Related
i've had windows mobile forever and basically i now have an oppertunity to get the hero but keep my touch pro.
does anybody have any advice on the difference between the 2 os's?
the goods and bads of anroid compared to winmo?
The biggest difference is that multi-tasking is a little different. By default there is no list of running processes, and no way to switch between them. Instead you go back to an already open app by going through the menu and opening it like regular again.
ahm, long pressing the Home button will bring up the list of currently/last opened apps so you can switch between them
Ok, I'll give you that, it makes switching easier, but it is not a task list. Just a shortcut to some recently launched apps. If you open 7 apps, you won't be able to switch to the oldest.
If you compare stock Android (1.5) versus stock Windows Mobile 6.1 / 6.5, it'll be a close call. I think I would rather have a WinMo device then.
But the HTC interface on the Hero makes it a no-brainer for me.
But it all depends what you use your device for. If you are a heavy bluetooth user you might want to look into that first, but since I hardly ever use it I have no issues with android and loved it from the first few minutes of using it . And that was after years of Winmo-using.
But Android simply doesn't have the HUGE list of applications, tweaks and tricks that Windows Mobile has.
If I had to choose between a Touch Pro or a Hero, I'd go for a Hero. But if it was a Diamond2 / Touch Pro 2 (or maybe even a Touch HD) and I could tweak it completely with all the knowledge from cooking I had, it'll be a though choice . TouchFlo 2.6 on a Diamond2 is still a lovely combo.
Hi everyone im new to the forum and to android.
Im also a converted WinMo user, i had the touch hd running with Duttys rom and sometimes Energy rom. I enjoyed the installing of new roms etc but the biggest thing for me though was the lack of a marketplace and consequently the lack of really good apps that compare with android.
True there is a marketplace on winmo being released soon with WM 6.5, but ive used WM 6.5 and i hated the interface. Plus there are no winmo phones i can think of that are finger friendly (all operate with pressure sensored UI's). Android has a nice UI.
The hero for me has exciting potential and i think can acoomplish great things once they get rid of the infamous lag. Plus the developers are shifting over more and more from apple (flooded) to android.
dipje said:
But it all depends what you use your device for. If you are a heavy bluetooth user you might want to look into that first,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good point - Android bluetooth is partly crippled at the moment, the API has not been finalised thus it has not been released.
nrains said:
i've had windows mobile forever and basically i now have an oppertunity to get the hero but keep my touch pro.
does anybody have any advice on the difference between the 2 os's?
the goods and bads of anroid compared to winmo?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The article linked here gives a reasonable accurate and concise summary of the differences between the two, including relative strengths and weaknesses. From my experiences, I'd agree with most of what the author has said.
http://smartphoneandroid.com/2009/07/06/whats-the-difference-between-google-android-and-windows-mobile.html
Regards,
Dave
wow thank you, but i have another related question, should i get the "my touch 3g" which from my understand is basically the htc magic and just put a hero rom on there or is it worth the extra bit of ram to get the hero?
Are you in the US? If so, bear in mind that the Hero won't work with any 3G network as yet, whereas the T-Mobile branded MyTouch 3G will at least work on the T-Mobile 3G network (assuming you're in the fairly limit coverage area!).
Personally, I would get the Hero, but if you can get a Magic with 288mb Ram, it should run the Hero run ok. As far as I'm aware, all HTC branded Magics should be ok, but I do know that some operator branded Magics (e.g. Vodafone UK) only have 192Mb Ram and therefore won't really run the Hero run acceptably.
Regards,
Dave
hello im new here. i dont have hd2 but interested on it . is it true that u can run android 2.2 froyo rom in this phone? please share thanks
yes, go look in the android thread in here
just buy the new HTC Desire HD and you are done
yes, but the device was never meant to be for android, better to get an adroid device if ur interested in it.
no its all lies.
Yeah, it is just a rumor proliferated by some Android fanboys jealous of our hardware.
So if I buy htc hd2 is it for sure ill get android on it and also windoes. I think its awesome. I saw it on gsmarena website that they put android 2.2 rom in hd2
Sent from my X10a using XDA App
My friend has android on his HD2, he complains about its functionality a lot!
So i guess it's better to stick to WM and use CHT for a better interface
sevoflurane said:
My friend has android on his HD2, he complains about its functionality a lot!
So i guess it's better to stick to WM and use CHT for a better interface
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Android = No good on Hd2
An entire os running from an SD card is rather clunky and just cant really compete.
ap3604 said:
+1
Android = No good on Hd2
An entire os running from an SD card is rather clunky and just cant really compete.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To offer an alternative view:
I've recently switched to running Android permanently on my HD2. I've even flashed the ChuckyDROID cut-down winmo ROM designed to boot Android as quickly as possible, so I'm not even using winmo as a fallback.
Recent HD2 Android builds are quite stable, and the performance and battery life is easily comparable to what I had under WinMo. I use Bangsters version, and it's great; there are many others reported to be working fine too.
It does take a bit of reading to find a good combination of the available options to suit your needs - the most important thing I found was to get the right radio version and a suitable winmo ROM build flashed to your device.
There's plenty of information on how to get it all working in the HD2 Android Development forum, but I can vouch that it does work.
joelfinch said:
To offer an alternative view:
I've recently switched to running Android permanently on my HD2. I've even flashed the ChuckyDROID cut-down winmo ROM designed to boot Android as quickly as possible, so I'm not even using winmo as a fallback.
Recent HD2 Android builds are quite stable, and the performance and battery life is easily comparable to what I had under WinMo. I use Bangsters version, and it's great; there are many others reported to be working fine too.
It does take a bit of reading to find a good combination of the available options to suit your needs - the most important thing I found was to get the right radio version and a suitable winmo ROM build flashed to your device.
There's plenty of information on how to get it all working in the HD2 Android Development forum, but I can vouch that it does work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 on this. Android has come a very long way. However, this IS a WinMo phone and I would not recommend that you buy it if your intention is using android as your primary OS. There are TONS of devices out there now that are either identical to or better than the HD2 in hardware and they run android flawlessly as the primary OS.
