WM 6.1 memory management "feature" - Mogul, XV6800 ROM Development
So, ever since I upgraded to windows mobile 6.1, there is one "feature" that is driving me nuts... I haven't seen any reference to it in the forums (though it's possible I just didn't read enough of the 20+ page threads), but I'm wondering if anyone knows how to disable it.
It seems that windows mobile automatically starts closing programs when I start running low on memory. Particularly Messaging and Internet Explorer are prone to suddenly not be there anymore, but other programs do it as well.
For example, I'm reading a text message, switch to contacts to update someone's information, and then I try to switch back to the text message to verify the data and it's no longer running. I start up text messaging, and contacts has closed.
Very frustrating. I'm fairly certain it does it only when memory is very low, but I much preferred the warning "yo, idiot, you're out of memory, shut stuff down" messages to this "I'm going to close this program with no consideration to what you're doing and w/out asking" approach.
Anyone have any ideas? Maybe I'm missing something obvious?
taxilian said:
So, ever since I upgraded to windows mobile 6.1, there is one "feature" that is driving me nuts... I haven't seen any reference to it in the forums (though it's possible I just didn't read enough of the 20+ page threads), but I'm wondering if anyone knows how to disable it.
It seems that windows mobile automatically starts closing programs when I start running low on memory. Particularly Messaging and Internet Explorer are prone to suddenly not be there anymore, but other programs do it as well.
For example, I'm reading a text message, switch to contacts to update someone's information, and then I try to switch back to the text message to verify the data and it's no longer running. I start up text messaging, and contacts has closed.
Very frustrating. I'm fairly certain it does it only when memory is very low, but I much preferred the warning "yo, idiot, you're out of memory, shut stuff down" messages to this "I'm going to close this program with no consideration to what you're doing and w/out asking" approach.
Anyone have any ideas? Maybe I'm missing something obvious?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WoW. You must be running a memory HOG program in the background to run out of memory with text messaging and the contacts program.
I have bluetooth to use with my Stereo Bluetooth head phones when I listen to Windows Media and Have the Threaded Text Messaging Software in the background running ( I text alot and I need it running in the background to initiate it faster ) all with HTC Home Plugin and I dont get any memory problems. Nothing closes out.
Do you have the X-Button program installed? The one that closes things out completely when you press the X. If so this can be the problem.
Honestly I use an Alt-Tab program to switch between programs. This helps alot.
I know exactly what you mean as far as the memory management closing applications. for example i used to be able to have tomtom running, and also audio manager playing music, however if memory is low, the management always closes audio manager. Rather annoying, i've had it do it during other programs also ie. messaging, internet explorer.
That's weird.... Possibly sending hibernate signal to programs to see if some will shut down?
I haven't noticed any apps getting closed automatically but I never try to have more than a few open at a time.
Well other then recommending that you review your installations and see if there are any memory HOG programs to remove, I also recommend using Oxios Hibernate.
Check out this website for more details.
http://www.oxios.com/memory/
I have some today plugins (like SBP diary) that may be taking part of the memory. I have to blame the memory leak for the rest... on a fresh boot I have 18 meg free, by the time I start having real problems with things shutting down left and right I only have 5 free. I use QuickMenu, which has a program similar to X-Button so that I can explicitly close programs, but I can also use it to switch tasks. In WM6 it worked fine. However, unless I reboot frequently, I end up with this problem. Some things always exhibit this problem, even right after a soft reset reset. For example, if I use PIE to view a site such as youtube and I play a video clip, PIE closes in the background while the video is playing, which is very annoying.
I know that there are things to do to try to free memory... I have hibernate, I have the task manager connected to quickmenu, but I still have this problem.
taxilian said:
I have some today plugins (like SBP diary) that may be taking part of the memory. I have to blame the memory leak for the rest... on a fresh boot I have 18 meg free, by the time I start having real problems with things shutting down left and right I only have 5 free. I use QuickMenu, which has a program similar to X-Button so that I can explicitly close programs, but I can also use it to switch tasks. In WM6 it worked fine. However, unless I reboot frequently, I end up with this problem. Some things always exhibit this problem, even right after a soft reset reset. For example, if I use PIE to view a site such as youtube and I play a video clip, PIE closes in the background while the video is playing, which is very annoying.
I know that there are things to do to try to free memory... I have hibernate, I have the task manager connected to quickmenu, but I still have this problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What ROM are you using? I have DCD 2.2.0 core with others mixed in and I get about 23 to 24 MB on soft boot. That is with all of my apps installed.
