Related
Since I'm not a developer, I'd like to help them all out with this.
I think it would be cool for people to just be able to click a thread and read up on all the great devs we have for the Fascinate. Like in this thread, they just post up what they have done for the fasciante, some minor stuff about themselves, and a donate button. These guys all deserve to be reimbursed for what they do, they also deserve to be reimbursed to listen to all these random threads about how development is slow. They work, loose sleep, and still do all this just to help us make our phones better.
So if you have done anything "Development-wise" for the Samsung Fascinate. Please post some minor info about your self, Link to your work, and a Donate button.
AND I WILL BE VERY DISAPPOINTED IF SOMEONE POSTS IN HERE AND YOU DIDN'T DO ANYTHING DEVELOPER-WISE. SO IF YOU ARE JUST A "TESTER" PLEASE DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD.
If you donated to them, you DESERVE credit too. Post your name (if you want) and who you donated to, and why you donated (if you have any certain reasons.)
I hope this will help the developers.
Thanks,
Samuel
As was announced last week, Operation:Iron Fist is in full effect. Read about it here.
With that being said, the following will begin to happen:
1. All non-development threads started in the Development section will be moved to the appropriate section and/or closed and the "responsible" poster (in quotes because the fact they posted in the wrong section clearly brings into question whether or not they are responsible) will be infracted.
2. Any abusive posts directed at any user will be deleted and the abuser will be infracted and/or given a temporary vacation. Multiple instances will result in a longer leave-of-absence, and if it continues you will be removed from XDA. You, and your behavior, are not welcome at XDA.
3. Any off-topic posts in the Development section threads will be deleted. These are non-helpful, and certainly not development posts. This includes the following:
"OMG THIS IS SO GREAT!"
"WOW! YOU ROCK AND I WANT TO HAVE YOUR BABIES!"
"THIS IS THE BEST THING EVER!"
"THANKS FOR THIS!"
If you want to thank someone for their work, do so by clicking the "THANKS" button on their post.
4. Any post, in any section, that is done to further post count will be deleted and you will face possible infraction.
5. Anything else that goes against the XDA Forum Rules and XDA Mantra will be dealt with firmly, but fairly.
masterfred said:
Omg this is so great!
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This is a perfect example of the type of boneheaded comment that does nothing but clutter the thread. LET THIS BE A LESSON TO YOU ALL!
thebadfrog said:
I think someone just got the "Iron Fist"
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Why thank you evil amphibian. But slightly off-topic........ You can hit thanks instead.
Chezbel said:
How about posts that say "#199 is up"? I'm pretty sure people that are seriously involved in a dev thread know how to monitor nightly builds...
Sent from my abucus
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Another great example. Something that shouldn't need to be posted, especially since the OP should have posted a link to where to monitor new releases. Unless you're trying to count with the abacus - then that makes sense. People might want to know how high you can count.
blader3759 said:
Omg thank you i wanna have your baby
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Hmm - going to decline - but I can think of a few other users who might oblige you.
blader3759 said:
Oh settle down cry baby!
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This is a perfect example of a post that would get you an infraction in any thread. XDA will not tolerate this behavior. Now knowing that this user that has been with XDA for 3 years is only seeking to provide an example of what NOT to do, it may be duly noted that this would earn a nice 5 point infraction or even a nice vacation from XDA.
I think someone just got the "Iron Fist"
This thread isn't a Development thread, it should be moved to General.
Nah, seriously now - this was needed a long time ago! Hopefully it's kept to.
This is not a complaint, but asking for clarification. i would like to ask a few questions..I read your iron fist policy and this post is not in any violation.
I read the comments on roms to see if I would like to download a rom. And if I see a positive comment then I might consider downloading it. If i get the policy of iron fist correctly, a post such as
Thanks, smooth and fast. Keep up good work.
The above little post is grounds for disiplinary actions? It tells me somebody else thought it was favored, smooth and quick. A thank you does not tell tell us the reader, how in the heck a rom operates. I will then go into a thread, and see only stuff that does not work, since any positive feedback does not represent development issues but bug posting represents development issues. How in the heck do we then tell the developer our views without getting in trouble. I understand the main issue of cracking down on trolls and flames, but in all honesty, iron fist should be called iron wall becuase we now have censorship on on a so called open forum. If i where to say to xyz developer anything positive to give him kudos and some words of encouragement which is just as valuable as anything else, we are not allowed. Since being positive and giving support to a developer does not matter in a personal and friendly way, when only a thank you button. These developers need positive feedback also..
life64x said:
This is not a complaint, but asking for clarification. i would like to ask a few questions..I read your iron fist policy and this post is not in any violation.
