Related
It has come to my attention that a few people have been misunderstanding a few recent posts by myself. This is post is to clear the waters up a bit and to explain my position as a developer here on XDA.
As many of you guys know, we're probably the most lively "dead" device on XDA. At least in my opinion that is. We have been through a lot as a community but we still manage to survive. But recently things have been getting a little tense.
I received this device last summer like most of you have. When I got it, I immediately started figuring out how to get CM7 on it. Problem is that it was my first Android phone and with all the ways that Motorola locked it down I had a lot to learn and no time to learn it. After I learned off and on how to get things working on the X2 during the NO free time I had last fall I cranked out a pretty much solid CM7 in a week.
Now for the explanation for CM9/ICS. Most people probably think that since I could crank out CM7 so fast that I would be able to do the same with CM9 and make it just as good and amazing as CM7. Although I had it booted on the first build, it was FULL of errors and the touch screen didn't even work. ICS and CM9 is definitely not as easy as CM7. CM7 was already a year and a half in the making and had most of the problems worked out on all the devices that when it finally came time for us, it would just as smooth as butter as soon as it was booted. CM9 hasn't had time to develop into a "smooth" ROM for most devices; especially non-official like ours. The code for the touchscreen to work wasn't even in CM9 on my first build, for example. The problems for CM9/ICS can be narrowed down to a few things:
Graphics Memory
No Official ICS
Kernel Improvements
Graphics Memory and No Official ICS: Due to the way that ICS handles the way it puts stuff on our screen we run into Video RAM (VRAM) problems on our device. Basically the routines that control it are expecting the memory to be mapped (stored) in a certain way in VRAM. On a device that has ICS officially, this isn't as big as a problem as the proprietary files (props) are coded to respond to those requests and mappings and as such run smoother. If a device doesn't have ICS, most it usually has a similar device in which props can be pulled and ran accordingly.
This is not the case for Tegra 2 phones as no Tegra 2 device has official ICS. In fact the Tegra kernel (just looked this up) is only at 2.6.34-rc3 officially and have a 3.1.10 kernel in developement (Motorola can update it again to .35 if they wish to do so like for the ATRIX). Because of the lack of an official Tegra 2 kernel for Linux 3.X, and likewise the props for such kernel, we can't have props that handle the requests the system is asking for. And even if another phone gets updated, we're locked and stuck, so It doesn't matter either way. This means that VRAM problems will probably always be there and that there is nothing that I can do for it. Best thing I can hope for (and this is slowly making it's way through CM9) is that the code in CM9 is updated to allow us to handle the VRAM differently like in CM7/GB.
Kernel Improvements: The kernel (that's supposed to be) for ICS is 3.0 or higher. This includes changes in memory as stated above, touchscreen handling, device interaction with the kernel and many others. That being said, we don't have those improvements thus causing problems. These include memory as stated above, touchscreen not working (obviously fixed), data usage not working, data monitoring not working, and a few various ways other routines to draw to the screen and handle other things (such as why Chrome is picky). Some of these can be backported (downgraded) to our kernel with mixed results.
Problem is they have to be complied with our kernel and must match the kernel version in every way. That is why the kernel check is in CM7 and CM9. I can slowly work through implementing these routines through drivers known as kernel modules (mods). I have made mods for data usage (with a few issues) and another one (which not sure what it's supposed to do yet). I cannot (as in it's impossible) write them to change the memory handling. If I could even build them the kernel won't let me load them due to routines of same name fighting for control.
Think of it like the phone is a car and you and your friend are in the front (the kernel routines) and you have the exact same name. Meanwhile, you have another friend in the back (the OS). The OS says, "Hey Routines Named the Same, grab the wheel and turn turn left!" You would turn it to your left, but your friend (the other routine) has a different view of what left is and instead wants to go to your right. Obviously some problems arise.
Regarding the Soft Keys Issue: I know a few of you guys are a little upset regrading the fact that I won't add the soft keys in there by default. I have a justifiable reason behind not adding them: our phone already has buttons.
Our phone was designed to have hardware buttons that separate from the screen. Adding more buttons to the screen for buttons that already exist is not advantageous. It also unnecessarily takes up screen space that makes our phone our phone. Now you may be thinking, "Well the GNex has the soft keys on the screen..." You are correct. But the screen itself has actually been extended (as in a non-standard physical height) to accommodate for the soft keys and also has no hardware buttons for the menu and home, etc. In fact! The Nexus S (a still HIGHLY developed for, supported device and previous "Google Phone") doesn't even have the soft keys enabled from the software directly available from Google themselves.
With that being said, XDA user csking33 has made the option of softkeys available to the public should you choose to enable it. He has it working on the current Alpha 4 and I look forward to him getting them working on Alpha 5 when I release it. You can download it here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1727680.
That is just a short (believe me when I say it's short) explanation as to why ICS is just a FUN FUN FUN thing to work with.
Personal Problems (I have a lot): This is not meant to be a whine-a-thon, more of an explanation of why I can't be as dedicated as I'd like to be. I have explained why ICS is a pain, I'm here to give you a brief rundown as to why I (personally) can't just make things work. I am a student studying Aerospace Engineering (not Computer Science or whatever else). It has kept me so insanely busy that I can't even begin to describe how much little time I have. I spend all day at school and all night doing the homework for it. I was lucky (once) when my Flight Structures II homework only took 5 hours to do. With so many long homework assignments and group projects it's a miracle I even survive. Next semester will be worse because now I have to actually design and build a model plane from scratch that does whatever my professors says it has to do. This is includes the whole design, approval process, building, testing, breaking, fixing, getting approved again, get it flown, doing it's mission and presenting our project. All that on top of the homework I have to do.
Whenever I do get free time during the day, I try to spend it with my girlfriend and/or friends or (if it's a few days) I go to visit my family (this weekend I am, for example). Family and friends have always a top priority of mine since forever and I won't let a phone be the reason why I don't see them IF I see them. In fact the donation money you guys have supported me with is going to get new tires for my car before I go visit my family. It has also bought me spare batteries and cables for when I really mess things up.
After all this is said and done, I stay up to 4 am working on the phone so that you guys can have a semi-legitimate Android experience. I do it because I want to and because we as a community deserve it.
It saddens me to know that I'm (essentially) the only one left working on the X2. Others pop their head in every once and awhile to help or to do what they want and that is GREAT. I love it. I'm always more than willing to help others out if they ask. And all they have to do is ask. PM me here on XDA, join me in the IRC or tweet me on Twitter. I'll be sure to get to it eventually.
TL;DR:
CM9/ICS will be unstable for as long as I can see in the future. There is not much I can do.
No I won't enable soft keys, there is no point in a default build. See the post if you wish to enable them.