It might be that the page pool on your ROM is high. If it is high it tends to speed up your device but you sacrifice memory. Are you using one of DCD's new ROM's? Because I believe his new ROM's have a higher page pool then before to cope with WM6.1.
taxilian said:
So, ever since I upgraded to windows mobile 6.1, there is one "feature" that is driving me nuts... I haven't seen any reference to it in the forums (though it's possible I just didn't read enough of the 20+ page threads), but I'm wondering if anyone knows how to disable it.
It seems that windows mobile automatically starts closing programs when I start running low on memory. Particularly Messaging and Internet Explorer are prone to suddenly not be there anymore, but other programs do it as well.
For example, I'm reading a text message, switch to contacts to update someone's information, and then I try to switch back to the text message to verify the data and it's no longer running. I start up text messaging, and contacts has closed.
Very frustrating. I'm fairly certain it does it only when memory is very low, but I much preferred the warning "yo, idiot, you're out of memory, shut stuff down" messages to this "I'm going to close this program with no consideration to what you're doing and w/out asking" approach.
Anyone have any ideas? Maybe I'm missing something obvious?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i've heard of oxios causing this phenomena, something in the way of how it alters things when you run it. I use oxios exclusively to manage my ram, and have done so for a long time. the newer dcd roms are a lot better at this, some 6.1 roms though have a terrible memory leak.
Honestly though, you really shouldnt ever have that many apps open at one time. i start to freak out when i get down to 15mb free
try to use something where you can monitor your ram on the today screen, like batterystatus today plugin along with mbutton to see the open apps in the taskbar, and oxiosw memory apps to keep it all tidy.
I'm having the same issue, but not sure it has to do with low memory. I have dcd 2.1.0 rom with Spb pocket plus 4.0, mobile shell and oxios. If I'm going from say IE to any other program and go back fairly quickly to IE it would is still active but If I'm on another program for more than a minute it closes down on its own
Strangly having same issue here. Bus most annoying for internet sharing, and Messenger Live, can't be memory issue, nothing else is running! It just closes stuff as it feels like it.
Using Task Manager 2.0 here, no X-Button.
Mine is doing the same thing and I am running DCD 3.1 ROM. Sometimes I can have only 2 apps open and it will close the one that I am not in. Just 5 secs ago I had opera mini running and spb wallet. I had opera mini running and minimized it with the ok button and then opened SPB wallet from the start menu to get a password and when I went to go back to opera mini it was gone. This seems to be happening to me when I get ~8M of RAM left. This is very annoying. I am running quite a few programs in the background though.
SPB mobile shell 1067kb
S2u2 613kb
tmail 125kb
Wisbar Lite 65kb
Mortscript 16kb
AEB 13k
Ftouchsl 5k
I have had all these programs running before on a WM6 rom and never had this issue. and I never map the ok key to close.
Guys, sooner or later you're going to have to come to terms that the Titan only has 64 mb of ram, with over 50% of it being used by the system. This means you only get about 23-26 mb of free ram with a CLEAN rom. Taking a look at some of the applications you use, I can see why the system is auto closing stuff. WM 6.1 does this so your freakin os won't crash due to no memory. I use a LOT of software and I still end up with 22 mb free at boot. This is because I choose not to use certain programs that eat ram. If you absolutely need to use all that bloat, go back to WM 6.0 until a device with more ram comes out.
Nothing I'm using should be going above 22MB (which is free at startup)
Here's what I use and how much ram they eat up:
Garmin Mobile 5-7
Opera same
Navizon 2.7
GPS Viewer 1
other stuff (no more than 4 at most) less than 1MB
But I use Garmin Mobile in the car and not Opera becuase I don't have a data plan. And If i'm using Opera I wouldn't have garmin on as I would be at a house or mall or something like that.
But with JUST garmin Navizon and GPS viewer (with free ram mind you) garmin will close everything else (sometimes)when I activate it. However, with all three open and garmin in he back it won't close....
Ha..first off..Navizon has to be the BIGGEST pile of bloat I've ever used on my ppc. I had it installed for about 5 minutes before I trashed it.
WM 6.1 doesn't close programs when you run out of ram. It automatically senses when certain programs are eating ram, and when it gets low it closes programs to ensure you don't run out of ram.
If it's closing programs it means something you're running is causing your ram to drop tremendously. I've never had WM 6.1 close any of my programs.
Hello, i had the same problem on my Hermes. But i solved it. Just changed this two registry Keys.
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
Enable Autokill change from 1 to 0
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
MemoryThreshold change from 9437184 to 943718
Now it works perfect. No more closing Tasks automatically.
Greets
ckraus000 said:
Hello, i had the same problem on my Hermes. But i solved it. Just changed this two registry Keys.
