t's a fair price for my Photon with no nicks scratches or blemishes with SPB 3d shell, and a 8 gig memory cad.
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Sprint is offering 80.00.
These kinds of posts/threads are always interesting because there are a lot of variables like is it unlocked for GSM, is it rooted, is it pure stock, where it's being sold, the market in that area, and so on.
I'd say at this point in time a Photon in excellent physical and working condition is worth roughly $125-150, as for the accessories or whatever that I don't consider to be too much of the pricing. An 8GB microSD card can be found for $5-10 these days so that's nothing at all. The case? No matter what people pay for those pieces of plastic or silicone or whatever, they're already overpriced by massive margins 99% of the time so, that shouldn't really be a factor either - the potential new owner may not even care to use their device in a case at all.
Original box, packaging, etc, it's all nice and dandy but that stuff doesn't increase the value of the phone itself.
This is US dollars I'm speaking of, as well, since I can't tell where you're hailing from and this forum is worldwide.
/me is expressing his own opinions about the value of the Photon so take all comments in this post as such...
I would say if your selling it, and its on 2.3.4, than NO DEAL. Ebay will give you 120 easy. If your buying it, and it is 2.3.4, than Buy! Only if it's running 2.3.5 do you have a problem.
Sent from my MB855 using Tapatalk 2
If you want reference, I bought my Electrify for $100 with no accessories off Craigslist about 2 months ago.
Sent from my MB855 using xda app-developers app
I'm wondering what I can get for my Electrify, but it won't matter until next August when I qualify for new-customer pricing at US Cellular (so I can put the amount towards the S3 or Note 2 successor, or whatever I decide on switching to then). I have an Otterbox Defender and a 4GB microSD card -- the 16GB card is coming with me. Unless the new phone doesn't have a microSD slot I suppose. And it's unlocked, so I can give the buyer whatever Android version they want. MotoBlur, CM7, CM9, or CM10, or a ROM based on one of those.
And I disagree about cases. The Otterbox Defender is a $50 case (though you can find it cheaper -- I paid $30 for mine). I wouldn't add $50 to the price but I would at least add $25. (What I paid for mine doesn't matter, it's what they go for.) It's in perfect condition so why not.
br0adband said:
These kinds of posts/threads are always interesting because there are a lot of variables like is it unlocked for GSM, is it rooted, is it pure stock, where it's being sold, the market in that area, and so on.
I'd say at this point in time a Photon in excellent physical and working condition is worth roughly $125-150, as for the accessories or whatever that I don't consider to be too much of the pricing. An 8GB microSD card can be found for $5-10 these days so that's nothing at all. The case? No matter what people pay for those pieces of plastic or silicone or whatever, they're already overpriced by massive margins 99% of the time so, that shouldn't really be a factor either - the potential new owner may not even care to use their device in a case at all.
Original box, packaging, etc, it's all nice and dandy but that stuff doesn't increase the value of the phone itself.
This is US dollars I'm speaking of, as well, since I can't tell where you're hailing from and this forum is worldwide.
/me is expressing his own opinions about the value of the Photon so take all comments in this post as such...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
THIS IS STOCK NEVER BEEN ROOTED, AND IS ANDROID 2.3.5 Box was not intended to increase sales rofl.wtf This was meant to be a simple question about value with no "hocus pocus" sales tricks with anything other than to show what item looks like. The memory card was included because some people may want it even if they have their own, and if I could get 5-10.00 every day without having to do anything that's a plus. Thanks for your candid honest thoughts. I appreciate all of them. I ended up listing on Craigs list for 150.0 or best offer, and on Ebay 125.00 to start bid and 150.00 buy it now
Update to this story is I sold this for the $150.00 buy it now, and I am waiting for payment. Thanks for all of your in put. The MOPHO was one of the best signal phones that I have ever used. However the replacement SGIII is very close to signal -dbm strength in weak areas just like the Photon.This is not to discredit or bash the Photon because it is still a great phone with solid performance. Good luck to you all, and enjoy this phone until your next upgrade.
Related
Just as the title says. It was an error and local stores WILL NOT be honoring a price match.
