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So I'd been using JIT on my Evil Eris ROM (and I'd used it with a few others) and I was getting scores of 5.1~ mflops. Here are some things I noticed.
While I had first enabled JIT it was glitch free. I can safely say at this point that any "speed increase" I'd noticed was likely placebo or at least admissible.
JIT is amazing, but it's amazing for Froyo. The way a JIT compiler works is that it precompiles information into code that is more easily read, causing slight lag to begin and increasing overall performance. The thing they had to do with froyo is optimize just about everything to stop the lag and to make JIT worthwhile.
The other reason is that despite removing sense and eventually using the Universal JIT and basically doing everything to make it stable JIT began to show problems. It was absolutely stable for a very long time but if I left my phone on for a few days or I started installing new programs/ a new launcher it would get glitchy and laggy. This likely goes back to what I said about JIT really being much better for Froyo. It came to the point that I felt slower than before I rooted.
Now that I'm not on JIT I can also overclock higher. Before I was limited to 768mhz and if I went over it was an instant crash. Now with JIT removed I'm up to 787, I can do 806 but it only lasts a few minutes before it freezes up but it's proof to the concept that I can overclock much higher. I get consistently 3.4~ mflops.
I do realize that I while on JIT I got a large increase in mflops but in my experience I am performing better without it. I think that when Froyo ROM's come out JIT will be much better implemented.
tl;dr: JIT ended up causing lag, I can overclock higher without it, I'm just as fast/faster without it.
note: For something like a game JIT may help you much more than just scrolling around since the game will be precompiled and then run more smoothly but in my experience (with Zenonia mostly) there was no improvement and occasionally I would in fact lag more.
Just thought I should say this to everyone.
Kind a sounds like steroids, ya you get muscle and look cool but there are side effects
Yeah and JIT was made for Froyo, not for the other ones. Froyo was heavily optimized, they spent a ton of time just making everything work as well as possible so that the JIT wouldn't actually be detrimental. So while JIT does increase MFLOPS and performance it can cause a lot of bugs and slow downs because it's trying to compile information that isn't optimized for it.
Hm. I think I'll try disabling JIT for a while too. I might prefer the quicker load time over any supposed increase in performance. I haven't had much buggy behavior, but I have had some restarts and wonder if they're caused by JIT or just overclocking in general.
I've found overclocking surprisingly stable without JIT. It's incredible that I can overclock to 806mhz now with glitches and 787 is absolutely stable...
Looking back I realize now that JIT had slowly degraded, I started off overclocking without it to 787 and as I turned it on it began to get very glitchy with 787, eventually freezing immediately with it. I wouldn't be surprised if the restarts you're having are due to JIT in combination with overclocking.
good post +1.
the devs don't say anything about this in their threads, thats if they even know it or have experienced it themselves so i'm not blaming anyone.
good to know so i can at least eval it for myself. thanks.
I think JIT might have been interfering with my Swype. Maybe it's doing too much "just in time" compiling and not enough "ahead of time" compiling. But anyway, yesterday I switched back and forth several times between using JIT and not using JIT, but didn't change anything else, and I definitely noticed that Swype was more responsive without JIT. With JIT enabled, I kept having to retype things because my tracing path would skip over parts; it was choppy. Without JIT it's smooth as silk and therefore accurate again.
I think a lot of the problem is that apps also aren't made to use JIT yet, all of the developers made apps for non-JIT phones first... you see a LOT of problems in phones that have background apps (setcpu, autokillers, etc) when they have JIT enabled. I think anyone who read up on JIT when it was announced will see mentions of the google dev's saying "We really really streamlined the phone to make use of the JIT".... obviously they're remarking that JIT without streamlining and "light" OS is a bit of a waste. JIT on my Froyo ROM (CM6) is very much more stable. If anyone's interested I did some benchmarks for JIT here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=726038
Found this in the Hero forums, and it obviously applies to the Eris as well:
illogic6 said:
http://forum.cyanogenmod.com/topic/880-jit-wont-make-your-phone-super-fast/page__p__7910?#entry7910
Notice this portion of the post: "CPU intensive tasks get faster, but at the cost of RAM."
The way Darchstar explains it is that our phones cannot sacrifice that RAM once our phones have been bogged down with installed apps. He doesn't plan to include JIT by default when CM 6 goes final for HeroC and that's why.
