First of All, I might seem pretty vague as I cannot find the threads where I heard about all this.
So I will apologise in advance If I am talking complete non sense.
Knowing about all the upsides of rooting, I have been seriously considering Rooting my S3 with CF auto root and triangle away.
I understand that currently it is possible to return the phone for warranty and not have any issues with it once stock roms is applied.
What I am worried about is the future implications with rooting, right now Samsung is being quite loose with how strict they are being with letting us root etc. But I heard that they have recently started a background service which keeps tracks of custom files created when rooting and that they are doing this in order to crack down on people who have rooted, using this log when attempting to use warranty. Again this might be completely wrong.
Can anyone confirm this with me, whether this is true? I'm worried about the future implications as I am only going to keep this phone for a year and keeping the 2 year warranty would be a huge plus.
Any help would be appreciated.
polesp said:
Any help would be appreciated.
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Click to collapse
Someone as scared as you are about the future ought not to be rooting!
Having said that,you need to ask yourself what you wish to achieve by rooting and if you get sound reasons,go ahead.
Try to enjoy your phone and live life kingsize rather than being worried about warranty issues.
Have you heard of anyone successfully having the cake and eating it too?
Life really is too wonderful to be spent worrying about Samsung spying on you!
Tell you what - go on ! Well i can't guarantee that the rumours are false but i can assure you that we'll have a workaround similar to what we have today for re setting bin counter
sathkartha said:
Someone as scared as you are about the future ought not to be rooting!
Having said that,you need to ask yourself what you wish to achieve by rooting and if you get sound reasons,go ahead.
Try to enjoy your phone and live life kingsize rather than being worried about warranty issues.
Have you heard of anyone successfully having the cake and eating it too?
Life really is too wonderful to be spent worrying about Samsung spying on you!
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Click to collapse
Yes, you are right nothing ventured nothing gained. It is just I am wondering how much it would pay off risking my warranty, I am only looking to install some audio mods and ad-blockers. If this rumour of Samsung tightening up the security in the near future wasn't there, I Would be rooted right now
If Samsung can fool such a large community, then I tip my hat to them (<--- that's my hat)
Like the movie Inception says, once you plant the idea of rooting into a user's mind, s/he will obsess over it. I did for 2 days (my previous android phone ran CM7), and I knew there was no way I could go back. So rooted
My advice: Right now, we have ways to circumvent, reset root counters and regain warranty. Tomorrow we may not. MobileOdin even flashes without changing the counters.
istoner said:
If Samsung can fool such a large community, then I tip my hat to them (<--- that's my hat)
Like the movie Inception says, once you plant the idea of rooting into a user's mind, s/he will obsess over it. I did for 2 days (my previous android phone ran CM7), and I knew there was no way I could go back. So rooted
My advice: Right now, we have ways to circumvent, reset root counters and regain warranty. Tomorrow we may not. MobileOdin even flashes without changing the counters.
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Click to collapse
That really sums the situation up nicely .
OP make a list of why you want root then decide if its worth it ,
Without root XDA does not exist no mods no custom roms no nothing.
jje
Related
The Evo already got it, and im sure the incredible is almost there. Whats wrong with the Eris? And what Hboot are those two devices running?
Nikolai2.1 said:
The Evo already got it, and im sure the incredible is almost there. Whats wrong with the Eris? And what Hboot are those two devices running?
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Click to collapse
uuuummm what r u talkin about ? im confused , the eris is already rooted ,atleast if u have 1.5 u can root it or the 2.1 ota i belie ve u can too
tazzpatriot said:
uuuummm what r u talkin about ? im confused , the eris is already rooted ,atleast if u have 1.5 u can root it or the 2.1 ota i belie ve u can too
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I thought it would be obvious that im talking about the leaked versions
it's just attention has been diverted that's all. if all the devs were working on rooting those leaks I have no doubt in my mind it would have already been, or very close to being rooted, but as it stands, most devs already have root on their phones so they arent as focused to rooting anymore, just providing more things already rooted phones. I'm sure there are some more devso ut there trying everyday to root it, but without as many, or as much work into it, it's going to be quite a while to get there.
