Hey everyone,
Some of you may know me from some of the programs I have made, to others I may be a whole new name. In any case, I am CycloneZephyrxz7, a developer and co-founder to Chicken-Egg Solutions. My friend and I conceived the idea: "People want programs, but can't code ... We can code, but can't think of ideas ... Lets mix it up!" and then came our project "Chicken-Egg Solutions"
Currently, we are employed in making a website for an up-and-coming Musician, and have a few more sites on the negotiating table.
BUT I AM SORRY ... this post is NOT ADVERTISING, I am just giving a little background.
Take the top like a Resume of sorts, to see if you all are in support of this idea of Continuing the XDA-Marketplace.
I spoke with my friend (the web-development expert of the two of us) to see if he would be up to making this, and taking on the now cancelled project. He said "If people are interested, then sure". So Please Please vote in the Poll and tell me if you would like to see this project resurrected! He and I are very devoted, and if we were to take on the project, we would sure be able to pump out results and updates [he being the web-developer, and I being the mobile and PC developer]
So yeah, if the polls turn out good, then we will have a new project, and XDA will have an organized application/hack/improvement repository!
After a long conversation, and reviewing some basic ideas of how we would attack such a project, my friend and I agreed:
We Will Ressurect the XDA-Marketplace and Make it Our Project!
We are going to start working on the website in the coming week. This is the plan of action we have decided to take:
Step 1: Conceptualization
In this stage of the creation of the new XDA-Marketplace, my friend and I will draw up designs for a functional, simple, yet feature-rich website. We will consider everything from ease of coding, to ease of use, to organization in the future. Our goal at this point is to generate the idea of a 'perfect' website that will accommodate all the needs we for-see the Marketplace needing the in Future
Step 2: Images ► Code
At this point, we will move on to taking our concept ideas, and making the code that will make them work. This process will take by far the longest time, but it will also be when the website goes live. During this stage, it will be accessible to the public [or maybe a private group of testers?] We will often update the code, expand on features, and finalize the website. It is here that Bug Reports are crucial, as we don't want to end up fixing one component that breaks everything else.
Step 3: Advertisement and Rallying
I know that advertising is generally against Forum rules, but the point of this advertising will be to make the XDA-Marketplace more popular. The more popular it is, the more applications that are submitted to the website, the more users can get. We will probably go about this by contacting developers on the website, and across the web, asking them to join and submit their applications. Of course, applications my friend and I make will go on the website [no more special than anybody elses ] This stage will continue on indefinitely, but we will proceed to Step 4 after we gain a little bit of attention.
Step 4: Portability
It is here, once the website has gathered a bit of popularity, that I will work on making the Mobile Application(s) that will allow even more Ease of Use for end-users. This will not simply be a browser that loads a website, no. It will connect to the internet and download the corresponding data, and parse it on the phone itself, to keep the speed of the website at its maximum.
Step 5: Additional Features
It is here that we mainly visualize making an API. This API will serve the purpose of allowing other developers to make client applications that can access the XDA-Marketplace via a Phone [and Maybe a PC]. The main API feature we will make sure to implement is a Version checker. Going along with what I had mentioned about making the site Update-Friendly, this API method would allow programs to be able to remind users [with consent for data usage] that there is an Urgent/Suggested/Minor/Beta/Alpha/etc. Update available. We may possibly expand this to include donations linked to the XDA-Marketplace, and other features we put on the website itself.
Step 6: Improvement and Development
Now the wheels of production will slow down immensely. Here we will concentrate on what can become of the Marketplace, now that we have made it into a large entity. We will have a suggestion form allowing users to give us ideas towards improvement.
As you can see, there is a lot to be done with this Marketplace, and my friend and I prefer to start from scratch. We own a portion of server and a set amount of Bandwidth, along with a domain ... however, if this is to benefit the whole XDA community, what we have will not cut it. Until the website goes live and public, it will be hosted on our website in an area restricted to Privileged users only [to conserve bandwidth]. Eventually, however, we will need to upgrade to Unlimited space and Bandwidth to accomodate for new files, new users, and common visitors. We will also probably want to buy a Domain Name in order to make it easier for people to access the MarketPlace (instead of going to Marketplace.Chicken-eggsolutions.com ... Imagine typing that every time!). My friend and I agreed, that while we are doing this to assist the community, promote development, and promote Windows Mobile and Android, we will simply not be able to keep this alive very long without monetary support from you all. At this moment we are not asking for donations, rather commitments to donations in the future. We would like to know that as we make this, people will support us with the fees of running such a website. So if you could please be so generous as to contribute to the future of the XDA-Marketplace, we would appreciate it greatly. We can also promise you that all donations and commitments will go towards the XDA-Marketplace, and nothing else. Please either Post here, or PM me to place commitments, and your name will be listed on the thread to show everyone that YOU SUPPORT THE FUTURE OF THE XDA-MARKETPLACE
I Proudly Present: Our Supporters!
Thank You to the following XDA-Users who have or will be contributing to the XDA-Marketplace Cause
Tribulattifather
Cajunflavoredbob
ashasaur
Kliptik
True2You
leba837
Byrdman164 (20$)
Firedog7881 (Domain)
Show Your Support! Place a Banner in Your Signature!
Be One of the Supporters of the XDA-Marketplace:
I think that this is an excellent idea. Thanks for working on something like this.
nice good idea would be nice to see it actually go off the ground ;D
Please don't let this die!
LeSScro has lot of idea but not capability to code programs...
then i say YES... we Can ! or you can...
Lot of project can be started and make some interestings things...
I am a developer and I do have a lot of ideas. But working in free time cuts the effort I can put into projects and we do have more requesters than coders!
Also what is an issue is, that we diffuse the market with this. There is a good place to put applications and get feedback, called Omarket (I guess you all know that). Providing just more and more sources will kill WinMo instead of helping it for the future!
There are more then 5k apps in the Omarket already. (not all of really high quality). I think XDA should ban more of the bull**** posts in app / dev forums and move the chatters to the boards, dedicated to chatting...
If you think I am wrong, please tell me!
im down for this
brandi said:
I am a developer and I do have a lot of ideas. But working in free time cuts the effort I can put into projects and we do have more requesters than coders!
Also what is an issue is, that we diffuse the market with this. There is a good place to put applications and get feedback, called Omarket (I guess you all know that). Providing just more and more sources will kill WinMo instead of helping it for the future!
There are more then 5k apps in the Omarket already. (not all of really high quality). I think XDA should ban more of the bull**** posts in app / dev forums and move the chatters to the boards, dedicated to chatting...
If you think I am wrong, please tell me!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know what OMarket is and everything, heck I had my Fake Fingerprint LockScreen application on there...but the whole thing just seemed to Haphazardly put together. One day, they literally just deleted my app from their website, and it took me days just to get in contact with them. I asked them to put it back up, and they never did. I decided not to put in the effort again, especially since it was rather difficult to make a good-looking description area [no easy preview ... had to re-load every time].
I don't actually believe that adding another Market will bring down WinMo ... if anything it will help it out. The thing with OMarket, as large as it is, is that it has a bunch of OLD random applications, making it hard to navigate correctly. Also, I don't find many XDA apps on there [or I can't find them because they are hidden amongst all the old stuff].
I am in no way trying to tear down OMarket ... it is great, I have to admit. I have used it myself. I just feel, as a developer myself, that much more can be done with a market ... and I am offering this opportunity to the XDA Community
I think that if this program is created it needs to be apps created by XDA Devs.
Maybe having a system where the XDA login is the same login name for this market..
I am also apart of a PSP community that has a homebrew app called 'MHU Free Store' where user can download apps/games/themes/portals/CFW.
So also, maybe, if we make the market apps/games/themes etc.. but from only XDA devs this can be really something that is an excellent idea.
I am sorry if that was not implied by the name of the app. But yes, this market would concentrate mainly on applications featured on XDA Forums. And that is a great idea! If/When I get this started with my friend, I will be sure to see if I can work something out with XDA to get logon's to be the same. I'll contact the Admin when the time arises.
Let me clarify:
If/When my friend and I take on this project we are going to be aiming for the following end product:
•Easy to navigate [via a Mobile app, Mobile/PC Page, and PC app]
•Organized in a way that is friendly to Version Upgrades, and doesn't hid apps with potential beneath heaps of amateur applications
• Accommodations for Donation Buttons [Since I understand that aspect ]
•[As suggested by Tribulattifather] Log-on in sync with XDA Forums [Will need to work with Admin on that matter]
•We will go to the Devs, if need be, to get all the apps centralized on one website.
•Easy of Use, Simplicity, and Convenience
A major thing I want to ensure: The CAB file should be available upon download [unlike with Windows Marketplace ... I believe?]
I would like to think right now that the end result would be great, I just need the support and Ideas [support - to convince my friend to take on this project, Ideas - to make the site YOUR site, the best it can be!] I am pretty sure he is going to say yes though ... I have been pushing him.
It is OFFICIAL. My friend and I are taking on this project!!
See the first post for details!!!
Congrats! And Thank You~
Once this project is up and going I will start donating (possibly monthly) to help with the server costs.
That is a promise!
I hope others will join me in this as well. As this app will be for us; so why not.
Cheers,
Trib
Thank You for stepping up first Tribulattifather! Its good to know some people are truly interested in the future of these devices and XDA.
In any case, I am very happy to say that I spent my 1 hour of Health class designing the website. I haven't passed it by my friend yet ... but I personally think the design is Do-Able and pretty darn modern looking. I will get those transformed from paper/pencil to Photoshopped images ... and if my friend likes them, Step 1 will be complete, and I will upload the proposed design of the website!
