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English isn't my first language, otherwise I'd write one myself.
I'm looking for a good english writer to write a petition to B&N to provide the development community with an ability to access the bootloader and root the device.
I think main points should be that they've made a lot of money by allowing people to mod original NC, and that this will greatly increase the interest in purchasing the NT. Also, worth mentioning some examples of devices like Captivate that really benefited from custom community development (improved GPS, fixed many bugs, early GB port, etc).
Basically persuade B&N to support and appreciate development community and give us means to develop for them.
Needless to mention, only use words like "develop", "improve", etc... not "hack" and "crack" lol.
Here's the site I found where we can collect signatures:
http://www.makeuseof.com/dir/petitionspotcom/
POST IT HERE first, then we'll go and make it official.
PS: before anybody goes all "they ain't gonna listen yo" - let me remind you of Samsung's support to SuperCurio about improving Galaxy S's sound processing. After community asked Samsung, they actually provided full support and helped SuperCurio improve the device.
Providing a device and documentation is VERY different from unlocking a bootloader, unfortunately...
Entropy512 said:
Providing a device and documentation is VERY different from unlocking a bootloader, unfortunately...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed, but I think my point remains - this is another avenue of "attack" to get B&N to support us.
Our hackers are approaching this from technical side, I want to try and help and organize a line of communication with B&N and see if we can get them to help us.
Get your petition up and I'll sign! I was going to get a NT but now I'm not so sure. If it can't run from a dual booting SD card, it's just not worth it. Might as well pony up and get a "real" tablet.
Assuming the bootloader is proven to be locked, I'm simply taking mine back. The apps I use on the Nook Color *must* be available on the Nook Tablet, or it's not worth my money.
I hate to say it, but I'm in the same boat. I bought it because of what was accomplished with the NC and because of B&N's assurances that the same would be possible with the NT.
goldenu said:
Assuming the bootloader is proven to be locked, I'm simply taking mine back. The apps I use on the Nook Color *must* be available on the Nook Tablet, or it's not worth my money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
iamnarada said:
I hate to say it, but I'm in the same boat. I bought it because of what was accomplished with the NC and because of B&N's assurances that the same would be possible with the NT.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what are you guys running on the NC that you cant run on the NT?
you can sideload apps onto the NT and run goLauncher etc...
postulio said:
what are you guys running on the NC that you cant run on the NT?
you can sideload apps onto the NT and run goLauncher etc...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agreed. i'm a little confused. I get the SD boot issue being a problem, but I haven't come across any apps that I use that couldn't be sideloaded.
maybe i'm just old and don't use some of the stuff you guys use?
I really enjoy the NT but don't know how long I will keep it if I constantly have to use workarounds to get any functionality out of it.
No custom kernels / ROMs
No Android Market
No settings page
No root (so far at least)
Nook button opens Nook launcher only
i dunno, I guess I'm just more patient than most. I really didn't expect to buy it and have it as functional as it is already, leave alone rooted or installing custom roms. I expected that in a few months....
I'm just glad I could install a real browser, and have access to install the apks i wanted.
postulio said:
what are you guys running on the NC that you cant run on the NT?
you can sideload apps onto the NT and run goLauncher etc...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, all of the Google apps install fine, but when I try to sign in to my account or associate it my account with the tablet, it tells me my user name or password is wrong. So effectively, I can't use any of the Google apps. I can log in to my google account in the browser, and access the web versions of the apps, but....what I was looking for really was to be able to put the ROM I wanted on it.
Add me to the list of those with a clock ticking. Picked mine up on the 16th, and it stays wrapped until we know if the NT can be rooted - or day 14 - whichever comes first.
Progress is great so far - but I don't want a device that can be locked down with any random update from B&N. Based on their earlier broken promises, they have about zero credibility for things said.
Let me retract my line about broken promises - that was Amazon that promised no rooting roadblocks - and they kept to their word. I don't think B&N made any statement about this.
A petition is good, for sure. But it doesn't hurt if everyone also contacted B&N [[email protected]] and explained personally and sincerely why it would be in their best interest to unlock the Tablet. I'd focus on how their specs are superior, but useless if they're not open. I'd mention the limited space for side-loading, and enabling 3rd party apps.
I'd remind them how popular their Nook Color got, and free press, when the NC was rooted. And use the MS Kinect & Linksys WRT-54G as examples of success stories when a company adopts and opens their hardware.
I thought everyone knows that e-petition is totally worthless. Actually, it's worse than worthless, since it gives you a false sense of complacency.
If rooting is that important to you, then take more effort than the few keyclicks to fill out an e-petition.
Take your purchased NT to the nearest B&N store. Return it, and make sure you give the reason why it's being returned, that the NT is hostile to tech enthusiasts. Say that you'll now consider the Kindle Fire because of its more tech-friendly mindset (whether that's true or not). Say that given your status as the go-to tech dude, you'll recommend against the NT for any who asks.
Ask to speak to a manager or a tech specialist; you don't want your words wasted on a grunt. Be polite but firm at all times.