I was looking into it myself, until my trackball stopped working and I got a replacement phone, so I guess I could be to blame as well for this.
Lemcott said:
it's just attention has been diverted that's all. if all the devs were working on rooting those leaks I have no doubt in my mind it would have already been, or very close to being rooted, but as it stands, most devs already have root on their phones so they arent as focused to rooting anymore, just providing more things already rooted phones. I'm sure there are some more devso ut there trying everyday to root it, but without as many, or as much work into it, it's going to be quite a while to get there.
I was looking into it myself, until my trackball stopped working and I got a replacement phone, so I guess I could be to blame as well for this.
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devs are def. working on the issue. problem is, it's a no paying job.
I dont get the whole point in calling Android open source software if they have to lock our phones so we cant do anything. if we screw it up thats our fault so i dont see the problem
cornbreadfarts said:
devs are def. working on the issue. problem is, it's a no paying job.
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Click to collapse
Yes, I recognized that some are still working on it, I just said that attention has been diverted greatly. do you think releasing an ad blocker, various roms, overclocking, froyo, live wallpapers, aosp/jit support they were busy trying to root at the same time? of course not, you can only do so much at once, and attention to rooting has shifted greatly. have they forgot about it completely? hell no! they just put it on the backburners.
Nikolai2.1 said:
I dont get the whole point in calling Android open source software if they have to lock our phones so we cant do anything. if we screw it up thats our fault so i dont see the problem
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Click to collapse
google and android being open source has nothing to do with it. it's the carriers who prefer to lock down the phones.
A to keep the general public out of things that could hurt. could you imagine any old lady picking up an android phone and overclocking and the SU app, and all the other tools were there? it'd either destroy her phone when she messes with it, or left alone entirely because she doesnt know what they do. eitherway? they become pointless to have on the phone.
B to keep users out of things that cost more money. did you know you have to actually pay verizon an extra addition on your bill to unlock tethering on the phones they allow tethering on? by having root, we can tether without them knowing on phones that don't usually have tethering and we can do it without paying for it. it's not exactly something they want going on, so they lock the phones down.
C safety. Having root access on our phone gives apps a lot more things to control, and with such, if anything malicious gets on our phone, it can do more damage on a root user then a locked down phone.
so take the nexus one for instance, if you bought that through google, not a wireless provider, it still has root on it for the first and last reasons I mentioned. to keep the general public out of things they don't need to be getting into/understand how to control. and with the safety lockdown, the average person who goes "oh what's this?" *click* on a malicious app doesnt get that chance.
it's not about keeping us out, it's about making the service providers happy, and keeping the general public safe.
google has put into android a very simple way to get root access for us all, it's the phone hardware (and their custom software additions) and the service providers that make it harder and harder to get into the system.
makes sense, but safe from what? its a phone... it wont kill you
buttttt how would you go about getting a pre rooted nexus one even if you dont have t mobile and just want the phone?
Nikolai2.1 said:
makes sense, but safe from what? its a phone... it wont kill you
buttttt how would you go about getting a pre rooted nexus one even if you dont have t mobile and just want the phone?
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Click to collapse
No the phone wont hurt you, just your pocket when the average person, who knows zip about what they are doing with a rooted phone totally bricks the phone and has to buy a new one, at full retail price. Or perhaps they load up a app that causes major issues with the phone, causing it to lock up/fail. again hurting the pocket book by having to buy a new phone at retail price.
I'm not trying to be a **** here but I'm fairly certain that when any of us load anything onto the phone we're aware of the risks it could bring, I would hope you went into this with the same mentality.
that is what we are saying, anying who can make an account on XDA, actually, anyone who has even HEARD of xda is probably smart enough to not do any brick-inducing stupid moves.
I'm talking about the average person who doesnt know the difference between RAM and ROM here, it's locked down to protect them from their own dumb moves.
frankspin said:
I'm not trying to be a **** here but I'm fairly certain that when any of us load anything onto the phone we're aware of the risks it could bring, I would hope you went into this with the same mentality.
