I'd like to keep my Flyer out in my truck as a perm GPS kinda thing. It gets kinda cold up in NY, so I'm concerned on how cold weather tolerant this thing is. The general rule is not to keep electronics outside when its cold, but come on... have you seen newer cars!! I left my Garmin outside 365/year without issue too.
I'd like to know fact from fiction on this. Maybe Myth Busters did something on it, lol.
If the worst thing to happen to my Flyer is a sluggish screen until it warms up, I'd like to keep it in the truck/car most of the time.
i literally never take my first gen ipod video from 2005 out of my trucks glovebox...in NJ, it gets as cold as single digits in the winter, and hits triple in the summer, and it's always in there, and somehow STILL works..and that's a moving hard drive too lol..i'd think as long as it doesn't move from cold to hot temps really quickly, no condensation should form or anything
Lion batteries tolerate cold better than heat but, I would imagine that there is still a potential for damage to occur.
I doubt the other components would be affected much.. but, just keep in mind there is a chance it will be on life support to actually run the rest of it's life.
If I may also go ahead and point this out.. You can get a Garmin with lifetime updates for about 250$ that doesn't require a cellular data connection and would be more reliable for what your buying it for..
Snow_fox said:
Lion batteries tolerate cold better than heat but, I would imagine that there is still a potential for damage to occur.
I doubt the other components would be affected much.. but, just keep in mind there is a chance it will be on life support to actually run the rest of it's life.
If I may also go ahead and point this out.. You can get a Garmin with lifetime updates for about 250$ that doesn't require a cellular data connection and would be more reliable for what your buying it for..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got the Flyer at BestBuy for $99 a few months ago when they messed up the price. I dont have a need for it in the house because I have a GT10.1. I was close to CraigsListing it for $175, but decided to buy the Flyer car dock and use it as device to leave in the truck for GPS and such.
I dont really want another Garmin if the Flyer can work (w/tethering).
While Li ion batteries tolerate cold temperatures better than some other types, they still drain much more quickly in freezing temperatures. If you are leaving your Flyer in screen-off mode (and not powering it down), then you should be careful its not draining until shutoff in cold temps. Full power cycles are not good for Li ion batteries long term. Its also possible that draining the battery until the device shuts off, will render the battery unable to take a charge. (doesn't happen often, but does happen with Android devices).
That said, I completely understand your feeling about wanting to use an Android device instead of a Garmin for car navigation. I haven't used the "latest" Garmins. But the one I have (couple years old) has a crappy unresponsive touch screen, low resolution, and search function is nothing compared to Google.
The only advantage to a Garmin, is that you don't need a data connection. But of course, there are ways around that with Android also, either downloading Google Map sections, or with 3rd party software.
This doesn't answer your question, but I'll just throw this out there:
I've had the Flyer since it's release date at Best Buy. I bought it with full intentions of leaving it in my truck as a GPS/Media Player/Browser.
I built a console for it that goes between my jump seat and dash (the unit basically sits right under my stereo) and I have left it there plugged into a usb charger and line in on my stereo since the day I bought it (I can easily remove it and have on occasion for a few hours at a time.
I live in West Virginia so it probably doesn't get quite as cold as it does in NY but it can get down below zero at night. We have had a pretty mild winter here but that being said - I have never had a single problem out of it. Neither heat nor cold has seemed to have any affect on it whatsoever.
This is not to say that it couldn't and I've wondered the same as you many times... but just as someone who is doing exactly what you plan to do... I have never had a problem with it.
Hope this helps.
Just an FYI regarding the need for a cellular or wifi signal to use the Flyer or View as a dedicated GPS. With the use of a standalone navigation app such as CoPilot Live (no affiliation) or similar, which include built-in maps, your GPS-enabled unit uses only the internal GPS antenna to set a fix, and the on-board maps to get you around. No data connection is required to constantly update maps, as is the case with Google Maps, which is an 'assisted GPS' (aGPS) program.
Once your nav app is loaded, conserve batt power by activating 'airplane mode,' then under 'Location' enable the 'use GPS satellites' function. Make sure your Flyer is securely mounted on windshield or dashboard with a reasonable view of the sky (that's where the satellites are). You'll have no problems getting around in remote areas not served by Sprint et al. Over the past few years we have used my Evo 4g, Evo 3D and Evo View to get around in Europe in just this manner (no phone calls though, these are not international phones).
Regarding cold temperatures, I would remove the device from your vehicle if sub-zero F readings are expected.
procerum said:
No data connection is required to constantly update maps, as is the case with Google Maps, which is an 'assisted GPS' (aGPS) program.
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Click to collapse
That is not what assisted GPS (aGPS) means. aGPS uses cell tower triangulation to speed up GPS location. Virtually any usage of the phone's GPS involves aGPS.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS
Also, as I've mentioned previously, Google Maps has the ability to download maps so you can use Maps and Navigation online. You just have to download the maps one area at a time.
I think we're saying the same thing. The Flyer/View will perform GPS (vs. aGPS) duties just fine without tower triangulation (in airplane mode) if your program has built-in maps. No tethering required.
The map caching is in Google Labs, right? I played with that while waiting at an appointment. I tried a Nav to home with it and Nav just spun. I only tried once though. I didn't get a "data connection required" so i know it knew the cached data was there.
I will think about Copilot if GNav doesn't cut it.
I like this thread, lots of good comments!
procerum said:
I think we're saying the same thing. The Flyer/View will perform GPS (vs. aGPS) duties just fine without tower triangulation (in airplane mode) if your program has built-in maps. No tethering required.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, we are not saying the same thing at all. You were saying that Google Maps can't be used without a data connection, since its an "aGPS program", and you seemed to be stating that aGPS had something to do with updating the maps (which it does not). Google Maps is fully functional without a data connection as I stated above.
Also, pretty much any current Android device is going to use aGPS when possible to shorten GPS lock time, regardless of what navigation app you are using (I hate when people call nav software "GPS", as GPS just determines lat/long and elevation and nothing more).