Money speaks the loudest. Let your money speak for you. Buy something else.
e.mote said:
I thought everyone knows that e-petition is totally worthless. Actually, it's worse than worthless, since it gives you a false sense of complacency.
If rooting is that important to you, then take more effort than the few keyclicks to fill out an e-petition.
Take your purchased NT to the nearest B&N store. Return it, and make sure you give the reason why it's being returned, that the NT is hostile to tech enthusiasts. Say that you'll now consider the Kindle Fire because of its more tech-friendly mindset (whether that's true or not). Say that given your status as the go-to tech dude, you'll recommend against the NT for any who asks.
Ask to speak to a manager or a tech specialist; you don't want your words wasted on a grunt. Be polite but firm at all times.
Money speaks the loudest. Let your money speak for you. Buy something else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If everyone were to do what you're saying, B&N would lose 3% of NT's total sales (judging by statistics someone referenced here), call it within a sales estimation margin of error and ignore it.
And we'd all be left without a $250 tablet, or with a ****tier one.
Sorry, don't like your solution. It'd only work if, say, 25%+ of NT buyers wanted root.
And you think e-petitions are better? Good luck with that.
There are different ways to communicate. Some more effective, some less. E-petition is at the bottom of the heap, followed by e-mail.
Money--ie making vendor lose money with refunds--is the most powerful method of persuasion. Sure, there may not be enough people to make the vendor reconsider, but it beats moping around and twirling your thumbs, hoping the vendor will change its mind with some dumb e-petition, no?
BTW, techies have an outsized influence on vendor decisions, as long as they know the proper buttons to push. B&N right now is in a battle with Amazon for e-readers. Saying that you'll get a Kindle Fire, and will recommend everyone to do so, is a big button you can push. Forcing the vendor to lose money with refunds is another.
In any case, if your envisioned use is a rooted NT, then this isn't it, so why hang onto it? If/when the NT is rooted, you can always buy it again.
e.mote said:
And you think e-petitions are better? Good luck with that.
There are different ways to communicate. Some more effective, some less. E-petition is at the bottom of the heap, followed by e-mail.
Money--ie making vendor lose money with refunds--is the most powerful method of persuasion. Sure, there may not be enough people to make the vendor reconsider, but it beats moping around and twirling your thumbs, hoping the vendor will change its mind with some dumb e-petition, no?
BTW, techies have an outsized influence on vendor decisions, as long as they know the proper buttons to push. B&N right now is in a battle with Amazon for e-readers. Saying that you'll get a Kindle Fire, and will recommend everyone to do so, is a big button you can push. Forcing the vendor to lose money with refunds is another.
In any case, if your envisioned use is a rooted NT, then this isn't it, so why hang onto it? If/when the NT is rooted, you can always buy it again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People have different reasons.
For one, if I were to call for mass returns of NT, that'd greatly decrease interest in rooting the NT, which makes it even worse. If you decided NT is not for you and u want KF - godspeed, I'm sure you've got your reasons.
And no, petitions are NOT worthless. Not with decent companies. As I've mentioned, ask SuperCurio and his collaboration with Samsung.
I, for one, had a $100 gift card for B&N, so it's $150 NT versus $200 KF for me. Regardless, even without that giftcard, I'd still not go for KF when there's NT around, cause KF is just gimped and kinda useless.
Regardless, can we please return to the topic of this thread - I'm looking for someone's help writing a letter to B&N asking them for help achieving root for developers.
>If you decided NT is not for you and u want KF - godspeed, I'm sure you've got your reasons.
I've no interest in the KF, and for now, the NT. But it doesn't hurt to tell B&N that I consider their competition to be better, for persuasion purposes.
>And no, petitions are NOT worthless. Not with decent companies.
"not with decent companies"..
Life's experience isn't something that can be told, I suppose. Good luck with your quixotic quest. Please do keep the NT past the return period, and make B&N happy.
Yes, let's return to the topic of e-petition. Below is a piece that'll let you know your chances. Welcome to the world of SLACKTIVISM.
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/petition/internet.asp
e.mote said:
>If you decided NT is not for you and u want KF - godspeed, I'm sure you've got your reasons.
I've no interest in the KF, and for now, the NT. But it doesn't hurt to tell B&N that I consider their competition to be better, for persuasion purposes.
>And no, petitions are NOT worthless. Not with decent companies.
"not with decent companies"..
Life's experience isn't something that can be told, I suppose. Good luck with your quixotic quest. Please do keep the NT past the return period, and make B&N happy.
Yes, let's return to the topic of e-petition. Below is a piece that'll let you know your chances.
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/petition/internet.asp
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, we get it. You're not happy. Return your NT and leave the NT forum. We're all just trying to have a friendly discussion here. There's no need to be so negative. Thank you.
Sent from my Nook Tablet using Tapatalk
I've noticed there's alot of new people here. I figured I'd give you guys a place to ask questions that might be common knowledge to the more experienced people here.
So ask away.....
There is just 1GB on the NT for users to contain their own data, right? So, if I got a microSD, can I expand my own data storage?
And after rooted, can I install the apk or download games/apps on the Android market?