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
Enable Autokill change from 1 to 0
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
MemoryThreshold change from 9437184 to 943718
Now it works perfect. No more closing Tasks automatically.
Greets
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am running a stock rom and it doesn't seem to have those keys. Could you post the exact spelling for the values (for example, is the value "Enable Autokill" or is it "EnableAutokill")
A clip for the registry itself would be even better.
Thanks for the tip!!!
ckraus000 said:
Hello, i had the same problem on my Hermes. But i solved it. Just changed this two registry Keys.
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
Enable Autokill change from 1 to 0
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
MemoryThreshold change from 9437184 to 943718
Now it works perfect. No more closing Tasks automatically.
Greets
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyouthankyou!! I'll try this out, if it works then one of my biggest gripes with this device will be addressed! I played with a friend's Tilt and the amount of available RAM blew me away but this will definitely help with the craptastic memory!
ckraus000 said:
Hello, i had the same problem on my Hermes. But i solved it. Just changed this two registry Keys.
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
Enable Autokill change from 1 to 0
Hkey_Current_USER/Software/HTC/Taskmanager
MemoryThreshold change from 9437184 to 943718
Now it works perfect. No more closing Tasks automatically.
Greets
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This appears to have solved my issue with this. I run no2chem 5069k with a 10mb Pagepool. I use Oxios and have ~24 mb of ram at boot. I normally encounter problems when trying to switch between apps. I use the LastFM app and prior to this fix I would OK out of the app and it would close 5-10 seconds after OKing out. Even with a fresh boot. With this fix implemented I have successfully had it running in the background for 10+ minutes while switching between using Google Maps, Live Search and IE. Note that none of the programs closed.
Keep in mind your mileage may vary from ROM to ROM and app to app. I'm guessing that it is exclusive to a certain version of HTC Task Manager. Also possibly maybe exclusive to some type of Memory Mangement App. All I know is that I have been fighting this closing issue since no2chem 5066 IIRC and this has apparently solved it. I've used the same app loadout since I've had my Mogul pretty much.
What I did:
I did not have these registry keys. I created the:
"HKCU\Software\HTC\TaskManager" key
then created a binary-dword for "Autokill" with Decimal value "0"
then created a binary-dword for "MemoryThreshold" with Decimal value of "943718"
I have rebooted my phone several times and have not had any close issues.
Radio: 3.39.10
PRL 60613
PRI.03_003
Current Mogul app load:
Oxios Memory
AC IMSelecter
Lonely Cat Games Slick
Unyverse Ltd Upvise
MS Hearts (yeah, yeah... I'm an addict)
Dashwire
Vicsoft Cleartemp
Youtube youtubeplay
WMwifirouter (.91 IIRC)
Singer's Creations Weather Watcher
HTC Diamond MP3 Trimmer
Google Maps
MS Live Search
PocketPicture
PocketCM Contacts .23
TP PPC-6800 Hacks
PocketToolman (ver, unknown
Total Commander
.net CF 2.0 (certain old programs can't use the ver 3.5)
ShoZu Mobile
GC Java Pack 1.1
TCPMP .72
Opera 9.5 Beta (build ???)
ELF Calc Skin
Someguy sMMS
vtable software lastcab
moBlog
Pocket CM Keyboard .14
EDIT: 20+ minutes and still no app closes, still browsing and switching between. I'm going to delete the keys, soft reset and test again just to make sure
ive found that 6.1 seems to establish a "baseline" of how much ram it wants to keep free, if i let it have 22-23mb free after a soft reset it will kill any apps in the background to get back up to 23mb, even if the app it kills is only using 500k or so
if i open a bunch of apps right after a soft reset, and get the ram down to about 10mb, i can run all day perfectly stable, and keep all those apps open, or close them and open others and be fine, but i let it free up more ram and 6.1 realizes it can have more ram it starts closing apps to reach the "new" baseline
Alright...
So...
That reg edit appears to do nothing. But. I think I may have stumbled onto something that may be causing the issue.
Reset 3 times and tried lastfm with removed reg keys. Nada - multitasked as previously mentioned with no issue. Had me confused. Then I realized I had never run Oxios Close/Hibernate since my last boot. Something I generally do at least once or twice a day, my phone usually doesn't get reset unless I'm installing something. Closed lastfm, ran Closeapps, launched lastfm and tried to multitask, closed out within 5-15 seconds. Something that Oxios (and most likely other tools like it) messes with WM memory management. I realize that even after a fresh boot I'll sometimes run Oxios (quick way to check ram). Either it loads something into memory or the function is sends is somehow looping or causing WM memory to close nonfocused apps.