I'm a really, really busy man but I do what I can. You guys have helped tremendously in supporting my work and helping me live a little easier
Thanks for the explanation. At this point I guess all we can do is hope that someone at Motorola feels sorry for us and leaks us some goodies. I bet with the unlocked goodness ICS would scream on this phone, even with it's less-than-optimal amount of RAM.
I just want to personally thank you for everything you have done with this phone. I still use CM7 as my daily driver and love it despite the Wifi and the root issues and will continue to use it until I say F you to Motorola and get a different phone a little more dev friendly.
You are doing a great job keeping the DX2 afloat. If you can get ICS in this phone you'll have a very bright future ahead of you. I wish you the best of luck but I don't think you need it
I don't know anything about developing, modding or themes and I won't imagine how hard it must be to do what you have done for the DX2. For that and more: Thank You! Im sure we'll be happy to throw a dollar or two your way.. it's the least we can do. :good:
M-
question
you say no tegra2 has i c s
what about xoom?
was just asking in case that could give you done ideas
good luck DZK, keep killing it
I'm glad you came out with this post. I have had this phone since last summer like you and since then I have used both of your ROMs and have followed your work. Mainly because there are not very many developers still developing for this phone. Lol. I think a lot of people needed to hear this. you don't come in here that much and are not very active in the forums. Not that it's your fault or anything. we all know that you're busy. But people are used to regular updates. Even if they are just verbal ones. So when a dev takes their time and no one hears anything, they don't understand. Most of us in here explain your situation when someone comes in here asking about stuff. We are all grateful for what you have given us so far and the things that are coming down the road. Without you there would be no development for this phone. As much as everyone would like to believe, we all know you are not just some guy sitting behind a desk all day working for us. By the sound of it, it looks like school is going to be getting a lot more busy for you which means less updates for us. By the time you get around to developing again for this phone I may have moved on to another. Just want to say again. Thanks :good:
also just wanted to add that I'm surprised you felt the need to explain yourself, pretty stand up thing to do,
i would HOPE no one gives you guff for having a real life with , priorities, but then again this is x d a haha
this is something you do for fun, we all should realize that, and it's awesome that you have gotten as far as you have
keep plugging away bro (at real life)
ashclepdia said:
also just wanted to add that I'm surprised you felt the need to explain yourself, pretty stand up thing to do,
i would HOPE no one gives you guff for having a real life with , priorities, but then again this is x d a haha
this is something you do for fun, we all should realize that, and it's awesome that you have gotten as far as you have
keep plugging away bro (at real life)
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I would think this is more for the newcomers here that don't know what's going on behind the scenes. Have you SEEN the kind of things people ask him on twitter? Lol
+1
ashclepdia said:
also just wanted to add that I'm surprised you felt the need to explain yourself, pretty stand up thing to do,
i would HOPE no one gives you guff for having a real life with , priorities, but then again this is x d a haha
this is something you do for fun, we all should realize that, and it's awesome that you have gotten as far as you have
keep plugging away bro (at real life)
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Click to collapse
Sent from my DROID X2 using xda app-developers app
I'm not a dev, but I am a project manager who works very closely with them, on very large scale deployments. Something that has always impressed me about you Bryan, is your prioritization and time management. Knowing where to focus energy in order to achieve maximum result, especially when strapped with limited resources, is a skill not as common as one might think--you've got it in spades.
I guarantee when you enter the work force, it's going to be something that sets you apart from a group of otherwise smart guys. Project managers and directors will LOVE you for that skill set.
That being said, thanks for giving us a portion of a sorely needed resource, it's appreciated.
DK you are the man! Thanks for everything!!! You and nitro saved the x2 without you two the x2 would be crap! Family is always first. Good luck with everything!
---------- Post added at 02:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:54 AM ----------
ashclepdia said:
also just wanted to add that I'm surprised you felt the need to explain yourself, pretty stand up thing to do,
i would HOPE no one gives you guff for having a real life with , priorities, but then again this is x d a haha
this is something you do for fun, we all should realize that, and it's awesome that you have gotten as far as you have
keep plugging away bro (at real life)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1000
Edit: I can't believe the asterisks...lol
**** whoever said what, ungrateful bastard!
Life first, just include Android in it
You are the miracle maker dragonzkiller, if anyone ever says less keep your head high and **** em...never a need to explain.
Keep doing what your doing, it rocks!!!
Ps sorry bout the language, it's a Jersey thing...lol
DROID DOES, Apple did...like I forgot when
I'm with the others, it's always nice to hear what's what, but you should never have felt it any kind of explanation was owed to us.
Even if you suddenly had to put it all to the side permanently, you'll always have my gratitude.
Droid X2 > Eclipse 2.2.1 > Tapatalk
Cheers DZK!! Thanks for your time which is not owed to anyone. Side projects are good esp. when going into difficult job fields. The distractions are going to be what keeps you going. Best of luck to you!
I do wonder now though if it makes more sense to continue to tweak CM7 than CM9.
jsgraphicart said:
I would think this is more for the newcomers here that don't know what's going on behind the scenes. Have you SEEN the kind of things people ask him on twitter? Lol
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i don't think i HAVE seen what is said to him in twitter...Hope it ain't some crazy crap
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Hey just want to stop in and say thanks for the work you do on this phone. And I agree with the what others have said you don't owe us anything we are just greatful with what ever time we can steal from you.
Sent from my Incredible 2 using xda app-developers app
Look, thanks every and as such. For those of you who think that I have to explain myself, I pretty much do. A lot of you guys know the basics behind what it is I'm dealing with, but don't KNOW. If that makes any sense. I really enjoy working on this device and working with the community. I know it seems like I might get snappy sometimes or I'm short with my answers, but please just keep in mind that I have a lot of things on my plate and that I mean well.
Someone pointed out that the XOOM is running a Tegra 2. I did forget that fact, however even with that being the case, it has helped us very little in our endeavors. In fact it's still on 2.6.35 if I remember correctly and the props are still designed with that in mind. However it is still an updated kernel to work with ICS and such still causes some problems.
DZK, man I appreciate all your efforts! I don' t have the plate you do to deal with but I can surely understand where you are coming from.
I do believe that the majority of the community appreciates tremendously what you do for us, and the ones that can't be patient and understand well they can just flip off!
Thanks man!
Dragonzkiller you have done so much for this community and our X2. Would you be interested in a 2 month old PERFECT condition Dinc2? At least you would get a phone with official ICS and it actually already does since UKB is using the official kernel from the China released OTA. Its a great phone with great battery life just a smaller screen. You have done so much for us I would be happy to hook you up with a great deal. One I won't be able to tell my wife about lol
DZK, I too am an engineering student currently, and I fully understand what you are/will be dealing with. Free time is something we engineering students don't have the luxury to afford
With that being said, I truly appreciate what you have done in the development of this phone and how much time you have devoted to doing so. Keep your head high and let the haters hate.