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http://androidcommunity.com/htc-flyer-on-sale-for-99-at-best-buy-fly-to-your-local-store-20111006/
Not that I think I'm entitled to a product at 1/3 the cost of its manufacture, but the tease is getting old...
(Not to mention, I really want to know how other people keep beating me to the punch. Are there really people out there that waste more time on gadget blogs/XDA than me?)
Well, I got two before the store opened at $99, saw geeksquad outside, asked a guy about it, and he offered to sell me early. Got home and saw the pricing error, I really hope the guy doesn't get in trouble, but I got two. I feel bad but is was an honest mistake.
Got one before store opened as well. 99....guess I got lucky.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
I've always wondered what the laws/courts specifically say about situations like this. While I understand that businesses shouldn't be held to honest mistakes. What if a typo or printing error meant a car dealer had to sell all his cars for $1, he would obviously go out of business if he was required to honor the advertisement.
On the other hand, somebody can definitely claim intentional false advertising or a bait-and-switch type thing. Get people to the store, then say "Ohhh, it was a mistake . . . but why don't you buy it anyway for full price while you're here?"
I was told that i will be given credit of $200 for price adjustment this morning. Hopefuly they carry through with it.
Otherwise, I'm prepared to pay the $300 like I agreed to in the beginning. I just hope they don't eff things over like they have a reputation for doing.
Just bought one for 99.99 from a best buy "vending machine" in the las vegas airport!
Pretty lucky if I do say so myself.
I got one as soon as the store opened. They honored the shelf price, then took down the $99 tag.
They canceled my online order .
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
Ok, now they are toying with me. They just sent me a UPS tracking number for my order
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
Walked in at 9:55am. I grabbed the very last one. I saw people running in as i walked out lol! I still think the HP Touchad was a better steal at $99.
akira02rex said:
Walked in at 9:55am. I grabbed the very last one. I saw people running in as i walked out lol! I still think the HP Touchad was a better steal at $99.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No way. The Flyer is head and shoulders better than the Touchpad - no matter how good the Cyanogenmod group is, it will always be a hack. The Flyer is purebred Android through and through.
redpoint73 said:
I've always wondered what the laws/courts specifically say about situations like this. While I understand that businesses shouldn't be held to honest mistakes. What if a typo or printing error meant a car dealer had to sell all his cars for $1, he would obviously go out of business if he was required to honor the advertisement.
On the other hand, somebody can definitely claim intentional false advertising or a bait-and-switch type thing. Get people to the store, then say "Ohhh, it was a mistake . . . but why don't you buy it anyway for full price while you're here?"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It depends on the applicable consumer protection laws--those usually differ from state to state (not that greatly) but it is general practice to honor the advertised price. There's mostly case law on it, but it's arguable to a point.
Contracts was so long ago ...
This, the Touchpad firesale and especially the Amazon Fire (250k orders in 5 days) send the industry (and hopefully HTC) a clear message: people want low priced tablets.
Exactly... they expected me to pay the same amount on the tablet as I did for my laptop, which can perform better in every single category (even in battery life).
(Acer 4820TG with SSD)
And who cares about the "iPad killer?" It pisses me off how many companies and review sites use Apple as the standard for everything. The only reason why they're successful is that they actually use common sense when designing their products and they come out with products BEFORE everyone else (which I think is kinda important).
Just make an attractive device without the iPad's price tag!
Lucas0511 said:
This, the Touchpad firesale and especially the Amazon Fire (250k orders in 5 days) send the industry (and hopefully HTC) a clear message: people want low priced tablets.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, and compared to the Flyer, the Fire is a slower and limited device. Your get what you pay for
The Flyer is a fine device at $300. Any lower has to be a loss, based on quality and features of the device.
sbrownla said:
It depends on the applicable consumer protection laws--those usually differ from state to state (not that greatly) but it is general practice to honor the advertised price. There's mostly case law on it, but it's arguable to a point.
