[Q] lumia 800 - upgraded to 7.8 - Nokia Lumia 800

Hello,
Happy to start of with the new screen, Bluetooth sharing options after the upgrade. Can some one post if there is any battery drain issues after the upgrade. My phone doesn't even stand good 5 hrs post the upgrade.( well iam a moderate user, couple of calls and texting )
Is it something very similar which been seen?
Version : 1750 0823 8858 12460

norysrinivas said:
Hello,
Happy to start of with the new screen, Bluetooth sharing options after the upgrade. Can some one post if there is any battery drain issues after the upgrade. My phone doesn't even stand good 5 hrs post the upgrade.( well iam a moderate user, couple of calls and texting )
Is it something very similar which been seen?
Version : 1750 0823 8858 12460
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well just observed that few things are missing one which really strikes is we still cannot attach any documents to a email when replying back, notifications on the home screen and wifi doesn't run on a locked screen.

Some have reported that their battery life is worse after the update. I havent noticed any major changes in my battery performance.
However your battery life (5 hours) is not even near normal. Check your background tasks if some app is draining battery. And complete a full charging cycle (from 100%-0%-100%). Maybe results change. About the notifications, I do get all the notifications I think, and while replying in gmail, I can add an attachment.

Related

[Q] How do you boost battery performance?

On my HTC HD2 (O2) phone, my drains battery drains why too faster, i'm running the latest ROM v1.72.206.3 from O2, is there a way of boosting battery performance?
install a new radio rom. Which is best for you is dependant on your area but for me it's 2.12.50.02_2. I also use the energy 6.5.x series roms (not the best on battery but is very easy to use) in conjunction with the radio rom i just mentioned. On light usage my phone will last almost 3 days. With heavy usage (but not playing video) it will last about 2.
Geting rid of the stock software and going custom and newer was probably the best choice i made regarding my phone.
If you want to keep your radio and stock ROM (like me, 1.72 TMob) you can also try and space out the update of weather and email. l have automatic weather updates every 3 hours and emails every hour. You'll be amazed how long the battery lasts. On the other hand, if you are in an area with not very stable reception, your battery will drain quicker because the phone will be working very hard to try and find a stronger signal to keep you connected. So, battery trouble is not just down to stock ROM or even usage. We have a growing number of super-sophisticated smartphones (not just HD2's) using almost Jurassic networks
ramonguthrie said:
On my HTC HD2 (O2) phone, my drains battery drains why too faster, i'm running the latest ROM v1.72.206.3 from O2, is there a way of boosting battery performance?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
turn the phone off. It will last for days that way!
ramonguthrie said:
On my HTC HD2 (O2) phone, my drains battery drains why too faster, i'm running the latest ROM v1.72.206.3 from O2, is there a way of boosting battery performance?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use Dutty's latest rom and have to say it is great for battery life! =)
Heres the settings that I use to get 2 - 3 days per charge:
- No email account (I use opera to see my gmail account so I dont need my email updating every few hours draining battery)
- No weather animation (The clouds get annoying for me anyways so I'd rather not have this battery drainer)
- 30% display backlight brightness
- Wifi off
- Bluetooth off
- 2g edge connection on and 3g turned off unless I need to browse the internet
- HTC location services off
- Black background
EDIT: Heres the link to the ROM I am using http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=610634
Sooooo, looks like the only way to have good battery life is to switch off all the functionality that makes the HD2 better than a crummy 10yr old Nokia. Is there nothing else? Anyone know of higher capacity battery availability? Mine drains completely between 8am and 6pm with a couple of short calls, couple of minutes on the internet, location on (hourly updates) and push gmail.
Just found this - very helpful people and lots of ideas to sort out battery draining issues:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=718173

Battery service life with new firmware 1750.0805.8773.12220

Hey,
I just wanted to start this thread to collect our experiences and current configurations about the battery service life since updating our Lumias to the new firmware release 1750.0805.8773.12220, because mine seems to be much better than before.
My configuration and usage is as follows:
3G now always enabled (though poor 3G signal)
1 IMAP account retrieving mails every 15 minutes
1 Windows Live account retrieving new objects every hour
Facebook account with standard settings
about 30 SMS a day
about 40-50 WhatsApp messages
listening to music about 2-3 hours a day
about 30 minutes Facebook a day
So battery drain is now about 3-5% an hour.
I updated my Lumia 800 via zune and now I have firmware 1750.0805.8779.12221. couldnt notice any changes after 12140. confused...
still a day and a half for me on 2g after the update...
I think this update has all but ironed out all the battery issues. I cannot expect Nokia to do anything more with the battery as it has been almost 6 months since the Lumia's release. If there was a big battery bug it surely would have been ironed out by now. So i do not expect anymore miracles from any software update from this point on. 14-15 hours is fair enough according to me for this phone. Wouldn't ask for more!
I'm very happy with this update, because battery drain was about 7-10% before (x.12072) on same settings.
Maybe Nokia hasn't listed all the fixes in the changelog.
So now, I wouldn't aks for more, because I can use my smartphone as long as my old DesireHD or even longer.
canstb said:
I updated my Lumia 800 via zune and now I have firmware 1750.0805.8779.12221. couldnt notice any changes after 12140. confused...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
where are you from? because you've got the 8779 oem firmware? rm-801? which country?
Mine i have 2 hours spent all day in Twitter, 1 hours in Facebook, 20 SMS, 3 hours of talking, 1 hour of Internet, 2 e-mail accounts syncing mail as soon as arrives, Accuweather,Live Calendar and Connection Tiles running on background and i uses only EDGE, i get only 1 day and a few hours, i think that its the normal.
Battery drain
I should not have to charge my phone every single day...
I don't often make calls or send sms'. My 2 email accounts are set to download every hour and my twitter account is barely used. I mainly use the phone for a 10 minute game a day and the rest of the time it gets used to read a chapter or two of an ebook. (while not busy at work )
But, battery drain is expected. I suppose I'd get better battery life if I let the phone discharge completely and then recharge from the wall plug instead of charging when the battery is around 20% at night.
Theseasonswither said:
I suppose I'd get better battery life if I let the phone discharge completely and then recharge from the wall plug instead of charging when the battery is around 20% at night.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it wouldn't affect it too much, because it's a lithium polymer battery inside our phones.
I also noticed that, with normal use the battery pass 2 days
goldfinch711 said:
I think it wouldn't affect it too much, because it's a lithium polymer battery inside our phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bugger. Guess I will cross my fingers and hope that somehow the drain decreases. :fingers-crossed:
If not, I have my charger with me at all times anyway :victory:
Nokia Win
its been 2 days since i updated and ive noticed that the battery level is enduring longer =), not sure if it is a placebo effecto or something, because the battery before the update was already very enduring.
Lumia 800 for the Win =)
canstb said:
I updated my Lumia 800 via zune and now I have firmware 1750.0805.8779.12221. couldnt notice any changes after 12140. confused...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you please share info on your model version?
Is your OS version also 8779 ?
bobzero said:
Can you please share info on your model version?
Is your OS version also 8779 ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bought this phone from finland, the day it was released(059N3K4). I was using this chineese 12140(059P4C2) before the update. yesterday, zune said there is an update, and did update.
now,
os version is 7.10.8773.98 but firmware version is, as I told earlier, 1750.0805.8779.12221.
there seems to be no change but maybe a slight better battery performance, if there is really any.
goldfinch711 said:
I think it wouldn't affect it too much, because it's a lithium polymer battery inside our phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's actually a lithium-ion battery - not quite the same thing as lithium ion polymer batteries.
well it may be wishful thinking - but the battery does seem a little stronger (after a hard reset (the volume + power button). Looking at the diagnostic app the battery drain of ~75mA is more consistent than it was previously.. 18hours is good enough for me - still carry a juice pack though
with normal usage I can get past 2 days without a problem. the last firmware update is great
I see an improvement also. Have had the update for a week and believed it to be wishful thinking in the beginning. But it is consistent. Not dramatically, but definitely better. Especially under 3G.
[email protected] .12220 from Everything Everywhere
Sent from my Lumia 800 using Board Express
Guys i used the china variant of tango, before the global release.
I noticed 3G is excellent on china variant, once set it gives me an "H" throughout.
I noticed the UK variant i flashed (tango) has browser problems with facebook, keeps giving error to "Try again"
There is export to sim in china
and the battery is extremely good, way better in the china.
So mayb the UPDATE from ZUNE and the flashed FW mayb have a difference
i will test a ZUNE update and let you;ll know
With Standby my Lumia lasts at least 22 hours with a 4-5% batterydrain per hour.. max 24 hours. (3g on, 5 mail accounts / 2hours, 2 BG tasks, 3 Push Apps.)
With minimal use i can use the device 12-16 hours.
My provider have 3G only, so i cannot use E or GSM.

[Q] Battery Life?

So how about the battery in the Lumia 920.
After the Lumia 800 failed in this area it would be great to know if the 2000mA battery is big enough for this whole Thing
Oberoth said:
So how about the battery in the Lumia 920.
After the Lumia 800 failed in this area it would be great to know if the 2000mA battery is big enough for this whole Thing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been using it for half a week now and battery is phenomenal even in LTE all the time. Will last you a full day off not a day and a half with moderate use. Full day heavy use probably.
You have nothing to worry about this time. Nokia got it right.
More details here: http://forums.wpcentral.com/showthread.php?t=200158
Mine sucks right now. I'm just using it for normal email updates and a few downloads from the app store and it'll be on 40% by 4-5pm. I've turned off a lot of the background updates on the live tiles too, but it's not making a difference.
Screen on time is disappointing.
Mine has excellent battery life. 2 days on a row on my last charge.
Ppl with battery life problems, I would suggest to visit the Nokia support forum.
Important
If you disable NFC (tap+send in settings) you have a HUGE improvement in battery life.
As mentioned above, disabling NFC and background apps will greatly improve battery life. I am more than satisfied.
I leave my data connection on 2G most of the day and it seems make the phone last all day, with heavy use. If I really need the faster connection I switch it to 3G. This seems to work for me
Full day, 3G use (using on a 3G only carrier, no LTE unfortunately). Moderate-to-heavy usage, not a problem getting back home, chilling on the sofa, doing what not, and having enough battery to last until bed time. FYI my day starts around 8-9 and I head to bed around 11ish+.
I hear battery life isn't as good when NFC is on. Don't know though, I never have NFC on anyways (really don't see how useful it is atm).
Battery saving Tips
This battery saving tip has been overlooked since WP7 first generation devices. The reason why some ppl will be having huge battery drain is due to apps running in the background. So, you need to think about the apps that you actually need to run in the background. Make sure all your email accounts are on the highest interval time to be checked and/or "as the item arrives". When you select as the item arrives I believe true push is being used which if you don't receive tons of emails will save battery in the end. The other apps settings are located here start screen>settings>swipe over to applications>background tasks>and block all apps that you can that don't need to be running background tasks. I for instance only have accuWeather app running background tasks. Another thing is you need to be aware of apps power usage...i noticed that accuWeather is far better at using less power consumption than the Weather channel app. Other tips are common knowledge. Disable NFC, use WIFI when available, turn off high sensitivity if you're not needing it, use low time-out for shutting off display and use low brightness. Be efficient!!
Good
Lasts me about 1hr for each 10% increment. About the same i was getting with the S3. While playing music its battery life seems to last longer than leaving it on standby :S Find standby kills battery some reason, just recently turned of nokia drive background app, hopefully that makes it last longer
Battery life has been excellent for me. Mine was fully charged on Wednesday morning @ 8 AM and was at 48% when I put it on the charger Thursday @ 2 PM with moderate uses. Unexpectedly, the battery life is much better while on the LTE network than when I'm using my SIM card not registered for LTE usage. Standby drain is very very good.
Kingakapadia said:
Lasts me about 1hr for each 10% increment. About the same i was getting with the S3. While playing music its battery life seems to last longer than leaving it on standby :S Find standby kills battery some reason, just recently turned of nokia drive background app, hopefully that makes it last longer
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's because WiFi stays connected when you're streaming music, whereas WiFi disconnects when on standby. Known windows issue that should be addressed by ms soon.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk 2
I get great battery life unless I enter into an LTE area. When I do, my phone gets VERY hot and the battery runs down in a few hours. Even if I'm not doing ANYTHING with the phone. Strange...
pvn70 said:
I leave my data connection on 2G most of the day and it seems make the phone last all day, with heavy use. If I really need the faster connection I switch it to 3G. This seems to work for me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you switch the 920 to 2g mode? I only have 3g and 4g in the options on max speed? my old lg wp let me set either 2g or 3g, huge difference in battery life on that devic.
to be honest tho so far i'm impressed easily outlasts my old phone, just tried turning off the high sensitivity on the touch to see if it makes a difference.
also run down the phone till it turned itself off last night, tried turning it on got the warning icon of low battery, did it again then it started, data connectino wouldn't work battery said 0% remaining and it lasted just under half hour with me playing mirrors edge, makes me wonder how accurate the battery % is
Battery capacity seems to have been cut in half!
When I first got the 920, at 100% the estimated battery life would say 1 day and X hours. Now (2 weeks later) when my battery is at 100%, it now says 13-14 hours of estimated life. My battery also drains much faster now than it did in the first week of owning the 920. My use of the phone has not changed over the last two weeks. I'm always in an LTE area, WiFi on and I use bluetooth from time to time. Is this an issue that other people are experiencing?
I'm trying to figure out if I need to exchange my 920. Any help or advice is much appreciated. Thanks!
i found it was using 2% battery every hour whilst connected to a data connection - but not syncing anything, all backround tasks turned off. This seems a bit mental.
So it seems that battery isn't so good :/ Too bad because i was wondering to buy this phone.
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda premium
chizzwhizz said:
Battery capacity seems to have been cut in half!
When I first got the 920, at 100% the estimated battery life would say 1 day and X hours. Now (2 weeks later) when my battery is at 100%, it now says 13-14 hours of estimated life. My battery also drains much faster now than it did in the first week of owning the 920. My use of the phone has not changed over the last two weeks. I'm always in an LTE area, WiFi on and I use bluetooth from time to time. Is this an issue that other people are experiencing?
I'm trying to figure out if I need to exchange my 920. Any help or advice is much appreciated. Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After deep cycling the battery, I am back to the correct reading. I am now losing a little less than 1% of battery life per hour on standby!

[Q] Battery life so bad?

My question is: Is the battery life of the Lumia 920 so bad, like they say?
Mine has been unplugged for 14 hours with heavy to moderate use and still has 20% left. Battery life got much better for me when I uninstalled the Battery Level for WP8 app. I'd say it's on par with the HTC One X or Galaxy S3.
brakke97 said:
My question is: Is the battery life of the Lumia 920 so bad, like they say?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it can be, if you don't terminate nokia drive and it is running constantly in the background
there are also some weird modes the OS can get into that cause faster battery drain. A reboot fixes that until the next time.
When it's working the right way, it should go all day with decent use on a single charge.
brakke97 said:
My question is: Is the battery life of the Lumia 920 so bad, like they say?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I checked my phone and the last time I plugged in was 1day and 2 hrs (i.e 26 hrs) ago. It still shows 79% battery life remaining.
I've made a few phone calls, checked emails regularly, took a 1 minute video (and uploaded to Skydrive) and some pictures. Minimal web browsing.
Turned on GPS to show it to somebody but didn't really use it.
I think if you make sure that unnecessary background tasks are turned off, then Nokia 920 has excellent battery life!
I've never been this pleasantly surprised with the battery life.
brakke97 said:
My question is: Is the battery life of the Lumia 920 so bad, like they say?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well it depends on many things. For me a bad GSM-Signal ****s up the battery very fast. (about 10 Hours) even in powersaving-mode. BUT from Saturday to monday with medium usage and in powersaving-Mode it took only 26% of Battery and than i went to work, where the Signal is poor and it took 9 hours to kill the battery :-/
So i would say, if Nokia fixes the radio, the lumia 920 will be great on battery life.
Montastic said:
I checked my phone and the last time I plugged in was 1day and 2 hrs (i.e 26 hrs) ago. It still shows 79% battery life remaining.
I've made a few phone calls, checked emails regularly, took a 1 minute video (and uploaded to Skydrive) and some pictures. Minimal web browsing.
Turned on GPS to show it to somebody but didn't really use it.
I think if you make sure that unnecessary background tasks are turned off, then Nokia 920 has excellent battery life!
I've never been this pleasantly surprised with the battery life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Update: Time since last charged: 2 days & 3 hrs (51 hrs). Battery remaining: 44%
I've been using my phone all this time - made a few calls, used Photobeamer to share pictures. Used bluetooth just for a few mins.
I will post a screenshot tonight but yesterday I went from 9 am -1240 until it died, I was making calls texting speed tests and listening to music aloud and taking pictures during the day also. its great battery life better than the One X, I would say about 18 hours battery if your playing games and taking videos compared to 15 for the one X
Here is my screen shot and my day of use:
5am wake up 5 text msgs, leave phone on with push notifications till 6pm (haven't touched it) 6pm-8pm constant testing and calling to make plans for the night, 8pm-8:30pm browsing flud reading RSS feeds. mild texting / calling till 2 am, wake up at 9 am mild texting and tweeting and at 5 pm this is the screen texting all day and lots of browsing
Here is the screen
http://sdrv.ms/R1cq8x
I have noticed Wi-Fi uses alot of battery along with low signal, more than on most phones
My battery life fluctuates a lot, mostly having to do with signal strength. I live and work in a low service area; I never see above 2 bars of LTE/4g.
My battery lasts me the whole day of work; 8 hours. That is 8 hours with Data, WI-FI, Location on; listening to non-streaming music, regular texting, 3 email accounts polling (as items receive). 3 background apps. (Weather, WP Central, Moon 3d), Checking FB, etc. So high usage.
I do not have Nokia Drive installed, I found it killed my battery very quickly. I would be lucky if I got 5 hours of battery with it. It even affected my battery life even after uninstalling it (and rebooting the phone). Luckily I was able to fix it by installing the newest version; enabling the battery saver, uninstalling, and rebooting my phone.
My 920 had a battery drainer called Skype. Before the latest Skype update, the battery would last only a day with normal usage, I needed to recharge it every night.
Now, since the last Skype update, the battery life more than doubled, I can get almost 3 days of normal usage without charging, which is pretty good.
brakke97 said:
My question is: Is the battery life of the Lumia 920 so bad, like they say?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. Well, not for me anyway,
It's definitely better than my old iPhone 4 in a like for like test (my daily work routine hasn't changed since I bought the L920).
If I listen to the BBC Radio app then I'll be down to about 30% by the end of the working day (just over 8 hours), but if I'm listening to audio on the device itself then I rarely drop below 80% before I leave the office. I'm very happy with the battery life on the L920, and unlike my flatmate with his GS3 I don't have to charge it up before I head out in the evening.
I am considering trashing my iphone 4s in favor of a lumia phone. It's good to know that the battery on a lumia phone is good if you dont let bad app run in the background.

Battery Life After 8.1 Update

I am starting this thread to see how you fell about new OS and do you have significant battery life change after 8.1 update.
Mine experience is not so good, at least to say, noticable battery drain...on slight use I manage to hold about 15h on NL 920, with battery saver and disabling backgroud apps as it was on WP 8.
Tell us your experience!
My battery life is also gone for the worse. With very moderate usage it barely keeps 16-17hrs, anything else is killing the battery dead.
my battery also worse but i make hard reset and do new settings manually (not restored from backup) and battery is much better
Battery life sucks on 8.1
I used to only charge every 2 (two) days and even managed to get 3 full days now and again depending upon work, but now it needs charging every night before bed . I charged it last night and went to bed and woke up today and 75% charge remaining, so it used 25% power doing nothing but hiding in my pocket. It used to only use 1% or 2 % charge overnight but not now.
Other thing i noticed is background tasks config page is missing and now the calander once open stays as a runnning task in task switcher.
I know after a firmware update the battery needs a few charge cycles to sort itself out but i am about to start the 4th cycle now and its still seems to be sh1t
---------- Post added at 12:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:16 AM ----------
Just found background tasks again. yeehaaa
open battery saver app
swipe to usage tab and tap on the desired app to see its background settings
Yeehaa time ti kill some apps again and save some juice
in my lumia 920 battery life is terrible after the 8.1
ie and whatsapp are sucking my battery juice as hell
guys, you must make hard reset and you must set all settings from fresh, not use old backup settings and dont forget block unnecessary apps in background... after this battery work much longer. this worked for me...
dxdy said:
guys, you must make hard reset and you must set all settings from fresh, not use old backup settings and dont forget block unnecessary apps in background... after this battery work much longer. this worked for me...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But.... but.... I just flashed the ROM two weeks ago, I don't want to have to reload everything AGAIN!!!. That said, with most of the settings synced, I'm willing to give it a go. Will report back tomorrow.
After a few tweaks in the background settings and an empty to full recharge everything is now back to normal. Yeehaa 2 days between charges and 1%-2% drain overnight. SWEET so no need to hard reset unless you have major problems. just sort the background apps and see how it goes
Im having a nightmare after 8.1 battery drain is the least of my worries..
my phone becomes unresponsive and only a hard reset brings it back to life .
I also get the screen crash and it looks like a old tv not tuned in
but it is an early release so hopefully ms will look and fix he problems because the update is worth it
Hey, I have the same problem. But not only the battery draining, the phone heats up. And I mean REALLY heats up. I gets hotter than my Laptop. Yesterday, while videocalling on skype over WIFI, the camera went dark, and 10 seconds later the picture was green. I don't mean just a completely green picture, It still showed me, but I was green. I then ended skype, opened the camera app and it was just awfully bright. With the flash off, the lights in my room out I could still see everything through the camera, but it was corny as hell. I then had to reboot the phone and everything worked again, but still. It's quite concerning, specially considering the heat.
did you make hard reset and set phone setting without using old backup settings?
phone work much better if you setup all from fresh beginning... seems old WP8.0 settings sometimes mess up things...
CBDSonline said:
After a few tweaks in the background settings and an empty to full recharge everything is now back to normal. Yeehaa 2 days between charges and 1%-2% drain overnight. SWEET so no need to hard reset unless you have major problems. just sort the background apps and see how it goes
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi there,
can you tell me please were is the option to set up background apps?
In Lumia Black and older versions the "background tasks" was in applications menu.
In 8.1 preview I can't find it.
Thanks!
Find in App list Battery Saver :victory:
dxdy said:
did you make hard reset and set phone setting without using old backup settings?
phone work much better if you setup all from fresh beginning... seems old WP8.0 settings sometimes mess up things...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I did reset it a few times. The first time I got it it had 8 on it, upgraded to 8.1. Then reflashed it, upgraded and used the backup. You really think it could help? If so, I may try it later today.
The skype thing frightened me the most to be honest.
I never used the 920 before the 8.1 update as I bought it on the 8.1 release day so can't compare the battery life before & after.
So far ive found the biggest hog on battery was the intermittent glance screen though proximity glance is ok but the biggest culprit was having 3 email accounts set to push receive emails. After changing to sync 2 email accounts manually & the other every hour I noticed a big improvement in battery life & its now similar to my previous Galaxy Nexus.
Worse battery life
My battery life was terrible, but after the last update it is much better and with 3-5 minutes of calls a day and HSDPA internet enabled it can last for 24 hours.
My battery life has increased significantly. With 8.0, the battery life was frankly pathetic. I couldn't even get a day out of the phone, and that's with only having 3 mail accounts and Facebook active (NFC & BT off), and only moderate use. It was bad enough that I couldn't use it as my daily phone.
After 8.1, it's a dramatic change, it easily lasts me a whole day - used it moderately today, and now 15 hours since taking it off the charger, there is still 45% battery left. I love 8.1
learn more about update
to know more about the update and for the link follow http://appsforlumia.com/nokia-lumia-920-software-update/
I agree, 8.1 has extended battery life... Not that I had any issue with it lasting the day before!
Sent from my Lumia 920 using Tapatalk
For me battery life has become alot worse after 8.1. And there's nothing I can turn off in battery saver

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