So, essentially not any further along, but maybe mem management apps are more responsible than many have guessed before? Anyone else have some time to do some independent research?
Related
Anyway to Kill Programs
Hi all, Normally when you are wokring in a program (say messaging) and press thbe red end button you are taken back to the today screen but the program continues to remain open in the background. Just wondering if any one knew of a software so that I can use the red end key to kill the running program and take me back to the today screen. Will appreciate your comments and suggestions Regards
This is intentional (as with all WM devices). Keeping the most often used programs running in memory allows you to switch to messaging / calendar / contacts etc. near instantly. If you had to load them from ROM every time you would soon find the delays very frustrating. Try killing the running programs manually with the Task Manager to see what I mean. I've never suffered a slow-down from working this way, unless a program goes awry (which I then just kill with Task manager). So I just let WM work the way it was intended. But if you need a more convenient way of managing tasks, have a look at xBar.
Sllloooooooowwww Down
Any one else notice their Hero slowing down? Mine's gotten to the point where it takes a few attempts at even unlocking the home screen....
Yeah, started to put some apps on the phone the first night I had it ( Friday) and when I started 'Sky map' to see what it was like the poor old phone had a major moment and wouldn't do much at all. I had read up on this so installed taskiller and just killed the app -it was fine after that- I believe it will be sorted soon, there is a firmware update just about to be released (hopefully) that addresses this issue.
I bought TasKiller Pro, since it lets you have unlimited amounts of Ignored apps. Then I just: * Go into TasKiller and Ignore TouchFlo, Touch Input, com.htc.dcs (whatever that is, it's always on) and all other apps you don't want to kill when you clean up (Babbler, ConnectBot etc... whatever you fancy) * Put the TasKiller widget on the desktop next to the TasKiller app icon. * Whenever I notice a slowdown I just press the widget button and it kills all processes / programs except the ones I've ignored. It immediately speeds up the phone This isn't an iPhone, this actually lets you start multiple programs at the same time and since the cpu isn't event capable of playing smooth MP4 videos (unless they are 480x360), there isn't a lot to spare. When I woke up this morning, i made a ConnectBot connection to screen to open irc, surfed a couple of webpages, wrote a couple of mails, started babbler for facebook and eBuddy for MSN and the slowdown on the desktop was visible. When I was done I clicked the TasKiller "Kill all" button and the phone was smooth as butter again. The moral of the story: If you start a lot of programs at the same time, it WILL slow down the phone. Nothing you can do about it. The iPhone "never" slows down, because it's the equivalent (almost) of a Hero with only one app running at any one time. Given those conditions, the Hero would be just as smooth as the iPhone too! Still, I hope sincerely for some optimization with the forthcoming update.
You need to look into how the Android OS works. there are two types of running apps. Applications and services. With applications, when you press the home button the application is suspended and can no longer use memory or cpu, Android can reclaim this memory when it needs to. Second is services, these run in the background. These do use cpu and memory while you are doing other things. So if you have a lot of apps that uses services running then it may slow down. I have found that usually the slowdown is because when you click home and then suspend the widgets that update are suspended and so when you unsuspend they wake up and start to refresh and that causes the slow down. Tip #1 when clicking home to put the phone into standby dont click standby for about 5 secs and see if it helps.
Exit running apps
hi i have only just got the hero and was wondering how to close apps properly. i have noticed that when you hold the home key for a while a window pops up showing some apps ...is this how you close them? or is simply pressing the home key shutting them .
The long press on home just brings up a list of apps that have been recently run. It's almost a task switcher, but not quite! Many apps will exit if you "back" out of them - i.e. when in the app keep pressing back until you get back to the home screen. However, this isn't the case for all applications. Some may have an explicit exit or close button, whereas others may have nothing at all. However, Android is pretty good at managing its own applications, and will kill/exit them as necessary. In my experience, there's little to be gained from explicitly killing applications using a task killer, but some people swear by it. Regards, Dave
foxmeister said: The long press on home just brings up a list of apps that have been recently run. It's almost a task switcher, but not quite! Many apps will exit if you "back" out of them - i.e. when in the app keep pressing back until you get back to the home screen. However, this isn't the case for all applications. Some may have an explicit exit or close button, whereas others may have nothing at all. However, Android is pretty good at managing its own applications, and will kill/exit them as necessary. In my experience, there's little to be gained from explicitly killing applications using a task killer, but some people swear by it. Regards, Dave Click to expand... Click to collapse Most Task Killers free up memory thats used by background apps.