Contracts was so long ago ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Having to honor the advertised price is what I would think, from what little I know about the consumer protection laws. But it seems this kind of thing happens all the time, where retailers state that an advertised price was an error. I'm on Newegg's email list, and it seems like every couple months they send out a message saying so-and-so price was an error, and they apologize, blah blah. It would seem that these retailers would be out of business, if they had to honor every advertised price that was a mistake. And the mistake might not even be theirs, but the fault of an ad agency, typo in newspaper, etc.
I wonder if promptly sending out a correction helps their case? Conventional wisdom (which of course does not always apply to the law!) would seem to dictate that making a conscious effort to quickly inform the public of the error, would help deflect any claims of intentional false advertising.
What's crazy us that if you look it up via the mobile app, it is still listed at $99. I have mine already, but seeing that price is tempting.
Sent from GrandAdmiral's phone using Tapatalk.
I can't even purchase it on the mobile. I couldn't get pass the log in stage.
W00t!!!!!
Went to pick it up from best buy. Receipt said $99!
Today the nib fell out of my pen and I haven't been able to find it - let alone figure out how it fell out in the first place. I didn't get any replacement nibs in the pack that came with my Flyer: does this mean that I am going to have to get an entirely new pen, or can someone point me to where I can get new nibs? A search on ebay didn't turn up anything.
veethree said:
Today the nib fell out of my pen and I haven't been able to find it - let alone figure out how it fell out in the first place. I didn't get any replacement nibs in the pack that came with my Flyer: does this mean that I am going to have to get an entirely new pen, or can someone point me to where I can get new nibs? A search on ebay didn't turn up anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think you can find it alone. It seems you have to go for a full new pen...
veethree said:
Today the nib fell out of my pen and I haven't been able to find it - let alone figure out how it fell out in the first place. I didn't get any replacement nibs in the pack that came with my Flyer: does this mean that I am going to have to get an entirely new pen, or can someone point me to where I can get new nibs? A search on ebay didn't turn up anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://flyertablet.net/about-htc-flyer-pen-and-how-to-replace-a-damaged-pen-nib/
I'd get a hold of customer support. I think they used to come with extras, but stopped.
Also a different alternative:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1122541
If it's the wifi version from best buy, i can swear they say on the plastic you can get a replacement one from them.
you might also jump on Ebay and contact this seller that seems to be a 3rd party supplier of HTC pens.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HTC-SCRIBE-...ccessories&hash=item20bcc792ce#ht_2701wt_1185
Thanks for the replies, everyone. Being outside the US, seems like I might have to go for the full replacement of the pen. I'll let you know how it works out.
I would contact customer support. The nibs ARE replaceable!
You can buy them, saw it somewhere but not sure where
Anyone get a replacement nib tip for the Scribe pen? I just contacted HTC USA at 866-449-8358 and unbelievably they have no clue on where to get replacements. Spoke to several service reps in various departments yet no one knows. They also transferred me to their accessories dept and they don't even carry the pen.
Can anyone here give me a lead on how to get a hold of one? Thanks!
Surely you have gotten hold of someone that hasn't a clue. They are using the same stylus with the Jetstream tablet and upcoming phones.
DigitalMD said:
Surely you have gotten hold of someone that hasn't a clue. They are using the same stylus with the Jetstream tablet and upcoming phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I spoke to 3 reps and 2 in the tech department (1 specifically for the tablets), ultimately they will direct you to a company called 'Let's Talk' who states that HTC sends them requests for parts that they never have. Called 3 Sprint stores and spoke with GM's who refer you to contacting HTC directly.
'DigitalMD' it seems like something trivial but do you have a source for ordering the replacement nib?
Thanks.
No I don't , I never tried to obtain one, but I am shocked Sprint and AT&T are currently selling Flyers and Pens
Wish Me Luck!
OK, so I have absolutely NO idea where my stylus tip went. One minute it was there, then gone. I've searched everywhere but it won't turn up until I'm no longer looking for it. So I was looking online. I didn't call support since it sounds like they really aren't much help on these kind of things but I did find tip replacements for a similar pen used by a Motion Computing tablet.
