Beyond being careful cosmedically with the Transformer Prime and docking, is it OK for the batter to take it off the dock for a while, use it, put it back on, and perhaps again, before you charge it again? Looking at battery life concerns mainly.
Thanks!
Brian
Should be fine as the Prime recharges from the dock depending on its current battery level.
garak0410 said:
Beyond being careful cosmedically with the Transformer Prime and docking, is it OK for the batter to take it off the dock for a while, use it, put it back on, and perhaps again, before you charge it again? Looking at battery life concerns mainly.
Thanks!
Brian
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Click to collapse
It's a Lithium Ion battery, so you don't need to worry about charging at various levels anyway. No battery memory on Lithium Ion batteries.
Good question, I was in fact wondering the same thing.
Edit: I've noticed while docking and undocking it tries to maintain the TFP's battery at around 100%, as a result draining the dock's battery way before the TFP's is near dead... Kinda strange if you ask me.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
The dock works even if it is at 0% so I suppose keeping the prime as charged as possible isn't really that big of deal. Then you will at least have a charged prime if you want to recharge the dock but don't want to be tethered to the wall. I think that's better than them both running out at the same time.
You shouldn't have to worry about memory effect in these batteries at all. This has a lithium polymer battery actually.
Good point, I'd rather have a working dock with 0% battery then a dead TFP the road. I think I need to better educate myself on batteries these days. Seems not all batteries work the way I think (or was told at some point) they do. I was under the impression all batteries have a limited number of discharge/recharge cycles (I'm guessing this is the memory being referred to) . Somebody once told me, to get the most out of your battery life, it is a good idea to run it all the way down before recharging them. I do not know what kind of battery this advise applies to (I assumed all).
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
That was true of nickel cadmium rechargeable batteries. These do have a limited number of charge and discharges but if you let it discharge halfway then charge it back up and do that again you effectively used one full discharge/recharge cycle.
Theres some info on li-po batteries in my sig.
Related
To get the best battery life, when should I charge my phone? When the phone almost runs out of juice, or whenever I can (below 80%) ? Please help!
Deep discharges are bad, but so is spending lots of time at maximum charge.
I'd consider charging around when you hit 80% if it's convenient, but if you're expecting to be on battery for a while soon, top off whenever you want.
Discharging to 5-15% is bad for your battery longterm.
So to get the best battery, I should charge when it is $80 right?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA App
kvl19 said:
So to get the best battery, I should charge when it is $80 right?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA App
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Click to collapse
There's no hard fast rule about 'exactly' when you should recharge it. Simply try and keep the phone from running < 20% a lot and never keep it always charged at 100%. If you get in the habit of charging in the 30-80% range, that would be best.
Basically throw out the old mentality of always using it as much as possible before recharging as lithium batteries simply don't work like the old nicad batteries from years past.
This phone uses a Li-Ion battery, and these batteries do NOT have any kind of "memory." Charge it whenever you want to. However, it's not really good to always keep it "topped off." (Deep discharges are also not good.)
If you are going to store the battery, drop it to 75%-50% charged first.
There are some things to consider, however:
If the phone's power circuit bypasses the battery when the battery is fully charge (instead of constantly pulling power from the battery while the battery is recharging), then leaving the phone plugged in is better than constant charge/discharge cycles. Based on the fact that this phone will work properly with NO battery attached when plugged in, this is probably a true statement (but I can't know for sure.)
Second, the phone itself might like to see the battery charged/discharged once in a while to calibrate the battery monitoring circuitry. (You never calibrate a li-ion battery - only the circuitry that monitors the battery.)
Here's a link with some interesting information:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Take care
Gary
Got it. Thanks for all your information
A small note to add why you shouldn't 'keep' it above 80% (constant top offs and being left on the charger). In general when above 80% it's been found that lithium ion batteries have a 'higher state of activity'.
What that does to the battery is what it sounds like. Higher state of activity means higher wear and overall shorter lifespan.
That wear is easily seen in laptops. Many people have the habit of leaving them always plugged in while using and through the night, so they're always 'ready to go'. People who consistently do this to their laptops usually find after 1 year the battery life is noticeably shorter, 1 1/2 years 50% or so of 'new' capacity, and after 2 years looking at replacing the battery.
And I usually find a cheap deal on eBay for them, plus $50-75 for me. At least phone batteries are a bit cheaper.
