Related
http://www.geek.com/first-look-qualcomms-new-fairbanks-and-anchorage-mobile-platforms/
The anchorage with its tasty 1ghz processor seems like it might be a easy replacement for the x7500. Who knows when it will arrive and in what shape internally. Some nice xp or linux action on the anchorage might be nice.
I saw that too, and am really interested in getting more info. However, I would still like it to run window mobile, hopefully wm7. XP will be a bad news for me. XP is simply not appropriate as a mobile, from the viewpoint of battery efficiency, software availability, instant on capability, etc. I'll be disappointed if it is Linux, as third party software just isn't good enough.
150% agree with eaglesteve.
I do hope that by the time these devices come out, WM7 will be out AND that it will, finally, fully support VGA and higher resolutions, and provide a truely ergonomical and good-looking user interface without the need for heavy tuning.
That will make the GHz processor more than a marketing argument in my opinion.
Thanks for the heads-up !
HeartOfDarkness said:
150% agree with eaglesteve.
I do hope that by the time these devices come out, WM7 will be out AND that it will, finally, fully support VGA and higher resolutions, and provide a truely ergonomical and good-looking user interface without the need for heavy tuning.
That will make the GHz processor more than a marketing argument in my opinion.
Thanks for the heads-up !
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By that time iPhone 2.0 will be out and this will be a moot issue. I say this as a Windows Mobile user since the original TMobile PPC phone. I mean, I really like my Advantage, but it's crazy how much time I have invested in it to get it to work like it should have from the first. The iPhone is not for me right now -- much too limited -- but when I watch my friends use them they actually work! And quickly! When the iPhone goes to the next generation, watch out! Not looking for a fight, just chatting.
wgary said:
By that time iPhone 2.0 will be out and this will be a moot issue. I say this as a Windows Mobile user since the original TMobile PPC phone. I mean, I really like my Advantage, but it's crazy how much time I have invested in it to get it to work like it should have from the first. The iPhone is not for me right now -- much too limited -- but when I watch my friends use them they actually work! And quickly! When the iPhone goes to the next generation, watch out! Not looking for a fight, just chatting.
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IMO phone is more for demonstration than actual utility. It is too tightly controlled by Steve Job. There isn't the same openness to foster third party software. Without the richness of third party software and choices, what you bought is what you get. It will always be limited relative to winmo devices. With winmo, each of us is able to change the device to our very individual taste.
I won't underestimate the power of microsoft to bring about a really good hand gestured based OS that works really really well with mobile devices, and that will heap frog the competition. May be wm7 feels like a late start, but I get the feeling that it will be solid.
wgary said:
By that time iPhone 2.0 will be out and this will be a moot issue. I say this as a Windows Mobile user since the original TMobile PPC phone. I mean, I really like my Advantage, but it's crazy how much time I have invested in it to get it to work like it should have from the first. The iPhone is not for me right now -- much too limited -- but when I watch my friends use them they actually work! And quickly! When the iPhone goes to the next generation, watch out! Not looking for a fight, just chatting.
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Let's see what Apple will be coming up with. Looking at their reputation, it will be something unexpected. However, to see is to believe.
yetdy said:
Let's see what Apple will be coming up with. Looking at their reputation, it will be something unexpected. However, to see is to believe.
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a 1ghz processor on a wm6 device is pretty pointless if you balance out barely-noticeable speed upgrade over loss of battery life. I have found the difference between windows mobile machines to be more about individual tweaks than the power of the processor: i certainly wasn't wowed by the Athena's performance after upgrading from a Hermes.
One thing windows needs to get right in the next upgrade is that it needs to LOOK AND FEEL NICE, and be EASY TO USE. This will take the windows mobile platform out of the nerd/office exec market and into the mainstream, something that just cannot be done at the moment despite the valiant tweaks of HTC with the Touch series.
Windows Mobile is fine for me, I'm used to it, but for the novice it's long-winded.
The performance of Windows mobile is abysmal when lined up against Linux and especially Apple machines: look at the smooth menu systems on Iphones, and the way the integrated pinch zoom mechanism fluidly drifts in and out. No programmer on earth could acheive these results around the current windows mobile architecture, this despite the fact that the Iphone has a 620mhz ARM processor comparable to the Athena's.
The Iphone is also capable of rendering web pages more reliably than the Athena - the only drawback in this respect is its meagre Edge connectivity.
Linux on the other hand has lots of potential:With open-source development, and loads of easily-ported software it's interesting to say the least.
Haavard Nord, the CE of a big mobile Linux developer recently said " if you want to build a phone using the Microsoft operating system it is pretty restricted what you can do with the user interface due to the licensing agreement between the customer and Microsoft. Microsoft wants to make sure everyone knows it’s a Windows Mobile phone so it limits what branding you can put on the phone."
This could cause problems for microsoft: the pda market is known to be decreasing, while Symbian continues to develop a huge foothold in the market.
If the capabilities of Symbian and Linux continue to develop then I see a great market loss for Microsoft unless they buck their ideas up and start WORKING with their manufacturers.
Get out of the fricking dark ages Microsoft before you screw up big time.
ONly a few weeks ago, leoni, I would have agreed with you about pretty much everyting but now, I have to say that WinCE (the "heart" of Windows MObile) is FAR from being that bad performance-wise, now that I have had the opportunity to dive deep into it (at work).
It's actually Windows Mobile that sucks, which basically is CE + crappy GUI, not Windows CE, and it's WinCE that you have to compare with LInux and stuff. Because Linux by itself may be cool, but you will not be able to run very heavy GUIs like Enlignhtenment on current mobile devices, however great Linux may be.
MY POINT being: WinCE is an extremely solid, fast and reliable OS. Simply looking at how 90% off all autonomous GPS run under WinCE, and knowing that the fastest of them are equipped with 300 MHz processors should convince you of that.
Look at what HTC, which is NOT a software company by far, managed to do for the Touch line in pretty much the blink of an eye.
It's the Windows Mobile team that needs some extremely heavily applied butt-kicking. Both because they still do not understand that people want simplicity and beauty on their mobile device, but also because they want to stick, absolutly, to this "Windows Desktop-like" GUI.
I *think* Microsoft finally got the message. But as they're also trying to converge all their OSes, the future is quite uncertain...
As to the iPhone 2... It's both way too remote, and way too "locked-down" a system to work for me... If Apple wants to have someone like me interested (and I don't mean they should necessarily, but we're talking about how Apple could please me with the iPhone2), they need to review their content management policies.
i agree with you that CE underpins a great many devices we use everyday. I'm sure it's not ce which is at fault, however it needs to be understood that running a basic satnav or epos system isn't the same as running an effective graphics-heavy mobile device.
Another point i don't entirely agree on is about the touch gui - this has nothing to do with winCE, it is an extension to wm6. They did a good job, but it's no miracle! Like i said, windows mobile in the end ruins it, since as snazzy as touchcube and touchflo look on the face of it you invariably end up back at the unfriendly and stylus-dependant windows gui.