They come in five packs for $15 plus $4.95 shipping. I'll let you know if they pan out. http://www.provantage.com/motion-computing-509-500-02~7MOCUE8C.htm
WickeR said:
OK, so I have absolutely NO idea where my stylus tip went. One minute it was there, then gone. I've searched everywhere but it won't turn up until I'm no longer looking for it. So I was looking online. I didn't call support since it sounds like they really aren't much help on these kind of things but I did find tip replacements for a similar pen used by a Motion Computing tablet.
They come in five packs for $15 plus $4.95 shipping. I'll let you know if they pan out. http://www.provantage.com/motion-computing-509-500-02~7MOCUE8C.htm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL, and they've got the pen for $21.95
http://www.provantage.com/motion-computing-509-500-01~7MOCUE83.htm
Kinda crazy that buying a whole new pen is just a few dollars more.
I know. But I have the two button stylus (well actually two of them) so I figure this is probably going to happen again sometime so I might as well have a backup. Of course that assumes this set works.
Ok, so the tips just arrived and we have a match. The tips aren't solid like the original but still work fine. I've included a picture comparing them.
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WickeR said:
Ok, so the tips just arrived and we have a match. The tips aren't solid like the original but still work fine. I've included a picture comparing them.View attachment 943694
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mmmmm... ribbed, for her pleasure!
I wonder, does that pen the nibs belong to, work on the Flyer as well?
Sent from my HTC Flyer P510e using xda premium
Yes it works. It has only one button but it also cost only $25 from B&H.
Sent from my PG41200 using Tapatalk
yall seen this? our precious S2 "Made In China"
i thought all s2's were made in Korea...
have the fakes hit fleaBay?!?!?!
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*btw, it's currently on sale on fleaBay for roughly same price as korean ones
edit: now that the auction ended, it wont seem like im pluggin my stuff
here's the link to the actual listing: www.ebay.com/itm/290710122593* click on pix, 4th one shows a close-up
sold for $330! i gotta export me some of those by the 1000s!!
"Made in China" isn't so bad, wait until you see the "SHG-I7777" pure China-made product.
Well pretty soon we'll be trading in our "made in the USA" stickers for made in China stickers, as much money as we owe em. I'm kinda OK with it tho as long as I get a hawt Chinese girlfriend outta the deal.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium
Proud (I think) owner of a korean made sgs2
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
votinh said:
"Made in China" isn't so bad, wait until you see the "SHG-I7777" pure China-made product.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ya, it's not necessarily bad. only when the parts are replaced w/ inferior 1s.
the truth is out there w/ ifone imitations
my concern is ... we gotta take benchmark program/s w/ us b4 making purchases thru craigs list???!!!
Phalanx7621 said:
Well pretty soon we'll be trading in our "made in the USA" stickers for made in China stickers, as much money as we owe em. I'm kinda OK with it tho as long as I get a hawt Chinese girlfriend outta the deal.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Chinese girls r a hawt commodity because the boys out-number them by a huge margin due2 one child policy (population control) in the early days. i am lucky2 have snatched1 !! my wife IS chinese.
AntwanL said:
Proud (I think) owner of a korean made sgs2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
me3! also their pad, lcd, tv & 2.5 shares of their stock i wish they make cars too
-----
im sure sum of u already know this, but ppl from mainland china frequently visit hongkong to buy ifones/ipad just to make money (+/- us $50) that is if they dont get spanked by customs/duty.... ironic innit? made in china ifone is more expensive in china than say.. usa
ya, it's not necessarily bad. only when the parts are replaced w/ inferior 1s.
the truth is out there w/ ifone imitations
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't even mention, it freaks me out, man.
Imagine, one near future day, driving a car with inferior "China-made" replacement parts, heading North while the left wheel broke loose toward Northwest.
That's just scary.
psst, wanna buy an iPad?? yuk!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SrvQ11L9vw
vdo of a fake iPad
Would that not be a win?! He got to keep the fake AFTER he got his money back!
Plus, its an Android tablet
Clay
Sent from my STOCK SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using XDA
China can make....anything. Lol
Do you know that in China, if you have money and guts you can blueprint any device to the details and mass produce it legally as long as the name isn't branded yet.