P/S: Sorry, my English it not good.
i'm also a new guy. but i can help answer some simple questions to reduce senior guys' work load. if not correct, please point out.
to tritrung's questions, here's my answer:
default 1G data's usage just like TF card, you can store your files on TF card and the 1G internal storage, and it will be 2 folders, not one.
12G storage is used to install apks, which almost no limit for applications.
even if you don't rooted, you can install most programs, but if you want use google market, you need to root the device
ms2003 said:
i'm also a new guy. but i can help answer some simple questions to reduce senior guys' work load. if not correct, please point out.
to tritrung's questions, here's my answer:
default 1G data's usage just like TF card, you can store your files on TF card and the 1G internal storage, and it will be 2 folders, not one.
12G storage is used to install apks, which almost no limit for applications.
even if you don't rooted, you can install most programs, but if you want use google market, you need to root the device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you very much!
By the way, have you used the Nook Tablet? Is its touchscreen sensitive?
The screen is quite responsive...much better than the nook color.
Advice for micro SDHC cards for Nook Color hold the same for Nook Tablet?
I have been doing research on what Micro SDHC cards are best for the NT. From the XDA forum for Nook color, the best cards going are those that are class 4 from San Disk that are 16GB in memory due to the read/write speeds for smalls block random files. (Nook color benefits tremendously from this when custom ROMs are loaded I believe). Link is here for above info:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1005633&highlight=learn+to+love+cm7
With the hardware upgrade for the NT, does the above still hold true? Or can I now start searching for higher class micro SDHC cards (class 6 or even 10)? Planning on getting my NT in the next couple of weeks.
Thanks for your help. It is much appreciated. These XDA forums are great for finding great answers/solutions to problems. Keep up the excellent work.
Regards, Eric in San Diego, CA
Yes pretty much everything in that thread still applies and is pretty sound advice. In general the higher the class the better. I have a class 10 16gb in mine. For just stuff like playing music any class is fine. When you start to get into advanced things like booting roms from sd or apps2sd is where class really starts to matter. One of the important things to remember is the class rating is the minimum speed that model should write. Like with my Sandisk 32gb class 4 alot of people were reporting write speeds around 6-8mbs/sec. Another example is the Sandisk in the thread you linked. Those are around $35 on Bens outlet or I heard newegg has them too. Good luck!
Where do files download to by default? Ive tried to download some pictures and other files via the web browser. The notification area on thr bottom says the files have been downloaded but it wont open them. For instance, with an apk I downloaded from this forum when i click to open it it says "cannot open file".
---------- Post added at 07:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:13 AM ----------
Never mind just found it.
/mnt/media/My Files/My Downloads
I thought i would add this (perhaps) little known tidbit...
Swiping the notification bar from right to left will serve as a back button when one does not appear to be available.
Sent from my BNTV250 using Tapatalk
OK. Lots of newer users here so let me touch on a few things that should well translate from the NC.
1. uSD classes: seems to matter little when using apps. Seldom are the speeds accurate anyway. Use reputable brands. Sandisc one of the best.
2. Never format uSD in your device. Always on your computer. Don't use Windows format. Often creates problems. Use this. Free and never failed me.
3. Root is optional for the NT right now. Certain apps require root access BUT untill a workable recovery scheme is devised I would recommend sideloading. Always unmount before removing. Yes, OTA will work and GApps will update.
4. I've not seen yet a reliable method of re-partitioning the eMMC for the NT (might have missed it if so) therefore sideloading would appear a workable plan for now.
5. If the hurdles can be overcome (and it is early yet, people) to achieve root + recovery many options will open but the NT appears pretty darn good as it is. Patience is a plus.
6. Search function and Google search is your friend. Xda is phenomenal but there are many other forums and many senior members post/read to several.
7. Research what you want to do before doing it. God knows I learned that the hard way myself!
8. An app called App2SD can help you moved apps that will function from the uSD and clear space on the eMMC.
9. Did I mention read and research?
10. One last thing...it's always good form to click "thanks" when assistance is lent.
The senior people on here once were where you are now and are happy to lend a hand. Read the Xda rules and all should be well.
skeeterpro said:
OK. Lots of newer users here so let me touch on a few things that should well translate from the NC.
1. uSD classes: seems to matter little when using apps. Seldom are the speeds accurate anyway. Use reputable brands. Sandisc one of the best.
2. Never format uSD in your device. Always on your computer. Don't use Windows format. Often creates problems. Use this. Free and never failed me.
3. Root is optional for the NT right now. Certain apps require root access BUT untill a workable recovery scheme is devised I would recommend sideloading. Always unmount before removing. Yes, OTA will work and GApps will update.
4. I've not seen yet a reliable method of re-partitioning the eMMC for the NT (might have missed it if so) therefore sideloading would appear a workable plan for now.
5. If the hurdles can be overcome (and it is early yet, people) to achieve root + recovery many options will open but the NT appears pretty darn good as it is. Patience is a plus.
6. Search function and Google search is your friend. Xda is phenomenal but there are many other forums and many senior members post/read to several.
