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I've looked around here a good bit and can't seem to find info on the USB functions of this device (I have an 8500). I've read where somebody got an external memory card to work through the cable, but what I am kind of curious about is do other USB devices work as well? Ie, if I get a cable with the appropriate ends on it, could I hook up a keyboard or, more importantly (and at the risk of "Read-the-massive-thread" flaming) an external GPS antenna (such as the one that comes with Microsoft Streets and Trips)?.
any ideas?
sorry if this is posted in the wrong place.
Jason
In any USB connection, there has to be a "bus master" device, which "directs" all the other devices, and manages the transactions. This operation is usually done by a PC; while there are other pdas (I've seen HPs do it) which can be "reversed" and turned into bus-masters, no HTC device can do this. It is a hardware problem, as the pda needs some special hardware in order to be able to act as a bus-master. As a usb bus can't work without a bus-master, two "client" devices (such as your hermes and a usb memory stick) will not be able to work together.
Sorry!
The Samsung S3C 2442 processor used by the HTC Hermes actually does have native USB Host support per Samsung's documentation here: http://www.samsung.com/products/semiconductor/MobileSoC/ApplicationProcessor/ARM9Series/SC32442/SC32442.htm.
Now if the wires are connected or not, that's a question I have not yet dug deep enough to answer. Maybe, maybe not.
The ETEN M500 supported USB Host while the M600 does not. These devices are identical hardware as far as I could tell, both using the Samsung S3C 2440. The difference is Windows Mobile 2003 on the M500 vs 5.0 on the M600.
This indicates to me that Microsoft has either omitted USB Host support which they previously included in the operating system, or a change in the OS has made USB Host very difficult to implement.
Hope this helps somebody figure out a way to hack USB Host onto our devices.
- Trane
Thanks for the reply Trane. this would be really handy to have working. Perhaps soemone else will chime in.
~Jason
I was just thinking, all that the lapdock is to the phone is an HDMI output and a USB input, so why does it trigger webtop, and could I trigger webtop the same way?
My initial thought is, it triggers it by something sent into the USB, is there any way anyone could identify what in particular so it might be mimicked?
I realize people have come up with software webtop without lapdock solutions, but I'd really rather just leave the software alone (harmless as the change may be..), I rather like it as it is (with launcher pro instead of default that is..)
So, what is the lapdock doing to key the atrix to go into webtop?
I did search for this, sorry if there's already a thread about it, I didn't find one..
Although I am not a hardware person and have limited experience with Linux, I am also interested in the answer to this question. I would have to assume that the Atrix recognizes the connection and sends a command to launch the appropriate software.
Once again...I am not really in any position to contribute much relevant information.
Just to throw out some other ideas that rattled around in my head for someone more familiar with this device...
There is a communication that comes from displays where they identify themselves and their modes for whatever device that connects to them- some pieces of this information could be key.
Beyond that, any particular piece of information the USB device identifies itself with similarly- a model or serial number the internal usb hub claims itself to be to the system, I know these are standard passive details these devices share with anything connecting to them.
In the identification side, I wonder if the files modified by the software webtop hack might lend details about what is precisely telling them to go into webtop..
If it's keyed off of some particular serial number or model information from the USB, I figure I could buy a cheap configurable USB diag board and flash it to mimic that info..
I sincerely doubt there's anything superbly intelligent in the lapdock where it does some non-standard communication as a handshake, I would think it has to be based on the standard passive device information every USB hub or HDMI connection shares..
edit:
Unless there's an extra device on the USB hub internally like a smartcard or flash chip with a key the atrix checks for..
I have webtop enabled without a dock, and webtop pops up when I plug just the HDMI cable in. I imagine it is just detecting the external display, and doesn't have anything to do with USB.
It should not be complicated as you you think. It's rather trigerred by some specific resistor on the pins 4&5 of micro USB connector
jenarelJAM said:
I have webtop enabled without a dock, and webtop pops up when I plug just the HDMI cable in. I imagine it is just detecting the external display, and doesn't have anything to do with USB.
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Click to collapse
You arent running stock software then. It detects it yes depending on what software you are running but the docks sends a signal to the atrix to turn on webtop on stock.
Not sure that it uses resistors, because when software hack was not available, bunch of people tried to do it with resistors however nobody got it to work. The best way would be to take apart multimedia dock and look at circuitry . Most likely it has a microchip sending some kind of ID. The problem is you need a special device to sniff usb communication between devices. If somebody has a device like that it should not be that hard to sniff it and program separate microchip to send it to usb.
this should have been posted in q&a... not the dev section
jgc121 said:
this should have been posted in q&a... not the dev section
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Sorry, I can never tell the difference, when things are technical and require some development understanding which place to put it. If a mod could move this post I would appreciate it then.
jenarelJAM said:
I have webtop enabled without a dock, and webtop pops up when I plug just the HDMI cable in. I imagine it is just detecting the external display, and doesn't have anything to do with USB.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its sensing an external diplay. The hdmi cable does a handshake upon connection of the cable. At that point, the software handles what happens. Webtop senses usb as well (like the car dock does), but the hack removes that check. Thats how hdmi triggers webtop.
