So i already installed Viper4Arise, now i would love to get dolby atmos but i wonder if i would use something bigger, what is the barrier? can i use arise sound systems without su.d or there are more limits than boot scripts?
Just wondering..
What soundcard are you using?
Do you have 5.1 audio?
Does this viper4arise, bypass the android framework limit? (like Usb audio player pro with dac)
Can you hear...better sound?
Cheers
But how? Could you share pls?
mitchell4you said:
Just wondering..
What soundcard are you using?
Do you have 5.1 audio?
Does this viper4arise, bypass the android framework limit? (like Usb audio player pro with dac)
Can you hear...better sound?
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i got some realtec hd audio card (i was able to use 5.1 on windows)
Hmm.. Windows?
Not Remixos...??
Anyway...Atmos is great,but only useful if you have 5.1 speakers (or more)
Even then.. i doubt your realtek card can drive the large speakers
___
If you are limited to headphones...
there are lots of players that support dsp/sound effects on gmarked (free and paid)
*i like jetaudio bongiovidps with dragonfly usdac
Many of you included myself complain about stock music player. It has uncountable problems but as far as I know it is the only player which can use the built in high end DAC. The most annoying thing is that it plays song in alphabetic order if files appear at all and secondly it is very slow.
I would suggest a temporary solution what I did and it works perfectly so far.
Delete all playlist (m3u, cue etc.).
Remove a metadata from files too.
Remove all songs with metadata from the phone!!!
Delete all record from "My Playlist" in the initial screen. (I was able to do it just one by one)
Reset Music Player by deleting cache and data in Application Settings
Reboot phone
Then open Music Player and play songs from Folder option. It will be enough fast and all songs appear and in filename order.
In order to remove metadata from files I would suggest using Mp3tag
http://www.mp3tag.de/en/
If you collect your files in any structure on the PC, all you can do is to move root folder into Mp3tag screen, select all songs and remove tags by right clicking. Then you can copy files to phone.
!!! Be careful !!!
Don't remove tags from your archive music folder. You cannot undo. Always create temporary folder and copy wishing music files there in order to remove metadata (tags).
Good lock!
obladi64 said:
as far as I know it is the only player which can use the built in high end DAC.
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where the heck did you read this load of bull?
Flaîm said:
where the heck did you read this load of bull?
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I have read discussions about it but no one was sure in any other player uses it obviously. If you know such please share it with evidence too. Thanks in advance.
obladi64 said:
I have read discussions about it but no one was sure in any other player uses it obviously. If you know such please share it with evidence too. Thanks in advance.
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Click to collapse
unless your device somehow is capable of utilizing magic to process and output audio there's nothing but the only active DAC to do this task, which you can set in your audio settings.
edit: sorry for being a sarcastic ****
Flaîm said:
unless your device somehow is capable of utilizing magic to process and output audio there's nothing but the only active DAC to do this task, which you can set in your audio settings.
edit: sorry for being a sarcastic ****
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except there is two DAC for output : AKM and SD820 built-in.
Flaîm said:
unless your device somehow is capable of utilizing magic to process and output audio there's nothing but the only active DAC to do this task, which you can set in your audio settings.
edit: sorry for being a sarcastic ****
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok I was not so precize. Other players don't use AKM dac directly. They do it just via Android which convert all audio input to 48/16 output. Let me know if I am wrong but justify it with something please. Of course then this stream goes to AKM DAC but this not the way we wish it. I welcome any non stock player which can drive dac directly in same way as stock one does. Sooner or later it will be available hopefully but now I don't know any.
If the "Headset HiFi" control in Settings is to switch between SD820 and AKM DACs, then I'm able to use the AKM DAC with other media players that pass audio processing/decoding to the OS (as opposed to fancier players that utilize their own built-in decoding methods/codecs). In my music player of choice (Clean Music), I can switch between the two "Headset HiFi" options (Standard & Super) in the middle of a song and, after a pause to transition, hear a difference between them.
obladi64 said:
Ok I was not so precize. Other players don't use AKM dac directly. They do it just via Android which convert all audio input to 48/16 output. Let me know if I am wrong but justify it with something please. Of course then this stream goes to AKM DAC but this not the way we wish it. I welcome any non stock player which can drive dac directly in same way as stock one does. Sooner or later it will be available hopefully but now I don't know any.