I will be submitting my apps to and how would all the advertisements work on this app?
You might have misunderstood the Advertising Step. That step is geared more towards rallying support from Developers for the Website as a whole, not for specific programs.
We have spoken, however, and will definitely be offering some special features such as Advertising, Keeping Updated Programs, etc.
We are currently working on a prototype layout to the website...when we get that going, we will post Screenshots for all to see!
Cyclonezephyrxz7 said:
You might have misunderstood the Advertising Step. That step is geared more towards rallying support from Developers for the Website as a whole, not for specific programs.
We have spoken, however, and will definitely be offering some special features such as Advertising, Keeping Updated Programs, etc.
We are currently working on a prototype layout to the website...when we get that going, we will post Screenshots for all to see!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can help you make the site i am good at doing that also.
If you need any file hosting hit me up.
Update - stage 2
So in my last update, I said my friend and I were working on Stage 2 of the development process. So now I am here to give you another update!
We are still on Stage 2, it will take a while longer, but we thought it may be a good idea to give you a tiny tiny preview of what we have going on.
Don't be mislead by the image, we have completed more than is shown in the image, but we only wanted to show so much ... in case we decide to change up the final details. So basically, what is in this image, you can assume will stay constant in the website until later later later on.
So ... Enjoy! Maybe we will release another image later tonight.
[To All Those In the USA: Happy Thanksgiving [Eve] !]
[Sorry about the large size (for mobile users)]
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Cyclonezephyrxz7 said:
So in my last update, I said my friend and I were working on Stage 2 of the development process. So now I am here to give you another update!
We are still on Stage 2, it will take a while longer, but we thought it may be a good idea to give you a tiny tiny preview of what we have going on.
Don't be mislead by the image, we have completed more than is shown in the image, but we only wanted to show so much ... in case we decide to change up the final details. So basically, what is in this image, you can assume will stay constant in the website until later later later on.
So ... Enjoy! Maybe we will release another image later tonight.
[To All Those In the USA: Happy Thanksgiving [Eve] !]
[Sorry about the large size (for mobile users)]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is very nice.
Hey,
Just updating you all again. We decided to 'finalize' a bit more, so here comes another Screenshot your way! Enjoy.
Just as a little 'let-you-know', this site is being semi-modeled after XDA, since it is the XDA-Marketplace after all, so certain things may end up reminding you of XDA. Also, all the links in the top-bar change color when hovered over [like on XDA!].
So enjoy!
[ALSO: IF QUOTING THIS MESSAGE, PLEASE DO NOT INCLUDE THE IMAGE. IT MAKES THE PAGE DISTINCTLY LARGER, AFFECTING MOBILE USERS]
Related
Paint Joy - Movie Your Drawing v1.7.2 (freeware)
Requirements: Android
Overview: Paint drawing by finger with many brushes. Play back drawing like a movie with "MOVIE" mode, way to share your fun with others.
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More Info:
Code:
http://www.cyrket.com/p/android/com.bejoy.minipaint/
Download Instructions:
http://hotfile.com/dl/81306156/fab6010/Paint_Joy_1.7.2.apk.html
Mirror:
http://www.filesonic.com/file/30617517/
http://depositfiles.com/files/61mwluczb
http://uploading.com/files/555b1419/Paint_Joy_1.7.2.apk/
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=X1MVYFXU
http://www.2shared.com/file/TZ61doTG/Paint_Joy_172.html
NICE!
hey thanks downloading right now.
looks good it's just like facebook's graffiti
This is on the market. My daughter has been using it on our old Eris. Why post it here?
ahorriblemess said:
This is on the market. My daughter has been using it on our old Eris. Why post it here?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not? This is the app section, where the community is welcome to share, discuss, and post apps of their likings on or off market so long that its not warez.
Is that a problem for you? I mean really, just because it's old to you doesn't mean its not new to someone else, and some people search the internet before searching the market for new and cool apps.
Klyentel said:
Why not? This is the app section, where the community is welcome to share, discuss, and post apps of their likings on or off market so long that its not warez.
Is that a problem for you? I mean really, just because it's old to you doesn't mean its not new to someone else, and some people search the internet before searching the market for new and cool apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1: You read my post to yourself in a tone that I wasn't using. That's understandable, I didn't put a little emoticon at the end. It's impossible to translate tone over text.
2: Some people might feel uncomfortable side loading apps from unknown sources. Rather than posting the QR code so people could view the application's security access, you posted mirrors. It's not entirely irrational for someone to question whether or not the application has been modified to allow malicious activity. I see that you posted a link to another page that has the QR code, but wouldn't it have been enough to post just the QR without numerous mirrors?
If you're the developer or are affiliated with Bejoy Mobile, then it would make a lot more sense. Their site seems to be down.
Here is the QR code for Paintjoy:
ahorriblemess said:
1: You read my post to yourself in a tone that I wasn't using. That's understandable, I didn't put a little emoticon at the end. It's impossible to translate tone over text.
2: Some people might feel uncomfortable side loading apps from unknown sources. Rather than posting the QR code so people could view the application's security access, you posted mirrors. It's not entirely irrational for someone to question whether or not the application has been modified to allow malicious activity. I see that you posted a link to another page that has the QR code, but wouldn't it have been enough to post just the QR without numerous mirrors?
If you're the developer or are affiliated with Bejoy Mobile, then it would make a lot more sense. Their site seems to be down.
Here is the QR code for Paintjoy:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
QR codes can be easier I suppose. But don't they require camera? Barcode scanner? I know people who's camera don't work, and some people, like my wife, don't know anything about apps like barcode scanner and wouldn't know what to do with it if they had it. Almost everyone, is familiar with links and mirrors, and as anything else you download from the internet...you download at your own risk. So I'm not obligated to edit my postings according to personal security of peace in mind to the anonymous viewers as to whether or the not the app has been modified in any malicious way.
As far as your posting, I did not read it in any type of tone at all, You asked a question & I answered. Simple as that. Maybe my answer carried a tone that disturbed you, if so, I apoligize...heres a few smiley's to lighten the mood--
Klyentel said:
QR codes can be easier I suppose. But don't they require camera? Barcode scanner? I know people who's camera don't work, and some people, like my wife, don't know anything about apps like barcode scanner and wouldn't know what to do with it if they had it. Almost everyone, is familiar with links and mirrors, and as anything else you download from the internet...you download at your own risk. So I'm not obligated to edit my postings according to personal security of peace in mind to the anonymous viewers as to whether or the not the app has been modified in any malicious way.
As far as your posting, I did not read it any type of tone at all, You asked a question I answered. Simple as that. Maybe my answer carried a tone that disturbed you, if so, I apoligize...heres a few smiley's to lighten the mood--
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was the "" that implied that you were being defensive.
You can't say that "almost everyone" is familiar with links and mirrors (or installing non-market apps for that matter. If they're on AT&T, they can't do that unless they root their phone or use ADB).
When I bought a Vibrant at the T-Mobile store, it came with a little pamphlet suggesting applications, one of them was the barcode scanner. It explained what it was for and how to use it. A customer can always call or visit the store where they purchased their phone to ask questions like, "I saw a cool paint program on a discussion forum with a funny little code. How do I install that?"
But - and again this is an assumption, much like the one you made about almost everyone being familiar with download mirrors - if they're perusing a developer's forum, there's a good chance they at least know what a QR code is.
I would imagine that the average user would feel more comfortable seeing the application in the Android Market along with all the other ones, with all of the application's security access explained to them. Do you really believe there are people who wouldn't question something on a random download site plastered with ads and other visual spam?
Also, why would you flat-out refuse to edit your post to make people feel safer about downloading an application that you wanted to share? Ignoring the fact that I never even suggested that you edit your post (that's why I posted the QR code myself) it's just weird that you wouldn't.
ahorriblemess ....stop trolling this thread dude.
If you like the app, or are happy the OP mentioned it as being cool...stay and enjoy.
If not, leave a reply that you already have it or something and leave it at that.
Good God.
ahorriblemess said:
It was the "" that implied that you were being defensive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rolling eyes is not defensive...its annoyed. Which you are doing right now..annoying me
You can't say that "almost everyone" is familiar with links and mirrors (or installing non-market apps for that matter. If they're on AT&T, they can't do that unless they root their phone or use ADB).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Keyword "ALMOST".. I never said everyone... I said "ALMOST" which means the percentage of those that do is higher than the percentage of those that don't.
When I bought a Vibrant at the T-Mobile store, it came with a little pamphlet suggesting applications, one of them was the barcode scanner. It explained what it was for and how to use it. A customer can always call or visit the store where they purchased their phone to ask questions like, "I saw a cool paint program on a discussion forum with a funny little code. How do I install that?"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YAAY for you...you actually read the book. Dude, all my life, every cell phone I ever owned...I NEVER read the book! LMAO
But - and again this is an assumption, much like the one you made about almost everyone being familiar with download mirrors - if they're perusing a developer's forum, there's a good chance they at least know what a QR code is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Assumption it may be....isn't that why a link for the QR code is also in my OP? DUH? just cus I didn't put the image of it on the screen you're having a big cow, lol
I would imagine that the average user would feel more comfortable seeing the application in the Android Market along with all the other ones, with all of the application's security access explained to them. Do you really believe there are people who wouldn't question something on a random download site plastered with ads and other visual spam?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Guess what dude Im the average user, I feel comfortable both ways. By the way, in settings...on your phone...yeah, when you put a check box in "Unknown sources" You (the user) agree to everything that happens from there. Need I say more?
Also, why would you flat-out refuse to edit your post to make people feel safer about downloading an application that you wanted to share? Ignoring the fact that I never even suggested that you edit your post (that's why I posted the QR code myself) it's just weird that you wouldn't.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmm...Because its my post. And you and anyone else that don't feel "safe" about it, can easily take your little mouse and scroll away!