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Yes well you can decrease or increase the amount of RAM that JIT will use (heap size) and increase stability or decrease it. I understand why it's default off, it makes sense especially since a lot of programs aren't made to use it *cough pandora cough*
I'm running Cyanogenmod 6 froyo, did you test the effects of turning on and off JIT on this ROM?
Yes, like I said JIT was literally made for Froyo ROMs, and you can quite clearly see that when you hear the devs who created it talk about it in google conferences and such, they had to do a lot to get JIT to work well without creating huge slowdown. Compilers are almost ALWAYS a bad idea because of their nature and because if information isn't made for the compiler it ends up doing more harm than good.
Froyo is streamlined to work with JIT without causing slowdown so I would highly recommend using the JIT compiler with Froyo.
Hungry Man said:
Yes, like I said JIT was literally made for Froyo ROMs, and you can quite clearly see that when you hear the devs who created it talk about it in google conferences and such, they had to do a lot to get JIT to work well without creating huge slowdown. Compilers are almost ALWAYS a bad idea because of their nature and because if information isn't made for the compiler it ends up doing more harm than good.
Froyo is streamlined to work with JIT without causing slowdown so I would highly recommend using the JIT compiler with Froyo.
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What about the Compcahe? Idk what it even does ahah
I turned JIT and surface dithering off. Phone runs smooth and no force closes.
surgeon0214 said:
What about the Compcahe? Idk what it even does ahah
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Compcache can speed some things up. I enabled it on a SenseUI ROM a while ago and had TERRIBLE, crashing results until I turned it off, at random.
I can confirm that JIT's make Swype crash sometimes. I can do a 100 fast-swype word experiment (which, I do a lot of 'texting', so this experiment happens every day), on days I have JIT on, Swype randomly disappears. (it is set to restart itself after 5.0 seconds, so don't worry). With JIT off, it only does its normal random crashing (when I accidentally hit the Swype key while it's thinking of what words I just swyped, for example -- just the known crash bugs).
JIT day was yesterday, for example (I'm experimenting with JITs because of this thread) - and Swype crashed more than 10 times (I stopped counting by the time I was at the bar for two hours, -- don't drink and swype!)
Non-JIT day was today, and Swype has not crashed 1 time (despite writing a few very long emails in a passenger seat and some serious texting).
Monday is a JIT day, and I'm pretty confident based on my findings, that these have a huge impact on Swype.
I'm just using SenseUI for the weekend (for reliability/etc, because I'm 'On Call' for work), but if my findings prove my theory WRONG, I'll edit this post and note that.
But in general, yes, I agree, JITs mess with Swype. Not to a point of usability, but to a point that, the late person might think Swype is unreliable (unknowingly).
Compcache is your processor compressing the information that is stored in your RAM to increase the total amount of RAM that you can use per program. This can increase performance by letting your programs use more RAM but it can also decrease performance by increasing the time that the CPU has to work on compression. For the Eris I don't suggest Compcache unless you're overclocking to at least 710mhz and if you're on a Froyo ROM I don't suggest it at all since you should have plenty of RAM already.
What VM Heap Size are you using pkopalek? Smaller heap sizes are more unstable, you may find swype is more stable at 24m if you're at 12 or 16. 24m is the point where sense becomes stable (sorta) with JIT.
How i can disable Hardware acceleration? Delete the file "local.prop"?
no dont delete lol
just debug.sf.hw=0 i think ...
Thx i will try it ...
what are the benefits of disabling hardware acceleration?
Apparently, disabling HWA improves battery life. I haven't actually tried disabling it though. My battery lasts a couple of days with HWA enabled, so I just keep it on.
from what i have experienced, enabling HW accel slows down linpack, therefore giving lower scores (9 with JIT only, 8 with JIT and HW accel)
should I still enable it anyways?
zero7525 said:
from what i have experienced, enabling HW accel slows down linpack, therefore giving lower scores (8 with JIT only, 5 with JIT and HW accel)
should I still enable it anyways?
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linpack score will be low but snappier and faster while using phone
Hey peeps,
Currently I'm in the possession of an HTC Sensation XE, but thinking about making the switch to the SGSII. However, some questions are still there and I was hoping that the helpful community here could help me answer some of these.
How is the Earphone quality? Anyone tried it with some decent pair of headphones yet and is able to tell me their experience?
