I just did the process of bricking my phone to downgrade hboot to 1.40 and got s-off with revolutionary.my question is,how to root my phone.I been looking around for rooting guides but they are like 2 or 3 different ways to.root it but I don't know wish one.to.use.I am a new to this.thanks
Danieliyo said:
I just did the process of bricking my phone to downgrade hboot to 1.40 and got s-off with revolutionary.my question is,how to root my phone.I been looking around for rooting guides but they are like 2 or 3 different ways to.root it but I don't know wish one.to.use.I am a new to this.thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You'll need a package to get SU like this . . . And you'll use it like any other in recovery than you should have root and be able to control what your phone pronpts via SU.
easy
Go to
www.revolutionary.io that is the quickest and easiest way. Make sure you have usb debugging checked, you will also need the serial # and the hboot for your phone, it will either be 1.5 0r 1.4.
Just follow the prompts at that web site, it is super easy, it even puts clockwork mod recovery on your phone for you, if you need help just pm me
musicman625 said:
Go to
www.revolutionary.io that is the quickest and easiest way. Make sure you have usb debugging checked, you will also need the serial # and the hboot for your phone, it will either be 1.5 0r 1.4.
Just follow the prompts at that web site, it is super easy, it even puts clockwork mod recovery on your phone for you, if you need help just pm me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He already did that . . . I think if I read his OP correctly, he just wants root access to his phone, which Rev doesn't give you off the bat.
Related
Hi there,
the next days I receive my HTC Flyer.... how can I be sure which root method I need ? How to check if it got S-OFF ?
I really wanna make phone calls later and use honeycomb >.>
The bootloqder of this test device in this store shows s-on. Can there be something done if s-on ?
This forum has a search function...
I feel gloomy about it when you can't read and search in this forum by yourself
So, use the search function here, read a little bit and you will find the answers. And don't forget to be happy and thankful
Refer. To revolutionary. Or HTC unlock
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
Ah ok so things like GSM Calls are possible either on S-ON or not .... thats great ^-^
Although the amount of information on XDA can be intimidating, you should at least try to use the search function, browse through the Development subforum, and read and educate yourself before making a post like this. If every noob that came on here posted basic questions like this before doing any research, this forum would quickly be swamped with such posts and be completely useless.
I used this guide to get S-Off and root, and its quite easy:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1194709
I personally have not tried the HC install. Its fairly complicated, and not without risk. But plenty of folks on here have done it.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1248635
My advice, read up and understand as much as you can before starting either process. Then follow the instructions very carefully.
Unsure about Rooting etc... can I make a backup before ? What if Rooting etc. goes wrong ?
Download Tool + Desire = ROOTED ... but this is complicated... I will ask again how exactly is the most secure method to do it ;D
shinwa87 said:
Unsure about Rooting etc... can I make a backup before ? What if Rooting etc. goes wrong ?
Download Tool + Desire = ROOTED ... but this is complicated... I will ask again how exactly is the most secure method to do it ;D
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately, there is no way to backup the ROM without root. If things go wrong during root, you may be able to recover using the official RUU, following this guide: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1195688
Desire is a pretty old phone. HTC has been adding more and more security against rooting and S-Off for the past year, and its probably only going to get worse (or at least stay the same). So if your intent moving forward is learning how to root current and future HTC devices, you might as well get used to the increased complexity.
The S-Off and rooting guides I linked to is actually quite easy. I think I accomplished it all in about 15 minutes, including downloading the needed files. Really, the S-Off process is just to get your Flyer hooked up properly to your PC, run the Revolutionary app to get S-Off, and that's really it. Its just broken down in very simple steps, to make it very clear. If you look at the step, some of them are not even really steps. Like the first step is "read the documentation", which you should already be reading up as much as you can before you start, anyway.
Once you have S-Off, getting root is just a matter of putting a file on the Flyer, and flashing it. Again, its just broken down into so many steps, to make it really simple and clear.
Installing HC is another matter. I haven't ventured to try it myself, but it looks significantly more complicated and risky than rooting. Its a lot of REAL steps, and the guide itself says its recommend only for experts. If you aren't confident about performing the HC installation, I'd stay away from it until the official update is released.
same like with my desire =) ... but after root, just download clockworkmod and install ROM ?
Ok now I can be precise ;D
FLYER PVT SHIP S-ON RL
HBOOT-1.07.0000
MICROP-0850
eMMC-boot
Now you can help me I hope ^^
someone ? I dont want to brick it when accessing Root (AND FINALLY) GSM Calls Funtion
Bump again .... I really dont wanna make a mistake
shinwa87 said:
same like with my desire =) ... but after root, just download clockworkmod and install ROM ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You install clockworkmod after you get S-Off with Revolutionary, and before you root. You need clockworkmod recovery to flash the root file.
After root, I would use clockworkmod to backup the stock ROM. But then yes, just flash your desired ROM from recovery after that.
Seriously, there are not a lot of steps or ways to mess them up. Just follow the instructions carefully. Don't mess with the phone (power off or unplug) while its flashing, and make sure you have plenty of battery before for each step (>50% should be plenty).
Yeah but your guides are for HBOOT 1.10 ;D ... I got 1.7 as I said ... thats why I am unsure :/ ....
USB Debug + Fastboot off .... and then ? Revolutionary -> ClockWork -> Backup -> Honeycomb Leak install -> GSM Call Activation ?
Like this ?
FIRST OF ALL, BE WARNED, YOUR WARRANTY MAY BE VOIDED IF YOU S-OFF YOUR FLYER
STEP 1
First, you have to make sure that your hboot version is compatible with the revolutionary tool. (Which yours are not, that adds a few more steps)
STEP 2
Go to http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1198650 and follow the instructions.
STEP 3
After successfully patching your hboot to the ROM's version on that thread, you are ready to go! Go http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1194709 and follow the instructions. PS: Remember to type Y and enter when it asks you wether you want to download and flash clockworkmod recovery. (S-OFF and root instructions are in the thread, just follow them, it's fairly simple)
STEP 4
Your Flyer is now S-OFFed and rooted, go to recovery (navigate from bootloader) and do a backup as you wish.
STEP 5
Download any ROM from this thread and flash it with recovery (navigate from bootloader -> install zip from sd card (Make sure you copied the rom to your SD card)-> Warning: This cannot be undone blah blah blah. YES)
STEP 6
Enjoy and hit the Thanks button if I helped.
#2 AFAIK - You need a Flyer that is HBOOT: 1.10.000
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Step 2 in this one in your link ;D ... I got 1.7
There are no v1.7 hboot for Flyer, check again. Yours should be v1.07 and v1.07 is not supported right now.
so I MUST keep Gingerbread and there is NO CHANCE for me to get Honeycomb until release ?
Nope. Just follow the instructions in the second step of my instructions to upgrade your hboot to s-off.
JazLiew said:
Nope. Just follow the instructions in the second step of my instructions to upgrade your hboot to s-off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I could do that... But the only thing is that I am unsure about the security.... I am afraid of bricking my Desire ... Then nobody can repair it :/ ....
Isn't there an easier method of making goldcard etc ?
I FINALLY switched over from the TP2 (thank god) and have been reading up on android rooting and ICS. I bought a used Evo 3D from ebay and the specs are below:
Shooter XC Ship S-ON RL
HBOOT-1.5.0000
eMMC-Boot
Aug 7 2011
Android 2.3.4
Sense 3.0
Software 2.17.651.5
Kernel 2.6.35.13-g277012f
I want to put ICS on here but am not sure exactly what I need to do. What I have done so far is put the phone in USB debug mode and started following the instructions here for hboot 1.5: http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/htc-evo-3d-development/146081-how-guide-s-off-recovery-root.html which took me to http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1343114
I installed the HTC drivers, hooked my phone to the usb cable with usb debug mode on, my computer recognized the phone and opened it as a drive, I started up htc supertool v3 and did option 1 for prep. I then did option 3 for rooting and it started flashing and said the phone was rooted. How do I check to make sure this actually worked?
I am not sure what I need to do next. I don't want to go any further without some info as I don't want to screw up this phone. Where do I go from here? Do I now do option 4? Do I need a "custom recovery" as mentioned in this thread: http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/htc-evo-3...ms-1-13652-1-ics-4-0-3-updated-5-17-12-a.html if so, how do I get that done? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
killerz298 said:
I FINALLY switched over from the TP2 (thank god) and have been reading up on android rooting and ICS. I bought a used Evo 3D from ebay and the specs are below:
Shooter XC Ship S-ON RL
HBOOT-1.5.0000
eMMC-Boot
Aug 7 2011
Android 2.3.4
Sense 3.0
Software 2.17.651.5
Kernel 2.6.35.13-g277012f
I want to put ICS on here but am not sure exactly what I need to do. What I have done so far is put the phone in USB debug mode and started following the instructions here for hboot 1.5: http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/htc-evo-3d-development/146081-how-guide-s-off-recovery-root.html which took me to http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1343114
I installed the HTC drivers, hooked my phone to the usb cable with usb debug mode on, my computer recognized the phone and opened it as a drive, I started up htc supertool v3 and did option 1 for prep. I then did option 3 for rooting and it started flashing and said the phone was rooted. How do I check to make sure this actually worked?
I am not sure what I need to do next. I don't want to go any further without some info as I don't want to screw up this phone. Where do I go from here? Do I now do option 4? Do I need a "custom recovery" as mentioned in this thread: http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/htc-evo-3...ms-1-13652-1-ics-4-0-3-updated-5-17-12-a.html if so, how do I get that done? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Instead of thoroughly explaining the process.. it's already been done.
CMDA Android Development forum > Roll-up Sticky by Lufc.
Download "Root Checker" to check for root. Or actually, if you have SuperUser installed, you're rooted.
G.Newton said:
Instead of thoroughly explaining the process.. it's already been done.
CMDA Android Development forum > Roll-up Sticky by Lufc.
Download "Root Checker" to check for root. Or actually, if you have SuperUser installed, you're rooted.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. I saw that post but I was concerned that something would be out of date and I would screw things up. Are all the links in that post current? I will check them out and then follow up here if I am still too dumb to understand what to do. Will what I have already done with the super tool affect anything I try to do from that post? Root checker said I do NOT have root access so I guess whatever I did last night didn't work.
Also, my company email requires good mobile messaging which I hear can be configured to detect root and disable the app. I am not sure if my company has this enabled or not. Is there a certain method of doing this which would allow me to still use good messaging with a rooted device? Would I be able to root the device, install ICS rom, then unroot it so the app would work?
killerz298 said:
Thanks. I saw that post but I was concerned that something would be out of date and I would screw things up. Are all the links in that post current? I will check them out and then follow up here if I am still too dumb to understand what to do. Will what I have already done with the super tool affect anything I try to do from that post? Root checker said I do NOT have root access so I guess whatever I did last night didn't work.
Also, my company email requires good mobile messaging which I hear can be configured to detect root and disable the app. I am not sure if my company has this enabled or not. Is there a certain method of doing this which would allow me to still use good messaging with a rooted device? Would I be able to root the device, install ICS rom, then unroot it so the app would work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
when you boot to recovery... the line on the top said: Shooter XC Ship S-ON RL
You precisly wrote it yourself.
Does it say "S-OFF" now? That means the security feature is disabled and you can flash whatever you find desirable. The bootloader is unlocked.
You just need to download a ROM and flash it. You should get a nice ROM manager aplication like 4ext. You can flash easily with it.
By rooting you didn't do anything ilegal (you gained administrator privileges), so it should be ok with the messaging software at work.
marC00Linho said:
when you boot to recovery... the line on the top said: Shooter XC Ship S-ON RL
You precisly wrote it yourself.
Does it say "S-OFF" now? That means the security feature is disabled and you can flash whatever you find desirable. The bootloader is unlocked.
You just need to download a ROM and flash it. You should get a nice ROM manager aplication like 4ext. You can flash easily with it.
By rooting you didn't do anything ilegal (you gained administrator privileges), so it should be ok with the messaging software at work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wrote shooter as I figured you guys needed to know that info. I have no idea what that means. It doesn't say off now.
As for good messaging I know the employer can configure it to detect and block access on rooted phones.
Simple...I want to root this thing and get s= off...but I swear HTC and their bootloaders suck at rooting in my opinion and I am very confused on how to root this guy..can someone explain what to do first...I'm guessing unlocking first but idk..
I am on HBoot 1.5 and the latest firmware...any help would be greatly appreciated and appreciate your time at least reading this
Sent from my "not so 3D, Evo 3D" using XDA Premium
Phantomg93 said:
Simple...I want to root this thing and get s= off...but I swear HTC and their bootloaders suck at rooting in my opinion and I am very confused on how to root this guy..can someone explain what to do first...I'm guessing unlocking first but idk..
I am on HBoot 1.5 and the latest firmware...any help would be greatly appreciated and appreciate your time at least reading this
Sent from my "not so 3D, Evo 3D" using XDA Premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
first you unlock your bootloader using HTC's method for , next youll want to flash the recovery to a new verson and then boot into it and load your phone as a usb device and then copy over the super user zip and run it...;reboot then youre rootedafter that you look up Unknownforce's method to dpwngrade and obtain s-off or you can do the new "wire trick"
wloftus said:
first you unlock your bootloader using HTC's method for , next youll want to flash the recovery to a new verson and then boot into it and load your phone as a usb device and then copy over the super user zip and run it...;reboot then youre rooted
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have not tried that method but i found this method to work very well..http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1563342
Let me be totally honest the easiest way to hboot s off is to perform the wiretrick it is the easiest fastest way to do it.... its all about the wire timing and having a root on your phone with a pc with the program and adb and fastboot drivers
you can obtain the adb and fastboot drivers by searching rootevo3dnew.zip via google and dll that once done go into the folder or zip file and obtain A file Called HTC Driver.exe click it and install after that use jeuponut bears wiretrick
For me, its easier to use boot cd or boot flashdisk...
I also a new user of shooter, my phone just arrived 36 hours ago but I'm success downgrade to 1.4 hboot, S-off,rooted,custom recovery, and custom ROM..
Just follow this:
Http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1563342
Sorry for my bad English.
Sent from my PG86100
Thanks guys for the replies..I heard of a way that requires the need to brick your phone and I was not doing that at all haha. I know how to use adb so I will look into your suggestions to see if it works out for me. This sucks I have never had a stock phone always rooted and flashed to get the best in life..need to get this darn s unlocked!!lol
Phantomg93 said:
Thanks guys for the replies..I heard of a way that requires the need to brick your phone and I was not doing that at all haha. I know how to use adb so I will look into your suggestions to see if it works out for me. This sucks I have never had a stock phone always rooted and flashed to get the best in life..need to get this darn s unlocked!!lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you follow the directions in the stickies in the development forum, you will be fine. I bricked mine following their directions and had no issues. Either way (using the wire trick or bricking), you will bee so glad you are s-off.
Sent from my ICS 3VO with Tapatalk 2
Phantomg93 said:
Thanks guys for the replies..I heard of a way that requires the need to brick your phone and I was not doing that at all haha. I know how to use adb so I will look into your suggestions to see if it works out for me. This sucks I have never had a stock phone always rooted and flashed to get the best in life..need to get this darn s unlocked!!lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The brick is only a temp-brick. Think of it more as putting it into a "recovery mode" in which you're recovering to a lower hboot. It's simple enough to do once you get it into that mode. Plus you don't have to use HTC Unlock and hand over your warranty to HTC.
For me, its easier to use boot cd or boot flashdisk...
I also a new user of shooter, my phone just arrived 36 hours ago but I'm success downgrade to 1.4 hboot, S-off,rooted,custom recovery, and custom ROM..
Just follow this:
Http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1563342
Sorry for my bad English.
Sent from my PG86100
__________________
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last edited by cupliz; Yesterday at 10:18 AM.
+1
i just followed this link to unlock:
http://androidforums.com/evo-3d-all...shing-evo-3d-roms-kernels-using-fastboot.html
then to downgrade and s-off:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1471246
as iam new to this when i tried it... i am really nervous of bricking my phone... but eventually... i succeeded after several tries of doing the same thing over and over again..... and its pretty exiting....you try it...you'll be fine
Dont use htcdev for these reasons:
1.Warranty void aka re-locked
2. Its a lot of mess
3.You need to flash the boot.img once you flash a new rom again.
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using XDA
I'm trying to temp root my phone so that i can do a backup with titanium backup before I permanently root my phone with HTCDev. How can I temp root my phone. All the methods i am seeing seem to be old and dont work with my hboot and software version. Here are my specs.
HTC EVO 3D Sprint CDMA
HBOOT - 1.58
Software Version - 2.89.651.2 71ORD
What is my best option.
Thanks,
TMPRO
tmpro said:
I'm trying to temp root my phone so that i can do a backup with titanium backup before I permanently root my phone with HTCDev. How can I temp root my phone. All the methods i am seeing seem to be old and dont work with my hboot and software version. Here are my specs.
HTC EVO 3D Sprint CDMA
HBOOT - 1.58
Software Version - 2.89.651.2 71ORD
What is my best option.
Thanks,
TMPRO
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can try this if you haven't already, but it was written for GB not ICS, and it sounds a little "iffy" to me.
Might want to consider MyBackup (Pro) which doesn't require root for the standard backup.
ramjet73
ramjet73 said:
You can try this if you haven't already, but it was written for GB not ICS, and it sounds a little "iffy" to me.
Might want to consider MyBackup (Pro) which doesn't require root for the standard backup.
ramjet73
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply. I have already tried that but to no avail. I'll give My Backup Pro another try. Ive used it before and there was something that it did kinda funky and i cant remember what it did.
After temp root any suggestions on how to permanent root my phone with my specs. I checked out HTCDev but it seems kinda iffy that it would work with my specs. My main reasons to be rooted is so i can install apps for rooted devices (ie. titanium backup, screen capture ect.) and maybe down the road get into messing around with custom ROM's. I would appreciate any advice and step by step procedure on how to do this since I am new to all this stuff.
Thanks,
HTC dev works on hboot 1.58 as does the wire trick. After temp rooting to backup:
1. Unlock with HTC dev.
2. push a custom recovery
3. Install super user to give you root
4. (optional for what you want) Do wire trick to get s-off.
A word of warning: my phone just bootlooped when I temp rooted. Not a big deal, but I lost my data.
Read, Search, Read again, ... Then Ask with Tapatalk 2
coal686 said:
HTC dev works on hboot 1.58 as does the wire trick. After temp rooting to backup:
1. Unlock with HTC dev.
2. push a custom recovery
3. Install super user to give you root
4. (optional for what you want) Do wire trick to get s-off.
A word of warning: my phone just bootlooped when I temp rooted. Not a big deal, but I lost my data.
Read, Search, Read again, ... Then Ask with Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok i just have a few questions.
First
What/Where is a good "custom recovery" and is this for?
Second
How do i install super user?
Third
Where can I get good instructions on how to complete step 4? And what does "s-off" allow me to do?
What does bootlooped mean?
Sorry for all the questions i just want to be sure i know whats going on before i get into this and possibly mess my phone up. I prefer videos tutorials so if you have any good suggestions that would be great. Tutorials that work with my phones specs.
Thanks,
Hi guys!
I read the forum, then read some more. And then read sticky topics and other links....
... and I'm totally confused now!
I want to root the phone, so I can manipulate the memory of it. That's it. I don't want to lock, unlock, S-off, flash or whatever the term it is for whatever action.
Is there a glossary on those terms, readable by a human being?
What I need is the Game CIH to work, so I can get more money/coins/lives/whatever in my games.
For that, I need the phone rooted.
And there we have it Now you know what I need, so if there's someone that can tell me 'go follow THIS tutorial' or 'read here', I would be very grateful!
This is most likely already poking my eyes out, but I have no idea what ROM flashing is, nor why would I want S-OFF instead of S-ON....
Help!
AW: What do I need for root?
If u only want root you dont need s-off
S-off gives you the ability to flash everything, even another bootloader
but if you dont even have an idea about that, better stay away from that
Heres a list of those terms :
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/Glossary
Do u have a GSM or cdma phone?
This guide is for GSM, the part of unlocking+root should be the same for cdma , but if you are cdma better wait for another cdma user just to make sure
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1743466
A+B
You need to unlock your bootloader to flash superuser^^
Thank you! That was quick
I wish there were more people like you, Quantenhall
Only one thing confused me, though...
Quantenhall said:
If u only want root you dont need s-off
S-off gives you the ability to flash everything, even another bootloader
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quantenhall said:
You need to unlock your bootloader to flash superuser^^
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You said root does not need s-off, but superuser does.
I was under the impression root = superuser
I suck at Linux, so don't curse me
AW: What do I need for root?
extremko said:
Thank you! That was quick
I wish there were more people like you, Quantenhall
Only one thing confused me, though...
You said root does not need s-off, but superuser does.
I was under the impression root = superuser
I suck at Linux, so don't curse me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, i said you need an unlocked bootloader
That is not the same as s-off
S-off is only needed if you want to flash aosp roms one day
Just follow the instructions of the second link (a+b) and you will have root access
But make a backup first
Conclusion:
1 backup (adb , there are tools for that, i think one was named ultimate backup tool, if you dont find it search for Android 4 backup without root or similar)
2 unlocking bootloader (htcdev, a from link)
3 flash custom recovery(adb , b from link)
4 flash superuser (copy to SD, boot to recovery, install zip from sd)
That should be all for root
Quantenhall said:
No, i said you need an unlocked bootloader
That is not the same as s-off
S-off is only needed if you want to flash aosp roms one day
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got it now
Thanks for the explanation
Quantenhall said:
Conclusion:
1 backup (adb , there are tools for that, i think one was named ultimate backup tool, if you dont find it search for Android 4 backup without root or similar)
2 unlocking bootloader (htcdev, a from link)
3 flash custom recovery(adb , b from link)
4 flash superuser (copy to SD, boot to recovery, install zip from sd)
That should be all for root
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I managed to understand the instructions you linked to, but it's good to have a summary just to make sure I did indeed understood everything as I should have
But there's a problem :/
B4. A link to recovery on mediafire is dead :/
And I don't have 10 posts yet, so I can't post in dev forum and ask OP to make an update.
On the other hand, he clearly stated he doesn't read private messages regarding other people problems :/
I'll go if I can be useful somewhere else on the forum and get myself up to 10 posts
Any recovery made for your phone should work. I would recommend 4EXT Touch Recovery. I uploaded it here for you http://www.mediafire.com/?702ttkdggk69g3i so just unzip it and use the recovery.img as the instructions imply.
Do note that I downloaded this recovery via their app I downloaded from 4ext.net using an Evo 3D CDMA phone. I do know 4EXT works with both CDMA and GSM phones but I can't be certain if they use different recovery.img files.
Thank you all!
I successfully rooted the phone, thanks to you!
Actually, not only you, mostly the guy who wrote the crazy good tutorial!
But without you my mojo wouldn't be enough to make it through
I unlocked the bootloader via htcdev.com, then flashed recovery image and finally ran superuser.apk.
I'm in the process of restoring all my data back to the phone at the moment, and this should be it I guess
Thank you so much for your help, going through the process once really put all the pieces together for me.
Now I really know what some terms actually mean
So... if I would like to install different OS (CWM, CM...), it's much easier now, right?
I should go to recovery and say "install from a file" and select my new OS?
I think so... but nevermind, I'm done with the questions. You've both been more than helpful already
P.S.
Oh so many smilies... can you tell I'm happy?