Anything else?
@horrorwolf: I'm not trolling. If I was trolling, I would be purposely trying to get a rise out of people by being offensive or rude. I'm merely suggesting that there are better, safer, and more reliable ways to refer an application to the public.
The manner of "Klyentel"'s responses are just kind of stupid. It's weird that he would be so uppity about this. Even in his last post, he's arguing with me. If he developed an application and wanted it on the market, he would have to outline the application's security access. If he didn't, or lied about it, it would be taken down. I just don't understand why someone would go through the trouble of uploading a market app to several random mirrors and then posting them here unless they modified it in some way (either with different icons, widgets, or with malicious script)
@Klyentel: No, nothing else from me. Clearly, you are infallible. Enjoy going through life a self-absorbed jackass.
over and out
ahorriblemess said:
It was the "" that implied that you were being defensive.
You can't say that "almost everyone" is familiar with links and mirrors (or installing non-market apps for that matter. If they're on AT&T, they can't do that unless they root their phone or use ADB).
When I bought a Vibrant at the T-Mobile store, it came with a little pamphlet suggesting applications, one of them was the barcode scanner. It explained what it was for and how to use it. A customer can always call or visit the store where they purchased their phone to ask questions like, "I saw a cool paint program on a discussion forum with a funny little code. How do I install that?"
But - and again this is an assumption, much like the one you made about almost everyone being familiar with download mirrors - if they're perusing a developer's forum, there's a good chance they at least know what a QR code is.
I would imagine that the average user would feel more comfortable seeing the application in the Android Market along with all the other ones, with all of the application's security access explained to them. Do you really believe there are people who wouldn't question something on a random download site plastered with ads and other visual spam?
Also, why would you flat-out refuse to edit your post to make people feel safer about downloading an application that you wanted to share? Ignoring the fact that I never even suggested that you edit your post (that's why I posted the QR code myself) it's just weird that you wouldn't.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ahorriblemess said:
@horrorwolf: I'm not trolling. If I was trolling, I would be purposely trying to get a rise out of people by being offensive or rude. I'm merely suggesting that there are better, safer, and more reliable ways to refer an application to the public.
The manner of "Klyentel"'s responses are just kind of stupid. It's weird that he would be so uppity about this. Even in his last post, he's arguing with me. If he developed an application and wanted it on the market, he would have to outline the application's security access. If he didn't, or lied about it, it would be taken down. I just don't understand why someone would go through the trouble of uploading a market app to several random mirrors and then posting them here unless they modified it in some way (either with different icons, widgets, or with malicious script)
@Klyentel: No, nothing else from me. Clearly, you are infallible. Enjoy going through life a self-absorbed jackass.
over and out
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No need for the name calling stranger. If thats what you wanted to know all you had to do was ask:
I didn't upload the app first of all some one else did, I don't host apps, and I don't use any of those crappy mirrors, I have my own mirror site, check my sig. I just simply re-posted these mirrors from somewhere else, for others to use.
Secondly, the benefit is the user can have a copy of the apk on their computer to use for their own reasons, or share with someone else for that matter.
This is my topic, my thread. So of course I will respond to every thing you say. Like it or not. Over and out.
no longer available on market, anybody know how and why?
Really?? That's how you get your first post??
If you really want the app, dl it from op.
sent from the depths of helly bean
lol @ last post before noob November 2010
xriderx66 said:
lol @ last post before noob November 2010
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right.....bumping threads posting BS.......lol
sent from the depths of helly bean
Wow can't believe this thread is still alive, I started this topic two years ago and people still replying lol, I don't even have a vibrant anymore.
I need to find a very good DEV who is available to work on a fairly large project.
I am a disabled yet still serving soldier, who has a need for a specific app. This app will help millions of people and I DO plan to market it to both VETS and
NON Vet disabled persons (as well as anyone else who wants it!) Vets will of course have either a free or reduced price option.
You will be required to know every aspect of a project DEV to include the GUI, images, background, visual aid, the Database, it has to "share" and export to several mediums including googleCal and Excel graphs. It may be built with a module style or have a lot of options that can be turned on or off. Some will be protected so it can't be turned off unless a password is entered depending upon the level of disability and functions needed per person.
I will expect a non-disclosure agreement. I have done the paperwork to protect my idea.
I will expect timely completion of phases as well as bug fixes. All of which I am very realistic about. We just need to be in daily or even hourly communication if needed.
This is a long term project that can lead to a permanent type of side job for all the ongoing updates/changes.
I need to get this moving while I am still able to keep track of what I actually need it to do. Your development skills will be instrumental in getting this up and running. You will have full liberty to do the app as you see fit as long as it meets the needs and has the ability to do each task I need. I really don't care how it is done as long as the outcome is correct. I have certain tasks that must be included, you are more than welcome to add your ideas as well.
Payment is of course Negotiable as either upfront or a portion of future income from sales, or possibly both. This will be agreed upon in writing for everyones safety, but this will really be more of a friendly work together type of environment.
Please msg me or reply here for more details.
(Mods, if this is is the wrong category, I apologize. Just move me and I will learn my lesson!)
Must have placed this in the wrong area! I can't seem find a good developer in the entire world that wants to take on a very lucrative (possibly like all good ideas are) project??
Wow Ok anyone know where I should look or post my "Programmer wanted" ad?
You would probably be better posting it in the developer forums rather than Q & A.
Good luck with your project!
All the best,
Ash
Hello All,
In recent events we saw our primary kernel developer completely drop his project and leave. This is a sad thing, but it could have been prevented on both sides. It seems that there has lately been a huge misunderstanding of what working with a community means and what open source means, it is tearing the community as a whole apart.
I. USERS/TESTERS: (this is the part most of us know about)
This can roughly refer to anyone that is not a developer or submitting code, but it can also refer to developers using ROMs or Kernels produced by other developers. Anyone in this position needs to realize that almost ALL Roms/Kernels/Themes are experimental even if considered "stable". There is a reason that on both Rootzwiki and XDA it is common to see developers stating they are not responsible for any damage done to your device or your data.
Device problems will differ from one device to another due to security implementations or new code/hardware or even something else. It needs to be understood that a kernel/Rom release that has bugs may NOT be due to code written by the dev, but by an inherent flaw in the hardware OR the stock code.
What does this mean to you?
Well, in order to function as effectively as possible a general guideline should be followed.
Be Tactful - Lets face it, there are going to be issues with ROMs and Kernels. There will never be a truly 'stable' release. Try to report issues in a polite and friendly manner. If you disagree with a developer, you can let them know, just be sure to be as tactful as possible, also make sure to provide adequate reports and detail.
Detail, Detail, Detail - Many of the newer folks don't know how to access logfiles, but this shouldn't stop you from being detailed. When an issue is come across, make sure to include as much detail as possible. For clarification, ANYTHING that is changed from stock configuration should be considered. For kernels, it is good to include any and all adjustments you have made. If a log can be pulled, DO IT, it won't hurt and the developer has an easier time figuring it all out.
Try to learn - The development community is a big place. By learning, you verify that you can help other newbies down the line, and that you provide more assistance to developers.
II. Developers: (the part less of us know about)
Ah, developers, without all of you, we wouldn't exist. Someone needs to do the work, and you provide the dedication and time. Most of us can't thank you enough. However, it seems that recently a lot of the developers are developing for the wrong reasons and are doing things against the very ideals we all stand for.
When developing with a community, ALL developers sign a non-verbal social contract. This contract includes many things.
- You are going to deal with some harassment (can be mitigated by mods) - Some people have bad days, others are asshats.
- Younger members will take you for granted
- Younger members will have difficulty providing detail
- The community will expect support for your product(s)
- Other developers (mostly new developers) will not credit you for your work occasionally (can be mitigated by mods)
All these things and more should be expected when working with a community. As a developer, you need to accept ALL of these things in order to contribute to making the community a healthy place.
Eventually, a developer must leave a device and move forward for WHATEVER reason they choose. This is inevitable, but in order to provide a healthy development cycle a developer should ALWAYS provide their source code for a time after development has stopped. This way projects can live on with other developers or be forked entirely.
MY COMMENTS ON TODAY:
DSB9938 - You are a fantastic developer and I urge you not to leave. I do believe you are misguided in pulling all your code and preventing others from forking or continuing your work. It goes against all that open source is about. You signed the social contract and you couldn't handle the terms, you wronged the community by breaking the trust you had developed.
Dr_Drache - Seriously? Kicking me from the AndIRC #droid-dna chat because you don't agree with what I say here? Did I step on your ego much? Stopping your s-off development because of all of this as well? You are whats wrong with the developers side of the community. God forbid someone disagree's with you, you either kick them or pull your project entirely. Go develop for Microsoft or some other proprietary company. You have forgotten about what the community really means and what open source is about.
Everyone else - We can pull through this. I have already started researching to pick up kernel development. It will be slow since DSB refuses to assist, but it can certainly be done.
Mods - We can't afford to lose more developers. We have to stop the harassment.
I agree with your post except the parts directed to DSB and Drache because it is a continuation of the feud. Let's just wipe the slate clean and follow the other parts of your comments because they are good guidelines on how to interact with each other.
th3raid0r said:
Hello All,
In recent events we saw our primary kernel developer completely drop his project and leave. This is a sad thing, but it could have been prevented on both sides. It seems that there has lately been a huge misunderstanding of what working with a community means and what open source means, it is tearing the community as a whole apart.