Could someone with a "stock" SGSII (International model preferably) tell me about the gaming performance on the SGSII? I'm talking about games such as Dungeon Defenders, Wind-Up Knight and PSX/N64 Emulation. If entirely possible with a recorded video.
Same request above for a person who flashed a ROM
How does the SGSII perform with Tegra 2 games through Chain-something?
How is the battery life for both the "stock" SGSII and the Lite-ning ROM?
Could a person with a "stock" SGSII show me their benchmark scores after a reboot of the phone?
Same for a person running the Lite-ning ROM
The standard hardware acceleration which is present on the SGSII. Is the hardware acceleration only being applies to browsing and the UI? or also to applications and games?
In addition to the above questions, how will ICS affect the hardware acceleration on the SGSII? Will it be disabled in favor of the ICS style hardware acceleration or will they live together happily ever after?
My apologies for the kind of weird requests. But I do sincerely hope you guys can help me decide whether to get this device or stick with the Sensation XE.
Regards,
Vex
-=Vex=- said:
Hey peeps,
Currently I'm in the possession of an HTC Sensation XE, but thinking about making the switch to the SGSII. However, some questions are still there and I was hoping that the helpful community here could help me answer some of these.
How is the Earphone quality? Anyone tried it with some decent pair of headphones yet and is able to tell me their experience?
Could someone with a "stock" SGSII (International model preferably) tell me about the gaming performance on the SGSII? I'm talking about games such as Dungeon Defenders, Wind-Up Knight and PSX/N64 Emulation. If entirely possible with a recorded video.
Same request above for a person who flashed a ROM
How does the SGSII perform with Tegra 2 games through Chain-something?
How is the battery life for both the "stock" SGSII and the Lite-ning ROM?
Could a person with a "stock" SGSII show me their benchmark scores after a reboot of the phone?
Same for a person running the Lite-ning ROM
The standard hardware acceleration which is present on the SGSII. Is the hardware acceleration only being applies to browsing and the UI? or also to applications and games?
In addition to the above questions, how will ICS affect the hardware acceleration on the SGSII? Will it be disabled in favor of the ICS style hardware acceleration or will they live together happily ever after?
My apologies for the kind of weird requests. But I do sincerely hope you guys can help me decide whether to get this device or stick with the Sensation XE.
Regards,
Vex
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Oh man, many questions and I can only give a few answers:
1. Earphone quality is IMO good. As I do not have a Sensation XE, I can not compare it directly. There are some tests (Google search is your friend ;-) which might give a more experience-based opinion.
2. + 3. + 4. Can't say much about gaming performance, as I am not a gambler.
5. I am running a stock ROM (XWKJ1, Android 2.3.5) and battery life is OK for me. With permanent wifi on, no bluetooth, no GPS, permanent Skype and Google Talk, some email, often internet news and looking into xda-developers forum, a nightly charged battery has about 50% in the evening. So, with less usage my phone could work for about two days.
There are many custom ROMs, which are specialized for optimizing battery life.
You have to set your priority between battery life and performance.
6. Benchmark scores ... which benchmark?
On Quadrant Standard, I usually have 3000-4000 with the stock ROMs.
My actual score is about 3400 as I am running CF-Root kernel XWKI8, which is not based on the real stock kernel of my ROM (XWKJ1).
But to have more than 4000 points in Quadrant, I think you have to use a custom ROM specialized for performance or at least overclock the CPU.
7. No custom ROM.
8. Good question. I think that hardware acceleration is in general available for any app too ... but ... if any app will use it, I really don't know. Each manufacturer ans even each phone has a different hardware and therefore need a different hardware acceleration, so that would be a very hard job for a developer to get familiar with all available hardware-specific APIs. At least the app of the manufacturer itself (=> Samsung) should use hardware acceleration.
But I am not sure about even this.
9. Hmm ... complicated question. I heard that the SGS2 or better the hardware of the SGS2 is 100% compatible with IceCreamSandwich. And that's it. I have got no more infos about this topic.
I will think about such issues just before getting ready for flashing ICS onto my SGS2. Hoping that there will be more and official statements up to this moment.
Regardless of the fact that you aren't able to answer all the questions, I really do appreciate your reply to these matters.
2 Days on battery, that's quite amazing seeing as my XE only lasted for about 8-10 hours on normal use with Wifi on.
Quadrant scores are also quite impressive, even at stock.
