocks for devices
See a pattern? No, Ill point it out for you, devices sell, carriers request EOL for devices to avoid selling lower priced phones, and Motorola saves and probably gets paid for not using man hours for development...
Precisely why I avoided, and will continue to avoid Motorola products!
Wanted the Photon 4G for myself when it was coming out, wanted a Xoom for myself, was going to get an Admiral for my mother (replace her aging 8330 crackberry)... 3 devices I DID NOT BUY
Keep it up Motorola, your doing a STUPID er STUPENDOUS job...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
whirleyes said:
I can't foresee the unlockable boot loader thing... At least not until this thing became older. Yes, ICS is coming but will we be happy?
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Click to collapse
oh bout the bootloader oh well I really dont think we are going to see some changes from Motorola, maybe maybe if Google decides to push this thing when they finish the takeover of motorola mobility
Is it me or are there no details for the Razr in Europe? (XT910)
Let's sum things up...
"I LOVE MY NEW BIKE!"
(pedal, pedal, pedal)
"Hey! That kid has the same bike as me, but with a new paint job!"
"I HATE MY BIKE! I HATE THE COMPANY THAT MADE IT! I WILL NEVER BUY FROM THAT COMPANY AGAIN!!!!!!!"
WillKennerley said:
Is it me or are there no details for the Razr in Europe? (XT910)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course there is
MOTOROLA RAZR
Asia Pacific, Canada, China, EMEA, Japan, Korea & LATAM
Development
Rollouts begin in Q2 2012.
EMEA stands for Europe, the Middle East and Africa
I don't see the big deal myself, they could have just released the phone and never released a single update. Be happy that they are at least talking about an update, and claiming that it is in development.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using XDA
bpingry said:
I don't see the big deal myself, they could have just released the phone and never released a single update. Be happy that they are at least talking about an update, and claiming that it is in development.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except they promised timely software updates for phones 18 months or younger. That hasn't happened.
The RAZR was advertised as ICS upgradeable, it received it 6 months after ICS released, advertising it is upgradeable implies it will get it soon.
It would have gotten ICS anyway, it would be good business.
But since it was advertised the implication is that itvwill get upgraded sooner, and not in six months.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using XDA
Simply because you inferred a specific time frame does not constitute an implication by the carrier.
The phone is great, it runs quite well on GB. They gave us a stability update.
If you bought it just for the ICS upgradeable and wanted it NOW then you should have gotten the Nexus.
The word upgradeable does not state a timeframe.
You don't buy a computer hoping it will be upgradeable.
sRDennyCrane said:
Simply because you inferred a specific time frame does not constitute an implication by the carrier.
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Click to collapse
The Google Update Alliance declared that a phone released within the last 18 months would get timely software updates, both carriers and manufacturers agreed to this deal. Therefore since it was advertised to be ICS upgradeable when the consumers could be assured that they were getting ICS anyway from the alliance that they would get a quick timely OS update. It wasn't.
Logical, no?
Link: http://androidandme.com/2011/05/new...ers-and-carriers-to-speed-up-android-updates/
lrlooly said:
The phone is great, it runs quite well on GB. They gave us a stability update.
If you bought it just for the ICS upgradeable and wanted it NOW then you should have gotten the Nexus.
The word upgradeable does not state a timeframe.
You don't buy a computer hoping it will be upgradeable.
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Click to collapse
Yeah, these aren't computers in the technical sense, these are smartphones. And in the smartphone market if you buy a popular high end phone released a month before a huge software update the overwhelming majority of users expect the update. Refer to my above response for the rest of your answer.
I don't understand why anyone cares if the bootloader is locked on this phone. Who cares about flashing a new kernel when the battery already lasts longer than a day? Why would you ever want to flash a new radio when this one is the best in the business? The phone can still be rooted and ROMed.
ac29593 said:
I don't understand why anyone cares if the bootloader is locked on this phone. Who cares about flashing a new kernel when the battery already lasts longer than a day? Why would you ever want to flash a new radio when this one is the best in the business? The phone can still be rooted and ROMed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you have the OG Razr we don't get over a day. Flashing custom kernels not only gives better battery, but better performance, more communicability and stability.
Flashing custom radios gives you the ability to get even better reception and possibly battery life than we are now. What is there not to want?
ac29593 said:
I don't understand why anyone cares if the bootloader is locked on this phone. Who cares about flashing a new kernel when the battery already lasts longer than a day? Why would you ever want to flash a new radio when this one is the best in the business? The phone can still be rooted and ROMed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If we had boot loader unlock none of us dingbats that flashed certain leaks would be concerned about ever getting updates again.
I agree w you on some points. Kernel? Blah, who needs it. On ics 84 I get well over 6 hours screen on time on 3g/4g mix. How much better could it get vs stability. But boot loader unlock would at least solve our issue of being stuck on leaked software. Until someone comes out with a patch...but it just shouldn't be so difficult. Free boot loader equals easier and less complicated. Less chance of bricks because people could actually simply fix them.
ac29593 said:
I don't understand why anyone cares if the bootloader is locked on this phone. Who cares about flashing a new kernel when the battery already lasts longer than a day? Why would you ever want to flash a new radio when this one is the best in the business? The phone can still be rooted and ROMed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, I try to give simple explanation on this,
In Android world, there were at least 3 type of users.
User1 : As long as he can make call, send msg, install app..bla2, he' s happy. When the time comes, he upgrades to new phones.
User2 : Like user 1, but sometime they got bored of the original firmware(mostly bloated) & like the option to do some modding. So that the get most out of what they've paid.
User3: Android phone is their toy. While they still using it like user1, they also like to mess it, make modded they want & eventually supply it to user 2.
I'm user3, I was like user1, 2-3 years ago.
This RAZR has a very solid hardware(At the time I bought it). But the potential is limited by the original firmware. The extra potential is not unleash-able because the BL gets in the way. User3 hates this & most of them migrate to other manufacturers.
Is root enough? Not for me.
This RAZR is too easy to brick. You maybe lucky, because somebody has leaked the original firmware for your variant.
What if it has never been leaked like my variant?? If there is no BL, I can just flash your firmware variant.
stkiswr said:
If we had boot loader unlock none of us dingbats that flashed certain leaks would be concerned about ever getting updates again.
I agree w you on some points. Kernel? Blah, who needs it. On ics 84 I get well over 6 hours screen on time on 3g/4g mix. How much better could it get vs stability. But boot loader unlock would at least solve our issue of being stuck on leaked software. Until someone comes out with a patch...but it just shouldn't be so difficult. Free boot loader equals easier and less complicated. Less chance of bricks because people could actually simply fix them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Makes sense. I did forget about the OG RAZR guys not getting full day battery, but I def think the radio is gonna be tough to improve on. The clarity on this phone and signal strength is amazing.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2