Hi all,
Please give any opinions all very welcome
I messed up at school and have done everything the hard way self taught in everything. Ive been in the security systems field for 10 years.
I went back to college 10 years ago at night and did C++ , it was supposed to be a foundation course but it was a 2 year course crammed into a year and had to be a job related field for 2 years min, i have never done it before but i told the lecturer who said i was on the wrong course that i would sit in the corner and catch up, i caught up in a few weeks and finished the year with a 98% distinction, he said he couldnt believe it and i should to a diploma. i couldnt as it was full time and i had a mortgage and family.
Things are different now and i have a year for study.
My question is should i continue with C++ or start and concentrate on Java & linux
Ideally i want to be able to write apps that can earn me money, if this isnt possible initially (after a year) then use what ive learnt to work part time as linux or java system admin/ dev
Thanks
Barks
barkx said:
Things are different now and i have a year for study.
My question is should i continue with C++ or start and concentrate on Java & linux
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Depends on the stuff you prefer to code. If you're more into Linux, Embedded System adn Real Time OSes then you should stick with C/C++. You should learn the new stull though like the boost library (it were popular nowadays) especially you should learn to use boost::shared_ptr which free a C++ programmer from the burden of manual memory menagment. You should also get a book on modern C++ programming (10 years ago C++ code looked more like C with classes now it's more Java like with a big focus on parterns, good OO design, boost, stl).
If you want to code enterprise Web Applications, PC applications or Android then go with Java (although C++ is also usful for phone programming).
barkx said:
Ideally i want to be able to write apps that can earn me money, if this isnt possible initially (after a year) then use what ive learnt to work part time as linux or java system admin/ dev
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Click to collapse
Really depends on the place you live in and how many job offers there are. In some places the demand for programmer is so big now that you can get hired with the stuff you already know (10 years in the sec industry and C++ knowladge). My company for example hires people that know a thing or two about computers and programming and teaches the rest (you get like a year to learn the ropes or you're out). The only thing requires is to be a fast learner, get the job done and to have a personality that allowes you to work with others.
buggs2k said:
Depends on the stuff you prefer to code. If you're more into Linux, Embedded System adn Real Time OSes then you should stick with C/C++. You should learn the new stull though like the boost library (it were popular nowadays) especially you should learn to use boost::shared_ptr which free a C++ programmer from the burden of manual memory menagment. You should also get a book on modern C++ programming (10 years ago C++ code looked more like C with classes now it's more Java like with a big focus on parterns, good OO design, boost, stl).
If you want to code enterprise Web Applications, PC applications or Android then go with Java (although C++ is also usful for phone programming).
Really depends on the place you live in and how many job offers there are. In some places the demand for programmer is so big now that you can get hired with the stuff you already know (10 years in the sec industry and C++ knowladge). My company for example hires people that know a thing or two about computers and programming and teaches the rest (you get like a year to learn the ropes or you're out). The only thing requires is to be a fast learner, get the job done and to have a personality that allowes you to work with others.
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521 views and finally a reply... thanks for taking the time mate, much appreciated :good:
barks
barkx said:
521 views and finally a reply... thanks for taking the time mate, much appreciated :good:
barks
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No problem Take care.
Being a good developer and a good sys admin are I would say, two quite different things. Personally I would spend some time working out which you *really* want to do, and follow that path.
If you're going to write apps, you're not gonna be able to do it in C++, it's that simple. Sure there's the NDK but the UI has to be in Java anyway, and it's (in most cases) unnecessary to write the app in C++ anyway. If you're writing something where you really need to be closer to the hardware then fine, but for normal apps/games it just doesn't make sense.
What I would recommend is start writing some simple apps - firstly you'll see if you like doing it, and secondly you'll learn so much. Reading about stuff only gets you so far! There are great resources online for tutorials, or like stackoverflow where you can ask questions.
Making money from apps in my opinion is more about the app and the idea than the implementation. I think it's pretty difficult to write an app that actually generates any revenue without a great idea or great game concept.
Related
Ok so I am learning coding Android apps. I wanted to know if learning math helps in anything other than developing math related apps. I have seen seen cube live wallpaper code and from what i see i think math is required for animation.
But still I would like to know if my math should be strong for this development.
Thanks a lot
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It really depends on what kind of an application you are developing.
You don't need to be great at Math to implement something like a spinning cube. For this specific kind of application you'd need to have some knowledge of matrices and transformations in 3d. Even if you don't know the math behind something, you can always learn it
So, if you are considering developing something that you think needs a good knowledge of some mathematical concepts, I'd say just get to developing it without worrying too much about what knowledge you need. If and when you find yourself stuck on something because you don't understand a mathematical concept, it is at this point that you should worry about learning it.
Another way of looking at this is "We are programmers, not mathematicians".
There are many programmers out there who use math libraries, which abstracts all of the complex mathematics behind the code. Hence allowing them to focus on the application they are developing.
Well, I am a lawyer and not a coder, though I like math very much, I can code in bash, some python, basic skills of c, c++ and java. In Italy all the coders who are 35 or older are able to code in several languages and environments and use math a lot, while younger coders are usually focused on one or two languages and don't use math very much. That's the trend that has been reported by my sister's husband, who's a Linux developer.
Just think that a young engineer of his team isn't able to make simple bash scripts to test a patch written in c++ by creating a couple of symbolic links.
The world more and more requires people highly specialized, but widely ignorant....
My suggestion is always to be curious, because math is the world itself and even when you put in your wifi mask a stupid sequence of numbers 192.xxx and so on, that's math.
I hope I wasn't a bore, but I like to know what is hidden behind what I do
The_R said:
It really depends on what kind of an application you are developing.
You don't need to be great at Math to implement something like a spinning cube. For this specific kind of application you'd need to have some knowledge of matrices and transformations in 3d. Even if you don't know the math behind something, you can always learn it
So, if you are considering developing something that you think needs a good knowledge of some mathematical concepts, I'd say just get to developing it without worrying too much about what knowledge you need. If and when you find yourself stuck on something because you don't understand a mathematical concept, it is at this point that you should worry about learning it.
Another way of looking at this is "We are programmers, not mathematicians".
There are many programmers out there who use math libraries, which abstracts all of the complex mathematics behind the code. Hence allowing them to focus on the application they are developing.
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Thanks a lot. I will do that. Learn something after I am stuck. That's the best approach I think personally.
lucaoldb said:
Well, I am a lawyer and not a coder, though I like math very much, I can code in bash, some python, basic skills of c, c++ and java. In Italy all the coders who are 35 or older are able to code in several languages and environments and use math a lot, while younger coders are usually focused on one or two languages and don't use math very much. That's the trend that has been reported by my sister's husband, who's a Linux developer.
Just think that a young engineer of his team isn't able to make simple bash scripts to test a patch written in c++ by creating a couple of symbolic links.
The world more and more requires people highly specialized, but widely ignorant....
My suggestion is always to be curious, because math is the world itself and even when you put in your wifi mask a stupid sequence of numbers 192.xxx and so on, that's math.
I hope I wasn't a bore, but I like to know what is hidden behind what I do
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I agree we should be curious but I think if I start learning at once I may soon get bored. That's my opinion though. But I agree after sometime knowing more is better.
I was wondering if anyone is doing this. I have no experience when it comes to programming (at all) but I'm a quick learner and willing to learn when it comes to extra money
I know there are some tricks like pay $50-100 to some developer to create an app exclusively for you and then you sell it on the market and earn cash from it, but I don't really feel like using someone else work for that. I wanna create my own stuff.
I've noticed that some live wallpapers sell over 100k copies over a year, for about $1, that is about $100.000. Which is A LOT more than what I earn per year. And I believe it doesn't take a long time to create a nice live wallpaper. On top of that you can create a bunch of other stuff and earn even more.
So, I wanna know, how hard is it to learn how to create live wallpapers or smaller games/apps for Android platform? Does it work? Is there anything I should know?
I'm currently in the process of learning Android development (apps, compiling ROMs, etc) and I had absolutely no experience in programming before. I've always been a big computer nerd though, so learning programming came pretty easy to me since I had a good understanding of computers and have been using them since a very young age. (I'm now 18)
If you want to learn how to make apps, there are a lot of resources out there to help you learn to write android apps. Here are some of my bookmarks for android apps -
Android App Development Tutorial
Google - Android Training
Some great youtube tutorials
Also if you get serious about it I highly recommend buying a book called Android How to Program. It's a great book and is really helping me gain a much better understanding of the underlying code that makes an app.
Thanks for the input
I'm still looking for the business point of view, as if this is worth doing as side job/part time job..
well, i am also learning how the things work in the android world, and ive made a few soundboards just for testing. But yea its possible i think everyone can think of an app the other thing is to make it. But it looks like everyone is now in the android business and by the time i actually get good with the software and things there might not be a spot for me
TH90 said:
well, i am also learning how the things work in the android world, and ive made a few soundboards just for testing. But yea its possible i think everyone can think of an app the other thing is to make it. But it looks like everyone is now in the android business and by the time i actually get good with the software and things there might not be a spot for me
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There is always place for creativity.
Recently I've been looking into checking out this online school for Android development. My question is to any and all developers is a school like this worth the time and effort do learn how to develop because it something I'm interested in learning how to do I just don't know if something like this is actually going to benefit me in any way.
sent from my DNA
Well if this is your first time programming then yes. It opens your mind in a new way.... Pay to learn? No. Go and learn java. Then android development will be easy to just pick up. For roms it's much easier to learn just picking apart mods and looking up xda tutorials
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I also had a similar question like this. Right now I'm looking to go into coding and developing as a profession. In my high school I picked my classes for next year and two classes I picked were computer sciences a and b. The course description said learning how to code in Java. So this would help with android? Obviously it will probably be vary basic but I figured it would look good on a college application and what not.
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I believe you need to learn at least Java and C programming language.
This thread has some usefull links http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2056596
This is kind of a big discussion and not as simple as you think.
There are some really important and big concepts you need to know for development of any kind - not just Android:
1. Theories - nearly all programming languages apply the same theories, they just have different syntax.
2. Data structures and algorithms will make you extremely efficient and powerful in coding.
That being said, I started off as a Software Engineer major, only to find out that I really don't care much for core coding - I learned that I loved scripting (Python, LUA, Shell, etc).
Scripting is different because instead of manipulating the core system, you work with what other software engineers have done and code as if you are writing a script for a play. There are SDKs that take advantage of scripting such as Corona SDK.
Either way, the best way to go (IMHO):
1. C programming
2. Python
3. C++
4. Data Structures and Algorithms
5. Java and or what ever other language you want to learn.
most online/regular universities will teach along this schedule I believe. Best of luck to you! I hope this helped a little.
Python won't help them at all with android
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Dri94 said:
Python won't help them at all with android
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Maybe not directly, but if he's learning how to program from scratch, python is a gentle way to get introduced to OOP and other programming concepts useful for java.
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Eriknors, so is the info helpful? I can't wait for your new pron app with one-legged women.
wakkadojo said:
Maybe not directly, but if he's learning how to program from scratch, python is a gentle way to get introduced to OOP and other programming concepts useful for java.
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Honestly it'd be easier to just start with java. The basics are pretty simple to understand and there are great tutorials for it.
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orangechoochoo said:
Eriknors, so is the info helpful? I can't wait for your new pron app with one-legged women.
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Honestly I'm still not clear as where to start. C programming, C++ isn't that the same thing? I've d/l an introduction to C++ but I feel like a guy who can't read walking into a library with this stuff. As much as I wanna learn android developing it seems like all I can find on all these topics throws u into the pool with no floaties and expects you to just know how to swim.
I've always thought I've been pretty knowledgeable on android aside from the whole developing aspect. I'm always the go to guy when it comes to an issue with my friends phones eg: rooting or trouble shooting. But after trying to see what all goes into developing I feel like they must feel when they ask me questions.
sent from my DNA
eriknors said:
Honestly I'm still not clear as where to start. C programming, C++ isn't that the same thing? I've d/l an introduction to C++ but I feel like a guy who can't read walking into a library with this stuff. As much as I wanna learn android developing it seems like all I can find on all these topics throws u into the pool with no floaties and expects you to just know how to swim.
I've always thought I've been pretty knowledgeable on android aside from the whole developing aspect. I'm always the go to guy when it comes to an issue with my friends phones eg: rooting or trouble shooting. But after trying to see what all goes into developing I feel like they must feel when they ask me questions.
sent from my DNA
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Start with java. Simple as that. Java is an easy language. It's what android is based off of. Don't worry about c for now. There are many java lessons online for free also. Download eclipse as the ide. It's great for beginners and explains things for you when a problem arises which helps alot
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Hey, i'm a cs student so in my opinon the order of language is best if you learn.
1. Intro to programing aka Intro to Computer Science (with C++ or python)
2. Data Structures (with C++ or python)
3. Object Oriented Programing (withJava)
3.5 learn some java api for Android
If you are really willing to learn by yourself, MIT puts up it's lectures so you can follow along and maybe post questions on a forum for learners?
open course ware(free mit lectures): http://goo.gl/BXpY
good luck!
atishpatel2012 said:
Hey, i'm a cs student so in my opinon the order of language is best if you learn.
1/2. C++/python (i just did C++ but i understood it really easily so i stuck with it. (just now learning python))
3. Java
If you are really willing to learn by yourself, MIT puts up it's lectures so you can follow along and maybe post questions on a forum for learners?
open course ware(free mit lectures): http://goo.gl/BXpY
good luck!
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Both one and two don't pertain to android however
*source, im cs student also
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Dri94 said:
Both one and two don't pertain to android however
*source, im cs student also
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Yes they don't pertain to android but learning java from point 0 does not really help understand programing really well. 1/2 help people understand basics of programing then taking something like data structures helps learn more strategies to make program efficient. After you have those steps covered, learning about objects makes sense. You shouldn't start learning about objects off the start because then you'd be like wtf i'm lost or not know exactly what you are doing. correct? Java also doesn't let the user know anything about memory. if i'm not correct then i guess a lot of colleges need to rethink the way they teach cs eh?
but thank you. I will edit my post to include data structures.
atishpatel2012 said:
Yes they don't pertain to android but learning java from point 0 does not really help understand programing really well. 1/2 help people understand basics of programing then taking something like data structures helps learn more strategies to make program efficient. After you have those steps covered, learning about objects makes sense. You shouldn't start learning about objects off the start because then you'd be like wtf i'm lost or not know exactly what you are doing. correct? Java also doesn't let the user know anything about memory. if i'm not correct then i guess a lot of colleges need to rethink the way they teach cs eh?
but thank you. I will edit my post to include data structures.
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1, teaching someone programming for cs is completely different than teaching someone who just wants to program android apps.
2, in the past couple of years a lot of colleges have started teaching java first, because it is actually a good starting point.
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Bigandrewgold said:
1, teaching someone programming for cs is completely different than teaching someone who just wants to program android apps.
2, in the past couple of years a lot of colleges have started teaching java first, because it is actually a good starting point.
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Mine included. Data structures is actually sophomore year for us. We learn java for a year first, making our own data typesn such
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Bigandrewgold said:
1, teaching someone programming for cs is completely different than teaching someone who just wants to program android apps.
2, in the past couple of years a lot of colleges have started teaching java first, because it is actually a good starting point.
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Yes, my teachers debated on why that was and wasn't a good option..and the first thing that pops up is java takes care of way too many things. if you do that, the people who learn from java get super confused when they go to other language. Its the same reason beginners don't use IDEs like eclipse because it does half the work for you... also teaching someone cs makes them a much better programer...and the first two courses are basically for most engineers...and for people learning coding...
think about it. you start with basic coding like loops..then you are like what now? what if i want a big program that is fast and memory efficient when dealing with bigger data...well you need data structures...okay cool now what? i can make a program that will run once or so and process information...well what if i want to write a giant program that has multiple things happening independent of the other.
well objects would be cool cause they can hold their own information...object oriented programing bam...now i can basically make any program/app with those skills if you try (i guess AI would be hard but thats a higher level CS topic)
if you just know java and Android's api, its not going to help you build your own program...syntax isn't everything
btw i'm not being sassy or mad. i really enjoy this debate
atishpatel2012 said:
Yes, my teachers debated on why that was and wasn't a good option..and the first thing that pops up is java takes care of way too many things. if you do that, the people who learn from java get super confused when they go to other language. Its the same reason beginners don't use IDEs like eclipse because it does half the work for you... also teaching someone cs makes them a much better programer...and the first two courses are basically for most engineers...and for people learning coding...
think about it. you start with basic coding like loops..then you are like what now? what if i want a big program that is fast and memory efficient when dealing with bigger data...well you need data structures...okay cool now what? i can make a program that will run once or so and process information...well what if i want to write a giant program that has multiple things happening independent of the other.
well objects would be cool cause they can hold their own information...object oriented programing bam...now i can basically make any program/app with those skills if you try (i guess AI would be hard but thats a higher level CS topic)
if you just know java and Android's api, its not going to help you build your own program...syntax isn't everything
btw i'm not being sassy or mad. i really enjoy this debate
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Click to collapse
Cs would definitely be better if he was trying to code graphic intense or heavy programs. But most likely he will start basic. I liked starting with eclipse because the program kept me from making those really simple mistakes that take hours to find (forgetting a closing parentheses and such... <-- see what i did there lol .. But no really. Learning methods and how to build data types isn't that hard either. May be confusing at first glance but princeton has there book online and so is the complete FIT java 1002 course. Which teaches all the concepts like recursion, bubble sort, selection sort n more... While i do recommend he learn data structures. I think that those who can't handle jumping into java aren't going to be great jumping in cs later in the courses.... Lol no worries i like debates too
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Dri94 said:
Cs would definitely be better if he was trying to code graphic intense or heavy programs. But most likely he will start basic. I liked starting with eclipse because the program kept me from making those really simple mistakes that take hours to find (forgetting a closing parentheses and such... <-- see what i did there lol .. But no really. Learning methods and how to build data types isn't that hard either. May be confusing at first glance but princeton has there book online and so is the complete FIT java 1002 course. Which teaches all the concepts like recursion, bubble sort, selection sort n more... While i do recommend he learn data structures. I think that those who can't handle jumping into java aren't going to be great jumping in cs later in the courses.... Lol no worries i like debates too
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i see what you did there
Not using IDEs is part of the experience of learning! using text based editor that highlights stuff would be much better...think about it like teaching kids multiplication with calculators when they first learn. its not good. when they to something they need to do mental math in, they suck at it. Your intro class should probably not use an IDE in my opinion. You are correct if the op just wants to make a simple app once or twice, but i assumed the op actually wanted to learn programing and making good apps. I guess we'd need the op to clarify. I don't agree with you on the java statement. If you want to get a deeper understanding of what java does behind the scenes, you need to know about pointers and classes and objects beforehand. Yes you can just try to learn java and do stuff other people do and try to modify things, but if you don't want to waste a bunch of time getting frustrated and settling for lesser things because you don't understand how things work in the language, you can just go for java as first language...I guess our debate is moot unless we know what the op is looking for. proper programing or some dirty programing to use for a smaller task. i'm curious. did you find it hard to get into c++ if you learned java first? i'd think most people would get annoyed cause java takes care of so much even though it is bytecode thus slower.
btw i'm ironically in my java class right now xD
Your best bet is to go beyond that. Anyone can make a rom, build a kernel, or even a AOSP build. Tons and tons of people build new kernels for their home boxes every day. It just takes time to learn how to deal with the compiling errors, and fix the bugs in your new kernel. Anyone that can use winzip can build a rom.
What we need are people with the skills to tear down locked devices and make them unlockable.
Hello,
First things first, thank you for clicking on the link.
I am a computer science major about 1/3 of the way through my educational career. I have been exploring opportunities each summer through internships and volunteerism how to be a better programmer and become more pragmatic in my approach. Recently, I have drawn up ideas for a UX design concept. Obviously, since I am a noob developer and know nothing about GUI (my classes in school completely skip over this section and it has always interested me). The most I have done was take a data structures and algorithms class which is like intermediate java. I have html experience as well and just started css course in code academy.