I read the comments on roms to see if I would like to download a rom. And if I see a positive comment then I might consider downloading it. If i get the policy of iron fist correctly, a post such as
Thanks, smooth and fast. Keep up good work.
The above little post is grounds for disiplinary actions? It tells me somebody else thought it was favored, smooth and quick. A thank you does not tell tell us the reader, how in the heck a rom operates. I will then go into a thread, and see only stuff that does not work, since any positive feedback does not represent development issues but bug posting represents development issues. How in the heck do we then tell the developer our views without getting in trouble. I understand the main issue of cracking down on trolls and flames, but in all honesty, iron fist should be called iron wall becuase we now have censorship on on a so called open forum. If i where to say to xyz developer anything positive to give him kudos and some words of encouragement which is just as valuable as anything else, we are not allowed. Since being positive and giving support to a developer does not matter in a personal and friendly way, when only a thank you button. These developers need positive feedback also..
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This is not an open forum. Trying to keep the development threads clear of pointless posts is not censorship. Post in general if you want to post "OMG.....I want to marry you". The devs themselves are the ones who want the development threads kept cleaned up. They don't want to sift through 10 pages of posts telling them what a god they are to find the 1 post post that tells them that "X" doesnt seem to work when doing "Y". Most of the ASUS devs are on Freenode IRC (#asus-transformer) everyday. Jump on and tell them in person as long as they aren't actually helping someone. Most say "Thanks" and tell you to hit the "Thanks" on their thread. They don't say "Please post another 'I wanna have your baby' post in my thread"
When a thread reaches 1000 posts and 900 of them are "Thanks to you I can solve world hunger now", no dev is gonna wanna waste his time trying to find the bugs people find. The devs time is better used deving and not digging.
This is xdadevelopers not xdacustomerservice or xdaiwannahaveyourbaby. The developers run the show and make our devices so much more fun to use. So let them dev
Both sides have a valid point. There must be a way to satisfy both needs. Perhaps the design of the "general forum" needs to be updated to adapt to the changing needs of the online community. Remember, both sides have the same goal.
Putzy said:
This thread isn't a Development thread, it should be moved to General.
Nah, seriously now - this was needed a long time ago! Hopefully it's kept to.
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You are correct - it was my mistake, as I replied to the wrong post.
See, the moderators are not above admitting our mistakes - you just don't see it very often!
life64x said:
This is not a complaint, but asking for clarification. i would like to ask a few questions..I read your iron fist policy and this post is not in any violation.
I read the comments on roms to see if I would like to download a rom. And if I see a positive comment then I might consider downloading it. If i get the policy of iron fist correctly, a post such as
Thanks, smooth and fast. Keep up good work.
The above little post is grounds for disiplinary actions? It tells me somebody else thought it was favored, smooth and quick. A thank you does not tell tell us the reader, how in the heck a rom operates. I will then go into a thread, and see only stuff that does not work, since any positive feedback does not represent development issues but bug posting represents development issues. How in the heck do we then tell the developer our views without getting in trouble. I understand the main issue of cracking down on trolls and flames, but in all honesty, iron fist should be called iron wall becuase we now have censorship on on a so called open forum. If i where to say to xyz developer anything positive to give him kudos and some words of encouragement which is just as valuable as anything else, we are not allowed. Since being positive and giving support to a developer does not matter in a personal and friendly way, when only a thank you button. These developers need positive feedback also..
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Here's where you miss the point. See below to clear this up:
zelendel said:
XDA is a developers site
XDA is a free forum you are ALLOWED to use. We could make it invite only
XDA is and always will be about the developers. And before you say without the users there would be no XDA, Bull****, who do you think used the stuff before normal people even knew what a smartphone was......wait for it.........other developers. People that could give good feedback with relavent info. Not just "dahhh this is broken, please fix".
XDA is not a place to come and make your phone cool.
XDA is not the cool place for idiots to hang out.
XDA is not your friends house
XDA is not a democracy
XDA is not a place to make Money.
XDA IS a place to come to learn and share your knowledge. If you are not here for those reasons then you are here for the wrong ones.
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Brush up on the XDA Mantra and understand what XDA is about.
In the Development threads, post only what is relevant to development - and "HEY! I flashed XYZ and it works great! You're the best!" is NOT relevant for discussion. End of story.
Hitting THANKS "should" be an indicator to someone that the development project in question is like. But, even so - this isn't really for the users. The developers post their work to share, but do so for themselves not you. Anything you do is at your own risk.
u170who said:
Both sides have a valid point. There must be a way to satisfy both needs. Perhaps the design of the "general forum" needs to be updated to adapt to the changing needs of the online community. Remember, both sides have the same goal.
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XDA is about developers (READ: XDA-DEVELOPERS) not users. We exist to facilitate development - not support. So the rules in place are for Development.
Read the XDA Mantra and this post above
you can see how many users pressed thanks, so if a post has 50 thanks that's way better than sifting through 50 OMGs
Sent from my abucus
You make your point...I had to ask, a part of me was dying to know..
life64x said:
You make your point...I had to ask, a part of me was dying to know..
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And thank you for asking. Now you no longer need to be dying.
Thank you for this. Will this also apply to people who ask the same questions that have already been answered in the thread?
Possibly the most annoying thing is perusing through pages of threads to see the same question asked and repeatedly answered. The one that comes to mind currently is the screen dim on the options window and the circle pointer. It seems like those questions get asked and answered on nearly every page of the Prime 1.7 thread.
phree1 said:
Thank you for this. Will this also apply to people who ask the same questions that have already been answered in the thread?
Possibly the most annoying thing is perusing through pages of threads to see the same question asked and repeatedly answered. The one that comes to mind currently is the screen dim on the options window and the circle pointer. It seems like those questions get asked and answered on nearly every page of the Prime 1.7 thread.
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This does apply - though it is harder to enforce meaning the community needs to assist the moderators in addressing these issues. You can report these posts and we can address them as they come in. We are also working on fixing our RP system.
jerdog said:
We are also working on fixing our RP system.
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Making it easier to report posts, you mean? That would definitely be a good improvement; I went to report a post using abusive language a few days back, and ended up not doing because I didn't have time at that moment to jump through hoops with finding out who to contact, then typing a message to them. I doubt I'm alone in skipping doing so.
If reporting a post was as easy as leaving thanks, I bet a lot more folks would be helping the mods. In fact, a two-click system might be nice. Slightly more complicated than the thanks button, but it would also help the mods prioritize which reports to check. The site visitor could click report, then click the type of issue they're reporting (abusive language, off-topic, post in wrong section, requesting warez, whatever). Then the mod's queue of posts to check sorts the most severe infractions (asking for warez, foul language, etc.) above lesser ones (off-topic, posting in wrong section, etc.)
Something else that might be helpful to mods would be for the system to automatically track how many reports any given member has made, and what percentage have been incorrectly reported. Members with a lot of false positives could sort to the bottom of the mod's queue, and members who reliably report bad posts could filter to the top for prompt action... Something like that might also be helpful when XDA was looking for new mods to help with the site -- the folks who did the most positive reporting might prove to be good candidates for new moderators.
It may be a stupid idea - but could you give thread creators moderation privileges in their own threads, even if it is only in development?
Putzy said:
It may be a stupid idea - but could you give thread creators moderation privileges in their own threads, even if it is only in development?
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Not something that can happen. Recognized Developers can open/close their own threads - but moderation pieces of deleting posts, etc. just can't happen. But thanks for the thought and idea.
How about the developer create a thread in Development section and called it "ABC - Bug Report" and another thread in General called "ABC - Discussion".
joking said:
How about the developer create a thread in Development section and called it "ABC - Bug Report" and another thread in General called "ABC - Discussion".
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The way to handle this, and what I am working on implementing but takes awhile, is to have the Developer post a thread in Q&A for that dev work and then all bugs, etc. are in the actual development thread.
I've been following this thread from day 1 and you should read it too if you care at all about getting past the Nook Tablets "locked" bootloader:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1378886
If you have been wondering about whether custom ROMs for the NT, this is the thread that will answer the question. HOWEVER, I still see people posting "what's the status" and "thanks" and "don't post junk to this thread" on that very thread, cluttering up the dev's conversations.
As a result, I'm creating this thread so people can just say "thanks" to the likes of Indirect, AdamOutler, Loglud, pokey9000, 150pilot and all the other individuals hard at work in that thread (sorry if I missed your name!). DON'T PM them or clutter their thread - if you like what they are doing, click "thanks" on their posts, donate to their PayPal accounts or simply post a "thanks" here. That way we can let them know we appreciate what they are doing without getting in the way of progress. Most importantly, subscribe to the above thread - it's history in the making.
THANK YOU guys - it's been fun watching you work and I, for one, will be watching the thread to see what comes next.
Have the mod move it to development. It's obviously not meant for general consumption.
Thanks Devs!
xdahgary said:
Have the mod move it to development. It's obviously not meant for general consumption.
Thanks Devs!
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It was originally in Dev until it was cluttered up by random posts. (Edit: actually, I was thinking of another thread that was moved for that reason. However, this one did start out in Development but was moved in part because it was asking about techniques to bypass the bootloader rather than actual "development".) But, yes, it appears to be far more dev-related now than when it started out.
I follow the threads in the development section as well - doesn't seem to stop people from asking things like "can you get me CM9 by Valentine's Day?"
I, for one, enjoy the anticipation as much as the end result. It's fun to watch the gears spin.
Random fact - did anyone else know Indirect was 16 before some of his recent posts? Quite impressed with his skills as well as his maturity on the forums. Makes me feel old and busted at 37...
PlacidCat said:
It was originally in Dev until it was cluttered up by random posts. (Edit: actually, I was thinking of another thread that was moved for that reason. However, this one did start out in Development but was moved in part because it was asking about techniques to bypass the bootloader rather than actual "development".) But, yes, it appears to be far more dev-related now than when it started out.
I follow the threads in the development section as well - doesn't seem to stop people from asking things like "can you get me CM9 by Valentine's Day?"
I, for one, enjoy the anticipation as much as the end result. It's fun to watch the gears spin.
Random fact - did anyone else know Indirect was 16 before some of his recent posts? Quite impressed with his skills as well as his maturity on the forums. Makes me feel old and busted at 37...
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I think ytt3r is around the same age might be older. I'm super excited that Adam joined in on the fun and following the thread is pretty entertaining.
Hopefully when Christmas is over I will be able to give a proper thank you via paypal, until then....
THANK YOU!!!!!
Thread cleaning in progress
Let me start off by saying donations are definitely a good thing. However, the nature of donations going on on XDA has got me thinking about a few things:
Do you think too many people want and/or expect donations for little things or things that don't really bring much to the table? Disregard the part at the bottom of their post that makes a lot of people seem righteous "Donations are not required, but are appreciated" something along those lines. Lines like that are what probably make people go "aww" or "wow, this person is really cool" But is it a subliminal tug at your heart strings on purpose? I have always been the kind of person that requires no donations because I don't consider myself bringing nothing really new to the table. More along the lines of bringing alternatives to things that are already on the table.
Most of us would do the things we're doing regardless, so why would you want money for it? I know a ton of people are going to rely on the "I never asked for money" stance, but the fact is, you kinda DO ask for money when donation links are plastered all over your topic.
Take for example someone who truly wanted to dive in and understand how modding Android files worked, how to make a ROM, how to theme a ROM. That person would do those things and probably push out something to the public even IF donations weren't accepted on XDA. In other words, true passion would yield community projects anyway, so why pretend like the donations are to "continue this project" when everyone knows you would continue it anyway? It's not like the people are doing these ROM projects just to get money, or are they? Now, I have seen more and more people wanting donations for slightly modifying things that aren't even open source software, like modifying proprietary HTC/Samsung/Motorola/etc files. Is this fair? Where does the line get drawn between giving donations for someone who truly is developing, and someone who is simply modifying?
I feel that teams like CyanogenMod, TeamWin, people who bring things to our phones that aren't otherwise available such as Beats, xLoud engine, etc. are the ones that truly deserve our money because they are the ones who raise the bar, bring exceptional software, software modifications, and new things to the table. So why then, does someone who downloaded a kitchen made by dsixda, smali/baksmali made by jesusfreke, various tools made by other people, and take information freely available on the internet written by other people expect, want, or even secretly want donations?
Chad Goodman is a perfect example of someone who truly does warrant having donations sent his way, but instead is satisfied with a mere thanks and appreciation from the community for his kernel development.
What are your thoughts on donating to people for something like a ROM that was for the most part completed by HTC? I wouldn't be surprised if sooner or later people started expecting donations for giving out information on upcoming phones. There are a ton of true developers that aren't "in your face" and are more behind the scenes that never really get recognized for their brilliance that should deserve our donations, thanks, and appreciation, but in the mix of so many 'developers' they seem to go forgotten.
I learn things for my own satisfaction and to make my phone better, and if I feel like anything I have done to my device can benefit the community that a lot of it I learned from, then I will most certainly share it without any financial compensation direct or indirect. I for one will never accept donations from the community I share things with that I would do for myself anyway, unless I feel that I truly am helping to raise the bar nor will I make it feel like their donation is what drives my continued support on a project, because let's face it- if a donation is what drives you to learn more and share with the public, you probably don't deserve the donation to begin with.
I'd just like to say that I think you're a class act, Freeza. I don't have a 3D and I'm not really sure how I came across this post, but I used your ROM exclusively on the TP2 from PPCGEEKs..Thank you for your contributions and never looking for anything more than a "thanks".
Not agree.
If you don't want - do not donate. If yes - go.
Nobody is not responsible for your unstable mental state, no one is forcing you to do donations.
I making the donations, made it for Kobra-rom and made it for MikRunny rom. Nobody is talking to me to do that, but i think the guys made work, great work, that making me to love my Android-phone. I think, that without custom roms Android is dead, and without the donates development is dead.
Even little development is development.
There is only my opinion.
You're a good guy freeza
Swyped from mah 3vo!
Kemanorell said:
Not agree.
If you don't want - do not donate. If yes - go.
Nobody is not responsible for your unstable mental state, no one is forcing you to do donations.
I making the donations, made it for Kobra-rom and made it for MikRunny rom. Nobody is talking to me to do that, but i think the guys made work, great work, that making me to love my Android-phone. I think, that without custom roms Android is dead, and without the donates development is dead.
Even little development is development.
There is only my opinion.
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Definitely not unstable in any way. This topic is only meant to spark discussion, not take away from developers. I really am looking for a reason that so many people put donation links up all over the place if they do it for the love of learning; with the exception of developers.
Kemanorell said:
Even little development is development.
There is only my opinion.
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Like what is little dev to you, is it modding because that is not. Alpha rev unrevoke teamwin creators of tools is dev without them guys you could not even modify so........ unless you are a dev you don't need those tools so...... What is little
Sent from my powered Shooter E3D with Infection of AnthraX Jamz by wolf.
funny you posted this here, as I just a few sec ago had to comment on this subject in the HTC Desire S forum when responding to a reported thread on this subject...
Here is what I said: (note the main topic was about having donation links in peoples signatures and if non RD's warranted having it. btw)
My personal opinion on the subject though.....
It is more than okay for people to have donation links in their sig's that are not dev's. You dont have to be a Dev to warrant a donation. Many of the themer's and other people that contribute to the community are NOT developers but they provide value to the overall community and if someone wants to donate to them so be it...They might not get much use out of the button, but it is their right to have one if they want...
Now asking or demanding for donations up front will not be tolerated here in any way. There can be a fine line on this with RD's and others using the donation system for their beta's and such before a wide release but thats NOT what I'm talking about here at all. I'm talking about the flat out demanding of a donation before providing a service or doing anything else...If you see that then report the post and I or someone else will handle it.
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Now I also agree the ones that do it out of pure love, I appreciate more as they are the true driving force here, imho. Now you have to agree that these people are taking time out of their personal lives to do work for the community and should be allowed to be compensated when/if users decide to do so. The $$/donation should never be the driving force or reason behind what goes on here. imho
Hence Rule 8 of XDA, "...donations up front are not allowed, this forum is about sharing, not about getting paid to do something, that's what your job is for."
Now as for those people putting links everywhere to donate and such to them....they typically just get put on the ignore list by me. I don't believe your donation link should be the biggest thing in your signature though if there...just poor taste imho and shows you are concerned more about the $ than the community here...
This is just like the professional athlete....some play just for themselves and some for the overall team reward in the end...Those that play just for themselves and the paycheck might be outstanding athletes and likely help a team win a bunch of games, but also might cause other frictions that the athlete playing for the team doesn't cause...both are professional athletes in the end so they are both talented but both have their pluses and minuses...imho
freeza said:
Definitely not unstable in any way. This topic is only meant to spark discussion, not take away from developers. I really am looking for a reason that so many people put donation links up all over the place if they do it for the love of learning; with the exception of developers.
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It is because we are at FORUM, some public-place, some impersonation of the network freedom, if you want...so anybody doing what he's want, because the site is allow that.
---------- Post added at 07:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:56 PM ----------
.Elite_The_King. said:
Like what is little dev to you, is it modding because that is not. Alpha rev unrevoke teamwin creators of tools is dev without them guys you could not even modify so........ unless you are a dev you don't need those tools so...... What is little
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See, my opinion is simple: any time-donation (to make some theme, other little thing) coast some money. So it is some type of freedom - if you want - make some donation, if not - so not.
And if you don't trust any "little dev", so don't expect to see some really amazing things. Any stick always have two ends.
Ah, yea, i forgot to say, Freeza, i like your work (wallpapers). Thank you.
Freeza, i have to say that you worded that up perfectly but I do feel as though some of the contributions "you" have made here does warrant donations. Your firmware zips (copy/paste or not) alone have saved many here from bricks and a lot of hassle.
Haven said that, I do agree with what you're saying here, anyone with common knowledge can copy and paste code. I myself have built my own personal roms to my personal liking by asking questions, researching, and copy and paste....that certainly doesn't classify me as a dev, nor would that warrant a donation to me if I posted them (even though some have turned out pretty good if i do say so myself lol).
I have donated to 4 devs here, but like you said, it was to those who have brought something totally new to the table and were worthy. The worst are the ones who actually start begging for money on their threads....I find that despicable. We've had those on the 3d thread before....one was banned (for something else), but i digress. I'll just end by saying, you my friend, are worthy of donations.
sgt. slaughter said:
funny you posted this here, as I just a few sec ago had to comment on this subject in the HTC Desire S forum when responding to a reported thread on this subject...
Here is what I said: (note the main topic was about having donation links in peoples signatures and if non RD's warranted having it. btw)
Now I also agree the ones that do it out of pure love, I appreciate more as they are the true driving force here, imho. Now you have to agree that these people are taking time out of their personal lives to do work for the community and should be allowed to be compensated when/if users decide to do so. The $$/donation should never be the driving force or reason behind what goes on here. imho
Hence Rule 8 of XDA, "...donations up front are not allowed, this forum is about sharing, not about getting paid to do something, that's what your job is for."
Now as for those people putting links everywhere to donate and such to them....they typically just get put on the ignore list by me. I don't believe your donation link should be the biggest thing in your signature though if there...just poor taste imho and shows you are concerned more about the $ than the community here...
This is just like the professional athlete....some play just for themselves and some for the overall team reward in the end...Those that play just for themselves and the paycheck might be outstanding athletes and likely help a team win a bunch of games, but also might cause other frictions that the athlete playing for the team doesn't cause...both are professional athletes in the end so they are both talented but both have their pluses and minuses...imho
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Good points... but do you really think some people who receive donations do it for the community or do they do it for themselves and simply share it with the community? Because if they're not taking requests and simply posting up something they've done, it was more than likely done for themselves before the notion of donations were even considered, then simply shared it with everyone else with the intent OR later intent on getting donations.
Having a donate button under your avatar is different and for the most part fine, because it isn't obtrusive, but when you plaster something at the bottom of your signature and/or posts telling people if you've helped them to 'please donate' or 'please consider donating' or any other phrase out there that is condescending to the bottom line of "GIVE ME MONEY", that's where I think it goes from being fine to just annoying.
Take for instance someone who made a ROM, then at the bottom of the ROM is like "so there you have it guys. OH and by the way if you find any of this helpful, donate to me!" or "please consider donating so that I may continue work on this project" and it's like.....really? That's borderline breaking the rules, at least in my eyes. I feel like the point of donating is for those who truly want to donate, and by doing so haven't read any annoying catch phrases that would make them feel obligated to donate--hence the donate button under your avatar. XDA should consider banning signature advertising of donating and strictly keep to the button. That and ban people from soliciting by using word trickery such as "If you feel i've helped you, donate to me" because a lot of time I DO feel as though someone has helped me, but if I don't donate, does it mean I don't feel that way?
freeza said:
Good points... but do you really think some people who receive donations do it for the community or do they do it for themselves and simply share it with the community? Because if they're not taking requests and simply posting up something they've done, it was more than likely done for themselves before the notion of donations were even considered, then simply shared it with everyone else with the intent OR later intent on getting donations.
Having a donate button under your avatar is different and for the most part fine, because it isn't obtrusive, but when you plaster something at the bottom of your signature and/or posts telling people if you've helped them to 'please donate' or 'please consider donating' or any other phrase out there that is condescending to the bottom line of "GIVE ME MONEY", that's where I think it goes from being fine to just annoying.
Take for instance someone who made a ROM, then at the bottom of the ROM is like "so there you have it guys. OH and by the way if you find any of this helpful, donate to me!" or "please consider donating so that I may continue work on this project" and it's like.....really? That's borderline breaking the rules, at least in my eyes. I feel like the point of donating is for those who truly want to donate, and by doing so haven't read any annoying catch phrases that would make them feel obligated to donate--hence the donate button under your avatar. XDA should consider banning signature advertising of donating and strictly keep to the button. That and ban people from soliciting by using word trickery such as "If you feel i've helped you, donate to me" because a lot of time I DO feel as though someone has helped me, but if I don't donate, does it mean I don't feel that way?
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yeah I agree. though I dont mind the donate button in signatures really long as its not some big huge button taking up half the sig...then its just poor taste imho...Also the whole "asking for donations" id put in the same category...You shouldn't have to ask for it nor remind people to donate to yourself...let others remind people to donate and spread the word that way....
freeza said:
Good points... but do you really think some people who receive donations do it for the community or do they do it for themselves and simply share it with the community? Because if they're not taking requests and simply posting up something they've done, it was more than likely done for themselves before the notion of donations were even considered, then simply shared it with everyone else with the intent OR later intent on getting donations.
Having a donate button under your avatar is different and for the most part fine, because it isn't obtrusive, but when you plaster something at the bottom of your signature and/or posts telling people if you've helped them to 'please donate' or 'please consider donating' or any other phrase out there that is condescending to the bottom line of "GIVE ME MONEY", that's where I think it goes from being fine to just annoying.
Take for instance someone who made a ROM, then at the bottom of the ROM is like "so there you have it guys. OH and by the way if you find any of this helpful, donate to me!" or "please consider donating so that I may continue work on this project" and it's like.....really? That's borderline breaking the rules, at least in my eyes. I feel like the point of donating is for those who truly want to donate, and by doing so haven't read any annoying catch phrases that would make them feel obligated to donate--hence the donate button under your avatar. XDA should consider banning signature advertising of donating and strictly keep to the button. That and ban people from soliciting by using word trickery such as "If you feel i've helped you, donate to me" because a lot of time I DO feel as though someone has helped me, but if I don't donate, does it mean I don't feel that way?
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I agree. I think that anything regarding donating shouldn't be allowed in someones signature or in their OP. I think the button is enough. I have donated and actually had to ask the dev what there paypal email was because I couldn't find any other way to send it to them. I also had another dev turn down a donation. I respect both of them a lot more for that.
While I don't consider my contribution as large as other peoples, I have a donate link. I realized that people actually appreciated the downgrade CD in my signature. That, more than anything, makes me happy. While I didn't develop the downgrade method (Unknownforce gets my full respect for this), I started putting in a (hopefully unobtrusive) link to my post on my policy on donations. I later changed that, and now I have the sidebar link.
Personally, my rationale for having a donate button was so that maybe I could buy a second hand phone or two to start developing for (likely ones that don't have the largest development community). I want to put out things while learning more about Android.
Now, I haven't received anything yet, But I'm okay with that. I love that I have been able to help (even in the slightest). That's really rewarding to me.
~co~
certain things warrant donations like hosting i try to get my user to donate to the host cause that is the most expensive part of deving and i think asking for donations for a goal is reasonable such as faster hosting, putting an app on the market, buying a mhl cable for testing etcc.
Nice discussion. I'll have to read all the comments in a bit and see what everyone says, but to me I agree with your OP freeza. I believe devs should definitely recieve donations if the raise the bar and bring something new that users didn't have before, I also believe that if you are enjoying and aprecciate a developers constant work then you can donate. I don't like developers and modders who have half their signature be a donation sign or constantly ask for them. Donations shouldn't even be asked for on here. I believe that the donation button above your avatar is enough to let users know "if you want to donate then here you go".
I have the little donation button at the top and although haven't received a donation yet, I don't personally care. It's my passion to learn more about android that keeps me going and making themes. Not the money. I don't believe I have actually done anything worth receiving money for.
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I don't mind people asking for donations if they make customizations to ROMs and host them themselves. If it's basically reassembling others' works and throwing it up to a free host.. well, then you're just doing your hobby.
Off topic, but freeza, are you going to get an Evo LTE? You're a guy I want to see in those forums.
Sent from my Evo 3D using Tapatalk 2.0
yousefak said:
Off topic, but freeza, are you going to get an Evo LTE? You're a guy I want to see in those forums.
Sent from my Evo 3D using Tapatalk 2.0
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Of course I am! and thank you, I will definitely be a part of it.
I agree with u freeza, I think the Rd's/Dev Teams and/or users that actually create the tools and/or create their own code, ports, etc... should be the only ones that should be allowed to ask for donations (If they so choose to).
IMHO, they are the ones bringing the stuff to the table and provide us (The users) the tools to allow us to modify and cook our own custom roms, etc..
Now I'm not trying to disrespect anyone who creates roms. They certainly deserve all the thanks for all their hard time and effort spent on creating their roms.
There's really a fine line here, You have the users that create custom roms from the tools that dev's create and then you have the dev's that create those tools to begin with. Without the building blocks to create those roms, there wouldn't be anything for us to flash.
So i believe that donations should be more favored towards dev's and not users who create roms to their liking.
Like I said before, I'm not trying to disrespect anyone who creates roms, I flash roms daily and thank the people who make this phone worth keeping. This is just for discussion purposes only.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA
neonfreak20 said:
I agree with u freeza, I think the Rd's/Dev Teams and/or users that actually create the tools and/or create their own code, ports, etc... should be the only ones that should be allowed to ask for donations (If they so choose to).
IMHO, they are the ones bringing the stuff to the table and provide us (The users) the tools to allow us to modify and cook our own custom roms, etc..
Now I'm not trying to disrespect anyone who creates roms. They certainly deserve all the thanks for all their hard time and effort spent on creating their roms.
There's really a fine line here, You have the users that create custom roms from the tools that dev's create and then you have the dev's that create those tools to begin with. Without the building blocks to create those roms, there wouldn't be anything for us to flash.
So i believe that donations should be more favored towards dev's and not users who create roms to their liking.
Like I said before, I'm not trying to disrespect anyone who creates roms, I flash roms daily and thank the people who make this phone worth keeping. This is just for discussion purposes only.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA
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I understand where you are coming from and in a way I do agree, but with that said I have to add in that just because ROM developers are creating ROMS with other people's tools does not mean they aren't spending just as much time writing code as the people who made the necessary building blocks. For a large part of ROM development people can't just simply use another's tools. Especially for ports. It requires lots of testing and risk and hours of looking at notepad++ and eclipse (or other ide's) . So I do agree alot of people need to think about the outstanding tools developers have made, but people who make ROM's are just as easily developers as the ones who design the tools.
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So, guys. We need to wake up. We need to stop asking for estimated time of arrive. We need to respect all the developers. Please read every posts before you posting. Please search before posting. We've lost many awesome developers. It's all because of you you guys keep asking for ETA and never search before posting question. When developers feel tired, then he just decide to leave XDA. XDA is a big family. Only respect between each other can help to maintain the peace. Every developers & members deserved to be respected.
Regarding the CM9 thread, guys. Stop asking about the ETA and 'IS CAMERA WORKING?'! We could lost the only unofficial CM9 development for Galaxy Ace because of that.
Regarding the AOKP thread, guys. Be nice to the developer. Although they made some mistakes. But we have to respect them too. They're human being, not GOD. They working on AOKP based on the CM9. The only AOKP development for Ace currently.
Furthermore, I want to apology to moderators and every members for my behavior. I know I made a mistake. I shouldn't post all those things. Once again, a truly apology to every members and moderators. Sorry.
Some of us made some threads like these last time .
Did they listen to us ? No . The noobishness got worse .
This was sent from a Galaxy Ace. Problem?
Excellent post sir. Your posts re moderator were very nasty and to be honest I'm a little surprised that he's allowed you to stay on xda. Your apology does however appear to be genuine and heart-felt. Regarding the noobs it's important that we guide, advise and assist them, not shout, swear and otherwise abuse what will, eventually, be the devs of the future. I trust that senior members will take the lead in this and stop moaning about noobs xda is not meant to be a closed shop and all new members should be made welcome.
themountig said:
Excellent post sir. Your posts re moderator were very nasty and to be honest I'm a little surprised that he's allowed you to stay on xda. Your apology does however appear to be genuine and heart-felt. Regarding the noobs it's important that we guide, advise and assist them, not shout, swear and otherwise abuse what will, eventually, be the devs of the future. I trust that senior members will take the lead in this and stop moaning about noobs xda is not meant to be a closed shop and all new members should be made welcome.
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The thing is that this is a DEVELOPER forum . I've seen such a thread where the noobs were trying to fight back discrimination , but were bashed down by the senior mods again .
This was sent from a Galaxy Ace. Problem?
EmoBoiix3 said:
The thing is that this is a DEVELOPER forum . I've seen such a thread where the noobs were trying to fight back discrimination , but were bashed down by the senior mods again .
This was sent from a Galaxy Ace. Problem?
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That, leaves me to think what I'm doing here...
We're all here to learn and share experiences from one another . Not to ask and whine about ETAs
This was sent from a Galaxy Ace. Problem?
As EmoBoiix3 said, this has been done. Imo people should stop trying to be a revolutionist and just do their part instead of telling others what to do. The only people who will take this to their hearts are those who have a bit decency, and those people are most likely not the "noobs" aka spammers. This kind of stuff are soon to be classified as spam.
It's not that hard to differentiate between genuine noobs (count the posts) and the habitual spammers. Report the spammers to moderator - I'm sure most would agree that so far he has been very fair and quite pro-active in handing out warnings by PM, giving general warnings on thread and being very willing to engage with members. It's his ot their job to police the site and ours to help keep it as clean as possible without totally stiflling comment and input. Also there is one section for Devs this section is everybody's.
Developers have no purpose without anyone to use their Mods and Roms etc.
great post, even great idea, but lets face it, noobs are gonna ignore this
diegonnc said:
great post, even great idea, but lets face it, noobs are gonna ignore this
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Get it straight it is not the NOOBS who are the problem. It's the attitude of the rest of us towards them. We should show equal understanding and respect to Devs and Noobs alike !!!
Sometimes they do get pretty annoying lol
This was sent from a Galaxy Ace. Problem?
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Of course people are lazy. Three or more of the problems surrounding this thread have been posted about several times I note. Maybe the "search this thread" button needs more prominence and easier to use. Maybe repeat questioners should always be directed to search button? It's our xda can't we work to improve it rather than despairing?
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Yep. I made a lot for Samsung Star (not android phone) without any code on my hand 2 years ago. I developed for LG OP, HTC on tiad and did a few things for galaxy 5. As it was in other forums my posts for some of you make me a noob right?
That's why I disagree on calling someone noob just because of the number of posts... And also treating noobs in a bad way because they make the same mistake all of us have made: not searching.
We should just provide a kind answer and invite them to use the searchbar instead of kicking them out.
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