I was quite happy with windows mobile (5 through 6.5) until I switch to HTC Desire (Android) 3-4 months back. Desire is a great machine, trust me. However since I'm a heavy user of Outlook, hotmail, messenger, Office etc. and use Windows 7 based laptop, I think I should go back to Windows plateform on my phone as well. Haven't got a chance yet to see Mozart in action so wonder if any body who has used it can give answers to some instant queries:
1- I'm with Orange, contract is due upgrade; should I get Mozart from Orange or wait until it's availalbe unbranded/unlocked form Phone4U or from Carphonewarehouse?
2- If getting from Orange is there any benefit getting Orange SatNav or Mozart can support Google maps or Bing maps with directions? (on Desire Google maps with navigation is free)
3- Hotmail connector works on Mozart?
4- Live messenger available on Mozart?
5- Mozart and Outlook sync 100% as in previous WinMo's? (i.e. email, contacts, notes, tasks)
Of any other information will be helpful. cheers...
ZeeShh said:
I was quite happy with windows mobile (5 through 6.5) until I switch to HTC Desire (Android) 3-4 months back. Desire is a great machine, trust me. However since I'm a heavy user of Outlook, hotmail, messenger, Office etc. and use Windows 7 based laptop, I think I should go back to Windows plateform on my phone as well. Haven't got a chance yet to see Mozart in action so wonder if any body who has used it can give answers to some instant queries:
1- I'm with Orange, contract is due upgrade; should I get Mozart from Orange or wait until it's availalbe unbranded/unlocked form Phone4U or from Carphonewarehouse?
2- If getting from Orange is there any benefit getting Orange SatNav or Mozart can support Google maps or Bing maps with directions? (on Desire Google maps with navigation is free)
3- Hotmail connector works on Mozart?
4- Live messenger available on Mozart?
5- Mozart and Outlook sync 100% as in previous WinMo's? (i.e. email, contacts, notes, tasks)
Of any other information will be helpful. cheers...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
everything you said is all yes but rumors are saying in a january update copy and paste and turn by turn voice naviation ill be coming
also i have a desire and am trading it in for a moozart
that's quite encouraging and yes I think I'll move back to WinMo.
Just called Orange upgrade team and apart from my usual call plan they are charging me £149.99/- one off, unless I choose talk paln of £40+. hmm, will do some more research in the eve.
I have contacted Orange (go through customer services rather than upgrades) and they are offering great deals i.e free phone on talk plans under £35. They are out of stock at the moment but I think a little bit of pestering and not accepting their first offers you may get a good deal
Despite Orange offering me deals, I'm still torn between the Mozart and the Desire HD. Any thoughts greatly appreciated!
ZeeShh said:
1- I'm with Orange, contract is due upgrade; should I get Mozart from Orange or wait until it's availalbe unbranded/unlocked form Phone4U or from Carphonewarehouse?
2- If getting from Orange is there any benefit getting Orange SatNav or Mozart can support Google maps or Bing maps with directions? (on Desire Google maps with navigation is free)
3- Hotmail connector works on Mozart?
4- Live messenger available on Mozart?
5- Mozart and Outlook sync 100% as in previous WinMo's? (i.e. email, contacts, notes, tasks)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. I'm very happy with the Orange branded one. Very little branding is present and it's easy to remove the Orange apps if you don't want/need them (although the Orange Wednesday app is awesome).
2. Bing maps is included, but not really tried it much to be honest. No Google maps as of yet.
3. Hotmail works nativly within WP7, so you just add you LIVE accont onto the device and everything is setup automatically.
4. There is NOT an official Live Messenger client that I've seen on WP7 yet, but I would be very surprised if one doesn't appear soon.
5. There is NO syncing with Outlook in WP7 via ActiveSync as in previous versions of Windows Mobile. You need to sync your Outlook with an online service like LIVE, Google or Exchange to get it on your phone.
Hmm, syncing now is different. but would it be as good and smooth as it used to be? Is this what Zune software is suppose to do. it'll be bit of exciting experience thought.
I believe Skype can be installed as well.
cheers....
ZeeShh said:
Hmm, syncing now is different. but would it be as good and smooth as it used to be? Is this what Zune software is suppose to do. it'll be bit of exciting experience thought.
I believe Skype can be installed as well.
cheers....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Skype is not available on WP7, and Skype have publicly stated they are waiting to see how much the OS takes off before starting development on an app.
Zune only syncs music, video and photos, it does not sync contacts, calendars, and other stuff.
ZeeShh said:
that's quite encouraging and yes I think I'll move back to WinMo.
Just called Orange upgrade team and apart from my usual call plan they are charging me £149.99/- one off, unless I choose talk paln of £40+. hmm, will do some more research in the eve.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have taken out a 18 month contract with orange with the mozat, its 30 queens heads a month with the hand set for free. they sold me orange maps but have compansated me as i called them back as i found out wp7 does not support them at the moment( been told they are hoping for them to be live late november).
Here's my opinion on the Mozart.
Got it a few days ago and i'm quite split, i've previously supported HTC and WM so naturally WP7 sounded great and the Mozart seems the best handset.
Overall the winning feature has to be the sound quality, with a 3.5mm jack for headphones and SRS enhancement available in an app, the sound quality is amazing. One bad point is teh shoddy handsfree kit provided with it, seems to be quite low quality for listening to music, does calls just fine though.
The camera is a high point, 8MP - more than enough quality there for my uses, unfortunately it comes with a flash, that doesn't sound like a bad feature but heres why - without the flash images are blurry, dark and as bad as they were on previous HTC devices, with the flash it takes about 5 seconds to actually take the picture, so forget about any kinda of quick snaps, the flash is also far too powerful, making shots look too dark without and too bright with, i'm sure an update will bring a little bit of control to the flash eventually though.
HD Video, great idea, great quality... that is if your target isn't moving, the autofocus is slow, exposure adjustment is the same, making the whole thing look cheap, uploading movies is also impossible without syncing to zune, no facebook upload like in WM6, again something that will be sorted in time hopefully.
Onto the programs. Unlike the camera tools, everything else is light and snappy, the Mozart opens programs quickly and effortlessly, making use of the lack of multitasking and heavy UI of WM6, WP7 is a completely differente experience. Live tiles are so so, some tiles are large and some are small with no way to switch between them, some are blank and give no information wheras teh built in ones are great. I think given time, live tiles will become a lot more custom built.