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Click to collapse
didnt know of that. any sources that this is the case?
edit:
according to this documentation it should be a systemwide default value - unless ZTE ****ed that up
https://developer.android.com/reference/android/media/AudioFormat.html
xtermmin said:
If the "Headset HiFi" control in Settings is to switch between SD820 and AKM DACs, then I'm able to use the AKM DAC with other media players that pass audio processing/decoding to the OS (as opposed to fancier players that utilize their own built-in decoding methods/codecs). In my music player of choice (Clean Music), I can switch between the two "Headset HiFi" options (Standard & Super) in the middle of a song and, after a pause to transition, hear a difference between them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have bad news which is good news actually. SD820 DAC is not used in A7 at all. There are two additional DACs and one ADC. "AKM AK4961 DSP CODEC, which can be considered the primary chipset for Hi-Fi audio playback and recording. The AKM AK4490EN DAC is an independent Hi-Fi audio sampler". This later is what you turn on when set "Headset HiFi" option. So SD820 ADC/DAC don't play at all.
http://www.androidauthority.com/taking-audio-next-level-zte-axon-7-706898/
and same is on ZTE site as well.
I have doubts that you can hear the difference between the two AKM chips while you don't between Clean Player and the built in ZTE player. Although I don't listen 4961 but I do Clean Player. The difference is significant especially if record is 44.1 kHz because conversion of it to 48 kHz is more difficult than of 96kHz record.
obladi64 said:
I have bad news which is good news actually. SD820 DAC is not used in A7 at all. There are two additional DACs and one ADC. "AKM AK4961 DSP CODEC, which can be considered the primary chipset for Hi-Fi audio playback and recording. The AKM AK4490EN DAC is an independent Hi-Fi audio sampler". This later is what you turn on when set "Headset HiFi" option. So SD820 ADC/DAC don't play at all.
http://www.androidauthority.com/taking-audio-next-level-zte-axon-7-706898/
and same is on ZTE site as well.
I have doubts that you can hear the difference between the two AKM chips while you don't between Clean Player and the built in ZTE player. Although I don't listen 4961 but I do Clean Player. The difference is significant especially if record is 44.1 kHz because conversion of it to 48 kHz is more difficult than of 96kHz record.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, the SD820 DAC is used and enabled. People with fancy players like PowerAmp (the latest alpha) report that in the app's settings, the only DAC that shows up in the list is the SD820 DAC. No AKM DAC listed.
I'm not an audiophile or anything, but when I have Super selected, the audio has a little more of a "punch" to it, while Standard I can kinda hear a bit of a ceiling. (this is all without ATMOS, of course)
xtermmin said:
Actually, the SD820 DAC is used and enabled. People with fancy players like PowerAmp (the latest alpha) report that in the app's settings, the only DAC that shows up in the list is the SD820 DAC. No AKM DAC listed.
I'm not an audiophile or anything, but when I have Super selected, the audio has a little more of a "punch" to it, while Standard I can kinda hear a bit of a ceiling. (this is all without ATMOS, of course)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
SD820 in Poweramp: I cannot say anything pro or contra. I try to be smart from commercial b...ts. I don't know any well detailed technical quide. Based on these as engineer I would say that SD820 DAC is not used at all. Phone reports SD820 DAC for third party softwares due to compatibility reason but in real AKM chips works. Like I said I don't know it surly but most likely. I am also searching for the correct answer.
I believe that you hear the difference especialy if PowerAmp turns SD820 on somehow.
Otherwise the two AKM chips are different therefore they should sound differently. To hear it is just question of headphone price. Of course it is without ATMOS.
guess we need @rikin93 to use his contacts to get a definitive answer
Flaîm said:
didnt know of that. any sources that this is the case?
edit:
according to this documentation it should be a systemwide default value - unless ZTE ****ed that up
https://developer.android.com/reference/android/media/AudioFormat.html
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Click to collapse
No. It is justify my concern rather.
"Expressed in Hz, the sample rate in an AudioFormat instance expresses the number of audio samples for each channel per second in the content you are playing or recording. It is not the sample rate at which content is rendered or produced. For instance a sound at a media sample rate of 8000Hz can be played on a device operating at a sample rate of 48000Hz; the sample rate conversion is automatically handled by the platform, it will not play at 6x speed."
obladi64 said:
No. It is justify my concern rather.
