Do we know for sure why it is that dash charging only works work the dash cable. Is it a DRM issue or a design element that needs to be licensed.
I'm not too stressed out because I plan to use a standard usb c cable for overnight charging but I am curious what is actually going on inside this charger.
I am quite familiar with OP official response concerning the matter, but given their track record of non answers, I'm assuming this situation is no different.
In other words I am curious what stops a company from releasing a cable that would in fact work. Possibly with the addition of some end user kernel changes. I understand this would be slightly impractical for a large company like Aukey or Anker to release a cable for one phone (that people could not use straight out of the box) however, my curiosity is still there
https://www.androidcentral.com/dash-charge has a good article on this.
---------- Post added at 12:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:47 PM ----------
Also, supposedly it's the same tech as http://www.oppo.com/en/technology/vooc - and anything "VOOC" branded will provide the same "dash charge" speeds.
Dougshell said:
Do we know for sure why it is that dash charging only works work the dash cable. Is it a DRM issue or a design element that needs to be licensed.
I'm not too stressed out because I plan to use a standard usb c cable for overnight charging but I am curious what is actually going on inside this charger.
I am quite familiar with OP official response concerning the matter, but given their track record of non answers, I'm assuming this situation is no different.
In other words I am curious what stops a company from releasing a cable that would in fact work. Possibly with the addition of some end user kernel changes. I understand this would be slightly impractical for a large company like Aukey or Anker to release a cable for one phone (that people could not use straight out of the box) however, my curiosity is still there
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Click to collapse
Simple Answer to this is the proprietary high amp usb type c cable which is supplied with the stock 5v 4amp power brick work well hand in hand, it is the way Oneplus has made this..one cannot work without the other so it is packaged deal..take it or leave..unless you are willing to compromise DASH Charge you can use any other type C cable and power brick adaptor
On a standard type-c (USB 3.1) cable connected to my PC, the phone slow charges. My other devices fast charge on this cable.
The other devices slow charge when connected to Dash cable and charger.
It leads me to think some very non-standards conforming USB tech is going on in the Dash gear, enough to make Benson Leung sick to his stomach. This isn't new to OnePlus, see https://plus.google.com/+BensonLeung/posts/JmcU4rA1csh
My advice would be to never use Dash gear with other devices.
Elnrik said:
It leads me to think some very non-standards conforming USB tech is going on in the Dash gear, enough to make Benson Leung sick to his stomach. This isn't new to OnePlus, see https://plus.google.com/+BensonLeung/posts/JmcU4rA1csh
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AFAIK this non-compliance thing has been there only in the first shipped cables and was fixed later on. So today's devices (this is already 2 years ago) should be compatible to USB standards and therefore other devices should load their battery at normal speed (not dash-speed) with the dash cables and dash plugs.
tobby88 said:
AFAIK this non-compliance thing has been there only in the first shipped cables and was fixed later on. So today's devices (this is already 2 years ago) should be compatible to USB standards and therefore other devices should load their battery at normal speed (not dash-speed) with the dash cables and dash plugs.
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Should, but I don't think it is. Q: why would the OP5 not fast charge over a normal type-c connection if it were standards compliant? Answer: it doesn't comply with standards.
Elnrik said:
Should, but I don't think it is. Q: why would the OP5 not fast charge over a normal type-c connection if it were standards compliant? Answer: it doesn't comply with standards.
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Amswer: OP5 doenst support any other quick charge methods (aka. QC 2.0/3.0, Adaptive Charging, Super Charging etc). It only supports normal charge or dash charge (& Vooc as dash is based on Vooc).
Also you should remember that different phones shows differently charging methods. Example Oneplus can maybe show normal 2A slow and Samsung as normal charge. Nexus 6P will show regular 3A charging as fast charging, Oneplus shows it regular charge.
For me if i use other C-cables (non-Dash charge one) it shows just "charging".
Regarding to Benson case... Original OP2 cable was non-standard. It didnt contain regular 56ohm thing. Oneplus fixed it later and dash charge cable is using standard things and also only for 3/3T/5 dash charge properties. For other phone you can use it without problems like use it to charge QC3.0 phones etc.
Sent from my OnePlus5 using XDA Labs
zige said:
Amswer: OP5 doenst support any other quick charge methods (aka. QC 2.0/3.0, Adaptive Charging, Super Charging etc). It only supports normal charge or dash charge (& Vooc as dash is based on Vooc).
Also you should remember that different phones shows differently charging methods. Example Oneplus can maybe show normal 2A slow and Samsung as normal charge. Nexus 6P will show regular 3A charging as fast charging, Oneplus shows it regular charge.
For me if i use other C-cables (non-Dash charge one) it shows just "charging".
Regarding to Benson case... Original OP2 cable was non-standard. It didnt contain regular 56ohm thing. Oneplus fixed it later and dash charge cable is using standard things and also only for 3/3T/5 dash charge properties. For other phone you can use it without problems like use it to charge QC3.0 phones etc.
Sent from my OnePlus5 using XDA Labs
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My point isn't so much about the cable as it is the device itself. It is a USB type-c device that doesn't conform to type-c USB standards.
There will be a plethora of usb-c ports on computers and chargers going forward. They are included on every new model of Apple, PC motherboard, and OEM PC - so type-c adoption is there and real. By ignoring these standards and producing a product with a proprietary design they are ostracizing their devices, and by extension their users, from simple and convenient charging methods. It ensures lots of sales of Dash chargers though.
It's a **** move straight from the Apple playbook. Apple made billions from the 30 pin to lightning connector change, and they will do it again with the lightning to Type-C change.
This Oppo/OP Dash charger isn't something consumers should be championing. It's not something Oppo/OP should be forcing on consumers either.
Elnrik said:
Should, but I don't think it is. Q: why would the OP5 not fast charge over a normal type-c connection if it were standards compliant? Answer: it doesn't comply with standards.
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I don't think your statement is accurate, the newer USB C Power Delivery specs allows voltages up to 20 volts and amperages up to 5 amps, the dash charger specs use 5 volts on 4 amps, well within USB C PD specs. The fact that their technology is proprietary does not mean it's not standards compliant.
There is also the very important difference between voltage and amperage, voltage is pushed to devices so it's always important that what you are using within the voltage required by the device. Amperage on the other hand is pulled by the device so the charger will allow the device to pull as much amperage as it needs as long as it doesn't go over it's own capacity. Think about your standard US outlet, it works at 120 Volts and at either 15 to 20 amps, you can connect as many 120V devices to it as long as you don't exceed its amperage.
That being said, the reason other usb cables don't work on the dash charger block is because the usb A side probably has different resistors, One + cables probably have higher resistors than regular, run of the mill usb C-A cables. That was the issue with the first cables that came out a few years ago, they had pull-up resistors with the wrong Ohm rating.
Here is a link to a PDF file explaining USB C Power Specs, keep in mind though that the eventual idea is to only use USB C-C cables and not the USB C-A cables that are the cause of so much headaches.
HueleSnaiL said:
I don't think your statement is accurate, the newer USB C Power Delivery specs allows voltages up to 20 volts and amperages up to 5 amps, the dash charger specs use 5 volts on 4 amps, well within USB C PD specs. The fact that their technology is proprietary does not mean it's not standards compliant.
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The listed power specs are only half the picture. The negotiation between devices is critical in getting those power numbers. That a OP5 can't draw above 900mA on a fully compliant 3.1 cable from a PD capable Type-C port shows it's not compliant. Its not negotiating power draw the way a standard Type-C device should.
And yes, I've already read all the spec docs. Thanks though.
Elnrik said:
The listed power specs are only half the picture. The negotiation between devices is critical in getting those power numbers. That a OP5 can't draw above 900mA on a fully compliant 3.1 cable from a PD capable Type-C port shows it's not compliant. Its not negotiating power draw the way a standard Type-C device should.
And yes, I've already read all the spec docs. Thanks though.
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Click to collapse
The phone itself doesn't have to comply to anything, the chargers and cables do since they are the ones providing the charge. The standards are there to determine thresholds on how much and how little current they can work with. The circuitry on the phone and battery are the ones who tell the charger how much current they need to charge the battery without warming it too much or overcharging it. Different combinations of chargers and cables will give you a lot of different charging speeds but that's because there are so many chargers and cables with different ratings that devices err on the side of caution when they can't recognize the charger that it's being plugged into them. It's kind of a unfortunate thing that companies like Motorola, Huawei, OnePlus and Qualcomm use different charging specs but all of them work within the 15 to 20 watts of power for fast charging, so it's not a really big difference.
The reason for the difference in charging speeds between the dash charger/cable and other chargers is that 1 + charger offloads the current regulation to the charger itself rather than leaving current regulation to the phone, like other fast charging devices, that's why 1 + phones fast charge at cooler temperatures than other fast charging technologies.
Now, why your phone doesn't go above 900mA on a regular cable is beyond me, the first photo I attached is of my phone connected to the dash charger via this cable and the second one is of the same cable connected to this wall outlet.
Elnrik said:
Should, but I don't think it is. Q: why would the OP5 not fast charge over a normal type-c connection if it were standards compliant? Answer: it doesn't comply with standards.
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That's a fallacy. To comply with the standards does not mean, that everything is exactly the same. The USB-standard is a little bit more complex than just "pin 1 of one end has to be connected to pin 1 of the other end". The USB-standard defines what is allowed, so no devices will get damaged and to ensure a "minimum" data and power connectivity of let's say at least USB 2.0.
That's what these cables and chargers offer: They don't violate the USB standards. They allow a data connection with USB 2.0 also for non OP-devices. They also allow "normal power" (5V 500mA). They don't damage other devices. They just "work" as they should. But they offer "additional extras" (dash charging) when all three parts (charger, cable, phone) are compatible.
So they comply with the standards while offering additional features and that means, that other cables/chargers, which also comply with the standards but don't offer the extras, won't be able to dash charge.
Anyone tried to see whether using the oneplus cables on QC devices + QC wall plug supports Quick Charging?
I get 2a off my 3a rated PD c to c cables and 38w PD charger.
The only PD compatible android chipset I know of is made by mediatek at present.
Related
I've previously been able to charge my phones (a droid Charge and the S3) with the USB plug in car with out any problems. It was slower than the A/C charger, but got the job done. But recently, I noticed that the S4 was taking forever to add any charge to the battery when plugged into the car's USB (Its a 2012 Ford Focus with My Ford Touch). I tested the USB line with the "Galaxy Current Charging" App and saw it was only registering 460 mAh (which is the same as when the phone is unplugged). I also tested my cigarette lighter charger which showed 860 mAh. (BTW, I tested the USB cord using my 2 Amp stock S4 A/C charger and it showed 1900 mAh, so I don't think there is anything wrong with the USB cord, itself.)
So, is there a problem with using the standard USB plug in our cars to charge the S4?
Thanks in advance,
Rich
richs10 said:
So, is there a problem with using the standard USB plug in our cars to charge the S4?
Thanks in advance,
Rich
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Click to collapse
If you're really getting 860ma, you should be OK. The problem is that most 12v car adapters end up delivering about half that current. As you've already figured out, the S4 can accept up to about 2000ma (or 2A), but only when using a 5V/2A adapter (like the one that comes w/the device) AND only when using a compatible cable (use a non-stock cable with the AC adapter and you'll probably see more like 950ma than 1900).
You might want to try this Motorola auto charging cable http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000S5Q9CA/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1 . It's rated at about 1A, which is about half the level that the S4 can accept, but still pretty good. I haven't measured the exact output, but I can tell you that it's faster than any other car charger I've owned before.
You may also want to search online for an adapter that can achieve closer to 2A.
Andy:
I have that exact Motorola cigarette lighter charger and it works fine. My problem is trying to charge the phone in the car using the car's usb plug and a 'usb to micro usb' cord. That is where I have run into the problem with the S4. I could do this with my older phones, but the usb plug in the car only seems to supply the 460 mah with the S4. Any ideas why?
richs10 said:
Andy:
I have that exact Motorola cigarette lighter charger and it works fine. My problem is trying to charge the phone in the car using the car's usb plug and a 'usb to micro usb' cord. That is where I have run into the problem with the S4. I could do this with my older phones, but the usb plug in the car only seems to supply the 460 mah with the S4. Any ideas why?
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Click to collapse
Because the usb spec it wasdesigned under limits it to a maximum of 500 mA. It is a given that charging will be excruciatingly slow at that low of a current draw if it even charges at all.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
richs10 said:
Andy:
I have that exact Motorola cigarette lighter charger and it works fine. My problem is trying to charge the phone in the car using the car's usb plug and a 'usb to micro usb' cord. That is where I have run into the problem with the S4. I could do this with my older phones, but the usb plug in the car only seems to supply the 460 mah with the S4. Any ideas why?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's a product review on Amazon, where the reviewer provides a pretty good summary that might help explain. He claims that if the device does not 'recognize' the charging source with certainty, it may default to 500ma to prevent potential damage to the charge source (which could be e.g., a PC). The recommendation seems to be to use a special charging cable that would demonstrate to the device that a low-current source is not connected.
(here's an excerpt)
"...The USB power spec is for 0.5 Amps at 5 Volts... or 2.5 Watts. This was great up until the last couple years when devices have gotten really power hungry, particularly smartphones and tablets and to a lesser extent dedicated GPS's. Some of these devices use over 2 Amps, particularly the tablets like the iPad (or in my case the HP Touchpad).
Manufacturers of these devices therefore had a dilemma. If they had their devices pull more than 0.5 Amps, they risked damaging the power source, which could be a computer, that was only prepared to source 0.5 Amps. Thus the manufacturers have used tricks to determine whether their device is connected to an unknown source, at which point they purposely only draw 0.5 Amps, or to the dedicated charger that was provided with the device, where they can draw all the power they need.
There seem to be two common tricks used. The first is to short the two data-wires together in the charger. This is what most non-Apple devices do. Since a computer or older device wouldn't have done this, the device can assume it is safe to draw all the power it needs..."
In a subsequent discussion about the review, one of the commenters went on to recommend this charging cable - note that, per above, it's a 'shorted' cable, so it can only be used for charging (not data xfer). You might want to give it a try: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003VYBCAY/ref=cm_cd_asin_lnk
That will not work if the source itself is limited to 500mA. The shorted data pins on the cable only allow the PMIC to draw a higher current if the source is capable of providing it.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Can I purchase the same exact cable that comes with N6 somewhere online? I want to be able to have an extra one for my car.
2014 SR5 Premium
Pretty certain its the same turbo charger they sell on Motorola.com, its like 35 bucks.
sfidelisrp said:
Pretty certain its the same turbo charger they sell on Motorola.com, its like 35 bucks.
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Click to collapse
I was looking for this, but it's out of stock. Any ideas who has this available.
http://www.motorola.com/us/accessories-batteries-chargers/USB-Data-Cable/usb-data-cable.html
2014 SR5 Premium
Don't know where you'd get that exact one but honestly if all you're looking for is the cable you can find micro USB cables almost anywhere. I bought two in Walgreen's for like 5 bucks a pop that I keep in my vehicles. They work perfect. Nothing special about buying over priced cables when they all do the exact same thing.
---------- Post added at 07:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:13 AM ----------
dinosaur1 said:
I was looking for this, but it's out of stock. Any ideas who has this available.
http://www.motorola.com/us/accessories-batteries-chargers/USB-Data-Cable/usb-data-cable.html
2014 SR5 Premium
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Above
Like the others have said. Any USB to Micro-USB cable would work just as well as another (unless the cable is faulty, which... well.... yea).
Isn't it more in the charger than the cable? Unless of course you're talking USB 3 of course.
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elementaldragon said:
Like the others have said. Any USB to Micro-USB cable would work just as well as another (unless the cable is faulty, which... well.... yea).
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Click to collapse
I'm not quite following your ending statement.
2014 SR5 Premium
elementaldragon said:
Like the others have said. Any USB to Micro-USB cable would work just as well as another (unless the cable is faulty, which... well.... yea).
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Click to collapse
Not true. Cable does matter. Some don't pass enough current. Some don't stay put.
Monoprice premium cables should be <$3 and quality seems good; no complaints here.
http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030307&p_id=9965&seq=1&format=2
(black ones seem to be OOS)
daftlush said:
Not true. Cable does matter. Some don't pass enough current. Some don't stay put.
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Click to collapse
dinosaur1 said:
I'm not quite following your ending statement.
2014 SR5 Premium
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Again... if it's a faulty cable. Only time I've ever seen a cable NOT work is if it was bent tightly too many times and split a wire in the casing, or as you said, if the connector itself was somehow flawed. Current supplied is a non-issue, because USB does not require a lot of current for anything. If it did, the wires would need to be thicker.
Just bought this to use with Incipio car turbo charger I bought earlier. I like coiled cables to use in the car: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008DVMRXG/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_75DBub1FSNSV2
This is my new favorite! I charges my N5 from 0% to 50 in 10 minutes! And I love the light on the plug so you can see when you plug it into the phone. I give this 6 out of 5 stars, specially with it being 6 foot long!
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CWM989I/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
and for the car (although can't vouch for speed in the car charger) http://www.amazon.com/Rapid-Dual-Car-Charger-Micro/dp/B00GB8XIZO/ref=pd_bxgy_cps_img_y
What is a good charger that I can use at work?
2014 SR5 Premium
dinosaur1 said:
What is a good charger that I can use at work?
2014 SR5 Premium
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Look at my post above yours.
dinosaur1 said:
What is a good charger that I can use at work?
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Click to collapse
The kick-ass 1.8A Blackberry Folding Blade Chargers... ~$5-6 each or 2 for ~$10.
Get a "Charge Only" cable. They deliver higher current to phone from charger than than data / charge cables. Amazon has them at reasonable price.
wtherrell said:
Get a "Charge Only" cable. They deliver higher current to phone from charger than than data / charge cables. Amazon has them at reasonable price.
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Link?
2014 SR5 Premium
http://www.verizonwireless.com/acce...er-with-fast-charge-technology-for-micro-usb/
Came across this today. I get 25% off so may be worth it for me.
I thought I'd jump in here and explain why there's so many inconsistent stories regarding cables. Here's the real deal:
Android determines whether a charger is a computer (USB) or a wall charger (AC) by the status of the data pins in the USB connector. In USB, there are 4 pins. The center two pins are data pins. The outer pins supply power and ground. If the central pins are shorted together electrically, then Android devices consider that a wall charger, and will attempt to charge at a higher amperage. If they're not, then the device assumes it's tied to a computer, and charges at 500mA (the power put out by a computer's USB 2.0 port). This is why some 2A chargers will show as "Charging (USB)" on the battery screen, instead of "Charging (AC)," which is what you want. ( I said attempt before, because connecting a cable where the data pins are shorted to a computer won't increase the 500mA that your computer is supplying. Thus, the device will TRY to charge faster, but won't, because it's limited by the computer.)
iOS uses a different method for determining AC/USB, so any charger designed for iOS devices will charge your Android device at 500mA, regardless of the rated power. (That's why some multi-port USB chargers, with a 1A and 2A port will often charge better with the 1A port -- the 2A port tends to be designed for iPads.) Along these lines, there are two types of "Charge Only" cables: Those where the central pins are shorted (Android-compatible), and those where the central pins are missing or disconnected (electrically, that's called "open," which is the opposite of "shorted" -- and these are iOS-Compatible). Thus, using a "Charge Only" cable, can actually be a bad thing. In fact, most "charge only" cables are of the "open" type. So, to say that you should get a "charge only" cable is wrong, more often than not.
Unfortunately, when you're purchasing cables or chargers, they almost never say "Android Compatible." Instead, look at what it DOES say. If it says it's iOS compatible, or that it's designed to charge any iOS device, then it definitely won't charge your Android device at more than 500mA. Stay away! Look for it to say it's designed to charge a specific Android device, like a Samsung S5, or a Droid Maxx, or whatever. Compatibility with ANY Android device, means compatibility with ALL Android devices. (Assuming it's still a micro-USB connector.)
Cables sold by themselves are almost always Data cables. Cables sold with chargers are almost always "charge only" cables, and you need to go by the charger compatibility to determine the cable compatibility. The real test is to find a charger/cable combination that will show up as "Charging (AC)" on the battery screen. The original OEM pair that came with the device is best for this. Once you have that pair of known Android-Compatible components, you can swap out the cable OR charger (ONLY ONE AT A TIME!), and test it to see if it still reads "Charging (AC)," or "Charging (USB)." If it's the latter, then that charger or cable was designed for iOS devices, and won't really be useful with your Android device. If it's the former, then it becomes a known compatible item for further testing.
In summary. The power rating of a charger means absolutely nothing. A 2A charger for iOS will charge much slower than an a 1A charger designed for Android. Don't rely on that. Instead, rely on the device that the charger was designed for. If it says it's designed to charge an Android device (any Android device), then select that over any charger that even so much as mentions an iOS device. Better yet, look for chargers that support the Qualcomm Quick Charge 2.0 standard. That's the same as Moto's "Turbo Charger," and since that's an Android thing, it's guaranteed to be Android compatible, and much faster at charging your N6.
jt3 said:
I thought I'd jump in here and explain why there's so many inconsistent stories regarding cables. Here's the real deal:
Android determines whether a charger is a computer (USB) or a wall charger (AC) by the status of the data pins in the USB connector. In USB, there are 4 pins. The center two pins are data pins. The outer pins supply power and ground. If the central pins are shorted together electrically, then Android devices consider that a wall charger, and will attempt to charge at a higher amperage. If they're not, then the device assumes it's tied to a computer, and charges at 500mA (the power put out by a computer's USB 2.0 port). This is why some 2A chargers will show as "Charging (USB)" on the battery screen, instead of "Charging (AC)," which is what you want. ( I said attempt before, because connecting a cable where the data pins are shorted to a computer won't increase the 500mA that your computer is supplying. Thus, the device will TRY to charge faster, but won't, because it's limited by the computer.)
iOS uses a different method for determining AC/USB, so any charger designed for iOS devices will charge your Android device at 500mA, regardless of the rated power. (That's why some multi-port USB chargers, with a 1A and 2A port will often charge better with the 1A port -- the 2A port tends to be designed for iPads.) Along these lines, there are two types of "Charge Only" cables: Those where the central pins are shorted (Android-compatible), and those where the central pins are missing or disconnected (electrically, that's called "open," which is the opposite of "shorted" -- and these are iOS-Compatible). Thus, using a "Charge Only" cable, can actually be a bad thing. In fact, most "charge only" cables are of the "open" type. So, to say that you should get a "charge only" cable is wrong, more often than not.
Unfortunately, when you're purchasing cables or chargers, they almost never say "Android Compatible." Instead, look at what it DOES say. If it says it's iOS compatible, or that it's designed to charge any iOS device, then it definitely won't charge your Android device at more than 500mA. Stay away! Look for it to say it's designed to charge a specific Android device, like a Samsung S5, or a Droid Maxx, or whatever. Compatibility with ANY Android device, means compatibility with ALL Android devices. (Assuming it's still a micro-USB connector.)
Cables sold by themselves are almost always Data cables. Cables sold with chargers are almost always "charge only" cables, and you need to go by the charger compatibility to determine the cable compatibility. The real test is to find a charger/cable combination that will show up as "Charging (AC)" on the battery screen. The original OEM pair that came with the device is best for this. Once you have that pair of known Android-Compatible components, you can swap out the cable OR charger (ONLY ONE AT A TIME!), and test it to see if it still reads "Charging (AC)," or "Charging (USB)." If it's the latter, then that charger or cable was designed for iOS devices, and won't really be useful with your Android device. If it's the former, then it becomes a known compatible item for further testing.
In summary. The power rating of a charger means absolutely nothing. A 2A charger for iOS will charge much slower than an a 1A charger designed for Android. Don't rely on that. Instead, rely on the device that the charger was designed for. If it says it's designed to charge an Android device (any Android device), then select that over any charger that even so much as mentions an iOS device. Better yet, look for chargers that support the Qualcomm Quick Charge 2.0 standard. That's the same as Moto's "Turbo Charger," and since that's an Android thing, it's guaranteed to be Android compatible, and much faster at charging your N6.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI. I ordered this and tried it today. Works like a charm in my vehicles built in USB port. Originally the USB by itself wouldn't charge.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00GC4AJOU/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?qid=1416764690&sr=8-3&pi=AC_SY200_QL40
I was going to pick this up which has the fastest charge using a 12v.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00P9UILUM/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?qid=1416764884&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SY200_QL40
Does anyone how much slower the USB adapter would charge vs the Powermod?
If I go with, lets say the OnePlus Type C cord, will I still get the faster data transfer speeds/fast charging as if I were using a straight USB type C cable? It seems as if you use a cable that isn't type C on both ends that you wouldn't be able to take advantage of the faster data transfer speeds. I would assume this also applies to the fast charging but I'm not sure...
Powell730 said:
If I go with, lets say the OnePlus Type C cord, will I still get the faster data transfer speeds/fast charging as if I were using a straight USB type C cable? It seems as if you use a cable that isn't type C on both ends that you wouldn't be able to take advantage of the faster data transfer speeds. I would assume this also applies to the fast charging but I'm not sure...
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Click to collapse
USB data speed will be the same because the Nexus uses USB 2.0 transfer. You won't get fast charging with a type C to type A cable. The type A only has the 4 USB 2.0 pins, whereas fast charging utilizes the power bus of the type-c cable (extra pins). So you will need a type c charger to get full charging speed.
Skitals said:
USB data speed will be the same because the Nexus uses USB 2.0 transfer. You won't get fast charging with a type C to type A cable. The type A only has the 4 USB 2.0 pins, whereas fast charging utilizes the power bus of the type-c cable (extra pins). So you will need a type c charger to get full charging speed.
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Click to collapse
awesome, thanks for the response!
I have been looking for a type C to type C cable, any suggestion?
Powell730 said:
If I go with, lets say the OnePlus Type C cord, will I still get the faster data transfer speeds/fast charging as if I were using a straight USB type C cable? It seems as if you use a cable that isn't type C on both ends that you wouldn't be able to take advantage of the faster data transfer speeds. I would assume this also applies to the fast charging but I'm not sure...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/nexus-6p/general/usb-type-c-vs-usb-3-0-3-1-vs-usb-2-0-t3221676
The best you should get is about 2300-ish mA charging from type A connectors. Chances are you will get less. You will never get 3A from a type A port unless something has gone very wrong. See link for details.
---------- Post added at 11:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:42 PM ----------
Skitals said:
USB data speed will be the same because the Nexus uses USB 2.0 transfer. You won't get fast charging with a type C to type A cable. The type A only has the 4 USB 2.0 pins, whereas fast charging utilizes the power bus of the type-c cable (extra pins). So you will need a type c charger to get full charging speed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is correct. Good post. Thanks
Skitals said:
USB data speed will be the same because the Nexus uses USB 2.0 transfer. You won't get fast charging with a type C to type A cable. The type A only has the 4 USB 2.0 pins, whereas fast charging utilizes the power bus of the type-c cable (extra pins). So you will need a type c charger to get full charging speed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then why is the nexus engineer warning that C to A cables and adapters without the proper resistor will cause the device to attempt to pull 3 amps through the cable and burn up the charger? Seems he is saying pins or no pins it's going to attempt to pull 3 amps.
Using an OEM Samsung fast charger with this cord:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B013187HZS/ref=cm_sw_r_other_awd_eJIpwbAMNJ231
I got these results:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Compared to these results with the OEM Nexus 6P charger:
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Powell730 said:
If I go with, lets say the OnePlus Type C cord, will I still get the faster data transfer speeds/fast charging as if I were using a straight USB type C cable? It seems as if you use a cable that isn't type C on both ends that you wouldn't be able to take advantage of the faster data transfer speeds. I would assume this also applies to the fast charging but I'm not sure...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Almost any definite answer you get is wrong because Google has decline to say what the did and full testing has not been completed There are 2 parts to this equation.
1. What is possible to deliver over an A to C connection
2. What the phone will do
As to the first, yes you can get 3A over A to C. The problem has been that there just are not any 5V/3A A port chargers out there. Companies have been making "over charging' chargers for years. I've been able to get 2.6Amp to the phone over an A to C charger limited by the charger capability.
As for part 2, the first thing the phone does when a cable is attached is to determine what type of facing port it is attached to. In this case, it will be a Dedicated Charging Port (DCP). It will check voltage on pin CC and determine it is not a C port and therefore not able to negotiate a power contract in that manner. Type C specs then require it to draw no more than default power (500mA) for USB 2.0. If the device wants more current, it is obligated to monitor voltage on the bus to determine if more current is available. Hence, the device should never over draw the charger.
On the charger side, it will monitor the current draw and limit itself via a maximum current setpoint beyond which it will shut down. If the PD (Portable Device) is designed appropriately, it won't ever hit that because it is monitoring Voltage and the voltage drop will tell the PD to limit the current it is drawing to maintain vREF.
What is really unknown is what is the exact trigger for the "Charging Rapidly" in the lock screen. I get it under 3A.
Recommendation: Use A to C if you need multiple charger ports to support other devices. Don't get bent around the axle over getting all 3A. Use C-C if you only need one port. And in the future, the whole world will be Type C so your investment will last longer. But don't believe that 3A will be widely used. It is a design requirement in the Type C spec, but not a power standard in the USB spec. For example, the Lumia 950XL and Sony Z5 both are Type C and are reported to use Qualcomm Quick Charge 2.0. which top out at 2A at 5V (though can do 12V/1.5A).
Good Test - Get a Male Type C to Female Micro B adapter. Put it on the end of the Type C to Micro B cable plugged into the Google supplied Charger and see what you get!
dwswager said:
Almost any definite answer you get is wrong because Google has decline to say what the did and full testing has not been completed There are 2 parts to this equation.
1. What is possible to deliver over an A to C connection
2. What the phone will do
As to the first, yes you can get 3A over A to C. The problem has been that there just are not any 5V/3A A port chargers out there. Companies have been making "over charging' chargers for years. I've been able to get 2.6Amp to the phone over an A to C charger limited by the charger capability.
As for part 2, the first thing the phone does when a cable is attached is to determine what type of facing port it is attached to. In this case, it will be a Dedicated Charging Port (DCP). It will check voltage on pin CC and determine it is not a C port and therefore not able to negotiate a power contract in that manner. Type C specs then require it to draw no more than default power (500mA) for USB 2.0. If the device wants more current, it is obligated to monitor voltage on the bus to determine if more current is available. Hence, the device should never over draw the charger.
On the charger side, it will monitor the current draw and limit itself via a maximum current setpoint beyond which it will shut down. If the PD (Portable Device) is designed appropriately, it won't ever hit that because it is monitoring Voltage and the voltage drop will tell the PD to limit the current it is drawing to maintain vREF.
What is really unknown is what is the exact trigger for the "Charging Rapidly" in the lock screen. I get it under 3A.
Recommendation: Use A to C if you need multiple charger ports to support other devices. Don't get bent around the axle over getting all 3A. Use C-C if you only need one port. And in the future, the whole world will be Type C so your investment will last longer. But don't believe that 3A will be widely used. It is a design requirement in the Type C spec, but not a power standard in the USB spec. For example, the Lumia 950XL and Sony Z5 both are Type C and are reported to use Qualcomm Quick Charge 2.0. which top out at 2A at 5V (though can do 12V/1.5A).
Good Test - Get a Male Type C to Female Micro B adapter. Put it on the end of the Type C to Micro B cable plugged into the Google supplied Charger and see what you get!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Google supplied type c to a cable says charging slowly when plugged into a PC which makes sense since type a should only pull 500ma from the port
The orzly cable that Benson tested shows me it says charging rapidly in that same port..
My other cable that I bought from a local electronics store shows "charging" only.. What does that mean? Is that a good sign that it won't damage up my port/charger/phone?
Thanks
All this is so confusing for first gen adopters to these types of cables haha
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
xxsashixx said:
The Google supplied type c to a cable says charging slowly when plugged into a PC which makes sense since type a should only pull 500ma from the port
The orzly cable that Benson tested shows me it says charging rapidly in that same port..
My other cable that I bought from a local electronics store shows "charging" only.. What does that mean? Is that a good sign that it won't damage up my port/charger/phone?
Thanks
All this is so confusing for first gen adopters to these types of cables haha
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What this tells me 1st and foremost is don't go by what the lock screen says.
A USB 2.0 port on a computer motherboard is only going to output 500mA as you found out. A USB 3.0 port on a motherboard can output up to 900mA.
This is what Benson is saying. The Orzly cable is improperly designed such that it signals to the PD that it is 3A so I suspect that is why the 6P is showing Charging Rapidly.
Best way to test what is going on is to use a multimeter to test the current flow, but that means cutting open the wires or using a special plug with terminals. The next best thing is to use a battery app to see what the app says the draw is. This won't be as accurate and you should allow a minute for the device to come to full draw and the app to update.
Personally, I am almost 2 days on a charge where my previous phone required a late afternoon recharge so I am not all that keyed up over fast charging. It is nice, but as long as my phone is usable, not as big a deal because I recharge every night.
dwswager said:
What this tells me 1st and foremost is don't go by what the lock screen says.
A USB 2.0 port on a computer motherboard is only going to output 500mA as you found out. A USB 3.0 port on a motherboard can output up to 900mA.
This is what Benson is saying. The Orzly cable is improperly designed such that it signals to the PD that it is 3A so I suspect that is why the 6P is showing Charging Rapidly.
Best way to test what is going on is to use a multimeter to test the current flow, but that means cutting open the wires or using a special plug with terminals. The next best thing is to use a battery app to see what the app says the draw is. This won't be as accurate and you should allow a minute for the device to come to full draw and the app to update.
Personally, I am almost 2 days on a charge where my previous phone required a late afternoon recharge so I am not all that keyed up over fast charging. It is nice, but as long as my phone is usable, not as big a deal because I recharge every night.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't care about fast charging I just want to make sure the cable doesn't damage my phone from overcharging or what not.
Plus all the good cables are either oos or won't ship to Canada and are overly expensive..
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
xxsashixx said:
I don't care about fast charging I just want to make sure the cable doesn't damage my phone from overcharging or what not.
Plus all the good cables are either oos or won't ship to Canada and are overly expensive..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then no worries. The Google Guy's whole point about the cables was that the phone might try to draw more current than the charger can supply and damage the Upstream Facing Port (read that as the charger). But any decent charger has overcurrent protection so neither the phone, nor the charger are in any danger.
dwswager said:
Then no worries. ... But any decent charger has overcurrent protection so neither the phone, nor the charger are in any danger.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to take exception to this. You keep saying people will be fine, there are protections in place, etc... But I have serious doubts if these protections are meant to be engaged every time a user plugs in. It's like saying it's OK to drive 120mph in a busy 45mph zone, because I'm wearing a seatbelt.
Further, I think you are doing a disservice to the community by posting that it's OK to use products that are clearly out of specification. If pulling more current than a charger could handle wasn't dangerous, they wouldn't be designed with some type of protection measures. As such, saying "neither the phone, nor the charger are in any danger" is patently false.
Elnrik said:
I have to take exception to this. You keep saying people will be fine, there are protections in place, etc... But I have serious doubts if these protections are meant to be engaged every time a user plugs in. It's like saying it's OK to drive 120mph in a busy 45mph zone, because I'm wearing a seatbelt.
Further, I think you are doing a disservice to the community by posting that it's OK to use products that are clearly out of specification. If pulling more current than a charger could handle wasn't dangerous, they wouldn't be designed with some type of protection measures. As such, saying "neither the phone, nor the charger are in any danger" is patently false.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Look, I think all devices should be designed in spec and wish the USB Forum would more strictly enforce the specifications. But the 6P is obligated, when it can't negotiate a valid power contract which it can't do with a USB Type A port, to use default power and if it wants more current to monitor the voltage on the bus to determine if more power is available. Hence, if it immediately begins drawing 3A, or it does not reduce current draw when the buss drops below vREF, then the 6P itself is out of spec!
Both sides of the equation, Device and Charger have responsibilities and protections in place. If we were discussing plugging a 10A charger into a 3A device, I would be a little more concerned. But we are discussing plugging a 2A charger into a device capable of using 0-3A.
I also would be a little more concerned if dozens of people weren't already using these cables with less than 3A Type A chargers with no problem. The phones and chargers are doing what they are supposed to do.
That it's perhaps the single most disjointed rebuttal I think I've ever read. It also completely deflects from my point that you are giving bad advice and doing the community a disservice... But hey, I'll play along. Let's break down your reply into intelligible pieces to see if there is any sense to be had.
dwswager said:
Look, I think all devices should be designed in spec and wish the USB Forum would more strictly enforce the specifications.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed.
But the 6P is obligated,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All components using licensed USB technology are obligated to follow specifications.
when it can't negotiate a valid power contract which it can't do with a USB Type A port,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It can negotiate power with Type-A ports just fine using cables which follow specifications. The port and the phone are not at issue here, no matter how much you want them to be.
to use default power and if it wants more current to monitor the voltage on the bus to determine if more power is available
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is monitoring voltage, but it cannot know current ratings of the system it is connected to without a marker or sign post, which is where the out of spec cable is defeating this process.
Hence, if it immediately begins drawing 3A, or it does not reduce current draw when the buss drops below vREF, then the 6P itself is out of spec!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So the 6p is out of spec itself when it is being told, by an out of spec cable, that it is safe to draw 3A?
Both sides of the equation, Device and Charger have responsibilities and protections in place.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Conviently forgetting the cable.
If we were discussing plugging a 10A charger into a 3A device, I would be a little more concerned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, that would be safe because the 10A device could safely provide 3A.
But we are discussing plugging a 2A charger into a device capable of using 0-3A.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which is unsafe, because MATH. 3 > 2
I also would be a little more concerned if dozens of people weren't already using these cables with less than 3A Type A chargers with no problem. The phones and chargers are doing what they are supposed to do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is just something fundamentally wrong with this way of thinking. I'd be a little more concerned if we had any damaged property, fires, or deaths, but since we haven't yet, everything must be OK. That's great.
Elnrik said:
That it's perhaps the single most disjointed rebuttal I think I've ever read. It also completely deflects from my point that you are giving bad advice and doing the community a disservice... But hey, I'll play along. Let's break down your reply into intelligible pieces to see if there is any sense to be had.
Agreed.
All components using licensed USB technology are obligated to follow specifications.
It can negotiate power with Type-A ports just fine using cables which follow specifications. The port and the phone are not at issue here, no matter how much you want them to be.
It is monitoring voltage, but it cannot know current ratings of the system it is connected to without a marker or sign post, which is where the out of spec cable is defeating this process.
So the 6p is out of spec itself when it is being told, by an out of spec cable, that it is safe to draw 3A?
Conviently forgetting the cable.
Well, that would be safe because the 10A device could safely provide 3A.
Which is unsafe, because MATH. 3 > 2
There is just something fundamentally wrong with this way of thinking. I'd be a little more concerned if we had any damaged property, fires, or deaths, but since we haven't yet, everything must be OK. That's great.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The USB Type A port has only 4 pins. VDD (+5V), D- (Data-)-, D+ (Data+) and GND (Ground). No way for a Type C device to use the CC channel to negotiate. It knows it is plugged into a legacy facing port.
The PD knows if more power is available or not by monitoring the voltage of the bus. If the PD trys to draw more power than the charger is capable of delivering, then the bus voltage will deviate from reference specs. As long as the charger is capable of supplying the current requested, it will be able to maintain the voltage within reference specifications. This is why the Tronsmart guy says his 2.4A will deliver 2.7A. It has enough margin capacity to maintain proper voltage over it's rated amperage up to about 2.7A.
I love my 6P and think it is the best Android phone on the market. But there are things that could be improved. I would like 2 fingerprint sensors, one back and one front, but if you are only giving me one on a phone this big, it would be better on the front. And 5V/3A was a mistake. It is a cheaper solution to faster charging. What does it say when the 2 port charger from Google is not 30W and they have no 15Watt (5V/3A) car charger available at all.
dwswager said:
As long as the charger is capable of supplying the current requested, it will be able to maintain the voltage within reference specifications. This is why the Tronsmart guy says his 2.4A will deliver 2.7A. It has enough margin capacity to maintain proper voltage over it's rated amperage up to about 2.7A.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great for Tronsmart. Not so good for users when they use that cable to transfer data or charge on a laptop, USB hub, or other data centric / non-charger type device and the current ramps up to 3A on a generic USB 2.0, 500mA, Type A port and fries something.
You're arguing that the phone should monitor what it could / should be able to pull from the port. I'm arguing that the USB specs are more complicated that that, which are the specs the phone follows, that the legacy ports and charging protocols follow, and is the current real-life facts of the situtation - not wishful thinking or hypothesizing of what it should or could do.
Elnrik said:
Great for Tronsmart. Not so good for users when they use that cable to transfer data or charge on a laptop, USB hub, or other data centric / non-charger type device and the current ramps up to 3A on the USB 2.0 500mA Type A port and fries something.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you get a report of a port getting fried, will you please post it here. The more data we have, the better.
dwswager said:
When you get a report of a port getting fried, will you please post it here. The more data we have, the better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*sigh* People, don't use non-complaint cables, ok?
A Google engineer has publicly stated in several places that it is not safe and has even posted instructions on how to test for it.
PC Magazine even ran an article on it.
Hell... Common sense should tell you messing around with improper charging currents and voltages isn't safe.
Elnrik said:
*sigh* People, don't use non-complaint cables, ok?
A Google engineer has publicly stated in several places that it is not safe and has even posted instructions on how to test for it.
PC Magazine even ran an article on it.
Hell... Common sense should tell you messing around with improper charging currents and voltages isn't safe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*Sigh* This reminds me of all the negative Nexus 6P case reviews concerning the Laser Auto Focus by people without the phone or the case. They heard something on the internet and parroted it in review after review. Even the PC Magazine online entry is only a news items that repeats Benson's statements. No reporting of incidents, no comment from any company, including Google.
Has Google made an official statement? If this was such a big issue, does it not behoove Google to warn it's users?
I do not support manufacturers making out of spec equipment, including cables. Only that this is a whole lot of concern without a single verified case of incident.
I have a ton of Qualcomm quick chargers and I'm not feeling this Dash charge with its special cable restriction. I saw this adapter and from the reddit posts, it seems to work well. It even works with normal USB Type C cable. Does anyone have experience with it and the 6T?
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=SFC+AFC+VOOC+SCP&_sacat=0
I have some coming in the mail as we speak - I will let you know once I get them tested. There are supposedly some signaling differences between different OP versions, which may require a new adapter.
My take is that none of the WEB- adapters (on eBay) would work with the 6T, since that manufacturer is already selling a specialized adapter for OP beyond or equals to 5T. The WEB- adapters, however, offer a wider range of fast charge protocols as opposed to the YZXStudio adapter, which supports only VOOC-DASH. The YZXStudio adapter also has a current cap, which you can slightly adjust by soldering pins on the adapter itself. You are unlikely to get the full benefit of DASH from the YZXStudio adapter because of this cap, although your Quick Charge chargers most likely will be the limiting factor. Also note that the WEB- adapters require an input of at least 10 or so volts, so their A2A adapters will automatically request QC2/3 @ 12V. If your adapter does not support 12V, then it would not work properly. Your adapter should at least output 12V @ 1.5A for it to be any good after conversion losses.
This cable works although it seems to have gone out of stock.
COOYA OnePlus 6 Dash Type-C Charger Cable, 5V 4A Dash Charge USB C Cable Charging Rapidly, Braided USB Type C Fast Charger Cable Dash Charging for OnePlus 5T, OnePlus 5, OnePlus 3T, OnePlus 3 (6.6FT) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F3DYDC7
Jaxidian said:
This cable works although it seems to have gone out of stock.
COOYA OnePlus 6 Dash Type-C Charger Cable, 5V 4A Dash Charge USB C Cable Charging Rapidly, Braided USB Type C Fast Charger Cable Dash Charging for OnePlus 5T, OnePlus 5, OnePlus 3T, OnePlus 3 (6.6FT) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F3DYDC7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the OP is trying to avoid using OP specific cables but rather use a QC2/3-DASH adapter and a normal USB-C cable for charging the phone. That said, aftermarket cables are not that expensive on AliExpress, eBay, or even Amazon. Although if you insist, I would encourage that you get heavier gauge USB cables for this...
chowfun said:
I have some coming in the mail as we speak - I will let you know once I get them tested. There are supposedly some signaling differences between different OP versions, which may require a new adapter.
My take is that none of the WEB- adapters (on eBay) would work with the 6T, since that manufacturer is already selling a specialized adapter for OP beyond or equals to 5T. The WEB- adapters, however, offer a wider range of fast charge protocols as opposed to the YZXStudio adapter, which supports only VOOC-DASH. The YZXStudio adapter also has a current cap, which you can slightly adjust by soldering pins on the adapter itself. You are unlikely to get the full benefit of DASH from the YZXStudio adapter because of this cap, although your Quick Charge chargers most likely will be the limiting factor. Also note that the WEB- adapters require an input of at least 10 or so volts, so their A2A adapters will automatically request QC2/3 @ 12V. If your adapter does not support 12V, then it would not work properly. Your adapter should at least output 12V @ 1.5A for it to be any good after conversion losses.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the information. Please let me know what you can find. I do have QC adapters that support 12V. If there're adapters that works, I rather buy those instead of investing in new bricks, cables, car chargers, battery packs,... My other devices either support QC or PD. Investing in Dash charger doesn't make any sense at all.
chowfun said:
I think the OP is trying to avoid using OP specific cables but rather use a QC2/3-DASH adapter and a normal USB-C cable for charging the phone. That said, aftermarket cables are not that expensive on AliExpress, eBay, or even Amazon. Although if you insist, I would encourage that you get heavier gauge USB cables for this...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, then I misunderstood something. I did read it quickly.
Thanks for pointing out my error.
tengtengvn said:
Thank you for the information. Please let me know what you can find. I do have QC adapters that support 12V. If there're adapters that works, I rather buy those instead of investing in new bricks, cables, car chargers, battery packs,... My other devices either support QC or PD. Investing in Dash charger doesn't make any sense at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hear you - I did buy a multifunction car charger that supports both QC3.0 and DASH - I will report whether that works when it comes (hopefully later in the week if not the following week). I have also gotten the specialized versions from WEB- in China so once I get those I will let you know.
So I got one of the adapters today - this is an older version that does DC to Type C, so I did not expect it to work (even though it specifically listed VOOC and DASH support - maybe it worked for an older OP version).
This one was from eBay, and supposedly the seller sent me the wrong item (WEB- makes a 12V and a 20V PD version - and instead of the 20V version they sent me the 12V version instead - which can only decrease voltage due to the builtin buck converter inside).
So the question is - does it work with DASH charging? --- No, it did not. However, it is still an interesting adapter because it has broad fast charge technology support. They market this little adapter to convert your "dumb" laptop charger into a "multifunctional charger."
Interesting facts:
1. This adapter requires 12V for it to function. It does start turning on at around 11V or so, and anything below that will cause the output to shut off and the operation light to go red. The USB to USB version automatically requests QC @ 12V, but obviously, this cannot be done on a DC jack (on this particular version).
2. As soon as the voltage going in exceeds 11.5V, the output turns on with a steady blue status indication.
3. The USB-C version of this adapter supports USB-C Power Delivery (PD2.0) with three selectable voltages 5.00V @ 3.03A, 9.00V @ 2.39A, 12.00V @ 2.31A (there is a 20V version that supposedly does 15 and 20V as well for laptops, but the seller sent me the wrong version).
4. The input side is a 5.5 x 2.5 DC jack, which is somewhat odd as an input because most input jacks use the smaller 5.5 x 2.1 jack (you can use an adapter on it, however).
5. You can see from the tester that this adapter supports pretty much everything, except VOOC/DASH and 20V QC and AFC 12V.
6. QC 2.0 9V engages just fine to charge my older Nexus 6 via a USB-C to USB-A adapter (since the D+/D- lines are intact).
I do have more adapters coming in soon so I will let you know how they go once they come in (including the WEB- VOOC/DASH specialized USB-USB adapter). This particular version may be a fun adapter to play with, although it won't really help with DASH charging on the OnePlus.
tengtengvn said:
I have a ton of Qualcomm quick chargers and I'm not feeling this Dash charge with its special cable restriction. I saw this adapter and from the reddit posts, it seems to work well. It even works with normal USB Type C cable. Does anyone have experience with it and the 6T?
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=SFC+AFC+VOOC+SCP&_sacat=0
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bought the first one and tried in my car yesterday. With the cable come with OP6T, the DASH charging works! It shows charging rapidly. Cool!
thomast said:
I bought the first one and tried in my car yesterday. With the cable come with OP6T, the DASH charging works! It shows charging rapidly. Cool!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice. Can you link to the exact one that you bought? For it work with non dash cable?
chowfun said:
I do have more adapters coming in soon so I will let you know how they go once they come in (including the WEB- VOOC/DASH specialized USB-USB adapter). This particular version may be a fun adapter to play with, although it won't really help with DASH charging on the OnePlus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow. Thanks for the info. It looks like a good replacement for the Macbook 12 30W adapter. :laugh:
tengtengvn said:
Nice. Can you link to the exact one that you bought? For it work with non dash cable?
Wow. Thanks for the info. It looks like a good replacement for the Macbook 12 30W adapter. :laugh:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The seller is resending me the 20V version - will let you know how that goes
Just using anker usb3.0 cables i had from a previous phone. Dont really need to dash charge, this phone seems fast enough.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
dermotti said:
Just using anker usb3.0 cables i had from a previous phone. Dont really need to dash charge, this phone seems fast enough.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for letting us know but what point are you trying to make? :silly:
tengtengvn said:
Thanks for letting us know but what point are you trying to make? :silly:
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Lol somehow i posted in the wrong thread. Meant to post in the "what usbc are you using for your oneplus"
Facepalm
Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
Here's an update on the car adapter I have received. Note that the other adapters are still on the slow boat so I will get to them when they arrive. This isn't necessarily what you are after, but nonetheless, it's another interesting toy. If you are interested, it can be found on AliExpress under item number 32916499372.
This is a car charger that accepts 12-24V input, and also supposedly supports multiple fast charging technologies (DASH, VOOC, QC, etc). It comes with an "original" (questionable - but capable of 3.5A charge) DASH cable which is not bad at all for about $13.
Interesting facts:
1) The car charger comes with dual USB ports. One "quick charge" port and one "standard" port. The quick charge port lights up red on one side and the blue indicates the normal charge port. Some may like that it lights up, but my thought is that it's a waste of energy.
2) The Quick Charge port supports all available quick charge methods (the VOOC-DASH section don't light up probably because it doesn't use the same protocol for unblocking DASH charging that the original charger requires).
3) The charger does not require an ID chip on the USB-C cable (unlike the stock charger), which means you can use any USB-A to USB-C cable on the market to activate DASH charging (as long as the D+/D- pins are not shorted out). This car charger doesn't even have the odd PIN in the back of the USB connector for the ID communication.
4) The car charger is not as fast as the stock wall charger, which charges around 3.5A. Here are the test comparisons (allow some current variances due to battery percentage ~70-72% - note all of them had the lightning bolt on the charging indicator which indicated that DASH was indeed activated with none of these cables having D+/D- shorted):
a) Normal, 1 ft USB-A to C Cable: 2.46A
b) Bundled DASH cable, w/ car charger: 2.73A
c) Bundled DASH cable, w/ stock wall charger: 3.5A
d) Normal, 3 ft (Rankie) USB C Cable: 2.56A
e) Normal, 3 ft MicroUSB w/ USB-C Adapter (ANKER): 1.95A
f) Normal, 3 ft multi (MicroUSB + Type C) free conference charging cable: 1.32A (this one did not "pass" the fast charging test because the current is below 1.5A but nonetheless it triggered DASH charging).
Not a big difference if you use quality cables, although don't expect it to charge as fast as the wall charger - nonetheless, it is still doing pretty well with less heat generated due to lesser current.
5) As mentioned previously, the charger supports multiple charging technologies besides DASH, where it activated QC 2.0 9V on my Nexus 6 just fine.
6) Since this adapter allows 12-24V DC input, you can use a DC to lighter adapter to power this device (as you can see in my screenshots I used a laptop battery pack and a 12V router wall brick and it was able to turn on and charge my devices just fine.) This may also be a good way to have a longer reach charging solution since DASH is very cable sensitive and it is best to keep the cable length short to minimize the reduction in charging currents.
Here's a test of the 100 cm noodle cable on AliExpress (item 32806193071):
Using the stock wall charger, charging the phone @ ~50%:
The genuine OnePlus cable was able to charge at 3.657A @ 4.69V (17.15W).
The noodle cable on AliExpress was able to charge at 3.617A @ 4.81V (17.4W).
Based on the results, it seemed like the quality was as good as the genuine cable, at least the copper that is carrying the power to the phone.
Here are the test results of the final adapter I received from WEB- (the specialized VOOC-DASH version - Taobao Item #560336325713):
Stuff to note:
1) This adapter is very similar to the car adapter, in which it supports pretty much all quick charge technologies and it does not require the OnePlus ID chip to activate DASH charging. However, this adapter is QC activated and has a USB-A input interface. Like the car charger, this charger is also not as fast as the stock wall brick, although it is still relatively quick.)
2) The USB pinout schematic also looks the same as the car charger (USB 2.0 with no dangling USB 3.0 pin in the back for ID chip identification).
3) Like the other 12V based WEB- adapters, this one uses the IP6518C chipset, which supports a wide voltage input (10.5V - 32V - from the chipset datasheet).
4) The board looks fairly similar to the USB-C board, except this one has a USB-A input (which is interesting because the board has the DC 12V-24V marking on it still).
5) The board also has the POW and OK lights similar to the USB-C version.
6) Since the board accepts broad input voltages, it is not required to use QC for the input voltage. A USB-A to 5.5 x 2.1 adapter could be used to also provide the DC input, as long as the voltage is above 10.5V.
7) Although the board indeed supports down stepping a 20V DC input, it seems like it is a bit less efficient in doing so than a 12V input.
8) Similar to the previous cable tests, the quality and the length of the cable really makes a difference. The shorter and the better quality cable that is used, the better the charging rate (remember that an official cable does not need to be used for third-party chargers).
9) As mentioned previously, this charger supports other fast charging technologies, like QC2.0 - which works fine in charging my Nexus 6 at 9V.
10) This charger / adapter essentially allows any 12V @ 1.5A output to be a multifunction fast charger w/ DASH support. In my example, I used a Xiaomi router wall brick (12 V @ 1.5A DC) and it charges my phone using DASH at almost 3A output using a short 1ft USB-C cable! (the phone registers the current slightly lower at around 2750mA).
Great info, @chowfun. I was able to purchase 2 OPPO wall chargers from Asia and a 3rd party VOOC car charger which work great.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=78182174&postcount=24
I also got the same oneplus flat cable but 150cm length. It works good with no notable slow down.
From your findings, it looks like the WEB- adapter charge slower but that's still plenty fast and much more convenience. :good: Does it generate a lot of heat when charging a low battery?
Nice keyboard, I like it. ?
That said, the Quick9 charger you bought probably does not require the ID chip as far as DASH is concerned. I didn't get that one because it had a lower current rating and that the top of the charger is wider than the other one I bought. I doubt the OPPO charger would work with a regular microUSB cable since I presume that it also requires the chip on the cable end... Did you also see what kind of maximum currents you are seeing on those chargers?
Heat wise, it does generate a bit of heat with the conversion. But given that the adapter is housed in an aluminum case it's to be expected. It feels just slightly warm to the touch, but not exactly hot to the touch. Instead of that conversion being done in the phone it's just being done outside the phone which is directing the heat away from the battery...
chowfun said:
Nice keyboard, I like it.
That said, the Quick9 charger you bought probably does not require the ID chip as far as DASH is concerned. I doubt the OPPO charger would work with a regular microUSB cable since I presume that it also requires the chip on the cable end... Did you also see what kind of maximum currents you are seeing on those charges?
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LOL. My wife doesn't like those RGB lights. lol
The input and output of the OPPO charger look exactly the same as the 1+ charger. It's pretty much identical except for the cosmetic (logo, prints, the USB A female is green). They're selling for $4.
On another thread, Berkowich made mention that Tab S4 supports PD Power, but not CH3.
These were not terms I was familiar with, so I turned to Google... So QC, QC 2.0 and QC 3.0 make sense. The "adaptive fast charger" in the box with the Tab S4 has outputs at 5 & 9 volts, so I assume it is QC 2.0 and it switches between 5V and 9V as the battery is filled to more efficiently charge the battery. But I see QC2 talks about 5V, 9V and 12V. So is this the same and/or safe? And it isn't clear to me how PD Chargers are different? Just more current? Are they safe for the Tab S4? What is the type of non-Samsung charger to buy?
Thanks
Joe
PD typically refers to USB Power Delivery, which is a fast charging specification developed by the non-profit USB-IF organization. It is the actual open-industry standard.
Quick Charge, even though it is in many devices, is actually a proprietary standard owned by Qualcomm. Some device manufacturers choose to not implement QC even when they use Qualcomm chips in order to save on licensing fees.
QC 2.0 & 3.0 are not in compliance with the USB-PD specifications. However, QC 4.0 is.
Samsung has its own quick charging technology and only some but not all of their devices are compatible with QC 2.0 standard.
USB-PD - https://www.usb.org/usb-charger-pd
Official Certified QC device list - https://www.qualcomm.com/documents/quick-charge-device-list (Note that the Tab S4 is nowhere on the list)
Let me reask the question....
I have have several different types of chargers... Older 1A and less chargers from miscellaneous devices. A few 2.4A / 5V chargers that either came or were purchased for older devices I have around the house. Two Samsung Adaptive Fast chargers (9V/1.67A + 5V/2A), one that came with the Tab S4 and another that came with an S7 Edge.
So which of these is optimum for charging the Tab S4?
Will the 2.4A charger be slower than the 2A adaptive charger?
Is there another type of charger that would work better for the S4?
Can some chargers damage the S4?
Does it make a difference if I'm using an HDMI/USB hub? (Mine always says I'm slow charging / draining the battery when I plug the 2A adaptive charger into the hub.)
Thanks for your help -- this is a more complicated subject than I thought.
Edit: there's a link on the charge time thread that leads to another link that helps answer some of my questions.
https://www.xda-developers.com/charging-comparison-oneplus-huawei/
https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/how-does-fast-charging-work/
This seems to say that the best bet is a Samsung adaptive charger or a QC 2.0 charger that will throttle back to Samsung's standard.
This doesn't answer what is best when using a hub, and what dangers there might be using non Samsung chargers.
On a related subject, years ago I learned that all USB 2.0 charging cables were not equal -- that you need to look at the gauge of the charging wires, and that you could have huge differences in charge speed based on the cable you used. Are all USB C cables equal with respect to charging? Or do you need to look for fatter gauage / bigger wires to get more current / less voltage drop over the cable?
thanks,
Joe
drjoe1 said:
Let me reask the question....
I have have several different types of chargers... Older 1A and less chargers from miscellaneous devices. A few 2.4A / 5V chargers that either came or were purchased for older devices I have around the house. Two Samsung Adaptive Fast chargers (9V/1.67A + 5V/2A), one that came with the Tab S4 and another that came with an S7 Edge.
So which of these is optimum for charging the Tab S4?
Will the 2.4A charger be slower than the 2A adaptive charger?
Is there another type of charger that would work better for the S4?
Can some chargers damage the S4?
Does it make a difference if I'm using an HDMI/USB hub? (Mine always says I'm slow charging / draining the battery when I plug the 2A adaptive charger into the hub.)
Thanks for your help -- this is a more complicated subject than I thought.
Edit: there's a link on the charge time thread that leads to another link that helps answer some of my questions.
https://www.xda-developers.com/charging-comparison-oneplus-huawei/
https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/how-does-fast-charging-work/
This seems to say that the best bet is a Samsung adaptive charger or a QC 2.0 charger that will throttle back to Samsung's standard.
This doesn't answer what is best when using a hub, and what dangers there might be using non Samsung chargers.
On a related subject, years ago I learned that all USB 2.0 charging cables were not equal -- that you need to look at the gauge of the charging wires, and that you could have huge differences in charge speed based on the cable you used. Are all USB C cables equal with respect to charging? Or do you need to look for fatter gauage / bigger wires to get more current / less voltage drop over the cable?
thanks,
Joe
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Actually does someone that has an accurate usb meter help us. When i look for the charging support for the Snapdragon 835 on the web, it says QC4.0 but i can't find any QC4.0 chargers and i think it is the same with PD that i say on the other thread (it is just a think by the way because there is no QC4.0 chargers soo it is maybe a PD equivalent).
By the way when you are using the HDMI dongle(just HDMI and charging) did you use the original charger and the cable because there is no slow charging notification when i use it?