And now you are mis-using the term "tethering". A data connection is not tethering. Tethering is when you share a cell data connection with another device. For instance, tethering a phone to a laptop, means your laptop can use the data connection on your phone.
You really need to get your terms right.
---------- Post added at 08:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:13 PM ----------
kenyu73 said:
The map caching is in Google Labs, right?
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Click to collapse
Yeah, that's right. I haven't played around with the feature much myself. But a buddy of mine recently used it during a trip to Europe, so he can navigate the cities on foot without pricey data roaming fees. He said it worked wonderfully.
redpoint73 said:
And now you are mis-using the term "tethering". A data connection is not tethering. Tethering is when you share a cell data connection with another device. For instance, tethering a phone to a laptop, means your laptop can use the data connection on your phone.
You really need to get your terms right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the suggestion, Captain. I am attempting to help the OP, who used the term 'tethering,' which is unecessary, as is a data connection, if you have maps on your device:
kenyu73 said:
I dont really want another Garmin if the Flyer can work (w/tethering).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My comments/methodologies are based upon actual travel experiences with these devices, which I'm sharing with the OP. Why do you feel the need to challenge me? Is this an initiation ritual for a new poster?
procerum said:
Thanks for the suggestion, Captain. I am attempting to help the OP, who used the term 'tethering,' which is unecessary, as is a data connection, if you have maps on your device:
My comments/methodologies are based upon actual travel experiences with these devices, which I'm sharing with the OP. Why do you feel the need to challenge me? Is this an initiation ritual for a new poster?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its all good gents. I just wanted to know if the Flyer was ok out in the cold.
Whether or not I'll use GNav or purchase something like Copilot is another story. I appreciated the comments from everyone.
procerum said:
kenyu73 said:
I dont really want another Garmin if the Flyer can work (w/tethering).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My comments/methodologies are based upon actual travel experiences with these devices, which I'm sharing with the OP. Why do you feel the need to challenge me? Is this an initiation ritual for a new poster?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The person your last response is directed at, and the OP are the same person.
No, I'm not trying to pick on you. But if you post something that is incorrect, people here are going to call it out. Or people here may just want to offer up a different opinion. Which brings me to the following.
I completely sympathize with the OP's desire to not want another Garmin navigation unit. I've found them to be crap. Overpriced for what they can do, not well made, and completely unreliable. I paid $399 for a flagship Nuvi unit, and it broke down a year after I bought it. Luckily, it was still on warranty, and they fixed it. But then the power cable failed soon after (out of warranty). Good thing I found a replacement on eBay for less than $10, because Garmin wants to charge you $30 (for something that will probably fail again in a year or so anyway). Both failures happened while I was traveling, and luckily I had my smartphone and Google Maps as backup.
Meanwhile, I have 3 HTC smartphones, and one tablet, from as far back as 4 years, still running fine as the day they were bought (aside from a few cosmetic blemishes from normal wear and tear). As far as I'm concerned, you are better off using a smartphone or tablet as navigation, with a 3rd party nav app with pre-loaded apps, if losing data connection is a concern.
Having a dedicated nav unit is probably a dying business model. Aside from providing software for smartphones, I don't see much of Garmin's business being around in a few years.
This is true, the last one I purchased was in 2003; it's unlikely that I'll ever purchase a dedicated unit again. The Flyer/View's 7-inch screen and robust build make for an excellent navigation device.
Related
I travel a lot, and I'm a minimalist. In other words, I'll travel for a week and take a paper lunch bag as my carry-on with hopes that I can get by with wearing the same outfit the entire week. I don't like carrying a full Navigation system and use my phone. This isn't an 'iPhone lovefest' because honestly, I hate everything about Apple, but I never had problems like this on my iPhone.
My problem though is the GPS. I'm on my third phone because of the GPS. The first phone would never get a lock on GPS. I could be sitting outside with a GPS satellite dedicated to me directly above me, and it would still say "Searching for Satellite". That phone went back and I took on another one.
Second phone had a problem where every now and then it would work, then stop working and never start working again until I rebooted the phone and even then it was questionable if it would start working again.
I just got my third phone a couple days ago. I did a stock root w/ no bootloaders, used Entropy's 11/13 Kernel, then threw on UnNamed ROM. This morning, I started up my car to drive somewhere and decided to test the GPS/Navigation. It took it a couple minutes to find the Satellite, then all seemed to be working ok. Then 20 minutes later it dropped the Satellite and it spent the next 40 minutes of my drive into the office saying "Searching for Satellite" no matter what I did.
This is really important to me as is the ability to tether when I want to (hence the reason I want a phone I can Root). So what can I do. At the moment, I've (In my head, so I could be wrong) narrowed it down to a couple things that could be wrong.
1. It's the ROM that's the problem. Though unlikely, it is a factor and it's me messing with the way the phone was designed and distributed.
2. It's the GPS in general. Seems like 95% of the people on here aren't having problems at all. There does seem to be 5% that seem to be having the same problems I am.
3. My region has crappy Satellite Coverage. Doubtful since my iPhone worked fine, and unless Apple did something amazing like put in an entire dedicated Satellite network to work with Jailbroke iPhones then this kinds of negates this though.
4. My cars are interferring. While this is entirely a possibility (I never do think to test this out in the open not in a car, so i can't say for sure) if it is the problem, then the device goes back as it's much cheaper to get a new device than to replace 2 cars. Again, though, my iPhone never had a problem doing this in these cars.
I love the phone, the speed, the Android OS etc... I don't want to go back to an iPhone because I"ll shoot myself. I just want to be able to have GPS work on this as it's the only hold up on the device. Any help anyone can do?
Take it back then. Honestly you say you have tried 3 different phones and all 3 are broken. I call bull****.
Never had a problem with it.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA App
You didn't mention if you've tried in ANY of the three (3) phones if the GPS worked before rooting?? I'm not saying it's the rooting that's causing the problem, but I'm still running stock on my SGSII and have had no issues with GPS? Not saying it's not possible but three phones is kinda stretching it a bit to all have the same issue.