Travisdroidx2 said:
Dragonzkiller you have done so much for this community and our X2. Would you be interested in a 2 month old PERFECT condition Dinc2? At least you would get a phone with official ICS and it actually already does since UKB is using the official kernel from the China released OTA. Its a great phone with great battery life just a smaller screen. You have done so much for us I would be happy to hook you up with a great deal. One I won't be able to tell my wife about lol
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HEY!!! I see what you're trying to do! Quit trying to kang our dev for the Dinc2 community!!!
Language warning! Don't open in front of boss or kids!
http://i.imgur.com/dWZMF.jpg
Just a quick note of thanks to OaT for his superior builds and the sadness he's now discontinued them .
I was first in line of the hungry hoards who insatiably devoured every mouthwatering release - from LnT_Beats to Linaro experimental builds, and to my shame never got a word of thanks or feedback out to the master chef! Unfortunately this pattern of general behaviour I believe contributed to the demise of this coveted build.
I tried a number of times to feedback on OaT's threads but was blocked by forum rules (hadn't hit the 10 x post threshold) and frustrated by this it was easy not to make the effort and feedback on this fine ROM. Apologies for this!
Nevertheless, OaT releases won't be forgotten, and my sincere thanks for his superb efforts on a thoroughly enjoyable and expert release.
Cheers,
P
I'm going to get eaten alive for saying this, but I think the whole quitting due to not receiving thanks was a bit childish... He knew people liked his ROM, mostly by the number of people he knew downloaded his ROM... If he wanted to quit for personal reasons then whatever, that's all good, it's his life. Just, I don't really get the importance of a thank you button on a message board.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Certain people just get a rush out of being able to show other devs how many "thanks" they have. It's the same as like-whores on facebook.
He wanted feedback on the ROM as well, not just thanks.
bananagranola said:
He wanted feedback on the ROM as well, not just thanks.
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What bananagranola just said is the biggest reason the man pulled the ROM.... Just as most users here are too lazy to search before asking questions... they're too lazy to fulfill the development request for feedback so he can make the ROM that THEY like using better... and those same people whining about the links being pulled are the same ones that conveniently forget to remember that's why he pulled links... not for the THANKS but for THEIR lack of ability to provide a simple request
For anyone with several devices can see... this is happening all over xda... the devs are tiring of the leeches that download and then simply whine and complain when things aren't all roses with their devices
Sent from my AOKP M6 TouchPad using TapaTalk 2
cdzo72 said:
What bananagranola just said is the biggest reason the man pulled the ROM.... Just as most users here are too lazy to search before asking questions... they're too lazy to fulfill the development request for feedback so he can make the ROM that THEY like using better... and those same people whining about the links being pulled are the same ones that conveniently forget to remember that's why he pulled links... not for the THANKS but for THEIR lack of ability to provide a simple request
For anyone with several devices can see... this is happening all over xda... the devs are tiring of the leeches that download and then simply whine and complain when things aren't all roses with their devices
Sent from my AOKP M6 TouchPad using TapaTalk 2
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Click to collapse
I said my thanks, and never complained. I didn't provide much feedback, because to me, it just felt like complaining and I knew I didn't have that right. Oh well, water under the bridge now... RIP touchpad for now. These days remind me of when bumblebee stopped supporting lg v500. Development died for months and I ended up selling the thing due to it.
Sent from my aokp_tenderloin using xda app-developers app
If this thread turns into a big arguing pit, I'll close this too. Please keep your posts civil and don't start arguments.
Noellenchris
Is the TP on its last Android leg?
It doesn't bear discussion as to the "why" OaT took down the ROM. It was a personal decision made by an individual for whatever rationale he/she determined was in their best interest to have a happy life. I have to respect that if I want others to respect my discussion and decisions as well. Many thanks for the time and effort that OaT put forward, but I'm not sure where to go from here.
The TouchPad isn't going to move forward. It's a static technology that HP as a manufacturer isn't going to come back to. At least not in its current incarnation. HP is coming back to the tablet world - just not at this moment, and not with WebOS. If you read the news, HP will be back in this space with Win 8 and tablets in the future.
Tech doesn't stand still, and as people's interests change on a non-standard / open sourced product - it's lifecycle is only determined by the people able to move it forward, and the demand people are placing on a limited supply item.
Reading the writing on the walls, the HP TouchPad is reaching the end of its (Android) life - for better or worse. Now it's up to those of us who own the TouchPad to determine just how long to hang onto it before moving on. Do you settle on a latest release of CM9, or hope that someone pushes CM10 forward and gets audio, HD video and all the other bells and whistles to the point of CM9? (Let's just all assume the camera is the great white whale for devs.)
It's only after the death of an artist that the world mourns their contributions. With OaT dropping out - I don't know where to put my focus. I don't know which devs are still around working diligently on CM10 versus the crew working on CM9.
--McBean
bananagranola said:
He wanted feedback on the ROM as well, not just thanks.
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Click to collapse
cdzo72 said:
What bananagranola just said is the biggest reason the man pulled the ROM.... Just as most users here are too lazy to search before asking questions... they're too lazy to fulfill the development request for feedback so he can make the ROM that THEY like using better... and those same people whining about the links being pulled are the same ones that conveniently forget to remember that's why he pulled links... not for the THANKS but for THEIR lack of ability to provide a simple request
For anyone with several devices can see... this is happening all over xda... the devs are tiring of the leeches that download and then simply whine and complain when things aren't all roses with their devices
Sent from my AOKP M6 TouchPad using TapaTalk 2
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Click to collapse
I'll try to make it official and clear here. The primary reason for me discontinuing development and pulling the links was the lack of feedback on the new Beats Audio in the new LnTBA. I don't have the hifi sound equipment to test that, and with 60 year old ears that are only able to hear middle range sounds, I'm not sure even if I did I would be able to tell if the new BA was an improvement or not.
The lack of feedback when specifically asked for, even initially when I asked for testers when I began to consider publishing the ROM, has been a real disappointment. In fact I initially expanded my testers list from ~20 to ~40 because of people asking me to 'please' let them test and 'promising' feedback. In the end I got at most a handful of thoughtful responses.
So in this last round where I requested feedback on LnTBA, I set the bar pretty low the day I posted it; I told myself if I only got 1 response when the download count reached 100 or more that would be enough, understanding that not everyone flashes as soon as they download. Ultimately there were ~250 downloads of LnTBA within ~24 hours of it being posted. Still, there was not one response, "none, zero, nada"!
In regards to the lack of folks hitting the "thanks" button, it should be obvious that if that were the real reason to discontinue development I would have stopped publishing the ROMs long ago.
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
O.a.T. said:
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
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OaT, that's awesome!