I. USERS/TESTERS: (this is the part most of us know about)
This can roughly refer to anyone that is not a developer or submitting code, but it can also refer to developers using ROMs or Kernels produced by other developers. Anyone in this position needs to realize that almost ALL Roms/Kernels/Themes are experimental even if considered "stable". There is a reason that on both Rootzwiki and XDA it is common to see developers stating they are not responsible for any damage done to your device or your data.
Device problems will differ from one device to another due to security implementations or new code/hardware or even something else. It needs to be understood that a kernel/Rom release that has bugs may NOT be due to code written by the dev, but by an inherent flaw in the hardware OR the stock code.
What does this mean to you?
Well, in order to function as effectively as possible a general guideline should be followed.
Be Tactful - Lets face it, there are going to be issues with ROMs and Kernels. There will never be a truly 'stable' release. Try to report issues in a polite and friendly manner. If you disagree with a developer, you can let them know, just be sure to be as tactful as possible, also make sure to provide adequate reports and detail.
Detail, Detail, Detail - Many of the newer folks don't know how to access logfiles, but this shouldn't stop you from being detailed. When an issue is come across, make sure to include as much detail as possible. For clarification, ANYTHING that is changed from stock configuration should be considered. For kernels, it is good to include any and all adjustments you have made. If a log can be pulled, DO IT, it won't hurt and the developer has an easier time figuring it all out.
Try to learn - The development community is a big place. By learning, you verify that you can help other newbies down the line, and that you provide more assistance to developers.
II. Developers: (the part less of us know about)
Ah, developers, without all of you, we wouldn't exist. Someone needs to do the work, and you provide the dedication and time. Most of us can't thank you enough. However, it seems that recently a lot of the developers are developing for the wrong reasons and are doing things against the very ideals we all stand for.
When developing with a community, ALL developers sign a non-verbal social contract. This contract includes many things.
- You are going to deal with some harassment (can be mitigated by mods) - Some people have bad days, others are asshats.
- Younger members will take you for granted
- Younger members will have difficulty providing detail
- The community will expect support for your product(s)
- Other developers (mostly new developers) will not credit you for your work occasionally (can be mitigated by mods)
All these things and more should be expected when working with a community. As a developer, you need to accept ALL of these things in order to contribute to making the community a healthy place.
Eventually, a developer must leave a device and move forward for WHATEVER reason they choose. This is inevitable, but in order to provide a healthy development cycle a developer should ALWAYS provide their source code for a time after development has stopped. This way projects can live on with other developers or be forked entirely.
MY COMMENTS ON TODAY:
DSB9938 - You are a fantastic developer and I urge you not to leave. I do believe you are misguided in pulling all your code and preventing others from forking or continuing your work. It goes against all that open source is about. You signed the social contract and you couldn't handle the terms, you wronged the community by breaking the trust you had developed. If you do not return, I can only hope that other, BETTER developers (in skill and ideology) fill your shoes.
Dr_Drache - Seriously? Kicking me from the AndIRC #droid-dna chat because you don't agree with what I say here? Did I step on your ego much? Stopping your s-off development because of all of this as well? You are whats wrong with the developers side of the community. God forbid someone disagree's with you, you either kick them or pull your project entirely. Go develop for Microsoft or some other proprietary company. You have forgotten about what the community really means and what open source is about.
Everyone else - We can pull through this. I have already started researching to pick up kernel development. It will be slow since DSB refuses to assist, but it can certainly be done.
Mods - We can't afford to lose more developers. We have to stop the harassment.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you, "my friend" need to learn when to stop running your mouth. you spent nearly an hour pretending to care, yet saying dsb/devs should give more back, because we have a contract with the community.
you never stepped on my ego, you were banned for being a luke. you want to quote GPL to the devs and expect us to fall down for you.
I agree with your post except the parts directed to DSB and Drache because it is a continuation of the feud. Let's just wipe the slate clean and follow the other parts of your comments because they are good guidelines on how to interact with each other.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do need to get access back to the #Droid-DNA chat, otherwise it is VERY difficult to even begin development.
dr_drache said:
you, "my friend" need to learn when to stop running your mouth. you spent nearly an hour pretending to care, yet saying dsb/devs should give more back, because we have a contract with the community.
you never stepped on my ego, you were banned for being a luke. you want to quote GPL to the devs and expect us to fall down for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, that is your assumption. I never even once demanded for more. I feel that the actions that have been taken are one of the sloppiest examples of open source development. I am trying to be a reasonable voice. I am trying to keep development going despite our recent setbacks.
I think that at the very least, devs should provide the sources so that development may continue after they decide to leave. Otherwise we loose too much progress.
th3raid0r said:
When developing with a community, ALL developers sign a non-verbal social contract. This contract includes many things.
- You are going to deal with some harassment (can be mitigated by mods) - Some people have bad days, others are asshats.
- Younger members will take you for granted
- Younger members will have difficulty providing detail
- The community will expect support for your product(s)
- Other developers (mostly new developers) will not credit you for your work occasionally (can be mitigated by mods)
All these things and more should be expected when working with a community. As a developer, you need to accept ALL of these things in order to contribute to making the community a healthy place.
Eventually, a developer must leave a device and move forward for WHATEVER reason they choose. This is inevitable, but in order to provide a healthy development cycle a developer should ALWAYS provide their source code for a time after development has stopped. This way projects can live on with other developers or be forked entirely.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, no no no no no no. No social contract, this is an at will thing, that most of us are not paid for. Some of us do it for a living, and also do it here for fun. We do this for FUN. We do this for our benefit (having fun). I can not be anymore honest, anything I do here, I do for my benefit (Brain exercise and fun). I enjoy Android. The day I no longer enjoy it, I will either leave for good, or take a break like I have in the past. We can leave the playground and go home at any time. In fact I encourage developers to do this from time to time, It helped me greatly.
We do get some *sshat harassment, no we don't have to deal with it. We can ignore it, take it to a mod, or take our cake and go home. I tend to confront it, bad habit of mine
Younger members will take us for granted, some times you have to turn the power off to wake them up, or let them sit a minute waiting for you to release something they want.
Support should be appreciated, but not expected. We have families, jobs, and some of use have a life outside of Android(not saying I do ).
Most people who steal work, are not developers. They are general *sshats, that is all.
th3raid0r said:
MY COMMENTS ON TODAY:
DSB9938 - You are a fantastic developer and I urge you not to leave. I do believe you are misguided in pulling all your code and preventing others from forking or continuing your work. It goes against all that open source is about. You signed the social contract and you couldn't handle the terms, you wronged the community by breaking the trust you had developed. If you do not return, I can only hope that other, BETTER developers (in skill and ideology) fill your shoes.
Dr_Drache - Seriously? Kicking me from the AndIRC #droid-dna chat because you don't agree with what I say here? Did I step on your ego much? Stopping your s-off development because of all of this as well? You are whats wrong with the developers side of the community. God forbid someone disagree's with you, you either kick them or pull your project entirely. Go develop for Microsoft or some other proprietary company. You have forgotten about what the community really means and what open source is about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RE: DSB9939: Sorry but take your social contract somewhere else, it doesn't even make sense. He didn't sign, didn't verbally agree, wasn't paid, rarely got a pat on the back. This is the guy who is the reason you all have root/unlock, and you are breaking his balls. Yeah no Beaups and I are not the reason, we were just the way to a means.
RE: Dr_Drache: AndIRC is not part of XDA, we are separate and really what goes on there doesn't belong here. If you have an issue, take it to me, Zifnab, TheFuzz4 or DougPiston. It is a PRIVATE server, and people are welcome at operator discretion. We are allowed to limit it to like minded people, or even to just be grumpy and randomly remove people if we wish (we don't normally). If you want to talk about it, you know where it is, and how to get ahold of me.
Dude, we don't another thread about this lol. I'm not here to harp on this fact, but I'm glad I dumped my DNA while I still had the chance. For some extremely odd reason, people don't know how to act in HTC threads. I definitely don't miss all of this drama from when I had my Rezound.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium
th3raid0r said:
I do need to get access back to the #Droid-DNA chat, otherwise it is VERY difficult to even begin development.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Requesting the community to be civil and then throwing in some parting shots is not ideal. I don't know what went down with you guys over there but maybe you can speak with the powers that be and work out an amicable solution.
jcase said:
No, no no no no no no. No social contract, this is an at will thing, that most of us are not paid for. Some of us do it for a living, and also do it here for fun. We do this for FUN. We do this for our benefit (having fun). I can not be anymore honest, anything I do here, I do for my benefit (Brain exercise and fun). I enjoy Android. The day I no longer enjoy it, I will either leave for good, or take a break like I have in the past. We can leave the playground and go home at any time. In fact I encourage developers to do this from time to time, It helped me greatly.
We do get some *sshat harassment, no we don't have to deal with it. We can ignore it, take it to a mod, or take our cake and go home. I tend to confront it, bad habit of mine
Younger members will take us for granted, some times you have to turn the power off to wake them up, or let them sit a minute waiting for you to release something they want.
Support should be appreciated, but not expected. We have families, jobs, and some of use have a life outside of Android(not saying I do ).
Most people who steal work, are not developers. They are general *sshats, that is all.
RE: DSB9939: Sorry but take your social contract somewhere else, it doesn't even make sense. He didn't sign, didn't verbally agree, wasn't paid, rarely got a pat on the back. This is the guy who is the reason you all have root/unlock, and you are breaking his balls. Yeah no Beaups and I are not the reason, we were just the way to a means.