Sent from my páhhōniē
I think that the 70-90% is kind of awkward and highly overuses the tablet inner lipo charge cycles.
Imho Asus should make a utility that alows the user to decide wheter:
The tablet runs from the dock battery with no charge of inner battery
The tablet is being charged from the dock up to 90% as it is reasonable for charge process
The tablet runs on it's own battery without recharge from the dock even though the dock has some juice left.
Any other scheme proposals are welcome .
Above should however vastly improve the quality of our batteries.
At least an option to disable the charge from dock to tablet is imho a must have
ankhazam said:
I think that the 70-90% is kind of awkward and highly overuses the tablet inner lipo charge cycles.
Imho Asus should make a utility that alows the user to decide wheter:
The tablet runs from the dock battery with no charge of inner battery
The tablet is being charged from the dock up to 90% as it is reasonable for charge process
The tablet runs on it's own battery without recharge from the dock even though the dock has some juice left.
Any other scheme proposals are welcome .
Above should however vastly improve the quality of our batteries.
At least an option to disable the charge from dock to tablet is imho a must have
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
could be possible via kernel mods... but you are right, i kinda dislike the current method too.
It's stupid that once I disconnect 2 fully charged modules the tablet battery gets few extra charges from the dock.
That way I cannot treat the dock as a backup battery for running or recharge for when I it is really needed.
Someone please stick this thread and make another offensive on Asus.
It would be sad to root/void the warranty just to get such a must have when it should be done on stock.
agree in 100%
Could someone explain what is the current 'charge policy'?
As as owner of the original Transformer and the headaches it came with the dock discharging charging the tablet all the time and dealing with a dock battery that had issues being registered as charged or recharging (I RMA'd and others had the same issues as well), I love, love, love the way the new charging method is.
With that said, I think choices are good and having ASUS provide a way to let you use it how you want would be nice.
jyan_osu said:
As as owner of the original Transformer and the headaches it came with the dock discharging charging the tablet all the time and dealing with a dock battery that had issues being registered as charged or recharging (I RMA'd and others had the same issues as well), I love, love, love the way the new charging method is.
With that said, I think choices are good and having ASUS provide a way to let you use it how you want would be nice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What is the new charging method?
kristovaher said:
What is the new charging method?
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Click to collapse
Instead of always charging from the dock, when docked in it only starts charging the tablet when the tablet gets to around 70% or so.. then it charges the tablet up to around 90% and then runs off the tablet and the cycle continues. So both the tablet and the dock discharge X amount at a time.
Hm, can see both sides to the argument, depends on whether you look at the dock as a battery booster or just to aid the tablet.
A utility would be a good idea to let the user choose, just have an option in the 'ASUS Customised Settings' menu.
jyan_osu said:
Instead of always charging from the dock, when docked in it only starts charging the tablet when the tablet gets to around 70% or so.. then it charges the tablet up to around 90% and then runs off the tablet and the cycle continues. So both the tablet and the dock discharge X amount at a time.
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Click to collapse
Does this mean that when tablet is docked, it sometimes uses tablets own battery and -not- dock battery even when dock battery is charged!? What is the point in that?
I thought that the dock gets discharged first before tablet touches its own battery.
kristovaher said:
Does this mean that when tablet is docket, it sometimes uses tablets own battery and -not- dock battery even when dock battery is charged!? What is the point in that?
I thought that the dock gets discharged first before tablet touches its own battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The point maybe to address the issue with the dock in the original design where it did discharge first and causes some issues. It's still using the dock battery when docked, just a different method from how the first one was. You'll still get 16 hours or whatever out if you use both together.
Either way, it's not getting to a point on the tablet where it's going leave you with like an hour left to play with should you undock it.. mid 70s seem to be the lowest it will go so if you do go all day with it docked and in use, the dock battery will get to 0 and the tablet will be around 90
yes there could be a time where you take it off the dock at 75 with some juice left in the dock.
Just to me it's a lot better coming from the original Transformer.
