Is there a reason why every custom ROM seems to go treble? There's no real proven benefit when having unofficial treble. As one of the LineageOS devs said on their subreddit:
You don't get treble. You have it or you don't. All those "ported treble" are plain fake and they don't have the same capabilities of the "real" treble (the one that you have on your device out of the box or from your manufacturer as a stock ROM update).
This because treble requires appropriate changes to the proprietary files (those stored on the vendor partition) that a device without "stock/real" treble won't have
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There's only one partition instead of both. The one for seamless updates is missing (I think).
As for treble ROMs, they are pretty much a gimmick unless devs actually make use of them. But I have seen reddit comments about people trying out generic system images via treble TWRP: https://www.reddit.com/r/Xiaomi/comments/8ac2gc/project_treble_is_amazing_and_because_of_this_my/
You can try it for yourself: https://forum.xda-developers.com/pr...-development/experimental-phh-treble-t3709659
https://www.xda-developers.com/flash-generic-system-image-project-treble-device/
What this could mean is, in 2 years if dev support drops for the Note 4, you may still be able to get the most recent version of AOSP or some other ROM as a generic system image. No need to wait around for devs to create ROMs or compile one yourself.
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Hello!
I have been following annual Google I/O 2017 and heard about all the benefits of Google's Project Treble.
I cannot help but wonder how are developers (for example here at XDA) able to create custom roms or unofficial Android updates. Why Google can't make official Android Nougat update for Nexus 7 2013, but you here at XDA can. What is different between your work and Google's when it comes to these things, as far as neither has access to hardware manufacturer's code support.
I have to say I am not a professional software developer, so I understand if this topic is beyond my comprehension.
Thank you!
"Why Google can't make official Android Nougat update for Nexus 7 2013"
Planned obsolescence.
"neither has access to hardware manufacturer's code support"
Google is obliged to release kernel source code because Linux(the kernel powering Android) is released under the GPL. The kernel is responsible for letting Android "talk" to the hardware. Developers at XDA can then modify the open-source kernel to "fit" newer versions of Android.
I'd like to chime in on this.
Let's use the Nexus 7 2013 as an example. The difference between what an official build of Nougat from Google would be and what a build of Nougat from XDA is that the Google released one will have updated devices drivers that are made specifically for Nougat, while the XDA released one simply uses the older device drivers and hope they work. In some cases they work flawlessly (mostly on Nexus devices), however other times there are things that don't work so they either need to be disabled or worked around. So essentially a Google released OS has everything updated and tested to work with the new OS, while XDA releases are more 'hacked' together to work (simply because the device drivers aren't Open Source). Google may not have access to the hardware drivers, but they still get them updated.
Now let's touch on Project Treble (and why I am so excited about it). Instead of each and every device driver needing to be upgraded and tested for each new OS version, the OS version will specify which version of the drivers (HAL's) will work with the OS. This means there will be a separate space where all the device drivers will reside, and the OS will simply load those when booting (no more proprietary binary blobs to include in the ROM! hopefully...).
This means on any Project Treble compatible device (all phones that ship with Oreo, and some that update to Oreo) with an unlocked bootloader, a user can simply compile AOSP and flash it directly to the device with no modifications and have the device work. I believe this is actually a requirement to pass Google's certification process for new devices with Oreo. That means, say, with the LG v30 if the bootloader is unlocked, there can be an AOSP ROM on day one of its release.
So instead of Android being strictly a per device compile, it is just a general compile (sans device specific features). However, this doesn't remove the old driver issue. If the drivers in their respective partition no longer are updated by the manufacturer, the later AOSP code will need to be modified to work around these (and accept them). This is still easier in my opinion than the binary blobs.
As for official updates, Project Treble allows device hardware manufacturers to work on updating the device drivers while the OS Dev (Samsung, etc) works on updating their OS. So it is a parallel development instead of a serial one (hardware AND os instead of hardware THEN os).
A question.
Do the Nexus 5X devices have the Treble system or project incorporated with Oreo?