"Expressed in Hz, the sample rate in an AudioFormat instance expresses the number of audio samples for each channel per second in the content you are playing or recording. It is not the sample rate at which content is rendered or produced. For instance a sound at a media sample rate of 8000Hz can be played on a device operating at a sample rate of 48000Hz; the sample rate conversion is automatically handled by the platform, it will not play at 6x speed."
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Click to collapse
you missed the important part:
As of API M, sample rates up to 192kHz are supported for AudioRecord and AudioTrack, with sample rate conversion performed as needed. To improve efficiency and avoid lossy conversions, it is recommended to match the sample rate for AudioRecord and AudioTrack to the endpoint device sample rate, and limit the sample rate to no more than 48kHz unless there are special device capabilities that warrant a higher rate.
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Click to collapse
which means that it can be programmed to output at 192 khz, but 48 khz should be the default value if there's no additional hardware.
or am i just misinterpreting this whole paragraph?
so either no player can play at 192 khz, or every player plays at 192 khz
Flaîm said:
you missed the important part:
which means that it can be programmed to output at 192 khz, but 48 khz should be the default value if there's no additional hardware.
or am i just misinterpreting this whole paragraph?
so either no player can play at 192 khz, or every player plays at 192 khz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, someting like that. Since it is Androud part it is 48 kHz. I used Clean player as altarnative and I prove that there is difference between this and stock.
So as I understand it says that every source is converted to 48kHz and this is sent to dac. You can play 44.1 or 192 kHz source it doesn't matter streams will be converted to 48. Stock player alone can bypass it so far. And it is important in case of CDs as well becuase 44.1 to 48 conversion is the one of the ugliest thing can happen here.
obladi64 said:
Yes, someting like that. Since it is Androud part it is 48 kHz. I used Clean player as altarnative and I prove that there is difference between this and stock.
So as I understand it says that every source is converted to 48kHz and this is sent to dac. You can play 44.1 or 192 kHz source it doesn't matter streams will be converted to 48. Stock player alone can bypass it so far. And it is important in case of CDs as well becuase 44.1 to 48 conversion is the one of the ugliest thing can happen here.
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Click to collapse
i just tested listening to some flacs in my regular player, vlc player and the zte player with my beyerdynamic custom one pro. either all of them were outputting the same format, or i am just not able to hear the difference.
Flaîm said:
i just tested listening to some flacs in my regular player, vlc player and the zte player with my beyerdynamic custom one pro. either all of them were outputting the same format, or i am just not able to hear the difference.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I am not fan of VLC Player therefore it is not installed on my phone. May be I felt wrongly and there is no difference because it doesn't exist at all and every player drives DAC appropriately. All I know is that I listened music by Clean Music for weeks and than I exchanged to ZTE player. Going through the music repertoire I was surprised. Anyway I am human too.
After all the fact is that you didn't here difference proves only one thing, namely you cannot hear the difference. Here and now.
I will study developer link what you suggested more thoroughly and also I am still waiting for the correct technical details from Android experts. Until I use ZTE player which works fine in above mentioned way. All song appears, all in order, no lag and sound brilliant. What else is needed?
Music Player DAC issue **Fixed**
Hi, I have a fix to using the DAC on non-stock music apps.
So I received my Axon yesterday.
Ipgraded from the Lenovo Vibe X3. I first ran in on the DAC problem on the X3.
In my experience all of these dedicated DAC phones follow the same approach, i.e., LG V10, Vivo Xplay 5, Vibe X3, Axon 7, and (I as sum) LG V20 as well.
There is already a thread on XDA explaining this in detail. -> http://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v10/general/music-apps-using-dac-t3252596
In short, the apps listed on the V10 page will use the DAC. Although the Vibe X3 had a dedicated DAC toggle, and the Axon 7 doesn't.
To test whether the DAC is being used by a music app on the Axon 7 is:
1. Plugin high fidelity headphones (so you will be able to hear and verify the difference in music), if you can do it with regular earphones/headphones, good for you. and kickass hearing btw
2. Play music on the music app you want to test. (Refer the LG link I posted)
3. while the music s running in the background, go to Settings -> Sounds & Vibration -> Headset Hi-Fi -> and switch between Standard & Super settings.