This post made me look at my AT&T SGS2 box a while ago... Yeah, mine is also from China
At least as long as it says "Samsung" with the correct spelling, it is Samsung. Just the "Made in China" thing that bothers many people.
votinh said:
Don't even mention, it freaks me out, man.
Imagine, one near future day, driving a car with inferior "China-made" replacement parts, heading North while the left wheel broke loose toward Northwest.
That's just scary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do realize many manufacturers either get parts from china/japan, etc or their products are made there right? Made in the USA hasn't meant high quality for decades....
sent from my magic shiny box using the tap tap tap
Not sure if anyone is aware but Sprint no longer carries the Evo 3D. You can go to their site and look and the Evo 3D is no longer in their line-up. Some retailers still have some in stock, as of now RadioShack is offering the Evo 3D for $29.99 for new upgrade or add-a-line.
lmao! umm yeah. that's been the story for over 2-3 months now. lol. But oh well, you just now figured it out. Discontinued a long time ago. Sadly, the Evo 3D really is a great phone. But they can't just have 60 phones in their lineup. wish they could keep this one.
they need to grow a sack.
with ICS, the device should be a front runner, and HTC devs should have overclocked the GPU a tick to keep it up with other devices coming out. They could have kept selling the damn things, for the same price, it's all about how you market a product... and with hardware, as always, the performance is only as limited as the restricting software loaded to it.
truly disappointing. with ICS available, they could still be marketing these devices at 100 bucks a pop, even more, and people would still be buying them up.
xCLUx said:
they need to grow a sack.
with ICS, the device should be a front runner, and HTC devs should have overclocked the GPU a tick to keep it up with other devices coming out. They could have kept selling the damn things, for the same price, it's all about how you market a product... and with hardware, as always, the performance is only as limited as the restricting software loaded to it.
truly disappointing. with ICS available, they could still be marketing these devices at 100 bucks a pop, even more, and people would still be buying them up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
None of this matters if the phone doesnt sell. It clearly didn't meet their expectations on the sales end which is why they elected NOT to put 3D on the next Evo. Doesn't matter what the hardware is, if people aren't buying it they aren't going to keep paying HTC to make them. Pretty simple business practice there.
brownhornet said:
None of this matters if the phone doesnt sell. It clearly didn't meet their expectations on the sales end which is why they elected NOT to put 3D on the next Evo. Doesn't matter what the hardware is, if people aren't buying it they aren't going to keep paying HTC to make them. Pretty simple business practice there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
The GS2 killed that phone. I had the 3d and figured it be just like my OG evo and i would keep it for a year. I got really bored with the phone. It was like they sold us a cool 3d phone and said have fun go find tour own 3d stuff lol. The phone didnt sell bc it wasnt that big of a difference from the original evo except the 3d and well there wasnt alot of 3d stuff available so what was the point in getting it. The GS2 how ever was thinner faster sexier and had a way better camera. The day the GS2 hit the shelves the 3d was done. I jumped ship asap
Sent from my SPH-D710 using XDA
xCLUx said:
they need to grow a sack.
with ICS, the device should be a front runner, and HTC devs should have overclocked the GPU a tick to keep it up with other devices coming out. They could have kept selling the damn things, for the same price, it's all about how you market a product... and with hardware, as always, the performance is only as limited as the restricting software loaded to it.
truly disappointing. with ICS available, they could still be marketing these devices at 100 bucks a pop, even more, and people would still be buying them up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea and they should still have nextel phones, just gotta market that push to talk feature better! *chirp chirp*
on a more serious note... glad you aren't the one making the decissions for sprint though
Marketing ICS
The general public seems to be a little uninformed about android versions. I work at best buy mobile and often used android version as a selling point (Especially when the Galaxy Nexus came out with pure ICS). However I don't emphasize software version as much now since most consumers have no earthly idea what it means. even after explaining, most customers respond with a lack of enthusiasm: "oh... that's neat..."
For myself and probably many power users, It would have made sense to release ICS earlier on the E3D so it could have a better edge on the competition, (iphone, Gs2), but the general public... Android versions don't seem to motive them as much. the early move to ICS would have translated to insignificant increases in sales to justify the release.