Internet is provided with good old IE, no opera yet, but given time i'm sure tjhat will change. The lack of flash is a bit annoying, needing a seperate plugin for youtube and no way to streaming any other kinda of flash video. I know windows believe HTML 5 is the future but it would be worth considering teh present, flash is a necessity pulled from under my feet. Altogether teh broswer is amazingly smooth, custom built for WP7 offereing many features like capturing a page for the live tiles. No copy and paste does cause issues but the January update will take care of this.
The marketplace is well equipped, more so than I thought it would be, with about 20 different apps for a flashlight (unfortunately those that use the camera flash do not work on the mozart for some reason), about 10 different apps to fake a phone call should you ever want it, all these range from free to about £2, the more expensive apps are mainly games, these run smoothly on the Mozart and give a nice touch to the new OS.
The major downsides to teh Mozart are the following:
Lack of ringtones, a few default boring chimes that you'd expect your dad to use, but no way to use mp3s, its just painful for me.
Battery life varies, I've been wuite impressed at times with it lasting me about 2days with light use, but everyday tasks like phone calls and wifi takes its toll.
Outlook doesn't combine emails or thread them, this may seem like somethign you don't need but WM6 had it, why doesn't WP7?
The marketplace is lacking many programs I would like such as a GPS program, bing maps is a poor substitute for Googlemaps, with very few inviting features, though i'm sure this will change.
Overall I'm impressed with the device, almost everything is snappy, the screen is great, devices are nice looking, but unfortunately with a new OS with no backward compatibility, it will take a while for things to pick up, whether the limited APIs and pricey edevelopers licence with hinder the growth of WP7 only time will tell.
My opinion of the Mozart is that although the camera puts it above the other, its software just brings it back down to the same level, theres almost no difference in the devices, maybe the Omnia 7 might push ahead with the super AMOLED screen, but as far as i'm concerned, and extra 3 megapixels on the camera makes no difference given the software.
I've been mainly distracted due to me having to switch back to Orange to get this phone. I live in North East England, and after orange and T mobile merged signals, I found t-mobile to have a constant 3G signal, cracking out speeds up to 2 meg (which is odd since only the 2G signals were merged). After having super fast mobile internet for the past few years I've moved to orange which seems to struggle to give me any form of mobile internet, I measured a mighty 13kb/s next to a 1800kb/s on my t-mobile, lets hope it improves or i won't be keeping the Mozart, after all a PDA is pretty useless without internet...
Hi All,
Thanks for you feedbacks, I'm quite convinced that I should move from Desire to Mozart. I'm really enjoying Desire as well but due to home / work on windows plateforms I think I should remain on windows plateform for my mobile as well, as I always used to be since 2006.
Orange UK is out of stock on Mozart at the moment but hoping to get it within November. cheers...
ZeeShh said:
1- I'm with Orange, contract is due upgrade; should I get Mozart from Orange or wait until it's availalbe unbranded/unlocked form Phone4U or from Carphonewarehouse?
2- If getting from Orange is there any benefit getting Orange SatNav or Mozart can support Google maps or Bing maps with directions? (on Desire Google maps with navigation is free)
3- Hotmail connector works on Mozart?
4- Live messenger available on Mozart?
5- Mozart and Outlook sync 100% as in previous WinMo's? (i.e. email, contacts, notes, tasks)
Of any other information will be helpful. cheers...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For what it's worth I'm sending my Mozart back as much preferred my Desire so will get a Desire HD.
But to answer your questions
1) Your call... cheaper on Orange and then pay £20 to unlock it
2) Orange Sat Nav doesn't work yet. Bing does support directions but is not a Sat Nav replacement.
3) Yes
4) Not that I've seen but sure it would be soon
5) Yes but as far as I could tell only email, contacts and calendar. Not tasks or notes. The outlook syncing (at least for me via exchange) has been flawless and enables you to sync multiple accounts.
Hope that helps.
Related
Hi Fellow XDA'ers!
I have a touch dual (with WM6.5).
I like the look of the Hero but have a few reservations.
Firstly, I read posts that it struggles to sync with Outlook!!?? - can this be sorted? - ActivSync (by BTooth) is very handy and does the job well.
Secondly, I like having the apps such as IGO8 or TOMTOM to hand on my phone, should I need it.
Can I install these apps (or similar) on the Hero?....In other words - can WM apps work on Android?
thanks
andy_dutch said:
Firstly, I read posts that it struggles to sync with Outlook!!?? - can this be sorted? - ActivSync (by BTooth) is very handy and does the job well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think syncing with Outlook over Bluetooth is out of the question. It can sync Contacts and Calendar (only those two) over the USB cable with the use of the 'HTC Sync' software. That software is not available _yet_ on the HTC site, but apparently it IS included on the memorycard included with the Orange bundle that is now shipping.
andy_dutch said:
Secondly, I like having the apps such as IGO8 or TOMTOM to hand on my phone, should I need it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Those two applications are not (yet?) available for Android. There are a few other navigation solutions available, but I'm under the impression they are not the level of iGO or TomTom. Also, I have no idea on which countries they support or what price they are available at.
andy_dutch said:
Can I install these apps (or similar) on the Hero?....In other words - can WM apps work on Android?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. There are a whole bunch of Android apps, but software made for Windows Mobile will simply not work (and never will) on Android. They will have to make a special Android version for it, and for utilities and tweaks that is simply not easily done.
dipje said:
There are a few other navigation solutions available, but I'm under the impression they are not the level of iGO or TomTom. Also, I have no idea on which countries they support or what price they are available at.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ALKs CoPilot Live 8 is available on the market and is quite competitively priced at £22.60 for a one region version (e.g. UK maps).
I've not played with it extensively, as I bought it as a backup for my regular Garmin satnav unit, but it is definitely much slicker than some of the other alternatives for Android that I've tried (e.g. AndNav).
Regards,
Dave
foxmeister said:
ALKs CoPilot Live 8 is available on the market and is quite competitively priced at £22.60 for a one region version (e.g. UK maps).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems to be a good TomTom alternative! Thanks for the Tip! And they even have 'whole of western europe' or only 'benelux'. That makes it much more affordable if you never leave The Netherlands for example .