Sent from my Motorola Atrix 4G on the network with the most backhaul, whatever that is
From a video I saw from Motorola in UK it was a RFID thing......I am looking for the video now
_Dennis_ said:
From a video I saw from Motorola in UK it was a RFID thing......I am looking for the video now
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About two and a half minutes in to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5vgYiF3Udw.
He is specifically talking about the desk dock there but seems to imply they use "whisper technology" to communicate for all docks.
That's not from Motorola and that guy made that up....
At least that's my take....
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
Thread moved to correct section.
There's no rfid ... the devs would have figured that out by now. Its most likely just by device id. Same reason the cable shouldn't be plugged into a computer. The device id is not in the standards compliance for usb. (E.g. not flash drove, hard disk, human interface device)
Sent from my Motorola Atrix 4G on the network with the most backhaul, whatever that is. This post might have errors as I hate touchscreen keyboards.
Since many of us plan to upgrade to a Honeycomb release, we may be interested in the USB host feature.
This brings up the question of the HTC 12pin micro USB port.
Question: If we can use a standard micro USB for typical data transfer purposes, can we also use the standard 5pin micro USB cables to attach things like mice, keyboards, and card readers?
I am thinking this might be a valuable adaptor??
vancraft said:
Since many of us plan to upgrade to a Honeycomb release, we may be interested in the USB host feature.
This brings up the question of the HTC 12pin micro USB port.
Question: If we can use a standard micro USB for typical data transfer purposes, can we also use the standard 5pin micro USB cables to attach things like mice, keyboards, and card readers?
I am thinking this might be a valuable adaptor??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
USB host alone would be worth an upgrade - for me.
Apparently, USB host is not enabled in the Official HTC HC releases. We are looking into how to enable it for rooted ROM. When that is accomplished it will be posted on the forum. When software enabled the cable will be a standard connector micro-USB , possibly needing an OTG cable. In addition to the cable and software, you will require a powered hub to connect devices as the Flyer cannot supply power through the USB connector
DigitalMD said:
Apparently, USB host is not enabled in the Official HTC HC releases. We are looking into how to enable it for rooted ROM. When that is accomplished it will be posted on the forum. When software enabled the cable will be a standard connector micro-USB , possibly needing an OTG cable. In addition to the cable and software, you will require a powered hub to connect devices as the Flyer cannot supply power through the USB connector
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I am very sad because my honeycomb flyer can not detect the flash disc, usb mouse and usb keyboard, though already using Belkin powered hub! Now I use mwakious rom because it is the smoothest of all the existing custom rom.
DigitalMD, is there any custom rom based on latest leak rom from globatron that can run current USB Host? Why the USB HC can not enable USB Host but the HC first leak can do it?
I am confused because on the official HTC rom there are also USB storage settings.
Without USB Host, then HC Flyer lost one of its greatest benefits than gingerbread. This problem must be solved immediately. Is it possible that official rom will be updated again?
Thank you for your help!
---------- Post added at 08:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:27 PM ----------
Now we can conclude that the USB Host is not supported by the official HC on the Flyer and View!
USB host was not available on the official OTA final either GB or HC. You cannot say it has been lost, because officially it was never there. It has been sneaked into some custom ROMs and the HC leak initially. There will be HC custom ROMs coming and we are looking into re -enabling USB Host, but it was never a generally available feature so its not considered a bug and I would not expect HTC to ever support it official since it cannot be used without an externally powered device (such as a powered hub) since the Flyer cannot supply power through the USB and this would lead to a multitude of support request calls emails etc.
If you have a favorite custom ROM developer, talk with them about adding USB host support.
But understand the limitations of USB host on Android. Most things other than USB hard drive support can be accomplished via other means in a simpler fashion I.e Bluetooth keyboard, mouse, etc. The USB host support in Android is very basic, you cannot just plug in any device and expect it to work, special devices need special drivers which are not going to be available in Android. Pretty much for now you can use things that act like keyboard, mouse or mass storage formatted Fat32 and not much else. having to use an external power source really takes the convenience factor out.
I use a Bluetooth keyboard and a Bluetooth mouse. I use Dropbox to store my files that i need to sync with in the cloud. Only occasionally do I miss the direct USB connection to large mass storage.
shoot....I incorrectly thought that host was enabled in Honeycomb. Oh, well, guess I'll wait and see what ROMS come out. Now I'm not in such a hurry to update to HC.
I think HC removed support for USB host because they did not want to deal with support for it when people tried to use it and found most devices would not work without external power and the the endless questions "will this device work?" no, will this , no, etc..
Since the hardware does not support a full USB host (no power) its just too much trouble to say its a real feature from HTC's standpoint . Just asking for trouble
DigitalMD said:
I think HC removed support for USB host because they did not want to deal with support for it when people tried to use it and found most devices would not work without external power and the the endless questions "will this device work?" no, will this , no, etc..