I really do hope that someone can clarify more on the amtter of ICS' hardware acceleration. I'm eager to find out how it differs from the acceleration currently present on the SGSII
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I'm on Androidmeda 2.5 with Siyahkernel 2.0. I can typically get about 4.5 to 5 hours of screen time.
It's my theory that the basic ROM itself shouldn't affect the battery life. It's the different init.d scripts of optimization and the kernel that will have *some* effect given that you don't OC/UC or OV/UV. Mostly it should be what apps you run in the background like facebook, skype, etc.
Also I find that having wifi and data always on doesn't affect my battery life too much if I disable background sync.
Thanks for that reply.
4-5 hours does seem a little meager though. Then again my Sensation lasted for about as long as that, if not less.
Eager to hear more opinions!
Hello everybody ! Basiclly i want to ask if it would be a good idea to try disabling CPU rendering for a GB rom? Im currently on CM10 but really cant use it too much cause some games like Fruit ninja force close and cant even listen to music whatsoever. But the main thing that i dont like about GB roms is that they are very slow compared to CM9 or CM10. Would disabling CPU rendering make a difference? People say it makes a big difference .
It's probably possible, but I don't have the slightest idea on howto do it.
gskillivenom said:
Hello everybody ! Basiclly i want to ask if it would be a good idea to try disabling CPU rendering for a GB rom? Im currently on CM10 but really cant use it too much cause some games like Fruit ninja force close and cant even listen to music whatsoever. But the main thing that i dont like about GB roms is that they are very slow compared to CM9 or CM10. Would disabling CPU rendering make a difference? People say it makes a big difference .
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No 2D GPU rendering is available on GB. All GUI is rendered by CPU. So turning that off would leave you a black screen (except in games).
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
HW acceleration was introduced in Honeycomb. Only the CPU is used for 2D rendering on earlier versions
I've been using performance mode since the day I got the phone, so for the last 10 days, but I wanted to know - is it really worth it? I rarely play games, if I play them at all. I don't edit videos, do some photoshop work or whatever. I mainly use M20P for whatsapp facebook insta reddit and browsing.
So do I really need it or should I disable performance mode and get even more battery juice?
Ty
furiouszagreb said:
I've been using performance mode since the day I got the phone, so for the last 10 days, but I wanted to know - is it really worth it? I rarely play games, if I play them at all. I don't edit videos, do some photoshop work or whatever. I mainly use M20P for whatsapp facebook insta reddit and browsing.
So do I really need it or should I disable performance mode and get even more battery juice?
Ty
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TBH, I've never used that and the mate is the fastest most fluid phone I've ever used. I really don't think it's needed at all.
mike2518 said:
TBH, I've never used that and the mate is the fastest most fluid phone I've ever used. I really don't think it's needed at all.
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I see. So you would reckon I dont need it enabled?
Not really seen any difference in performance with it, I tested but don't use it at all now.
Sent from my HUAWEI LYA-L09 using XDA Labs
The performance mode increases the GPU performance and doesn't have this much impact on the CPU.
So you will only notice it while playing games or doing some GPU-accelerated video editing - the everyday performance won't improve this much..
I think it changes the cpu's governor to respond faster to any solicitation (for me it unlocks a bit faster for example).
If you don't need extra battery life you can stick to performance mode.
But like others said, it's not a big change, it will still feel smooth and fast without performance mode.
Alright, I'll just do a test and if the battery lifr difference is significant, I'll turn it off. Thank you everyone
I didn't realize we even had a toggle for that. Too bad they treat it the way they do - it should be a list of apps that automatically turn it on when they are running. EMUI 9.1 has something kinda like that, except it is a group of optimized settings that have been pre-made for specific games. There are only about a dozen or so games on the list so far, which kinda makes it pointless. There were reports that Huawei had changed their mind and remove the performance toggle from the Mate 20 Pro at the last moment, because it made the phone heat up and didn't really gain anything. I have a zillion games on my phone but none of them are so GPU intensive that the phone struggles, haven't seen a need for this mode - yet.