On the whole i think you are right in that it is the windows mobile programmers who are at fault, but eaglesteve's boundless optimism is possibly unfounded as these programmers have had YEARS to make the interface nicer and improve the user experience and have patently failed to do it.
Wm6 is inherently the same as all the rest but for bug fixes and some tweaks, what's to say wm7 will be any better?
I really hope they see sense, but who knows? It could be that they've seen the market lead symbian is getting in the mobile arena and are content to release windows mobile updates only for the hardcore. They might not see themselves as competitors to apple and nokia in this field. I hope i'm wrong...
Fl3.0 has just been embedded into the N95 8gb firmware. This means that N95 8gb users have FULL ACCESS to youtube and other flash sites. Nokia are already ahead of the game, and despite the limitations of a qvga, non-touchscreen device it seems that not only will N95 users have a better video and multimedia playback device than Athena users but also full, uninhibited access to most websites.
I see a microsoft-killing PDA on the horizon.
leoni1980 said:
Fl3.0 has just been embedded into the N95 8gb firmware. This means that N95 8gb users have FULL ACCESS to youtube and other flash sites. Nokia are already ahead of the game, and despite the limitations of a qvga, non-touchscreen device it seems that not only will N95 users have a better video and multimedia playback device than Athena users but also full, uninhibited access to most websites.
I see a microsoft-killing PDA on the horizon.
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Click to collapse
I've already seen N95. You would have to hold a gun against my head to make me use it as an internet browsing device. It does not have an acceptable input method. It does not have an acceptable screen. The browser is too slow as compared to Athena's.
It's true that Athana could not access classical youtube without first downloading it, but there is still youtube mobile that you can use.
The Anchorage will be even better than Athena, I'm sure, although I have not have enough info on it. It is at least a device that has GPS, Phone, Camera, PDA, Wifi, Bluetooth all in one, and stays with the mainstream winmo environment, with the widest choice of third party software. That's why this is going to be such a interesting device to watch.
When it is released, I think Leoni you will abandon your N95/N800/Asus eee solution immediately and go for this, despite your negative attitude toward anything microsoft now.
eaglesteve said:
I've already seen N95. You would have to hold a gun against my head to make me use it as an internet browsing device. It does not have an acceptable input method. It does not have an acceptable screen. The browser is too slow as compared to Athena's.
It's true that Athana could not access classical youtube without first downloading it, but there is still youtube mobile that you can use.
The Anchorage will be even better than Athena, I'm sure, although I have not have enough info on it. It is at least a device that has GPS, Phone, Camera, PDA, Wifi, Bluetooth all in one, and stays with the mainstream winmo environment, with the widest choice of third party software. That's why this is going to be such a interesting device to watch.
When it is released, I think Leoni you will abandon your N95/N800/Asus eee solution immediately and go for this, despite your negative attitude toward anything microsoft now.
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The N95 renders pages just as quick as the Athena - trust me I've owned and burned out every device under the sun! its drawback is - I agree - the screen size and input method, but given that I only use it for short-term browsing and checking information it is more than capable. It allows me flawless access to more web pages than either of the Athena's browsers do too.
the Anchorage is just a mocked-up device. It will never be released, and was simply designed to show off a new chipset from Qualcomm which has lots of snazzy features. The site linked on this page is somewhat misleading.....
The Snapdragon chipsets will obviously hail marked improvements on performance, but they are more than capable of running Linux AND (if rumours are to be believed) full windows OS. With this in mind I fail to see how this has any bearing on my experience of Windows Mobile. For a decent Windows experience we will have to wait for number 7 and I doubt that will be backwards-compatible with older applications since it's going to be a total overhaul.
leoni1980 said:
The N95 renders pages just as quick as the Athena - trust me I've owned and burned out every device under the sun! its drawback is - I agree - the screen size and input method, but given that I only use it for short-term browsing and checking information it is more than capable. It allows me flawless access to more web pages than either of the Athena's browsers do too.
the Anchorage is just a mocked-up device. It will never be released, and was simply designed to show off a new chipset from Qualcomm.
The Snapdragon chipsets will obviously hail marked improvements on performance, but they are more than capable of running Linux AND (if rumours are to be believed) full windows OS. With this in mind I fail to see how this has any bearing on my experience of Windows Mobile. For a decent Windows experience we will have to wait for number 7 and I doubt that will be backwards-compatible with older applications since it's going to be a total overhaul.
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I suppose we just have to disagree over the N95 versus Athena's ability to deliver good internet browsing experience.
You said the Anchorage will never be released (not may never be released). What makes you so certain?
I have no qualm with using Linux if it has the same array of quality software. I heard that the GPS software on N810 is a piece of crap, for example. I have never come across any website that indicates I can get third party software at this moment. It may be true that more software will be available in the future, but that does not help because I need it right now. For GPS, I only want iGO, or one that does warn me if I exceed the legal speed limit; is iGO available on linux? Can I get Cash Organiser on linux? What about creating and editing Word and Excel documents, can that be done on linux yet? What about MobileGolfScorer, which is the best golfing software that I know of? Does it run on linux? If not, is that anything as good? The list goes on and on.
It may be true that with WM7 some software may not run. We know that from the wm2003se to wm5 upgrade experience. However, almost all the software vendors quickly adapted with the newer version, so I'm not worried. I've watched a video interview with the WM7 development team, and know that they do try their best to minimise migration difficulties.
One of the attractions of Qualcomm's SnapDragon platform is its low battery consumption. It consumes between 250 to 500 miliwatt of battery. In contrast, the A110 and A100 chip from Intel consumes about 3 watts, which is 6 to 12 times more power hungry. The Intel's Silverthorne consumes power between 0.6 and 2.0 watts.
The chipset apparently allows even full OS to run on it. This may be the start of a more useable UMPC running full OS??
HTC is currently testing SnapDragon. Let's hope that they adopt it and come up with a battery efficient mobile device.
eaglesteve said:
It's true that Athana could not access classical youtube without first downloading it, but there is still youtube mobile that you can use.
QUOTE]
Or, of course, vTap
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Confucious said:
eaglesteve said:
It's true that Athana could not access classical youtube without first downloading it, but there is still youtube mobile that you can use.
QUOTE]
Or, of course, vTap
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Youtube is only sited as a prime example of a flash-based site. Vtap, and other solutions do not allow access to all Flash 9 based sites.
On the subject of the Anchorage - it is definitely not being released, which is no surprise since its primary function was to demonstrate the Snapdragon Chipset - the device wasn't even fully functional and was only running WM5. HOWEVER HTC wil be adopting the Snapdragon Chipset, this is a certainity.
HTC are demostrably not concentrating soley on Windows Mobile anymore so it's a good bet that these new chipsets will herald more full windows/linux devices - I'll be happy with that!
Maps software on the N800 is not crap - Maemo mapper integrates loads of mapping applications - including google maps and is very responsive. It also informs you of your current speed limit.
And it's free.
Nokia Maps (wayfinder) also works fine. To be honest though I don't really need GPS as I don't drive.
I don't know if any Word apps are available for os2008 as I would never wish to edit word docs, or even view them on such a small screen. The keyboard is so crap on the Athena that I never edited word docs anyway.
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leoni1980 said:
Confucious said:
HOWEVER HTC wil be adopting the Snapdragon Chipset, this is a certainity.
Maps software on the N800 is not crap - Maemo mapper integrates loads of mapping applications - including google maps and is very responsive. It also informs you of your current speed limit.
I don't know if any Word apps are available for os2008 as I would never wish to edit word docs, or even view them on such a small screen. The keyboard is so crap on the Athena that I never edited word docs anyway.
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Good to confirm that HTC is coming up with a Snapdragon Chipset. As long as it is a convergent device like Athena, hopefully running WM7, they would have my money.
I think most GPS software inform you of your current speed. However, very few compares it against the road's legal speed limit and gives an audio warning when one exceeds it. I sometime forget to look at the speed sign and unintentionally exceed speed. Fine is hefty and its easy to be slapped with license suspension. I use iGO even if I'm already familiar with the direction, for the purpose of giving just that speed warning.
I do have lots of words and excel documents created on Athena and shared on the desktop.
Creating words document is extremely productive if you use Tengo soft keyboard. Tengo would not be availalable on Linux again, I believe.
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eaglesteve said:
leoni1980 said:
Good to confirm that HTC is coming up with a Snapdragon Chipset. As long as it is a convergent device like Athena, hopefully running WM7, they would have my money.
I think most GPS software inform you of your current speed. However, very few compares it against the road's legal speed limit and gives an audio warning when one exceeds it. I sometime forget to look at the speed sign and unintentionally exceed speed. Fine is hefty and its easy to be slapped with license suspension. I use iGO even if I'm already familiar with the direction, for the purpose of giving just that speed warning.
I do have lots of words and excel documents created on Athena and shared on the desktop.
Creating words document is extremely productive if you use Tengo soft keyboard. Tengo would not be availalable on Linux again, I believe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You've got a long wait for WM7 so don't hold your breath, there's life in wm6 yet as far as MS is concerned.
Not so bothered about on screen keyboards on N800 - there's a stylus kboard and a thumb kboard which are both fine. I don't do extensive typing anyway, mostly listening to bbc onine or fm radio with the plugins and browsing the net. I do pretty much all my major typing on the EEE. I can't imagine a long period of typing with onscreen input but I take my hat off to you for managing it. I don't imagine you can type many words per minute though!
Igo sounds good i'll give you that, but I don't drive and even if I did I wouldn't necessarily rely on the speed limits given by a satnav. It's a great-sounding feature though.
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leoni1980 said:
You've got a long wait for WM7 so don't hold your breath, there's life in wm6 yet as far as MS is concerned.
I don't imagine you can type many words per minute though!
Igo sounds good i'll give you that, but I don't drive and even if I did I wouldn't necessarily rely on the speed limits given by a satnav. It's a great-sounding feature though.
Click to expand...
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One year passes very fast. By then I would have already got 2 year use and would pass on Athena to one of my sons who frequently fight over the use of Athena with me now.
As to the typing speed, watch the speed demo on this website:
http://www.tengo.net/
You'll then understand why Tengo is so different and unique as compared to the normal softscreen keyboard.
The speed limit is accurate for most of the roads. On some roads the speed limit has not been entered into the database. I understand that in one of the Tom Tom versions, users are able to manually update a particular road's speed limit as well as to add/change/delete road. I don't rely on it to the extend of not watching the speed sign and speedometer, since some road's speed are not there. I use it just to mimimise the chance of speeding when I day dream away, or got distracted.
So, there are GPS software and there are GPS software. They are'nt created equal. What I like about my existing winmo platform is that I have already sourced the best of bread in almost all areas. Finding applications which are as good on Linux platform may be a challenge.
leoni1980 said:
i agree with you that CE underpins a great many devices we use everyday. I'm sure it's not ce which is at fault, however it needs to be understood that running a basic satnav or epos system isn't the same as running an effective graphics-heavy mobile device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, you hugely underestimate what a "basic" satnav application does, I believe. TomTom, or others in kind, probably are the most power-hundgry applications running on our devices, especially so since they are, on top of CPU hungry, usually greedy on graphic resources. Yet most of the WinCE devices that run dedicated satnav solutions are 200, at most 300 MHz.
leoni1980 said:
Another point i don't entirely agree on is about the touch gui - this has nothing to do with winCE, it is an extension to wm6.
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As I said in my previous post, it has everything to do with WinCE. Of course, the Touch GUI is, basically, a Windows Mobile application. But, Windows CE is, just the same, underlying all this. And it's WinCE that allows for easy, fast and efficient application development and allowed HTC to produce the Touch application that fast.
leoni1980 said:
They did a good job, but it's no miracle! Like i said, windows mobile in the end ruins it, since as snazzy as touchcube and touchflo look on the face of it you invariably end up back at the unfriendly and stylus-dependant windows gui.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right. But do not forget that the GUI of the Nokia and iPhone you mention end, too, at the nice-looking GUI. The difference, and advantage, we have on these devices is that however flawed the ergonomy of the rest of the interface is, it is at our disposal, while it does not even exist on those other devices.
leoni1980 said:
On the whole i think you are right in that it is the windows mobile programmers who are at fault, but eaglesteve's boundless optimism is possibly unfounded as these programmers have had YEARS to make the interface nicer and improve the user experience and have patently failed to do it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They didn't do it for multiple reasons: they didn't need to (the WinCE platform was self-sustaining, competition faded to nothingness...), and they were even required to make an interface that even vaguely ressembled the desktop versions of Windows...
leoni1980 said:
Wm6 is inherently the same as all the rest but for bug fixes and some tweaks, what's to say wm7 will be any better?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mainly the fact that, in they roadmap, they said from the start that:
- WM6 would be a "consolidation" of WM5;
- WM7 would provide a significant overhaul, in particular with the GUI and the general user experience.
leoni1980 said:
I really hope they see sense, but who knows? It could be that they've seen the market lead symbian is getting in the mobile arena and are content to release windows mobile updates only for the hardcore. They might not see themselves as competitors to apple and nokia in this field. I hope i'm wrong...
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Click to collapse
Nokia is, for now, the leader in mobile devices. Whichever OS they use is, therefore, the most distributed OS. But that's valid for "regular" phones, NOT PDA phones. In the PDA, and PDA phones market, Windows Mobile is quite simply the undisputed leader.
leoni1980 said:
Fl3.0 has just been embedded into the N95 8gb firmware. This means that N95 8gb users have FULL ACCESS to youtube and other flash sites. Nokia are already ahead of the game, and despite the limitations of a qvga, non-touchscreen device it seems that not only will N95 users have a better video and multimedia playback device than Athena users but also full, uninhibited access to most websites.
I see a microsoft-killing PDA on the horizon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't agree more that PocketIE should be much better. In fact, much more than the "Windows-like" GUI, I find it infuriating to have such a basic 'HTML experience" on such a state of the art device, in 2007/2008. If the iPhone has any impact on our WinMo machines, I hope it is to show that integrating functionnalities such as Youtube, weather forecast, etc. is a minimum requirement for integrated functionnalities.
Hey all, Just bought the g-tab as my first android device. I liked playing with the Xoom and iPads in the store, but wanted the same experience for cheap and knew that I would have to root this g-tab thing to unleash that awesome hardware value. So far I've easily put TNT Lite 4.2 and it really is much faster and more usable then the Tap N Crap that viewsonic shipped. Thanks a bunch devs for fixing what should have never been modded in such a crappy way.
My question is will there every be Android 3.0 available for the gtab? I just read an article about how google is trying to ensure oems don't mess up the UI like viewsonic did to protect their reputation. Since the gtab wasn't even an official android device, I'm wondering if Honeycomb will even be available to viewsonic or devs here to put on the gtab.
I totally agree with this article. Google shouldn't be as totalitarian as Apple, but this lack of quality control is making Android look bad in the public sphere (not to hackers of course) So did I just buy a dead end device?
As a new user - I still can't post links, so here's the pasted article from pc world:
Why Google's Tighter Control Over Android Is a Good Thing
Limiting availability of Android 3.0 code and apparent tightening of Android smartphone standards means that Google finally gets it about the platform.
By Galen Gruman, Infoworld Apr 6, 2011 11:30 am
Last week, Google said it would not release the source for its Android 3.0 "Honeycomb" tablet to developers and would limit the OS to select hardware makers, at least initially. Now there are rumors reported by Bloomberg Businessweek that Google is requiring Android device makers to get UI changes approved by Google .
As my colleague Savio Rodrigues has written, limiting the Honeycomb code is not going to hurt the Android market . I believe reining in the custom UIs imposed on Android is a good thing. Let's be honest: They exist only so companies like Motorola, HTC, and Samsung can pretend to have any technology involvement in the Android products they sell and claim they have some differentiating feature that should make customers want their model of an Android smartphone versus the umpteenth otherwise-identical Android smartphones out there.
[ Compare mobile devices using your own criteria with InfoWorld's smartphone calculator and tablet calculator. | Keep up on key mobile developments and insights via Twitter and with theMobile Edge blog and Mobilize newsletter. ]
The reality of Android is that it is the new Windows : an operating system used by multiple hardware vendors to create essentially identical products, save for the company name printed on it. That of course is what the device makers fear -- both those like Acer that already live in the race-to-the-bottom PC market and those like Motorola and HTC that don't want to.
But these cosmetic UI differences cause confusion among users, sending the message that Android is a collection of devices, not a platform like Apple's iOS. As Android's image becomes fragmented, so does the excitement that powers adoption. Anyone who's followed the cell phone industry has seen how that plays out: There are 1 billion Java-based cell phones out there, but no one knows it, and no one cares, as each works so differently that the Java underpinnings offer no value to anyone but Oracle, which licenses the technology.
Google initially seemed to want to play the same game as Oracle (and before it Sun), providing an under-the-hood platform for manufacturers to use as they saw fit. But a couple curious things happened:
Vendors such as Best Buy started selling the Android brand, to help create a sense of a unified alternative to BlackBerry and iOS, as well as to help prevent customers from feeling overwhelmed by all the "different" phones available. Too much choice confuses people, and salespeople know that.
Several mobile device makers shipped terrible tablets based on the Android 2.2 smartphone OS -- despite Google's warnings not to -- because they were impatient with Google's slow progress in releasing Honeycomb. These tablets, such as the Galaxy Tab , were terrible products and clear hack jobs that only demonstrated the iPad's superiority . I believe they also finally got the kids at Google to understand that most device makers have no respect for the Android OS and will create the same banal products for it as they do for Windows. The kids at Google have a mission, and enabling white-box smartphones isn't it.
I've argued before that Android's fragmentation, encouraged by its open source model, was a mistake . Google should drive the platform forward and ride herd on those who use it in their devices. If it wants to make the OS available free to stmulate adoption, fine. But don't let that approach devolve into the kind of crappy results that many device makers are so clueless (or eager -- take your pick) to deliver.
So far, Google's been lucky in that the fragmentation has been largely in cosmetic UI areas, which doesn't affect most Android apps and only annoys customers when they switch to a new device. The fragmentation of Android OS versions across devices is driving many Android developers away , as are fears over a fractured set of app stores. Along these lines, Google has to break the carriers' update monopoly, as Apple did, so all Android devices can be on the same OS page.
It is true that HTC's Eris brought some useful additions to the stock Android UI, serving as a model for future improvements. But the HTC example is the exception, and Google's apparent new policy would allow such enhancements if Google judges them to be so.
More to the point is what the tablet makers such as ViewSonic, Dell, and Samsung did with their first Android tablets. Their half-baked products showed how comfortable they are soiling the Android platform. For them, Android is just another OS to throw on hardware designed for something else in a cynical attempt to capture a market wave. The consistently low sales should provide a clue that users aren't buying the junk. But do they blame the hardware makers or Google? When so many Android devices are junk, it'll be Google whose reputation suffers.
Let's not forget Google's competition, and why Google can't patiently teach these companies about user experience: Apple, a company that knows how to nurture, defend, and evangelize a platform. Let's also not forget the fate of Microsoft and Nokia , who let their Windows Mobile and Symbian OSes fragment into oblivion. And let's remember that the one company that knows how the vanilla-PC game is played, Hewlett-Packard, has decided to move away from the plain-vanilla Windows OS and stake its future on its own platform, WebOS , for both PCs and mobile devices. In that world, a fragmented, confused, soiled Android platform would have no market at all.
If Google finally understands that Android is a platform to be nurtured and defended, it has a chance of remaining a strong presence in the mobile market for more than a few faddish years. If not, it's just throwing its baby into the woods, where it will find cruel exploitation, not nurturing or defense.
I didn't read your 1000 word post, but I read your topic. HC on GTAB has NOTHING to do with Google. It has everything to do with Nvidia abandoning GTAB.
The media has an idea in their head but they are shooting the messenger. Google has no choice when Nvidia stops producing source for the proprietary elements of the system.
Nvidia simply does not care about Harmony which is the hardware reference legacy devices are built on.
So this device is going to be left behind when it comes to the new android stuff?