Yes, I know you took it back to STOCK rom with #3 but who knows if the STOCK ROM is really *STOCK*, you should try a new phone #4 stock without ROOT for at least a day or two to determine if it is a DESIGN/HARDWARE issue rule that out first and then try from there... If this still happens with STOCK phone, you may have to switch to another phone (iphone or otherwise)...
Good Luck!
I just took it back to stock and was going to go outside to see if it had problems finding service. Though as mentioned in many other threads on here, it's not so much it finding you when you're standing still. It's when you're driving the streets of Atlanta that things get crazy.
stalked_r/t said:
I just took it back to stock and was going to go outside to see if it had problems finding service. Though as mentioned in many other threads on here, it's not so much it finding you when you're standing still. It's when you're driving the streets of Atlanta that things get crazy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Stalk,
Keep in STOCK mode and drive around with it and see if this is still an issue then... Also if you have an aluminum case, this has been a known issue where the TARGUS (SP?) korean made BEAUTIFUL/GORGEOUS case affected the GPS antennae. Try it stock no case on the dash away from DIRECT sunslight and begin troubleshooting there...
UNFORTUNATELY it may boil down to Stock and working GPS or ROOT with Tethering... You ***MIGHT*** not be able to do both...
Good Luck...
If you JUST root, it shouldn't affect GPS - but test without rooting first.
And I agree - if you've got a metal case, DITCH IT.
So far, my experience is that the GPS chipset is almost as good as any standalone GPS chipset I've used - Sirf StarIII, MTKv2, STM Cartesio (the latter being the chipset in my Garmin Oregon, the former being chipsets in various Bluetooth dataloggers I've used for hiking). Actually, the GPS in this phone beats the StarIII and is around on par with the Cartesio. So far nothing I've ever used can touch an MTKv2 though.
I'm used to phones having crappy awful GPS chipsets - this is the first device I would ever consider using for geocaching on its own.
Thanks for the replies. I did test just now on the way to and from lunch with stock everything. I do have a case that's part aluminum (Case-Mate). I didn't try it without the case. didn't even think it could affect this.
Running a stock setup, I attempted to get navigation to my lunch location The drive was about 6 miles each way. When I left the office, I started Navigation. It never found a satellite enroute to the restaurant. I never stopped it during lunch from looking, though I was in a building, so i didn't expect it to find anything. On the way home, same status. Searching for satellites. I'm torn. I want this phone bad, love the Dev support, and there's nothing coming from AT&T that makes me want to use an old Blackberry to wait for. I also don't know what I can do to test this further.
On the way home, I'm going to do something very simple. I'm going to wipe the phone. I'm going to skip all steps of the initial setup, just have service and that's it. I'll start navigation and have it direct me home. If it doesn't work, I'll look at my options. If it works, then I know it's an app that's causing the problem.
Unless someone else can think of something for me to try. I wish this just worked like I know it can.
Ok. So an update. Wiped phone, not even associated with Google, Removed my 32 gig SD card for the heck of it, removed the case. Started nav and INSANTLY inside a building it had me pinpointed and was directing me to the next turn point to get home.
Here's the case I have: http://www.case-mate.com/Samsung-Ga...rsion-Barely-There-Brushed-Aluminum-Cases.asp
In one of the reviews, this is said:
As much as I wanted to love this case, I couldn't. I've used many Case Mate products before and I am just disappointed in them for the lack of quality of this case. There is a noticeable issue with the case fitting the bezel on the top right corner of the phone. The lip of the case fails to properly wrap around the front bezel. There is also the connectivity problems that come with this case. GPS has especially weakened with this case on. Other than that, I like the quality material that this case is built out of and feels very sturdy. Unfortunately though as of this writing, this is really the only choice for a decent case for this phone on the market. Time will tell if better choices come about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm going to keep this setup through tomorrow, then root the phone if there's no difference in performance and all is well. If that works fine for 2 days, I'll throw the Kernel on and throw UnNamed on. If that works, I'll throw the case on and see what happens. I now feel like this could be the problem. Thanks for the thoughts guys. I'll continue my abuse of the "THANKS" button and thank you all.
ride home was flawless. If ride to work tomorrow is flawless, I'll root and flash.
Entropy512 said:
If you JUST root, it shouldn't affect GPS - but test without rooting first.
And I agree - if you've got a metal case, DITCH IT.
So far, my experience is that the GPS chipset is almost as good as any standalone GPS chipset I've used - Sirf StarIII, MTKv2, STM Cartesio (the latter being the chipset in my Garmin Oregon, the former being chipsets in various Bluetooth dataloggers I've used for hiking). Actually, the GPS in this phone beats the StarIII and is around on par with the Cartesio. So far nothing I've ever used can touch an MTKv2 though.
I'm used to phones having crappy awful GPS chipsets - this is the first device I would ever consider using for geocaching on its own.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't gotten enough free time to log the NMEA output, but I don't think our "SirfSTAR IV" chipset is actually even using DGPS/WAAS. Which makes the accuracy it get's even more impressive. The chip definitely supports WAAS, but who knows exactly how the implementation is done between Android & Samsung...
I've also owned a SirfStar III based Bluetooth GPS, a MTK-based GPS (also the best I've found), and several phones with dedicated and integrated GPS chipsets. Have to agree our GS2 is one of the best. I can't exactly wander around the house and have it track my every movement like my Bluetooth pucks can (also having a large ceramic patch antenna helps a bit no doubt), but my GS2 locks fast, and stays locked. What else can you want from a GPS?
Might be worth it to look into WAAS either way though. On any standalone GPS unit, WAAS is the difference between 15-30 meter accuracy, and 3-5 meter (or better) accuracy. That is unless you have a military GPS unit, and the appropriate keys to receive the high accuracy P(Y)/M signals...
If you want to get a good idea of how the GPS is doing, this app will show you the strength of your GPS lock:
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.eclipsim.gpsstatus2
Also, upon further research, the NMEA output is reporting that WAAS/DGPS is not in use.
Example: "$GPGGA,222520.000,4218.460926,N,07111.901869,W,1,06,1.2,77.1,M,-33.8,M,,*53"
Where the bold "1" should be 2, and the null field right before the checksum "*53" should be the age of the DGPS/WAAS info if it were in use.