Since I'm an Android newbie myself (well, not even an Android newbie, still waiting for my Hero): On the CoPilot site, on 'where to buy' to say to go to the Android market. But they also have three picture, some sort of square barcode. I've seen those more around Android oriented pages. How do they work?
It's a QR code (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QR_Code) which is essentially a 2-dimensional barcode that can hold a variety of data. In this case, it is holding a URL.
If you download a barcode reader from the market (e.g. Barcode Scanner by ZXing team, which is the one I use) you can use the phones camera to "read" the barcode and it will then allow you to jump to the URL in the browser.
Regards,
Dave
Winmo apps on Android
You never know what could happen guys!
I currently dual boot windows 7 ultimate and Linux Ubuntu.
And as all linux users are aware, there is a nice little app called wine, Wine allows us to run and use many windows apps in a Linux enviroment...
Cant be that much different with Android (linux) and windows mobile.. can it?
Would be a fantastic step and i think possibly the final push for many winmo users!
Im still struggling to choose my self....From HD to Hero?? mmmm
There are few things you need to know about the young android:
1. You cannot save apps to memory card unless rooted.
2. You cannot receive files via bluetooth unless rooted.
overall, Android is a lot better than Winmob
Sorry if this is a stupid question :-(
I run a number of Java applets under WINMO via an applet manager (ESmertec for example). Will these run on Android?
CoPilot is working brilliantly on my Magic and I'll be putting it on my Hero when I get it at weekend.
Here's a great thing - any apps that I've purchased from the Android Market are tied to my google checkout account - When I sign in on my Hero and go to market, those apps will show as purchased and downloadable for me. Also my calendar and contacts will automatically sync to my Hero.
As far as WM apps are concerned, I've used both WM6 and android devices - Not missing anything on my Magic that I had on WM now that Turn By Turn Nav is there. Some apps are already ported over - Docs To go, and recently Touchpal Keyboards.
The ability to search for, find, pay for (if needed) and download software on the fly is just priceless. The fact that most apps are free or very cheap is even better. I'd not go back to WinMo now for anything...
However, you're just gonna have to get one in your hand and see for yourself - its all personal preference amongst the top handsets really.
well my upgrade is being delivered in the morning! yey! HTC Hero on orange..
Wonder if tomtom will port any time soon? should be an easy job considering the tom tom units are linux driven!
jackdaniels_lee said:
Wonder if tomtom will port any time soon? should be an easy job considering the tom tom units are linux driven!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been a TomTom user (on my HTC Trinity and HTC Touch Pro) for almost 3 years now. My HTC Hero will be arriving on Monday morning and I'm actually pretty excited about the change I'll be making to CoPilot.
Not that there's anything wrong with TomTom, but the newer version of CoPilot looks very cool, and it might be nice to try something different.
iammorris said:
I've been a TomTom user (on my HTC Trinity and HTC Touch Pro) for almost 3 years now. My HTC Hero will be arriving on Monday morning and I'm actually pretty excited about the change I'll be making to CoPilot.
Not that there's anything wrong with TomTom, but the newer version of CoPilot looks very cool, and it might be nice to try something different.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have heard a lot of people complaining about the version of CoPilot crashing on the Hero, not sure why this is. TomTom are releasing an iPhone version so who knows, might make its way over to Android in about 3 years?
For me, Copilot certainly crashed. It was not a patch on the stability of Garmin XT. The application felt unfinished with a lot of times when not a full crash, lack of keyboard reponse. Tbh, this failure was the straw that broke the Hero's back
I've not had a single problem with copilot on my magic. Fully tested with postcodes etc and long journeys. Its VERY cheap compared to most satnavs, can be used without any data assistance at all, and very quick to reroute etc.
I have heard about some probs but they have mostly seemed to be related to people trying to hack it or get the maps running without paying, and I know that copilot has added a few layers of security since I bought mine for magic - initially it just installed and needed your google checkout number.
Then it needed that, and you then got a license code and device ID thingy.
I had an update early on from version .303 to .327 which made mine stop loading - One email to support, told me to uninstall ALL, including the maps folder, and it was back working perfectly... I personally think the voices of folks having probs trying to get it running without paying are clouding the issue a bit - I've only heard from one (cbailey) who I know paid, but still got crashes.
Daisy - Was happy with my G1 (since Jan) Happy with my Magic(since beginning of June), and gonna be happy with my Hero I think...
Dayzee said:
I've not had a single problem with copilot on my magic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're in the UK right? I have been looking into copilot as a replacement for my old TomTom once I get my Hero. And although copilot said on their website they have european versions, if I browse the store (though Cyrket for example) I only see their USA map pack / application. Is this location / localization dependant somehow? Why can't I see the european maps in the market?
Dayzee said:
Daisy - Was happy with my G1 (since Jan) Happy with my Magic(since beginning of June), and gonna be happy with my Hero I think...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think we got a big android fan here
In the Market, you get the option for a One Region map - Uk and Ireland comes under that - for £25.99 (Market shows 22 something but then checkout adds VAT for UK)
I think these options are only seen/available on market for android phones. I think they are not offered as products for other platforms, and you only get details once you have bought CoPilot 8 for android.
I personally downloaded CoPilot Central and got my maps via PC through that. You get a Membership name and password when you checkout at google Checkout - I was sent an email with details of that. The actual copilot programe for android downloads to your fone OTA like other apps, but the map fetcher is on PC. I think you CAN get the maps OTA to your fone, but I thougyht that seemed silly and would take ages and be heavy on your data allowance etc.
CoPilot central is free I think - You can get it here
http://www.alk.eu.com/copilot/central/
Daisy xxx
Dayzee said:
I think you CAN get the maps OTA to your fone, but I thougyht that seemed silly and would take ages and be heavy on your data allowance etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can get them OTA direct onto the phone via cellular data, but the program advises you do it over WiFi.
Regards,
Dave
cbailey said:
For me, Copilot certainly crashed. It was not a patch on the stability of Garmin XT. The application felt unfinished with a lot of times when not a full crash, lack of keyboard reponse. Tbh, this failure was the straw that broke the Hero's back
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problems at all with CoPilot APART from TouchFlo seems to lock up when I exit. Not sure if anyone else has this problem.