7. Research what you want to do before doing it. God knows I learned that the hard way myself!
8. An app called App2SD can help you moved apps that will function from the uSD and clear space on the eMMC.
9. Did I mention read and research?
10. One last thing...it's always good form to click "thanks" when assistance is lent.
The senior people on here once were where you are now and are happy to lend a hand. Read the Xda rules and all should be well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Theres some very very good things in there. I agree with mostly everything you said.
For someone new I really would only recommend sideloading one thing, and that is the amazon marketplace. Before root and the real market I stumbled across alot of suspicious apk's looking for things, people need to be very careful downloading vaguely worded things on file shares and torrent sites.
The google market is well worth it and really it is fairly easy to root and install. The key to anything here is to follow the instructions exactly, word for word
Also we won't need apps2sd. That was mainly for phones with very small internal storage, even when we can repartion we will be able to choose how much storage for apps we want. As it stands right now I believe we have the largest storage available of any android device by far.
Well I'm as noob as they get so, I just want to know if this will get rooted and run Ice Cream Sandwich. I've been eyeballing that 7" Acer tablet too (A100) but I want to see if this may be a better buy since I have no need of a camera.... I'll be watching this forum closely...
Thanks Skeeterpro for that link to SD Formatter. I can now put away the camera I've been using to format my cards.
Drewmungus said:
Theres some very very good things in there. I agree with mostly everything you said.
For someone new I really would only recommend sideloading one thing, and that is the amazon marketplace. Before root and the real market I stumbled across alot of suspicious apk's looking for things, people need to be very careful downloading vaguely worded things on file shares and torrent sites.
The google market is well worth it and really it is fairly easy to root and install. The key to anything here is to follow the instructions exactly, word for word
Also we won't need apps2sd. That was mainly for phones with very small internal storage, even when we can repartion we will be able to choose how much storage for apps we want. As it stands right now I believe we have the largest storage available of any android device by far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good point, chum. Agree with you on Amazon App store. Also, something to remember to everyone that if you DO install an app from Amazon then later delete the Store App....the programs you installed from them will cease to work until you re-install the Amazon App Store app. Really! I thought that was Urban Legend but others have verified.
AppBrain is another along with Android Market I have used.
"Largest storage of any android device by far"....think I might have to ask you how you mean that. There are many android devices with larger internal (eMMC) storage. Unless I mis-read your statement there, partner.
---------- Post added at 08:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 AM ----------
Tel864 said:
Thanks Skeeterpro for that link to SD Formatter. I can now put away the camera I've been using to format my cards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad to help! That's what we're all here for.
---------- Post added at 08:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:08 AM ----------
KDOG2020 said:
Well I'm as noob as they get so, I just want to know if this will get rooted and run Ice Cream Sandwich. I've been eyeballing that 7" Acer tablet too (A100) but I want to see if this may be a better buy since I have no need of a camera.... I'll be watching this forum closely...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gotta say I have strong doubts we will see an "official release" of ICS to the NT. As I have said (repeatedly) in the KF forums, BN/Amazon have no reason to upgrade the OS for the devices as it doesn't enhance their revenue stream. The fact remains the NT (and KF) is an e-reader that runs android. Just because it's "called" a tablet doesn't necessarily mean it is the same AS a tablet. These devices exists to sell content. That the NC was so modifiable was gravy. BN learned their lesson, it appears, with the NT (sadly). "Nook Old-Timers" will recall it took BN a long time to upgrade the original NC from 2.1 (Eclair) to 2.2 (Froyo) and that was primarily just for Flash support (to sell more BN content).
If (and that's a BIG "if") the current challenges can be overcome, one of the talented Dev might be able to port something but that could be months away.
Side note: had the Acer A100 for a couple weeks before returning it. Horrible battery life (<5 hours), smaller internal eMMC, and lousy viewing angles broke the deal for me for that price point. Have also read that Acer is most likely abandoning the tablet arena so the "promised ICS release in January" may or may not happen. Just my opinion/observations.
skeeterpro said:
"Largest storage of any android device by far"....think I might have to ask you how you mean that. There are many android devices with larger internal (eMMC) storage.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was wrong. I'm used to phones where there is two partitions, one for data and another for user storage. A quick google search showed me that Honeycomb tablets aren't partitioned apps install right next to user files.
Is it possible to mount the sd card right after it boots without having to manually pull it out and sticking it back in?
Some apps that have data on the sdcard fail at reboot because the nt. Does not automatically remount the card. Ex) thumb keyboard
Here's a tip for people new to Android. There are some apps that says "aren't compatible" with the NT (like Voice search) in the Market, and won't let you install. And there are ones you can't even find in the Market for the NT, like TuneIn radio or Fancy widget.
If you have an Android phone or another Android device, you can install those from the market on the phone. And use ES file explorer or Titanium backup to grab the apk file on the phone and sideload to the NT.
To do it with with ES file explorer. Just hit the menu key, select "App manager" and long press on the app and select backup. The apk file will be in sdcard/backups/apps folder. And get that file over by either dropbox, wifi, or usb for sideloading on the NT.
This is better than downloading from unknown sources.
Drewmungus said:
I was wrong. I'm used to phones where there is two partitions, one for data and another for user storage. A quick google search showed me that Honeycomb tablets aren't partitioned apps install right next to user files.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure. Pop one in and go to Settings>Storage and mount the disk. It's just not a good idea to pull a disk while the device is running. Some apps use files from the uSD while the device is running. Pulling it without unmounting can be a problem.
Think coitus interruptus? (Google that and you'll know what I mean!)
nook noob
I got the Nook tablet and rooted it, and I have a few questions...
Why do programs like antutu, dropbox, and the amazon appstore say there is no sdcard? Does the internal memory not work with these, and if so will a micro sd card work with them?
Copy/paste? I cant figure out if it doesn't work or how to do it. Long pressing on text or in a text box doesn't do anything.
Can you change the notification bar to the top like on a standard android device? Using go launcher ex and the notification bar covers the buttons (preferences, settings, etc). Also, can it be the normal slide instead of the pop up style?
Edit: So I tested my micro sd from my atrix and dropbox and antutu benchmark work, and I would assume the amazon appstore would work too. I guess I never really used the phone without that so maybe those apps would fail on that too.
Drewmungus said:
I was wrong. I'm used to phones where there is two partitions, one for data and another for user storage. A quick google search showed me that Honeycomb tablets aren't partitioned apps install right next to user files.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
S'ok dude. The only thing I know is how little I know. Still learnin'...
Rather than clutter up other threads, such as the blocking 1.41 OTA update thread, I propose we put thoughts/frustrations here. As such, here is what I think:
Upon thinking about this more, this is really just the final wedge that B&N put in place to separate the people here, versus the people who are locked into B&N content.
We/I had been hoping that maybe someday they would change their mind and open up the NT so it would act the way the NC would. But, this is a clear message to consumers on how they want to proceed with their product. There will be no unlocked bootloader in the future. There will be no use of outside apps from other markets.
I can't blame them for trying to make money. They put together a nice piece of hardware, and are probably making little to no profit on the hardware. The real bummer here is, for me at least, I would have likely purchased non-apps(see books) from B&N and used the software originally provided by them to view the books. But now with this update, I am basically forced to do the full bloatware removal, and I will get books through other means.
For me, the NT is more a toy for apps and less for reading. Utilizing the B&N app market, which as others have said, is very limited and often pricey, does not make sense. Could I spend some more money and get a full android tablet? Sure, but if I've learned anything from these forums in my short time here, its that it is fun to work together on tweaking something and making it better than what it was originally intended for.
Your thoughts?
I think it's only a matter of time before the devs figure out a way around their "block" of nonBN apps. All they did was take out the ease of sideloading out of the box.
I still haven't gotten a Nook Tablet. I still plan to. I have no doubt that this will be a temporary setback. The locked bootloader is, no doubt, a challenge. Rooting the device after this update, however, shouldn't be nearly as significant an issue, I wouldn't think.
I have the same feelings about the device - it will be a fun toy and useful device and will serve less as an eReader.
For the time being, I will be reading the forums to see what new developments come along in this drama.
CapsLockKey said:
I think it's only a matter of time before the devs figure out a way around their "block" of nonBN apps. All they did was take out the ease of sideloading out of the box.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It sounds like they already have, but the point remains that it was a slap in the face to anyone that has been previously side-loading apps and customizing their NT without rooting.
If you've read some of Indirect's posts before, i believe he debloats most if not all of BN's stuff. Changing the db values worked for the Nook Color, and i assume it's just a matter of hours before one of us work out a quick workaround to rescuing those who got bumped to 1.4.1. I suspect it's gonna be something like this:
1) Using SD card method to restore to 1.4.0
2) Identifying the culprit to push/pull OTA on the NT
3) debloat B&N footprint to minimal so that the NT will be a stable platform to research the bootloader issue.
I'm really surprised so many people start thinking returning their NT because of one minor update. As long as there's one copy of rooted NT among us, i think we'll be able to propogate and beat BN at their game.
I pulled this from the "How to block B&N 1.41 update" thread.
AdamOutler said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=20502705#post20502705
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For my fellow XDA noobs, fear not and don't lose faith in the brilliance of this community.
Here is a fine example(see post above): AdamOutler is amazing and comes through for XDA often like so many others.
Watching him and Loglud give NT bootloader the business in the Development thread is impressive even though I don't fully understand. I see though that they are making progress. They prove that there are many ways to crack the NT nut.
Remain calm and keep reading.
HMG10 said:
It sounds like they already have, but the point remains that it was a slap in the face to anyone that has been previously side-loading apps and customizing their NT without rooting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I took offense at every manufacturer that has "slapped the face" of their market, I wouldn't own anything. I would live in the woods because the people that made my house cut corners to line their pockets. My shingles wouldn't be prematurely failing. I would have sold my Prius immediately when I found out about the cover-up of some very important safety information. I would start a class-action suit over the burst capacitors on my motherboard due to the manufacturer using questionable sources for their electronics. I would never buy a toy for my kids because most are made in China using questionable labor tactics.
If people choose to take this personally, fine. Return your devices. Please also take stock of what you own and what pains you go through daily because capitalism encourages these behaviors. Then, sit back and ponder how you, as a consumer, contribute to the issue.
Am I unhappy about the decision? Yes. I'd rather thumb my nose at B&N by being patient and using whatever new tricks are up people's sleeves to use the device in a way "I'm not supposed to be able to" than not even buying one. Does this make me a hypocrite by making a rationalization to own a device while still supporting the very practices that perturb me? Perhaps.
Moved my thoughts from the other thread:
I think B&N is going to be surprised at the number of returned NT's- I'm betting far beyond their 3% estimate. 3% is probably people like on this site, average/above average tech users. Well beyond that are many others who buy NTs based on a recommend from the 3%, who then just follow the instructions for sideloading/rooting.
Personally, I've recommended the NT to about 4 other people who bought as Christmas presents. If there will be a constant worry for them about sneaky updates wrecking their NT's, my only advice will be to return while they can and get something else. I recommended based on the NT's ONLY real advantages- that it can be rooted and sideloaded. It sucks, and now I regret recommending this, and from now on I won't. I don't mind being responsible for the NT I bought my wife for Christmas, but not anyone else's.
In the end, B&N and others who go this crazy locked down route will lose- more and more people are tech savvy enough to know they're getting the shaft. B&N needs to develop a better app store, like Amazon. People willingly put Amazon's app store on their devices, including the Nook. I wonder how many KF users willingly put B&N crap on their devices?
They think they can just force people into a crappy walled garden like they are Apple, but with a subpar app store, charging even for otherwise free apps. It's not gonna work, and unfortunately the NT will eventually sink in a sea of better tablets that aren't locked down.
I'm not so sure that people will be returning their NTs with this update. Most of us have had ours far past the two week return period. Even if we returned them, it would be for store credit.
sonicdh said:
I'm not so sure that people will be returning their NTs with this update. Most of us have had ours far past the two week return period. Even if we returned them, it would be for store credit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
return window for "holiday" purchases has been extended to 01/31/12 if purchased between 11/14 and 12/31.
is it really worth returning it for a little reason like this? Heck, even Amazon have done the same thing in the past couple days. Granted you have the option of flashing a new ROM onto the KF but what about the people who have just bought it and it comes with the new FW or they haven't seen the post on the new FW?
I agree with most saying that B&N are doing what is best for them, which makes sense in a business aspect and everyone who bought this for a cheap colour e-reader have no concept about it. We get upset, someone finds a way to fix it, we move on to something else.
I too considered returning mine but A) it won't do me any good B ) Other "cheaper" tablet developers seem to be doing the same thing.
Final thought - Might as well keep it and patiently wait for something to change from here.
Being a total noob to all things android and not a very adept at computers, I was so happy to compare the Nook Tablet and the kindle fire side by side. I picked the nook tab because I saw that I could side load all the kindle book store and Amazon apps to the Tab. Also because of the hardware improvements.
Now I feel like I've been baited and switched. I do believe that I will be returning the Nook Tablet I have purchased. Before I do, I have a few questions. Please excuse my ignorance.
1. where do I go to buy the refurbished nook colors for 130.00 ?
2. If I buy an upgraded nook color, will I be able to load the kindle bookstore and my kindle books on to it?
3. Will I have access to sideloading all the things I want on the nook color?
4. How do I save the content I now have to move over to the nook color?
5. Will the 16gig SD card I bought for the nook tablet work on the nook color?
If all these things can be done with the nook color, then I must vote with my wallet and return my tablet if for no other reason than principle. I purchased a product from a company that performed a certain way and I wake up and find they have disabled the functions that mattered to me the most. I didn't rent or lease the product. I purchased it. It should be mine to use or modify as I please.
With my needs, it appears that the nook color will do me just fine. I don't plan on watching movies or TV on it.
As others have noted, my frustration is this... I bought (3 in total) and recommended several others buy over things like the Fire because one could sideload without rooting.
I'll be the first to state that I am perfectly content rooting my own NT (as I did for my NC previously), but I have two other NTs in my household as well. It is neither practical nor desirable to have to root all three and maintain all three for less savvy users who want software not available in the BN store.
The capability to sideload made the selection of the NT an easy choice. Blocking sideloading without rooting makes the choice to return two - if not all three - an easy choice as well.
I hope this helps with your questions.
1. where do I go to buy the refurbished nook colors for 130.00 ?
Ebay
Google Search
2. If I buy an upgraded nook color, will I be able to load the kindle bookstore and my kindle books on to it?
No. It has 1.41.
Go to the "Nook Tablet Android Development - [Stock Firmware]Restore Barnes & Nobel Nook 1.4.0 from SDCard" to understand how to undo.
3. Will I have access to sideloading all the things I want on the nook color?
Only with a rooted 1.4 or custom rom. Unsure how 1.41 might impact a custom rom or if this would even be an issue for custom rom.
4. How do I save the content I now have to move over to the nook color?
SD card and/or Dropbox or some other way to access later.
5. Will the 16gig SD card I bought for the nook tablet work on the nook color?
Yes from what I have read.
PlacidCat said:
I still haven't gotten a Nook Tablet. I still plan to. I have no doubt that this will be a temporary setback. The locked bootloader is, no doubt, a challenge. Rooting the device after this update, however, shouldn't be nearly as significant an issue, I wouldn't think.
I have the same feelings about the device - it will be a fun toy and useful device and will serve less as an eReader.
For the time being, I will be reading the forums to see what new developments come along in this drama.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This update demonstrates that B&N is openly hostile to the dev community. Most manufacturers (even Apple!) take a laissez faire approach to outside development - they don't go out of their way to help, but they also don't go out of their way to break things. Kindle Fire updates, for instance, are a minor inconvenience for rooters, and rerooting is very easy.
A lot of people were willing to live with the locked bootloader because, in the end, you can still achieve most of what you want simply through sideloading. All the bootloader really curtails are those ugly themes that rom chefs seem to love so much. But stopping sideloading? Ugh, no way.
By doing this, B&N has proven that they are not happy with sideloading and I believe it is within their power to disable it permanently. And even if it is always possible to circumvent, you'll see the community here get smaller and smaller until there aren't enough people willing to bother.
So I would say do not get a Nook Tablet if you are not happy with using the pure stock experience without sideloading.
Gotta vent too. Blocking sideloading is a total f u in our faces. We also can't root it with ZergRush. What do we have left? Total waste of hardware if you lock it down like this. Might as well get the simple touch ereader. You can't call it a tablet if it can't do tablet things!
If it's going to affect their revenue stream, they're going to look for a way to block it. there's no getting around it. they don't have the ecosystem that Amazon has, so they can't afford to have people go elsewhere for some of the more mainstream apps that they have in their store.
the solution to that it that B&N needs to aggressively expand their app store and price at least close to the Android Market prices.
at least then, there's a reasonable retort, despite how we may feel. still, I paid for the device, I shouldn't have them decide how I should be able to use it.
Mama Luigi said:
<SNIP>
So I would say do not get a Nook Tablet if you are not happy with using the pure stock experience without sideloading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I said, I'm waiting and watching. My "plan to" is not 100% firm. I'll leave it to the devs to decide if they want to stick with this or not and base my decision on their progress, not what people are saying now in frustration. There are still ways around the issue and OTA updates appear to be (hopefully) already circumvented if people installed Gapps as part of the basic root procedure outlined on this forum.
To simply say "do not get... unless you want stock" is quite premature. Again, I have bigger worries on my mind - if Toyota was late on reporting a safety issue that could have affected my life and my family members', I have far more reason to turn away in disgust. Will I turn away from a reading device that STILL offers a tablet experience if people follow directions just because of B&N's asshattery? No.
JoeM01 said:
If it's going to affect their revenue stream, they're going to look for a way to block it. there's no getting around it. they don't have the ecosystem that Amazon has, so they can't afford to have people go elsewhere for some of the more mainstream apps that they have in their store.
the solution to that it that B&N needs to aggressively expand their app store and price at least close to the Android Market prices.
at least then, there's a reasonable retort, despite how we may feel. still, I paid for the device, I shouldn't have them decide how I should be able to use it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Personally, I don't like being locked into a B&N app store. For my next tablet/phone/android device, it won't necessarily be a nook, but it will run android, therefore google market is still the best bet. Google market is there and established. B&N should focus on making profits via ebooks, magazines and other media.
Is the extended return policy specific to purchases at the B&N stores? I purchased mine at Best Buy.
I bought a nook tablet on craigslist and well i cant register it.. i called B&N its blacklisted. I been doing all the research I can think of to see if i can still use it jailbroken as this is a gift for my 14 year old son for christmas. If anyone can advice me or redirect me in the right direction that would be great. Its a NOOK Tablet with version 1.4.1. Im hoping this thing is not a paperweight now.
I have a microsd card ready to do everything I need.
Well if you want to use it with the stock rom, just as a reader, you have contact to contact the previous store or owner and ask it to deregister the NT from the B&N web page so you will be able to register it under your account.
If not you can make an micro sd bootable with CM10 and use the NT as a tablet.
Check the developer section there are some threads about hkw to create a bootae sd card and how to install CM10 in internal memory, I cannot post links from my phone sorry.
Good luck.
Sent fr om my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
This is why I'm glad I bought mine from the store using my brother's ex's employee discount. Caveat emptor.
Your best bet is to contact B&N abut it.
Sent from Spaceball One.
Initially I would contact who you bought it from and let them know it was reported stolen and it is blacklisted. If not an option at this point eat the loss or load CM10 on it. Once you load CM10 B&N is out of the picture and it functions essentially like a Nexus(relax people I said LIKE a Nexus ). There are plenty of threads telling you HOW to install CM10. Use the search button or hell just go through the forums. In the future all questions need to be posted in Q&A also.
