I'm not a programmer. Actually starting school for programming in a month, but what makes it hard for Devs to unlock them selves?
Sent from my ADR6300 using xda premium
128-bit encryption key
Which is quite interesting. I am guessing they did it to prevent people from bricking their systems and returning them when in fact they are probably getting more returns now than they would have had the bootloader not been encrypted.
yup, by now the devs would probably have custom roms fixing all the issues...
fuzzer said:
yup, by now the devs would probably have custom roms fixing all the issues...
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+1(0 char)
fuzzer said:
128-bit encryption key
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Click to collapse
this means there are 128 ^2 possible combinations to test before finding the one for your device. This amount of tries would take years to brute force (trying every single one till you found it) even on today's most powerful super computers.
Paris6906 said:
this means there are 128 ^2 possible combinations to test before finding the one for your device. This amount of tries would take years to brute force (trying every single one till you found it) even on today's most powerful super computers.
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Click to collapse
So close. It's actually 2^128. That's two to the power of one-hundred twenty eight.
Question, when you unlock the bootloader your warranty becomes void. Will there be a way to re-lock for warranty purposes?
hashish16 said:
Question, when you unlock the bootloader your warranty becomes void. Will there be a way to re-lock for warranty purposes?
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Click to collapse
no one is really going to know how it all works for asus until asus releases their tool with the specifics on everything.
but as far as the law goes, if whatever you need warranty work for has nothing to do with you loading custom roms or messing with the kernel etc, you should have no problem sending it in for warranted repairs.
ie, the power button is broken or the screen dies
Rooting can become illegal soon
But once your unlocked warranty void forever because they track serial
tylermaciaszek said:
Rooting can become illegal soon
But once your unlocked warranty void forever because they track serial
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I read that is what apple is doing and they are close to passing the bill. Its ridiculous, rooting is not all about pirating, its mostly for performance.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
Evo_Shift said:
Which is quite interesting. I am guessing they did it to prevent people from bricking their systems and returning them when in fact they are probably getting more returns now than they would have had the bootloader not been encrypted.
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Click to collapse
IIRC Asus did explicitly say that it was nVidia forcing them to lock the bootloader on the Prime. This could of course be BS, but after such a public statement saying this, nVidia would have gone apesh*t if it was not the truth.
It's all to do with the Tegra3 and the Prime being basically a prototype released only for mass beta testing. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it. Still love my Prime though.
tylermaciaszek said:
Rooting can become illegal soon
But once your unlocked warranty void forever because they track serial
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't have to be! It is not a bill, but an exemption to the DMCA. If we can show our support by contacting the Copyright office and showing them that jailbreaking/rooting is beneficial, they can extend the exemption. The EFF has more info on how to contact the Copyright office and how to request that other electronics be included (did you know that tablets are NOT covered in the exemption?) like consoles, tablets, and more.
https://www.eff.org/pages/jailbreaking-not-crime-tell-copyright-office-free-your-devices
XDA has 337,000 active members. This effects all of us. Let them know it should not be illegal to use your electronics however you wish!
It does not affect ALL of us by any means, however, I have already shown my support by donating to the EFF. It's disgusting that a device that you have paid your hard earned cash for can be ruled over with an iron fist as though you are simply renting it for the duration of it's life....
.... Oh that business model sounds familiar.
Doktaphex said:
It does not affect ALL of us by any means...
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I assume that if you are on here, you are either a dev or get support from a dev. In either case, making rooting illegal again would give manufacturers cause to turn a deaf ear to us, making it more difficult to impossible to work with these devices and in turn help others. Even if you have never rooted a phone or even heard of jailbreaking, you would still (indirectly, yes) be affected, since fewer will want to put themselves in that position.
Devs will usually find a way around these locks, but the level of support will not be there as they will think twice about breaking the law (in the US at least).
silentheero said:
I assume that if you are on here, you are either a dev or get support from a dev. In either case, making rooting illegal again would give manufacturers cause to turn a deaf ear to us, making it more difficult to impossible to work with these devices and in turn help others. Even if you have never rooted a phone or even heard of jailbreaking, you would still (indirectly, yes) be affected, since fewer will want to put themselves in that position.
Devs will usually find a way around these locks, but the level of support will not be there as they will think twice about breaking the law (in the US at least).
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Click to collapse
I concede, you make a very good point. I was referring to the fact that I am in the UK and therefore it does not DIRECTLY affect me, but again, you ARE right.
Doktaphex said:
I concede, you make a very good point. I was referring to the fact that I am in the UK and therefore it does not DIRECTLY affect me, but again, you ARE right.
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Thank you for supporting the EFF! All I can do at the moment is to support by getting people motivated.
monkey10120 said:
I read that is what apple is doing and they are close to passing the bill. Its ridiculous, rooting is not all about pirating, its mostly for performance.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
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Click to collapse
Rooting can be considered as illegal as it uses hacking methods, and so break the software that belongs to the company made the device, even if the software is in majority open source, there are always closed parts that are concern by trading laws.
And be precise please, the'illegal' rooting stuff is ONLY concerning USA.
Plenty of places with some very smart devs where rooting will never become illegal. Russia as an example, or China (where the exemption would only apply to US built product). If some countries want to kill off their engineering and software development communities, plenty of other places in the world will be only too happy to step in and take over.
Correct me if I'm wrong but, android is open source. So then there's no copyright infringement unless you hack the apps or something. IOS on the other hand isn't open source so jailbreaking it could be seen as infringing. But I still disagree that rooting/ jailbreaking should be illegal.
Sent from my DROIDX using xda premium
Related
Yeah, I'm not entering my name anywhere. Thanks anyway, HTC. Besides, AlphaRev and Unrevoked already did your job for you.
Since our last update, many of you have asked how the bootloader unlocking process will actually work, and in particular why HTC's most recently released devices still have a locked bootloader. Rest assured we're making progress toward our goal to roll out the first software updates in August to support unlocking for the global HTC Sensation, followed soon by the HTC Sensation 4G on T-Mobile and the HTC EVO 3D on Sprint. Because unlocking the bootloader provides extensive control over the device and modifications may cause operation, security and experience issues, new devices will continue to ship locked but will support user-initiated unlocking using a new Web-based tool.
So how will this work? The Web tool, which will launch this month, requires that you register an account with a valid e-mail address and accept legal disclaimers that unlocking may void all or parts of your warranty. Then plug in your phone to a computer with the Android SDK loaded to retrieve a device identifier token, which you can then enter into the Web tool to receive a unique unlock key via e-mail. Finally, apply the key to your device and unlocking will be initiated on your phone.
We're excited to bring bootloader unlocking to developers and enthusiasts, and we feel this new Web tool will meet your needs and continue to provide customers with the best experience. Thanks to the community for supporting these efforts!
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https://www.facebook.com/note.php?saved&¬e_id=10150305151453084&id=101063233083
I figured they would want a way to know exactly which phones were unlocked. i'll stick with alpha revs method.
From my mikmikoptimized shooter!
blackroseMD1 said:
Yeah, I'm not entering my name anywhere. Thanks anyway, HTC. Besides, AlphaRev and Unrevoked already did your job for you.
https://www.facebook.com/note.php?saved&¬e_id=10150305151453084&id=101063233083
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wow. some actual clarity on what they plan to do.
nice to see an update !
but for the evo3d is a bit late
Lmao,actually according to their explanation,their method sounds just like AlpharevX.It would be hilarious if alpharevX sold their method to HTC.
That blows. They couldn't just ship the damn thing unlocked.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
ktulu909 said:
Lmao,actually according to their explanation,their method sounds just like AlpharevX.It would be hilarious if alpharevX sold their method to HTC.
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Click to collapse
Well, if he did I hope he didn't sell them the serial numbers of the ones already unlocked jk
I guess it all makes sense (har har).
If it makes the carriers happy, who cares if this is how they do it? I'm sure whenever they release a bootloader unlocker someone on XDA will take it and make it so you can do it without the email/key. We're gonna come out ahead either way.
Well i guess now they will know when we unlock our bootloader and warranty I don't care since I don't use the warranty anyways
If you don't have an Evo3d well you don't have an Evo3d
I'd be curious to know from Google, Sprint and Samsung how many problems they have from the NexusS4G being very easily unlockable...I doubt it's very many...and HTC should suck on that.
I don't know if that's as much of a fair comparison - with the Nexus being near stock I wouldn't expect them to be flashed/bricked nearly as much as with the Evo4G.
The OG Evo gained so much from flashing - features, kernels, whole new versions of sense. And it had so many updates over the life of the phone, making for different rooting methods and having people flash their phones many many times, making it one of if not the most developed phone we have seen.
I'm quite certain the brick count on those were some of the highest anyone's ever seen as well. That's after all the returns from dead pixels, bad charging ports, and what have you. You can understand a carrier/manufacturer's wishing to prevent all that.
By the same token, it feels like HTC benefits greatly from the development community, perhaps using a lot of what they see here in their own updates (maybe even waiting for people to fix their bugs). They definitely see value in unlocking phones, which I guess we should be happy about.
As long as HTC keeps their unlocked policy I will remain a loyal customer.
nhutpham said:
I don't know if that's as much of a fair comparison - with the Nexus being near stock I wouldn't expect them to be flashed/bricked nearly as much as with the Evo4G.
The OG Evo gained so much from flashing - features, kernels, whole new versions of sense. And it had so many updates over the life of the phone, making for different rooting methods and having people flash their phones many many times, making it one of if not the most developed phone we have seen.
I'm quite certain the brick count on those were some of the highest anyone's ever seen as well. That's after all the returns from dead pixels, bad charging ports, and what have you. You can understand a carrier/manufacturer's wishing to prevent all that.
By the same token, it feels like HTC benefits greatly from the development community, perhaps using a lot of what they see here in their own updates (maybe even waiting for people to fix their bugs). They definitely see value in unlocking phones, which I guess we should be happy about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Were there that many bricked E4G's? I don't recall hearing about that many of them in my tenure on the forum...admittedly I barely spent any time in General that year as Development was bustling from before day 1.
...but, per capita I doubt the brick-count was that far off the average for any other popular phone worth rooting. God knows I did horrible things to mine and never even had to fix it via adb/fastboot.... it was a very popular phone even among the average joe.
I know that HTC benefits greatly from the dev community. Where do you think they got the FPS-unlock from? Among other things. That's how open source works and is designed to work. That's also why myself and others were so shocked with the whole 'locking' fiasco.
...now, aside from our own speculation about how high the brick rate may or may not have been why not speculate about something more productive: How LOW the brick rate could be if they utilized eMMC's secure-write technology to make a 'mega-recovery' partition that would be locked and even WE wouldn't want to unlock it....that could be used in a worst case scenario to fully restore a phone to stock...to enable the unlocking that WE want and reduce the (understandable) liability of allowing full control that they want. We get unlock, they get insulation from liability of allowing such a feature (that most people STILL wouldn't know about or care about)....why don't they do that? eMMC makes that trivial to implement (as we found out the hard way)...neglecting the fact that they could have utilized any number of simpler technologies to accomplish the same thing even before eMMC...why not?
That's a topic for further speculation (get your tinfoil hats ready), but, why don't they do that? Play both sides of the field. No voided warranties, no brick returns, no pissed off modders....win win win, right? The carrier doesn't want that? Cool, let us know, we'll flock to the carrier that allows it...something tells me Sprint would be that underdog...
ktulu909 said:
Lmao,actually according to their explanation,their method sounds just like AlpharevX.It would be hilarious if alpharevX sold their method to HTC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not at all like what AlphaRevX did. The only reason they had the serial number check was because it was in Beta so they could shut down their serial generator and stop people using their unlock if they found a problem with it.
This HTC method makes sense, and I think it's fair. Their tool only needs to hook up to your phone to get the device identifier token, the unlock actually happens on the phone itself. This way HTC gets a list of unlocked phones so when people go for support you can't lie to them that your phone was unlocked, but people can have day one unlocks on any phone from HTC going forward.
So now HTC wants to know who exactly is unlocking there phones??
Nice try you sneaky basterds
What's wrong with them knowing if you're unlocked? They have to do that... Otherwise insurance companies would get upset. This is legit and it if people screw their phones up due to user error while unlocked then they shouldn't be able to file a claim.
This also let's them see just how many people want to be unlocked so they don't try and take it away from us again
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App
Rippley05 said:
What's wrong with them knowing if you're unlocked? They have to do that... Otherwise insurance companies would get upset. This is legit and it if people screw their phones up due to user error while unlocked then they shouldn't be able to file a claim.
This also let's them see just how many people want to be unlocked so they don't try and take it away from us again
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah....I dunno. They could (relatively) easily make the phones nearly brick-proof (see my above post) yet they do not. Why? I'm almost irritated by all of the altruistic sentiment for 'doing the right thing'....not because of the altruism, I actually find that refreshing and endearing. It's more because they could take steps to nearly eliminate the potential for bricking (and in doing so insulate the insurance company from liability...making that a moot point), but that people are defending a position that needn't exist.
nhutpham said:
i guess it all makes sense (har har).
If it makes the carriers happy, who cares if this is how they do it? I'm sure whenever they release a bootloader unlocker someone on xda will take it and make it so you can do it without the email/key. We're gonna come out ahead either way.
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+1000000000
Haha, sounds exactly how alpharev did it...hmm, maybe they tore it out of alpharevs hands, i dont know, sounds fishy.
daneurysm said:
yeah....I dunno. They could (relatively) easily make the phones nearly brick-proof (see my above post) yet they do not. Why? I'm almost irritated by all of the altruistic sentiment for 'doing the right thing'....not because of the altruism, I actually find that refreshing and endearing. It's more because they could take steps to nearly eliminate the potential for bricking (and in doing so insulate the insurance company from liability...making that a moot point), but that people are defending a position that needn't exist.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You don't know why they're doing it. Maybe they wanna track the people that abuse the crap out of wireless tether... Maybe it's for other reasons. Who cares, they are unlocking it for us and that's all that matters. I have nothing to hide when I root so I care less. If you're upset about it then there are other options.
People are getting exactly what they wanted and they still find a reason to cry... Get over it already
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App
Need to take my Atrix in for warranty purpose. A few methods have been discussed and I'm looking for the safest means possible. Any opinion's on this? I leaning towards the SBF method using Moto's stock 2.3.4 via RSD Lite.
Sounds like having your cake and eating it too.. You seen all the warnings saying your void if you unlock right? Here is another thread about "relocking" (hiding "unlocked" is not relocking btw, relocking is impossible.) also there are many threads on this topic, feel free to search.
WiredPirate said:
Sounds like having your cake and eating it too.. You seen all the warnings saying your void if you unlock right? Here is another thread about "relocking" (hiding "unlocked" is not relocking btw, relocking is impossible.) also there are many threads on this topic, feel free to search.
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Click to collapse
Dude why do you have to be such a DB all the time, i'v looked around these posts for about 30 min and i have seen you respond with same kind of Jack A remarks everytime. Were here for help not to be ridiculed.
Please don't take this the wrong way but the dev community is actively trying to get all manufacturers to allow for unlocked bootloaders and one of the main things most of us are willing to forfeit is our warranties so when someone decides to voluntarily do something that is known to void the warranty and then try to trick the manufacturer into fixing their phone under said warranty it hurts our argument. We all made the choice when we unlocked our phones so it is only fair that we take responsibility for our decisions.
Hopefully, in the future we can come to an agreement with manufacturers that there is an "opt-in" option for unlocking our phones and as long as we stay within the confines of the agreement then we can still have the option to have the phone serviced for physical defects.
kyleallen5000 said:
Dude why do you have to be such a DB all the time, i'v looked around these posts for about 30 min and i have seen you respond with same kind of Jack A remarks everytime. Were here for help not to be ridiculed.
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live4nyy said:
Please don't take this the wrong way but the dev community is actively trying to get all manufacturers to allow for unlocked bootloaders and one of the main things most of us are willing to forfeit is our warranties so when someone decides to voluntarily do something that is known to void the warranty and then try to trick the manufacturer into fixing their phone under said warranty it hurts our argument. We all made the choice when we unlocked our phones so it is only fair that we take responsibility for our decisions.
Hopefully, in the future we can come to an agreement with manufacturers that there is an "opt-in" option for unlocking our phones and as long as we stay within the confines of the agreement then we can still have the option to have the phone serviced for physical defects.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm going to have to second this. as much as i dislike the "unlocked" at the top of my screen i made this choice. little did i know that it would actually say this when done:-( however rooting, rom, bootloader unlock, other mods done by us, unfortunately void our warranty.
however.... if you wanted a device that you could unlock bootloader or what not. you should have went with an inspire as you can turn s-on after being s-off and flash back to stock firmware. therefore in essence. not be hurting the valiant efforts of our communtiy to get the manufacturers to allow us more exploration.
I do feel your pain, yet like stated in every thread for rooting and romming and bootloader..... YOUR WARRANTY IS NOW VOID!!!
SErooted said:
I'm going to have to second this. as much as i dislike the "unlocked" at the top of my screen i made this choice. little did i know that it would actually say this when done:-( however rooting, rom, bootloader unlock, other mods done by us, unfortunately void our warranty.
however.... if you wanted a device that you could unlock bootloader or what not. you should have went with an inspire as you can turn s-on after being s-off and flash back to stock firmware. therefore in essence. not be hurting the valiant efforts of our communtiy to get the manufacturers to allow us more exploration.
I do feel your pain, yet like stated in every thread for rooting and romming and bootloader..... YOUR WARRANTY IS NOW VOID!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It actual says may void warranty. I think until there is some agreement made, we don't have any rules regarding this. I mean unlocking the bootloader doesn't make some of the defects happen. As an American with consumer rights, I will hold them responsible, but only if not directly from my mingling. Also I have read that moto has fixed phones with unlocked bootloaders.
Sent from my MB860 using xda premium
Sass86 said:
It actual says may void warranty.
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Click to collapse
+1
"May" is not synonymous with "will." People continue to misinterpret those terms.
If unlocking the BL absolutely voided your warranty, they would have indicated as such with a term that meant "will."
I stand corrected. The point is valid.... "may" and "will" are different words and meanings.
However most times when the statement made by a corporation that includes "may" or "might" means you are out of luck.
Not to argue, because I do agree with you but in legal terms the word "may" does not mean the same thing as the normal definition.
may v. a choice to act or not, or a promise of a possibility, as distinguished from "shall" which makes it imperative. 2) in statutes, and sometimes in contracts, the word "may" must be read in context to determine if it means an act is optional or mandatory, for it may be an imperative. The same careful analysis must be made of the word "shall." Non-lawyers tend to see the word "may" and think they have a choice or are excused from complying with some statutory provision or regulation.
The underlined part highlights how they would see it as it implies you are making the choice to void your warranty.
Now, this is how I see it because I tend to think most definitions regarding legal terms is in place to protect companies and not consumers so if someone could elaborate and prove me wrong, I invite it with open mind.
magecca said:
+1
"May" is not synonymous with "will." People continue to misinterpret those terms.
If unlocking the BL absolutely voided your warranty, they would have indicated as such with a term that meant "will."
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Click to collapse
kyleallen5000 said:
Dude why do you have to be such a DB all the time, i'v looked around these posts for about 30 min and i have seen you respond with same kind of Jack A remarks everytime. Were here for help not to be ridiculed.
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Click to collapse
Lol, you read all my other posts about this in the past 30 minute and still dont understand you voided your warrenty DA!? I dont care if you do or dont get service for your voided phone, and Im not gonna argue about the word may. I dont care. What i do care about is checking XDA without seeing the same GD threads over and Fing over again because DAs like you refuse to use the Fing search button. SMC.
lol funny arguments gotta love em. For one hiding the Unlock really doesn't matter considering I have returned one Atrix to where I bought it and they didn't care. Secondly Motorola has the "Choice" to deny you warranty repairs but they MAY accept the warranty repair and third they could always, if the phone was returned, reflash the bootloader to Lock it again. Plan and simple easy answer is it is ultimately up to Motorola if they want to repair it or not once it is unlocked.
I'm not talking about personal experience, it's about assuming responsibility for your actions. My whole point is accountability, there are people all the time trying to take advantage of the system and end up ruining it for everyone else. Society is fostering an entire generation of vain and spoiled derelicts.
You are right though, it could all come down to who you run into while trying to have your phone repaired.
malickie said:
lol funny arguments gotta love em. For one hiding the Unlock really doesn't matter considering I have returned one Atrix to where I bought it and they didn't care. Secondly Motorola has the "Choice" to deny you warranty repairs but they MAY accept the warranty repair and third they could always, if the phone was returned, reflash the bootloader to Lock it again. Plan and simple easy answer is it is ultimately up to Motorola if they want to repair it or not once it is unlocked.
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Click to collapse
live4nyy said:
I'm not talking about personal experience, it's about assuming responsibility for your actions. My whole point is accountability, there are people all the time trying to take advantage of the system and end up ruining it for everyone else. Society is fostering an entire generation of vain and spoiled derelicts.
You are right though, it could all come down to who you run into while trying to have your phone repaired.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True more or less. Society is propagating the problem but it really starts with the way the government is running things as a whole. Not saying it's right but until something changes in society and the government it's just all down hill. Also if you look deeper banks have a Major role as well. Anyway enough on off topic issue's there yea I do believe it is ultimately up to Motorola whether they will repair the device or not. I would assume they would probably deny the repair if it had something to do with the actual Software of the phone considering you messed with it, hardware probably different considering software usually doesn't blow up hardware.
Thread about how to return phone after voiding warranty, contents:
some name calling, discussion about morality, the meaning of the word "may", society, laws, government, companies
to TS,
try 'accidentally' sinking your Atrix in the ocean for a minute, and then claim your warranty?
or try 2 cover it with your thumb while booting?
to others,
help TS, (like me?), don't condemn everything about what he had done in the past.
maybe, he's your friend next door, a helping hand's neighbor?
SErooted said:
however rooting, rom, bootloader unlock, other mods done by us, unfortunately void our warranty.
however.... if you wanted a device that you could unlock bootloader or what not. you should have went with an inspire as you can turn s-on after being s-off and flash back to stock firmware. therefore in essence. not be hurting the valiant efforts of our communtiy to get the manufacturers to allow us more exploration.
I do feel your pain, yet like stated in every thread for rooting and romming and bootloader..... YOUR WARRANTY IS NOW VOID!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please show me where it states all these things, (rooting, ROMs', bootloader unlock, and 'other' mods), void our warranties.
Also, for the bootloader, as was already stated, it does say MAY void your warranty. The reason it says 'may' is in all probability because if your phone doesn't work/stops working for some reason they legally cannot refuse to warranty it unless they can attribute the problem to the act of unlocking the bootloader. Someone else stated in another thread that it really is not in Motorolas' best interest to start messing with people for unlocking bootloaders when they send in phones for repair. I would tend to agree with this. After reading all the threads I have seen over the last few months, I can't remember reading about anyone who has been declined warranty or been made to pay for repairs because they unlocked their bootloader. To the contrary there are many stories of people getting their phones back fully repaired and still unlocked with no issues.
malickie said:
True more or less. Society is propagating the problem but it really starts with the way the government is running things as a whole. Not saying it's right but until something changes in society and the government it's just all down hill. Also if you look deeper banks have a Major role as well. Anyway enough on off topic issue's there yea I do believe it is ultimately up to Motorola whether they will repair the device or not. I would assume they would probably deny the repair if it had something to do with the actual Software of the phone considering you messed with it, hardware probably different considering software usually doesn't blow up hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would love to see an agreement put in place that allows us to have "hardware" still under warranty regardless of "software".
---------- Post added at 06:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:56 AM ----------
palmboy5 said:
Thread about how to return phone after voiding warranty, contents:
some name calling, discussion about morality, the meaning of the word "may", society, laws, government, companies
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're right, how could we have messed up so bad? We forgot to talk about Lindsay Lohan!
---------- Post added at 07:04 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:57 AM ----------
baddiejang said:
to TS,
try 'accidentally' sinking your Atrix in the ocean for a minute, and then claim your warranty?
or try 2 cover it with your thumb while booting?
to others,
help TS, (like me?), don't condemn everything about what he had done in the past.
maybe, he's your friend next door, a helping hand's neighbor?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@WiredPirate has already provided a link but I guess I can be pro-active and actually USE the "search" feature.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1201105
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1261413
There are more discussions as well.
---------- Post added at 07:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:04 AM ----------
CaelanT said:
Please show me where it states all these things, (rooting, ROMs', bootloader unlock, and 'other' mods), void our warranties.
Also, for the bootloader, as was already stated, it does say MAY void your warranty. The reason it says 'may' is in all probability because if your phone doesn't work/stops working for some reason they legally cannot refuse to warranty it unless they can attribute the problem to the act of unlocking the bootloader. Someone else stated in another thread that it really is not in Motorolas' best interest to start messing with people for unlocking bootloaders when they send in phones for repair. I would tend to agree with this. After reading all the threads I have seen over the last few months, I can't remember reading about anyone who has been declined warranty or been made to pay for repairs because they unlocked their bootloader. To the contrary there are many stories of people getting their phones back fully repaired and still unlocked with no issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're right about Motorola should not reject people for warranty repairs, they still have a lot of work to do in rebuilding customer relations and their public image.
I would not care at all about people using their warranties if they just did it but I don't like all the threads discussing how to "dupe" Motorola because they made a conscious decision to unlock their bootloader knowing it "may" void their warranty. And don't get me wrong, I'm not siding with Motorola on the issue, I just believe people should fully understand the implications of their choices and until there is a set agreement on the issue then people should just accept the outcomes.
Also, people should continue to actively pursue getting these policies overturned by companies like Motorola and AT&T. The community has made great strides over the past year and we need to keep pushing.
I really wish people would search instead of crearing another thread on the same thing. People need to be coddled and what better way to start an argument/pity party by starting another thread without using search.
I voided my warranty and your mum.
If you're on Gingerbread, or have atleast updated to it, you can flash the stock gingerbread .sbf and it won't brick your phone. Just don't flash any other kind of .sbf , you can't go back to any other version. When you flash that with RSDlite, it'll take you back to stock and wipe the "unlocked" logo off your screen. It will still BE unlocked, it just won't say it.
CaelanT said:
Please show me where it states all these things, (rooting, ROMs', bootloader unlock, and 'other' mods), void our warranties.
Also, for the bootloader, as was already stated, it does say MAY void your warranty. The reason it says 'may' is in all probability because if your phone doesn't work/stops working for some reason they legally cannot refuse to warranty it unless they can attribute the problem to the act of unlocking the bootloader. Someone else stated in another thread that it really is not in Motorolas' best interest to start messing with people for unlocking bootloaders when they send in phones for repair. I would tend to agree with this. After reading all the threads I have seen over the last few months, I can't remember reading about anyone who has been declined warranty or been made to pay for repairs because they unlocked their bootloader. To the contrary there are many stories of people getting their phones back fully repaired and still unlocked with no issues.
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Ok let me rephrase,
I have noticed people in the Atrix community, are not as well versed in being civil with each other, as members in my other device forums are. Point is. everywhere you read, when it comes to rooting, unlocking, there is a "chance" of the statement "may" void warranty. (don't act like you are dislexic or in a special ed class and cant read or never learned how to) Maybe go read again where these statements are at when you read the thread.
Also to install a rom, you need to be rooted, and in some cases like this device, you need to have unlocked bootloader and cwm or a recovery installed to flash the rom to your device.
Which yet again brings up the point you have to go to a forum, locate a thread, read the info, and most of them always say, there is a chance at "may void warranty" and not responsible if you brick your device, kick your cat, crash your car,pull your hair, beat the sh** out of your wife, murder your neighbor, or somehow end up having to dive to the bottom of the ocean to retrieve your dog.
removed cuz of people *****ing have fun making emails yourself
Hawkysoft said:
Yeye i know...
Another person not happy about Asus's acts...
My problem? the bootloader not being fully unlocked... halve a promiss which has been made by asus IMO.
So therefor i sended them an email asking if they will change the unlock tool so we can use NVFLASH as well..
if i get an reply, i'll post it here... >.<
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Cool thanks. This would be awesome. Save people from a few brick situations.
The only reason they may not is because it gives access to DRM information, correct?
mtotho said:
Cool thanks. This would be awesome. Save people from a few brick situations.
The only reason they may not is because it gives access to DRM information, correct?
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as far as i know, that was the reason why we wouldn't get any google music store or w/e it was support? which i never used and heared about before all this stuff anyway
Hawkysoft said:
as far as i know, that was the reason why we wouldn't get any google music store or w/e it was support? which i never used and heared about before all this stuff anyway
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Yea, I have never once considered buying a movie/music there. That is what Netflix/Spotify/Grooveshark is far
I would be 100% okay with a second unlock tool that will further unlock but disable access to DRM material on the market
If I were to hypothetically steal music/movies, It would be on my PC anyway where it is much easier. Hypothetically speaking
removed cuz of people *****ing have fun making emails yourself
mtotho said:
Yea, I have never once considered buying a movie/music there. That is what Netflix/Spotify/Grooveshark is far
I would be 100% okay with a second unlock tool that will further unlock but disable access to DRM material on the market
If I were to hypothetically steal music/movies, It would be on my PC anyway where it is much easier. Hypothetically speaking
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lol I know right? They're punishing you by not giving you access to something no one uses anyway. Great way to make sure they don't get customers.
ickkii said:
lol I know right? They're punishing you by not giving you access to something no one uses anyway. Great way to make sure they don't get customers.
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that would be okey if they denied us the access, but in trade for that they should have unlocked the entire bootloader, and not on the current state where we are screwed on both sides (and not the pleasant way)..
removed cuz of people *****ing have fun making emails yourself
Just saw this thread funny i had to rant about the same thing last night. IMO if they're gonna fully void our warranty they HAVE to fully unlock it. Anything else is bull****. Not having nvflash and fastboot is a bigger issue than all others combined for me.
di11igaf said:
Just saw this thread funny i had to rant about the same thing last night. IMO if they're gonna fully void our warranty they HAVE to fully unlock it. Anything else is bull****. Not having nvflash and fastboot is a bigger issue than all others combined for me.
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its like giving away a car without an engine, nor a spot for one... ;/
and that noob @ asus... wow.. serious... i thought they had more brighter people working there...
also without being capable of using nvflash and fastboot, i won't unlock it i think..
and what if they release a new tool? would it be capable to use at the 'unlocked' devices as well? which im afraid off it won't at start of it...
post the email. We should have the whole forum send them an email. OR lets do another BBB complaint
i just used contact us @ asus.com... you won't get to see a true email adress, but at the bright hand, you don't have to fill in your serial number, just fill in like not-needed i did that as well
[update] seems like email 1 has been forwarded, since it has been changed activity to: your suggestion has been received by us and is being progressed.......etc...
email2 still no changes
removed cuz of people *****ing have fun making emails yourself
Looks good. But man if you get a real response from Asus at least proof read first. Everyone appreciates professionalism.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
AdamHart612 said:
Looks good. But man if you get a real response from Asus at least proof read first. Everyone appreciates professionalism.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
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i know don't worry, but to helpdesk workers... i can't help it but my anger speaks, these people think we are stupid and will accept every answer they are giving..
removed cuz of people *****ing have fun making emails yourself
I can see a few reasons where it would make sense.
0.) Maybe they can't officially. I'm not sure where TF101's nvflash stuff comes from but I could see nVidia making it an issue not to just throw it around willy nilly. Who knows, they could be held liable or risk damaging their contracts with suppliers (like nVidia).
1.) If it could "Undo" the unlocker, well d'uh we're not gonna get it in any legit way.
2.) Maybe they're fed up with enough leaks and general issues that they don't care, after all two new models coming on line soon. And I do expect even if ASUS isn't replacing the Prime, stores will replace it with the new budget model and the Infinity.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk
IF unlocking the boot loader was for rooting(which this could be the case IF fastboot was working), they are basically contradicting themselves. They're saying since the boot loader is unlocked we can now root. The way you root when you unlock the boot loader is by changing ro-secure= from 1 to 0 in default.prop in the boot.img(unsecure boot.img), then flash the unsecure boot.img with fastboot. This gives you a root terminal and adb remount to mount system r/w. This is the proper way to do it.
The guy in that email is full of ****, or has no clue what he's talking about. Most likely both
It makes absolutely NO sense for them to cripple fastboot. Nvflash, I can somewhat see in the eyes of some paper pushing pu$$y, but not fastboot.
maybe someone else should try to email... ;/
Would people be willing to start a bounty for a true unlock/relock without voiding warranty and would this even be possible since I hear the bootloader is encrypted or whaterver?
A way for my evo 3d was posted where you have to hard brick the device and restore to get total unlock. Are you willing to risk something like that on your tablet?
Sent from my tablet thing with XDA Premium.
jdeoxys said:
A way for my evo 3d was posted where you have to hard brick the device and restore to get total unlock. Are you willing to risk something like that on your tablet?
Sent from my tablet thing with XDA Premium.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess I would have to see the success the people had.
I unlocked my used to be Evo 3D w/ out bricking it without bricking it?
Papichulo06 said:
Would people be willing to start a bounty for a true unlock/relock without voiding warranty and would this even be possible since I hear the bootloader is encrypted or whaterver?
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its AES128 bit encription so would be hard work to brute force it and theres always the risk of bricking the tablet...
I think if it was possible people would work on it not sure if a bounty thread would help
Hawke84 said:
its AES128 bit encription so would be hard work to brute force it and theres always the risk of bricking the tablet...
I think if it was possible people would work on it not sure if a bounty thread would help
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same was said about our Senny, and what did we get? Revolutionary. Everything is possible, its just a matter of time and effort.
The way Asus does unlock is crying for an proper s-off like unofficial way, to make thing more open and more safe.
After watching the pressure on AlphaRev with HTC unlock, it wouldn't surprise me if they are actually working on it but keeping it quiet.
Sent through the wormhole from my CoinInserted Sensation OG.
Encryption is a funny joke.
I want to start by saying I don't have all the answers to encryption. However, if you were to looks at encryption from a simplistic mathematical equation (as do programmers)
(X + Y) = Z
X = a unknown variable of infinite possibilities
Y = a mathematical collaborative equation with X, crating a consistency in the encryption equation
Z= Equals the unknown/infinite result, or, the unlock encryption or paraphrase to the same.
Bare in mind, often, there are more variables then X and Y which equal Z - This example is simplistic.
The key is identifying the consistencies and inconsistencies in the equation by reviewing coding. Again, not always an easy task, you have to study the coding (which has many languages depending on platform, security, etc.) and/or the way the OS reacts to coding input.
If one cannot achieve the above due to the infinite possibilities of unknown variables in the environment.... One must change the programming environment by introducing a new environment ex) Using Linux root to unlock file partitions in Windows to bypass security perimeters, or even walking around WEP or WPA encryptions not mentioned on this site. Encryption: Think of it like someone closing a door and locking it. Your can break through the door by kicking it in, or drilling the lock...or by going through the window left open, changing your entry method.
Just sharing some thoughts based off of my experience on multiple platforms.
Wave.
Sure it's possible. It's been done with other devices it's just extremely hard and doesn't have the need that some of the other devices had before they were cracked. If you're worried about the warranty so much I would be the accidental damage warranty on it.
This was brought up many many times in December and it's just not worth the time.
tinky1 said:
Same was said about our Senny, and what did we get? Revolutionary. Everything is possible, its just a matter of time and effort.
The way Asus does unlock is crying for an proper s-off like unofficial way, to make thing more open and more safe.
After watching the pressure on AlphaRev with HTC unlock, it wouldn't surprise me if they are actually working on it but keeping it quiet.
Sent through the wormhole from my CoinInserted Sensation OG.
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i hope it is being worked on in secret that would be perfect. im getting worried with all the rumblings of TF201 being end of life already in some of the other threads..
Hawke84 said:
i hope it is being worked on in secret that would be perfect. im getting worried with all the rumblings of TF201 being end of life already in some of the other threads..
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Click to collapse
I keep a very close eye on the things here, very close.
Sent through the wormhole from my CoinInserted Sensation OG.
Hawke84 said:
i hope it is being worked on in secret that would be perfect. im getting worried with all the rumblings of TF201 being end of life already in some of the other threads..
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Click to collapse
All i will say is this, i have a Samsung Vibrant it was thought the vibrant would be EOL last year, well it happened samsung stopped support for the device stopping at froyo 2.2 (didnt even bother with the 2.2.1 update) since then development for the vibrant has sprouted. As of right now the device is running 4.0.3 that said im sure many TF101 owners were scared by the release of the TF201 given that they felt device support from developers would drop.
This is a great device by every possible measure and i have a feeling the Dev community will support it for some time, that said i wouldnt worry too much about whether or not ASUS continues support, it will only be a matter of time before the device is decrypted, or our warranties will run out and there will be no problem unlocking the device given the asus utility.
Fret not my friend
- Cheers
Hi,
Here's a unique idea.
Let's pass the word to boycott Samsung over the whole KNOX fiasco.
Use social media, ie. twitter, facebook, etc. to pass the word.
Tell everyone you know not to buy a Samsung phone this holiday season.
The only thing that will make companies take notice is if we take action.
1. Just the attempt to downgrade firmware or load unauthorized firmware triggers KNOX in 4.3 and voids your warranty.
2. Now that's not bad enough, because even if you now load a signed piece of firmware KNOX still stays triggered.
3. If my warranty is now void, I should be able to do what I want, but nooooo, my bootloader is still locked and I have no warranty.
So Samsung should fix this. Just trying to do something should not void my warranty, especially since they block the possibility of being able to change the bootloader.
This is not Samsung's device.
Everyone does not need nor want KNOX and those that need it, know it.
The majority of devices are not enterprise, so why are they forcing an enterprise and NSA solution down our throats!
BOYCOTT SAMSUNG!!!
tech_head said:
Hi,
Here's a unique idea.
Let's pass the word to boycott Samsung over the whole KNOX fiasco.
Use social media, ie. twitter, facebook, etc. to pass the word.
Tell everyone you know not to buy a Samsung phone this holiday season.
The only thing that will make companies take notice is if we take action.
1. Just the attempt to downgrade firmware or load unauthorized firmware triggers KNOX in 4.3 and voids your warranty.
2. Now that's not bad enough, because even if you now load a signed piece of firmware KNOX still stays triggered.
3. If my warranty is now void, I should be able to do what I want, but nooooo, my bootloader is still locked and I have no warranty.
So Samsung should fix this. Just trying to do something should not void my warranty, especially since they block the possibility of being able to change the bootloader.
This is not Samsung's device.
Everyone does not need nor want KNOX and those that need it, know it.
The majority of devices are not enterprise, so why are they forcing an enterprise and NSA solution down our throats!
BOYCOTT SAMSUNG!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was going to say a lot of the obvious, but let's just say this is um admirable.
tech_head said:
Hi,
Here's a unique idea.
Let's pass the word to boycott Samsung over the whole KNOX fiasco.
Use social media, ie. twitter, facebook, etc. to pass the word.
Tell everyone you know not to buy a Samsung phone this holiday season.
The only thing that will make companies take notice is if we take action.
1. Just the attempt to downgrade firmware or load unauthorized firmware triggers KNOX in 4.3 and voids your warranty.
2. Now that's not bad enough, because even if you now load a signed piece of firmware KNOX still stays triggered.
3. If my warranty is now void, I should be able to do what I want, but nooooo, my bootloader is still locked and I have no warranty.
So Samsung should fix this. Just trying to do something should not void my warranty, especially since they block the possibility of being able to change the bootloader.
This is not Samsung's device.
Everyone does not need nor want KNOX and those that need it, know it.
The majority of devices are not enterprise, so why are they forcing an enterprise and NSA solution down our throats!
BOYCOTT SAMSUNG!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For your #1, how did you load unauthorized firmware?
I don't understand your #2...what "piece of firmware"?
How do you know it voids your warranty? Did you have issues with the warranty?
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
I really doubt something like this would work. The only people on board would be those of us who mod, which make up such a small portion of Samsung's sales, they wouldn't care. The general consumer is where they get their money and said general consumer couldn't care less about Knox.
prshosting.org
Tell your friends and family. Word of mouth is huge.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
Samsung sold 213 million phones in 2012.
Two things...
1) Though XDA and all seems huge, only a really really small percentage of cell phone users play around with crap that will effect knox. I doubt a large number of those "don't care" people are going to want join your campaign.
2) There are a lot of great things about Samsung phones and products. It's like people complaining about VZW cost and billing and marketing, but they have great coverage and I'd never switch because someone starts a "boycot Verizon for $$ reasons".
I don't like the S4 lockdown either, but I'd rather have a locked S4 than an unlocked G2.
JeeperDon said:
I don't like the S4 lockdown either, but I'd rather have a locked S4 than an unlocked G2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure I'd agree with this. At the same time o hate Samsung, I'd have a Motorola phone if I wouldn't have had to upgrade when I did. Kind of screwed me.
SirHoover2010 said:
Not sure I'd agree with this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You don't have to.
JeeperDon said:
You don't have to.
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Click to collapse
Yea ik. Exactly why I put "at the same time I hate Samsung" so I'm kind of biased
They can make lock downs most of this is to stop forms of piracy in my opinion. I'm new to rooting but I'm from the modding scene. I have no worries do to developers here as I do on game system modding. Give them time nintendo,Sony and Microsoft have done similiar things with updates the push regularly to their gaming consoles and boycoting will not work do to the modding group is a small group that has a small impact they already planned on loosing.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda app-developers app
Boycott yourself, this would defeat the purpose of "DEVELOPER" phones...you knew what you were getting into when buying a consumer s4.
When will people think logically? Samsung wants security. They sell the developer phones completely unlocked for US.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
Knox is high security put on the phone as a bid to gain military contracts. They only want the most secure phones. Do you think Samsung will stop trying to get that military high $$$ over a few people saying they won't buy anymore? Also add to this many corporate businesses that buy bulk phones and contracts and want a more secure phone for their Exchange and corporate software. XDA users are barely a ripple in that ocean of waves.
you should have bought a developer edition if locked bootloader was a concern.
Sent from my XT1080 using xda app-developers app
not that it matters but i believe a korean family controls 46% of samsung husband wife and 3 kids. just saying.
eklipz3 said:
not that it matters but i believe a korean family controls 46% of samsung husband wife and 3 kids. just saying.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, so you're going to tell their kids that their daddy is a bad man for locking bootloaders? Tell their kids they won't get Christmas presents if they don't get their parents to unlock bootloaders?
orangechoochoo said:
Okay, so you're going to tell their kids that their daddy is a bad man for locking bootloaders? Tell their kids they won't get Christmas presents if they don't get their parents to unlock bootloaders?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The kids don't care. They have the Developers Edition.
orangechoochoo said:
Okay, so you're going to tell their kids that their daddy is a bad man for locking bootloaders? Tell their kids they won't get Christmas presents if they don't get their parents to unlock bootloaders?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sorry i should have made myself a little more clear about the kids but they are adults as well and are vp's and such of samsung and i think the oldest girl was just promoted to run some part of sammy. and yes i bet there's is not locked.
eklipz3 said:
sorry i should have made myself a little more clear about the kids but they are adults as well and are vp's and such of samsung and i think the oldest girl was just promoted to run some part of sammy. and yes i bet there's is not locked.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Umm...yeah...because the international versions are not locked...neither is Sprint...it is a carrier request to lock bootloaders on Samsung phones, otherwise all phones would be locked. Locked bootloaders and Knox are not the same thing. This thread states it is about Knox. True that Knox in the bootloader prevents you from downgrading the firmware...but does not equal locked. There are many phones with locked bootloaders but no Knox.
Batttie said:
you should have bought a developer edition if locked bootloader was a concern.
Sent from my XT1080 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not just about a locked bootloader.
If that was all, no issues.
KNOX and SE Linux are now baked in from the bootloader up.
No it was not on my phone when I first got my phone and was not detailed before they rolled it out.
Messing with the bootloader in anyway even an attempted downgrade, void your warranty.
Not tampering by using unauthorized software, but just trying to go to an older version of *SIGNED* firmware will void your warranty.
My issue is this, if my warranty is now void, why can't I install any *SIGNED* firmware that came on the phone?