Since the hardware does not support a full USB host (no power) its just too much trouble to say its a real feature from HTC's standpoint . Just asking for trouble
Click to expand...
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I haven't gone back to the stock kernel since recompiling the source but I have my suspicions that it is there, and if not it's easy to compile it in. I've gotten side-tracked on the view hboot for now but I'll get back to it when I'm done with that.
DigitalMD said:
I use a Bluetooth keyboard and a Bluetooth mouse. I use Dropbox to store my files that i need to sync with in the cloud. Only occasionally do I miss the direct USB connection to large mass storage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Direct USB connection is the simplest way to interact with many basic peripheral. Many people just don't know where to buy dedicated powered hub, so they don't use it! But it's very easy using a powered hub and does not add the slightest inconvenience. We will be very understand of the USB Host limitation, as well as the limitations of other handhelds supported USB Host, although they can provide additional power to the USB.
So, please, make it enable again on Honeycomb Flyer. Thank you in advance.
As DigitalMD, I also prefer to use Bluetooth peripherals as I hate carrying a multitude of cables around. For Storage, I use a modified DIR-685 with a 1Tb hard drive as it is also my hotel firewall. You could use a http://www.seagate.com/www/en-us/products/external/external-hard-drive/goflex-satellite.
But I really think HTC have just erred with USB host.
If they disabled it, why leave it showing in Settings Storage why not remove it as in GB?
They will get more customer complaints for a non-function rather than a missing function!
solar powered usb hub
I found a solar powered usb hub on amazon that I hope will work nicely when usb host finally gets enabled. I'd post the link, but I am too n00b, it says. At amazon if you search "solar powered usb hub" its the first link. Once usb host is enabled it at least removes the annoying tether to a power outlet.
Farsquidge said:
As DigitalMD, I also prefer to use Bluetooth peripherals as I hate carrying a multitude of cables around. For Storage, I use a modified DIR-685 with a 1Tb hard drive as it is also my hotel firewall. You could use a http://www.seagate.com/www/en-us/products/external/external-hard-drive/goflex-satellite.
But I really think HTC have just erred with USB host.
If they disabled it, why leave it showing in Settings Storage why not remove it as in GB?
They will get more customer complaints for a non-function rather than a missing function!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a go flex satellite too, but I am just greedy
butterflygirl said:
I have a go flex satellite too, but I am just greedy
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You are never greedy bg, just exploring broader possibilities, same as me.
Yeah its just my own opinion that HTC pulled the option at the last second on the final release because its was in the earlier leaks. But I just think they saw a raft of calls coming because the interface won't even power most small thumb drives. I'd like to see it working, but its not really of much use.
So I just saw a tweet about how on a SGS2 you can use a Samsung cord and are thus able to plug in USB devices. I had no idea you could do that, I knew with the Galaxy Nexus you could, but not the SGS2.
Is there any similar thing for the Amaze that anyone had heard of?
eliasadrian said:
So I just saw a tweet about how on a SGS2 you can use a Samsung cord and are thus able to plug in USB devices. I had no idea you could do that, I knew with the Galaxy Nexus you could, but not the SGS2.
Is there any similar thing for the Amaze that anyone had heard of?
Click to expand...
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Are you talking about the USB micro/mini plug turning into a USB host port instead of a client port?
there have been hack up's for this since the N1 that even let you run a USB video card off of it (with a power adapter hacked into the USB line tho)... like this http://sven.killig.de/android/N1/2.2/usb_host/
Ashcunak said:
Are you talking about the USB micro/mini plug turning into a USB host port instead of a client port?
there have been hack up's for this since the N1 that even let you run a USB video card off of it (with a power adapter hacked into the USB line tho)... like this http://sven.killig.de/android/N1/2.2/usb_host/
Click to expand...
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Yea, that's what I'm talking about, but looking around online about the SGS2 all you need is that OTG cable and it works. This solution looks fairly intense, with changing the kernel and editing scripts... Thanks anyways, at least we know it's possible.
@faux said the USB OTG code is missing in the HTC kernel. so, either htc or someone write some code in the kernel or it won't happen.
Not sure if the Telus kernel is different but using the stock .config file, it seems OTG is enabled.
OTG support for Qualcomm on-chip USB controller (USB_MSM_OTG_72K) is what is enabled.
I have a Kindle Fire I recently flashed CM10.2.1 Otter onto. I'm working on a project in which a wired network connection to the tablet is necessary. I cannot use any type of wireless connection for this. I am using a powered USB hub along with a USB OTG cable to host peripherals like keyboard and mouse. I have a CAT5 to USB adapter I need to get working on the Kindle. So far it looks like there aren't any drivers for USB ethernet adapters built into the kernel.
My question is where do I go looking for such drivers, and where can I go to learn to get them to work? If there aren't any drivers written for my kernel, where do I start learning to create them? I know writing/installing drivers is a tough job, but I want to make it work. I have experience as a programmer. Surely there is a small community somewhere centered around kernel developments for the Kindle Fire. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong part of the forum? Anyone have a website to suggest perhaps? Also any advice regarding my developments here would be nice. Thanks.