Other than that, it has no lag what-so-ever, which I used to always have with TomTom. Big thumbs up for me, even more so when I sort out the locking issue when exit, but thats no biggie.
I hope no-one minds but I got my Mozart yesterday and the only link that seems to talk about what is good and bad about it (here) hasn't had a new entry since November.
I also reckon that the Microsoft Developers know that xda-developers is the only place to go for sensible smartphone discussions and hopefully they will read this and make some changes.
I wasn't convinced that the Mozart would be better than my HD2 but actually....
Good:
Great Screen Resolution
Fast
Internet Explorer is better than I expected and the Pinch to Zoom is great
I like the start screen and the way the 3G signal gets out of the way
Bad:
No Comm Manager - switching on WiFi, Bluetooth, Flight Mode is a real pain
No Internet Sharing - AARRRRGGGHH!
Can't find my WiFi with hidden ESSID - GGGRRRRR!
No MyPhone Sync
I'm not sure I'm keen on the lock-down on apps - it's probably the only thing that will force me to Open Source Android.
I used gyrator2 to switch the screen off when I turned the HD2 vertically down - it saved on battery.
Thank goodness MS don't seem to have made WP7 into a steppingstone to a proper OS (like vista was to Win7!). The way I'm using it, it's the almost finished.
I'm hoping that someone will come up with a Comm Manager App. But I don't know about the other stuff.
Has anyone else got anything to add? What would make WP7 work better for you?
PS Please move this if it's duplicated elsewhere.
Thanks for the heads-up, just brought a Mozart today expecting delivery on Tuesday, I've come from the Android phones Galaxy S & X10 Mini, will be interesting to see how this shapes up against them.
anoyances
i also bought one and generally i think they realy solved the job doing a MS based phone that works. (i moved from a diamond2 with os6.5)
but what realy makes me angry is that i read in the commcersials and specs that i could use mp3 for ringtones (wich phones cant today anyway). but even if being a trivial requerent i would not go with out it.
now i realize that i can use mp3 - BUT ONLY IF I BUY IT FROM ZUNE WTF!!!!!
are they trying out the apple business plan?
im aware that i can "jail break" (where did i last hear about this.. og iPhone/apple) .. but i risk brick´ing my phone and thats a bummer.
still realy nice phone.
a file handler would be nice though and some grouping functionality. the start screeen cannot collect all your messaging and mail in a single icon for access. you have to add evry single one of them in the shortcut list for ease of access.. thats anoying if you have 4 mail and text messaging like me.. grouping would rock..
another thing is "People" its a looker if you want to see contratct and facebook updates, byt anoying for phone contact list
and whats it with the contact list? you cannot sync with outlook only exchange serveres. otherwise you have to expose your full contact list on windows live or facebook to get it synced to your phone.
now i believe i should be paid for using my phone then.. they get to know me and all of my friends including phone info, full name, job detaisl address etc etc. thats something that valueable.. and i dont get to choose if i want to take part.. i want money Zune/HTC and Microsoft!
im semi pleased .. nice phone but realy creapy business methods
A week later....an update
I can see what you're saying js0937.
I'm not really into changing the ringtone but I did notice that you couldn't do it. I can't believe that it has to come from Zune - it does make Android seem very attractive!
I've coped with the Outlook / Live syncing by having a separate account for my contacts but it is a bit long-winded.
I'm waiting for the update (due in Jan 2011 but when??? we're already two-thirds through!) to see whether these problems get solved.
Given that I worked with winphone 6.5 for so long, winphone7 is still much, much better but I still want Internet Sharing and a Comm Manager
tony_wh said:
I'm waiting for the update (due in Jan 2011 but when???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Update whill be soon (7 feb.?)
h..p://microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/features/update-info.aspx
Hoping the update sorts the voice dialing out as its rubbish compaired to 6.5. This is a big step back. Be nice to get more info of what the update will bring. Roll on the 7th, fingers crossed.
My 2 cents
Ye, here you have the list:
MUSTS (otherwise I will NOT use the phone for my business):
- Network sharing
- People view by company OR search by company
- copy paste OR use selected text as signature
- outlook categories (seriously!) sort/show calendar, ppl, by category
- tasks list
WANTS (It would be nice to have it):
- activesync with desktop (mailny notes, and such)
- messaging hub (it is enough to group it together in one tile displaying summary of all unread messages, no matter from where they come. It can link to selection screen, where I can pick the mail/messaging account).
- connect tasks with SharePoint lists
- see Active Directory coleagues callendars (or at least simple meeting assistant that shows free/busy for attendees)
- Remote Desktop Connection (it is a pity that having that screen I cannot connect to my virtual desktop if needed)
I am business guy, and always used WinMo as a nice tool. Now... I have waited so long for WP7 and I cant use it for work. I gave it to my Woman, and now I am considering other OSes...
Microsoft, you are pissing on your most loyal customer segment!
Hi Titan users
I'm a current Android user and was thinking of jumping over to WP7 and Titan.
My question is, how is customization on WP7? I know WP7 uses tiles, can I make my own tiles and replace the stock ones?
I used Launcher Pro 7 for Android for awhile and I was able to customize the tiles in that.
Also wanted to know how the marketplace is compared to Android. I don't use a whole lot of apps but there are important ones I do use. Netflix, GooglePlus, maps etc etc....
Any advice in moving from Android to WP7 would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance!
Mortem Tuam said:
Hi Titan users
I'm a current Android user and was thinking of jumping over to WP7 and Titan.
My question is, how is customization on WP7? I know WP7 uses tiles, can I make my own tiles and replace the stock ones?
I used Launcher Pro 7 for Android for awhile and I was able to customize the tiles in that.
Also wanted to know how the marketplace is compared to Android. I don't use a whole lot of apps but there are important ones I do use. Netflix, GooglePlus, maps etc etc....