The chipset in our phones (http://www.csr.com/products/35/sirfstariv-gsd4e) clearly states that it supports WAAS. And since the choice of DGPS or not is solely in the hands of the chip and software (wiring/antenna connection/configuration is irrelevant) perhaps there is a way to enable the DGPS mode? If so, I'm sure we would all see MUCH better position and accuracy information.
WAAS probably requires modifications to the host processing binary (SIRFHost)
BTW, our chip is a GSD4t, not 4e.
I was having problems with my gps losing its lock for the longest time, i got a replacement phone and it started doing it again AFTER root. Im thinking some app might be causing the issue. I read somewhere that ROM Manager can cause issues. I deleted it and so far my gps has been working. I am really baffled on to what can be causing it.
stalked_r/t said:
ride home was flawless. If ride to work tomorrow is flawless, I'll root and flash.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its the case man. Great looking case, but kills the cell signal and terrible GPS. Mine went back after 3 days.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA App
Yep. Ride into work today lost signal once. After letting it sit for a couple minutes, I rebooted. After reboot it worked flawlessly. Definitely the case at this point. Putting Root/Kernel/ROM on it today and seeing how the drive home is. If it's good, then the case can be tossed and I'll find a different one.
Entropy512 said:
WAAS probably requires modifications to the host processing binary (SIRFHost)
BTW, our chip is a GSD4t, not 4e.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good catch. Interesting. Haven't checked out the sources, but I'm assuming all the GPS binaries are blobs? And source is not available?
Always wondered why mobile phones never have WAAS support... course then again, if the hardware was developed in Korea, that would make a little bit of sense. Seeing as there isn't WAAS coverage there, although I do believe there is an alternate DGPS solution for Asia.
i never had a galaxy S so now idea how bad that really was, but it does kinda suck when you need gps and have to have data on to get a lock in a shortish manner (mainly on holiday where i have no data allowance).
any chance that process tech (nodes etc) will have matured to the point where we can have a dedicated gps received in our phones of the quality of what you can get in a tom tom or whatever? no data needed at all to work?
i ask since i use gps on holidays via jogtracker to track where i've been and the train/bus/plane journies from A to B. very cool to look at after the fact - zoom in - and see what you were passing at the time
Well, you could go tell the US government to go modify their satellite so they transfer GPS almanac faster to your device.
Otherwise no, you'll need to get the info from somewhere, either from data network or the satellites themselves.
what? it's nothing to do with the satellites. get a tom tom and they lock on within 30 secs. get an sgs2 without data and it will lock on within 30 seconds, upto 5+ minutes, same with my old desire.
the "get the info from somewhere" line? it comes from the gps sats.
Well it was a joke, but looks like you didn't it. So to simplify the answer:
NO
The answer keeps being NO, but I'm gonna explain a bit further:
First time you boot a Tom Tom, it can stay anything from 5 to 10 minutes out in the sun to catch the goddamn GPS signal. Which is the average time for any GPS to get proper signal the standard manner. What happens the next time? Well, your tom has already the GPS data cached, so unless you move very far from the last point you connected the GPS, it will catch it rather fast (because it's asuming it stays in the same location).
With Android the results are rather mixed. I believe the caching part is done per app basis, which means maybe an app will get a fast lock provided you used it recently, and some other apps may really take the 5 minutes to get the proper location without any aid.
I think an standarized cache in android for any app using the GPS could be a good idea.
But that's my thought.
AGPS is also used as a signal booster in areas of low GPS signal .
Phone GPS does not need AGPS to work .
jje
Also, smartphones generally have weaker GPS antennas than dedicated navigation devices -- a good GPS antenna requires space, something that's at a premium in a smartphone. There are probably also RF issues to contend with.
So a smartphone is more likely to have a poor GPS signal and thus require help from other technologies like AGPS.
than you to the last 3 posters for providing useful responses
As reference, my SGS1 had terrible GPS. If I had no data and I wasn't using wireless networks to help pinpoint my location, the GPS sat would never find me.
In comparison, my SGS2 can usually get a lock on me within 30 seconds without data/wifi on and no assitance from wireless networks.
It may not be as fast or as reliable as a dedicated GPS unit, but it gets the job done when I need to know where the flip i am.
So this may be a stupid question from someone who isn't an advanced tablet user, but why is the GPS so important to so many people? If I need a GPS to get somewhere, I use my phone or GPS. And even if my tablet is tethered to my phone with the GPS off, it still gets it's location just fine. If I'm just an ignorant fool please feel free to let me know, just wondering what the benefit of it is.
Dan
I like maps and have very nice and detailed maps from memory map. It's very nice on a phone, but it would be so mutch better from a tablet.
Besides that, I can't stand it if something doesn't work (even if I never gone use it).
ddelong22 said:
So this may be a stupid question from someone who isn't an advanced tablet user, but why is the GPS so important to so many people? If I need a GPS to get somewhere, I use my phone or GPS. And even if my tablet is tethered to my phone with the GPS off, it still gets it's location just fine. If I'm just an ignorant fool please feel free to let me know, just wondering what the benefit of it is.
Dan
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
they make seat mounts where you could technically use it as a turn by turn navigation. someone mentioned he wanted to mount one in his RV. I personally wouldn't mind having mine be functional so when I am riding with my friends to a vacation spot or something I can backseat turn by turn us to a liquor store or something....... all in all shouldn't be a huge deal for most but the fact that Asus was dumb enough to put a aluminum plate to block signal is kind of alarming.
ddelong22 said:
So this may be a stupid question from someone who isn't an advanced tablet user, but why is the GPS so important to so many people? If I need a GPS to get somewhere, I use my phone or GPS. And even if my tablet is tethered to my phone with the GPS off, it still gets it's location just fine. If I'm just an ignorant fool please feel free to let me know, just wondering what the benefit of it is.
Dan
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
[A] I believe the point of GPS on this device (or any modern tablet / phone) is the utter ubiquity of GPS functions in apps, search, etc.... that coupled with gps hardware being so small, cheap, and power-conscious - it makes little sense to leave it out (even wih major usability issues)
I rarely use gps on my phone, let alone a tablet. Location based services are overrated
Maybe a gps to track a jog or hike? I'd love to see a jogger carrying a tablet
I'd also say that the people that post on these forums are generally not like the average user
It allows the FBI to find you when you view questionable material on the web.
Also, it allows Google to know where you are while collecting all of your habits, personal info and tastes.
Not everyone has a smart phone...not everyone can afford multiple gadget...
They buy the best gadget that meets their needs, the tp was originally advertised as the only device you need....
before ASUS dropped it from its specs, gps was part of the tp, so they expected the product to work...
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
Well whats important with GPS?? Well, whether you use it or not. If the box says it has GPS, it better have a working GPS. If you buy a car and it says it has a rearview camera and you find out that rearview camera was not working. Would you just says its ok thats what turning your head and looking at the mirrors are for. You paid for the feature, you best bet it works correctly if you paid for it. But if you bought it after the fact that they struck the GPS out of the box specs, then you shouldnt complain about the GPS or the use of it on your tablet.
People are upset because the box says GPS, and you paid for GPS but your not getting GPS.
Not getting what you paid for = upsetting.
Its like buying a turbo charged MR2 then finding out that the turbo isn't actually hooked up because toyota says the MR2 isn't meant to be a high performance race car...
And to add to that note..
And you find out the guy in your neighborhood bought the same MR2 at the same dealer and his turbo actually works. Its like WTF??? The guy is ranting I love my MR2 and not all MR2's are the same. And another guy with a faulty MR2 is also saying "its ok I dont use the turbo that much anyways" ... hehehehe.. Sorry just had to add.
Here's another idiot question, is GPS a subscription service?
No. As long as the device you have has a GPS receiver all it needs is a navigation software. The prime has a built in GPS receiver and has a navigation app so in theory it should lock on to satellites without the help of a wifi connection. But due to whatever Asus did to the prime, whether the aluminum case or firmware. The prime is a hit, or somewhere in the middle, to a complete miss in getting a lock on a satellite. Thus making the prime's GPS way below other devices with a GPS receiver and made Asus remove it from their specs.
ddelong22 said:
So this may be a stupid question from someone who isn't an advanced tablet user, but why is the GPS so important to so many people? If I need a GPS to get somewhere, I use my phone or GPS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Think a little, then you will know:
1. Not everyone has GPS in their phone. Buying phone with GPS = additional cost.
2. Dedicated GPS devices have often outdated maps because they lack internet connection and buing one = additional cost.
3. Tablet has enormous screen, great for using navigation while being a passenger (you hold the tablet in your hands, look at maps or use navigation) - the screen is much bigger and better than most phones (I for one have very basic phone because I have tablet for more advanced things).
4. Tablet has a great battery life - it's perfect for out-of-car navigation (trips on foot, on a bike) and for tracking GPS for your photo camera on any type of trips.
5. GPS is usefull not only for navigation. Simple thing like having Google Maps locate you is very useful, but also webpages and many fun application use it. Just search the market for GPS, you will find a lot of useful applications of your tablet with GPS.
6. For instanced where your tablet gets stolen GPS can help you locate it.
I think I missed some things, because I'm writing this list second time, from what I remember...
All,
I am open to suggestions on what to do with my prime. Some background:
I bought it because I wanted an Android table that I didn't have to hack to make work and that I didn't have to keep plugged in all the time. I had a Viewsonic Gtablet and that was such a turd I was totally disgusted with having to support it anytime I wanted to use it. I just wanted it to work, but as I am an Engineer by trade I liked the flexiblity that came with an Android tablet vs an iPad.
I was one of the early ones to get the prime, and as such I thoroughly tested everything, screen bleed, dead pixels, battery, bluetooth, wireless, GPS, the whole 9 yards. Then I got the patch that came out around New Years Day and never got GPS back. I called support and they wanted me to send it in for at least 7 days. I found that to be ridiculous and decided to live with it. I got hopeful that as other people got theirs working with newer patches mine would too.
I just got the new patch the other day, still no GPS and as I was trying to use my tablet tonight, it was slower than dirt. I run a speed test and I get 1.5Mbps down, and I pull out my phone and run a speed test over wireless (802.11, not 4G) and I get 15Mbps down. Ran the same tests a few times with consistent results.
I just want a tablet that works and everything works as it should. I don't want an Apple product as I take long flights and like to be able to watch mkvs as well as a couple of other things Apple doesn't do easily. I really thought my Prime would be the solution for me.
So your thoughts on my options:
Return it to ASUS for service, how likely am I to be satisified with those results?
I see that there is a potential fix for GPS, is there one for WIFI? I don't want to hack it to get my stuff to work, but it is an option.
Sell it and buy an Apple Product.
My wife has an iPad and anytime I have issues with my Prime, I pick hers up and it just rocks and rolls. I really like Android and the features it offers over an iOS device, not to mention I really HATE iTunes.
Thanks in advance,
Kevin
I understand about itunes, it drove my away from apple also. But it seems as if the Prime really isn't the tablet for you. I don't know if its just hardware or bad luck, either way I sorry to hear your having problems.
I don't think anyone can make the decision as to what you should do, however it seems as if you have made up your mind already. If you think ipad is a better solution then that might be the better pad for you. Good luck.
unlock it, throw a custom rom on it. worries will be over
IMO, try to return it for a device with C20 or above on the serial number.
Check and see if you can get an exchange, or refund. Refund is probably the better idea over exchange.
For GPS.. if the feature is important to you, Transformer Prime simply isn't the right tablet for you. Look for other alternatives .....
As for WIFI:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5688/apple-ipad-2012-review/18
It could just be Anandtech's Prime (however, mine is similar to Annandtech.. slightly better or worse on each given day)... but either way, you will be taking a chance if you wish to re-purchase Transformer Prime.
shinzz said:
Check and see if you can get an exchange, or refund. Refund is probably the better idea over exchange.
For GPS.. if the feature is important to you, Transformer Prime simply isn't the right tablet for you. Look for other alternatives .....
As for WIFI:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5688/apple-ipad-2012-review/18
It could just be Anandtech's Prime (however, mine is similar to Annandtech.. slightly better or worse on each given day)... but either way, you will be taking a chance if you wish to re-purchase Transformer Prime.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why is GPS so important? If you really have this device mounted in your car, you should be shot. A 10 inch screen has no place in your car. Look at the road, for christ. Buy a decent smartphone that has GPS. There's really no reason for a tablet to have GPS anymore, with the Wifi system.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201
here is my suggestion~
Prime isn't perfect, nor the new ipad is and its hard for every user to expect its do all the things it supposed to do (I know its on the spec and we all want it working fine... but u know ipad wasn't perfect too, though it came with a extra egg-cooking function which is not on the spec list) I guess in other few patches, Prime will finally work the way u want it be, but u know, getting other tablet may disappoint u in other ways as well. chances are always there~
so if u really want GPS then refund it~
if u can bear the difference of 1.5 mbps and 15 mbps, then it worth the wait ~
kjp1231 said:
All,
I am open to suggestions on what to do with my prime. Some background:
I bought it because I wanted an Android table that I didn't have to hack to make work and that I didn't have to keep plugged in all the time. I had a Viewsonic Gtablet and that was such a turd I was totally disgusted with having to support it anytime I wanted to use it. I just wanted it to work, but as I am an Engineer by trade I liked the flexiblity that came with an Android tablet vs an iPad.
I was one of the early ones to get the prime, and as such I thoroughly tested everything, screen bleed, dead pixels, battery, bluetooth, wireless, GPS, the whole 9 yards. Then I got the patch that came out around New Years Day and never got GPS back. I called support and they wanted me to send it in for at least 7 days. I found that to be ridiculous and decided to live with it. I got hopeful that as other people got theirs working with newer patches mine would too.
I just got the new patch the other day, still no GPS and as I was trying to use my tablet tonight, it was slower than dirt. I run a speed test and I get 1.5Mbps down, and I pull out my phone and run a speed test over wireless (802.11, not 4G) and I get 15Mbps down. Ran the same tests a few times with consistent results.
I just want a tablet that works and everything works as it should. I don't want an Apple product as I take long flights and like to be able to watch mkvs as well as a couple of other things Apple doesn't do easily. I really thought my Prime would be the solution for me.
So your thoughts on my options:
Return it to ASUS for service, how likely am I to be satisified with those results?
I see that there is a potential fix for GPS, is there one for WIFI? I don't want to hack it to get my stuff to work, but it is an option.
Sell it and buy an Apple Product.
My wife has an iPad and anytime I have issues with my Prime, I pick hers up and it just rocks and rolls. I really like Android and the features it offers over an iOS device, not to mention I really HATE iTunes.
Thanks in advance,
Kevin
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well if you can live a few months without a tablet, return it and wait for the infinity... It should resolve most of the issues.
rorytmeadows said:
Why is GPS so important? If you really have this device mounted in your car, you should be shot. A 10 inch screen has no place in your car. Look at the road, for christ. Buy a decent smartphone that has GPS. There's really no reason for a tablet to have GPS anymore, with the Wifi system.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Amen!!, This should be stickied and placed in bold. Anybody who buys a wifi device (like the Prime) that would have to be tethered to another device with a cell radio (like a cell phone) to be used properly, but complains that the GPS won't work, needs to rethink the purpose for a wifi tablet.
GPS on a tablet is a gimmick feature at best and I don't blame Asus for removing it from spec. It certainly isn't worth the headache it has casued.
ill1 said:
Amen!!, This should be stickied and placed in bold. Anybody who buys a wifi device (like the Prime) that would have to be tethered to another device with a cell radio (like a cell phone) to be used properly, but complains that the GPS won't work, needs to rethink the purpose for a wifi tablet.
GPS on a tablet is a gimmick feature at best and I don't blame Asus for removing it from spec. It certainly isn't worth the headache it has casued.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Part of the problem with the Prime forum is ill-informed posts like this one, and the post that prompted it. Note, I'm not singling out the individual posters here as this seems to be a very common sentiment on the Prime forum these days, but just using these posts as an example.
There are many reasons why someone might want GPS on their WiFi only tablet beyond navigation, and even if you did want to use it for navigation in a vehicle, there is absolutely *no* requirement for it to be tethered if you have offline maps.
There are plenty of apps out there that rely on GPS for things like marine navigation, hiking, geo-tagging photos etc that don't need data access, but require having working GPS. Something like the Prime with its IPS+ screen is ideal for those sorts of uses, *if* the GPS worked correctly. Saying that it is a "gimmick feature", or doesn't matter because the WiFi iPad doesn't have it, is patently absurd.
Ok, so Asus have stopped advertising the Prime as having GPS, but that doesn't help those who purchase the Prime beforehand, or those like the OP who had functioning GPS which was nerfed by an update.
It's incredibly short-sighted to just assume that because *you* don't have a use for GPS on a WiFi tablet, no one else does.
Can we please stop with attacking people who just want their tablets to work as they expected?
Regards,
Dave
foxmeister said:
Part of the problem with the Prime forum is ill-informed posts like this one, and the post that prompted it. Note, I'm not singling out the individual posters here as this seems to be a very common sentiment on the Prime forum these days, but just using these posts as an example.
There are many reasons why someone might want GPS on their WiFi only tablet beyond navigation, and even if you did want to use it for navigation in a vehicle, there is absolutely *no* requirement for it to be tethered if you have offline maps.
There are plenty of apps out there that rely on GPS for things like marine navigation, hiking, geo-tagging photos etc that don't need data access, but require having working GPS. Something like the Prime with its IPS+ screen is ideal for those sorts of uses, *if* the GPS worked correctly. Saying that it is a "gimmick feature", or doesn't matter because the WiFi iPad doesn't have it, is patently absurd.