RE: Dr_Drache: AndIRC is not part of XDA, we are separate and really what goes on there doesn't belong here. If you have an issue, take it to me, Zifnab, TheFuzz4 or DougPiston. It is a PRIVATE server, and people are welcome at operator discretion. We are allowed to limit it to like minded people, or even to just be grumpy and randomly remove people if we wish (we don't normally). If you want to talk about it, you know where it is, and how to get ahold of me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A social non-verbal contract is never an official thing.
In a most basic form it is the trade of safety/stability for a service when it comes to political science. They apply everywhere.
The reason we are no longer roaming nomads is due to social contracts.
I am not saying that this social contract is why you guys develop. It is the generalized community expectations. They are going to vary from member to member as well.
I understand Support is not expected, on your end, however it is essential to a successful project and furthermore it is essential to reputation. Reputation garners donations and therefore some developers incomes.
Most of my other points also follow this same logic.
A healthy community flourishes when these invisible expectations are met. Look at the GNex development for example and take note at what the successful projects are and how they got there.
I understand that DSB wasn't well appreciated. But the community opinion doesn't get better if he leaves in this way, I would argue that he broke a lot of trust that the community had in him. He could have still taken a break, but there are much more elegant ways to do so.
Sigh.
You want a contract? What does the guy on the other end get out of the contract?
I make the things I make so that I can run my phone how I want to run it. That's the only reason. I do not make them for you, or to look like some smart guy, or for my ego. I am the first to admit that I don't know a damned thing about coding. What I make takes hard hours of trial and error. Basically pounding on things till I slowly figure out how they work and bend them to do what I want.
And I do it for days on end. Till it works well enough for me to run on my phone. And I AM PICKY. I want it to be perfect. However, I also share what I make. I share it so that others who want to have their phone run the way I do, don't have to work so hard to get there.
Now comes the rub. There are billions of people in the world. And I bet if you put every phone next to every other phone, you would still not find two setup and/or used the same way. Because of that, I cannot test every possibility. When people come to me with something that doesn't work, do I just say no? Of course not. I made it. I feel responsible for it working correctly.
Now, having determined that I am not a coder, what do I do? First I go ask other people who are much smarter than I am. People like jcase, beaups, imoseyon, show-p1984. These are the real coders/android hackers in the world. They look at the code and actually know what it's doing. They don't have to try to arm wrestle with it to figure out what's wrong.
If that doesn't work, I beat on it. I look at logs. When you post those logs in my threads, there's a bunch of people who read them, not just me. And if I can figure it out, with what help is available, I fix it. If not, I say so. Half the time, what's in those logs is of no help, a quarter of the time, it's in there what happened, but it wasn't related. And lets not forget those logs are usually thousands of lines to read through.
Do I claim to be perfect? Hell no. But I do my best. And that's the very limit of what anybody else on the site has any particular right to ask me for. Nothing more. I try to let slide all of the little digs that people use when things don't work right. But over time it gets to you, ya know? And you guys only see the public stuff, in the threads. You don't see the PMs. And see the people who come online to the chat. You have no clue.
Now top that off with people twisting my words to insult me. I basically said that there are other reasons you can have problems with your phone. I did not say it wasn't my kernel, I said it wasn't in the logs. And I have this guy come in and say yeah, mine runs fine on stock. Seems our phones are only crap on your kernel. Now how did you honestly expect me to react?
I have asked this guy more than once to not run my kernel because he has these outbreaks. This was not the first one. And if you go look through his previous postings, you can see his doesn't only disrespect me, he has outright disrespected MODs as well. This makes me wonder why he was still around to bother me in the first place. But that's beside the point.
Now anybody who thinks I'm curt with others, go read the stuff I've had to put up with and see how long you can take it. I have no problems with people posting when they have an issue. And I can tell you right here and right now, my stuff isn't perfect. But when I tell you I can't find it, or fix it, that doesn't give you the right to flip out and go off on me. That means you go back a version and wait till I make a new one, or you go run something else. I even made a simple stock one for those with issues to run so they could have system write if they had issues.
I DO NOT MAKE ANYBODY RUN MY STUFF.
Now, having said all of that. Put yourself in my shoes and see how happy you would be.
D
.
orangechoochoo said:
Requesting the community to be civil and then throwing in some parting shots is not ideal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, hindsight is 20/20.
It's early in the morning but after reading these threads that big bottle of Grey Goose is calling.
dsb9938 said:
You want a contract? What does the guy on the other end get out of the contract?
I make the things I make so that I can run my phone how I want to run it. That's the only reason. I do not make them for you, or to look like some smart guy, or for my ego. I am the first to admit that I don't know a damned thing about coding. What I make takes hard hours of trial and error. Basically pounding on things till I slowly figure out how they work and bend them to do what I want.
And I do it for days on end. Till it works well enough for me to run on my phone. And I AM PICKY. I want it to be perfect. However, I also share what I make. I share it so that others who want to have their phone run the way I do, don't have to work so hard to get there.
Now comes the rub. There are billions of people in the world. And I bet if you put every phone next to every other phone, you would still not find two setup and/or used the same way. Because of that, I cannot test every possibility. When people come to me with something that doesn't work, do I just say no? Of course not. I made it. I feel responsible for it working correctly.
Now, having determined that I am not a coder, what do I do? First I go ask other people who are much smarter than I am. People like jcase, beaups, imoseyon, show-p1984. These are the real coders/android hackers in the world. They look at the code and actually know what it's doing. They don't have to try to arm wrestle with it to figure out what's wrong.
If that doesn't work, I beat on it. I look at logs. When you post those logs in my threads, there's a bunch of people who read them, not just me. And if I can figure it out, with what help is available, I fix it. If not, I say so. Half the time, what's in those logs is of no help, a quarter of the time, it's in there what happened, but it wasn't related. And lets not forget those logs are usually thousands of lines to read through.
Do I claim to be perfect? Hell no. But I do my best. And that's the very limit of what anybody else on the site has any particular right to ask me for. Nothing more. I try to let slide all of the little digs that people use when things don't work right. But over time it gets to you, ya know? And you guys only see the public stuff, in the threads. You don't see the PMs. And see the people who come online to the chat. You have no clue.
Now top that off with people twisting my words to insult me. I basically said that there are other reasons you can have problems with your phone. I did not say it wasn't my kernel, I said it wasn't in the logs. And I have this guy come in and say yeah, mine runs fine on stock. Seems our phones are only crap on your kernel. Now how did you honestly expect me to react?
I have asked this guy more than once to not run my kernel because he has these outbreaks. This was not the first one. And if you go look through his previous postings, you can see his doesn't only disrespect me, he has outright disrespected MODs as well. This makes me wonder why he was still around to bother me in the first place. But that's beside the point.
Now anybody who thinks I'm curt with others, go read the stuff I've had to put up with and see how long you can take it. I have no problems with people posting when they have an issue. And I can tell you right here and right now, my stuff isn't perfect. But when I tell you I can't find it, or fix it, that doesn't give you the right to flip out and go off on me. That means you go back a version and wait till I make a new one, or you go run something else. I even made a simple stock one for those with issues to run so they could have system write if they had issues.
I DO NOT MAKE ANYBODY RUN MY STUFF.
Now, having said all of that. Put yourself in my shoes and see how happy you would be.
D
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, I totally understand all of that.
I have made some tweaks myself, but I don't publish them because I know they don't have much application outside of myself.
I do know where you are at, I work at a large legal software company as a QA Analyst. I KNOW the daily grind on this.
The harrasment won't always go away. Hell, i get it here in a large company. It can be mitigated by a few things. For example you can use a smaller community.
You don't have to deal with these things at all, but if you leave on such bad terms without a way for someone to pick up where you left off, it doesn't leave a good impression on the rest of the community.
The fact that you don't know code makes this all the more impressive. You are a fantastic problem solver, it shows, maybe we can find some way to lessen the blow for you and yet continue public development?
th3raid0r said:
A social non-verbal contract is never an official thing.
In a most basic form it is the trade of safety/stability for a service when it comes to political science. They apply everywhere.
The reason we are no longer roaming nomads is due to social contracts.
I am not saying that this social contract is why you guys develop. It is the generalized community expectations. They are going to vary from member to member as well.
I understand Support is not expected, on your end, however it is essential to a successful project and furthermore it is essential to reputation. Reputation garners donations and therefore some developers incomes.
Most of my other points also follow this same logic.
A healthy community flourishes when these invisible expectations are met. Look at the GNex development for example and take note at what the successful projects are and how they got there.
I understand that DSB wasn't well appreciated. But the community opinion doesn't get better if he leaves in this way, I would argue that he broke a lot of trust that the community had in him. He could have still taken a break, but there are much more elegant ways to do so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You keep saying signed social contract. It is non-sense man. What you mean is expectations from non involved individuals.
Most developers get jack for donations, only people who get tons are either A) the attention begging people who release 100000 roms for 1000 devices that are nothing special, or B) ones who release something special, and then the donation spree is short and sweet. We don't do it for donations. DSB is not making much from donations on this device, he does it strictly for fun and people are making it NOT fun for him.
I fell into B) with the DNA. I will say I made ~$800 from donations on the DNA unlock, it is not the rule but an exception. I bought two used phones really cheap to develop on ($200 and $140, gave the $200 one away to another developer for free after I was done. $140 one I will give away as well at some point.), pizza dinner for my kids ($35, my personal reward), sent some for another developer (DSB, for his work and risks) and donated the rest to various charities. This is NOT A normal amount of donations. Don't fool yourself thinking most developers are making an income of any kind doing this.
GNex community flourished due to paid support from Google (AOSP), and open documentation. Two things we did not have.
*PS*
If you haven't been in our shoes, you shouldn't pretend to know, and you shouldn't complain about us.
solutions anyone?
dsb, jcase I have to side with you guys entirely. I love your work and I appreciate it completely. I am grateful for you guys, were it not for you guys and other people like you I would not get to 'OCD' on my droid all hours of the night like I do. I have learned much. I am a machinist in a shipyard, I can understand fine tuning and perfection in your work.