Atleast on Iphone instead of saying "The new 5.0/5.1" you can just say, "it's loaded with icloud." Consumers respond a lot better to that. even though I like selling androids better. especially after apple screwed up my evo LTE pre-order (was supposed to get it day after my birthday)
runcool said:
lmao! umm yeah. that's been the story for over 2-3 months now. lol. But oh well, you just now figured it out. Discontinued a long time ago. Sadly, the Evo 3D really is a great phone. But they can't just have 60 phones in their lineup. wish they could keep this one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know I don't have my head up Sprint's butt or my face constantly glued to XDA. So when someone makes a post that may be a little behind or in the wrong forum, coming out and try to make fun and humiliate them only pushes people away from the site. Next time show some courtesy and some decency and correct them in a respectful manner. Some people such as myself didn't know this until I went to add-a-line and saw it was no longer offered, others may see this post and find the same info and see a good sale for a great phone.
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LINK
Another point is that HTC screwed up on this phone. About 70 percent of the people who've had this phone say its glitchy. I inherited this phone from my dad and when he had it, it would reboot or shut off by itself. Had it not been for it glitching out all the time my dad would'be kept it. And if a lot of people weren't hearing such things it wouldve been more popular.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
1st Note: bad headphone jack - replaced under 30-day return
2nd Note: bad glass glued down - replaced under 30-day
3rd Note: bad vibration unit - replaced under warranty for refurb
4th Note: really bad black crush - replaced under warranty for refurb
5th Note: phone powers off when tapped (OMG)
Trying to get AT&T to replace the phone with a brand new Note (not refurb) or give me a SGS3 or my $300 back.
They keep either wanting to:
1. send me refurb
2. send me a refurb of a different, lesser phone
3. reset my upgrade date and allow me to purchase a new phone at discount
What does it take to get something resolved here. Anyone have any contacts in AT&T that I can call to get something done?
Some really bad luck you got there. Hope all works out for you
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda premium
Yup...really talk about bad luck. Maybe its just not meant to be...maybe you're just really destined for the sgs3 or something lol.
My suggestion, ask for your money back and buy one from BestBuy. Their black tie program is the best.
In the end, good luck with everything brotha.
I received my note day one. Never had a problem.
You have super bad luck.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda premium
I know. I really love the phone and its screen size but after all this, I'm kind of bummed.
I finally talked to someone who could help and they have decided to send me a brand new Note and i get to keep the "4th Note" for free. So in that regards, AT&T actually came through for me. But now I have to decide on sticking with it, selling and getting a SGS3 or just go with the Galaxy Nexus. I'm just really turned off by Samsung right now. They are a great company but this situation was pretty ridiculous.
wow!!! that is a sign...to get something else...maybe, just keep telling them ATT no refurb...and say your a unsatisfied ATT user...
mean while....ATT hooked me with a what seems to be perfect NOTE...Free!!!
long story short...had a used, out of warranty pantech phone (non smartphone) for my kid, it was unlocked but still ATT phone, well they couldn't put it on the network, 3 tech's and hour later all on the phone, ATT said "tell you what" bigjoe, we will just sent you a new phone & replace that pantech"....."so pick one"...so I did told them a MOFO NOTE!, day later got it which was 2 weeks ago....so went back on ebay and got my kid another pantech...LOL
ok, see ATT took care of you...good deal..
I had something like that happen with me, I had got a skyrocket, and then returned that to get a Note, still in that 14day period, the note wont turn on at one point, and was at the 30day of getting the skyrocket, called their warranty support and they dint have any refurb notes at the facility cause it was too new, after talking with premium customer care, they sent me a new one, and I kept the old one, got it replaced eventually and sold it, also got my first one for $150, so got two of them for $75
I'd be less concerned about the phone and more interested in learning what caused the bad Karma that resulted in so many Note problems...Grasshopper.
bridge4d said:
I'd be less concerned about the phone and more interested in learning what caused the bad Karma that resulted in so many Note problems...Grasshopper.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
:cyclops: ahhhh, yes...good [email protected] y u no good karma....
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