I figured this would be the best place to ask since it is a pretty large community of well-versed developers; not just for android but for the windows 8 and apple platforms as well.
What books, websites, mentors do you recommend I learn from in order to enhance my skillset so that I may implement these design concepts I have come up with. Honestly, they are all ideas on paper right now. I want to even slightly implement them so any help is appreciated. Thank you in advance for your time.
Grandadd said:
Hello,
First things first, thank you for clicking on the link.
I am a computer science major about 1/3 of the way through my educational career. I have been exploring opportunities each summer through internships and volunteerism how to be a better programmer and become more pragmatic in my approach. Recently, I have drawn up ideas for a UX design concept. Obviously, since I am a noob developer and know nothing about GUI (my classes in school completely skip over this section and it has always interested me). The most I have done was take a data structures and algorithms class which is like intermediate java. I have html experience as well and just started css course in code academy.
I figured this would be the best place to ask since it is a pretty large community of well-versed developers; not just for android but for the windows 8 and apple platforms as well.
What books, websites, mentors do you recommend I learn from in order to enhance my skillset so that I may implement these design concepts I have come up with. Honestly, they are all ideas on paper right now. I want to even slightly implement them so any help is appreciated. Thank you in advance for your time.
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I would suggest you try Human-Computer Interaction on coursera. Its a free course conducted by a professor from Stanford through the coursera platform. It'll give you a basic understanding of UX, UI and interaction. The course may feel a bit rushed because the assignments may take some time to do. This of course, depends on individuals so some people may not feel rushed and some may feel they need more than the allocated time. It takes about 9 weeks to complete. The latest offering just finished but there should be another one being offered in september or so.
This course is not a certified course and will not gain you credit though. Even so, I feel its one of the best courses on coursera. I know i gained a lot from it. You could read up about it and use the "watchlist" feature so you'll know when the next offering is. Here's the link:
coursera.org/course/hci
As the title says I'm a Pre-med Biology Major thinking of double majoring in computer science (purely because of my new profound love for android and the way it intuitively becomes a big tool of my life.) As a junior moving into higher level physics and bio classes. Could I manage coding classes as well. I'm a pretty good student, 3.1 GPA. Is it even necessary to get university lecture on the material, or can it be self taught? I've always had a knack for computers and was upgrading hardware on a brand new Windows ME system when I was like 8-9. Yeah it exists, Google it lol.
Bottom line, where do I start? I think if Organic Chemistry II doesn't do me in, I might have a fighting chance.
Suggestions? Languages to learn?
Thanks,
Edit: I'm really proficient with the adobe suite. Any perks with that?
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not sure what its like in the states, but in Australia pretty much all university computer science courses teach you Java first, then use that as a basis for more advanced subjects. Which is handy as Android apps in particular are built using the Java framework.
If you want to get into Android then take Java. I know you can build apps with C++ as well but Java is a lot more common.
I think any graphics tool skills will be useful if you are creating your own apps. If you are an android programmer for a development house then you would have a graphics team doing that work for you.
I say learn Java to start out, its the main language for just about every android app/game. And I too have a love for science (chemistry, biology)
And computers.
Nothing should stop you from learning, and nothing should stop you from thinking freely. Do what you love!
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Get your first degree and then move on to the second if you wish. If you jump around too much, some unexpected life event may come and you will be stuck with a whole bunch of credits and not much to show for it.
Unlike most other fields, computer science and IT is actually mostly self taught. This is the one field that traditional university isn't a necessity and thats why there's so many certifications and phenomenal self study resources. So if you're interested, start reading up.
That being said, I would be careful with your choice with a Biology degree. Dont get me wrong, its a totally different story if you live and breathe medicine and are 100% committed on pursuing medical school. However, if you dont go the MD route, a Biology degree in the real world won't get you very far. I've know plenty of people with Pre-Med degrees who are back in school a second time cuz they can barely find a job.
Just a few things to think about....