Unfortunately most of today's societal behaviors even in grown adults are dysfunctional at best. I have been on the internet since it's inception to the public eye and all I can say is that arguing and bickering that happens on the internet is absolutely ridiculous. I feel bad for you guys and embarrassed for the "others."
I have to agree with what works though. My daughter, when she was young would throw a temper tantrum and slam her bedroom door, so I removed the door.
orangechoochoo said:
Sigh.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
orangechoochoo said:
It's early in the morning but after reading these threads that big bottle of Grey Goose is calling.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its almost night here, and Jack Daniels is calling me, all after reading all that posts and some chating on IRC... Never ever see such outcome because of some not polite posts. I have degree in International Relations and first thing i 've learned - don't say what you think, say what you need to say and SMILE )))) We all just people. I got my family. Wife, kids... But i spend time here not only because of kernels, ROMs and all that stuff. But because of great community. It looks like that 1 person can spoil all that great atmosphere.... :silly:
jcase said:
You keep saying signed social contract. It is non-sense man. What you mean is expectations from non involved individuals.
Most developers get jack for donations, only people who get tons are either A) the attention begging people who release 100000 roms for 1000 devices that are nothing special, or B) ones who release something special, and then the donation spree is short and sweet. We don't do it for donations. DSB is not making much from donations on this device, he does it strictly for fun and people are making it NOT fun for him.
I fell into B) with the DNA. I will say I made ~$800 from donations on the DNA unlock, it is not the rule but an exception. I bought two used phones really cheap to develop on ($200 and $140, gave the $200 one away to another developer for free after I was done. $140 one I will give away as well at some point.), pizza dinner for my kids ($35, my personal reward), sent some for another developer (DSB, for his work and risks) and donated the rest to various charities. This is NOT A normal amount of donations. Don't fool yourself thinking most developers are making an income of any kind doing this.
GNex community flourished due to paid support from Google (AOSP), and open documentation. Two things we did not have.
*PS*
If you haven't been in our shoes, you shouldn't pretend to know, and you shouldn't complain about us.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never said you make a living off the income generated from donations. I know it is mostly small, but the funds do help most people. It is also nice to know that you mean something to a few individuals.
Also, I work at a legal software company as a QA Analyst officially, but I do mostly QA Engineering work for no recognition, no additional pay, and the occasional bit of harassment when someone doesn't understand my methods. I really DO get the environment.
The only thing I am complaining about is devs leaving on such bad terms without a way for the community to recover, that's it.
th3raid0r said:
The only thing I am complaining about is devs leaving on such bad terms without a way for the community to recover, that's it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What makes you think anybody owes "the community" a way to recover?
D
.
If the name "Android" were changed to something more accurate & device-specific, people could make more informed decisions
I suggest ADroid
like Ad + Roids = ADroids
The Discussion here is thought provoking
-
Maybe Ad-Droid would be better
ADDROID
or ADD-Droid
or AdsDroid
or maybe even... "spamdroid"
ooh i like that one
-
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"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
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http://store.apple.com/us
^^^^ click this link and never come back again.
if you don't like it, take another phone which does suit your needs instead of some useless complaining on the internet.
matgras said:
http://store.apple.com/us
^^^^ click this link and never come back again.
if you don't like it, take another phone which does suit your needs instead of some useless complaining on the internet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry, but did you vote?
please do because I'm especially interested in hearing from the people who make the apps with the ads in them..
This thread is created specifically to address this very issue..
How many people, upon entering the android shop and playing around with the phone, had any idea 90% of the apps are chock full of annoying ads?
there was literally not a single google ad on any of the phones I tried in all the stores
Its a bit deceiving.
Hence, the suggested name change..
no, i'm not spending even more money on even more phones.
thanks though
but we should be extra vigilant in helping others who may fall into the same trap
It may be too late for me, but I believe with the proper name change, we can help other people avoid this exact same problem.. a problem you yourself may even hate more than me.. if thats even possible
keep up the good work
and dont forget to vote!
-
Every person I know does not complain about ads and stuff, and if you really don't like them; buy the adfree and give the dev a beer!
Verstuurd van mijn ST18i met Tapatalk
matgras said:
buy the adfree and give the dev a beer!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, or turn off data & wifi if not needed, and that's it... no ads
matgras said:
Every person I know does not complain about ads and stuff, and if you really don't like them; buy the adfree and give the dev a beer!
Verstuurd van mijn ST18i met Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
is that 3 people? and are they all by chance app developers hoping to become millionaires?
MANKIND is fed up with the ads
we're fed up with noobs who should stick to programming or email spamming and stay the fk out of marketing, an area they obviously know nothing about.
you want money, you want a beer? EARN IT!
nobody's giving you any money because you annoy the sht out of them.. the advetising companies know that.. they are just using programmers for ad placement,, you are ad company fodder
the majority of ads on apps are not even making the developer any money.. if you didnt actually code the program yourself, and used one of the online app-building services, and are offering your app for free, then odds are you had no choice but to put ads in your app, just to be able to make it for free... and if you did pay to build it. all you get is 50% of ad revenue shared with the online builder service
and then you make 0% of the revenue the ads produce, and the online service makes 100% funded by THE most uneducated, classless, bunch of dirtbag wannabe advertisers on the planet, "the all-in-one-internet advertisers/codemonkeys"
buy you a beer eh?
are u joking or toking?
people donate money to developers who have made an awesome program from top to bottom.. a program they love, by a dev who offered it for free at a great personal cost, and who may very well have no money at all, since all of his time has been spent helping the community
thats how its always been
nobody is giving you any money for spamming them..
YOU HAVE YOUR REWARD.. your ads.. thats your beer money, drunkard...you are not a coder who does things for the community, investing all his own free time for the benefit of others without reward or thought of reward...
you are someone who has chosen to spam the community for pittance, YOU DONT DESERVE COMMUNITY MONEY..
you already have a sugardaddy.. the Ad companies.
not only do you appear to be a pathetic beggar, and pretending to need beer money, you are also behind the Ad spammers, you are on their wagon.. you're playing both sides, like we're all a bunch of fools...
who in the hell is going to pay you anything just so that special ol' you may graciously stop your uber-annoyances & ad spamming?
good luck with that
-
The good thing about android and its freedom, is that you can always use ad-blockers, restrict internet access, and other permissions with just a quick internet search and a little reading.
Trust me, blocking ads is quicker than spamming a forum.
dxppxd said:
The good thing about android and its freedom, is that you can always use ad-blockers, restrict internet access, and other permissions with just a quick internet search and a little reading.
Trust me, blocking ads is quicker than spamming a forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that does nothing to address a wide-spread problem
here, we're looking for real solutions to the spam problem
the spam problem is not mine, as a user, though I'm sure you'd like to run around calling everyone who doesnt enjoy your spamming a noob
the spam problem lies in the relationship & system ecostructure existing between ad companies, googles own ad interests, app devs, dev ethics, ad compnay ethics and Google policies
but would you rather I "just shut up", or "just go away"?
rather than solving a serious problem?
and might that have something to do with your own ad spamming?
this is about a real solution, not shutting up one person so you continue carrying about like a monkey
thanks for your imput though
and please vote
Well don't really understand your hate towards ads chinarabbit but heck i just replied to state my thoughts on it.
I don't like ads and don't see any advantage these ads provide besides giving you totally pointless info.
But since you are free to download and install anything you wan't i don't see a reason to then just uninstall the app and either buy the full unlocked version without ads or find another app that does what you wan't.
I hardly have any apps on my phone with ads so annoying that i needed to click the ad away before i could use the app.
On your comment that a dev needs to EARN his money
On one side i do follow you and one only should receive money after showing his programming money worthy skills.
But isn't that the whole idea of a free & paid app? If you like what you see in the free 'ad sponsored' app then you can buy the app and have an AD FREE app.
If there are still ads in the paid version you just uninstall it and get your money back to never look at that dev ever again.
And if you still say they need to give you and ad free version and then you'll happy pay them if it's good then WOW what a naive mind setting you live in.
Once a person receives a free full working ad free version then let's say 80% (no stats to show just made this up) won't even bother helping out the dev by donating. Out of those 80% one side are cheapskates not carrying about the dev and on the other sides they don't like the app but since it was adfree they still use it.
Long discussion short:
- You are free to choose what you DL / use so if you don't like ads use the paid versions or just don't use ad sponsored apps
- A dev should be allowed to use in app ads no matter what ( cause people are cheap bastards)
- Ad sponsoring does provide some income (i was able to host 2 sites in the past purely running on ads)
To me this thread is just your way to vent out ad frustration and trying to find other people with the same mind set.
But face it if you don't like ads go live in a cave because:
- Ads on radio
- Ads on TV
- Ads in Newspaper
- Ads in magazine
- Ads on the roads
- Ads on the internet
- All your base are belong to ads
As to finding a solution. there is NO solution.
Ads exists because companies wan't there name out there to be known and don't mind spending some $$ to achieve it.
If you can make it so companies can let everyone know who/what they are/do (<--- HHMMM ads) then you will automatically remove the ads from every place.
See how this above sentence made absolutely no sense what so ever ( point proven that ads are impossible to remove cause then companies won't survive)
What are you on? You're having a conversation with yourself in this thread and the front page comments. Google is making steps to make those annoying ad distribution methods bannable. Take a deep breath, count to 10, and relax. In the future, stop downloading all these trash apps that keep spamming you.