It is interesting that you ask. With 318 posts here you have to have followed some of the threads discussing this before. At this point in time I don't think anyone knows. Lots of speculation, lots of pent up desire and the best Devs ever so I am sure there will be improvements, Will it ever make full HC who knows?? If you read your article carefully, even the stuff out there ( Zoom and Transformer) does not have complete Honeycomb.
I wonder what Honeycomb will bring to the picture that we don't have already. I have my gtablet rooted and running TnT 4.4 and it's sufficient for almost all my tablet needs. Yesterday I was reading Kindle books to the kids, streaming movies/music from my media center PC, watching youtube and browsing the net, all with nary a hiccup. I even got a cheapo keyboard leathercase to use for editing documents. If it's the UI, the current Launcher Pro Premium and GO Launcher EX are pretty nice alternatives.
I have played with the XOOM tablet at Best Buy and thought other than some pretty UI and a nicer screen, functionally I wasn't getting much for double the price.
samaruf said:
I wonder what Honeycomb will bring to the picture that we don't have already. I have my gtablet rooted and running TnT 4.4 and it's sufficient for almost all my tablet needs. Yesterday I was reading Kindle books to the kids, streaming movies/music from my media center PC, watching youtube and browsing the net, all with nary a hiccup. I even got a cheapo keyboard leathercase to use for editing documents. If it's the UI, the current Launcher Pro Premium and GO Launcher EX are pretty nice alternatives.
I have played with the XOOM tablet at Best Buy and thought other than some pretty UI and a nicer screen, functionally I wasn't getting much for double the price.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats interesting. What ROM are you running? Most of my video is choppy, and I read in the dev forum this has to do with no video acceleration yet for the Gingerbread versions.
Good point - if it does what you want it to do then so what if it's not the newest... I'm a little embarrassed, but still rockin out to my first gen iPod nano a the gym
Guess I still wanted whatever tablet specific ui improvements that honeycomb was expected to bring.
nitefallz said:
Thats interesting. What ROM are you running? Most of my video is choppy, and I read in the dev forum this has to do with no video acceleration yet for the Gingerbread versions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I mentioned in my post, my ROM is TnT Lite 4.4 with Clemsyn's kernel (v9). I can stream 700 MB avi files with no stuttering or choppiness. I use GMote app on the tablet and the GMote server in the media PC. My video player is Rockplayer, which is free from the market.
I too was just at Best Buy bout a week ago and messed around with the Xoom for a little bit. Quickly I realized why its been a couple years since I've been to this store (prices?!?!), not to mention the help asking me if I had any questions and if I was looking to buy the Xoom (they left me alone after proclaiming I was completely satisfied with my gtab).
The only real difference I could notice (which in my eyes was a big one) was the interface. Its definitely more "flashy" in looks and prettier for eye-candy, but no real difference outside of that, actually seemed to lag a bit; almost comparable to the gtab out of box.
Me personally, I'm in no hurry to see any kind of honeycreams equivalent make its way to the gtab. I'm more anxious to see gojimi release their vegan ginger Beta more than anything right now. Been counting the days (sometimes hours) since reading their update about him coming back from vacation, lets do this!
Closing thread - see this
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1026411
Hey Guys, just came across this article and thought it was a good read. Do you think Android will partner with Asus to make their own brand of tablets...will it be better for us as Android buyers in the future if Android had more control by being the hardware as well as software maker. or do you feel like this is turning them into Apple-lite
http://www.androidauthority.com/will-google-abandon-android-71483/
Seems like Android Authority is a bit desperate for clicks. That is all I got from it.
detta123 said:
Seems like Android Authority is a bit desperate for clicks. That is all I got from it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah basically..lol.
they taking the whole Asus Manufacturing Google Nexus tablet and spinning it into some crazy apocalyptic Android dying story. Android will be fine. Android growth has really actually just begun. we haven't seen nothing yet. Google needs a nexus tablet to instill confidence and optimism in Androids future. It can almost be guareenteed to attract more developers to android ecosystem. If android was dying, I'd seriously doubt they'd be making a tablet with Asus, restructured Google Play Store, and Making Google store purchases possible to be made online by anyone. All these recent moves Google has made is pointing to something big coming up.
Android for LIFE!
All of my current and future devices will continue to be android.
It is just way too much fun, IOS sucks.
If android goes away, I will go back to laptops.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk
I dont even want to read that article Android brings profit and is a huge thing worldwide. Why would you abandon something like this? Of course its not Google's biggest income generator but it has so much potential and it serves as competition to Apple.
Google deciding to do some hardware manufacturing? I really like that. They probably learn from it and be able to improve the software/hardware.
There is one thing though they could do to android imho. I like some of the 3rd party GUI's that come with android devices. For example HTC Sense. They add alot of nice widgets and great looking uniform base apps.
BUT. At the price of getting important updates like ICS half a year later? No... No.
For me there are 2 ways those companies could handle the situation. Make custom UI's optional. Let people use vanilla Android if they want fast upgrades and let them switch to custom UI's once their done. Or just open all the bootloaders and release all kernel source and stuff to XDA so people can make their own roms and updates (which usually are better anyway...).
Apart from that Android is just totally great.
clouds5 said:
For me there are 2 ways those companies could handle the situation. Make custom UI's optional. Let people use vanilla Android if they want fast upgrades and let them switch to custom UI's once their done. Or just open all the bootloaders and release all kernel source and stuff to XDA so people can make their own roms and updates (which usually are better anyway...).
Apart from that Android is just totally great.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually Google is already consdidering this. read several articles on it. it's a great idea bit one catch, Phone carriers would hate it. those companies add those GUI to devices to differentiate themselves from other similar devices. I'd rather have vanilla android experience and not have bloat ui on top of it. A GUI on top of vanilla android will never be faster out the box than a plain vanilla experience. one suggestion was to make the various companies GUI removable if the user chooses. they could use that companies GUI or go vanilla route or use one of the many launchers available on android. Usually a company GUI will be more integrated and stable than one from marketplace.
Yeah i've read about that too. i dont think custom UIs need to go away. Sometimes they're great. And with tegra3 phones coming out i guess the performance wont be such an issue anymore.
But i'd love to see some change in that situation. I think updates shouldnt be delayed more than 1 month. Not like half a year.
The article is the usual blog filler; title is admittedly clickbait. Then again, most news & blog sites have SEO'ed titles to varying degree. Yellow journalism used to be on the fringe. Now, it's the way to get clicks. That's the cost of "free" content.
Idle gossip aside, Google's strategy for tablet adoption has not worked. It will need to do something, and soon. We should know by Google I/O in June, if not earlier.
IMO, the rumors presently circulating--direct-sale of cheapo tablet & online store--aren't enough. The problems are more fundamental, and are myriad. To me, what's discouraging aren't the obstacles, but that I haven't seen any signal from Google leadership that they recognize the scope of the obstacles.
At any rate, Android won't suffer the fate of WebOS. It's entrenched on phones, and its open-source distribution will allow it to live on as a "hobbyist" OS, if nothing else.
Things move pretty fast in this mobile market, so we won't have long to wait, one way or the other.
Trolling done wrong.
A terrible excuse for either op-ed or journalism. sigh.
Seems this kid who wrote the article didn't get the point of android....
It amplifies all the Google services. It gives Google a extremely huge platform to present their products... it generates Google accounts which can be used for the almost infinite range of Google products. It helps to spread G+ and not to mention Google ad-words..
There is no essential need for a strong Google Phone brand... When you use it the normal way you pretty soon notice that Android is a Google product... you are asked to create a Google account, you have a ton of Google services pre-installed etc. .
Android could be a losing deal and it would still be worth the effort. Just because it spreads Google stuff. The power you have when 50% of the smart-phones world wide run with your is is enormous... Google does not have to worry too much about branding as long as the providers don't remove the Google-Products from it...
I see it like a commenter in the article, Google Tablet to fight the Kindle Fire... because it breaks the Google-branding... not so funny for Google...
>[Android] amplifies all the Google services. It gives Google a extremely huge platform to present their products...There is no essential need for a strong Google Phone brand...Android could be a losing deal and it would still be worth the effort.
These are all true. But IMO it misses the forest for the trees, the forest in this case being the next computing form factor, ie the tablet being a successor rather than adjunct of laptops. That should be the goal, not just an extension to sell more wares.
To be the next "computer," the OS has to do more, akin to the range of functions on desktop OS'es. Android, like iOS, lacks basic underpinnings--things like built-in networking, printing, support for peripheral devices, apps interoperability, etc etc.
The shortcoming doesn't affect Apple, because iOS has achieved critical mass on phones and tablets. Its success engenders 3rd-party support to address any deficit faced.
The other aspect not oft mentioned is that a bona fide OS needs support. One takeaway from a quick scan through these and other (official) Android forums is that OS support is grossly inadequate. As much complaints as there are in this forum, Asus is actually one of the better vendors for support. Users of Acer, Toshiba, and others, have given up on support. And these are enthusiasts. Think of how worse it would be for normal users.
The writing is on the wall: HW vendors don't have the expertise to support the OS. Google needs to do it. But with its current distribution philosophy, ie making AOSP code public and let HW vendors do what they will, Google can't do that. For it to support its OS, Google will need to follow the Microsoft path.
Getting its hands dirty with its own hardware may be a start, assuming Google better supports its product. But customer support has never been in Google's DNA, so I have my doubt that things would improve soon.
Google bought Motorolla, why would they need to partner with ASUS?
Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk
>Google bought Motorolla, why would they need to partner with ASUS?
Because Asus can make cheap tablets, eg the rumored $199 tab, and Moto can't. Secondly, because Google still needs to maintain some degree of impartiality. With declining vendor support (on tablets), it can ill afford to piss off the few remaining.
e.mote said:
>Google bought Motorolla, why would they need to partner with ASUS?
Because Asus can make cheap tablets, eg the rumored $199 tab, and Moto can't. Secondly, because Google still needs to maintain some degree of impartiality. With declining vendor support (on tablets), it can ill afford to piss off the few remaining.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, the Motorola Xoom, great as it was(I owned one), was simply overpriced.
I do believe that in order to be widely accepted as being better than Apple, Google needs to seriously focus on getting better developer support. You can release the best tablet in the world, but if you do not have developer support, people will continue to flock to IOS. Lower the price of tablets while maintaining good quality standards, and gain developer support=win for Android
e.mote said:
>[Android] amplifies all the Google services. It gives Google a extremely huge platform to present their products...There is no essential need for a strong Google Phone brand...Android could be a losing deal and it would still be worth the effort.
These are all true. But IMO it misses the forest for the trees, the forest in this case being the next computing form factor, ie the tablet being a successor rather than adjunct of laptops. That should be the goal, not just an extension to sell more wares.
To be the next "computer," the OS has to do more, akin to the range of functions on desktop OS'es. Android, like iOS, lacks basic underpinnings--things like built-in networking, printing, support for peripheral devices, apps interoperability, etc etc.
The shortcoming doesn't affect Apple, because iOS has achieved critical mass on phones and tablets. Its success engenders 3rd-party support to address any deficit faced.
The other aspect not oft mentioned is that a bona fide OS needs support. One takeaway from a quick scan through these and other (official) Android forums is that OS support is grossly inadequate. As much complaints as there are in this forum, Asus is actually one of the better vendors for support. Users of Acer, Toshiba, and others, have given up on support. And these are enthusiasts. Think of how worse it would be for normal users.
The writing is on the wall: HW vendors don't have the expertise to support the OS. Google needs to do it. But with its current distribution philosophy, ie making AOSP code public and let HW vendors do what they will, Google can't do that. For it to support its OS, Google will need to follow the Microsoft path.
Getting its hands dirty with its own hardware may be a start, assuming Google better supports its product. But customer support has never been in Google's DNA, so I have my doubt that things would improve soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You make some interesting points, but I disagree that iOS is anywhere near being accepted as a PC replacement. In many important ways, Android is much farther along in this respect--access to the file system alone is one area. And, I think the idea that tablets will replace PCs is way overblown--having tried to use mine (even with the keyboard dock) as a replacement for my Windows notebook, I can testify that although some things are more convenient with tablets (like ebook reading, casual surfing, etc.), NOTHING is as efficient as with a "real" PC.
I could never do my job on any existing tablet, whether it's iOS or Android. I work with complex documents, use Photoshop for more than changing color tones, do some light video editing, etc. None of those are efficient (or even possible) on a tablet. Even the simple things like browsing, Twitter, etc., etc., are more efficient on a notebook or desktop. Again, a tablet is convenient--lightweight, long battery life, etc.--so it has its place alongside a real PC. But thinking it can replace a PC for most people is, I think, entirely unrealistic at this point.
Maybe that'll change in a few years, although I doubt even that. Seriously, who can imagine working EXCLUSIVELY on a 10" screen? And if a tablet becomes something that you plug into external monitors and keyboards and such, well then, ASUS is already mostly there with the Transformer series. And at that point what we'll have is just a more portable PC with external accessories. Once a tablet becomes complex enough in terms of network support, printing, peripheral devices like scanners, etc., then is it really a "tablet" any longer?
..........
demandarin said:
Actually Google is already consdidering this. read several articles on it. it's a great idea bit one catch, Phone carriers would hate it. those companies add those GUI to devices to differentiate themselves from other similar devices. I'd rather have vanilla android experience and not have bloat ui on top of it. A GUI on top of vanilla android will never be faster out the box than a plain vanilla experience. one suggestion was to make the various companies GUI removable if the user chooses. they could use that companies GUI or go vanilla route or use one of the many launchers available on android. Usually a company GUI will be more integrated and stable than one from marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was hearing at one point that Google was looking to simplify the custom GUI creation (just a custom GUI xml that the manufacturer can push that the vanilla OS will honor) so that even if there are large changes underneath by Google, there is no change needed by the manufacturer prior to release (assuming the manufacturer is only making GUI changes and not anything deeper).
sparkym3 said:
I was hearing at one point that Google was looking to simplify the custom GUI creation (just a custom GUI xml that the manufacturer can push that the vanilla OS will honor) so that even if there are large changes underneath by Google, there is no change needed by the manufacturer prior to release (assuming the manufacturer is only making GUI changes and not anything deeper).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that was what it was involving. thanks for pointing out those details.
Link doesn't work anymore!
Is it just me or does android Overall lack standardizations?
There are so many different versions of android tablets and phones that app developers seem to have to make for one, then keep changing for others.
Things do not seem to be cross compatible between devices either.
The way I'm looking at is is like windows:
With windows you have all kinds of PC's and there is a standard, Keyboard & mouse. Windows interfaces between the hardware and apps and allows seamless transfer between different PC's with windows OS.
Then I look at android. And what runs on my android tablet, wont work on my friends tablet. Same in reverse.
Basically has anyone else noticed this? Lack of standardization when it comes to a practical interface?
And it seems to fall on the app devs to support a specific device, when android itself should be the interface between the hardware and the app.
Does anyone see where I'm coming from?
What does everyone else think?
Do you think there will eventually be a standard with android devices like what happen to the PC after Microsoft made windows and created a standard in that respect?
Do you think that traditional PC computers running windows and MAC will eventually phase out?
--------------------------------------------
And whats the deal with a phone needing 2 GHz dual core CPU's?
If the code was optimized properly, wouldn't you be able to get the same speed and quality from half that?
I've seen high end android tablet lag badly, when an intel PC of lesser speed runs windows just fine.
I dont get it, It would save battery power as well if it was refined, would it not?
---------------------------------------------
I dont really want this to be a question air post and people answer, I'm hoping all kinds of us people can have one big giant discussion.
Maybe if enough people want a standard for tablets and smartphones like there is with computers, there will be better progress.
Because at the moment, everyone seems to be doing their own thing, and they are all suing each other over the dumbest details, so what if someone elses device has a home button in the front like an iPhone, where else would you put it?
I think Samsung has the best setup of all of them, its touch buttons in the front bottom, other buttons on the sides.
Seems like a good place to start a standard design, don't you think?
The biggest advantage that Android currently has is that its available for every price range, in every flavor you would want. Android reached 72% market share not due to the flagships but due to the lower end devices that majority of consumers buy. Standardizing the specs at a high end would cause it to not be affordable for many people especially in countries outside the US where there are no carrier subsidies. So I vote for it to go on like this.
premsrj said:
The biggest advantage that Android currently has is that its available for every price range, in every flavor you would want. Android reached 72% market share not due to the flagships but due to the lower end devices that majority of consumers buy. Standardizing the specs at a high end would cause it to not be affordable for many people especially in countries outside the US where there are no carrier subsidies. So I vote for it to go on like this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mean creating a standard like with windows PC's, they are all the same basically, and each has its own price range and level of power.
And windows is the interface between the hardware and the software you install.
With android, I don't see this, I see app developers having to make the app for each device, when they should just have to make it for the android OS, and the android OS is the interface and inturpurtation between the app you install and the device hardware.
Aside from that, they should all at least have a basic standard interface like home, back, search, power, volume, buttons and then the touch screen. Kinda like the samsung phone design.
There are only so many physically achievable ways we can design a smart phone, for example apple sued Samsung over copying their iPhone because the home button on the Samsung phone was mechanical. I mean, what is this world coming to? Where would apple have liked samsung to stick the home button? On the back of the device?
It is in a practical location. So why not put it front and bottom of the screen?
I'm after a "basic" standard, not a complete identical standard. Something kinda like how every windows PC has the same basic keyboard design and mouse design. The rest can be different... But apply it to smart phones and tablets in their own respective interfaces designed.
See what I mean?
(I'm thinking of this great world where android ARM tablets, PC's, and phones replace the current computer systems and stuff. It would work, android seems to be able to do so much more and consume so much less power. While maintaining the same or greater speeds.)
zBusterCB87 said:
I mean creating a standard like with windows PC's, they are all the same basically, and each has its own price range and level of power.
And windows is the interface between the hardware and the software you install.
With android, I don't see this, I see app developers having to make the app for each device, when they should just have to make it for the android OS, and the android OS is the interface and inturpurtation between the app you install and the device hardware.
Aside from that, they should all at least have a basic standard interface like home, back, search, power, volume, buttons and then the touch screen. Kinda like the samsung phone design.
There are only so many physically achievable ways we can design a smart phone, for example apple sued Samsung over copying their iPhone because the home button on the Samsung phone was mechanical. I mean, what is this world coming to? Where would apple have liked samsung to stick the home button? On the back of the device?
It is in a practical location. So why not put it front and bottom of the screen?
I'm after a "basic" standard, not a complete identical standard. Something kinda like how every windows PC has the same basic keyboard design and mouse design. The rest can be different... But apply it to smart phones and tablets in their own respective interfaces designed.
See what I mean?
(I'm thinking of this great world where android ARM tablets, PC's, and phones replace the current computer systems and stuff. It would work, android seems to be able to do so much more and consume so much less power. While maintaining the same or greater speeds.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You must be a great essay writer
My English teacher would give you an A for sure.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using xda premium
What are the chances we'll see the new Ubuntu for phones os running on our hardware anytime soon?
As far as I understand it it should be just a matter of compiling for our specific soc, making a flashable rom and then flashing, right? They say it can run on android kernels so there shouldn't have to be any hardware interface work that needs to be done, right?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda app-developers app
If you don't mind me asking, how would this make any difference to us?
rangercaptain said:
If you don't mind me asking, how would this make any difference to us?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It would enable us an alternative operating system choice, allowing application developers to create processor native applications (rather than using a java virtual machine that's quite resource intensive than running apps on the bare metal) thus using less system resources, enabling faster multitasking, greater compatibility with preexisting applications, enhanced security, and the desktop mode that they are touting is quite nice as well. connect an hdmi dongle and use a bluetooth keyboard and mouse to turn the phone into a desktop computer... there are lots of uses for a bare metal operating system on a hardware platform with restrictive system resources.
there's really nothing wrong with android per se, she's a great OS, but there are a wide number of other approaches to building os's and user experiences. I would consider this pretty similar to choosing to install ubuntu on a PC, or windows on a mac for that matter. it's a matter of widening the variety of application approaches and compatibility. a matter of choice.
I really want to know if this is possible after seeing the demo of it on engadget this morning I'm convinced that this is one os I'd be willing to flash and possibly leave on over android, as amazing as Android is this just better though out in terms of where everything is and speed of access
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using Tapatalk 2
It may take off, if someone is able to best the entire android community as a whole, but the odds of that are "0"...
We would be better served if google took it over, and incorporated the OS into a handful of smart phones. Beyond that prospect, a port for us would be nothing more than a pet project.
This idea is not new, and mention of it can be found in virtually ever forum on this site, and a few devs have met with success on getting a bootable Android device running Ubuntu, but it was a short lived event, as support for the OS is simply not there ATM.
I do agree that a different OS is a good idea, but as a dedicated Android user, I would not be willing to switch at this point, as a stable, functional OS is months or even years away.
Likely the OS would fall the way of RIM, and other OS platforms, albeit, ahead of it's time.....g
gregsarg said:
It may take off, if someone is able to best the entire android community as a whole, but the odds of that are "0"...
We would be better served if google took it over, and incorporated the OS into a handful of smart phones. Beyond that prospect, a port for us would be nothing more than a pet project.
This idea is not new, and mention of it can be found in virtually ever forum on this site, and a few devs have met with success on getting a bootable Android device running Ubuntu, but it was a short lived event, as support for the OS is simply not there ATM.
I do agree that a different OS is a good idea, but as a dedicated Android user, I would not be willing to switch at this point, as a stable, functional OS is months or even years away.
Likely the OS would fall the way of RIM, and other OS platforms, albeit, ahead of it's time.....g
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I strongly believe that everyone is entitled to their opinion, the fact of the matter is that it's already running on the quintessential android test bed for the current generation of phones (the galaxy nexus) which means that it should be very easily ported to other, similar hardware (which is most of the android devices out there right now.). if they made this completely open source (which i'm pretty sure they'd have to given that most of the components of the OS are built on open-source licenses), and allowed the already very good and very diverse linux community expand it's functionality, write good apps for it, I think it has some pretty great promise.
my personal standpoint however, is that operating systems for mobile should work exactly like they do for PC's (and macs for that matter). you should be able to install whatever, whenever, without the approval of the company that happens to make the hardware, and without the approval of the company who provides the data and telephone services for the device... it's a pocket computer, not a dumb phone designed for one thing.
I thought Android was Linux and Ubuntu was Linux. Why is one type better than the other? And to run native, wouldn't hardware manufacturers have to write a butt load of drivers? Like the fiasco of upgrading from win2000 to win7.
Ubuntu won't be released til 2014, will older phones like our note1 be supported?
Keep in mind that by 2014 the note1 would be considered old in mobile years.
rangercaptain said:
I thought Android was Linux and Ubuntu was Linux. Why is one type better than the other? And to run native, wouldn't hardware manufacturers have to write a butt load of drivers? Like the fiasco of upgrading from win2000 to win7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hardware drivers always run on the bare metal anyway (usually as part of the kernel, or occasionally as a background daemon service). the point is that android applications are built on top of the java environment which is a virtual machine - it's processes are abstracted and emulated which requires much more system resources than writing in something like c++ for the underlaying hardware. the only compatibility that this would break is that binaries don't work across cpu platforms. if something is compiled for the arm9 architecture for example (what most modern smartphones use, including our note), it wouldn't run on android for x86 or another java virtual machine like bluestacks. in order to get it to run on a different hardware platform you'd either have to emulate a complete device (like the iphone and android sdk simulators), or recompile it for the platform you want to run it on (only useful if you have the source code). the latter method is how linux distributions have been doing things for years. there are virtually identical linux distributions that can run on intel, arm, powerpc, sparc, motorola 68k, etc. etc. they can all run pretty much the same applications (because of the hardware abstraction layer present in the kernel), but in order for it to work, those applications must be recompiled for the appropriate underlaying processor architecture, as the output of a c(++,#) compiler is code that is cpu architecture specific.
also, windows 2000 and windows 7 were designed for the same (or similar) underlaying hardware problems. windows 2000 to windows 7 was mostly a piece of cake. whereas the move from windows 98 to windows 2000 or windows 98 to windows xp was difficult because windows 9x and windows 2000/xp use a different variety of hardware abstraction layer and thus different drivers must be written as drivers designed for one HAL won't work with another. (same thing for major linux revisions. the HAL in the 2.4 series of kernels is different from the one in 2.6 series of kernels which means one has to rewrite device drivers in order to get some less-than-standard hardware working.
So cp....
your a smart guy...
Get it going for us.....
you've got the skills we need to pull it off....g
gregsarg said:
So cp....
your a smart guy...
Get it going for us.....
you've got the skills we need to pull it off....g
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, If i had access to the sources (that by all rights should be open thanks to the way the gpl is designed), I'd be happy to build a rom and help with the development efforts. I'm pretty decent at optimizing linux distributions for arm hardware. we should all petition canonical to release the code post haste.
I would love to see ubuntu ported over to phones. I almost fell off my chair when I heard of the idea that your phone could just connect to a monitor/keyboard/mouse to become a fully fledged desktop computer. This would literally replace almost all of my gadgets into one device. I wouldn't need a laptop, an ipod, a dvd player, or even a gaming console possibly as well.
I've been using ubuntu for a number of years and would be overjoyed to see almost all of my electronics and computing essentially made into one pocket sized device. The possibilities are so great for this kind of leap in technology and it almost seems to be the inevitable succession in personal computer technology. This could possibly be the beginning of the end for laptops, desktops, tablets, and netbooks/ultrabooks. All data would be transmitted using flash memory or transmitted OTA instead of spinning disks or other media.
If the source code is released, and I'm sure it will since Canonical has done a decent job of running Ubuntu lately, I hope someone brings it to the i717 because then I would probably sell a lot of electronic equipment
The release will never happen to allow a single, all inclusive device.
Ubuntu or not, there are too many hands in the pie, and billions of dollars on the table.
The apples, and Samsungs of the world will go at it until the day we die.
They all want the biggest piece, and will squash anyone that gets in their way.
Ubuntu would need a home run piece of code that emulates a magic carpet if they ever hope to slay the beast.
And if they did, I'm not so sure that people would embrace the one stop shop mentality for a single device anyway.
It simply stinks of yet another apple type monopoly in the making.
I support the idea, but it's the logistics that kill the deal, money driven logistics of course.....g
gregsarg said:
The release will never happen to allow a single, all inclusive device.
Ubuntu or not, there are too many hands in the pie, and billions of dollars on the table.
The apples, and Samsungs of the world will go at it until the day we die.
They all want the biggest piece, and will squash anyone that gets in their way.
Ubuntu would need a home run piece of code that emulates a magic carpet if they ever hope to slay the beast.
And if they did, I'm not so sure that people would embrace the one stop shop mentality for a single device anyway.
It simply stinks of yet another apple type monopoly in the making.
I support the idea, but it's the logistics that kill the deal, money driven logistics of course.....g
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Too true, it's all about the money in the end, even with free stuff.
Now that you mention it, it does sound a lot like some sort of Apple type ploy to get you to buy their things... either way I hope it happens someday