IF that app is using the DAC, you'll notice a slight pause (when the DAC switches on/off) and of course the difference in sound quality.
Note: Switch Dolby off or ignore it when testing the app, cos for some reason switching Dolby Atmos on/off produces the same gap in playback as the DAC.
On the Vibe X3 it didn't.
I used to use PowerAmp earlier, cos I found that best for my taste.
Then I discovered Neutron, and fell in love with that.
However then I bought a DAC phone & both Power-amp & Neutron don't use the DAC(or I wasn't able to make them)
As per a lot of users online "Poweramp Alpha" can be made to use the DAC on such phones, somehow. I tried fiddling around with it, got fed-up & left it.
If someone has the patience to figure it out AND explain it to me, I'd be grateful, cos Poweramp is my player of choice in terms of UI & ease of usability.
Neutrons latest changelogs mention it can use DAC usage as an update. But I can't notice the difference in the method listed above, or maybe its referring to USB DACs.
Now my player of choice adter going through the list of DAC supported music apps is Pulsar. - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.rhmsoft.pulsar
Reason being, I found it to be the lightest/cleanest player which supports the DAC and can relatively smoothly handle my 10K+ collection of 320kbps MP3 & FLAC collection.
You guys can go through the list of apps on the LG V10 page and decide. which suits you best.
h/t @stupc. I've found his thread to be the most informative and bang on in solving the problem of 3rd party DAC phones throughout the net. And trust me, I've searched. Went crazy trying to solve this when I first bought the X3
Hope this helps.
Mods: Please move the post/thread to the appropriate section if required and close the thread as solved.
Hit Thanks if this helped.
Evil0verlord said:
[...]
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thank you for your answer.
the method to check whether the seperate DAC is being used supports my observation, that i wasnt able to hear a difference between all 3 players i've used.
but i guess the question remains whether the output is in 48khz or 192khz for all of them :/
I'm sceptical about the differing sound quality when switching the "Headset HiFi" setting. I noticed that the volume increases significantly when the setting is on, and goes quieter when switched off. This is a well known and proven psychological sales tactic for audio. The human brain subconsciously associates louder sound to be of higher quality.
In this case it would be very difficult to perfectly volume match the on/off setting of the "Headset HiFi" toggle for a proper blind test. I don't believe any user testing can be trusted unless it's done blind, as confirmation bias could easily take precedence.
Some good reading:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychoacoustics
EDIT: I just did some more rudimentary testing with consumer quality mp3s and the ZTE music app, toggling the Headset HiFi setting on/off. The difference in frequency response is very noticeable even when not using high end FLAC encodings. There are significant bumps in bass and treble, even when compared to other sources I have with known flat sound signatures.
So you're asking, what does this mean? There's two scenarios:
1) if the Headset HiFi toggle is indeed switching between the Axon high end DAC and the SD820 standard DAC, the Axon DAC is far from neutral and has a coloured sound with unnaturally increased bass and treble response. This is arguably positive for the average consumer who likes the visceral sensation of an unnatural U-shaped equalizer, but will be disappointing for audiophiles looking for a flat sound signature.
2) the second possibility is that the Headset HiFi toggle does not change which DAC the system is using, but rather is like a Loudness button found on many stereos. When volume decreases, the human ear perceives low and high frequencies dropping off faster than other mid range ones. Loudness buttons are added to stereos so that low volume listening frequency response sounds closer to what the ear perceives at higher volumes.
After digging into the kernel code for the Qualcomm WCD audio codecs on a few phones (Hammerhead, Pixel, Nexus 6P) I'm having some trouble figuring out how to access the DC blocking/high-pass filter being applied to a signal coming in through the headset mic line (ADC2 on some phones). Looking at the spectrum on all of these phones shows a definite high-pass filter shape with a cutoff between 50-100 Hz depending on the phone. What is more problematic is the phase distortion that the DC blocker is applying.