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thats exactly what im trying to say. if we screw up our phones that our own fault so i dont see why we should worry about others who brick their phones and end up buying new ones. thats their fault and they can deal with it
(now because i said that if im ever able to root ill probably brick my phone trying) karma sucks...
but still.
im thinking about rooting my vibrant. but my buddy told me if i root, that it sends a message or signal of some sort back to t-mobile, thus voiding my insurance that i pay an extra 5 buck a month for. and i dont want to root, then have my $500 phone get stolen, or water damage, or anything like that and then be out a phone. i understand the other risk, like losing my warranty, and the possibility of turning the phone into a paperweight. but i cant find any good answers on this little signal that gets sent back to t-mo. so true or false? Details?
djkozdefantastico said:
im thinking about rooting my vibrant. but my buddy told me if i root, that it sends a message or signal of some sort back to t-mobile, thus voiding my insurance that i pay an extra 5 buck a month for. and i dont want to root, then have my $500 phone get stolen, or water damage, or anything like that and then be out a phone. i understand the other risk, like losing my warranty, and the possibility of turning the phone into a paperweight. but i cant find any good answers on this little signal that gets sent back to t-mo. so true or false? Details?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no signal that goes back to T-Mobile because you root your device. T-Mobile can tell if it's rooted if you send it back to them for a warranty repair rooted. And they can (though often don't) deny warranty claims because of this. So, now that we've doffed our tinfoil hats....
The real issue here is honest risk assessment and an understanding of what root is and why we want it.
Rooting is a means to an end, not an end in and of itself. Merely rooting the phone changes practically nothing at all really. Rooting (or obtaining superuser/administrator privileges) simply allows you access to the OS in a manner generally not necessary to simply USE a device.
The question you really should be asking is why should I root my phone? If you come up with reasons and then root, you must then accept responsibility for what you do, as well as what you can undo.
Are there some things you cannot do without root? Yes. Are they deal breakers? Except for the tinkerer who invested in an Android device precisely BECAUSE they wanted to tinker with it at the OS level, the answer here is generally no.
Root is not needed to install apps, play games, make phone calls, navigate, read twitter, etc... If you want total control over the look/feel/behavior, or even the entire OS, then you need root. So it depends on what your intentions are.
Many things that WE DO HERE do require root access. But we're all well aware that doing so absolves T-Mobile from necessarily having to honor a warranty.
Now, can a phone be rooted, tinkered with, and then reverted to a factory state in a manner where T-Mobile/Samsung would be basically unaware (effectively) that the device had ever been rooted or tinkered with? Yes. Does this mean you are not responsible for what you do to your phone? No.
Just keep in mind that many of the things we do to our phones with root access are varying degrees of risky, so it is equally possible (though not really likely if you do your homework) to brick your device and make the ability to revert the phone to a factory state impossible.
The reason why service providers will void warranties with evidence of root is a practical one for them. Rooting an Android phone is generally (or usually becomes) easy as pie. Modding your phone, thanks to the gracious work of many devs and rom cooks, is also very easy. So easy that you can easily do most of this stuff without having the first clue what you've actually done. Click a few buttons, smile, eat pie...mmm...tasty pie!
Start stacking multiple mods along with this lack of clue, and you can easily screw up a device. This is a road T-Mobile (and every other provider) does not want to encourage. People's stupid mistakes can cost them money. It's just that simple.
i have mos def been doing my research . and i know the things i wanna do once i root. i just wanted to be positive that if i root, and then somthing happens to my phone that is not from me rooting (like if i gets stolen, damaged, or lost) that i can get a new one with out having to pay full price. thanks for the advice friend
Hard to top the previous post, but remember, you can always unroot if you ever needed to send your phone back. With custom recoveries you can make backups of your system, and three Vibrant is crazy hard to brick...
djkozdefantastico said:
i have mos def been doing my research . and i know the things i wanna do once i root. i just wanted to be positive that if i root, and then somthing happens to my phone that is not from me rooting (like if i gets stolen, damaged, or lost) that i can get a new one with out having to pay full price. thanks for the advice friend
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well nothing is 100% positive, and you should realize that your ability to avoid violating the spirit (if not the letter) of the warranty entirely depends on your ability to leverage your research towards understanding what you can easily and safely do.