I can understand some folks who would rather just use dock's power first and then the tablet. But again, as an owner of both and seeing how both work, for me this is a better way
If the dock has no battery but the tab has loads, and you plug the dock in... would it work? If no, then I can see why it doesn't discharge first, if it does then there really isn't any point.
kevinm2k said:
If the dock has no battery but the tab has loads, and you plug the dock in... would it work? If no, then I can see why it doesn't discharge first, if it does then there really isn't any point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes it works fine. Had this issue on the original one all the time.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
So as the title says, even after my dock exhausted its own battery recharging the ATP, it's still functioning. I'm showing 0! and it's still going strong. For me, that's really awesome that I don't have to worry about whether or not I remembered to charge the dock.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
I noticed this as well
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
mletchworth said:
So as the title says, even after my dock exhausted its own battery recharging the ATP, it's still functioning. I'm showing 0! and it's still going strong. For me, that's really awesome that I don't have to worry about whether or not I remembered to charge the dock.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, yeah it take power from the tablet to power it.
thats awesome! can't wait to get a dock..if i ever find one in my life time lol.
you can order the keyboard at best buy and pick it up in the store a week later
nevetsvsx said:
you can order the keyboard at best buy and pick it up in the store a week later
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
only the grey one, i have the champagne prime -_-
Last night I found out that the SD card on my dock no longer worked after the dock had given all of its power over to the tablet. Does the sd card slot on anyone else's dock still work after the power in the dock has drained out? The keyboard still worked. I think that what I saw was normal but after seeing this thread I just wanted to make sure.
One thing though. Isn't it bad to deplete lithium ion batteries down to 0? Or does the keyboard dock reserve some sort of minimal charge so it doesn't ruin the Battery?
Mikroft said:
One thing though. Isn't it bad to deplete lithium ion batteries down to 0? Or does the keyboard dock reserve some sort of minimal charge so it doesn't ruin the Battery?
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Click to collapse
i don't know about the prime yet as i don't have one yet, but with the first gen transformer, what they did was once the keyboard is drained to 3% it would stop charging the tablet and use that as reserved
usually that 3% last a couple of days even when the tablet is connected so i'm not sure if the tablet is giving power or not but the keyboard still works
Mikroft said:
One thing though. Isn't it bad to deplete lithium ion batteries down to 0? Or does the keyboard dock reserve some sort of minimal charge so it doesn't ruin the Battery?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's highly unlikely that 0% on the battery meter literally means a complete discharge of the LiIon cells. There is likely 15-20% charge still left in the cells, but the battery reports 0% because to go any lower would risk damaging them. Basically, the manufacturer isn't going to let you damage your device simply by using it in the intended manner.
...and for clarification, these aren't old-school LiON batteries, they're Lithium Polymer...a little different. When the machine is reporting the battery as 0%, it's not actually that low as the above poster has stated. In fact, if your tablet is running when both batteries reach 0%, it smartly uses the little bit of power it has left to shut itself down cleanly.
Li-Po batteries wont go lower than 2.7V but generally kept above that to be safe.
3.0v is the normal safe discharged voltage (per cell), so your 0% reported on the prime is really 3.0v (per cell) ... nowt to worry about its all normal.
3.0v = 0%
4.2v = Full
I'm guessing the dock has a 3cell Li-po too ?
hi guys,
so when i'm at home i found myself using the prime more and more and often with the dock for writing posts and also for using it as a stand while watching youtube or playing a game with gamepad.
Since the dock empties itself as soon as the Tablet dropped to ~75% i'm a bit concerned. I know that li-po batteries dont like to stay at low voltage/low charge for long times.
So the Tablet is at 80% and the dock is empty. 80% can mean days of medium usage, so the dock will be at 0% for a pretty long time.
Should i prevent that and always charge the dock as soon as it runs out? Would be nice to know how the dock handles voltage and charge. It could also be that it still has plenty reserve charge when it displays 0%..
any thoughts?*
Shouldn't be a problem. The dock is going to use the power of the tablet to power itself.
clouds5 said:
hi guys,
so when i'm at home i found myself using the prime more and more and often with the dock for writing posts and also for using it as a stand while watching youtube or playing a game with gamepad.
Since the dock empties itself as soon as the Tablet dropped to ~75% i'm a bit concerned. I know that li-po batteries dont like to stay at low voltage/low charge for long times.
So the Tablet is at 80% and the dock is empty. 80% can mean days of medium usage, so the dock will be at 0% for a pretty long time.