On your original post, I don't think Google should rebrand Android. Rebranding is terrible. I vote keep the name the same
sleeperzzz said:
Well don't really understand your hate towards ads chinarabbit but heck i just replied to state my thoughts on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmm, well, i strongly disagree there is "no" solution
lets look more closely at the problem
On the developer side, they are doing the best with what they have, which is a very limited education focused on a very narrow field.. not your marketing wizs.. they are doing what they know, which is ad-based internet revenue generating as a valid form of advertising..
but that doesnt work when it takes up a tenth of your screen.
and the other side of the problem is that companies like Coco-cola, or whatever, who are not very tech-savvy, have hitherto had to rely on said webdevs to place their ads and run their online marketing
but make no mistake, the overwhelming majority of internet marketers are not actually marketers at all, but are little web designers and social media architects etc, that have really no concept of how to set-up, run, or manage a proper Marketing Campaign...
both sides are to blame..
u cant understand why I am so upset, so I'll tell you right now it likely has something to do with the fact that I have been in Marketing for the last decade. real, actual marketing, and have taught advanced-level marketing at some of the best marketing institutes, including those in Singapore.
anyway.. there are many ways to make money, ads in your app that people have to pay to remove is one way you can try to earn money
another way, and perhaps one of the best ways, is micro-charging, a concept fully realize in Korea, Japan & China, but which Americans can't seem to grasp at all.. and I have my doubts as to whether they ever will.
firstly, the carriers wont ever do whats needed for micro-charging to work, namely, allow you to take it out of your account, largely because America is not a Pay as you go telecom system, but one you pay per month and are given a set plan..
in Asia, you recharge your phone by recharge cards, and with a click of a button you deduct money from your balance for whatever you want
and Secondly, because America cant seem to figure out the numbers, and take that leap of faith required to charge people $0.01-$0.05 cents per function, rather than $0.25 and up... and offer them enough activity for their money they had a good time with it...
EA Sports is an example of such a company failing to grasp this basic Asian concept.
EA bought Popcap, and being a North American company is having a hard time making it successful in China.. Plants vs Zombies 2 for your Android Device is currently only out in China, and its one of the most popular games, currently... But those EA dorks ACTUALLY THINK PEOPLE WILL PAY 2RMB FOR 5 SECONDS WORTH OF IN-GAME FUNCTIONALITY.. ok. actually, its for blue diamonds. but anyway..
they are completely retarded.. people play that game all day long.. charging 2 to 5 Cents per function is ok, you may use that function up to 2rmb or 2 dollars a day, and be happy to pay for it if you got a good amount of fun for your money...
but to charge someone 2 yuan because YOU think people should pay 2 Yuan, because you laugh at 1 cent.. even when its not actually costing you anything to increase the in-game value, actually makes you a retard.. in Asia anyway..
or make them pay upfront from a large number of tokens etc.. is not going to work as well as on-demand, need-it-now, 1 to 5 cent, single-click, in-app micro-pays
especially when you have 1 billion users. who play the game every day for years to come
instead, what dorky American companies get is exactly squat.. and its probably more than they deserve
OR they give you some lame crappy game and expect you to pay for having a worthwhile game
Plants v Zombies is a very fun game, challenging, and fulfilling, even if you never spend a penny on micro-charges
-------anyway
another way people make money is by offering a very great and fully functional app, that is in itself a pleasure & joy to use, and fulfills your needs.
then, YOU GET OFF YOUR BUTT AND INCREASE THE SIZE AND FUNCTIONALITY OF YOUR PROGRAM 2-10 TIMES MORE
yes, that means way more work for you
and then, you charge people small amounts to add that functionality
Pleco is an example of a successful app doing this.. they give you a great, robust, very full-featured & useful app that is itself very complete and you would not need anything more
they then offer you things you didnt even know you wanted until you saw partly how they work within the app, and you end up buying them
.......... great
and another way is create an app for free, also without ads, that people really enjoy, and then request that they donate to you if they enjoyed it & feel its worth it
they sometimes even suggest an amount.
or they ask you to pay if you use it for business, or you make money with that app, etc..
---------fantastic
AND THEN, in stark contrast to all the ad-free options above, there is the worst possible way imaginable.. you make an app which annoys the crap out of everybody, making them hate your app, causing some people to fall into epileptic seizures, when you yourself have not even the slightest concept of what marketing is..
those ads arent even targeted, maybe by region or IP address, but rest assured, many more people will be hating your company, when you stick crap in the face of people who would never use your product and are not even in your target demographic.
its completely useless
WHAT USE COULD POSSIBLY COME FROM SPAMMING AN ELITE 30 SOMETHING MALE WITH ADS OF WOMEN'S MAKEUP?
none..
its a marketing fail
and its worse than that, it actually hurts your company
and no, you cant ask your customers why your ad spamming bothers them and look at them like they're stupid for not wanting them on the limited space displays in their handheld devices
---------------
and worse than those people are the ones who also want you to pay for complete functionality on a limited functionality app, or to remove the ads
-------------
there is definitely solutions
Marketing companies taking over App Development from the too-geeky-to-get-it devs
let people click close on the banner, and dont make it re-open until the next time the app is opened
or something like youtube has done, "you can close this banner ad in 5-4-3-2-1"
the ability to 'click next' on the ad, with an option to say "this ad doesnt apply to me"
and for google to enforce these protocols, as well as require all in-app ads to be targeted to a specific demographic according to more than 3 demographic or psychographic criteria..
---
oh, make no mistake, my friend, the problem is monumental
and, yes, there are many, many solutions to the problem.. indeed...
-
I find it ironic that you tout how important good marketing is (which I wholeheartedly agree with you on that point), while simultaneously suggesting Google to rebrand their most successful operating system to Ad-droid or the likes. Surely you must have realised that the marketing team at Google would not do such a thing for obvious reasons?
SammiSaysHello said:
I find it ironic that you tout how important good marketing is (which I wholeheartedly agree with you on that point), while simultaneously suggesting Google to rebrand their most successful operating system to Ad-droid or the likes. Surely you must have realised that the marketing team at Google would not do such a thing for obvious reasons?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
its not a complete rebranding.. that is obviously the same current android logo, the android logo is very familiar, and it can have many different versions
the above version is just a suggestions.
Google is the brand, Android is a product line of the brand
and its in a dynamic market needing dynamic & innovative adjustments to keep up with the trends, technology, and social nuances
Adroid would be a re-introduction, an honest improvement over the current and inferior "Android"
Now, at this point I feel that I should point out to you that everything I have just said in this post right here is a joke.. not the haha type, but kind of a sad parody.. or more of a parable of sorts
it seems nobody here can really get a figure of speech that has a lesson beyond the surface text
the Adroid above is an example of everything that is wrong with the current situation in Google's Android platform and its connectors
its a Metaphor
for a real and devastating problem
shall I draw an image of exactly how annoying it is..
this is what it would look like on an HD Windows 7 Desktop
-
Perhaps instead of a full banner, they could make a small corner icon, that says "Click to See Your Ads"
"what use is that", you say?
"who would ever click on that"? you say?
Before installing an ad-supported app from the Ad-supported app section of Google Play, you need to first install the "Special Offers Manager" app.. where you are given a list of options/ a short survey where you select the type of ads you are interested in
You can select things like "sports", "movies", Fishing" etc, entering your own text if suitable choices arent available
you can also sign up for ads from specific companies or products, like Pepsi, Nike, Walmart, etc..
and you only get those ads..
AND they are full-screen, multi-page ads
and they never auto-appear
so the ads are tailored to the person's interests and personal preferences, and thus spark their interest, and may even be anticipated, or the highlight of their android usage.
"But they wont click on them if they arent shoved in their faces" you angrily exclaim
but they will, because they know there is something relevant to them, and because they can be presented with ACTUALLY SPECIAL offers.. that is, offers the user finds special, not offers the company finds special
on clicking an ad, you see Pepsi or Walmart, you are presented with a full-page Coupon or page of coupons,, or swipable multi-pages, as a coupon book..
then you click "Save QR Code" on a specific coupon, and its stored in your "Special Offers Manager" which comes as a stand-alone app for people who want to use Ad-supported ads.. the ads can be viewed by company or by date..
and there is an option in the "Special Offers Manager" app to only update coupons on WiFi connection, so you can upload larger coupon books
and all ad-supported ads are labelled as such on Google Play, and searchable in a specific category, separate from "Free".. Free, and "Ad-Supported Free"
then you go to a store, pull out your phone, go to your 'Special Offers Manager', click "Get QR Code" for the offer you saved, scan it at the store, and receive your special offer.
users will actively seek out the ads, clicking through them on the "Next" and "Previous" buttons, cycling through ads made just for you, according to your needs.
no secret info collecting and guessing what people want
whatever.. America is 15 years out from this, yet.. if ever
And here's a well put together article for you take a gander at http://www.forbes.com/sites/ayoomojola/2013/09/26/ios-is-for-revenue-android-is-for-ads/
iOS users spend more on Apps, Android users don't. iOS users are going to shell out more $$$ for a product that's not always up to date or quickly falls behind the Android competitors.
So Android users it would seem have adapted and can deal with the ads. If it's something that bothers you so greatly, maybe you should take your money over to iOS. Pay more and get less ads. bye!
Surprise surprise this thread is going nowhere. I'm shocked.
Thread closed.
This [New Approach to get HTC to listen.] thread was OP by hasoon2000, and stickied into Tony Stark's "General sticky."
It is more important now than ever to ask HTC to lend a hand, especially in making some unreleased code available.
Please see the link for the simple instructions.
Thanks,
pbergonzi
pbergonzi said:
This [New Approach to get HTC to listen.] thread was OP by hasoon2000, and stickied into Tony Stark's "General sticky."