Faelok said:
+1 on this. Android has come a very long way. However, this IS a WinMo phone and I would not recommend that you buy it if your intention is using android as your primary OS. There are TONS of devices out there now that are either identical to or better than the HD2 in hardware and they run android flawlessly as the primary OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TONS is really a bit overstated.
Samsung has Android phones of comparable hardware, however most of them perform bsdly (If the reviews are right) and running on Android 1.6,,,,
There are only a few phones comparable not tons.
If one comes from WinMo, it is a nice option to run Android.
I have not(yet) heard of Android devices running WinMo.
The HD2 is still the most powerfull machine around beeing able to run both.
Completely switching to Android is a very definitive step in my opinion.
Beeing able to switch between the two is (again, n my opinion) a big plus.
Also: NAND is apparently just around the corner, meaning one can FLASH Android on the HD2, thus no longer run it from SD. (And loosing dual boot possibilities) This should perform better, and since the IO is not going to SD, probably the batterylife will be longer.
As rumours go: It should be possible to flash to Android and back to WinMo
Another great option for this remarkable machine.
But enough of pro-HD2 talk, Could you give me a list of phones beeing able to do all that?
The Droid X, Droid2, All the variants of the Samsung Galaxy, Desire HD, EVO, Nexus One, Droid Incredible. 3.7" on a couple of those but they are still very similar devices hardware wise. Since xda members make sure to root every phone weeks before it even launches the version of android that it happens to be running is sort of a moot point.
Compared to the options that were out there when the HD2 came out, I consider this tons.
But I think the point of my post was missed entirely. I would never trade the HD2 for any of them. It is by far the BEST phone for ME.
However, I cannot recommend someone buying a phone with the sole intent of running an alternate OS when there are so many similar options out that are designed with android. The HD2 may be the most versatile phone out there but aside from those of us who are able/willing/committed/experienced enough to take advantage of that, your average user typically is not happy with it. I have had 3 people I work with purchase the phone (despite my warning) after seeing what I have done with it. 2 of them returned it. The 3rd constantly complains to me about x y and z.
Anyway, my point was that the OP should consider whether they are getting the phone only to run android. If that is the case, they should take a look at some other options before doing so.
Like posted above, I would not buy this phone if your main intention is running Android. But if you are interested in dual booting Android and Winmo then this is the best choice. I use both an equal amount of time, my info is in my signature and I can tell you I am extremely happy. WinMo will always be my primary but it's nice to use Android to sample a few new games or listen to Pandora. I prefer the option of which to use so I will never flash the Nand version.
But finding the right combination is really up to you as a lot can depend on your Winmo build of choice, the radio, and which Android build you use as different combinations can have varying results. For example I use the builds in my sig with that radio as it works best for me in my area in terms of battery life and connection speed. Now someone in say, New York may get better results with a different radio or different WinMo build. It's up to you to try them all
Maybe it's me but way will people buy a WM device if thy will/need a Android?
Okay fore people who have there HD2 already, and thy will switching to Android I could understand (white lots of imagination)
but peoples who don't ha a device, and must buy one way you will buy a WM device if you need a Android?
I don't understand it!
it's the same fore me to buy a diesel car and after that I will transform it to a engine car!?
not to blame peoples but way make live complicate?
kurt-willems said:
Maybe it's me but way will people buy a WM device if thy will/need a Android?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Perhaps because they are used to WinMo and would like to eperiment with Android?
kurt-willems said:
Okay fore people who have there HD2 already, and thy will switching to Android I could understand (white lots of imagination)
but peoples who don't ha a device, and must buy one way you will buy a WM device if you need a Android?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well: Use proven technology, while beeeing able to experiment with Android and eveluate its possibilities/capabilities.
HD2 is the top on speccs and has dual boot capability.
kurt-willems said:
I don't understand it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do: it's a hacker thing, beeing able to put things to your hand, make it do what you want, not what it is intended for.
kurt-willems said:
it's the same fore me to buy a diesel car and after that I will transform it to a engine car!?
not to blame peoples but way make live complicate?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is not the same, it is like buying a Diesel car, adding a petrol engine and using whatever you want (either depending on fuel price, or depending on driving style you want to experience that moment)
Running Android of SD Card is not transforming your device, it is extending it's capabilities.
One can experiment with Android while it is still possible to "revert" to WinMo.
eg: during the office hours WinMo, in the evening Android, as a hobby, from interest, playing games fill in....
Faelok said:
The Droid X, Droid2, All the variants of the Samsung Galaxy, Desire HD, EVO, Nexus One, Droid Incredible. 3.7" on a couple of those but they are still very similar devices hardware wise. [...]
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
still no TONS....
Quite a few, but it is not like HD2 is completely outclassed by these devices....
But remains: wich ones can do dual boot?....
Rest my case
Wilco said:
still no TONS....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Semantics
Quite a few, but it is not like HD2 is completely outclassed by these devices....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are correct. The HD2 is absolutely not outclassed by any of those devices and I never said it was. I simply noted that they are very similar in terms of hardware. The EVO is perhaps the only one that has same or better stats in all areas. My wife has an EVO but I personally perfer my HD2 because of the dual-boot versatility you mentioned.
But remains: wich ones can do dual boot?....
Rest my case
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AFAIK none. But I don't think that is relevant to the advice I gave.
To reiterate: Buying the HD2 with the intention of running android as the primary OS is in my opinion a mistake. There are better options that do not require -
a) running off of the SD card
b) changing the radio (and possibly the ROM as well)
c) 99% functionality
d) waiting (and hoping) for a quick nand solution
However, already owning an HD2 and deciding that you are bored with WM is completely understandable. If the OP is good with tech/gagets, experienced with WinMo, enjoys the occasional hard-reset when tweaking has gone awry, and wants a phone that can dual-boot WM and droid, then the HD2 is an outstanding choice for him/her. If the OP wants to buy an HD2 and use nothing but android on it... I think that is kind of silly. Since they never made clear thier intent, this is really all pointless speculation.
ap3604 I can also report, the android ins't better than hd2 in native OS
Wilco said:
Perhaps because they are used to WinMo and would like to eperiment with Android?