Originally I tried modifying the TX HPF Cutoff settings as well as turning it on in cases where it was still off during recording, just to see if it would have an effect. These values don't seem to affect the signal at all, whether it's set to 3 Hz, the default of 75, or the max of 150. I believe the TX HPF is only part of the signal chain during telephony modes and not during normal recording. There are also IIR filters available with these Qualcomm codecs but looking at the datasheet for the WCD9311 (the only one publicly available) shows that these are for sidetone processing and not the direct ACD headset mic path, so again it seems these are only applicable in telephony modes.
For my application the raw signal is desired - so minimal HPF effects, no ANC, no Compander, and no automatic gain control. Basically what the new UNPROCESSED config in Nougat is supposed to provide, but testing so far on the Pixel has shown that this HPF+phase distortion are still happening even when running a clean square wave or similar signal in through the headset mic line. I'm using TinyMixer to check exposed mixer path values over adb in real-time while recording (and comparing the values to what they are before recording).
In the past on the Nexus S this problem could be overcome with root by modifying a register (the enum was something like ADC High Pass Filter Switch), but the mixer paths for these WCD9xxx codecs are a little more complex with no signs of a single HPF switch for this ADC line that exists outside of the TX one. This doesn't seem to be a problem that many people face but I was hoping for any insight anyone here may have, and also hoping that anyone who needs to use this line in without distorting their signals will be able to find a solution in the future, at least before USB C over and the 3.5mm jack becomes obsolete.
Hello,
i bought a LG V30 a few days ago, because i want to use it as DAC or DAC/AMP.
Before i used an Axon 7 with Viper4Android, a headphone amp (Schiit Vali2) and a custom VDC file for Viper4Android with these settings.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v999jbft39506ma/Sennheiser HD800.pdf?dl=0
It made a huge difference to use my headphone (Sennheiser HD800) with or without these parametric equalizer settings.
Perhabs it is useful for you, here a link with many different eq settings. Think this can improve sound quality of many headphones or inears.
https://www.reddit.com/r/oratory1990/wiki/index/list_of_presets
1. Most important part, i want the best possible sound quality. Ainur Sauron, Ainur Narsil, Whiskeyomega Soundmods, https://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v30/themes/magisk-bring-24-bit-output-aosp-pie-t3900863 .....
Dont know, because im new with this phone...
2. I need a parametric equalizer with 10 bands. Viper4Android use VDC files, but i read somewhere that Viper4Android only can handle 48000. And i wanna use the full potential from this Quad DAC.
It is an option for me to use USB Audio Player Pro and if i am right, it is possible to use inbuild parametric eq with only 6 bands.
3. If best sound quality is only with stock roms possible, its ok for me. But if it makes no difference i prefer custom roms. My device is H930, do you have any recommendations?
Hope someone can help me to squeeze the best audio quality from these wonderful device.
Thank you
Adriano
I don't think you can use viper4android with the DAC because viper4android will resample the audio back down to 16 bit @ 48khz. Thus it's pointless to use the DAC + v4a at the same time. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Hi
1.) best possible sound quality - thus you want as little processing as possible (audiophile paradigm) - go with AINUR NARSIL
2.) viper4android is outdated, closed source and is supposed to offer worse quality vs. JamesDSP, both are limited to 48 kHz though
https://github.com/james34602/JamesDSPManager
https://forum.xda-developers.com/android/apps-games/app-reformed-dsp-manager-t3607970
So if you want to go that route, you'll limit yourself to 48 kHz and 16 bit.
according to https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq
USB Audio Player PRO
USB Audio Player PRO is an Android app with improved USB audio drivers for usage with USB DACs. USB Audio Player PRO is not system-wide but works with local files and many streaming services though not with Spotify. USB Audio Player has Toneboosters Morphit plugin which has parametric equalizer. This app and the plugin are not free.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
UAPP with the Morphit plugin (additional purchase) would be the (best?) way to go to retain best possible quality with a parametric equalizer.
Someone needs to try that though and e.g. toggle the quad / SABRE DAC and see how well it works with UAPP and the MorphIt plugin
3.) nope, in fact there's more processing on LG Stock ROMs and thus it sounds warmer and different than the less processed and colder output on AOSP-based ROMs - thus the quality on AOSP-based ROMs should be closer to source (less processing = "better", less additional artifacts and distortions)
LG Stock ROMs are a must though if you're dependent on voLTE or voWiFi
Hope that helps