Any advice in moving from Android to WP7 would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've moved from WinMo 6.5 to Android to WinPho 7.5
From WM6.5 to Android - I loved the market and apps and games (for first 10 days). Then I got bored. As I only install about 9-10 apps max and on daily basis used probably 2-3 of those. But then it was boring boring boring. I used Launcher7 for about a year just to make it 'feel' like WP7. However all those tiles in Launcher7 are just big icons that launch apps. But after buying Titan yesterday, I've realised how much I've been fooling myself! The real WP7.5 tiles do launch an app but again the UI and interface makes you drool! It's cool, crisp, quick! Feels nothing like Launcher7. In terms of customization, like Launcher7 you can't rename tiles etc. But if you have an app that can be pinned, your bookmarks can be pinned, your contacts can be pinned, your fav recipe can be pinned, you fav anything can be pinned! The apps are pushing major updates now to support 7.5 Mango which has major benefit of live tiles - Launcher7 never will be able to achieve this! The live tiles in apps like BBC News, Scorecentre, FB etc - are much fun and gives all the info you need. This way in past two days I've not launched FB, Twitter even once to see if I had notification coz the tile said it as soon as I unlocked the screen!
WP7.5 - Market is tiny compared to Android, but I got all the apps I use apart from a decent forum app. All the apps/games I liked on android I found it free here on WP7.5. But if you are into apps and their numbers, you won't like WP7.5 so don't buy it. There is no official Google+ yet, but there are couple of workaround for now. I think major apps will show up in next 5-6 months or so in the market.
drupad2drupad said:
I've moved from WinMo 6.5 to Android to WinPho 7.5
From WM6.5 to Android - I loved the market and apps and games (for first 10 days). Then I got bored. As I only install about 9-10 apps max and on daily basis used probably 2-3 of those. But then it was boring boring boring. I used Launcher7 for about a year just to make it 'feel' like WP7. However all those tiles in Launcher7 are just big icons that launch apps. But after buying Titan yesterday, I've realised how much I've been fooling myself! The real WP7.5 tiles do launch an app but again the UI and interface makes you drool! It's cool, crisp, quick! Feels nothing like Launcher7. In terms of customization, like Launcher7 you can't rename tiles etc. But if you have an app that can be pinned, your bookmarks can be pinned, your contacts can be pinned, your fav recipe can be pinned, you fav anything can be pinned! The apps are pushing major updates now to support 7.5 Mango which has major benefit of live tiles - Launcher7 never will be able to achieve this! The live tiles in apps like BBC News, Scorecentre, FB etc - are much fun and gives all the info you need. This way in past two days I've not launched FB, Twitter even once to see if I had notification coz the tile said it as soon as I unlocked the screen!
WP7.5 - Market is tiny compared to Android, but I got all the apps I use apart from a decent forum app. All the apps/games I liked on android I found it free here on WP7.5. But if you are into apps and their numbers, you won't like WP7.5 so don't buy it. There is no official Google+ yet, but there are couple of workaround for now. I think major apps will show up in next 5-6 months or so in the market.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
very cool.
thanks for your reply, much appreciated
I'm coming from a Samsung Galaxy S (also used to have an iPhone), and I have to say the switch to Windows Phone was pretty smooth, and I love my Titan now.
The only nuisance I've had so far is getting my Google Contacts to show up in my address book... I couldn't find an option for "only display contacts with phone numbers" as there is on Android, so I had to go through one by one and pin my most contacted people for convenience - not sure if there is another way to do this.
But other than that, I love WP. Very clean interface, very cool transitions from page to page, good integration with Xbox Live, Zune, etc., I recommend it to any Android user.
As the person above me stated, the biggest difference between WP vs Android/iPhone right now is the size of the market. But most of the apps you use are probably on the Windows Marketplace in one form or another, and apps are slowly being ported over.
I have an HTC HD2 (no Titan yet). I started on WM6.5 with it and moved to Android (ACA Rom) loved it. I stayed primarily on Android until the end of Aug when I flashed my first WP7 Rom. It was a NODO Rom, I didn't really like it very much and went back to Android for my daily driver for a few more weeks. Yuki/XBMod's Rom was released at the end of Aug. I flashed that and have only gone back to Android just to keep it updated. When my HD2 dies, I'm probably going to go with a WP7.5 device. Even on the HD2, WP7.5 is responsive, smooth and quick. It meets my needs in almost all respects. Android is much more customizable then WP7.5, no question. There are a few things on my "wishlist". I miss Swype, I would like to be able to modify bluetooth so that I can have my BT connected for phone calls and still have the 3.5mm output for music. It's also missing internet connection sharing (right now, hopefully that will be remedied soon). No flash for WP7.5 and I can't connect to my companies webmail (both work fine on Android). You can't transfer files to the phone easily over usb and you are really tied to Zune. I think that's the one of the biggest drawbacks. I hate being tied to a computer. Another major drawback is that there is no way to back up SMS or other personal info and apps (Titanium Backup). You can backup (only when updating with Zune) if you are unlocked and can use Yuki/XBmod custom cab sender to backup (not sure about other pure WP7.5 phones though).
WP7.5 market is terribly small and limited compared to Android, but as I said I don't get crazy for apps. I've found most apps that I need. Official Netflix works great and gMaps Pro is a Google maps app, Bing maps is pretty good and Nokia maps/drive will be available in the near future. Unfortunately, no Google+.
I think my biggest difficulty was trying to use the Google Calendar & Hotmail Calendar together.
Overall experience with both Android & WP7.5 has been great. Both have limitations, both have advantages. I'm so glad I have an HD2 so I can go back and forth to try both out and so each can compliment the other!
This is a sweet looking phone. I've been a long time iPhone user and tried Android. Went back to the iPhone. Android was to buggy for me. Tried WinMo and really liked it. I did go back to the iPhone just because I am so vested in the Apple ecosystem. But if I had to give up the iPhone it would be for the Windows phone. The Windows phone is the closest thing to the iPhone in terms of stabability and smoothness.
lantern20 said:
I have an HTC HD2 (no Titan yet). I started on WM6.5 with it and moved to Android (ACA Rom) loved it. I stayed primarily on Android until the end of Aug when I flashed my first WP7 Rom. It was a NODO Rom, I didn't really like it very much and went back to Android for my daily driver for a few more weeks. Yuki/XBMod's Rom was released at the end of Aug. I flashed that and have only gone back to Android just to keep it updated. When my HD2 dies, I'm probably going to go with a WP7.5 device. Even on the HD2, WP7.5 is responsive, smooth and quick. It meets my needs in almost all respects. Android is much more customizable then WP7.5, no question. There are a few things on my "wishlist". I miss Swype, I would like to be able to modify bluetooth so that I can have my BT connected for phone calls and still have the 3.5mm output for music. It's also missing internet connection sharing (right now, hopefully that will be remedied soon). No flash for WP7.5 and I can't connect to my companies webmail (both work fine on Android). You can't transfer files to the phone easily over usb and you are really tied to Zune. I think that's the one of the biggest drawbacks. I hate being tied to a computer. Another major drawback is that there is no way to back up SMS or other personal info and apps (Titanium Backup). You can backup (only when updating with Zune) if you are unlocked and can use Yuki/XBmod custom cab sender to backup (not sure about other pure WP7.5 phones though).