It is more important now than ever to ask HTC to lend a hand, especially in making some unreleased code available.
Please see the link for the simple instructions.
Thanks,
pbergonzi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I followed the advice, contacting them, and within 12 hours got this reply, and attempted to provide the requested information:
"Dear (pbergonzi),
Thank you for contacting HTC Technical Support.
(pbergonzi), first of all I would like to thank you for being a member of our family of smart mobile devices. In this case, I want to make sure your request is passed along to our proper department. Remember your thoughts are imperative for us to grow as a community. Our goal is always to provide you with top of the line devices as well as a spectacular HTC experience.
In this case, in order to pass this information to the proper department, I will like to know the following:
• Carrier
• Android version / Software version requesting source code for
• Radio Version Note: This is Baseband version on Android devices
• Serial Number/MEID/ IMEI/ESN
• Software Number
• Full Name
• Email Address
• Contact Number
• Mobile Number
• Preferred Contact Time
• Time Zone
• Carrier
I look forward to your reply with the necessary informaiton. Please do not hesitate to contact us through http://www.htc.com/us/contact/email/ or call us at +1-866-449-8358 from (8 Am – 1 Am) ET, 7 days a week or you can reply to this email by clicking on the link below.
Thank you for being a member of our HTC community and I wish you a good day!
If this answers your comment or question, please click here to complete the process.
To submit another comment, please click here.
Sincerely,
The HTCDev Team
Want to see what others are saying? Have a question to ask other HTCDev fans?
Follow us on Twitter www.twitter.com/htcdev
Explore our development resources www.htcdev.com
We are unable to receive replies to this email account. Please visit us at www.htcdev.com if you have any questions or need further assistance."
I can only imagine what would happen if 5 million more of us contacted them.
pbergonzi said:
I followed the advice, contacting them, and within 12 hours got this reply, and attempted to provide the requested information:
"Dear (pbergonzi),
Thank you for contacting HTC Technical Support.
(pbergonzi), first of all I would like to thank you for being a member of our family of smart mobile devices. In this case, I want to make sure your request is passed along to our proper department. Remember your thoughts are imperative for us to grow as a community. Our goal is always to provide you with top of the line devices as well as a spectacular HTC experience.
In this case, in order to pass this information to the proper department, I will like to know the following:
• Carrier
• Android version / Software version requesting source code for
• Radio Version Note: This is Baseband version on Android devices
• Serial Number/MEID/ IMEI/ESN
• Software Number
• Full Name
• Email Address
• Contact Number
• Mobile Number
• Preferred Contact Time
• Time Zone
• Carrier
I look forward to your reply with the necessary informaiton. Please do not hesitate to contact us through http://www.htc.com/us/contact/email/ or call us at +1-866-449-8358 from (8 Am – 1 Am) ET, 7 days a week or you can reply to this email by clicking on the link below.
Thank you for being a member of our HTC community and I wish you a good day!
If this answers your comment or question, please click here to complete the process.
To submit another comment, please click here.
Sincerely,
The HTCDev Team
Want to see what others are saying? Have a question to ask other HTCDev fans?
Follow us on Twitter www.twitter.com/htcdev
Explore our development resources www.htcdev.com
We are unable to receive replies to this email account. Please visit us at www.htcdev.com if you have any questions or need further assistance."
I can only imagine what would happen if 5 million more of us contacted them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hate to rain on your parade, but you're referencing a nearly two year old post that was made at a time when HTC wasn't unlocking devices or providing source code for them. Tens of thousands did write letters and signed several online petitions, the most famous of which was at change.org. HTC eventually did bow to pressure and provided the means to unlock boot-loaders and released the source code. It's why we and other HTC owners can run different kernels and ROMs now, without jumping through hoops trying crazy hacks and exploits to do so.
The issues are now with the component manufacturers like Texas Instruments and Qualcomm who have yet to release up to date open sourced drivers for newer kernels. Heck, it took petitions and a letter writing campaign just to get them to release the stale sources we have now that were already nearly two years old. Don't hold your breath that they'll be inclined to release any newer ones for a device as old as ours is.
Sorry to give you the bad news but you're jumping in with this pretty late in the game. Our device wasn't a big seller, and was eclipsed by lighter more powerful units within 3 months of its release. All but a handful of devs left for greener pastures long ago. What we have left is a small group of dedicated diehards who are doing the best they can with what they have to work with. Just be thankful that we have them, and that any work is still being done here.
Look at this forum, on a busy day there's maybe 6-7 posts, but on average 2-3. Were lucky that the powers that run this place haven't relegated us to "legacy" status yet. Again, I don't want to down you out, but even if every active reader of this forum were to run out and immediately do as you suggest, we'd be lucky to get a hundred sent in. I'm sorry, but these are the facts. To believe anything else would be at best hopeless optimism, or at worst pure fantasy. Just my opinion.
Ciao
Oh, thanks Odysseus. The history lesson was edifying and poignant. Since the subject was stickied, it still seemed relevant.
Nevertheless, after ravike mentioned just recently about communicating with someone there, I thought communication at the very least wouldn't hurt, and who knows if someone somewhere might just change something. I think that energy spent in changing my mind would be better spent and more psychically rewarding directed toward HTC, even though presumably useless. You for example, are certainly articulate enough that your words might well work a lasting sympathetic response in a developer, and who knows where that will go, even if he doesn't directly reply in kind--he might for example, be kinder to the person who brings his coffee, just as an example.
Granted, 5 million members of xda are not about to contact HTC, however, as the little sparrow, with feet pointed skyward to prevent it from falling, said to the chuckling farmer who doubted him, "One does what one can."
Sorry to Burst Your Bubble
Odysseus1962 said:
I hate to rain on your parade, but you're referencing a nearly two year old post that was made at a time when HTC wasn't unlocking devices or providing source code for them. Tens of thousands did write letters and signed several online petitions, the most famous of which was at change.org. HTC eventually did bow to pressure and provided the means to unlock boot-loaders and released the source code. It's why we and other HTC owners can run different kernels and ROMs now, without jumping through hoops trying crazy hacks and exploits to do so.
The issues are now with the component manufacturers like Texas Instruments and Qualcomm who have yet to release up to date open sourced drivers for newer kernels. Heck, it took petitions and a letter writing campaign just to get them to release the stale sources we have now that were already nearly two years old. Don't hold your breath that they'll be inclined to release any newer ones for a device as old as ours is.
Sorry to give you the bad news but you're jumping in with this pretty late in the game. Our device wasn't a big seller, and was eclipsed by lighter more powerful units within 3 months of its release. All but a handful of devs left for greener pastures long ago. What we have left is a small group of dedicated diehards who are doing the best they can with what they have to work with. Just be thankful that we have them, and that any work is still being done here.
Look at this forum, on a busy day there's maybe 6-7 posts, but on average 2-3. Were lucky that the powers that run this place haven't relegated us to "legacy" status yet. Again, I don't want to down you out, but even if every active reader of this forum were to run out and immediately do as you suggest, we'd be lucky to get a hundred sent in. I'm sorry, but these are the facts. To believe anything else would be at best hopeless optimism, or at worst pure fantasy. Just my opinion.
Ciao
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
@pbergonzi I do appreciate that you are trying to help, but the Amaze is LONG dead. If you decide to visit HTC's official website, the Amaze has vanished. They are pretending it never existed. The only things left are old drivers and antiquated software support from HTC (doesn't apply to us anymore). From what I saw, they only released source because they would have been breaking the GPL, thus decreasing their reputation as a smartphone manufacturer.
Also, it's not that HTC doesn't want to support us, it's that they can't. Texas Instruments doesn't support our chipset, and never will because this phone didn't sell. HTC has absolutely no obligation to release source code for less than a dozen hobbyist developers. They have better things to do, like develop for the HTC One. Why would they care about us. That's the ugly unwritten truth about companies.
If they do decide to spontaneously resume support, I will buy 3 goats, paint numbers "1", "2", and "4" on them and release the goats while in school and let them run wild!
pbergonzi said:
Oh, thanks Odysseus. The history lesson was edifying and poignant. Since the subject was stickied, it still seemed relevant.
Nevertheless, after ravike mentioned just recently about communicating with someone there, I thought communication at the very least wouldn't hurt, and who knows if someone somewhere might just change something. I think that energy spent in changing my mind would be better spent and more psychically rewarding directed toward HTC, even though presumably useless. You for example, are certainly articulate enough that your words might well work a lasting sympathetic response in a developer, and who knows where that will go, even if he doesn't directly reply in kind--he might for example, be kinder to the person who brings his coffee, just as an example.
Granted, 5 million members of xda are not about to contact HTC, however, as the little sparrow, with feet pointed skyward to prevent it from falling, said to the chuckling farmer who doubted him, "One does what one can."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Listen, I hope my comments haven't dampened your enthusiasm. I truly love this device. It's the perfect size for my needs, takes great photos, and connects to the net much faster than the HD2 it replaced. The hardware still holds its own 3 years after release. It was the top of the line when it came out and the build quality that one would expect from a high-end product is evident wherever you look on the device.
The only problem with it is software, in particular an outdated OS. The very software that allows lesser devices to perform better than this, is what's holding it back. Please don't be discouraged, instead learn what you can so that you too can contribute to our small, but loyal community. Together, each in his own way, we can continue to keep the amaze alive.
Maybe it should be "New Approach to get Texas Instuments to listen."
Like for example, in the TI Engineer to Engineer community, where ravike14 is trying to get a little satisfaction regarding unreleased code:
http://e2e.ti.com/support/low_power_rf/f/307/p/305896/1089531.aspx#1089531