Well: Use proven technology, while beeeing able to experiment with Android and eveluate its possibilities/capabilities.
HD2 is the top on speccs and has dual boot capability.
I do: it's a hacker thing, beeing able to put things to your hand, make it do what you want, not what it is intended for.
It is not the same, it is like buying a Diesel car, adding a petrol engine and using whatever you want (either depending on fuel price, or depending on driving style you want to experience that moment)
Running Android of SD Card is not transforming your device, it is extending it's capabilities.
One can experiment with Android while it is still possible to "revert" to WinMo.
eg: during the office hours WinMo, in the evening Android, as a hobby, from interest, playing games fill in....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Faelok said:
Semantics
You are correct. The HD2 is absolutely not outclassed by any of those devices and I never said it was. I simply noted that they are very similar in terms of hardware. The EVO is perhaps the only one that has same or better stats in all areas. My wife has an EVO but I personally perfer my HD2 because of the dual-boot versatility you mentioned.
AFAIK none. But I don't think that is relevant to the advice I gave.
To reiterate: Buying the HD2 with the intention of running android as the primary OS is in my opinion a mistake. There are better options that do not require -
a) running off of the SD card
b) changing the radio (and possibly the ROM as well)
c) 99% functionality
d) waiting (and hoping) for a quick nand solution
However, already owning an HD2 and deciding that you are bored with WM is completely understandable. If the OP is good with tech/gagets, experienced with WinMo, enjoys the occasional hard-reset when tweaking has gone awry, and wants a phone that can dual-boot WM and droid, then the HD2 is an outstanding choice for him/her. If the OP wants to buy an HD2 and use nothing but android on it... I think that is kind of silly. Since they never made clear thier intent, this is really all pointless speculation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All you guy's statements are on point.
My experience is coming from the G1 phone - HD2. I loved Android when it was on my G1. I rooted, hacked, and flashed a billion times (exaggerated; but felt like it). But when I found out that the HD2 was coming to the US, I had to jump on it. The hardware and spec sheet was HUGE compared to the phones that were available in the US at the time. C'mon, 4.3" screen vs. a 3.2"? No contest. I'm a multimedia geek, and this was a huge plus!
I love my HD2. WM was a new experience for me thus I read pages after pages after pages just so I can better my phone than the next persons' HD2. You guys above me saying that the HD2 is versatile, YES.. Very much so. I did everything on my HD2 w/WM. But I really missed the Android Market and it's apps...
Now, when Android was being pushed into development into the HD2.. this changed the game. WM + Cookies / GTX / SPB MS / etc is great (still is).. but someone who has experience with Android, loves the OS, and wants to see it on a phone with this much on the spec sheet, wouldn't let it slip by. I didn't. I use Android on a daily basis. It is my primary OS, only because I feel as if I have come to an end with WM on my HD2.
When I found out dual booting WM + Android, this made my HD2 even better! What Android is missing on the HD2... WM has. Or vice versa, IMO. For instance... I use a 98% stable build.. At least. GPS / BT will not work. Not a big deal for me. When I travel, I switch to WM. Done.
Lastly, I do agree with one of the above post. If you don't have an HD2 and want the phone solely for the purpose of running Android as a primary... DONT. Unless you're willing to put some time in running WM and getting familiar with it.
I believe hacking the HD2 to dual boot WM+Android is like riding a motorcycle for the first time... Start off in a smaller displacement bike and work your way up. Don't shoot for the fastest bike or you're bound to drop it.
Good evening XDA crew,
I was just wondering if there is going to be a possibility of a SD bootable version of WM6.5 in the future? Is it technically possible? What are the limitations?
Everyone's (rightly) moving away from WM6.5 and jumping onto the Android bandwagon, myself included, but WM6.5 still earns a place on the HD2, imo.
For two reasons for me anyway - TomTom and LowCaller.
Being able to boot WM6.5 as a secondary OS would be ideal.
So what's the verdict?
I read something either earlier or yesterday (can't remember where on xda) that cotulla was working on getting wm6.5 to boot from an sd card. I don't know if it's true and i can't verifiy it or find the thread i saw it in so don;t hold your breath.
One other thing, please don't assume that using android over WM6.5 is the best choice for everyone. It is just your opinion that android is better. Your post insinuates that any other opinion is wrong. For example, my opinion is that android is an immature, open source, iphone clone for immature, fan boy teenagers. This is not wrong, it is just my opinion. Please take that onboard for the future
Personaly, I don't know if this will be possible. (major doubt about it). But I can be wrong.
but let's be honest, running Android (what is relative a small OS) from your SD works but if we ar honest, it isn't the same as running as if it is install on internal memory.
Now we have WM who is a more large OS. imaging it running from SD
What I will say (I'm a big fan of WM) is we all knows that WM is sometimes what slow/buggy. So if tomorrow it will run from your SD-card I will have doubs about how good it will be.
If I was you I take a good WM custom ROM and run android from your SD-card.
Looks like it's in the works!
http://twitter.com/cotullacode
# We (DFT Team) developing several interesting stuffs for LEO, like WM65 running from SD card! 1:00 AM Feb 1st via web
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fantastic news for those of us who rely on WM for navigation and Android for everything else!
^agree^
I lost all the utility I had when it came to backpacking/hiking. Geocache and even when it came to navigating with meens other then gps winmo is still the strongest OS. Anyone remember 100% free orbcast and other, iptv ipcc? Those days may not be behind us with this. I love bits and pieces of all the moder platforms, but none provide the real/true utility value of wm65
^^^ +1 for this.
It will most probably take some time (for any platform) to re-discover all the niches which are still being served by WinMo 6.5.
As long as it´s a niche which promises commercial success, one would think it will go fast - but then again, there is some massive doubt about that, considering the current situation.
However, "homebrew" solutions are king when it comes to smaller niches - this is, for the time being, the strength of the Android platform. It was an old, traditional strength of Windows Mobile. Just consider the xda platform we are all being a part of right now.
thats very true, unfortunetly most of my primary utilization of wm was simply that a niche, I must have adopted more niche uses then any other user lol
I know a while ago there was talk of cotulla and friends getting WM6.5 to run off SD, does anyone know anything from irc or anywhere if this was completely abandoned?
would be pretty cool.
haven't heard anything, though not too up to date on the IRC stuff.
but no talk here minus that one post by cotulla.
if i may, what is on WM that android doesn't have? i don't use my phone but for a few programs (specific work things) and modding is mainly a distraction for me...but am curious how a dual-OS existence works in real life. just pondering. (now i am all about the development as well, it is bad ass to have options, but just philosophizing..if that is a word...)
jsmccabe78 said:
haven't heard anything, though not too up to date on the IRC stuff.
but no talk here minus that one post by cotulla.
if i may, what is on WM that android doesn't have? i don't use my phone but for a few programs (specific work things) and modding is mainly a distraction for me...but am curious how a dual-OS existence works in real life. just pondering. (now i am all about the development as well, it is bad ass to have options, but just philosophizing..if that is a word...)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well currently I have WP7 and Android dual-boot. The reason it's nice is because WP7 does have a couple games I like and just for the "fun change OS" factor. Practically speaking neither WM6.5 nor WP7 have anything really functionally better, but I miss playing "experiment 13" on WM6.5 and I also wanted to play with all of the new CHT goodies I see for fun. It's more of an enjoyment thing than any real practical need.
I dual boot between 6.5 and android.
6.5 for work when I need a solid data connection and a no nonsense browser (opera 9.7).
Android at home when I want to use the XDA app and look at pictures of cats hiding in shoes....
About 6.5 from SD.
I think it may take them some time as Wm as an OS is somewhat more awkward and tricky to tinker with than android. As far as porting it is concerned. That's what I read somewhere anyway....
Sent from my fingers to your face...
It would be great to have winmo on sd many of us could then go to nand Android having opportunity to boot winmo as alternative. For example I have my beloved gps soft on winmo...
I too think it would be great to boot Win Mo from SD. This would give poople the awsome ability to still use Win Mo after that have went NAND Andriod or WP7. I myself still use the stock Win Mo ROM as my daily and preferred OS cause it fits me better and my needs better. But if I was abale to boot Win Mo from SD I would give WP7 a try for a while. I like Andriod well enough but it is just not as functional to me plus I can running it from SD anytime I want so I see no reason to go NAND.
I do think it will take a good bet longer to achieve this ability though cause compared to Andriod Windows Mobile is a much larger OS and it is written with different code. But if anyone can do it is the Cottula and the rest of DFT.
I agree it would be nice. Actually having all the OS options on boot would be nice. Just was curious what people use in Wm that isn't available elsewhere. Cool!
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
jsmccabe78 said:
I agree it would be nice. Actually having all the OS options on boot would be nice. Just was curious what people use in Wm that isn't available elsewhere. Cool!
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To answer your queatuon it is really not that things in Win Mo are not avaliable in other OS'c but that so much comes built into Win Mo and for the functionality of it is more complete, atleast for me. Take things like internet sharingl/tethering and WiFi sharing. With Win Mo all you have to do is install the application and you are good. With Andriod you have to root the device for this and many more things. I like the full functionality of Micosoft Office compared to it on other mobile OS's. I like the feel of Win Mo too as it is more like a mobile PC or a extention of your home or office PC. Plus Win Mo is a true stand alone OS where as Andriod runs on top of Linux. Also to me Andriod feels more like a childs toy than a truly functional OS. Now I have not had but a limited amount of experience with WP7, but to me it is less functional than Andriod and more of a reversion to a some what dumb phone OS as it gives you limited capabilities and interface. That is just my opinion.
Would a sd build be with or without sense?
I agree it.Thank you for sharing, like very much
Very much down to whoever cooks the Roms. Once such a port is achieved anyone will be able to build roms so you'll get one of your choice.
If anyone can take care of this its cotulla and his crew!
Sent from my Nexus One
I have created this thread after asking this question in a different thread. drupad2drupad suggested i create a thread and sticky it. I agree, thought it might be useful to others. Hope its helpful.
I used to always use Windows phones (back in the days of WM6.5), but the draw of android tempted me. Now i am considering a returning to the the land that is Microsoft. The titan looked like a really good bet for me, but i had the following concerns:
Single core: I know microsoft says there is no real need for dual core phones, but a friend of mine has got a sensation XE, and compared to my desire HD, it flies! Even though my desire is clocked at 1.8Ghz the sensation is running stock 1.5Ghz x2. Can WP7 be that different?
512 MB of RAM: This seems pityfull in todays phones, my old HD2 that! Does WP7 have better memory management than android?
No SD Slot: This is just plain criminal, i have a 32 Gig card and its almost full! Adding a slot could not add that much to the price/Bulk of the device.
Screen Resolution: That lovely big screen was a major attractant to me, But 480x800. 640x960 is becoming the norm with screens nearly a inch smaller in size.
Beloved TomTom: This is more of a general WP7 Gripe. I used TomTom with my old WM6.5 devices, it is hands down the best navigation software. I know android has no TomTom but this would get me back to windows handsets in a flash! I use sat nav for 3-4 hours a day at work, mostly in rural places. Nothing matches TomTom for accuracy or re-routing. Come on TomTom, sort it out!
Please don't take any of this as criticism over the phone. I was seriously tempted when the titan came along. Just me venting my thoughts.
Sorry if i hijacked the thread, just seemed like a good opportunity to ask.
So the big question is, to stay with android or run with WP7?
Have you or any other WP7 users got any thoughts on that?
Regards
Your friendly HTC Titan Moderator
Android To Titan?
original_ganjaman said:
Hi there
This might be a good question(s) for you, as you have come from a android device.
I used to always use Windows phones (back in the days of WM6.5), but the draw of android tempted me. Now i am considering a returning to the the land that is Microsoft. The titan looked like a really good bet for me, but i had the following concerns:
Single core: I know microsoft says there is no real need for dual core phones, but a friend of mine has got a sensation XE, and compared to my desire HD, it flies! Even though my desire is clocked at 1.8Ghz the sensation is running stock 1.5Ghz x2. Can WP7 be that different?
512 MB of RAM: This seems pityfull in todays phones, my old HD2 that! Does WP7 have better memory management than android?
No SD Slot: This is just plain criminal, i have a 32 Gig card and its almost full! Adding a slot could not add that much to the price/Bulk of the device.
Screen Resolution: That lovely big screen was a major attractant to me, But 480x800. 640x960 is becoming the norm with screens nearly a inch smaller in size.
Beloved TomTom: This is more of a general WP7 Gripe. I used TomTom with my old WM6.5 devices, it is hands down the best navigation software. I know android has no TomTom but this would get me back to windows handsets in a flash! I use sat nav for 3-4 hoursa day at work, mostly in rural places. Nothing matches TomTom for accuracy or re-routing. Come on TomTom, sort it out!
Please don't take any of this as criticism over the phone. I was seriously tempted when the titan came along. Just me venting my thoughts.
Sorry if i hijacked the thread, just seemed like a good opportunity to ask.
So the big question is, to stay with android or run with WP7?
Have you or any other WP7 users got any thoughts on that?
Regards
Your friendly HTC Titan Moderator
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi!
I am so glad you asked this!
Probably your question and my answers need to be stickied somewhere, because I have been long time user of WinMo 6 and 6.5 and then Android's so called openness tempted me. I gave it a shot too. Ran gingerbread stock ROM with 1Ghz processor, ran Cyanogenmod 7 as well as custom gingerbread ROMs. Over clock to even 1.3 Ghz make that android pant for breath and oh those force closes! I still get those nightmares about things force closing right when you are trying to show off how cool your phone is with all those apps in it!
So I gathered courage (and money) to jump the android ship even after the reviews saying ICS will make it all better for android. Guess what? I don't regret it at all. I am so glad I made that switch.
Windows Phone 7 - is what professionals can design. Android is what open source can give. I just tweeted this morning about an interesting article that said, why Android will stay sluggish compared iOS and WP for rest of it's life until they do something what Microsoft did - it's in their framework.
They need that huge processor and huge dual cores because they got their framework wrong. The way they manage memory is ridiculous now that I have understood the difference between WP and Android. I know this will make my post long, but I think it's best if I summarize that article:
1) The UI rendering in android isnt done by separate dedicated thread in framework like WP7 or 7.5 does. So the priority of rendering UI is same as anything else on the phone = more memory requirement
2) In WP each view is rendered separately and stored in the memory. However in Android the UI is flattened before rendering. So this makes android to redraw the whole screen elements from scratch = more processing power
3) About memory - I think this is very much a personal preference. I don't sync my documents to my phone, I keep them on the SkyDrive most of the time. The only things that take up my memory is my songs, lots of them. But my requirement is nothing compared to yours. Say roughly 250 songs = 1GB, I will need to have 8000 songs that I listen to. Honestly, by the time I finish listening to these 8000 songs even once, I am sure there will be atleast 200 new songs. So I don't bother with music or storage much. 12GB serves me well.
4) Screen Res - If you are using AMOLED on Android, you will miss it for may be 3 days. If you are using LCD - you won't notice much difference in resolution. It would have been nicer to get higher res as you suggested, but for this price - it's much worth it with this UI!
5) TomTom - you've got to try Bing Maps! Come on, if you are on android and already don't have TomTom, I bet you've settled for something else. So if you can settle for something else on Android, why not on WP? And the market apps are being added, I don't think TomTom is much farther.
After such a lengthy post, I think I should add, that I've used exactly same spec and same size phone i.e. HTC Sensation XL on the side with HTC Titan. Sensation XL runs Android, Titan runs WP7.
I can bet anyone £500, without rooting and overclocking Sensation XL - show me that it works and looks as good as Titan! - It doesn't.
Every evening I try to play with Sensation XL, trying to make myself regret buying WP because I don't have so called 'must have apps' - but that counts for nothing as soon as I see live tiles on WP and think of the flawless working.
Hint: I bought both phones 3 weeks ago. I got 8 force closes and 2 reboots on Sensation XL so far. I haven't got single freeze or reboot on Titan. - see how different WP7 is compared to 6.5?
Sorry, I forgot to add - if you are a phone user whose life depends more on apps than flawless UI, integration and speed - Don't switch from Android. WP will need at least 12-15 months to have even half the apps (good or ****e) any other platform has.
original_ganjaman said:
Hi there
This might be a good question(s) for you, as you have come from a android device.
I used to always use Windows phones (back in the days of WM6.5), but the draw of android tempted me. Now i am considering a returning to the the land that is Microsoft. The titan looked like a really good bet for me, but i had the following concerns:
Single core: I know microsoft says there is no real need for dual core phones, but a friend of mine has got a sensation XE, and compared to my desire HD, it flies! Even though my desire is clocked at 1.8Ghz the sensation is running stock 1.5Ghz x2. Can WP7 be that different?
512 MB of RAM: This seems pityfull in todays phones, my old HD2 that! Does WP7 have better memory management than android?
No SD Slot: This is just plain criminal, i have a 32 Gig card and its almost full! Adding a slot could not add that much to the price/Bulk of the device.
Screen Resolution: That lovely big screen was a major attractant to me, But 480x800. 640x960 is becoming the norm with screens nearly a inch smaller in size.
Beloved TomTom: This is more of a general WP7 Gripe. I used TomTom with my old WM6.5 devices, it is hands down the best navigation software. I know android has no TomTom but this would get me back to windows handsets in a flash! I use sat nav for 3-4 hoursa day at work, mostly in rural places. Nothing matches TomTom for accuracy or re-routing. Come on TomTom, sort it out!
Please don't take any of this as criticism over the phone. I was seriously tempted when the titan came along. Just me venting my thoughts.
Sorry if i hijacked the thread, just seemed like a good opportunity to ask.
So the big question is, to stay with android or run with WP7?
Have you or any other WP7 users got any thoughts on that?
Regards
Your friendly HTC Titan Moderator
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Single core - My experiences with WP7 have gone back to the beginning and the single core has never been an issue. Even with loading all my email, text message, pics, games, and apps that i use. I'm one to reset my phone (and reformat my PC) just to keep it fresh but I haven't had to do that with the Focus from day 1. I can't say the same for my Captivate which, when I compare it to my Focus being both 1GHz processors, had its slow moments and I've reset that a couple times. WP7 has been more responsive at the same single core speeds. To me this became a non-issue based on experience.
RAM - My experience here is the same as with the single core question. I must say, when they built WP7, they did an excellent job with how it handles memory it would seem. As a programmer and project manager myself, I've seen apps just explode over time (been doing this since the late 80's) because of memory requirements or space requirements. It seems that MS has done a good job keeping the overhead down.
No SD Slot - I agree with you 100% here. As someone who isn't into putting all their stuff on the web I also think an SD slot is called for in all of todays phones. Especially when you reach this stage of feature phone that is supposed to be your one-in-all device. Manage what you have and it will be ok but it might be tedious depending on how often you need to change things up.
Screen Resolution - After handling the Focus, the Titan, and the Vivid on AT&T, I would say that this should be a non-issue for most. I was pleasantly surprised at how well the Titan looked on the bigger screen. Side by side, there was no real difference. People might say there is (to a purist techy, yeah) but in using it, there really isn't.
TomTom - There are a couple big names that already have GPS apps for WP7. TomTom will follow shortly I'm sure. Garmin already has theirs as well as others. WP7 is finally getting traction in the real world and companies are starting to get that. I think it was a "wait and see" scenario from a business perspective for most companies but they're starting to realize the market really is bigger than they thought it was going to be.
Hope this helps...
-Cyber
Echo sentiments on memory and cores. I'll add that the best way to manage music is through playlist. I pick albums to sync via playlists on my Focus. Remove an album from the playlist, add a few more, whatever, makes it easier than manually syncing. I also set up auto playlists for recently added and recently favorited music.
GPS, I used the new flavor of Bing Maps and the direction assistance. Pick a destination, it picks the route. The screen goes into a split mode with the upper half a map auto rotating with current direction and the lower half with the next waypoint. Double tap the screen for audio assistance telling you distance, street name and direction. Once you execute the correct turn, the phone confirms you're on the right path with a ding. Just double tap the screen again for the next step spoken to you. Very easy to do while driving with a level of interaction that keeps you on course with out nagging. I loved it.
Single core:
and
512 MB of RAM:
My HD2 runs winmo 6.5 much better than my friend's captivate runs android. Winmo was much leaner and faster (though prone to locking up) and WP7 takes after that, but never locks up. Winmo also uses roughly 150-180MB leaving an excess of memory... my friend is anal retentive about ending processes on android and I don't remember exactly how much, but he always has significantly less memory available than me. WP7 also inherited this good trait. Honestly, the only drawback is I don't think you can play 1080p video with only 1Ghz, but with the wvga resolution that isn't something worth doing anyway.
No SD Slot:
Kind of annoying, but aside from media, my SD card is otherwise entirely filled with cabs and exes and apks... tools not yet available for use on the titan/wp7. The reason there is no SD expansion is because by locking down the file system size they were able to increase performance. If you invest in a larger data plan and the zune market / get the zune music pass, media storage isn't really a concern. You could even set up a home server and just stream your music, or set up playlists on youtube and get the metrotube app, which can load youtube playlists and it still plays the audio from videos while the phone is off (think: music from youtube).
Screen Resolution:
Since there is no HDMI out, resolution is a non issue. WVGA is fine, there is no stretching or pixelation, you'd never even know it was wvga from looking. This saves space as well, as you don't need to waste space with HD videos; if you properly convert all your videos, you save a lot of space and lose no quality.
Beloved TomTom: Garmin has an app, there are other apps, and there are apps to come. Bing works fine. I really don't see the difference between tomtom / garmin or other major brands: they both work fine and those who like one over the other are generally nit picking extremely irrelevant features, or had one bad experience with one and now unfairly judge it as nonfunctional.
WP7 is a new OS, and for a new OS it's doing very well. Android SUCKED when it first came out, but has grown quite well. WP7 will do the same, in both updates and through here, with the hacking / dev community. The base for WP7 is still windows CE, and technically it can support winmo 6 stuff, technically we can do everything we used to on our old winmo phones... when someone hacks that ability in
Here's hoping we can still dual boot with android in some years
original_ganjaman said:
Your friendly HTC Titan Moderator
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Am I misreading this, or is the moderator of the Titan forum not a Titan owner, not even a Windows Phone user?
Wow. That explains so much.
YES you should make the jump! Love my Titan...not sure Android will ever be as smooth and efficient as WP, no matter how much processor and RAM you throw at it.
This device’s brilliance isn’t limited to the hardware either. Windows Phone Mango is really, really good. Nearly nothing about Microsoft’s OS works anything like iOS, while still feeling very fresh and accessible. It’s exactly the opposite of the way that Android normally feels, which is an uglier and slower version of iOS.
Speed is one of the biggest pitfalls that befall Apple’s rival operating systems. Time after time, touch is proven the biggest reason that iOS feels better to use.
At first, people blamed it on specs, or types of touchscreen. But now that phones are all coming with dual-core processors saddled with blazing GPU’s powering mutitouch tech that is potentially just as good as what Apple is running, it’s a different story.
There is simply no excuse for any mobile device not to scroll, zoom and navigate smoothly any more. Period.
It’s crazy to me how many Android devices still fail this simple test, dramatically. The Lumia 800 is a different beast. With a 1.4GHz CPU, underpowered by most modern standards, the scrolling and zooming experience is absolutely flawless.
Menus scroll and flow with well-timed inertia, pinch-to-zoom is brilliant in the browser as well as in apps like Bing Maps. It really is a first class interaction experience that is matched only by the iPhone in terms of smoothness.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From http://www.thenextweb.com/microsoft...device-that-would-make-me-give-up-the-iphone/
drokkon said:
Am I misreading this, or is the moderator of the Titan forum not a Titan owner, not even a Windows Phone user?
Wow. That explains so much.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have not misread, i am not a Titan owner let alone a WP7 user. I have gone through a few OS's now, Theming and developing for them. As of yet i have not tried WP7 (but that might well change)
As of the second comment, it is not helpful. If there is anything i have done that you are not happy with, please feel free to point it out. I try my best to keep everything nice a tidy and keep everyone happy, the great users here in the Titan forum help me out, which i am most grateful for. I do put my time into this free of charge, Its all for the love of this great forum.
Anyway, i am here to moderate not to help with the device itself.
For most of thing i have seen, i think you should have bought the Sensation XL. It is Titan in Android, have almost everything you listed.
But personally, when i chose Windows Phone 7 for another 2 years, i have already kept the idea of no other mobile-based OS. Everyphone got its own optimized hardware for the OS it uses. I would prefer my Titan has the Metro UI instead of a custom build HTC Sense 3.0 .
original_ganjaman said:
You have not misread, i am not a Titan owner let alone a WP7 user. I have gone through a few OS's now, Theming and developing for them. As of yet i have not tried WP7 (but that might well change)
As of the second comment, it is not helpful. If there is anything i have done that you are not happy with, please feel free to point it out. I try my best to keep everything nice a tidy and keep everyone happy, the great users here in the Titan forum help me out, which i am most grateful for. I do put my time into this free of charge, Its all for the love of this great forum.
Anyway, i am here to moderate not to help with the device itself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Give WP7 a try. It might surprise you. I enjoyed flashing ROMs, testing versions of Sense, battery life issues, glitches, incomplete features, app launching, instability, ...wait... no I didn't.
WP7 is the only OS on the market. The others are app launchers with afterthought to social networking and notifications. Metro UI is clean and efficient while still delivering plenty of info with out launching an app.
I used to moderate message boards back when I was an editor and reviewer for a tech site. It isn't easy, so much respect.
HalcYoN-Fuze said:
Give WP7 a try. It might surprise you. I enjoyed flashing ROMs, testing versions of Sense, battery life issues, glitches, incomplete features, app launching, instability, ...wait... no I didn't.
WP7 is the only OS on the market. The others are app launchers with afterthought to social networking and notifications. Metro UI is clean and efficient while still delivering plenty of info with out launching an app.
I used to moderate message boards back when I was an editor and reviewer for a tech site. It isn't easy, so much respect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am most tempted by WP7. Just waiting for my ideal phone. Thought it might be the titan, but the lack of a SD slot is a real issue for me. But i am sure the twelve gig you get is fine for a lot of users.
Thanks for the support. It is much appreciated.
Peace!
original_ganjaman said:
You have not misread, i am not a Titan owner let alone a WP7 user. I have gone through a few OS's now, Theming and developing for them. As of yet i have not tried WP7 (but that might well change)
As of the second comment, it is not helpful. If there is anything i have done that you are not happy with, please feel free to point it out. I try my best to keep everything nice a tidy and keep everyone happy, the great users here in the Titan forum help me out, which i am most grateful for. I do put my time into this free of charge, Its all for the love of this great forum.
Anyway, i am here to moderate not to help with the device itself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're totally right. I didn't mean any offense - you're doing a bang-up job, and this Titan forum is great.
I confused this forum with the generic WP7 forums, in which EVERY thread devolves into a WP7 vs. Android debate. It's tiresome to the point of being entirely counter-productive.
As a moderator, do you think you could talk to the "powers that be" and request a few things?
First off, not all of the WP7 devices, 2nd gen specifically, have their own forums yet, even thought they've been on the market for a while now. Focus Flash and Focus S users are left to post in the 1st gen/original Focus forum. Here's a list of WP7 devices.
Also, the drop down at the top of every forum screen that says "Devices by OS or Manufacturer" only has Android and "Windows Mobile" listed as OSes. If you click on the latter, the Windows Phone devices appear at the very bottom of a tediously long list of old WinMo handsets. It would be more efficient (and more CORRECT) if the "Windows Phone" OS were split from the "Windows Mobile" OS.
Sorry to hijack your thread, and my apologies once again for my counterproductive comment. I don't have much experience with Android, but my thoughts on the Titan specifically may be found here.
I switched from HTC Desire to Titan yesterday. So far so good Everything looks and feels nice and fancy
original_ganjaman said:
I have created this thread after asking this question in a different thread. drupad2drupad suggested i create a thread and sticky it. I agree, thought it might be useful to others. Hope its helpful.
I used to always use Windows phones (back in the days of WM6.5), but the draw of android tempted me. Now i am considering a returning to the the land that is Microsoft. The titan looked like a really good bet for me, but i had the following concerns:
Single core: I know microsoft says there is no real need for dual core phones, but a friend of mine has got a sensation XE, and compared to my desire HD, it flies! Even though my desire is clocked at 1.8Ghz the sensation is running stock 1.5Ghz x2. Can WP7 be that different?
512 MB of RAM: This seems pityfull in todays phones, my old HD2 that! Does WP7 have better memory management than android?
No SD Slot: This is just plain criminal, i have a 32 Gig card and its almost full! Adding a slot could not add that much to the price/Bulk of the device.
Screen Resolution: That lovely big screen was a major attractant to me, But 480x800. 640x960 is becoming the norm with screens nearly a inch smaller in size.
Beloved TomTom: This is more of a general WP7 Gripe. I used TomTom with my old WM6.5 devices, it is hands down the best navigation software. I know android has no TomTom but this would get me back to windows handsets in a flash! I use sat nav for 3-4 hours a day at work, mostly in rural places. Nothing matches TomTom for accuracy or re-routing. Come on TomTom, sort it out!
Please don't take any of this as criticism over the phone. I was seriously tempted when the titan came along. Just me venting my thoughts.
Sorry if i hijacked the thread, just seemed like a good opportunity to ask.
So the big question is, to stay with android or run with WP7?
Have you or any other WP7 users got any thoughts on that?
Regards
Your friendly HTC Titan Moderator
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) and 2)
HTC Titan is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaast !! ^_____^
I understand what you are saying. I had doubts too ...
1.5 Ghz and 512Mb of Ram grants on titan the faster smartphone I experienced so far.
3) Here you have a point. I would have appreciated an SD slot too. I didn't see any Windows Phone 7 with SD card so far. Could this be a way to fight piracy ? (to force people using zune to trasfer files? really dunno).
4) Trust me, the screen is amazing, you won't argue about resolution or anything else every time I turn up my Titan all that I think is "WoW!!"
5) There are several alternatives to Tom Tom. Some are free, some are not, some are 'hidden' ... I hear strange voices in the wind whispering " ... use nokia drive ... "
Microsoft of nowdays keeps on giving us high quality products ...
So : YES, buy a Titan over any Android and enjoy the experience
dragonide said:
1) and 2)
HTC Titan is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaast !! ^_____^
I understand what you are saying. I had doubts too ...
1.5 Ghz and 512Mb of Ram grants on titan the faster smartphone I experienced so far.
3) Here you have a point. I would have appreciated an SD slot too. I didn't see any Windows Phone 7 with SD card so far. Could this be a way to fight piracy ? (to force people using zune to trasfer files? really dunno).
4) Trust me, the screen is amazing, you won't argue about resolution or anything else every time I turn up my Titan all that I think is "WoW!!"
5) There are several alternatives to Tom Tom. Some are free, some are not, some are 'hidden' ... I hear strange voices in the wind whispering " ... use nokia drive ... "
Microsoft of nowdays keeps on giving us high quality products ...
So : YES, buy a Titan over any Android and enjoy the experience
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used a Samsung focus. You could add a MicroSD to it. We were effectively able to upgrade both of our Samsung Focus' with a 32gb MicroSD card. The phones had 40gb of memory. Very nice. Be warned though, that when you try to remove the card and reset the phone, the MicroSD card is locked and cannot be used by anything else, EXCEPT your Windows phone. Yes, it locks the MicroSD card so that it cannot be read by any other device.
drokkon said:
You're totally right. I didn't mean any offense - you're doing a bang-up job, and this Titan forum is great.
I confused this forum with the generic WP7 forums, in which EVERY thread devolves into a WP7 vs. Android debate. It's tiresome to the point of being entirely counter-productive.
As a moderator, do you think you could talk to the "powers that be" and request a few things?
First off, not all of the WP7 devices, 2nd gen specifically, have their own forums yet, even thought they've been on the market for a while now. Focus Flash and Focus S users are left to post in the 1st gen/original Focus forum. Here's a list of WP7 devices.
Also, the drop down at the top of every forum screen that says "Devices by OS or Manufacturer" only has Android and "Windows Mobile" listed as OSes. If you click on the latter, the Windows Phone devices appear at the very bottom of a tediously long list of old WinMo handsets. It would be more efficient (and more CORRECT) if the "Windows Phone" OS were split from the "Windows Mobile" OS.
Sorry to hijack your thread, and my apologies once again for my counterproductive comment. I don't have much experience with Android, but my thoughts on the Titan specifically may be found here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Firstly apology accepted, no hard feelings and thanks for the positive feedback
On the first part of your question, i do agree with you the forums are not up when the phones are available. I have had many problems in other forums because of this (Focus S being one of them). But with the sheer number of devices that get released at one time, its hard to keep up and know which ones will be popular. There is a thread somewhere explaining it, but i cant remember where i read it now, sorry!
The second point is a difficult one, i do tend to agree with you. But what about the other builds of android? They could be thought of as different OS, So we get a Froyo, Gingerbread, Honeycomb, Ice Cream Sandwich (not counting the ones before that) So the OS list might get a little complicated. And before you shoot me down saying there not different OS's. Other Android users might totally disagree. Its all a balance of keeping everybody Happy. As i said i personally agree with you, but not so sure others would.
What i will do is post your comment in the MOD section. See what sort of comeback i get and let you know.
Thanks for your feedback and if you have any more questions/issues, please feel free to ask i will do my best to sort them.
Glad you are enjoying the HTC Titan Forum
PEACE!!
rvbarton said:
I used a Samsung focus. You could add a MicroSD to it. We were effectively able to upgrade both of our Samsung Focus' with a 32gb MicroSD card. The phones had 40gb of memory. Very nice. Be warned though, that when you try to remove the card and reset the phone, the MicroSD card is locked and cannot be used by anything else, EXCEPT your Windows phone. Yes, it locks the MicroSD card so that it cannot be read by any other device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did read about the locked SD card. Sounds like locking you down to zune is what microsoft wants. Not a massive issue, i would assume its still easy to use zune to transfer your music/video?
original_ganjaman said:
I did read about the locked SD card. Sounds like locking you down to zune is what microsoft wants. Not a massive issue, i would assume its still easy to use zune to transfer your music/video?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
transferring through zune is very easy and i love the interface, i wish it would be faster though...
there are solutions for unlocking the sd card. the most common one is to format it using a nokia symbian phone. there is also an app made by xbmod which unlocks the sd card but i don't know if it works on any device. i used it on my htc hd2 running yukixda & xbmod's "back to the future" wp7 rom.
however, unlocking the card won't give the ability to transfer usable files to the phone. the wp7 partition has a special format type which cannot be read (yet). unlocking the sd card is necessary if you want to:
- partition your sd card and use part of it as removable storage space. again, this was made possible by xbmod on the hd2.
or
- replace it with another one and transfer the wp7 partition to the new card. also, you will be able to delete the wp7 partition from the old card and format it to be usable again on another device.
Ok so I should be getting my Titan by the End of Next Week and am curious about the Navigation on the phone. With my Android phone all I have to do is cache some of the maps zones using google maps than I can turn off data completely and just have the GPS chip work it's magic. So I guess the question is does the built in maps do this on WP7 and is there a way to completely turn off Data and only have Wi-Fi running so I don't run into overages as I cannot afford a higher tiered plan than the 200mb one. If not I will most likely wind up selling the phone or returning it as I cannot have my Data running my bill through the roof.
try turn by turn nav. You can cache your route at home over WiFi before you set off