so basicly back out of the app and let android do the rest of the worring. thanks for advise
risterdid said: Most Task Killers free up memory thats used by background apps. Click to expand... Click to collapse Yes, but the point is that Android itself will start killing applications if it starts to run low on resources. (see http://developer.android.com/guide/topics/fundamentals.html) Regards, Dave
I'll attempt to sum it up once and for all, to try and set the record straight. In Android's virtual machine, there is no functional differentiation between "closing" an app and "switching away from" an app. They are the same (the exception is things like music players which need to keep playing after you switch away from them, but even then only the 'service' part needs to keep running). Whenever you switch away from an app, its current state is remembered so that even if it is effectively "killed" it can be returned to in just that state next time it's opened. Then Android either kills the process or it keeps it open, killing it when it needs the memory. You won't notice any difference between either scenario, except maybe that an app loads a little bit faster if it was kept in memory. At any rate, "closed" apps do not "run", and they do not take RAM or CPU cycles from other apps. In terms of process/memory management, Android's VM has more in common with a web browser than a desktop OS - sure it can remember your state when you switch apps (like switching tabs, going back/forward/home in a browser) but whether behind the scenes it loads it all into and out of memory when you switch back and forth, or it all stays in memory is irrelevant to the user. Nobody worries that a long forum page on another tab or in their back button history is occupying 80 megs in the background or not, the browser takes care of loading/unloading it from RAM as needed, and that's just like how Android's VM works when switching between various pages of various apps. Once you understand this you understand that all these 'task killer' apps are really unnecessary - all they'll do is make it slower to restart an app once closed. They don't reclaim RAM that was previously unavailable to other apps. To cut a long story short, pressing "home" is a great way to close an app, whether you want to return to it later or not.
MercuryStar said: Nobody worries that a long forum page on another tab or in their back button history is occupying 80 megs in the background or not, the browser takes care of loading/unloading it from RAM as needed, and that's just like how Android's VM works when switching between various pages of various apps. Click to expand... Click to collapse that is not true for me, my firefox can eat a lot of resources as long as it is open. and i can see a performance difference when having a lot of apps open on my hero. not that it would be a problem, but you can see the menus scrolling more "fluid" after killing all bg apps, for example.
kendong2 said: you can see the menus scrolling more "fluid" after killing all bg apps, for example. Click to expand... Click to collapse I would wager that's the placebo effect. It feels faster because you believe it should. If you understand how the OS works you realise that apps you've switched away from do nothing to slow down or take memory from any other app (see my exception above about apps that launch background services such as music player).
kendong2 said: that is not true for me, my firefox can eat a lot of resources as long as it is open. and i can see a performance difference when having a lot of apps open on my hero. not that it would be a problem, but you can see the menus scrolling more "fluid" after killing all bg apps, for example. Click to expand... Click to collapse I do notice this too. There is a general 'sluggishness' with my Hero when there are lots of app sleeping/running/hibernating/whatever in the background. As soon as I kill off a few unwanted ones, all the menus scroll faster and home screens change quicker. And this is not the placebo effect either. The menu's DO scroll more fluidly after I have killed a few apps, regardless of how you describe the RAM management...
Micksta said: And this is not the placebo effect either. The menu's DO scroll more fluidly after I have killed a few apps, regardless of how you describe the RAM management... Click to expand... Click to collapse exactly, you can tell easily if it is one motion or looks like it is "skipping frames". even it is only because it takes the device some cpu cycles to kill other apps, it does make a difference. like i said a rather cosmetic one, since it doesn't really effect the general usage. nevertheless i like to know what is running and what's not, and so far im running good with advanced task manager free.
WOW i didnt expect a massive response for my question but i thank you all for your responses
MercuryStar said: I would wager that's the placebo effect. It feels faster because you believe it should. If you understand how the OS works you realise that apps you've switched away from do nothing to slow down or take memory from any other app (see my exception above about apps that launch background services such as music player). Click to expand... Click to collapse that's not true, my phone gets so sluggish sometimes that i can't answer a phone call, the phone doesn't register that i press the answer button. and when that happends i usually have like 20 mb of free ram.