Ok, so Asus have stopped advertising the Prime as having GPS, but that doesn't help those who purchase the Prime beforehand, or those like the OP who had functioning GPS which was nerfed by an update.
It's incredibly short-sighted to just assume that because *you* don't have a use for GPS on a WiFi tablet, no one else does.
Can we please stop with attacking people who just want their tablets to work as they expected?
Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you Dave, couldn't have said it better myself.
I didn't buy the tablet so that I could mount it on my dashboard and drive around with it. My previous tablet didn't have GPS, the Apple products do as does the original Transformer. When I pre-ordered mine GPS was listed as a feature and I expected it to work right. It did right out of the box until the first patch came, Asus doesn't recognize it as a hardware problem. GPS is not just for directions, there are quite a bit of applications out there that use Location Based Services and when you aren't connected to Wi-Fi, it would be nice that the GPS actually worked as GPS is a better at Location Based Services than Wi-Fi is.
I also bought a product that supports Wi-FI, accepting that 1.5Mbps down is not really an option.
I just want a product that works everytime I pick it up. The Gtablet was not that product as the ROMS were always in development, and there was always one feature or another not working. That is why when I bout the Prime I wanted a product that just worked.
Kevin
ill1 said:
I understand about itunes, it drove my away from apple also. But it seems as if the Prime really isn't the tablet for you. I don't know if its just hardware or bad luck, either way I sorry to hear your having problems.
I don't think anyone can make the decision as to what you should do, however it seems as if you have made up your mind already. If you think ipad is a better solution then that might be the better pad for you. Good luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you ill,
I haven't made up my mind yet, I really really do not want an Apple product. I really want a functioning Android product. I was more posting to see what suggestions people had to get mine to be fully functioning as the product that was advertised and I bought.
Kevin
bk201doesntexist said:
IMO, try to return it for a device with C20 or above on the serial number.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
returning it is not an option as this was a pre-order and I only had 30 days to return it. I got it the last week of December 2011.
Why not try the Samsung tab 10.1?
If GPS is a requirement, I'd go for a cheap bluetooth GPS, if you can find one that's compatible, and rely on a mobile hotspot if you need data on the road. That being said, I dunno if the bluetooth + wifi problem affects GPS in such a configuration. The Samsung tablet is also a good alternative...that, and a good Windows tablet can be overlaid with RoadRunner or other control and give you a car-oriented interface for Nav and control of music, etc. that rivals a lot of factory control systems. From what I've seen of what's available in android thus far, the options for a control interface in android don't come close to what's available for windows...
My combination of problems differs; I never had a usable GPS, but since the .15 update, I've had no GPS at all (no satellites). That, and the no serial issue, and the bluetooth (A2DP) drops out when streaming audio or video over wifi.
I'm thinking about an RMA, but I'm not encouraged by the reports of effectiveness for forum members that have gone through the process...I'm kinda waiting on the "big announcement" from Gary before I pass judgment on the RMA. I'm kinda hoping on being able to unlock the device at some point, and at least be able to load a custom ROM if I'm stuck with no OTA updates. In the mean time, the tablet makes a great media consumption device and game platform, and I'd like to explore the keyboard option in the near future.
To those with a problem with a car mount: You'd rather someone use a 4.5" Garmin or a dash-mount 7" factory nav? You do know that it's easier to glance at a larger screen when it comes to navigating, right? I don't suggest use of the tablet while driving: Pre-program your routes (and playlists for music) before you go, and pull over for geo-tagging or finding restaurants, etc....but there's no reason a tablet can't be used for in-car purposes, so long as you use a little common sense and foresight. I run a laptop with an in-dash touch screen (7") carputer system, it works fine this way.
GernBlanston said:
If GPS is a requirement, I'd go for a cheap bluetooth GPS, if you can find one that's compatible, and rely on a mobile hotspot if you need data on the road. That being said, I dunno if the bluetooth + wifi problem affects GPS in such a configuration. The Samsung tablet is also a good alternative...that, and a good Windows tablet can be overlaid with RoadRunner or other control and give you a car-oriented interface for Nav and control of music, etc. that rivals a lot of factory control systems. From what I've seen of what's available in android thus far, the options for a control interface in android don't come close to what's available for windows...
My combination of problems differs; I never had a usable GPS, but since the .15 update, I've had no GPS at all (no satellites). That, and the no serial issue, and the bluetooth (A2DP) drops out when streaming audio or video over wifi.
I'm thinking about an RMA, but I'm not encouraged by the reports of effectiveness for forum members that have gone through the process...I'm kinda waiting on the "big announcement" from Gary before I pass judgment on the RMA. I'm kinda hoping on being able to unlock the device at some point, and at least be able to load a custom ROM if I'm stuck with no OTA updates. In the mean time, the tablet makes a great media consumption device and game platform, and I'd like to explore the keyboard option in the near future.
To those with a problem with a car mount: You'd rather someone use a 4.5" Garmin or a dash-mount 7" factory nav? You do know that it's easier to glance at a larger screen when it comes to navigating, right? I don't suggest use of the tablet while driving: Pre-program your routes (and playlists for music) before you go, and pull over for geo-tagging or finding restaurants, etc....but there's no reason a tablet can't be used for in-car purposes, so long as you use a little common sense and foresight. I run a laptop with an in-dash touch screen (7") carputer system, it works fine this way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually purchased cheap Bluetooth GPS to tether to my Prime. I personally find it annoying that I have to carry multiple device & charger... =/
This will ultimately depend on the user...
As for big announcement, don't expect a miracle or hardware "solution" provided by Asus (especially on GPS).
Btw, if the OP can wait.. there are other options.
Such as this one...
http://www.amazon.com/Acer-A510-10s...TWKA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333374516&sr=8-1
reNeglect said:
Well if you can live a few months without a tablet, return it and wait for the infinity... It should resolve most of the issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Returned mine to Amazon today and now eagerly awaiting the arrival of the Infinity so that I can buy it!
kjp1231 said:
returning it is not an option as this was a pre-order and I only had 30 days to return it. I got it the last week of December 2011.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should be able to RMA it with Asus. If the unit they send as a replacement doesn't meet your needs, sell it on eBay. Even used you should have no problem getting $400-450 for it.