Gloom and doom aside, so long as you can do a hard reset, reliably enter download mode, figure out Odin3 v 1.30 and use it to flash back to factory JFD (something I do as a safeguard first step when messing with experimental roms anyway...it's best to start with a clean slate...), it's simple to get the phone back to a pristine state.
I generally err way on the side of caution when answering these sorts of questions, but only because I've seen some people do some really boneheaded things here.
YMMV.
bird is the word. now i just kinda have to decide which way to go about actually rooting. seems like theres multiple ways to do so. any thoughts on which way of rooting is the best? or do they all have the same features?
Sure there are different methods but in the end they all accomplish the exact same thing.
Nothing can void your insurance except for 2 replacements in 12 months. It will void your warranty. If the phone gets lost, stolen or damaged Asurion will gladly take your $130 and mail you a replacement.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Hi everyone,
I've been looking forward to upgrading from my Photon to the GN3. So I've been on the forum trying to read through everything posted at the early stages for the GN3 and I have a question about this Knox program. When I finally get my phone, hopefully on the 4th, should I install or accept the Knox set up? I know at some point that I will probably want to root like everyone else, but I don't want to limit myself or blow the ability to root later by accepting or setting this up on initial start up. Thanks for your patience with this senior citizen noob!
To me the most logical route would be NOT to do anything Knox related whatsoever. Don't accept anything, don't run anything, don't even say the word when looking at your phone!!!! Heck, if you say it you might activate it!!! It does have a **** ton of sensors and such!
Jammol said:
To me the most logical route would be NOT to do anything Knox related whatsoever. Don't accept anything, don't run anything, don't even say the word when looking at your phone!!!! Heck, if you say it you might activate it!!! It does have a **** ton of sensors and such!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And phones are getting the point where you won't want to even think about something.bad.
First and foremost, I sincerely apologize for making this type of thread, but I have done some searching and reading and I am now thoroughly confused.
My phone is the BNG3 version so obviously not towelroot compatible. After figuring out that was the case and it ain't being updated I stumbled upon Odin Pro, but it needs root to use. Seems like a bit of a catch 22.
So how do I root my S5, what is this Knox and why shouldn't I trip it, and what the heck is happening?
Once again, sorry for making this kind of thread, but I am just so confused.
Nemaides said:
First and foremost, I sincerely apologize for making this type of thread, but I have done some searching and reading and I am now thoroughly confused.
My phone is the BNG3 version so obviously not towelroot compatible. After figuring out that was the case and it ain't being updated I stumbled upon Odin Pro, but it needs root to use. Seems like a bit of a catch 22.
So how do I root my S5, what is this Knox and why shouldn't I trip it, and what the heck is happening?
Once again, sorry for making this kind of thread, but I am just so confused.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll answer the second part since the other poster already answered the first part.
Tripping knox is just setting a flag in the bootloader to true. Basically it tells Samsung that you did something "unauthorized" with your phone and voided your warranty with them. The thing is, tmobile doesn't care. They will replace/upgrade your phone without even looking. This has been confirmed many times here and other places. (don't hold me accountable...yada yada...)
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fffft said:
But TMB, like most carriers doesn't care about Knox and it usually won't affect a warranty claim made with TMB.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not always the case. Before rooting, I called T-Mobile a few times speaking to different representatives each time and asked them to explicitly describe their policy on rooting and Knox, and how it relates their JUMP! program (T-mobile's warranty/insurance and upgrade service) with regards to upgrading and general insurance repair/replacement.
EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM SAID: If the Knox counter is tripped we will know/find out and you will no longer be eligible for upgrading nor replacement in accordance to the JUMP! program. In fact, a couple of them went into further detail that I could be liable for paying the full remaining price plus a fine if I were to attempt to upgrade/replace a Knox tripped phone.
THAT SAID, the employee that I bought the phone nonchalantly remarked when I asked him about rooting the phone with respect to the JUMP! program that T-Mobile would honor the JUMP! program despite root. HOWEVER he said nothing about a Knox tripped phone. Perhaps he equivocated meant that a towelrooted phone may be accepted but a full-fledged Knox tripped phone may not.