Daniehabazin said: that's not true, my phone gets so sluggish sometimes that i can't answer a phone call, the phone doesn't register that i press the answer button. and when that happends i usually have like 20 mb of free ram. Click to expand... Click to collapse Just as a matter of interest, do you use swapper or AppsToSD? My phone never gets into the situation you've described, but even though I do have the full version of TasKiller, I almost never use it, and I don't see a need at present to use AppsToSD. In addition, I'd imagine that having a swap partition would cause an issue with Androids own memory management, since I guess it can't distinguish between real and "virtual" memory. So where a "non-swap" device would start killing processes, a "swap" device would just continue on regardless because it thinks it still has physical memory available. Regards, Dave
Yesterday I downloaded "Advanced Task Killer Free"... anyone who has experiences with this? Is is better than just "Task Killer" or is it just an updated version of "Task Killer" ? thanks!
have been using atk free for a while (lol 2 weeks since i got the hero) now, i really like it. its advantage over all other task managers IMHO: it has an ignore list, things you ignore are not shown in the running tasks list. in the list you have check boxes, where you can select the tasks that will be killed, and this list is remembered. for example "htc sense" is on my ignore list, but "music" is only checked, so i can uncheck it when i don't want to kill it while listening to music. next time i want to kill music i just have to tap the checkbox, no dealing with the ignore list here...
Daniehabazin said: that's not true, my phone gets so sluggish sometimes that i can't answer a phone call, the phone doesn't register that i press the answer button. and when that happends i usually have like 20 mb of free ram. Click to expand... Click to collapse I get this problem a lot, and in answer to fox meister, I don't have AppsToSD. I don't know if the problem is RAM or CPU related, but the CPU often jumps to 100% when things are really slow. Is the issue likely to be background apps, or widgets even?
Sausageman said: I get this problem a lot, and in answer to fox meister, I don't have AppsToSD. I don't know if the problem is RAM or CPU related, but the CPU often jumps to 100% when things are really slow. Is the issue likely to be background apps, or widgets even? Click to expand... Click to collapse Same for me with the processor. When i reboot my phone i usually have 90 mb of free ram, after starting a few applications, like browser and phonebook, it plummets down to 20 mb. I do have some extra applications that starts as services, like systray monitor and 3g watchdog. when i open atk after a fresh reboot i see that some applications that i don't even use is started, like footprints, settings and calendar, even my webrowser is started, whats up with that, can it be disabled? I think the issue is that we have some applications that autostart withous us using them, and also programs that we download that autostarts as services and maybe having memory leaks...
I came to chime in with my experiences of the CDMA hero and sluggishness. I watch memory like a hawk (thanks Mogul) and I too have around 80-90mb free ram on start, but it can get down to around 30 rather quickly. Once it gets down here, I notice that screen transitions and random lag occurs in apps. If I go into Advanced Task Killer and kill many of the stragglers, my menus are as smooth as can be. It is most certainly NOT a placebo effect. One thing I really like about Advanced Task Killer (pay version) is that it has the "Auto End" feature, where it will kill all apps not chosen to be excluded at the interval that you choose. For example, I have determined the system applications that need to be on all the time, and I've excluded those. Every hour, ATK kills everything else. For the most part, my Hero hovers around 70MB now at all times, although it can get down there to around 30-40MB if I'm right around the 1 hour mark. That feature alone makes it much better than Taskiller IMO. Totally worth 99 cents
This definition would imply that android works exactly like the iphone osx? I mean saving "screenshots" of the last state of an app. But NOT having real multitasking? Because it's not possible to have multitasking and at the same time "inactive" background apps everytime you hit the home button... MercuryStar said: I'll attempt to sum it up once and for all, to try and set the record straight. In Android's virtual machine, there is no functional differentiation between "closing" an app and "switching away from" an app. They are the same (the exception is things like music players which need to keep playing after you switch away from them, but even then only the 'service' part needs to keep running). Whenever you switch away from an app, its current state is remembered so that even if it is effectively "killed" it can be returned to in just that state next time it's opened. Then Android either kills the process or it keeps it open, killing it when it needs the memory. You won't notice any difference between either scenario, except maybe that an app loads a little bit faster if it was kept in memory. At any rate, "closed" apps do not "run", and they do not take RAM or CPU cycles from other apps. In terms of process/memory management, Android's VM has more in common with a web browser than a desktop OS - sure it can remember your state when you switch apps (like switching tabs, going back/forward/home in a browser) but whether behind the scenes it loads it all into and out of memory when you switch back and forth, or it all stays in memory is irrelevant to the user. Nobody worries that a long forum page on another tab or in their back button history is occupying 80 megs in the background or not, the browser takes care of loading/unloading it from RAM as needed, and that's just like how Android's VM works when switching between various pages of various apps. Once you understand this you understand that all these 'task killer' apps are really unnecessary - all they'll do is make it slower to restart an app once closed. They don't reclaim RAM that was previously unavailable to other apps. To cut a long story short, pressing "home" is a great way to close an app, whether you want to return to it later or not. Click to expand... Click to collapse
Shahpur.Azizpour said: This definition would imply that android works exactly like the iphone osx? I mean saving "screenshots" of the last state of an app. But NOT having real multitasking? Because it's not possible to have multitasking and at the same time "inactive" background apps everytime you hit the home button... Click to expand... Click to collapse No, you've not understood the explanation. The iPhone will always* terminate an application that isn't on its list of "approved" multi-tasking apps once it isn't active any more (i.e. you've switched tasks). Android will try to keep whatever it can in memory, but eventually will start killing processes in order to keep the system running. So, if you're on an iPhone listening to something on Spotify and you want to browse something on the web, the iPhone will "kill" Spotify when you switch to the web browser. On Android this won't occur except in the most critical of resource low situations, but then again, I'd imagine other apps would get killed before Spotify. Read this article, specifically the section from "Component Lifecycles" onwards specifically "Activity Lifecycle", "Saving activity state" and "Processes and lifecycles". Regards, Dave * Unless it has been jailbroken!
