So you are a talented individual (or a group) whose product out there some people would benefit from ?
Or not yet done with your product yet?.. but you do have the skills that you can use to build a product, that is a great gift by itself! and it should not be gone unnoticed.
“Nothing from nothing ever yet was born”
Neither it comes out of nowhere, nor it would just disappear.
Inspiration and outcome.. two elementary aspects for the process, and the main subject of this article as well.
You're either generously willing to gift your product to the world (which is highly appreciated by all your users) like so many free apps on the market. That works very well as long as you can afford the luxury of supporting your product without expecting a financial return.
Or naturally, you would be thinking.. can I get money out of this? which is absolutely fine, and it should keep up your desire to support, update, and upgrade your product, what you should be thinking is how!.
Software
Writing this article having software production as a primary subject in mind, I strongly believe that the discussion can fairly fit any other kind of product.
In this article
We will be discussing some very common methods first, as well as some unusual methods later on.
it’s not a guide with a couple of steps to follow and unleash the jinni!
It is meant to briefly provide our brain juice by covering different aspects in ways we can provide a better cause for our innovation.
Straightforward
One of the first, yet most commonly used methods by mankind. Some would call it “being an honest tradesman”. This is when we simply ask our customer for money equivalent to the product we are providing. A good way to get a return for what we propose. When following a "straight forward" strategy, I would strongly advise a good product presentation and marketing campaign, this is how we can get our customers to willingly pay to get our product.
Sponsored
What could be better than someone funding our project, believing in our product and outcome. This is where we can focus only on our product, as having someone believing in our skills enough to sponsor our project is quite a push for self confidence. But the question remains; What does it take to get sponsored? How to lead a sponsored project to success?!
A spectacular proposal, promising outcome, uniquely identified features. As of leading our sponsored project to success, a solid plan in details is the main element of success.
Fishing?
Are you a fishing kind of person?
Lay ahead your net with all your goods for free to the sea of customers, some will gracefully offer you a fish in return!
Except you don't actually need a fishing boat to do so in here..
One more common strategy is depending on donations. Releasing our useful product absolutely for free, promoting either ourselves or our product, a satisfied customer will be offering us donations to keep up the good work. it’s not as easy as it sounds.. yet not too complicated, we have already done most of our part in this when we successfully produced a quality product mentioning that donations are most welcome. That being said, this strategy depends totally on the kind of customers we have.
Campaign Strategy
Previously, we mentioned 2 different methods, getting a sponsor and asking for donations. In campaign strategy we combine both these methods together. Like when we’re looking for a sponsor, we prepare the attractive proposal, but we don’t do it for a specific sponsor, we ask for donations support to build our project and bring our ideas to life.
A part of a bigger picture
Another commonly used strategy, not in a direct way occasionally, is supporting -with our product- a successful organisation by being a part of their production campaign. There is where we get a return for our efforts without caring about how is the product presented or published. However, using this method indicates lower risk factors, most likely our product will lose its identity by becoming a part of something else.
Trials
It is always an option to split our product into 2 parts, a stripped version for free, and a full paid version. A successful strategy, counting mainly on our product quality plus having attractive features to offer. A free product is attractive by itself for our customer, but that’s not all what we’re looking for, the end game here is to have this free product itself truly deep within its user experience to keep our users looking for our full version.
Ask for more!
Quite similar strategy to our previous one, but we don’t have to produce 2 different versions of our product in here, just one version.. but missing some features (or accessories). With these missing litle features we can make money. However, we are actually selling these desirable features in here, our product better be functioning and totally usable without these features. Product quality and user experience are playing an important role in here as well.
An Apple
Spotting Apple’s brand logo on any piece of technology uniquely identifies it, guarantees as well the quality and support. A regular customer would peacefully pay a huge amount of money for it without doubting the product.
To be able to ask for the price we’re looking for, we have first to build reputation, and gain our customers’ trust. What identifies our product uniquely ? Why would a regular customer prefer our product than others already existing? Unless our product is quite unique or a one of a kind invention, one good strategy is to actually compromise in terms of price.
Never underestimate the crowd
Our customer has already made it that far and decided to go with our product. it doesn’t mean nothing, it means we are actually one step closer to our esteemed goal, the more customers we get the closer we are to becoming an icon. so if selling for the desired price is not currently an option for our product, then spreading our product to gain popularity should be the first step. social networks would help a great deal in doing so.
Speaking of networks..
As it is surely easier to use an existing network, it is absolutely more powerful to build our own. even a symbolic return for our loyal customer promoting our brand would be an encouragement. There are many ways where we can use customers and fans to to gain profit.
The Idea of Sharing
What if the customer himself is actually finding our next customer? or actually selling one of our products in our name!
However, a simple return could be all what it takes when you ask nicely a satisfied customer, a symbolic return to the new business partner is not enough to keep the network growing, but sharing a tiny bit of your assisted earnings would do the trick.
The Art of Perfection
The concept of perfection is absolutely relative.. one would say it doesn’t exist!
It depends on how you look at it, and what are you looking for. From a consumer point of view it could be just satisfying whatever was originally expected out of it.