I haven't had any of the issues you have described aside from the poor GPS. WiFi works great, the tablet's performance is smooth and apps run fast with no issue. Also the latest update got rid of the annoying "Browser Not Responding" glitch after I did a factory reset.
FYI, GPS never really worked. It it seemed to either you hadn't really tested it, or the Prime was lying to you
If GPS is a necessary feature you will never be happy with the Prime. And yes, I also have an early model (BBOK) with GPS listed as a feature on the box.
almightywhacko said:
FYI, GPS never really worked. It it seemed to either you hadn't really tested it, or the Prime was lying to you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tested my unit very thoroughly as soon as I got it out of the box. I was consistently getting a very fast lock on to at least 13 satellites inside my house. Not sure how the prime would have lied about that. Since the first update around January 1, I cannot get it to lock on to any sattelites outside my house in a field no matter how I hold the unit.
foxmeister said:
Part of the problem with the Prime forum is ill-informed posts like this one, and the post that prompted it. Note, I'm not singling out the individual posters here as this seems to be a very common sentiment on the Prime forum these days, but just using these posts as an example.
There are many reasons why someone might want GPS on their WiFi only tablet beyond navigation, and even if you did want to use it for navigation in a vehicle, there is absolutely *no* requirement for it to be tethered if you have offline maps.
There are plenty of apps out there that rely on GPS for things like marine navigation, hiking, geo-tagging photos etc that don't need data access, but require having working GPS. Something like the Prime with its IPS+ screen is ideal for those sorts of uses, *if* the GPS worked correctly. Saying that it is a "gimmick feature", or doesn't matter because the WiFi iPad doesn't have it, is patently absurd.
Ok, so Asus have stopped advertising the Prime as having GPS, but that doesn't help those who purchase the Prime beforehand, or those like the OP who had functioning GPS which was nerfed by an update.
It's incredibly short-sighted to just assume that because *you* don't have a use for GPS on a WiFi tablet, no one else does.
Can we please stop with attacking people who just want their tablets to work as they expected?
Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not singling out any individual posters either but since you used mine and noted the one that prompted my response then I'll respond to you.
On this forum I come across a lot of threads that get hijacked because of the GPS issue, it's a known problem Asus acknowledged it and took it off spec. You could always ask for a refund or sell it and get one that is better suited for your needs. It would be a completely different thing if Asus hadn't acknowledged it or worse just simply ignored it but they haven't.
No GPS is not an issue for me, but I understand it is for others however Asus has said it may not work properly and should not be considered in place of a professional GPS unit. There are other tablets that may be a better fit for users who need GPS . So I don't believe it's me who's being short sighted.
I never meant to attack anyone if you feel attacked I apologize but I stand by what I wrote.
I don't know how many more times my desk will survive due to me banging my head against it...
It's a long story which I will cut short; we have bought a large number of cheap handsets (Nuu A3L, spec sheet here: https://www.devicespecifications.com/en/model/4fc6428b ) and they're using Sygic truck as their navigation tool.
We straight away ran into some major issues, the main one being with Sygic/GPS. The devices would begin navigating but would then start to lose GPS signal and start bouncing around, sometimes they would recover (only to do the same thing again a few minutes later) and other times they would just lose GPS connectivity entirely and would lock up for 10+ minutes.
After seeing how poorly the application ran on these devices I had a hunch that the application was hogging every last drop of available system resource. I removed as much bloat from the application as possible, I turned off the 3D map (2D is much more fluid), turned off all POI, turned off traffic updates etc and it appeared to resolve the issue. I drove for 30 minutes with two devices side-by-side, the default one continued with its horrid GPS loss while the customised one worked fine.
A few people have taken these out today to test, but are apparently having the same issues regardless of the changes that I made.
I'm now at a loss and struggling to work out what else can be done to help. They're running Airwatch and we can push remote changes out at any time, so I am at the mercy of those more knowledgeable than I (you).
If anybody has a decent suggestion then you win a free balloon.
jaffster said:
I don't know how many more times my desk will survive due to me banging my head against it...
It's a long story which I will cut short; we have bought a large number of cheap handsets (Nuu A3L, spec sheet here: https://www.devicespecifications.com/en/model/4fc6428b ) and they're using Sygic truck as their navigation tool.
We straight away ran into some major issues, the main one being with Sygic/GPS. The devices would begin navigating but would then start to lose GPS signal and start bouncing around, sometimes they would recover (only to do the same thing again a few minutes later) and other times they would just lose GPS connectivity entirely and would lock up for 10+ minutes.
After seeing how poorly the application ran on these devices I had a hunch that the application was hogging every last drop of available system resource. I removed as much bloat from the application as possible, I turned off the 3D map (2D is much more fluid), turned off all POI, turned off traffic updates etc and it appeared to resolve the issue. I drove for 30 minutes with two devices side-by-side, the default one continued with its horrid GPS loss while the customised one worked fine.
A few people have taken these out today to test, but are apparently having the same issues regardless of the changes that I made.
I'm now at a loss and struggling to work out what else can be done to help. They're running Airwatch and we can push remote changes out at any time, so I am at the mercy of those more knowledgeable than I (you).
If anybody has a decent suggestion then you win a free balloon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let me be clear that I never played with sygix enough to speak directly about it. You may have already tried the things I'm brainstorming here.
I'm not clear as to why you didn't just load a different mapping app on these? There certainly are a lot of them.
What level of connectivity are they using? If you are on GSM or 3G, downloading map information as the vehicle moves around, that could slow things down to a crawl. Using an app that doesn't have to work this way could be a solution.
I noticed that the phone has a 500ish MHz clock speed and just 1 GB of RAM. As you've discovered, every layer of complexity in the mapping will slow it down further.
Something like Tom-tom was written to run on a lot less hardware. That's the kind of thing that I'd look for. I believe that Here is also made for very low end hardware.
Not sure if it helps, but at least it's a path worth looking at.
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk