Hi,
I just installed Viperone 2.0.0. and am now experiencing slow boot times. I now realize that I should have installed the newer firmware.However I am having trouble. But as far as I can tell I am already on the newest firmware which is 1.54.401.5. Is this correct? I have only been in the Android camp about a month so I am still learning.
But I have unlocked the bootloader, rooted, s-off, and flashed a few roms mostly from following tutorials from Sakitech on youtube. So I have a fairly good understanding of the process but I am still a beginner.
Adk_Mailman said:
Hi,
I just installed Viperone 2.0.0. and am now experiencing slow boot times. I now realize that I should have installed the newer firmware.However I am having trouble. But as far as I can tell I am already on the newest firmware which is 1.54.401.5. Is this correct? I have only been in the Android camp about a month so I am still learning.
But I have unlocked the bootloader, rooted, s-off, and flashed a few roms mostly from following tutorials from Sakitech on youtube. So I have a fairly good understanding of the process but I am still a beginner.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the firmware for the 4.4.2 update I believe. If your rom is based on 4.4.3, you need 2.2.X.X firmware that is on a lot of threads. Look for Android Revolution HD thread, that one has the link to firmware as well. That should take care of it. Try updating firmware multiple times if it doesn't take it first time.
Adk_Mailman said:
as far as I can tell I am already on the newest firmware which is 1.54.401.5.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is not even the newest AT&T software version, the latest is 1.58. In any case, you need 2.22 based firmware, as any 1.XX base will lead to long boot times (as you have experienced) as well as possible broken WiFi and Bluetooth. There is actually no "official" 2.22 firmware, but the 2.22.1504 was released for the US Developer's Edition (same phone as AT&T version, aside from branding).
Follow instructions here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=54408500&postcount=9592
Or here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/att-htc-one-m8/development/att-4-4-3-2-22-1540-3-debloated-sense-6-t2837365
This is the one I actually used (and great instructions), as I wanted to try the ROM anyway.
redpoint73 said:
That is not even the newest AT&T software version, the latest is 1.58. In any case, you need 2.22 based firmware, as any 1.XX base will lead to long boot times (as you have experienced) as well as possible broken WiFi and Bluetooth. There is actually no "official" 2.22 firmware, but the 2.22.1504 was released for the US Developer's Edition (same phone as AT&T version, aside from branding).
Follow instructions here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=54408500&postcount=9592
Or here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/att-htc-one-m8/development/att-4-4-3-2-22-1540-3-debloated-sense-6-t2837365
This is the one I actually used (and great instructions), as I wanted to try the ROM anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey thanks a lot. I will do this when I have some time. Still somewhat nervous so I like to take my time.
Sure thing man. Here is a detailed write-up on flashing firmware:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/htc-one-m8/development/progress-fuu-m8-t2813792
Here is the link to firmwares:
http://xda7.androidrevolution.org/db_mirror/Firmware/index.php?dir=HTC/HTC_One_M8/
2.22.401.4 is the latest firmware I think that is mentioned on here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2694917
Hope that helps.
noobsquared said:
Sure thing man. Here is a detailed write-up on flashing firmware:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/htc-one-m8/development/progress-fuu-m8-t2813792
Here is the link to firmwares:
http://xda7.androidrevolution.org/db_mirror/Firmware/index.php?dir=HTC/HTC_One_M8/
2.22.401.4 is the latest firmware I think that is mentioned on here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2694917
Hope that helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay thank's a lot everyone. Apparently there are many seeking the same info. Team Venom just issued a complete guide to accomplish the new firmware install. I guess they were getting flooded with requests.
It is not advised to flash euro firmware on US devices
Adk_Mailman said:
Okay thank's a lot everyone. Apparently there are many seeking the same info. Team Venom just issued a complete guide to accomplish the new firmware install. I guess they were getting flooded with requests.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
noobsquared said:
2.22.401.4 is the latest firmware I think that is mentioned on here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2694917
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the international or European firmware, and as Wonders_Never_Cease indicates, its not recommended for US versions. Flashing this will probably cause reception, including NO SERVICE and other issues.
2.22.1540 is recommended for US versions, and Wonders_Never_Cease has kindly included it, along with excellent installation instructions on the link I provided previously.
redpoint73 said:
This is the international or European firmware, and as Wonders_Never_Cease indicates, its not recommended for US versions. Flashing this will probably cause reception, including NO SERVICE and other issues.
2.22.1540 is recommended for US versions, and Wonders_Never_Cease has kindly included it, along with excellent installation instructions on the link I provided previously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for letting me know guys. You learn something new every day! :good:
Okay I am all set. That was actually quite easy. From the time I had all the files in place to the time I had my firmware and new rom installed was maybe 5 minutes. I used the method that Wonders_Never_Cease posted from the thread that was linked in this thread except I used the Venom 2.0.1 rom. Thanks again guys
Related
I have a asia MB860
System version is 4.3.10.MB860.AsiaRetail.en.03.
Internel version is OLYEM u4 3.1.0
Produced in July
Can I flash any firmware and don't brick my phone?
Can I flash the origin firmware?
Could anyone give me a link of this origin firmware?
lihanchenhz said:
I have a asia MB860
System version is 4.3.10.MB860.AsiaRetail.en.03.
Internel version is OLYEM u4 3.1.0
Produced in July
Can I flash any firmware and don't brick my phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't think you can just flash any firmware. you have to make sure that it is compatible with the hardware you have in your phone (but if you mean flashing AT&T builds, it might be possible. Then again, why would you do this? lol Oh, and this is providing that you have unlocked your bootloader. If you didn't, only official updates made for your specific phone and region will work. However, even if you're unlocked, don't try to just flash a ROM for say, the Desire HD, and expect it to work.
lihanchenhz said:
Can I flash the origin firmware?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, given you have either the CWM zip (for unlocked bootloader) or the sbf. If you unlocked your bootloader, TAKE CAUTION WHEN USING A SBF. WHEN IN DOUBT, JUST FIND THE CWM VERSION. And of course, if you can't find one, which i doubt, request and someone (or i if i have time) will make one =]
lihanchenhz said:
Could anyone give me a link of this origin firmware?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here's the link, but learn to use the search bar/google to find stuff like these. I might be willing to find the specific link to give you, but some people will yell at you if you don't do a bit of searching yourself first. =] just a heads up
~jojojohnson7410~
jojojohnson7410 said:
Don't think you can just flash any firmware. you have to make sure that it is compatible with the hardware you have in your phone (but if you mean flashing AT&T builds, it might be possible. Then again, why would you do this? lol Oh, and this is providing that you have unlocked your bootloader. If you didn't, only official updates made for your specific phone and region will work. However, even if you're unlocked, don't try to just flash a ROM for say, the Desire HD, and expect it to work.
Yes, given you have either the CWM zip (for unlocked bootloader) or the sbf. If you unlocked your bootloader, TAKE CAUTION WHEN USING A SBF. WHEN IN DOUBT, JUST FIND THE CWM VERSION. And of course, if you can't find one, which i doubt, request and someone (or i if i have time) will make one =]
Here's the link, but learn to use the search bar/google to find stuff like these. I might be willing to find the specific link to give you, but some people will yell at you if you don't do a bit of searching yourself first. =] just a heads up
~jojojohnson7410~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a lot!
I am in China and I can't visit the link of Filesonic. Is it because the website is busy or I have to go through the firewall of China. Or there is another mirror link.
Morning
I think a has to update my radio to use some custom ROMs...
Which is the latest update radio?!
Does the latest radio automatically accept all custom Roms, or do the custom roms needs specific radio's?!
What is a firmware?!
Do I need to update this too?1
If yes, which is the latest firmware?!
Some question here: last firmware accept all custom roms, or do the custom roms need specific firmware?!
Thanks
Hello.
I see you need some help. I will try to answer your questions the best I can. Radios are part of firmware. Firmware is the software that governs your data and voice signal. It is best always have your firmware up to date. As a matter of fact. Most current roms require this latest firmware to work. Depending on whether your cdma or gsm. Some roms are not dependent on a specific carrier like sprint. Most are. All cdma roms are either virgin mobile or sprint. Gsm is a little confusing as there are many different firmware for different countries. To find these firmwares look through yhe stickies in the cdma dev or gsm dev section depending if you are cdma or gsm. Never flash a gsm firmware or rom with cdma or else you will brick your phone and vice versa. Take the time and look and read about a rom you are interested in. i cant tell you how much trouble you will save if you read through things carefully. if you have anymore questions. Feel free to ask. By the way, the latest radio for cdma ics is 1.09.00.0706. You'll find that in the dev section. There is a thread with just the firmware radios you are looking for.
Thanks a lot man! I've forget to say, that I'm using a gsm device... Lives in Germany, if its important...
So if I understood right, its enough to flash the latest firmware, right?!
I don't have to flash radio and firmware, right?!
Just flashing firmware, cause radio is in the firmware ha?! Ok, thanks man!!!
Ps: I know, I have the baddest english here ^^
No problem sir. Hey don't sweat it. Even some americans seem to have bad english sometimes. Lol
If I update using OTA, that's include radio and firmware update too?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda app-developers app
mikocok said:
If I update using OTA, that's include radio and firmware update too?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes
... with Tapatalk 2
Yes, you will get an entirely stock phone that way tho... no root, no s-off, no custom recovery... so in order to get a custom rom you will have to wire trick it
Where can i find the Newest Firmware?!
If i Flash the Firmware, is everything else delete on my HTC?!
Should i make a Backup with Titanium?
How to install?!
Thanks
EnesGTR said:
Where can i find the Newest Firmware?!
If i Flash the Firmware, is everything else delete on my HTC?!
Should i make a Backup with Titanium?
How to install?!
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1676276 (the link to the newest firmware is at the top of the second post)
flashing firmware should not interfere with your data.
making a backup wouldn't hurt, but it's really not necessary
to install:
you take the PG86IMG.zip you will download and put it onto your sdcard
boot the phone into bootloader (power and vol-down)
at this point it will parse through the zip, so wait a bit, after a while it asks you if you want to apply the update, if i remember correctly u should press vol-up (whichever one accepts the update) from here, just let it finish installing and don't turn it off untill it's done
when it's done, boot up to system and remove PG86IMG.zip from your sdcard so it doesn't try to flash it everytime.
that's it you're done.
hope this helps
Thanks a lot, I'll give it a try
Some custom roms stuck in bootloop ( kingkobra, cool ics etc)
Hope a firmware update will help...
EnesGTR said:
Morning
I think a has to update my radio to use some custom ROMs...
Which is the latest update radio?!
Does the latest radio automatically accept all custom Roms, or do the custom roms needs specific radio's?!
What is a firmware?!
Do I need to update this too?1
If yes, which is the latest firmware?!
Some question here: last firmware accept all custom roms, or do the custom roms need specific firmware?!
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should read carefully in Custom ROMs thread, you will find the ROM and also the needed firmware to flash with. You should not try other firmwares if not
Q&A for US Dev/AT&T 442/443/444 Debloated VVM/ISIS Release 10-19-2014
Some developers prefer that questions remain separate from their main development thread to help keep things organized. Placing your question within this thread will increase its chances of being answered by a member of the community or by the developer.
Before posting, please use the forum search and read through the discussion thread for US Dev/AT&T 442/443/444 Debloated VVM/ISIS Release 10-19-2014. If you can't find an answer, post it here, being sure to give as much information as possible (firmware version, steps to reproduce, logcat if available) so that you can get help.
Thanks for understanding and for helping to keep XDA neat and tidy!
Download:
M8 - 3.28.1540.5 (Read flashing instructions included in download)
[URL said:
http://goo.gl/o7A9xR[/URL]
For those who want to update to newest versions for developer build,you must have stock 2.22.1540.3 operating system and recovery and soff to run either of these files
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi, i have a stock rom AT&T 4.4.2 - firmware 1.58.502.1 - Root - S-ON (cant turn off)
can i install this "M8 - 3.28.1540.5 ROM+fimrware" directly?
No a firmware upgrade is needed for 4.4.4 to function correctly,need to be s-off for that.
Firmware question
So just to get this cleared up, i flash 2.22.1540.3, then after that 3.28.1540.5? Is the radio fix mandatory? Or only if 1.16?
Delete, senior moment
can flash 2.22.1540.3 (full firmware update) then 2.22.1540.4 (partial update) then flash 3.28.1540.5 firmware(full firmware update) no @ radio @1.16..
malteasers said:
So just to get this cleared up, i flash 2.22.1540.3, then after that 3.28.1540.5? Is the radio fix mandatory? Or only if 1.16?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wonders_Never_Cease said:
can flash 2.22.1540.3 (full firmware update) then 2.22.1540.4 (partial update) then flash 3.28.1540.5 firmware(full firmware update) no @ radio @1.16..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm on 3.28.401.7 can I just flash 3.28.1540.5 or is it not the full firmware?
If I'm reading this correct I would first have to flash "2.22.1540.3" then 2.22.1540.4 and finally "3.28.1540.5"?
If I'm all wrong please excuse my ignorance
Its full firmware,the correct way would be to flash in sequence
ozziedog said:
I'm on 3.28.401.7 can I just flash 3.28.1540.5 or is it not the full firmware?
If I'm reading this correct I would first have to flash "2.22.1540.3" then 2.22.1540.4 and finally "3.28.1540.5"?
If I'm all wrong please excuse my ignorance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For those not able to post yet in the dev thread, an update was released today...
Did I miss the 4.4.4 ROM link?
I'm running the arHD rom and having problems like most people. I've got a 3.28.1540.5 firmware downloaded, but I seemed to have missed the link for the 4.4.4 ROM. Did I miss something in my reading or did it get pulled? A few people said they were running it already?
Was pulled today till I get back from Hospital,will post link for it then,sorry your having issues with arhd...seems to be issues with euro builds these days.
turbochad said:
I'm running the arHD rom and having problems like most people. I've got a 3.28.1540.5 firmware downloaded, but I seemed to have missed the link for the 4.4.4 ROM. Did I miss something in my reading or did it get pulled? A few people said they were running it already?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wonders_Never_Cease said:
Was pulled today till I get back from Hospital,will post link for it then,sorry your having issues with arhd...seems to be issues with euro builds these days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay.. just wanted to make sure I wasn't being an idiot (more than normal). Hope all is good, hospital's generally aren't a great place to be.
Links are live...and we all have our moments..lol..and nope not a good place to be at all...
turbochad said:
Okay.. just wanted to make sure I wasn't being an idiot (more than normal). Hope all is good, hospital's generally aren't a great place to be.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay dumb question, how do I remove all widgets from lockscreen? I've checked out everything on exposed and don't see it also searched Google. Ideas?
ozziedog said:
Okay dumb question, how do I remove all widgets from lockscreen? I've checked out everything on exposed and don't see it also searched Google. Ideas?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Slide your finger down on the widget then tap and hold on it and drag it to remove like normal
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
ZeRo2o9 said:
Slide your finger down on the widget then tap and hold on it and drag it to remove like normal
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks I tried that and its like they are locked, they move but once at the edge of screen they launch. I'll try it again in the morning. Thanks again.
Edit
Disregard I moved back to ViperOne 3.1.0 and its way more customizable I have it just like I like. Thanks
I installed the Rom per instructions, installed xposed, softcard, and just popular apps, no more tweaks. On my 4.4.2 Rom, I have my phone connected to my car via bluetooth, and once connected, it resumes music without having to take my phone out my pocket, unlock the phone, open the app and finally play. Was there a tweak done on the Kernel, maybe for battery savings, that prevents the phone from autoplay when connected to a car on the latest version of the Rom? If there is, can we make exceptions on the Kernel for maybe, Google play music?
Thanks in advance for any ideas.
No there was nothing changed by me with kernel or otherwise. Not all things remain same from htc with the newer builds..from my reading things will be completely different again with Lollipop. And also google has been changing things in thier apps as well in anticipation of 5.0. Long winded reply. Havent changed anything.
sgndroid1 said:
I installed the Rom per instructions, installed xposed, softcard, and just popular apps, no more tweaks. On my 4.4.2 Rom, I have my phone connected to my car via bluetooth, and once connected, it resumes music without having to take my phone out my pocket, unlock the phone, open the app and finally play. Was there a tweak done on the Kernel, maybe for battery savings, that prevents the phone from autoplay when connected to a car on the latest version of the Rom? If there is, can we make exceptions on the Kernel for maybe, Google play music?
Thanks in advance for any ideas.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the replay, I always have the same problem every time I do a major update on a phone. It happened on my GSII, Note, S4 and now HTC.
Could check on radio manufacturers site for updates on headunit, I know my Kenwood has updates for compatability every so often
I'm coming from a nexus 5 (sad story, power button is broken).
I've loved not having any bloatware from day one.
On the other hand, LOVING the feel of this HTC so far.
I'm not finding a great deal of search results about the xposed framework on these phones. I see there is some hesitation with some htc one phones (couldn't determine which ones from what i read), So i thought i'd ask if anyone has any reason why it wouldn't run on a newly wiped stock OTA 5.0.2 install that i just rooted.
Thanks in advance and happy to join the community here.
Haven't had any issues (I'm new to the phone myself, love it, had it for 2 weeks so far), but I S-OFF and converted mine to GPE. Make sure you're using the official alpha xposed for 5.0 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3034811. There is also a different unofficial one for 5.1 http://forum.xda-developers.com/xposed/super-alpha-posted-permission-xposed-t3072979 if you decide to upgrade. I'm running a bunch of modules and they work as far as I know.
008freak said:
Haven't had any issues (I'm new to the phone myself, love it, had it for 2 weeks so far), but I S-OFF and converted mine to GPE. Make sure you're using the official alpha xposed for 5.0 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3034811. There is also a different unofficial one for 5.1 http://forum.xda-developers.com/xposed/super-alpha-posted-permission-xposed-t3072979 if you decide to upgrade. I'm running a bunch of modules and they work as far as I know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As mentioned, Xposed should work. It was broken for a while, meaning it didn't work on Lollipop, so many folks had to stop using it for a while for that reason (or use KK ROMs until Xposed was updated). And I think there was a point where Xposed framework itself was updated for LP, but many modules were not (and therefore did not work with LP). But I think a lot of that has ironed itself out, by now. You might run into a few modules here or there that don't work on LP; but most things should work fine.
008freak said:
Haven't had any issues (I'm new to the phone myself, love it, had it for 2 weeks so far), but I S-OFF and converted mine to GPE. Make sure you're using the official alpha xposed for 5.0 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3034811. There is also a different unofficial one for 5.1 http://forum.xda-developers.com/xposed/super-alpha-posted-permission-xposed-t3072979 if you decide to upgrade. I'm running a bunch of modules and they work as far as I know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GPE is such a great suggestion, I hadn't considered that as an option. this(http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2716306) seems to the the most supported I can find, you mind me asking what version you are using as GPE.
redpoint73 - My mileage varied from module to module also when it first got alpha support for 5.1, but everything I was looking for customization wise was met eventually. My quirky preferences aren't as numerous as they used to be.