Should i prevent that and always charge the dock as soon as it runs out? Would be nice to know how the dock handles voltage and charge. It could also be that it still has plenty reserve charge when it displays 0%..
any thoughts?*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i don't think any of us have had the TF201 long enough to have a dock battery degrade, maybe TF101 owners can advise. but your concern is fundamentally sound. the dock has a lithium ion battery in it like any other. all li-on batteries are prone to having their cells dry out if they spend a lot of time fully discharged. the net effect is that the battery will diminish it's capacity over time.
asus made a good design decision with the TF201 by not having the dock charge the tablet until the tablet depletes to 70% capacity, because li-on batteries also degrade when constantly being held at 100% charge. but imo they should have put in another threshold for the dock battery, say at 25%, where the dock stops charging the tablet until the tablet gets dangerously low. in lieu of this, my personal opinion is that it is wise to give the dock a charge (or disconnect it from the tablet) once it dips below 20%.
Hey guys,
My dock has been acting kind of weird lately (see my thread in the Q/A section if you're curious - dock battery showed as 0% even when charging). What I'm wondering now is how others are doing with battery life in terms of the dock recharging the prime.
When I first got the tablet + dock, I used to be able to recharge the prime 2-3 times when the tab dropped to 70%. That would usually drain my dock battery all the way.
Fast forward to today and the past two weeks...My prime just finished recharging my tab up to about 90%, while it was being used to annotate lecture notes with some mild browsing and emailing in the background, the dock dropped to about 60%. This is what's concerning to me...It seems to be taking double the battery from the dock to recharge it to about the same, or less than, what it did before on the dock.
My use today has been pretty constant. I recharged both to 100% last night, and when I opened it up today at 12:30 pm, the tab was at 96% and the dock at 98%. Since then, my dock dropped to 88% while the tab drained in the same time to about 70%. It then started to charge my tablet to about 90% but the dock dropped to 34% where it is now. I have been using this constantly for the past 3.5 hours.
Here are my concerns, which I hope you guys can help me address:
Is this normal battery drain for 3.5 hours of moderate-heavy use?
Is this drain software related? It seems to have been fine way back on .11 (I'm on .15 now)
Is my dock battery shot? (ie should I RMA it)
Does the dock battery drain EVEN MORE if it's recharging the tablet while you're typing notes, etc on it?
Does a USB peripheral (ie wireless mouse) increase battery drain SIGNIFICANTLY?
I would attach a battery screenshot, but my settings battery menu doesn't have it tracked since it's docked.
I'm hoping this is a meaningful and useful thread so please try to avoid stating something obvious lol
Thanks guys
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using XDA Premium HD app
What performance modes, brightnesses are you using? Can you give us more info about what would be draining the battery?
It's quite possible your prime could be using a percent of the dock for every percent it receives, making it seem like your dock isn't working well, when in actuality it could be your tablet.
.15 was a battery killer for me, since I put virtuous on my prime and underclocked the cpu as the battery gets lower, it's fixed my battery life.
ickkii said:
What performance modes, brightnesses are you using? Can you give us more info about what would be draining the battery?
It's quite possible your prime could be using a percent of the dock for every percent it receives, making it seem like your dock isn't working well, when in actuality it could be your tablet.
.15 was a battery killer for me, since I put virtuous on my prime and underclocked the cpu as the battery gets lower, it's fixed my battery life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry - forgot to include that. I'm on the normal regular mode with auto brightness. With SetCPU, I had it on On Demand up until this afternoon around when I wrote this post. Then I switched it to interactive.
And as for your second point, I agree that it's possible that's what's happening, but because I'm using it for hours on end, I'm not quite sure if that's what's happening, part of why I started this thread.
Have other people seen improvements from .15 to Virtuous?
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using XDA Premium HD app
Another question, along the same line.....If the tablet's battery is low, the dock is fully charged, and unplugged, will the juice in the battery partially charge the tablet, so that I can remove it from the dock and use it separately until I get to a charging station? Or will the tablet ONLY run off of the dock's battery?
Thanks,
Bob......impatiently waiting for my champagne dock to come
robertg9 said:
Another question, along the same line.....If the tablet's battery is low, the dock is fully charged, and unplugged, will the juice in the battery partially charge the tablet, so that I can remove it from the dock and use it separately until I get to a charging station? Or will the tablet ONLY run off of the dock's battery?
Thanks,
Bob......impatiently waiting for my champagne dock to come
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, the dock charges the dock when it's plugged into the tablet.