WP7.5 market is terribly small and limited compared to Android, but as I said I don't get crazy for apps. I've found most apps that I need. Official Netflix works great and gMaps Pro is a Google maps app, Bing maps is pretty good and Nokia maps/drive will be available in the near future. Unfortunately, no Google+.
I think my biggest difficulty was trying to use the Google Calendar & Hotmail Calendar together.
Overall experience with both Android & WP7.5 has been great. Both have limitations, both have advantages. I'm so glad I have an HD2 so I can go back and forth to try both out and so each can compliment the other!
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Click to collapse
you've got to remember though that most of android functionality are because you had it rooted! If you jail break wp7.5 it will have many other apps to support things similar to what you mentioned. However that said, we still have slower development on wp7.5 but I think one major update and 50,000 apps in just over a year is very positive news for fresh from the scratch OS!
I can connect to 6 emails and 3 social networks without any issue with contacts or sync or anything! That's where I got very impressed compared to android or iOs. In other OS you have to have atleast 3-4 apps to sync that amount of data with pictures!
No issues with work emails or work address book. We use outlook 2007.
I do have internet Sharing on this phone. It works fine! Obviously you won't find the real experience with a ported OS. Maybe Bluetooth might work if you use a real wp7.5? ;-)
I have also easily synced google, hotmail, yahoo and Facebook calenders. Not a single issue.
Best part is WP 7.5 NEVER force closes :-D
3.5 mm will be supported on Titan in near future apparently. However using connected media app its possible to link up. You can use this phone as a usb stick TRUE, but you can sync all you need via Zune so don't see this as an issue. Its rather safer knowing how easy it is to get windows corrupted if plugged as a usb.
drupad2drupad said:
you've got to remember though that most of android functionality are because you had it rooted! If you jail break wp7.5 it will have many other apps to support things similar to what you mentioned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Speaking of which, I understand jail-breaking WP7(.5) just got a lot easier.
https://labs.chevronwp7.com/
However, last time I logged into my account there, they were "out" of unlock tokens available for purchase.
spd_rcr said:
Speaking of which, I understand jail-breaking WP7(.5) just got a lot easier.
https://labs.chevronwp7.com/
However, last time I logged into my account there, they were "out" of unlock tokens available for purchase.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure if jailbreaking is reversible. I don't know much about it, but don't want to not be able to come back to WP standard. Because in future if updates stop coming to jailbreakon WP, then it's not good. Because Mango, Tango anything, keeps making it better and better...
It's not a jailbreak like iOS or root like android. It allows you to sideload apps from outside the market but doesn't elevate your privileges beyond that.
The Chevron WP7 Labs are done in cooperation with Microsoft and uses Microsoft's own Servers at some point to do the actual Developer Unlock on the phone. It is the same as the Developer Unlock but without the possibility to publish to the Marketplace.
Calling it Jailbreak therefore is pretty much misleading.
StevieBallz said:
The Chevron WP7 Labs are done in cooperation with Microsoft and uses Microsoft's own Servers at some point to do the actual Developer Unlock on the phone. It is the same as the Developer Unlock but without the possibility to publish to the Marketplace.
Calling it Jailbreak therefore is pretty much misleading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any links to developer unlock? Or is it not possible?
Hello,
I'm fed up with my Nokia N-8. Works bad, is slow, freezes, has some hidden files somewhere taking all the phone memory, and generally pisses me off.
So now I'm hesitating between the Galaxy S4 and the Lumia.
I'm someone who needs :
- reliable phone in most situations. It would be unnaceptable to have no phone due to proffessional duties.
- A Citrix app (good), thethering on an Android tablet (even better) or both (awesomeness).
- Reasonable amounts of games for train strikes.
- Reasonable pictures taken (I heard the Lumia is amazing on this side)
- NO BLOODY NOKIA OVI SUITE. NO. NO. NO.
- A SIMPLE software to synch the phone music/pics/videos, and save the phone contacts. I'll be running windows 8 pro from tomorrow evening onwards.
- A VLC or equivalent application.
- A Dropbox App
- Microsoft Office documents read and write. Can you store Excel spreadsheets on this Skydrive thingy and read/modify it on the phone whenever you want ?
- And lastly a complete email client. I guess there's an Outlook on theese things, but could you please confirm ?
I know the GS4 will be better in terms of pure hardware, but I'm generally not a big Google fan, and I would like to avoid having work stuff on Google's Android. I guess if I take the Lumia I'll switch the Asus Transformer for a Surface 2 when it comes out. This said I was extremely pissed off with my whole Nokia N-8 experience, and try to be sure I'm not making the same mistake again...
Thanks a lot.
Kind regards,
A prospective
Wouldn't know about Citrix, Android tethering or VLC, but as to the rest, the answer is yes. I got my 920 as soon as AT&T posted them, and I love it.
No problem tethering an android tablet...or any tablet for that matter. Not sure on VLC
Sent from my LG-E970 using Tapatalk 2
- reliable phone in most situations. It would be unnaceptable to have no phone due to proffessional duties.
I'm using Windows Phone for years since in my opinion is the most stable and user friendly phone experience... In my smartphone telephony is still the most important thing, thats a reason why i left Android, it's not acceptable for my that my phone reboots and hangs on the pin screen which android did a lot
- A Citrix app (good), thethering on an Android tablet (even better) or both (awesomeness).
Wifi-Tethering is build in in Windows phone, don't know about a citrix app
- Reasonable amounts of games for train strikes.