Closing Apps vs Running In Background
Hey Everyone, Just got my Droid Eris yesterday and I'm having fun exploring the phone and checking everything out. One question, I noticed that many apps (in fact, almost all) don't have a direct "Quit" or "Exit" command. So I'm usually pressing "back" or "home" when I'm done with something. This left me wondering though... when I use "back" or "home", does the app actually exit? From what I can tell, it doesn't... so does the OS automatically clean up these apps from time to time? I came from WinMo 6.1, and it was irritating that everything defaulted to running in the background. How does Android treat it? Is there something special in this regard with the HTC Sense UI? I've seen there are some third-party task manager apps you can get... are they worth getting? Or just "let the phone do it's thing" and i will be fine? Thanks!
I use a Task Manager from the Market called "Taskiller." But I'm still trying to figure out how the Hero handles the apps because sometimes it gets sluggish and taskiller helps out but then theres other times when I have all sorts of apps open and it runs smoothly, lol, I guess it just works sometimes.
I wonder if it's like the iPhone, where it kills the task when you hit the "Home" button. It doesn't seem like it, as some apps seem to just come up instantly when go back in them, as if I was "switching" to them, and no re-opening them...
false_apology said: I wonder if it's like the iPhone, where it kills the task when you hit the "Home" button. It doesn't seem like it, as some apps seem to just come up instantly when go back in them, as if I was "switching" to them, and no re-opening them... Click to expand... Click to collapse No I dont think thats the case because Android has a special way of "Multitasking," though I'm not completely informed so you might have to research that on your own. But like I said download a Task Manager from the market so you can see how much available memory there is.
By default, Android applications never really "close" as their components can be called upon at any time. (Android applications are structured to be very modular, allowing individual components to be used from each.) When an application needs memory immediately, and another hasn't used it for a while, it shoves the old app into what's called swap space (presumably it's on your SD card) while the new one takes over. This is why you'll occasionally see a delay while performing a "hard" operation (like opening an app) while the system is under heavy load. That's the old app's memory getting written out to temporary storage and the other one taking it over. At least this is my understanding of the situation.
From what I've heard Android (linux) does a much better job of managing the memory used by our apps. And, that we "...shouldn't have to use a task killer..." to close out apps that are running in the background, especially on our phones. For instance, the myTouch 3G usually only gets about 20-30 MB of RAM freed after a full clean up of background apps, the Eris will have about 80+ MB after a cleanup and they both feel about the same to me. I still use Task Panel to close my apps sometimes because I just like starting fresh in an app from time to time. Also if things start getting fishy (screen stuttering, touch screen not working properly) I'll kill all running apps to see if it fixes the problem which in some cases it just does not and a reboot is still required.
I have found that by holding the home key it will bring up all the apps so you can switch to the one that you want so it is still running them in the background.
refthemc said: I use a Task Manager from the Market called "Taskiller." But I'm still trying to figure out how the Hero handles the apps because sometimes it gets sluggish and taskiller helps out but then theres other times when I have all sorts of apps open and it runs smoothly, lol, I guess it just works sometimes. Click to expand... Click to collapse i use a Task application called Task Manager. It gives lists of all Applications running, all process and even has an uninstall feature. It also has a auto end application feature but on my eris it's greyed out(maybe Pro only?)
Here are a couple of links that I found on this subject. Don't mind that it says Hero in the thread title it talks about android phones in general. Also something to look into once we get the Eris rooted in the second link. Task Managers and your Hero by romeosidvicious @androidforums.com How to configure Android's *internal* taskkiller by androcheck @xda-developers.com
Problem with apps
Hi I'm currently having problem with apps they are auto opening themselves. Sometimes at startup when I open my open and use Helix/ADW all launcher manu apps are open automatically. It eats like 50MB of memory and battery. And even while my screen turns off it opens app. I was sleeping and my screen is turn off/sleep and I check task panel it got apps open even the screen is lock. Got No Idea on this. Why my apps are auto opening. And do I need to debrand? I just got a unit Unlocked X10i Baseband 1.0.14 Build Number R1FA014 Kernel 2.6.29-rel [email protected]#2 Do I really need to debrand? Does it reset my phone and my settings/apps will be deleted? TIA
It's not the X10, it's an Android thing.