I play tekken 6 on PPSSPP emulator, it runs the same with or without it, pretty much perfect.
kaibosh99 said:
I didn't realize we even had a toggle for that. Too bad they treat it the way they do - it should be a list of apps that automatically turn it on when they are running. EMUI 9.1 has something kinda like that, except it is a group of optimized settings that have been pre-made for specific games. There are only about a dozen or so games on the list so far, which kinda makes it pointless. There were reports that Huawei had changed their mind and remove the performance toggle from the Mate 20 Pro at the last moment, because it made the phone heat up and didn't really gain anything. I have a zillion games on my phone but none of them are so GPU intensive that the phone struggles, haven't seen a need for this mode - yet.
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In other words, what you're saying is basically there's no need to actually run it as the perfomance isn't significantly improved, likely not at all? And I don't even play games, I guess it's even more pointless for me? Lol
kaibosh99 said:
I didn't realize we even had a toggle for that. Too bad they treat it the way they do - it should be a list of apps that automatically turn it on when they are running. EMUI 9.1 has something kinda like that, except it is a group of optimized settings that have been pre-made for specific games. There are only about a dozen or so games on the list so far, which kinda makes it pointless. There were reports that Huawei had changed their mind and remove the performance toggle from the Mate 20 Pro at the last moment, because it made the phone heat up and didn't really gain anything. I have a zillion games on my phone but none of them are so GPU intensive that the phone struggles, haven't seen a need for this mode - yet.
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Derpling said:
I play tekken 6 on PPSSPP emulator, it runs the same with or without it, pretty much perfect.
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I see. Could it be Huawei just put that with the EMUI 9 to satisfy those who complained they couldnt get the same or similar antutu or geekbench scores that were advertised?
kaibosh99 said:
I didn't realize we even had a toggle for that. Too bad they treat it the way they do - it should be a list of apps that automatically turn it on when they are running. EMUI 9.1 has something kinda like that, except it is a group of optimized settings that have been pre-made for specific games. There are only about a dozen or so games on the list so far, which kinda makes it pointless. There were reports that Huawei had changed their mind and remove the performance toggle from the Mate 20 Pro at the last moment, because it made the phone heat up and didn't really gain anything. I have a zillion games on my phone but none of them are so GPU intensive that the phone struggles, haven't seen a need for this mode - yet.
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I think this is what "Game acceleration" mode is for...you select the apps and they will get a performance boost at the expense of battery. Never tried it myself, but I wonder if this is a "Performance mode" limited to those apps...that's how I look at it.
Ipse_Tase said:
I think this is what "Game acceleration" mode is for...you select the apps and they will get a performance boost at the expense of battery. Never tried it myself, but I wonder if this is a "Performance mode" limited to those apps...that's how I look at it.
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Makes sense. I agree
Ipse_Tase said:
I think this is what "Game acceleration" mode is for...you select the apps and they will get a performance boost at the expense of battery. Never tried it myself, but I wonder if this is a "Performance mode" limited to those apps...that's how I look at it.
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Game acceleration is the gpu turbo, performance mode is in battery settings,2 different things.
Be that as it may, general consensus seems to be that it is pretty much useless...
The performance mode was meant for a higher score on benchmarks. Huawei and a few other OEMs were accused of detecting popular benchmark apps and purposely tune their software to score higher on benchmarks. The performance mode was a result of public demand.
Koong1 said:
The performance mode was meant for a higher score on benchmarks. Huawei and a few other OEMs were accused of detecting popular benchmark apps and purposely tune their software to score higher on benchmarks. The performance mode was a result of public demand.
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Yeah, thought it was something amongst those lines. So, useless in day to day usage
furiouszagreb said:
Yeah, thought it was something amongst those lines. So, useless in day to day usage
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Yes. It is useless. There is no need to keep your CPU running at maximum in everyday usage. The phone can auto detect graphics intensive and CPU hungry apps, it will adjust automatically to the needs of different apps. Use the phone as it is for the best stress free experience.
(Damn, I sound like some Huawei salesperson)
Lmao! But yeah I figured as much. thanks haha
Koong1 said:
The performance mode was meant for a higher score on benchmarks. Huawei and a few other OEMs were accused of detecting popular benchmark apps and purposely tune their software to score higher on benchmarks. The performance mode was a result of public demand.
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this!
I think people have forgotten about the benchmark cheating controversy.
"optimisation" in benchmark apps (that is detection and different settings for benchmarks vs real world apps) was considered cheating (and rightly so)
so instead, huawei made the optimisations an option for the entire phone. only affects benchmarks afaik. maybe some intensive apps... but which apps right now would be considered power intensive for a phone (not a benchmark, an actual app).