The future is the true success
Straight to the point.. it could be fairly easy to gain some profit from our initial product, however, this should not be the final goal, it can only be just a step on the way. regardless of how is the product presented, advertised, or promising are the features in it. The product quality and support is what puts in the final words with its customer satisfaction.
A final word
Out of all debated concepts of this subject, besides gathering our clear thoughts on the product outcome, a final thought in mind should lead to initially aiming for development and production, as close as it gets to its relative perfection. Which is a money making strategy by itself regardless the methods used.
Related
Alright here's the deal. I have an app idea for a game that I plan on creating that is very simple, and I have a good feeling it will take off. My worries is that developing it will almost be pointless because of the lax android market policy. I am a new programmer, so my worry is I will make the app pretty decent, and some more experienced programmer will be able to duplicate it and make it better. This just doesn't seem right. I know this happens all the time (Fruit Slice, for example, is a Fruit Ninja knockoff and it's free).
Android is a love it/ hate it relationship. Users love being able to download just as good of knockoffs for free, but I'm sure this is a major turn off for developers who worked hard on their original idea's, just to have it undercut by another developer who will offer a similar (or even better app) for free. Part of me wishes I could just develop it for iOS, but I don't have a Mac or iPhone, and don't ever plan on getting one.
My question is, is there anyway to stop it? Like a patent, or something similar? This is my major hesitation to developing for android. I know I'm not going to be the best programmer out there, but it's the idea that make the apps, and that's where I feel like (I'm sure a lot of other people do too) I could do some contributing. Let me know how you guys feel about this
Anybody? 10Char
welcome to programming for any platform. There are (free) alternatives to almost every single program (android-based, windows-based, etc...)
I think you're in a very bad place to ask about that question. Programmers are usually not at all fond of patents since they tend to be overly broad, hard to detect and generally of low quality. (In case you haven't noticed that's also my opinion)
But yes, if that's what you want to do, a patent would be the way to go. Copyright protects your code, but not your idea.
Make it free. Put ads on it. If it takes off make an iOS one
Sent from my MOTWX435KT using XDA App
As far as I can remember, from my Intellectual Property Law class, software (i.e. apps) cannot be the subject of a patent. But of course, this changes from country to country.
Here are some links you might want to read up on:
http://www.wipo.int/patentscope/en/patents_faq.html#software
http://www.freibrun.com/articles/articl2.htm
Computer-based inventions... yeah, they're not supposed to be patentable: Not in the US and even less in the EU. The key point is how computer-based inventions is defined. The standard way around it is simply to patent "a machine doing XY" instead of "XY"
Basically, the patent clerks don't check for anything but formalities. I used to help out on the peertopatent platform, but it just became ridicolous because the clerks would let everything through no matter what prior art or explanations of obviousness we provided.
Patenting is the worst thing you can do. Don't you read all the patent BS going around lately? Also, spending money on a patent won't be enough, you'll also need to spent money enforcing it, and you won't make any friends by being a litigator.
All you can do is provide the best product you can come up with and hope for the best. If someone makes something similar but better, well, you'll just have to work harder. Or drop the whole thing.
But as others have said, you'll have this problem on *all* platforms. A practical example, when Nero released their burning app for Linux, my thought was "This is kinda cool, but why would I pay for Nero, when there's K3B and other apps that to the job, but are open source and free?"
The trick is to provide something others don't have. In the case of NeroLinux it's familiarity for ex-Windows folks or dual-booters. In your case it could be more features, better graphics, easier to navigate interface, regularly provided additional content... something in that direction.
Hello I appreciate the time you are taking to read my thread!
I have a background in real estate development and no programming experience. I already have a bachelors in Business (emphasis Finance). I am currently getting my MBA in an evening program at one of the top 20 schools in the world. I don't want to go back into real estate and want to get into the tech industry.
What I really want is to become a mobile applications developer (ios/andriod).
I can financially support my existence with a part-time job and the MBA really isn't that hard because I have an undergrad degree in business. These activities will take about 35 hours of my time a week, 45 hours during finals week.
So, I want to go back and get a degree so I can break into this field. So I am looking for recommendations.
Looking at the local state college it looks like the program is really outdated and I won't learn much practical knowledge. Having already done a bunch of college I don't really want to spend my time getting a degree to have another degree. I want to be at least relatively work force ready at graduation.
So it looks like my only option is to do an online degree.
I have identified a few options.
Full Sail, this was the only program I could find where you can specifically study Mobile development. I like that its completely project based because I will learn practical experience. Having a completed app by graduation will certainly help find a job I would think. It is however expensive and I have seen some complaints about the school online. However these complaints seemed to be mostly from people pursing a recording arts degree. IMO its crazy to pursue a degree where thousands of people graduate for only a few new openings a year. Could probably graduate in about 2 years.
Western Governors University. Has lots of good reviews online and is quite inexpensive ($6000 a year). Also you get 18 tech certifications as you go through the program. I am worried it will be less practical and it will certainly take more time. Also, its in "software" in general. So I would need to spend additional time after graduation getting more certifications and building an app to get hired most likely.
Baker College, I haven't heard much about it. It's also pretty inexpensive. Looks like it could take a while.
I have also seen Mobile development certifications from Champlain College and University of Washington Online
I would love to hear of what tech professionals think about these degrees/programs. Also, if you have heard of any other options please let me know!
Sorry I'm not a tech pro but I did enroll into Full Sail Mobile App program. I am starting on the 30th of this month. I did 3 months of extensive research including some of the schools you mentioned, and from what I have found is that Full Sail offers the best Mobile Program you can find. The applications they teach you to use is future proof. What I mean by that for example is once you learn Adobe CSS 5.5, it will be easy to transition into CSS 6, or 6.5 when it does come out. The only down side I see to it is that you are going to pay for it. The program is expensive $57,000 total for a B.A.S. From what I see is its worth it, if your serious about pursuing this career field, Full Sail is the way to go if you can afford it. Its either this or learn old soon to be outdated tools at other schools only to end up trying to catch up even after you graduate.
breaking in to the mobile dev industry
I have a similar interest in getting started in the mobile app development industry. i agree with the initial poster that going to a brick and mortar school to learn will soon be outdated once you graduate. It's hard for them to keep up with the changing nature of the industry.
I have zero experience in programming and mobile app development. As I learn about the field, I have more questions.
I haven't looked into the different programs available, but I would imagine there are some free resources to learn some basics without having to go through a degree. What does a degree even mean? I feel that being able to create something tangible is more valuable than a piece of paper. I'm sure there is a benefit to the degree as it gives you the necessary background information. W3schools offers free online training in a plethora of disciplines...html, css xml...and so on. I just need to find out which ones I need to focus on, and how to put it all together.
60K for a degree is a lot. Hope you are able to find a job afterward to pay off the loan, or if you're lucky to recoup the investment of the tuition.
I am not here to start a flame war. I am here to express my honest opinion. I would be more than happy to engage in polite rhetoric, but I will ignore any post containing personal attacks and completely illogical jumps/wild conjecture.
I have been paying very close attention to the OPMOSH movement, and I must say, I am extremely disappointed with what I have seen. To those who have already stopped, I thank you for either realizing that this movement is not going to accomplish its stated goal, or for giving up and moving on to another manufacturer's device, which I truly hope you are enjoying.
For those still pursuing this course of action, I offer the following:
Motorola Mobility, in response to a very poorly written reply from one of their Facebook page operators, stated that they were working with carriers to provide a solution that allowed their devices to be open to developers, and still stisfied their overall security policies. This statement was not a promise to unlock anything, merely stating that they were working towards a solution.
In April of 2011, Motorola released a statement that it was their intention to offer unlockable/relockable bootloaders across their portfolio in late 2011 where carriers would allow it. Again, this statement is not a promise, but a clarification and expansion of their Facebook reply in January. They were aiming for deployment in late 2011, but they didn't explicitly state that there would definitely be an unlock tool at that time.
In October of 2011, Motorola stated that the Motorola Razr would have an unlockable bootloader if the carrier wanted it. This statement is indeed a promise, but there was no timeline given for its deployment. If they were still on course for late 2011, I'm absolutely certain they would have been more than happy to announce that as well. Since they did not say the tool would be available at launch, nor did they say when it would be available, the only logical conclusion is that it would be made available when it was ready and the proper agreements had been reached with each specific carrier, which I'd gather is more difficult than simply notifying the carrier of their intended action.
And so, we come to OPMOSH. The thread was started on the xda website on January 4th of 2012. The idea was that if enough people screamed loud enough, and long enough, and disrupted their operationss enough, Motorola Mobility would give in to the demands of the community and provide the unlock tool that was "promised" nearly a year prior.
Except there was no promise, there is no "right" to having an unlocked bootloader. There is a possible FCC violation, but at this point I'm absolutely sure they are aware of the situation, and we can let them go about their investigation. They won't tell us the progress on such investigation, but continually showering them with notifications will not speed the process.
Motorola's position is fairly well laid out in post #40 of the Razr Developer Edition discussion thread on their official forums. For those who don't want to Google it, essentially one of the forum managers states that they have had issues with working with the developer community in the past, and are not exactly jumping at the chance to open what they see as a Pandora's box of sorts. And, based on the actions taken by many supporting OPMOSH, I really can't blame them. The community has shown that they are willing to maliciously disrupt Motorola's normal business operations because they want something they are not entitled to in the first place. OPMOSH is the equivalent of a smear campaign, and if Motorola were to give in at this point and provide an unlock tool, it would only open them to further abuse from the community, or anyone else who wants a particular feature they think is "necessary" or their "right".
And before anyone throws the "it can't be *insert carrier*, they let the Nexus/HTC/Samsung phone be unlocked", I'm certain that each carrier has an agreement with each phone manufacturer that differs in key aspects. In the Verizon/Motorola agreement, there could very well be a clause that prevents Motorola from unlocking their devices. Obviously, encrypting the locked bootloader was Motorola's choice, but by doing so they can more effectively market their products to the lucrative enterprise and government accounts, who welcome such details to retain the integrity of their intranets. I know several IT departments that have issued Droid X2s, and more recently Razrs, to replace aging Blackberries for precisely this reason. True, some others are starting to use HTC and Samsung handsets, but there is no denying that Motorola produces the most secure and business oriented devices of any current major manufacturer.
And so, it is my firm opinion that based upon the above arguments, OPMOSH needs an immediate and total cease and desist. We are shooting ourselves in the foot at this point. They are removing/ignoring posts on their Facebook because that is their right. They are removing/ignoring tweets because that is their right. We do not have the right to abuse, slander, or otherwise disrupt any corporate entity, when they are well within their own rights to distribute their products within the confines of their legal obligations based upon binding carrier agreements which were most likely made long before having a locked bootloader became such a huge issue.
If you do not like the handset you have, sell or trade it for another one through Swappa, eBay, or Craigslist. If you like the handset you have, then be patient. I can guarantee that Motorola has heard what now amounts to little more than whining, and will move forward with their stated intent of unlocking their bootloaders where they can, and possibly (hopefully) working to renegotiate their carrier agreements to allow unlocked bootloaders. Thinking that all it takes for Motorola to unlock their bootloaders is to flip a switch and there will be no repercussions to that decision is to not only overlook important facts, but in the end is simply wishful thinking. If it really was that simple, then all HTC phones would have been unlockable as soon as their site went live.
Regardless, by pitching the internet equivalent of a child's fit, constantly bombarding Motorola's social media outlets, and wasting the time of several Motorola employees in the process, we are only reaffirming Motorola's view of our lack of trustworthiness as a community.
I, for one, love my Motorola device. I will continue to hack it to my liking and to the best of my ability. I will share anything I think is cool or interesting with the community because I want to do so, not because I am or feel obligated to. I will make the choice to believe that I am not limited by the manufacturer of my device, but only by my imagination and ingenuity. I will continue to support the countless devs who use their precious personal time to enhance my user experience far beyond what I thought possible.
Finally, I will continue to believe that Motorola still intends to follow through on their statements, and are working toward a solution that will allow us to have the freedom to do as we please with our phones, while providing a strong and secure experience to the customers who require such things.
I appreciate anyone who has made it this far, and apologize for the wall of text. I hope that my plea does not go unnoticed, and can bring at least some sanity to our community.
TL;DR : Motorola never promised us anything. We do not have any right to an unlocked bootloader, any more than we have a right to use exploits in the Android code to gain root access. OPMOSH is a smear campaign that is likely to only serve to deepen Motorola's distrust in the Android development community. Only by stopping OPMOSH, and showing faith in Motorola as a company, will they ever see fit to give us what we ask for, and start to close the massive rift that has come between us.
As an aside, I am in no way affiliated with Motorola or any of its partners. I'm just a guy who is severely disappointed at the lack of reason and basic decency shown by the Motorola development community with regards to this situation. I have no illusion that my opinion means anymore than anyone else's, but I felt that I must at least try to forestall what I see as the only possible outcome should this operation continue, which is that Motorola will issue a statement that despite their best efforts they did not find a solution which is feasible at this time beyond offering special "developer edition" phones.
Kindly post a link to this "post #40" of which you speak of...
I have tried looking for it on their Support Forums, and their Developer Forums but I could not seem to find it.
This is an interesting post, and - if nothing else - I appreciate the amount of thought you've put into it.
I can agree on some points, and do feel that social media smear campaigns and/or armchair activism will accomplish little beyond hot air, as Motorola have not shown any indication that they're willing to budge. Endless Facebook spam does little to aid anyone, since the poor social media team and other customer-facing representatives are, in all likelihood, on the side of the customers they have to deal with on a daily basis, and have little to no power to make the fundamental changes we seek.
I have no doubt that there are Motorola representatives both among us, and on 'our side', as it were. There have been leaks galore, including one that resulted in the Atrix's bootloader being unlocked, a massive boon for its community. The GSM RAZR has already seen an early ICS leak, which was very welcome. Whispers and rumours have it that Moto has had some falling out with the developer community at some point. If anyone knows more about this, I'm very interested.
What you're missing, here, is a combination of expectation and impression. To make it personal, this is the first Motorola device I have personally owned, as there simply haven't been any flagship Moto devices that came in GSM flavours as well as CDMA (Aside from the too-little-too-late nobody-really-cares Milestone range, and the Atrix, which was a great idea that ended up outdated by launch). The RAZR's wonderful industrial design spoke to me, as did its SAMOLED screen, as Samsung have spoiled me and I can't stand LCDs any more. So I took the plunge, shifting from the very popular and very well supported Galaxy S II. No offense to Moto, their hardware is lovely, but their software is awful, the battery life is awful (A bigger battery is a very blunt force solution, re: RAZR MAXX), and it disappoints me greatly that I can’t change that when I could with my past three Android phones, and even my last Windows Mobile phone. I don't fully regret making the shift, but in retrospect, I wish I'd bought a Galaxy Note or Galaxy Nexus instead.
There are reasons for locking bootloaders that, disagree as I may, make a degree of sense. There's 'security', there's DRM content, there's enterprise IT requirements, and there's (supposedly) carrier requirements. But at this point, there's really not much reason to keep it locked, as the only thing it does is prevent running unsigned kernels. ROMs can be flashed, security can be breached, bloatware can be removed, and all that reasoning is essentially null and void. There is no advantage to a locked bootloader when a device is already rooted, it really doesn't provide any added security - indeed, the ability to flash one's own custom kernel compiled from source is the domain of the security conscious, not the casual user who might haphazardly harm their device - which, again, is certainly possible without the bootloader being unlocked.
There is really no good, specific argument in favour of locking the bootloader, especially when other OEMs – see: HTC, Sony Ericsson – are happy to provide tools that allow this, and Motorola did lead consumers to believe that the RAZR would be unlocked in much the same manner. A quick Googling leads me to this post here, which I believe to be the origin: http://ausdroid.net/2011/10/21/motorola-razr-to-be-unlockable/
Here, one Christy Wyatt is quoted as saying that the GSM variant of the RAZR would have an unlockable/relockable bootloader, and that Verizon had disabled this feature. The interesting thing about “where carriers allow” is that a large number of GSM RAZRs are sold SIM-free, and contain no carrier branding. There is no carrier to disallow the unlocking of the bootloader. Where is the excuse here?
I think it’s safe to say that the majority of RAZR owners pushing for the bootloader unlock would be happy to give up any features Moto – or carriers – feel the bootloader needs to be locked to enable. Webtop? DRM? Citrix? Enterprise security? Honestly, it seems like Moto is trying to market their devices to a specific niche, the BYO corporate market, and it feels to me that there’s too many compromises for what amounts to a relatively small segment (Or one that’s happy with iOS/Blackberry/et cetera anyway). Take a record of my IMEI. Disable as many stock features as you like. I would even give up Activesync support if I could have that unlocked bootloader.
These phones are hardware platforms, computing platforms. Back when the original Milestone was released – the delayed GSM counterpart to the original Droid – its bootloader was locked where the Droid’s was not. Motorola representatives went as far as to suggest that development enthusiasts purchase the then-current Nexus One instead of a Milestone. Bad form to actively turn their customers towards the competition. Android development has bloomed in the last few years, and it’s now expected that one should be able to modify one’s mobile device, just as has been the case with desktop hardware for decades. When one buys a phone, one owns that hardware. Even if they only have a ‘license’ to Motorola’s (Flawed) flavour of the software, they currently have no choice but to use it, and it’s an expectation of the open-source Android operating systems that its hardware platforms should be open for development.
There’s two more factors, here. One is damage control. Regardless of how this came about, consumers DID get the impression that – at the very least – the open market GSM RAZR would have an unlockable bootloader. It does not. Moto have only issued vague statements, some of which specifically mentioned software solutions (rather than “Buy another phone”) but have done very little to clarify the situation, or to placate their increasingly upset userbase.
Motorola might not ‘owe’ us an unlocked bootloader, per se, but they do owe their audience some clarity and some answers. It was also suggested in the above article that the bootloader solution may be rolled out with the Ice-Cream Sandwich updates, but this too has been a point of contention. Many are very disappointed with the Q2 timeframe when, again, the expectation was that the RAZR would be swiftly updated and not leave fans disappointed that they opted for a device shipping with an old OS revision when the new one was announced the same day as the RAZR itself. Moto have not been clear – and yes, I know there’s the old business mantra of underpromise and overdeliver, but it’s been going from bad to worse. Which brings me to the final factor…
The ‘Developer Edition’ is no solution at all. It is hardly fair to anyone, least of all existing customers who purchased the original RAZR in good faith, to announce a hardware revision to circumvent a firmware restriction. No warranty, full retail price for the same hardware, and just to make it laughable, the development device can’t even be unlocked at present.
TL;DR?
Yes, childish spam and/or smear campaigns on social media channels are childish. But there is no good reason for the bootloader to remain locked, and many customers purchased the device under the impression that an unlock method would be provided. Motorola’s communication has been poor at best, and people are understandably upset.
"I can guarantee that Motorola has heard what now amounts to little more than whining"
Please explain.
How long have you worked for Motorola?
And a short answer to your question:
NO!
In my opinion the problem is not only the locked bootloader. The bootloader is only a trigger that forced people to go over the edge. The problem is the arrogant and ignorant stance the motorola has been taking toward the common user of their devices. I know we live in an ultra capitalist world where "big players" can get away with anything, but in my opinion that alone should not be the reason for all of us to just give in and take it up our butts. Maybe these kinds of rebellions don't bring much success right away, but it sure as hell reminds these people that what they are doing will make some noise, and maybe will at least force them to think twice next time.
If we talk about this specific case: I understand that to some 400+ euro is not a lot of money, but to some it is almost their entire monthly paycheck and if i am willing to spend so much money on a product, the producer can expect from me wanting to get some "love" in return. Of course it is not their legal obligation, but just common logic that not all of us will be quiet and let them get away with anything and that is very important....what i was saying earlier. I'm sure in todays world when people are being eaten alive by the current political and social system, a little "love" (even if its fake), can take a company a long way and can in a long run be a market advantage and bring more money to that company. And money is the only thing they really care about. Well maybe 10.000-15.000 signatures are very little, but 5+ million users of xda now have heard or know for a fact (many known before OPMOSH) that motorola is the most unfriendly user company in the market. These people being a bit of tech-geeks have friends that come to them for advice when buying new phones,.... and very soon you come to a number ob 20+ million people having an argument against buying your product. And that is a very bad thing in todays highly competitive market where differences between products are very small.
So what i want to say is, that no matter what the way, it is always important that not all people are quiet, because even if it doesn't look like it straight away, it does makes a difference....maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow but surely the day after that
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1511364
It does in fact elicit a response, so it is working
Im happy I also own a Xperia. I got my Razr because I belived the an article about the loader. Wont do that again.
http://blogs.sonymobile.com/wp/2012...e-for-unlocked-2011-xperia-smartphone-models/
Sent from my XT910 using Tapatalk
Well put by the OP and too have an honest opinion. I have followed the threads and it started strong but just like the whole "Occupy Wall Street/whatever city they wanna occupy" movement, it lost the true message and became a bunch of adults acting like spoiled 3 year olds when an adult tells them no. I could care less about an unlocked bootloader, I care more about rooting my Android phone and being able to use a stable custom ROM. I understand however taking a stand for a product we own. If y'all desperately want an unlocked bootloader got get the GNex
Sent from my rooted and Safe Strapped Motor DROID RAZR
kimo91 said:
I could care less about an unlocked bootloader, I care more about rooting my Android phone and being able to use a stable custom ROM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry, this is a ridiculous opinion to hold. I can understand frustration at people's behaviour, and I can understand playing devil's advocate, but custom ROMs are practically little more than themes without custom kernels. The locked bootloader is the reason we don't have a wide selection of stable custom ROMs for you to flash.
Enjoy your 'themes and tweaks'.
Sent from my XT910 using xda premium
onslaught86 said:
I'm sorry, this is a ridiculous opinion to hold. I can understand frustration at people's behaviour, and I can understand playing devil's advocate, but custom ROMs are practically little more than themes without custom kernels. The locked bootloader is the reason we don't have a wide selection of stable custom ROMs for you to flash.
Enjoy your 'themes and tweaks'.
Sent from my XT910 using xda premium
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Rediculous opinion? Last I checked I wasn't one if the many that claimed to be duped into buying a phone because Motorola said they would unlock the bootloader. I bought my Razr to suit my everyday needs, accessibility to root, and what not. Who cares if the current roms out now are mainly themed and has tweeked kernels, cause I simply don't. If my simple ways of using my phone or even customizing it the way i like it then im one of the few that perfers my phone the way it is currently. You sound like one of the many sheep out there that bought the Razr for Motorola to unlock the bootloader. Baaaaaa
Sent from my rooted and Safe Strapped Motor DROID RAZR
kimo91 said:
Rediculous opinion? Last I checked I wasn't one if the many that claimed to be duped into buying a phone because Motorola said they would unlock the bootloader. I bought my Razr to suit my everyday needs, accessibility to root, and what not. Who cares if the current roms out now are mainly themed and has tweeked kernels, cause I simply don't. If my simple ways of using my phone or even customizing it the way i like it then im one of the few that perfers my phone the way it is currently. You sound like one of the many sheep out there that bought the Razr for Motorola to unlock the bootloader. Baaaaaa
Sent from my rooted and Safe Strapped Motor DROID RAZR
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You like custom ROMs and claim not to care about unlocked bootloaders. Do you genuinely not see the fundamental contradiction in that, or are you just arguing the point because it's cool to be non-conformist these days?
Unlocking the bootloader affects you and your usage of the phone all of not - that's great, good for you. But it does affect plenty of other people, and your being a little tired of seeing them complain on social media channels does not invalidate their claim.
Sent from my XT910 using xda premium
Do not attack or offend other users regardless of your PERSONAL opinions. Keep this thread clean from abusive, flaming or attacks.
I don't know if anyone has seen the new post made on portal but I intend to send this to all the Apple Exec's and relevant people I can find.
We should all send this to the same people to let them know what we think.
Dear Apple,
Your ENTIRE organization lacks morals and free market competition basics, and as such, you are not worthy of having the glory that you now posses. While you may have revolutionized the world as we know it with very well crafted marketing campaigns and some good ideas, you are far from being a true innovator in the field of… anything. Just think for one second about the LEAPS in technology that you would have accomplished, should you have invested in R&D a quarter of the money you spend into advertising and marketing. Then, you would have something worth portraying as a technological wonder, something that would likely be untouchable by others. Something truly genuine that you can call your own, and at the end of the day you could look at with pride. What you have right now is a bunch of reinvented wheels, most of which don’t do much more than other wheels out there.
Redefining concepts and ideas is not what makes a company great; coming up with new concepts is. HTC and other major OEMS have often been in the vanguard by innovating with their products, adding new features, rethinking, and just putting concepts out there to imagine their possibilities. Your last innovations and only major contributions to the world of mobile technology were the inclusion of capacitive multi-touch gestures and an accelerometer in mobile devices, and these were with the original iPhone back in 2007. For that and only that, I give you credit. All the newer models of virtually every product you sell have been remakes of previous technology—perhaps a little thinner and a little faster, but all in all, minor changes.
It is because of companies like yours that technology is not further today than where it currently is. You are so adamant in protecting something that you didn’t even invent that you are holding back future innovation. The spirit and basic concepts of engineering are completely missing from your business models. Courtesy of the Accreditation Board for Engineering and Technology:
Engineering is the profession in which a knowledge of the mathematical and natural sciences gained by experience, study, and practice is applied with judgement to develop ways to utilize economically, the materials and forces of nature for the benefit of mankind.
Notice the importance of the concept that you are no longer following. Engineering practices are used for the betterment of mankind. What have you done for this purpose? Rebrand an existing technology (MP3 players) and sell them for twice the price? Trying to cripple your competitors by claiming that you invented something that was previously invented, when you simply adapted the technology and closed off any other use of this by others? This can be compared to using a Linux kernel (if it weren’t under GPL license), patenting it, and closing it off so that no one else can use it.
Apple, you are simply a disgrace to the world of technology and to engineering in general. I feel ashamed of being called an engineer in a world where your company roams around freely without even following the most basic of the field’s concepts—a world where the law and justice are blind to the fact that your actions are hindering humanity’s advancement. While I understand that there is nothing wrong with making money, there is something very wrong with replacing engineering with greed.
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Does anyone know some definite e-mail addresses to Apple execs and relevant people?
E-mail Addresses found so far:
Tim Cook [email protected]
How about sending it to one infinite loop,Cupertino CA
At least spam filters won't get it...
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
I went to their site earlier today and when on chat to let them know my anger. Click thru their Google ad first
Nice! Even though i dont have any email addresses, i think this should be posted to any and every response to or from a crapple fan or employee.
Sent from my Transformer
sent
This is silly.
I mean, heck. If I were company A who invented idea X and company B came along with idea X, I would not be so different from Apple.
And, Apple employees are not the ones hording our EVOs. Its the government.
What we need is a "Free EVO" campaign
typhoonikan said:
And, Apple employees are not the ones hording our EVOs. Its the government.
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Ah, didn't realize the Customs office is holding HTC products for ****s and giggles.
Doesn't matter. Voices need to be heard.
I sent one too!
Steve Jobs would sometimes personally answer emails, but I doubt Tim Cook would. Honestly at this point it's out of Apple's hands as it's US Customs who are enforcing it and controlling the process of holding the phones so a mass email to them would be more effective.
typhoonikan said:
This is silly.
I mean, heck. If I were company A who invented idea X and company B came along with idea X, I would not be so different from Apple.
And, Apple employees are not the ones hording our EVOs. Its the government.
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Therein lies the biggest issue, Apple didn't invent a lot of the stuff they have patents for. They are just the first ones to try and patent something so ridiculous.
coolblue830 said:
Steve Jobs would sometimes personally answer emails, but I doubt Tim Cook would. Honestly at this point it's out of Apple's hands as it's US Customs who are enforcing it and controlling the process of holding the phones so a mass email to them would be more effective.
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Tell my why the HTC One on T-Moblie is being held? You know, the network without the iphoney...
Pure thuggery by apple
Sent from my Sprint Galaxy Nexus CDMA using Tapatalk 2
shook187 said:
What we need is a "Free EVO" campaign
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As in "free" beer, or "free" willy?
Sent.
All sprint and other cellular phone salesman should advise customers against buying the iPhone. Recommend a Nexus or EVO LTE instead.
Peace All,
Where is ANONYMOUS when we need them? They would be the best at doing this--hey they might even be able to shut down some of Apple's infrastructure
phatmanxxl said:
All sprint and other cellular phone salesman should advise customers against buying the iPhone. Recommend a Nexus or EVO LTE instead.
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I sell phones and already do this! B-)
Apple doesn't care what non-customers think of them.
Apple's action is anti-consumer, it's time to awaken the government's consumer protection arms to take action against Apple. Write to your Attorney Generals, write to the Federal Trade Commission. Make Apple listen.
Compensation for Galaxy Note 7 Owners. Sign the petition if you guys can.
Change.org Link:
https://www.change.org/p/samsung-compensation-for-galaxy-note-7-owners
After reading that laundry list of those dema---errr requests I feel pretty confident that it ain't gonna happen but I suppose we'll see what happens.
br0adband said:
After reading that laundry list of those dema---errr requests I feel pretty confident that it ain't gonna happen but I suppose we'll see what happens.
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Chances are slim, but hey never hurt to try right? You never know!
I'm the person who started that petition.
Being an ex-N7 owner and now S7 Edge owner, I was on several forums and the most common demand was the ability to upgrade to the next Note without a penalty or a free Note altogether. So the $1000 is an estimate on what it would cost for a free Note, case, and screen protector. Do I honestly think Samsung will do it? No. However that doesn't mean we can't ask. In fact we should request something COLLECTIVELY so they understand it's not just a few sporadic groups complaining.
Basically if you don't ask, you will most likely get nothing. If you look at the petition, I've added updates showing how Samsung is considering an upgrade option for those affected by the recall. Is this because of the petition? I have no clue, but they know it's there and they know the number of signers is growing..... because it's also posted on their forum.
Even if you don't agree on the petition verbatim, please SIGN & SHARE. The more support we have, the more it will encourage them to step up and make the options better for us.
jealbr75 said:
I'm the person who started that petition.
Being an ex-N7 owner and now S7 Edge owner, I was on several forums and the most common demand was the ability to upgrade to the next Note without a penalty or a free Note altogether. So the $1000 is an estimate on what it would cost for a free Note, case, and screen protector. Do I honestly think Samsung will do it? No. However that doesn't mean we can't ask. In fact we should request something COLLECTIVELY so they understand it's not just a few sporadic groups complaining.
Basically if you don't ask, you will most likely get nothing. If you look at the petition, I've added updates showing how Samsung is considering an upgrade option for those affected by the recall. Is this because of the petition? I have no clue, but they know it's there and they know the number of signers is growing..... because it's also posted on their forum.
Even if you don't agree on the petition verbatim, please SIGN & SHARE. The more support we have, the more it will encourage them to step up and make the options better for us.
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Hmmm, hitting the 1,000 mark real soon.
Oh absolutely, let Sammy hear what's up. Shoot, spent $1k and exchanging a lower end device? The loyal customers def. deserves something better IMO.
Hmm, maybe a class action lawsuit?
Samsung is doing what they can to handle the situation, with refunds and exchanges and even some credit towards future purchases (in amounts they feel are adequate) but if a bunch of people continue to press them for more and more and more it's just going to hurt them more and more and more as they're trying to resolve things.
They probably look upon such requests or petitions and attach some level of understanding towards the consumers who are affected by this whole fiasco since it started and they will do their best to settle things.
Jumping on a bandwagon heading into a situation that is already on fire (pun intended) isn't actually helping, but that's my personal view on the situation. Samsung simply cannot be expected to be "OK" with the loss of all the money from all the defective devices that were manufactured and should be returned + all the money they're losing from the lost sales of millions more units that will never be made (but were projected sales) + all the money they're going to have to spend to keep the recall in place till all the units they can get returned do actually make it back to them + all the money it's going to cost them to destroy all the units that get returned + all the money for all the devices they're using as exchange units that now won't actually be sold + legal fees + the cost of the booths in the airports they're putting up + more and more and more... not to mention the hit to their reputation which can't be expressed as a monetary cost + the hit to their stock price as that reputation sours more and more each day no matter what they try to do to gain some level of control over this entire situation.
And then some people think because they owned a Note 7 that they feel like they should get a big discount on the next flagship device from Samsung in 2017 or that perhaps on some level they feel they should get it completely free too.
This is a lose-lose-lose-holy-crap-we've-lost-so-huge situation for Samsung and it's not going to end anytime soon, unfortunately.
After all this, I'm not saying customers don't deserve to be compensated for time and effort and the hassles of dealing with this, I'm saying that sometimes people - especially large groups of people - just go a bit too far in their demands and requests, this could eventually be one of those situations.
br0adband said:
Jumping on a bandwagon heading into a situation that is already on fire (pun intended) isn't actually helping, but that's my personal view on the situation.
[snip] not to mention the hit to their reputation which can't be expressed as a monetary cost + the hit to their stock price as that reputation sours more and more each day no matter what they try to do to gain some level of control over this entire situation.
[snip]
.
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Problem is, they've had my money for a couple of months and supplied me with (according to them) two dangerous devices, then completely stop responding to phone calls, emails, tweets.
They've scheduled someone to come to my house to collect it at a date and time when I'm not here, but attempts to get through to them also fail.
They haven't responded to questions about the refund process in general, nor about how we can get refunds for 3rd party accessories where the retailer won't accept the return. Amazon were great (though charged me P&P), but I have other bits (Brodit car adapter, for example).
I've just initiated a credit card chargeback so that I at least get a refund.
Unfortunately for Samsung, those who are reasonably high net worth can afford to pick and choose brands, and the replacement TVs, washing machine, fridge etc all won't be Samsung since they've proven they can't provide even a basic level of customer service.
Another set of brands that set themselves apart, http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35301019 - those I won't buy from either since, again, and regardless of 'fault', they've proven they can't provide the level of service that customers need.
You're absolutely correct in how things are being handled overall and I'm 100% certain that the recall (both of them) and the refunds/exchanges/etc - especially in situations where people did surrender a previously owned device so they could essentially be without one entirely if they return the Note 7 they currently own) - could be dealt with better. I've been reading reports in the past 24 hours of some basically scummy ways that customer concerns are being addressed with respect to returning the devices worldwide and it's pretty disheartening when the end user is just trying to do the right thing themselves and they encounter a brick wall of sorts even so.
I hope it all works out for everyone and it doesn't kill Samsung to such a degree that they never ever produce another device like the Note but I'm leaning to the direction that they probably feel the Note brand is now so forever tarnished they may just drop it entirely, even as a branding label on the tablet line too.
Was just saying in another thread that it's somewhat odd that no other company over the past 5 years or so since the original Galaxy Note has appeared ever produced a device that could match it or even come close because of the Wacom hardware Samsung was smart to choose.
If there was ever a time for any company to pounce on this market - and it's a huge one considering how popular the Note series has been so far - this is it.