TL;DR:
T-Mobile representative/"official" web-sources say Knox tripped phones will not be eligible for the JUMP! program.
ONE employee at a T-Mobile store seemed to be willing to accept a rooted phone with regards to the JUMP! program.
..
fffft said:
TMB is a large company. ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a troll/unwise, I am being completely serious. I am a cautious guy, and I wanted to know the full potential hazards of rooting with regards to their warranty policy. Of course on a person to person basis it should be easy to find a rep that will let a Knox tripped phone slide. However, in my personal opinion to pay the price of the warranty + full price of the phone + a fine in the unlikely worse case scenario that T-Mobile holds their policy to the letter seems expensive, especially when I know I will more than likely keep the phone for 2yrs+. My conclusion was to not buy their warranty, root, and be happy.
..
Just do a deferred trade in then when you jump. You skip one person looking at your phone and the people in the warehouse honestly couldn't care less.
Wow, thanks for the massive amounts of information folks, truly.
A couple question though.
1. If I Install an older version and root using towelroot...
Would I be able to keep my device up to date with the performance updates Samsung releases?
2. These custom recoveries/kernels that would trip Knox? What do they mean and what advantages do they have?
3. If I do end up tripping Knox, can I un-trip it?
Nemaides said:
Wow, thanks for the massive amounts of information folks, truly.
A couple question though.
1. If I Install an older version and root using towelroot...
Would I be able to keep my device up to date with the performance updates Samsung releases?
2. These custom recoveries/kernels that would trip Knox? What do they mean and what advantages do they have?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure on the first one, so I'll let someone else answer.
The reason I chose to use the root method that tripped knox is I knew I was going to flash a custom rom later on. I would really recommend flashing the CM11 rom in the forum. If you wait a few days, most if not all the bugs will be ironed out and it'll be just as stable as stock.
As to what they mean, recoveries are what you use to flash and backup roms (they can be used for more, but this is what most people use) and kernels would just add MUCH more control over the inner workings of the phone (performance, screen calibration, button tweaks, etc).
..
Last question,
If I root using an old kernel would it be possible to install updates without breaking root? Someway to keep the kernels just get the improvments?
Nemaides said:
Last question,
If I root using an old kernel would it be possible to install updates without breaking root? Someway to keep the kernels just get the improvments?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
here are two threads concerning how to update without losing root and or tripping knox. i suggest you read as much as you can b efore doing anything http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2790292 http://forum.xda-developers.com/tmo.../experimental-how-to-root-triggering-t2845421
AleHanSolo said:
That's not always the case. Before rooting, I called T-Mobile a few times speaking to different representatives each time and asked them to explicitly describe their policy on rooting and Knox, and how it relates their JUMP! program (T-mobile's warranty/insurance and upgrade service) with regards to upgrading and general insurance repair/replacement.
EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM SAID: If the Knox counter is tripped we will know/find out and you will no longer be eligible for upgrading nor replacement in accordance to the JUMP! program. In fact, a couple of them went into further detail that I could be liable for paying the full remaining price plus a fine if I were to attempt to upgrade/replace a Knox tripped phone.
THAT SAID, the employee that I bought the phone nonchalantly remarked when I asked him about rooting the phone with respect to the JUMP! program that T-Mobile would honor the JUMP! program despite root. HOWEVER he said nothing about a Knox tripped phone. Perhaps he equivocated meant that a towelrooted phone may be accepted but a full-fledged Knox tripped phone may not.
TL;DR:
T-Mobile representative/"official" web-sources say Knox tripped phones will not be eligible for the JUMP! program.
ONE employee at a T-Mobile store seemed to be willing to accept a rooted phone with regards to the JUMP! program.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah if you call them and ask they will tell you that ... Its completely the opposite of what happens when you bring a knox tripped phone in for an upgrade or whatever .. Think about it ... If you have jump then you have premium handset protection which means you can throw your phone at a wall and take it to tmobile and get a new one . They would way rather get a knox tripped phone that they can resell without having to pay for parts or anything like that ...I have been using tmobile for years and they never ever check for know . Knox voids the manufacturers warranty not the handset protection. The sales people really don't know jack about anything . There only fix for anything is to do a factory reset . At the end of the day Tmobile wants you to have a device so they can give you a bill monthly . Its bad business to take away equipment that makes you money . Im saying this from personal experience and basic common sense . Plus I have a friend that worked at tmobile for some time . When I bought my GS5 I rooted it while I was still in the store waiting for them to finish my transaction and even showed the sales guy how towelroot works . Jump is kinda a waste anyway cause you have to have half your device paid off to JUMP , when you can just sell your phone outright to pay the other half off .Especially if you buy flagship phones . I sold my GS4 for 320 which was more than what Jump would have covered
I like this!
fffft said:
Fair enough and I appreciate the elaboration. You described yourself as cautious which is fine. It's an individual choice whether to rely upon common practice or only trust what is official policy. You can decide what is best for yourself.
My perspective is that life is nothing if not learning to read between the lines. Have you ever read the back of a movie rental contract? Or car rental.. or rent almost anything contract? If you took the worst case, they have the right should you ever be late in returning the rented item to literally bust down your door, retrieve the rented item and not be held responsible for damage to your home. Not to mention collect hundreds of dollars in penalties for "being forced" to repatriate their overdue rental.
It would be naive to think that is common practice or likely to happen though. And that is the lesson of worst case scenarios. It's wise to know about them, but you also have to make a judgement as too how likely they are to occur. The alternative would be to refrain from doing many common place activities and live something like a hermit.
There is no reason that you or anyone else need agree though. That's just my take on it.
.
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Click to collapse
:good: That right there was a lesson in life!
spirodave said:
Jump is kinda a waste anyway cause you have to have half your device paid off to JUMP , when you can just sell your phone outright to pay the other half off .Especially if you buy flagship phones . I sold my GS4 for 320 which was more than what Jump would have covered
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Click to collapse
Not the old JUMP. That lets me upgrade twice per year without having to pay off 50%.
So I've had this phone for a while now and I'm fairly happy with it. Other than the fact it acts a bit weird with the college wifi. I'm pretty sure we didn't buy any warranty for it, so whatever it might of had when I got it about a year ago is probably about to expire. Anyway, I'm knew to the rooting scene and I would like to know if it would be worth it for me personally to root my phone. It is a Samsung Galaxy S4 from Verizon, it says the model number is SCH-I545 and is running on version 5.0.1. At first I kind of just wanted to root the phone just to play modded games on it, stuff without leaderboards mostly. But then I saw somewhere that you could extend the battery life with a different kernel or something, and that is definitely something I could use. So... any words of advice or suggestions for me? I appreciate it.
I would say rooting is worth it especially on an older phone. Rooting is really just getting access to the root directory of the phone. If you want to run custom firmware I recommend this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3132555
Our s4 has a locked bootloader so our options are a little limited but I like this devs work. Remember to do a lot of reading first and welcome to the community!
Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk
OrisX said:
So I've had this phone for a while now and I'm fairly happy with it. Other than the fact it acts a bit weird with the college wifi. I'm pretty sure we didn't buy any warranty for it, so whatever it might of had when I got it about a year ago is probably about to expire. Anyway, I'm knew to the rooting scene and I would like to know if it would be worth it for me personally to root my phone. It is a Samsung Galaxy S4 from Verizon, it says the model number is SCH-I545 and is running on version 5.0.1. At first I kind of just wanted to root the phone just to play modded games on it, stuff without leaderboards mostly. But then I saw somewhere that you could extend the battery life with a different kernel or something, and that is definitely something I could use. So... any words of advice or suggestions for me? I appreciate it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm new as well to rooting... although in the PC world, I've always been an admin. I think that the biggest reason to root is to have control of what you've bought! Deleting the apps you don't want, and getting the updates. I understand that via rooting you can overclock your CPU (which for gaming would probably be a good thing).
I haven't had great luck in a successful root for my Verizon S4 but I'll keep trying. So much of a different 'language' of what you're doing over a PC world. Just takes time.
Best of luck!