I do respect your decision to pull your ROMs due to lack of feedback. It goes back to something I say almost every day... If I don't know there's a problem, I can't fix it. I'm trying to get my 10 posts in so, hopefully, when/if you do make another release, I am able to provide input in the dev forum.
O.a.T. said:
I'll try to make it official and clear here. The primary reason for me discontinuing development and pulling the links was the lack of feedback on the new Beats Audio in the new LnTBA. I don't have the hifi sound equipment to test that, and with 60 year old ears that are only able to hear middle range sounds, I'm not sure even if I did I would be able to tell if the new BA was an improvement or not.
The lack of feedback when specifically asked for, even initially when I asked for testers when I began to consider publishing the ROM, has been a real disappointment. In fact I initially expanded my testers list from ~20 to ~40 because of people asking me to 'please' let them test and 'promising' feedback. In the end I got at most a handful of thoughtful responses.
So in this last round where I requested feedback on LnTBA, I set the bar pretty low the day I posted it; I told myself if I only got 1 response when the download count reached 100 or more that would be enough, understanding that not everyone flashes as soon as they download. Ultimately there were ~250 downloads of LnTBA within ~24 hours of it being posted. Still, there was not one response, "none, zero, nada"!
In regards to the lack of folks hitting the "thanks" button, it should be obvious that if that were the real reason to discontinue development I would have stopped publishing the ROMs long ago.
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
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This is unbelievably great news. Many people like your Roms and have great experiances with them. As you said I don't flash right away. i dont have alot of time to play with my touchpad so when I get around to it, all the issues that I have seen are usually already posted. Plus I'm not a heavy user of so I dont see many of the issues.
As far as Beats Audio, I've only flashed it on my LG revolution and it made it worse. Otherwise if a Rom has it in it for the touchpad I haven't noticed. I also don't use audio that much. I'm basically explaining that I do like your ROMs but i think my feedback might not make an impact.
OaT the TP God
O.a.T. said:
I'll try to make it official and clear here. The primary reason for me discontinuing development and pulling the links was the lack of feedback on the new Beats Audio in the new LnTBA. I don't have the hifi sound equipment to test that, and with 60 year old ears that are only able to hear middle range sounds, I'm not sure even if I did I would be able to tell if the new BA was an improvement or not.
The lack of feedback when specifically asked for, even initially when I asked for testers when I began to consider publishing the ROM, has been a real disappointment. In fact I initially expanded my testers list from ~20 to ~40 because of people asking me to 'please' let them test and 'promising' feedback. In the end I got at most a handful of thoughtful responses.
So in this last round where I requested feedback on LnTBA, I set the bar pretty low the day I posted it; I told myself if I only got 1 response when the download count reached 100 or more that would be enough, understanding that not everyone flashes as soon as they download. Ultimately there were ~250 downloads of LnTBA within ~24 hours of it being posted. Still, there was not one response, "none, zero, nada"!
In regards to the lack of folks hitting the "thanks" button, it should be obvious that if that were the real reason to discontinue development I would have stopped publishing the ROMs long ago.
Let me end on a somewhat positive note saying I do not know if or when I will restart publishing, after all the thread says "discontinued" and not for example "abandoned" in the CM sense. But rest assured development on my end for TPad is certainly still continuing. In fact I had the first bit of progress on sound for JB last night/today.
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Click to collapse
OaT,
I was out of town during that release (in Alaska, no internet), and I don't use BA at all, ever. I think it's a gimmick. I will say that your 829 build is amazing, and probably the best OS I have used on any tablet ever.
I don't agree with your decision to pull all your roms. It IS your decision, but I know hundreds of TP users out there (most probably lurkers that don't even post on XDA) have benefited from your superior roms, and it seems like helping people in the future (or even just currently) would be the "right" thing to do.
Thank you for:
A) Your roms
B) The explanation of your sudden disappearance
C) Giving us some hope for the future
D) Continuing your development
I can understand your frustrations about testers. Doing a bunch of work and not getting feedback can be a real drag. I'll try to be more vocal in the future. Hell, I'll start right now.
The 829 build is GREAT. The battery lasts forever. I have been getting occasional FCs here and there, in particular the holo launcher is DOA on this build. Apex works great (as usual), I don't really like GO launcher. I think it's kind of a mess. This is my daily driver now because the battery is so much better than the 819 JB build. Google Now voice input doesn't work at all for me (using OaT gapps 429). The rest of Google Now works great.
Feel free to let me know if you need more testing with something specific, but don't expect it too quickly. I'm married, new baby, play in a band, and have a full time IT job. I will get to it late at night on Thursdays or Sunday afternoon though, if I can.
Rhy
I for one am guilty as charged in the "no feedback" issue, my bad. I've used and enjoyed your roms and most definitely should have participated in helping squash the bugs. Sorry buddy. On another note though, the stupid rom is just so damn solid I really had nothing to say I would kinda feel like a whiner if I mentioned the occasional fc. I am still amazed that this old webos tablet can even run android, let alone run it well.
Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk 2
ItsDon said:
I for one am guilty as charged in the "no feedback" issue, my bad. I've used and enjoyed your roms and most definitely should have participated in helping squash the bugs. Sorry buddy. On another note though, the stupid rom is just so damn solid I really had nothing to say I would kinda feel like a whiner if I mentioned the occasional fc. I am still amazed that this old webos tablet can even run android, let alone run it well.
Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have to echo ItsDon. I don't feedback much either because the thing works so damn well. Thanks again OaT.
OaT, your ROM is the best.
Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk 2
As for me, I am a newb for xda, not a lurker, and couldn't post feedback on the dev section til I got the requirements done. Something like that.
Sent from my YP-G70 using xda app-developers app
hanjosep said:
As for me, I am a newb for xda, not a lurker, and couldn't post feedback on the dev section til I got the requirements done. Something like that.
Sent from my YP-G70 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I. for one, could not leave feedback because I didn't have enough posts. They should remove this requirement from the forum because I think many people can't leave feedback because of this requirement. Some people (including myself) don't like posting random comments to increase their posts and want to get to the point.
Regardless, thanks for everything you've done so far OaT.
Sad to see that on a weekend when I don't check up on OAT thread I miss out on an update. As far as beats feedback goes off the top of my head I ran with the beats build of 7/06 and 7/29. Before that I ran the standard version of 6/03. On a whim I switched over to the non beats version of 7/29 and never looked back. I believe I stuck to the standard version of 7/29 because overall audio clarity seemed to be better on the standard. Easiest way for me to say that is at equal volume the standard seemed louder? Again this was from memory, the testing was conducting in the best setting, and I wasn't trying that hard. In all honesty I think what I was trying to see if there would be a significant difference between the two and if there was I would keep my preferred version. Since I'm running the 7/29 non beats still I assume I found no significant difference. I would like to add that I found no difference even in webos with beats on or off.
This is too little too late, but this has been my personal experience. I used Audio Technica CKS77 iems. Thank you for all you have done OAT, your light n tasty philosophy was something I really appreciated when I was looking at roms and was what made pick your rom first. I never bothered to try the rest
Legion021 said:
I. for one, could not leave feedback because I didn't have enough posts. They should remove this requirement from the forum because I think many people can't leave feedback because of this requirement. Some people (including myself) don't like posting random comments to increase their posts and want to get to the point.
Regardless, thanks for everything you've done so far OaT.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I second that. And the "thanks" button does not show until you make your first post. I went crazy trying to find it.
It's just sad that I never cared for oat's roms until now that he disappeared. I also don't think it's fair that a small portion of people were able to download the latest build and others were not. In case someone has the latest build and it didn't break any rules and disrespect the developer then please share.
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
Howdy folks,
I used to be very active with the HP touchpad shenanigans so I'm not a complete noob but I'm certainly out of the loop. This is my first android phone though and I have ten days for my love to blossom with it. I really want to like it but as I assume all IOS losers say, android is mighty overwhelming! Still, I've spent the past couple days lurking the forums and am fully rooted so my questions probably won't be the most stupid you've ever heard.
Anyone out there want to take a bit of time on skype and give me a rundown about what they like, cool tricks, their favorite app options, where the unicorns are, and such?
If you do well I'll order silvermine to your house or something and if my questions are the stupidest you've ever heard I'll even throw in a brownie.... I also promise to wear pants, no weird chat roulette bogus
what do you want to know? the beauty of android is the endless possibilities of tweaking and customization but it will take some time to master and find whats out there.
skinsfanbdh said:
what do you want to know? the beauty of android is the endless possibilities of tweaking and customization but it will take some time to master and find whats out there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mainly I just want to ask opinions about common things, I know better than to ask "what is the best launcher" but I'd like to have a verbal (IRC isn't my favorite) conversation about their various advantages with someone who has tried most of them in the past few months. I've read so much about all these questions but finding up to date info is exhausting since Android has so much history. I've spent the last two hours just researching music syncing but most comparisons are at least a year old so I end up cross referencing complaints with change logs to see what has been fixed, but that's a slow way to learn...
My main questions probably fall into these categories which I'll keep updated, if anyone simply wants to wildly throw out their opinions below rather than taking me up on a chat feel free!
Merits of various ways to sync music with itunes or WM player, preferably where I can control the bitrate - Went with tunesync, feedback?
Merits of various launchers and UI tweaks - Grabbed Apex before I realized it would cost me blinkfeed which I want to give a chance, none of my reading warned me that launchers would replace that...
Merits of various keyboards - Swiftkey is so hot, so hot right now, so I grabbed it. Won't sync with my facebook though, typical?
Merits of various roms/merits of tmobile bloatware - Trying stock rom/kernal for now but I hate all the extra apps I can't get rid of. Tomorrow I'll look for a "poof" app before investigating kernals more and we'll see what roms are available when I'm bored with stock, MIUI looks awesome but very distant for an official release
Tricks for typing one handed on large screens - littering and...?
What spiffy things could I do/What has really wowed you - Droidsheep has been fun, what else is out there?
If you were a starving college student who had 20$ left in his budget after buying a 600$ phone what apps would you start with? - I've spent that 20 and a bit of next weeks food budget too, but I'm always taking suggestions.
Friends on hackforums have given me interesting apps with "questionable uses", any other forums(besides here) where it would be worth building some rep? - Still hunting.
I rooted my phone and my cat threw up on the rug, should I expect my cat to do that every time I re-root and should I just get a parrot? Looking into rooting parrots out of cats, missing SU...
Perhaps most important, since I loathe the power button position, it would be a new kernal which would add swipe to wake, right? Like the blackberry trick where swiping from one side of the bezel to another wakes up the phone. I want that like fat kids want acceptance...
The usual noob questions but wrapped into a conversation with someone who has the time to try a lot of the latest updates so we can go off on tangents and I can absorb as much of your wisdom as possible
Hello all!
See below for this thread on other forums.
Android Tablet Forum
====================
Click here to subscribe to this thread. I recommend it!
I'm a fellow Nexus 10 owner. I love my device, but I'm a bit tired of facing applications that are low-resolution and unoptimized for the incredible display we have on the Nexus 10. Even tablet-optimized apps are lacking. Aren't you frustrated? Hence, I thought we could do something about it as a community.
Which is the purpose of this thread!
Here's how it will work. This first post will serve as a compilation of all the petitions made to any and all developers to optimize their applications for tablets, and also the Nexus 10's display. Any subsequent posts in this thread shall be for petition requests and discussion, which I will personally put together and post up to the petition site being used for this purpose (Care2 as of this thread's posting). I will then add a direct link to that petition to this thread, sorted by category. Feel free to make any suggestions or to criticize! I will also start us off with a petition I have already created myself: to the developers of the Bloons TD series of games, Ninja Kiwi.
I'll try to keep things simple! Keep on topic, please, and try your best to sign each and every petition. Its the only way we'll be able to actually push developers to optimize their applications for tablets like ours! So, without further ado, let us begin!
Petition List
===GAMES===
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Bloons TD 5 - Optimize Bloons TD 5 for Android Tablets
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===APPS===
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Facebook - Optimize Facebook for Android Tablets
Instagram - Optimize Instagram for Android Tablets
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This is likely Google's job, not ours. In any event, Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter are three that immediately spring to mind. Not because they are low resolution -- not sure what you mean there -- but because the layouts are so clearly designed for smaller screens. I shouldn't have to opt for Friendcaster, Tabstagram, and Plume.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
JasW said:
This is likely Google's job, not ours. In any event, Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter are three that immediately spring to mind. Not because they are low resolution -- not sure what you mean there -- but because the layouts are so clearly designed for smaller screens. I shouldn't have to opt for Friendcaster, Tabstagram, and Plume.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, it's the app devs job. The point of this is to show them that there is a need for this to be done by enough of their user base to merit the work hours it will take them to implement it. What they don't know ends up hurting us. It is actually an excellent idea.
A dedicated Facebook app should be a priority. My mate has an iPad and I found myself looking longingly at the sickness of the dedicated app. Something needs to be done to put a stop to this sick perversion!
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 2
JasW said:
This is likely Google's job, not ours.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would tend to agree with Brees on this one, which you could probably guess. I think Brees put it excellently!
brees75 said:
No, it's the app devs job. The point of this is to show them that there is a need for this to be done by enough of their user base to merit the work hours it will take them to implement it. What they don't know ends up hurting us. It is actually an excellent idea.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its the job of the application developers to get out proper apps. Google has done TONS of work already. Now we need to show these guys that we, the users, actually care about proper tablet applications, and that it is worth the investment.
Thats why I created this thread - if we don't do something about it, no-one will! I'm going to try to get as many signatures as possible, and I'm going to spread this thread across multiple forums if necessary. AndroidTablets.net springs to mind.
Eztiban said:
A dedicated Facebook app should be a priority. My mate has an iPad and I found myself looking longingly at the sickness of the dedicated app. Something needs to be done to put a stop to this sick perversion!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly! I'm tired of this sort of thing. This needs to be put to a stop. I'll create the petition.
Like previously said all those social apps need optimization for sure. And the xda app needs optimization. I think there's an HD version but it costs money
Sent from my Xperia Play (r800x)
brees75 said:
No, it's the app devs job. The point of this is to show them that there is a need for this to be done by enough of their user base to merit the work hours it will take them to implement it. What they don't know ends up hurting us. It is actually an excellent idea.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CWalkop said:
I would tend to agree with Brees on this one, which you could probably guess. I think Brees put it excellently!Its the job of the application developers to get out proper apps. Google has done TONS of work already. Now we need to show these guys that we, the users, actually care about proper tablet applications, and that it is worth the investment.
Thats why I created this thread - if we don't do something about it, no-one will! I'm going to try to get as many signatures as possible, and I'm going to spread this thread across multiple forums if necessary. AndroidTablets.net springs to mind.
Exactly! I'm tired of this sort of thing. This needs to be put to a stop. I'll create the petition.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You'll excuse me if I seem overly cynical about this. I used to be a BlackBerry user. Well over two years ago, some folks on Crackberry launched a campaign to bombard Reid Hastings, the president of Netflix, with email to get Netflix on the BlackBerry platform (the OS 6 devices like the Torch had then fairly recently come out). If you are familiar with Crackberry, you know that they are a rabid, fanatical horde. Nothing happened. Then came the petitions -- change.org and the like. They are still going on more than two years plus later, and despite the fact that BlackBerry now has quite decent phones and a decent OS in BB10, there is still no Netflix on the platform.
EDIT: Holy! I already have 4 signatures for Facebook on Android Tablets and I haven't even posted it anywhere yet! That shows something.
C'mon guys, I'll post it up in the main thread. Vote for it now!
JasW said:
You'll excuse me if I seem overly cynical about this. I used to be a BlackBerry user. Well over two years ago, some folks on Crackberry launched a campaign to bombard Reid Hastings, the president of Netflix, with email to get Netflix on the BlackBerry platform (the OS 6 devices like the Torch had then fairly recently come out). If you are familiar with Crackberry, you know that they are a rabid, fanatical horde. Nothing happened. Then came the petitions -- change.org and the like. They are still going on more than two years plus later, and despite the fact that BlackBerry now has quite decent phones and a decent OS in BB10, there is still no Netflix on the platform.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think your points make sense, but they aren't a valid reason really to cause Netflix to develop for BB10. The marketshare simply isn't there.
With Android, however, the market has shown that it is a valid platform (and I hate to say that as if it was an option - c'mon. ANDROID IS AWESOME! ); it makes sense for them to update, and it only helps us out. We need to show them that we actually CARE. If they understand that, then they will update for us without question. If they have any business sense, that is.
Same with BB10 (which is, quite frankly, a very nice OS - it even has NFC Beaming support between BB and Android devices). If they had the market AND Crackberry screaming like it was/is, they would get a proper app quite quickly.
This deserved a quick update post: the petitions for Facebook and Instagram are now online. Facebook already has a few votes!
I just signed Facebook one.
Sent from my Xperia Play (r800x)
What's the address part for?
Sent from my Nexus 10 using xda app-developers app
Mannn121 said:
What's the address part for?
Sent from my Nexus 10 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So that you can be stalked lol. No need to put you real address I made one up and it didn't even check if it was right
Sent from my Xperia Play (r800x)
Mannn121 said:
What's the address part for?
Sent from my Nexus 10 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, what abdel said lol.
Its mostly to confirm that you're a real person with a real place to live, that kinda stuff.
CWalkop said:
EDIT: Holy! I already have 4 signatures for Facebook on Android Tablets and I haven't even posted it anywhere yet! That shows something.
C'mon guys, I'll post it up in the main thread. Vote for it now!
I think your points make sense, but they aren't a valid reason really to cause Netflix to develop for BB10. The marketshare simply isn't there.
With Android, however, the market has shown that it is a valid platform (and I hate to say that as if it was an option - c'mon. ANDROID IS AWESOME! ); it makes sense for them to update, and it only helps us out. We need to show them that we actually CARE. If they understand that, then they will update for us without question. If they have any business sense, that is.
Same with BB10 (which is, quite frankly, a very nice OS - it even has NFC Beaming support between BB and Android devices). If they had the market AND Crackberry screaming like it was/is, they would get a proper app quite quickly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BB's problem is definitely rooted in market share, something that Android in general obviously has no problem with. But the numbers dwindle considerably when you're talking about Android tablet market share, and then on top of that, you've got to consider how many Android tablet users really care that there are some apps that are just scaled up phone versions. Apple cared enough to do something about it -- remember that was one of the criticisms of the first iPad, i.e., that it seemed just like a oversized iPod. Google has not been responsive on this front (nor on others for that matter).
Anyway, I don't want to discourage anyone, so have at it.
Signed them all and subscribed to thread, will check daily to check for new petitions
JasW said:
BB's problem is definitely rooted in market share, something that Android in general obviously has no problem with. But the numbers dwindle considerably when you're talking about Android tablet market share, and then on top of that, you've got to consider how many Android tablet users really care that there are some apps that are just scaled up phone versions. Apple cared enough to do something about it -- remember that was one of the criticisms of the first iPad, i.e., that it seemed just like a oversized iPod. Google has not been responsive on this front (nor on others for that matter).
Anyway, I don't want to discourage anyone, so have at it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't worry, you're not discouraging (me, at least).
Android Tablet market share has been steadily on the rise - in fact, it rivals the iPad. According to many statistics, they are slated to pass (if they have not already) Apple devices in tablet market share by the 3rd quarter. I listed 3 (or 4?) links in all of the petitions.
As for Google, they have been doing a great job lately. They added dedicated tablet sections to Google Play, and have been pushing developers to adhere to the guidelines constantly. I say keep up that pressure!
lvnatic said:
Signed them all and subscribed to thread, will check daily to check for new petitions
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks! We need more people like you here. Keep it up!
As for everyone else, keep an eye out for new petitions; and, most importantly of all:
SIGN THEM!!!!
We have hundreds of views on this thread, yet most people don't seem to want to take 60 seconds and sign the petitions, oddly enough. And this is a Nexus 10 forum. Keep it up, anyway! We CAN do this with enough time.
Signed them all
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
One of these days I plan to actually try to learn some Android development; I'll be sure to make whatever apps I make optimized for the N10 though :good:
It makes no sense on a 10-inch tablet.
Frankly, the navbar should be on the side, because that's how you hold it in both portrait and landscape. But at least with the old TabletUI, it was in the corner, which is sort-of to-the-side. Phablet UI on a huge 10-inch tablet just makes no sense to me.
It works just fine for me. Heck, i even used the tablet UI when i had AOKP on it, didn't see the hype, went back to phablet. Same with pie controls.
Everyone likes everything. Any change made is always going to please one and displease another.
---------- Post added at 02:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:27 PM ----------
It works just fine for me. Heck, i even used the tablet UI when i had AOKP on it, didn't see the hype, went back to phablet. Same with pie controls.
Everyone likes everything. Any change made is always going to please one and displease another.
fredryk said:
Phablet UI on a huge 10-inch tablet just makes no sense to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They did this to unify the Android experience. I think this was an important step. With KitKat, every app can hide the navbar if need be. I think this is a good compromise, at least in the long run.
(The N10 has this feature too, right?)
philosopher09 said:
They did this to unify the Android experience. I think this was an important step. With KitKat, every app can hide the navbar if need be. I think this is a good compromise, at least in the long run.
(The N10 has this feature too, right?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hate not havind tablet UI. I find Phablet mode annoying. It is one of the biggest reasons I root and mod, then I can custom my UI the way I like. If google were run with half a brain they would understand the importance of being able to customize the user experience but they have proven their inability to manage responsibility just with their lack of announcements allowing potential customers to plan ahead, so I expect ignorance on a colossal scale when dealing with any sort of reliability or customer service issues when it comes to this giant waste of potential we call Google.
philosopher09 said:
They did this to unify the Android experience. I think this was an important step. With KitKat, every app can hide the navbar if need be. I think this is a good compromise, at least in the long run.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It they want to better unify the Android experience I wish they would do it by adding features to the phone (auto rotate quick setting, option to select the channel when using the volume buttons) instead of taking useful things away from the tablet!
In my opinion, the only thing potentially out of place is the nav bar buttons positions. Being in the centre makes it a bit hard to reach if you are holding your tablet with both hands. Which is why I have the ability to reposition the buttons in my custom ROM... other than that, I love the unified UI... I always hated the old tablet UI...
When i had Xoom on 4.1.2 I couldn't wait to get the phablet mode that was introduced in 4.2. When I got it in my hands I really liked it, specially the two notification bars (one for notifications and one for settings). Then I got Nexus 10 and never willed to have the tablet UI back, as I really enjoyed this one. However the only thing that I really disliked in KitKat update was the settings app! I think it's important to unify android now, as we're talking about many devices worldwide, but leave tablet stuff for tablets and phone stuff for phones!
If you don't like the UI you can flash a custom ROM and bring it back I believe.
sad news for many...
A lot of people on a Google+ Paranoid Android thread upset about this.
conan1600 said:
I hate not havind tablet UI. I find Phablet mode annoying. It is one of the biggest reasons I root and mod, then I can custom my UI the way I like. If google were run with half a brain they would understand the importance of being able to customize the user experience but they have proven their inability to manage responsibility just with their lack of announcements allowing potential customers to plan ahead, so I expect ignorance on a colossal scale when dealing with any sort of reliability or customer service issues when it comes to this giant waste of potential we call Google.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't agree with much of this. If it was as you say then you would not be able to ever modify anything. The reason you were able to root and do your modifications is because Google does listen and releases source code for android. They could keep it closed. Then people could kiss their Roms goodbye. People that modify, root, and change their phones are still in the minority. Sure if you come here it will seem like everyone does, but in truth we are a small minority. My son is the only person besides myself that I personally know that roots. So what Google is trying to do is create a uniform look and experience. They are trying to get developers to follow the model. Android is still basically new, but has come a long way. If they get enough requests they may bring the feature back. But if not, I am sure it will continue to evolve.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 4
a heads-up would be respectful...
It's hard to disagree with conan1600's suggestion that some type of changelog prior to upgrades would be extremely helpful.
Bigralphn said:
I can't agree with much of this. If it was as you say then you would not be able to ever modify anything. The reason you were able to root and do your modifications is because Google does listen and releases source code for android. They could keep it closed. Then people could kiss their Roms goodbye. People that modify, root, and change their phones are still in the minority. Sure if you come here it will seem like everyone does, but in truth we are a small minority. My son is the only person besides myself that I personally know that roots. So what Google is trying to do is create a uniform look and experience. They are trying to get developers to follow the model. Android is still basically new, but has come a long way. If they get enough requests they may bring the feature back. But if not, I am sure it will continue to evolve.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Simply by taking options away invalidated your beliefs. That I can modify my tablet is not an issue regardles of google. All locked bootloader tablets are eventually broken. But Google makes you do it this way. Add features and make defaults but NEVER take features people like. Also it wouldn't be hard for google to easily say, hey guys we are going to refresh this or that device, or we are not would show common courtesy. Google or most other big brands know nothing of customer appreciation.
Apple and Microsoft frequently remove features when they upgrade. In fact I have seldom seen any Of that doesn't remove something in an upgrade. Sometimes they are added back, but more often than not it never is. There are always people that are upset when this happens but they hope that most are happy with what they have improved or added. Windows does this over and over. There are things I miss also in this version. One is tablet mode. But for me it is not a deal breaker. And yes, unlocking a device allows you to modify the device, but if the Operating System can't be modified like Google allows by providing AOSP then all your tweaks can't happen. Android is to phones like Linux is to PC. Apple and Microsoft do not allow the flexibility. I understand your frustration, we all hate losing things we use. Like I said, I am not real happy about losing tablet mode. I just do not think Google is terrible like you say. I see steady performance improvement and a desire to added useful features. Are they perfect? Hardly, but they are trying.
Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk
---------- Post added at 05:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:24 AM ----------
Bigralphn said:
Apple and Microsoft frequently remove features when they upgrade. In fact I have seldom seen any Of that doesn't remove something in an upgrade. Sometimes they are added back, but more often than not it never is. There are always people that are upset when this happens but they hope that most are happy with what they have improved or added. Windows does this over and over. There are things I miss also in this version. One is tablet mode. But for me it is not a deal breaker. And yes, unlocking a device allows you to modify the device, but if the Operating System can't be modified like Google allows by providing AOSP then all your tweaks can't happen. Android is to phones like Linux is to PC. Apple and Microsoft do not allow the flexibility. I understand your frustration, we all hate losing things we use. Like I said, I am not real happy about losing tablet mode. I just do not think Google is terrible like you say. I see steady performance improvement and a desire to added useful features. Are they perfect? Hardly, but they are trying.
Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also wanted to add that Google didn't decide what devices get updated. In fact Kitkat was specifically designed so more device could handle updates. It is the carrier/device manufacturer that decides that. Google sends them the updated system then it is up to them to modify source and prepare it for the device. Luckily we have some great ROM makers who are capable of doing this themselves.
Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk
openness...
The Open Source Project was a brilliant business decision which has been hugely successful in accomplishing what Google has referred to as ''our most important goal... widespread adoption of the software....'' They go on to say, ''Openness is vital to the long-term success of a platform, since openness is required to attract investment from developers.... to make sure there would always be an open platform available for carriers, OEMs, and developers to use to make their innovative ideas a reality.''
Has Android succeeded at attracting the creativity of developers? For sure. And I'm glad they have... Android is awesome that way! But let's not forget that Android's openess was born of a business decision, to attract not only developers but end-users as well.
Google: ''We also wanted to make sure there was no central point of failure, so no single industry player could restrict or control the innovations of any other.''
I'd like that to include allowing Paranoid Android to continue using Tablet UI to give us a more tablet-friendly environment... and, for that matter, CM to be free to introduce MultiWindows without facing a dictator's wrath. CM's MultiWindows would be kick-ass on the Nexus 10!
conan1600 said:
...Add features and make defaults but NEVER take features people like. Also it wouldn't be hard for google to easily say, hey guys we are going to refresh this or that device, or we are not would show common courtesy. Google or most other big brands know nothing of customer appreciation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's encouraging to see Google emphasize tablet apps more in the Play Store, but discouraging to see them de-emphasize tablets in Android itself... especially when it's a surprise. Google could be a lot more 'open' about what they've done... at the time they release Android updates.
I assume, conan1600, when you talk about Google refreshing devices, you're talking about it's own Nexus brand. I guess that's kind of obvious since this is a Nexus thread. Also, I read you as wanting to hold Google to its own standards of openness, not to the low bar set by Microsoft and Apple.
If I understand you right, it's not enough to say there are worse tyrants... we love Android precisely because it promises freedom from tyranny.
***** ***** ***** ***** *****
'The people of Spain in the 1930s would have taken no solace in hearing that Franco wasn't as bad as Mussolini or Hitler.'
***** ***** ***** ***** *****
fredryk said:
It makes no sense on a 10-inch tablet.
Frankly, the navbar should be on the side, because that's how you hold it in both portrait and landscape. But at least with the old TabletUI, it was in the corner, which is sort-of to-the-side. Phablet UI on a huge 10-inch tablet just makes no sense to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
conan1600 said:
I hate not havind tablet UI. I find Phablet mode annoying. It is one of the biggest reasons I root and mod, then I can custom my UI the way I like. If google were run with half a brain they would understand the importance of being able to customize the user experience but they have proven their inability to manage responsibility just with their lack of announcements allowing potential customers to plan ahead, so I expect ignorance on a colossal scale when dealing with any sort of reliability or customer service issues when it comes to this giant waste of potential we call Google.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I could not agree more.
Found this while searching for tabletui options for the nexus 7.
I guess this is it with android. By moving everything to closed source and removing features like tabletui, Google is showing itself to be just as bad, if not worse than others.
With baytrail win8 tablets landing, I would say this might be a costly mistake for Google.
I love my android phone, but if Google declared war on tablets, then I will leave ... And it looks like I won't be the only one.
midnite_blue said:
I assume, conan1600, when you talk about Google refreshing devices, you're talking about it's own Nexus brand. I guess that's kind of obvious since this is a Nexus thread. Also, I read you as wanting to hold Google to its own standards of openness, not to the low bar set by Microsoft and Apple.
If I understand you right, it's not enough to say there are worse tyrants... we love Android precisely because it promises freedom from tyranny.
***** ***** ***** ***** *****
'The people of Spain in the 1930s would have taken no solace in hearing that Franco wasn't as bad as Mussolini or Hitler.'
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This goes far beyond simple decisions such as tablet UI. It is the demeanor of Google in taking Tablet UI that does show their direction of thinking though. Android was freedom, it was different than cookie cutter icrap.
Yes I am talking about nexus. It makes no sence whatsoever to refrain from at least making loyal customers aware if they should continue to wait on our chosen favorite devices. However I do not consider this high standards at all but simple common sense. By being so introverted they have driven me and several loyal nexus fans into the arms of others on both the 7 and 10 inch lines. Its not specs or trade secrets we are looking for but simply is there going to be another one or should I look elsewhere. But so many companies have become so large and powerful they dont even care about pissing a few thousand off with rudeness. And then there are the fan boys who defend bad business practices. Secrecy is one thing. Stupidity is another.
I came to android because I felt trapped by Apple and Itunes. As you can see by my sig I like android, and those are just the devices I personally used. This household has 5 times that many devices. Lately though I see Google forcing Google plus on me, i see google messing up youtube comments, I see Google making decisions about a few killobyte lines of code that could easily be defaulted rather than done away with, I see Google being closed mouthed about simple things such as if there will even be a new nexus tablet in a timely manner, and I see Google forgetting why we, the customer, made them great. the first page of a google search is almost entirely adds now. Over all I have been a Google backer, however I find myself pulling away from the monstrosity that I once saw as a bright and more transparent company than Apple or Amazon.
So yes Microsoft is becoming more appealing to me again. At least they had the decency to say, hey we took a butt kicken on surface rt but you can count on us making a surface 2. People knew they would get a refresh and could easily decide if they wanted to wait on it or buy from another company.
I most likely will stay with Android this year but Nexus has lost me simply because of the unreliability of the parent company and its inability to show courtesy. Fortunately other manufacturers of Android tablets are as yet not so crazy.
Another great invention by Matias Duarte?
Like the non rotating portrait UI on the Nexus 7...
I think the guy should really GTFO.
Cholo981 said:
Another great invention by Matias Duarte?
Like the non rotating portrait UI on the Nexus 7...
I think the guy should really GTFO.
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Yes I miss the days of how fast, beautiful, and functional GIngerbread was. Come on man.
Greg Tolan said:
Yes I miss the days of how fast, beautiful, and functional GIngerbread was. Come on man.
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Dude, we are basically coming back to gingerbread, without the tablet UI...
Everything come after ICS in terms of interface, was worst. IMHO.
They wanted the experience to be the same across all of their devices. I personally prefer the tablet UI on a ten inch screen, but whatcha gonna do? Still beats a physical home button!
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Cholo981 said:
Dude, we are basically coming back to gingerbread, without the tablet UI...
Everything come after ICS in terms of interface, was worst. IMHO.
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There have been a lot of what people argue are missteps (these generally being wildly up in the air; even the tablet vs. unified layout debate rages on months later), but a wealth of subtler improvements that take us far and beyond Gingerbread. The comparison is juvenile at best, both at an aesthetic level (Holo has been refined significantly since Ice Cream Sandwich, and the new "Cards" style UI is starting to come into favor) and at a performance level (Project Butter and Project Svelte, among other things).