Do you mean that you can't get off the initial registration page? There was a way to get past that. Look in Google for nook tablet out of the box experience. It bypasses the registration screen but I don't think you can use the store.
get bootable cwm and flash cyanogenmod. Way better IMO
The only near official info from Verizon so far appears to be to CNET, which basically said, "We (VZW) have no current information on a 32GB model". That of course is not a confirmation that they will or will not, but considering AT&T has a 32GB and even tweeted the week of their launch they would- Seems anecdotally bad for a VZW 32GB.
Seems if we do not keep this issue "alive" in some manner and VZW has no current plans, they probably never will.
Get an SD card. That's what they're for.
Sent from my Droid DNA
Based on the device you have only has 11gb out of box and no sd, seems you might not use a bunch of apps. Especially not the newer 3d games that take 2gb of storage.
Apps can not go on the sd card, so not an applicable option for some people. What MOS are you? I was an 0331.
I was tempted to wait for the 32 but was scared that by the time it got released (if ever) Verizon would have patched the boot loader exploit. Not worth the gamble for me.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
Hey guys, sign the petition I have in my signature
rushless said:
Based on the device you have only has 11gb out of box and no sd, seems you might not use a bunch of apps. Especially not the newer 3d games that take 2gb of storage.
Apps can not go on the sd card, so not an applicable option for some people. What MOS are you? I was an 0331.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can install apps to the SD card, and most games allow you to save all of that extra data to the SD.
I'm a 7599 right now.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
i think not
TheBiles said:
You can install apps to the SD card, and most games allow you to save all of that extra data to the SD.
I'm a 7599 right now.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can not install or move data with the S4, nor any Jellybean OS device. Android got rid of the option. Some devs offer the ability to install data to the card, but most do not due to customer complaints when the app messes up (swapping cards is example how apps mess up and users do not make the connection why). No conjecture on my part, but one of several actual Android team reasons why the feature was removed. The main reason was they hated the feature to begin with.
You can root, but the results with virtual mounting apps have been mixed, depending on the apps.
rushless said:
You can not install or move data with the S4, nor any Jellybean OS device. Android got rid of the option. Some devs offer the ability to install data to the card, but most do not due to customer complaints when the app messes up (swapping cards is example how apps mess up and users do not make the connection why). No conjecture on my part, but one of several actual Android team reasons why the feature was removed. The main reason was they hated the feature to begin with.
You can root, but the results with virtual mounting apps have been mixed, depending on the apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, today I learned. I never realized they actually removed this feature because I didn't actually use it.
Understandable considering your device Even Samsung was saying that and they should know better.
I think that that's the problem of everyone. Most of those upgrading to S4 are coming from S2. They are saying: "F**k, I'm buying the 16gb because that's enough space and I can move the apps to the sdcard". Most of S2 users are still running on 4.0
I think in a few months there will be more than expected complaints and customers will point out that Samsung and Verizon CSR/Sales misled that you can put apps on sd.
It makes no sense not to offer larger models for this device. If you will not use the storage buy the 16, and buy the 32 if you will. Verizon are being arrogant a$$e$ for at least not giving a public answer. Verizon have not responded to customer or media inquiries beyond a generic, "We have no current information". This same lame answer is from their Sales & Marketing department. The very people that WOULD know.
I guess a, "We are not going to carry it, because we are milking customers at the same price point for a two year as the 32 model last year" is too honest.
Make your voice heard
http://aboutus.verizonwireless.com/leadership/executive/profiles/Tami_Erwin.html
Verizon Wireless Vice President and Chief Marketing Officer
I have sent a note and others as well last week, but no response. Not even a generic one. Same link.
good luck to you guys hoping for the 32gb version. my 16gb came with 9.8gb of device storage available. i've got about 70 of the downloaded apps i normally use installed and still have 7.7gb of internal memory free. admittedly i don't use my s4 for gaming, that's what the n7 is for. i do, however, have over 30gb of media and docs loaded up to my 64gb sd card. hopefully they come out with higher capacity sd cards since that's where i'll see the crunch sooner. either way very nice device, the s4 is. and i'm already rooted!
rushless said:
I have sent a note and others as well last week, but no response. Not even a generic one. Same link.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here. Some sort of reply would be a nice thing just to confirm the message got somewhere. Hopefully someone is seeing the messages and figured customer feedback is never a bad thing.
when i found this post. i thought i would find my answer . i guess know one knows.
The ones that do, appear too arrogant to bother saying, in spite of requests for an answer.
This is the reply I got when inquiring about the 32gb S4 using the link listed above.
Your inquiry would need to be directed to the manufacturer.* You may contact Samsung at 1-888-987-4357.* Samsung makes the decisions on what devices and the timeframes in which they are released.
*
Regards,
*
Shenika Frederick
Executive Office
Verizon Wireless
I guess they are just passing the buck and blaming Samsung.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
There are no current plans for a 32gb model from Verizon. That being said, if they do release a 32gb version it will be months from now as to make sure they get sales for the 16gb now. This is common practice for years. Same goes for different colors and such.
Officially no plans to release a 32gb version. Doesn't mean there won;t be one down the road.