There are enough games on Windows phone, sure there are more on iOS and Android, but now with native coding and xbox live every day more games are coming
- Reasonable pictures taken (I heard the Lumia is amazing on this side)
Windows Phone is the best an fastest picture taking experience you can get on a smartphone, every phone has a dedicated camera button which starts the camera super fast... and you can view your last shot in milliseconds.. which is taking ages on android... The quality of the pictures depends on your smartphone... if you want good pictures take Nokia or Samsung... but do not take a HTC for pictures ^^
- NO BLOODY NOKIA OVI SUITE. NO. NO. NO.
No ovi suite
- A SIMPLE software to synch the phone music/pics/videos, and save the phone contacts. I'll be running windows 8 pro from tomorrow evening onwards.
It's all done directly from the phone to your live account no need for a PC for pictures, calender and phone contacts...
If you want music or videos, just copy them from the explorer to your phone
- A VLC or equivalent application.
VLC is coming, right now you have xbox video... i play everything i throw at it
- A Dropbox App
I use Skydrive so i don't know abaout Dropbox
- Microsoft Office documents read and write. Can you store Excel spreadsheets on this Skydrive thingy and read/modify it on the phone whenever you want ?
Yes, Yes, Yes
- And lastly a complete email client. I guess there's an Outlook on theese things, but could you please confirm ?
Email is solid and built in, and you can even "zoom in" into your HTML mails unlike on android
Ikkari said:
- reliable phone in most situations. It would be unnaceptable to have no phone due to proffessional duties.
I'm using Windows Phone for years since in my opinion is the most stable and user friendly phone experience... In my smartphone telephony is still the most important thing, thats a reason why i left Android, it's not acceptable for my that my phone reboots and hangs on the pin screen which android did a lot
- A Citrix app (good), thethering on an Android tablet (even better) or both (awesomeness).
Wifi-Tethering is build in in Windows phone, don't know about a citrix app
- Reasonable amounts of games for train strikes.
There are enough games on Windows phone, sure there are more on iOS and Android, but now with native coding and xbox live every day more games are coming
- Reasonable pictures taken (I heard the Lumia is amazing on this side)
Windows Phone is the best an fastest picture taking experience you can get on a smartphone, every phone has a dedicated camera button which starts the camera super fast... and you can view your last shot in milliseconds.. which is taking ages on android... The quality of the pictures depends on your smartphone... if you want good pictures take Nokia or Samsung... but do not take a HTC for pictures ^^
- NO BLOODY NOKIA OVI SUITE. NO. NO. NO.
No ovi suite
- A SIMPLE software to synch the phone music/pics/videos, and save the phone contacts. I'll be running windows 8 pro from tomorrow evening onwards.
It's all done directly from the phone to your live account no need for a PC for pictures, calender and phone contacts...
If you want music or videos, just copy them from the explorer to your phone
- A VLC or equivalent application.
VLC is coming, right now you have xbox video... i play everything i throw at it
- A Dropbox App
I use Skydrive so i don't know abaout Dropbox
- Microsoft Office documents read and write. Can you store Excel spreadsheets on this Skydrive thingy and read/modify it on the phone whenever you want ?
Yes, Yes, Yes
- And lastly a complete email client. I guess there's an Outlook on theese things, but could you please confirm ?
Email is solid and built in, and you can even "zoom in" into your HTML mails unlike on android
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Xbox video will not play MKV files. Or at least the encodes that much of the anime fansubs are done in.
Thank you for all your answers.
I will wait a little and see if I get along fine wih windows 8, and then I guess I'll switch to the 920.
Thanks for your time.
Kind regards,
T
I'm running outlook synced with work server. it runs well and updated all my contacts and appointments well. i can also update appointments and sync using my phone. only downside so far is pdf experience. Office files can be saved on phone and skydrive so you can work offline. I like also nokia map as it is offline as many times i am in china and don't have cell data only wifi. New update for skype allows notifications as well which was finally released. I been happy with phone only couple of hangs since november. i also dropped it from good height and only got couple minor dings on frame of phone.
Oh well.
I did my usual thing. Sigh. Say "f*** it". Ordered it.
I hope I'll like it
Solarenemy68 said:
Xbox video will not play MKV files. Or at least the encodes that much of the anime fansubs are done in.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unsupported files are recoded on the fly while you copy them...
---------- Post added at 06:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:13 PM ----------
Thrawninioub said:
Oh well.
I did my usual thing. Sigh. Say "f*** it". Ordered it.
I hope I'll like it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are a little bit like me than...
As a long time android user (since the T-Mobile G1 so about 5 years) i decided to try the Lumia 920 a few days ago and so far i`am loving it, so here are my first thoughts :
- The speed and lagless performance of the OS powered by a dual core cpu instead by a quad- or octocore cpu that is required for android. Clearly the OS and hardware are far better optimized than android. Also i had no reboots or fc`s so far.
- Many specific Nokia apps like Drive that enables navigation without a data connection required as you can download and install maps from the country`s you need.
- Seemless integration and synchronisation with Google and great data/contacts/calender transference when setting up the phone.
- Though there are obviously less apps available than with iOs and android there are many more than i initialy thought and most good and important apps are available. Only Dropbox is limited imo as it doesn`t sync and add automaticaly.
- Great camera and speakers.
- Good call quality.
I didn`t think it was going to be as good as it turned out so far but atm i don`t miss android at all and so i might stick with WP8 for a long(er) while than i anticipated.
Hope the coming update planned for July will bring some more goodies
if any problem with Google sync, simple set Google account via advanced setup
settings - email+accounts - add an account - advanced setup
- add your account info
- select Exchange ActiveSync
- add other data (dont forget to enter full email address for username), for server use m.google.com
- Sign in.... that's all
for calendar's problems look Microsoft advises
http://microsoft-news.com/sync-google-calendar-events-to-windows-calendar-app-via-outlook-com/
P.S.
Also must have app for WP is Store Deals to check latest discounts and occasional free periods for pay apps
Don't know what you mean about seemless integration with Google Calendar. Can't edit it at all. I had to follow Microsoft's tip and subscribe to it via Outlook.com but you can't edit the Google calendar that way as it is read only. Email and contacts are great. Hopefully the update that includes CalDAV support will fix the calendar issues.