I do not understand the other manufacturers that cheaper excuses are giving, it is true that they are not obliged but I think it would be good practice, maybe they think as before that you will not buy them a phone.
Does someone make a Change.org or similar campaign to ask all Android manufacturers to make a minimum effort?
Is it end of less popular custom ROMs..??
Or is it end of Custom ROM itself..??
What will be the future..??
XDA will fill with kernels and vendor images..??
syamkumar.tpl said:
Is it end of less popular custom ROMs..??
Or is it end of Custom ROM itself..??
What will be the future..??
XDA will fill with kernels and vendor images..??
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You can't say. No one can. There are still thousands of legacy and old devices which are getting the traditional custom rom support. Uptill now. But to answer your question regarding vendor images. That could be great because. If one custom vendor.img file is made for a treble device. 95% of the other devices with treble support can boot that too. Just like phussons aosp vendor.img file.
This isn't definetly not the end. But a beginning of a new era. Treble supported custom rom vendor.img will make more roms available to more devices. Since the work pressure of devs is greatly reduced in porting it.
syamkumar.tpl said:
Is it end of less popular custom ROMs..??
Or is it end of Custom ROM itself..??
What will be the future..??
XDA will fill with kernels and vendor images..??
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Click to collapse
I am slightly confused. I thought that Treble was all about portable system images (GSI). In my understanding (which may well be wrong) the vendor images are (and must be) device-specific, but the GSIs are meant to be generalised. So, if there is a decent Mido vendor image (either from Xiaomi, or XDA members), we should be able to flash any GSI made by anybody - Google, Samsung, OnePlus, Xiaomi, Huawei, or whatever. Also, anybody should be able to customise any GSI to make their own GSI (e.g., by adding root, tweaking build.prop, or any other such). And, anybody should be able to build their own GSI, without worrying about the underlying hardware. If this is all correct, then I would imagine that there would be even more custom ROMs (i.e., GSIs). I would probably cook my own as well.
Will we get android pie roms?
i am really interested in the pixel experience.
I was a mtk user and a porter ...can i port other pie rom like xiaomi note 4's with same kernel version ?
i am new so treat me like a noob:good:
mona356 said:
Will we get android pie roms?
i am really interested in the pixel experience.
I was a mtk user and a porter ...can i port other pie rom like xiaomi note 4's with same kernel version ?
i am new so treat me like a noob:good:
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I'm very sad to see R5+ development is currently dead. I was hoping someone would build a Pixel Experience or any AOSP based ROM for our device but even the oreo roms are dead or finalized already. So i don't think people have anymore interest in R5+..
bdogan1912 said:
I'm very sad to see R5+ development is currently dead. I was hoping someone would build a Pixel Experience or any AOSP based ROM for our device but even the oreo roms are dead or finalized already. So i don't think people have anymore interest in R5+..
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The real problem is lack of updated Oreo kernel sources (how much less Pie). This means, for example, that certain display panels (eg, ebbg) cannot be supported by custom ROMs (you might have to go back to Nougat kernels for that).
Why not write to Xiaomi to release up-to-date Oreo kernel sources for vince in the first instance? If enough people make a fuss, perhaps something will happen ...
DarthJabba9 said:
The real problem is lack of updated Oreo kernel sources (how much less Pie). This means, for example, that certain display panels (eg, ebbg) cannot be supported by custom ROMs (you might have to go back to Nougat kernels for that).
Why not write to Xiaomi to release up-to-date Oreo kernel sources for vince in the first instance? If enough people make a fuss, perhaps something will happen ...
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Xiaomi however isn't listening their customers. A big example is ARB system which absolutely destroys devices. So i guess we are gonna stay dead until something shows up..
Hi!
i am new to the treble-enabled stuff, this is the first phone i own that is treble capable and i have a few questions. I think they can apply to other NOBS, so here i go hoping some nice guy will help me understand:
Background: i have the redmi 5plus (global) which i have unlocked (after painful 720h) and i have flashed Pixel Experience 8.1 rom, but i like to experiment and it seems most of interesting roms are on treble.
1. By default, "vince" is not treble enabled. (treble check app says so)
2. "vince" seems to be an "A only" device, not A/B device,
Main Question: Now, what should i do to try (safely) some GSI roms (like here XDA LOS 16 GSI)?
Sub-Question 1: I must most likely flash some other things first, i guess... like a vendor or a treble image? Where do i find it?
Sub-Question 2: I have installed TRWP recovery, is it treble enabled or should i ALSO find a treble enabled recovery?
If i got it all wrong, please i would be happy to stand corrected!
Hi.
Well, yeah, you need to install another vendor, as far as I know, OrangeFox is the treble enabled recovery.
Someone already explained this in this post.
Have fun. :fingers-crossed:
Xyzko said:
Hi.
Well, yeah, you need to install another vendor, as far as I know, OrangeFox is the treble enabled recovery.
Someone already explained this in this post.
Have fun. :fingers-crossed:
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Thank you! Sometimes hard to find the right threads...
Installed orangefox, cool recovery!
One last question... how does kernel works with treble? Do i need treble enabled kernels if i want to change the kernel? Are they provided with the treble-enabled rom already or i get to keep the existing kernel? Is the kernel on a dedicated partition separated from the GSI and the Vendor? (i am starting to understand this, maybe)?
gardiol said:
Thank you! Sometimes hard to find the right threads...
Installed orangefox, cool recovery!
One last question... how does kernel works with treble? Do i need treble enabled kernels if i want to change the kernel? Are they provided with the treble-enabled rom already or i get to keep the existing kernel? Is the kernel on a dedicated partition separated from the GSI and the Vendor? (i am starting to understand this, maybe)?
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Months ago it started to appear some projects about android 9.0 before of Google revealed it as android Pie, then at this time devices with treble support also can support GSIs from these projects according two specific conditions: the processor (first qualcomm, then exynos, kirin and mtk were supported) and kind of partition system A-A/B.
At this first times was needed to flash a vendor treble supported rom to add treble support and flash over it a GSI 9.0. without the need to flash other kernel.
In this forum there are a lot of GSIs that eventually could work in our device but it could be many bugs https://forum.xda-developers.com/project-treble/trebleenabled-device-development.
Now is not needed to complicate the job flashing a vendor, then a GSI and maybe a custom treblized kernel so started to appear first developments of roms running 9.0 and these roms will work as exactly did it any rom 7.1 or 8.1, in the future they could be include treble support.
This is the short story.
Just received this phone, and want to install a custom ROM on it. I have only two requirements:
1. Must support exFAT on external storage (including the micro sd card). No reason exists now for ROMs not to have this - Microsoft released the specification last year, and the Linux kernel now contains the code for it.
2. Must NOT have gapps installed (with preference given to ROMs that have microG installed, or at the very least are microG ready).
Any suggestions? Thank you in advance.
I did installed MIUI 11 and it's good but Pixel Experience is better and then again but Android 10 is comming to Mi A3!
Just wait till the end of the month!
hdnote said:
I did installed MIUI 11 and it's good but Pixel Experience is better and then again but Android 10 is comming to Mi A3!
Just wait till the end of the month!
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I don't believe that any of those meet my requirement of a Google-free ROM.
n.p. said:
I don't believe that any of those meet my requirement of a Google-free ROM.
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There are quite a number of gapps-free ROMs, one of the popular one is LineageOS. (I don't know if it support exFAT tho, you can always try it)
MarcusMario0605 said:
There are quite a number of gapps-free ROMs, one of the popular one is LineageOS. (I don't know if it support exFAT tho, you can always try it)
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I am quite aware of LineageOS (and yes, it does support exFAT). Even better, a microG subsite (https://lineage.microg.org/) automatically rebuilds all LineageOS ROMs with microG support. However, LineageOS ROMs only exist for a few devices (just over a dozen Xiaomi phones, and specifically NOT, at least yet, including the A3). I hope they will add official support for it soon (and that will become my choice). In the meantime (particularly if the A3 never gets added to the list of supported devices), I continue to look for an alternative (as evidenced by creating this thread).
there is a section here with lot of ROMs, just use your time and read them.