I would love to learn more about fastboot flashing from the terminal, I know enough to be dangerous at this point. Do you all have any good pointers or tutorials you could direct me to?
Thanks for the prompt replies everyone! Now I have yet another reason to procrastinate the research paper I'm supposed to be writing today .
wakeboardsam said:
GPE is such a great suggestion, I hadn't considered that as an option. this(http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2716306) seems to the the most supported I can find, you mind me asking what version you are using as GPE.
I would love to learn more about fastboot flashing from the terminal, I know enough to be dangerous at this point. Do you all have any good pointers or tutorials you could direct me to?
Thanks for the prompt replies everyone! Now I have yet another reason to procrastinate the research paper I'm supposed to be writing today .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Disclaimer (I can't remember the exact steps I took, so in addition to me being vague, obligatory: I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANYTHING THAT HAPPENS TO YOUR DEVICE!)
I'm on the latest GPE 5.1 LMY470.H6. I didn't flash a rom maintained by a user, I did the conversion through changing MID, CID, flash RUU, so I could get official OTA updates.
I followed a combination of the following guides. READ BOTH CAREFULLY FIRST as this is probably a bit more involved than just flashing a ROM in recovery: http://forum.xda-developers.com/htc-one-m8/general/change-wwe-m8-to-dev-edition-ota-t2826567
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2708651 Has a guide for loading the official GPE RUU. The guy's website has 4.4.2 to latest 5.1 GPE
I installed 4.4.2 un-rooted, then updated through OTA to 5.1, flashed TWRP, installed SuperSU, rooted, installed xposed, DONE!
Then go to town on xposed. I would just say read carefully. I spent a good half a day converting mine xD
If you don't feel comfortable doing this, going with a dev/team maintained GPE ROM is probably fine and might even be better maintained.
wakeboardsam said:
I would love to learn more about fastboot flashing from the terminal, I know enough to be dangerous at this point. Do you all have any good pointers or tutorials you could direct me to?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are good fastboot guides on XDA like the following: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2277112
Honestly, I can't say I know much more, aside from the few commands I've had the occasion to use: wipe cache, flash kernels, flash zips, flash recovery, etc. For the most part, when I need a certain command, I just look it up.
So I've been on a slim-stock rooted ROM (I believe this one) of OB1 variety (Lollipop 5.0) and figured why the hell not update to the newest 5.1.1 base since I've been back into phone stuff trying to get my dad's new T-Mo S4 all freshly rooted and updated .
I was thinking of installing this OJ4 (5.1.1) ROM but then noticed that the current modem/kernel/stock .tar files in this wonder thread here say NH4 is the newest version and there's no mention of neither OJ4 nor OB1...which made me have an utter "WTF" moment. Why doesn't that list have either of them on there? My phone's current baseband/moden is OB1, which is what one'd expect from a OB1 ROM without its modem separately updated...but why are NEITHER of them in that list??
Someone please tell me I'm not the only one who finds that downright strange or could help shed light on this mystery, thanks!
TL;DR= Trying to update to OJ4 (5.1.1) and not sure if I have to THEN update everything I can to NH4 after the fact.
Bump, anybody?
iviyth0s said:
Bump, anybody?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably because that thread has not been updated.
Here is the official firmware update list from T-Mobile for the S5. You can search for custom builds of those if you like.
Sorry, can't post links yet.
//support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-10398
mrgoober22 said:
Probably because that thread has not been updated.
Here is the official firmware update list from T-Mobile for the S5. You can search for custom builds of those if you like.
Sorry, can't post links yet.
//support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-10398
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WOW! I feel pretty dumb lol
Thanks for that, repped! Guess I'll go along with the upgrade then and see what trouble I get myself into :good:.
iviyth0s said:
WOW! I feel pretty dumb lol
Thanks for that, repped! Guess I'll go along with the upgrade then and see what trouble I get myself into :good:.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks okay. There's a reason they coined the phrase "brain fart". Sometimes something so simple evades you!