Then how to get rid of this auto opening app? I never exp. this on 1.5 and 2.1 on my HTC Hero just on this 1.6
Get Automatic Task Killer or something similar, and set it to kill apps on open...if you find the apps opening affects your performance. Also, if they're apps that sync with a service, make sure all syncing is off, or they'll keep coming up anyway, to try to sync with the cloud. as a personal anecdote, once I stopped using task killers, the phone started running more stable and quicker.
So Task killers are not good? I check my Task Panel once i boot my phone tons of APPS are open Like Bluetooth file transfer SMS Backup and Restore Email Alarm Clock Calender Settings Voice Dialer It opens on startup. seriously I just boot up my phone and use ADW Launcher and those open up automatically? what does those do? for startup? there are tons more like 25 apps on startup. This thing is not good since I'll do task killing always even the phone is screen off. My phone is opening Voice Dialer Handsent SMS even though i dont have message or calls received. It's like every min or hour I'll do task killing it kills battery
Well, Alarm Clock has to be on, so it knows when to go off... If you don't have any alarms set, delete all the alarms that are in it. Email is on by default, since it's a smart phone. If you don't have an account set up, email won't sync, and thus, isn't really doing anything. Calendar will attempt to sync with google if you set it up, but if not, again, shouldn't be doing anything. SMS will start to monitor for incoming SMSes. A lot of services start so they're there when you try to start them up. Basically, anything that has to sync to the internet to update will start automatically. If things like Photoshop Mobile or a game or something start up, those should be killed. Stand alone apps that don't access the internet should have no business starting up on their own. Some people on here claim task killers are great and help a lot... some claim they do nothing. I'm torn, because the phone feels a bit faster than when I used the task killer everytime I unlocked the phone. If your phone is new, cycle the battery a few times, and let it 'break in' and, eventually, the battery life should improve.
Thanks. I'm just a little bit worried that I'm not aware that there are many task opening with me noticing or knowing it and use much battery as I do. Some apps open automatically
I know that apps auto close ok , here's its invers.. Any how use some task killers frequently to kill them.... Or just unistall them .....:thumbup: ................................................................................................
Can somebody help me? I am running my xperia x8 and as i know since i rooted and got myself new rom i was wondering why my games work slow but after a little research i found out that official Facebook app is working in background so i unninstaled but now my question is is there someone who has some facebook app non-official which i can run without the problems? PS: Sorry if spam on this thread but i cant make new threads on this app (or i can but i cannot figure it out) Sent from my X8 using xda app-developers app
gr3yh0und said: Thanks. I'm just a little bit worried that I'm not aware that there are many task opening with me noticing or knowing it and use much battery as I do. Some apps open automatically Click to expand... Click to collapse Android works by loading EVERYTHING it can into memory, up to a threshold and then removes apps from memory if they're not being used and memory is required for newly initiated applications. Some apps have a terminate and stay resident approach and are seen as 'services' and they just stay active no matter what. Email, Calendars and status bar and etc never leave memory cause they're all waiting for there big moment, an email, an appointment, a finger touch etc. Using a task killer doesn't really do anything, cause as soon as you 'kill' the process and the moment there is available memory again the process will just return to active/inactive memory because that's the way Android memory processing works. If you have root access you can delete/freeze system apps you don't require. A 'slim' Android v2.3 ROM shouldn't have more than approx 110 system apps. Less that 95 if you're good. gr3yh0und said: I check my Task Panel once i boot my phone tons of APPS are open Like Bluetooth file transfer SMS Backup and Restore Email Alarm Clock Calender Settings Voice Dialer​ Click to expand... Click to collapse Most of the apps you listed are system apps and will, by their nature find there way into memory all the time. That's just how it is. After a few hours of use many of the non-used apps will drop out of memory and others will take their place. Loading applications into memory has a time and processing cost and so if it's already in memory, it's quicker to access. However the Android system doesn't know your usage traits at start-up and that's why some less used system applications may be seem in memory until they're weeded out by those you do use. Again, nothing to worry about, Using an XPERIA X10i with ~384MB of memory leaves little room for bloatware and thus a lean running machine is the order of the day for the XPERIA X10i.