Spectre51 said:
Don't know what you mean about seemless integration with Google Calendar. Can't edit it at all. I had to follow Microsoft's tip and subscribe to it via Outlook.com but you can't edit the Google calendar that way as it is read only. Email and contacts are great. Hopefully the update that includes CalDAV support will fix the calendar issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you use Google calendar which i don't changes you make on the regular calender on the phone will sync to the google calendar and vice versa if you change google calendar on the PC. Just use the normal calendar on the phone and it should sync with your other calenders linked through google or hotmail.
Solarenemy68 said:
If you use Google calendar which i don't changes you make on the regular calender on the phone will sync to the google calendar and vice versa if you change google calendar on the PC. Just use the normal calendar on the phone and it should sync with your other calenders linked through google or hotmail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry I was getting my windows devices mixed up.....It is working for me on WP8 just not Windows 8
Agreed in everything.
worst problem I found in WP8? Whatsapp...not always updating, got the notification but not the message....and we really need a good video player with mp4, avi and srt support.....and a notification center.
Any MS guy ever read this forum?
ramping said:
Agreed in everything.
worst problem I found in WP8? Whatsapp...not always updating, got the notification but not the message....and we really need a good video player with mp4, avi and srt support.....and a notification center.
Any MS guy ever read this forum?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
whats app working fine for me... no missed or late notification....
also avi and mp4 files work fine... and dont except or hope for srt (or any other subtitle) player... f you hope for this, you not learn anything about WP....
dxdy said:
whats app working fine for me... no missed or late notification....
also avi and mp4 files work fine... and dont except or hope for srt (or any other subtitle) player... f you hope for this, you not learn anything about WP....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YXPlayer can play videos with srt subtitles....but it´s a crappy app.
Still waiting for the VLC official app.
Anyone expiriace any problems with whatsapp?
Mobtel063 said:
Anyone expiriace any problems with whatsapp?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't use it; I use Skype and MetroTalk. Skype's not free but I'm not going to worry about paying on average $60 a year; $5 a month. It doesn't require my universe to have the identical app on the other end.
Quick question...
I really, really, really detest my Xperia S now, like really detest it.
The lagging, god-awful camera, the freezing, everything.
I would try to install a custom Rom, but my Bootlocker unlocked allowed is: no.
I'm really not a high-end user. No interest in games, or intensive apps.
Camera, browsing, travel apps are the main interest for me.
I can get rid of it and pay approx £60-£100 to get the Lumia 920
Would you guys advise it?
steevio_uk said:
Quick question...
I really, really, really detest my Xperia S now, like really detest it.
The lagging, god-awful camera, the freezing, everything.
I would try to install a custom Rom, but my Bootlocker unlocked allowed is: no.
I'm really not a high-end user. No interest in games, or intensive apps.
Camera, browsing, travel apps are the main interest for me.
I can get rid of it and pay approx £60-£100 to get the Lumia 920
Would you guys advise it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bought the 920 to replace the xperia t I had, best thing I ever did
It's fast, fluid, no freezes or hangups, battery life is great for me, the camera is awesome and I love the wireless charging.
If you can live without the modding and just use your phone for what it is then I don't think you'll be disappointed.
Sent from the event horizon of a quantum singularity
steevio_uk said:
Quick question...
I really, really, really detest my Xperia S now, like really detest it.
The lagging, god-awful camera, the freezing, everything.
I would try to install a custom Rom, but my Bootlocker unlocked allowed is: no.
I'm really not a high-end user. No interest in games, or intensive apps.
Camera, browsing, travel apps are the main interest for me.
I can get rid of it and pay approx £60-£100 to get the Lumia 920
Would you guys advise it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have been an iPhone user and then a multitude of android phones user (Samsung) before embracing WP8.
My opinion: iPhone is fine if you just want a phone that works - although Apple lost me after the release of the iPhone 4: I was obviously holding it wrong when I wanted to make a call so it mostly wouldn't iOS is simple to use and has lots of apps, but is a walled garden.
Android, while open and extremely customizable, really annoyed me: at first the phones were fine, then became laggy over time. I also found I was frequently rebooting the phones daily. You shouldn't have to install a custom ROM for it to work smoothly. While there are a lot of apps, they are mostly poor quality compared to their iOS counterparts.
So I decided on trying out WP8 around 4 months ago and bought a Lumia 920. First off the build quality is excellent, it's a solid lump of a phone, not tacky plastic feeling like the Samsungs I had. The operating system has NEVER lagged on me...EVER. I only found out a few weeks after I'd had it how to reboot it, and I only did that to find out how to, not that it needed it. Although not nearly as customizable as the androids, I personally got bored doing so with the Samsungs anyway. I love the Live Tiles on the Lumia 920. Again there are nowhere near the amount of apps as iOS or Android, but those there are I find to be as good as iOS apps.
The camera is excellent. So good in fact that when my other half wants pictures taken she asks me to do so - she has an iPhone 5.
At first I was worried by the fact you cannot use a memory card, but honestly I find the 32gb onboard to be plenty - never had to go through and delete stuff to make more room. An added bonus is the wireless charging - I still think it's witchcraft :laugh: no idea how or why it works but it does lol
So in summary, yes - I thoroughly recommend the Lumia 920 for your needs: the camera is great, the stock browser is quick and I never had a problem with it and navigation is top notch.
Thanks so much for your replies.
I have had the phone for 4-5 days now and I am absolutely delighted by the decision. Possibly the best hardware change/update I've ever made.
I am finding excuses for taking pictures, such is the quality of the camera, enjoying getting to grips with the new layout and O/S, trying to find decent apps for certain things I used on Android, the main one being the notes app, which was sat on my Android home screen and I used regularly as a 1 click solution to add a note and remind me of things.
Something like that, as a simple live tile would be great, but haven't found such an app yet. (Any you guys suggest?)
I was initially very concerned by the battery life. I took it out with me after an initial charge and found the battery draining away at an alarming rate, even with it in my pocket!
But as I'm sure you're well aware, there's the changes to remedy this;; turning NFC off, location, background apps, getting used to exiting an app with the back button etc.
Great battery life now.
Just ordered a case and I'm one happy bunny!
My god, the Xperia S seems like a distant nightmare now! :victory: