Anyone else see this:
https://9to5google.com/2016/09/19/zte-is-working-to-bring-an-official-cyanogenmod-rom-to-the-axon-7/
Yes, it's been discussed in the CM dev topic.
xtermmin said:
Yes, it's been discussed in the CM dev topic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What most are not realizing, is that there are two versions of Cyanogen built operating systems. Cyanogen OS is built by Cyanogen Inc. for the device manufacturer and the other is community driven and is open source. These two operating systems may be identical in how they operate once on the device, but how they are developed is different. The question is which one is actually being developed?
jim262 said:
What most are not realizing, is that there are two versions of Cyanogen built operating systems. Cyanogen OS is built by Cyanogen Inc. for the device manufacturer and the other is community driven and is open source. These two operating systems may be identical in how they operate once on the device, but how they are developed is different. The question is which one is actually being developed?
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Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/axon-7/development/cyanogenmod-13-a2017u-t3457410/page10
If it is a true CyanogenMod rom, that means ZTE would have to release proprietary source codes for open source development. They have not done that as of this writing. So more than likely a Cyanogen operating system will be created for this device totally in house, thereby not allowing for future development by the "open source" community of devs.
jim262 said:
If it is a true CyanogenMod rom, that means ZTE would have to release proprietary source codes for open source development. They have not done that as of this writing. So more than likely a Cyanogen operating system will be created for this device totally in house, thereby not allowing for future development by the "open source" community of devs.
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Click to collapse
From what I'm gathering from the discussions on the ZTE Community forums and the Cyanogenmod dev topic I linked, it seems that ZTE is sending their code to Cyanogen employee Steve Kondik to create an official cyanogenmod github for the A7, not that Cyanogen the company is going to create a CyanogenOS for the device.
Only for USA.
rikin93 said:
Only for USA.
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Correction: Only for unlocked bootloaders, as it will not be officially signed by ZTE.
xtermmin said:
From what I'm gathering from the discussions on the ZTE Community forums and the Cyanogenmod dev topic I linked, it seems that ZTE is sending their code to Cyanogen employee Steve Kondik to create an official cyanogenmod github for the A7, not that Cyanogen the company is going to create a CyanogenOS for the device.
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Click to collapse
Based on what I have seen and heard, the difference between OS and Mod is nill. They are exactly the same. The difference between the two is how they are developed. One is open source and can be shared by the general public, the other is developed in house for the device manufacturer and proprietary information is kept in house and not shared. The two are quite often just referred to as CyanogenMod, although they are different.
jim262 said:
Based on what I have seen and heard, the difference between OS and Mod is nill. They are exactly the same. The difference between the two is how they are developed. One is open source and can be shared by the general public, the other is developed in house for the device manufacturer and proprietary information is kept in house and not shared. The two are quite often just referred to as CyanogenMod, although they are different.
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Click to collapse
There's a huge difference between CyanogenOS and CyanogenMod behind the scenes though. Like you said, CyanogenOS is in-house, but most importantly it tends to include bloatware, especially now that Cyanogen the company is owned by Microsoft. And since it's closed source, people who want to develop custom ROMs will still have no access to the sources that would speed up development. Plus, if there are bugs or features that people want to implement, they can't, and have to wait for Cyanogen to release them. This also means that things such as security patches will have to wait for official rollout by Cyanogen.
Cyanogenmod, however, is open source, not controlled by Cyanogen the company at all, bug fixes / features can be added and addressed by the community, security patches can be applied to nightlies quickly, etc.
jim262 said:
If it is a true CyanogenMod rom, that means ZTE would have to release proprietary source codes for open source development. They have not done that as of this writing. So more than likely a Cyanogen operating system will be created for this device totally in house, thereby not allowing for future development by the "open source" community of devs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's been clarified multiple times on the ZTE forum that it will be CyanogenMod, not CyanogenOS. Unless there's some weird, first-time-in-history NDA regarding the HALs / overlay that ZTE provides for the development of CM, they will be open source.
If they did offer open source at least it would alleviate concerns on the Chinese state-sponsored company reputation
Finally, the best hardware of 2016 and all it needs is aosp love... I hope this helps to spur more development or makes it easier for our fantastic developers at XDA.
From what I read from the Employees at ZTE Forums, ZTE currently doesn't want to deal with setting up a place for Devs to access the needed resources for things, so they're basically going to just dump it all on CyanogenMod for them to sort it out. It's easier for the ZTE higher-ups to swallow that way.
Do we have any ETA on this ?
I fear than the OP3 will get more love from the dev, and that the Axon 7 will be forgotten :/
rczrider said:
It's been clarified multiple times on the ZTE forum that it will be CyanogenMod, not CyanogenOS. Unless there's some weird, first-time-in-history NDA regarding the HALs / overlay that ZTE provides for the development of CM, they will be open source.
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Click to collapse
Don't count on anything "open" from ZTE. It really doesn't matter what they may say, the reality this phone doesn't have much more than the day it was released.
Araewuir said:
Do we have any ETA on this ?
I fear than the OP3 will get more love from the dev, and that the Axon 7 will be forgotten :/
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Click to collapse
The oneplus one still gets more dev support than the Nexus 6p. Oneplus devices get pretty much the best dev support period. That being said, more devs are starting to get the axon 7, but we're never going to be at the oneplus 3 level of support. The oneplus 3 is supported by SultanXDA, flar2, Franco, despair, and dozens more. It had official cm13 support as soon as it was released. It has official support from paranoid Android, elemental x, Franco kernel, PAC rom, dirty unicorns, and pretty much every other rom and kernel you've ever heard of. I love the Axon, but I don't it's ever going to get that kind of support.
jim262 said:
Don't count on anything "open" from ZTE. It really doesn't matter what they may say, the reality this phone doesn't have much more than the day it was released.
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Click to collapse
Okay.
xxBrun0xx said:
The oneplus one still gets more dev support than the Nexus 6p. Oneplus devices get pretty much the best dev support period. That being said, more devs are starting to get the axon 7, but we're never going to be at the oneplus 3 level of support. The oneplus 3 is supported by SultanXDA, flar2, Franco, despair, and dozens more. It had official cm13 support as soon as it was released. It has official support from paranoid Android, elemental x, Franco kernel, PAC rom, dirty unicorns, and pretty much every other rom and kernel you've ever heard of. I love the Axon, but I don't it's ever going to get that kind of support.
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I feel like the last phone I owned with that level of support was the Nexus 4.
rczrider said:
Okay.
I feel like the last phone I owned with that level of support was the Nexus 4.
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Click to collapse
One Plus released everything before the phone even hit the market, so there was development for the One Plus 3 from the beginning. The Axon, in my opinion, is a very good device, but ZTE has limited development of this product. It is almost as though they are perfectly happy being an iPhone/Apple wannabe.
japzone said:
From what I read from the Employees at ZTE Forums, ZTE currently doesn't want to deal with setting up a place for Devs to access the needed resources for things, so they're basically going to just dump it all on CyanogenMod for them to sort it out. It's easier for the ZTE higher-ups to swallow that way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which is never a good thing. Especially when they admit they don't care.
As a Sprint subscriber I'm locked out of the Axon7 until Sprint stop being dickbags about BYOD, which most likely will be never. If that changes, I'll probably buy an A7 if CM actually appears in a timely fashion since Shamu is being dropped by Google very shortly.
...but dumping code on the community and expecting them to make it right is massively annoying at best. It is exactly what Google does with AOSP....The Nougat AOSP is seriously broken and takes a ton of effort to fix enough just to get to compile. The stock AOSP GApps packages are all in varying stages of brokenness as of now. Sure they release the source, but what you get doesn't compile without a ton of forensic work.
Nougat has been on Nexus for over a month (minus Shamu)...and it is not going well.
Related
or does anyone else feel like we dont have enough aosp love? I mean we have miui, cm7, had decks(went ghostbusters on us) and empiire(heard he got grounded for molesting his hard drive.) I understand theirs still kinks to be worked out but everything is Sense. Just wanted to see who else felt this way. PLEASE DONT COME IN AND START A PARAGRAPH WAR, I read enough in high school.
Temari x Shikamaru
Evervolv exists.
il Duce said:
Evervolv exists.
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Link please. Ive been hunting it.
Temari x Shikamaru
Talked to shift on twitter yesterday, he said CM7 is being worked on. I honestly think what it is that people are happy with their phones just the way they are, so it brings less crowd. While it is smaller than the original Evo, there is still a pretty big following. Plus, this is just a US phone, so when comparing the Sensation with us is like apple and oranges. We just got mike and androidrevolution! Which is great.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
PatrickHuey said:
Talked to shift on twitter yesterday, he said CM7 is being worked on. I honestly think what it is that people are happy with their phones just the way they are, so it brings less crowd. While it is smaller than the original Evo, there is still a pretty big following. Plus, this is just a US phone, so when comparing the Sensation with us is like apple and oranges. We just got mike and androidrevolution! Which is great.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its not just US. Theres gsm models for overseas.
Temari x Shikamaru
The problem is, most AOSP ROM's(99.99%) are based off CM kernel source, so with no update to CM, there's no update to other AOSP ROM's. Many devs might want to wait until a few more bugs are worked out of CM before they start kanging. Once we get an RC1 or a stable CM release, you may see more AOSP love.
Can the gsm users get some aosp love? Any roms?
Sent from my Evo 3D GSM...bring on the AOSP!!!
housry23 said:
The problem is, most AOSP ROM's(99.99%) are based off CM kernel source, so with no update to CM, there's no update to other AOSP ROM's. Many devs might want to wait until a few more bugs are worked out of CM before they start kanging. Once we get an RC1 or a stable CM release, you may see more AOSP love.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This man is right. Most AOSP is done by Cyanogenmod devs and kanged from there. I can guarantee you when they come out with a CM7 RC, there will magically be other AOSP roms.
housry23 said:
The problem is, most AOSP ROM's(99.99%) are based off CM kernel source, so with no update to CM, there's no update to other AOSP ROM's. Many devs might want to wait until a few more bugs are worked out of CM before they start kanging. Once we get an RC1 or a stable CM release, you may see more AOSP love.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your right. I forgot about that.
Temari x Shikamaru
housry23 said:
The problem is, most AOSP ROM's(99.99%) are based off CM kernel source, so with no update to CM, there's no update to other AOSP ROM's. Many devs might want to wait until a few more bugs are worked out of CM before they start kanging. Once we get an RC1 or a stable CM release, you may see more AOSP love.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have complained about this over and over, and will continue to complain in multiple threads until more people see the point I make and support that. Using someone else's kernel and/or ROM as a base for their "new" ROM isn't all bad all the time. It is analogous to game development on a PC using another developer's graphics/game engine (only with permission and proper credit of course!!). It saves time, and in some cases help that particular engine to advance, but it slows down new technological advancement in the industry as a whole.
Developers need to start honing their skills, start attempting to bring a ROM to the public that they built from the ground up, that includes a kernel build from the ground up too. Doing this eliminates such a large collection of ROMs that are all essentially the same, and because of the open source nature of Android it brings new technological advances to the public faster. It also raises the bar, the standard. The public will begin to expect more out of Android, and this in turn creates more motivation for a newer, better Android.
I think some developers have lost sight of the purpose and nature of open source information and products. Instead of hijacking someone's source code, and using it as a base for a new ROM with a new name, and small amount of new features, development should be done that conforms to the original intent and purpose of open source. Work together with a developer that has created a ROM [from the ground up] that is most similar to the product you want to create. Improve the ROM as a team, make bug fixes and enhancement to the existing ROM. That is what open source was meant to do. This will prevent a forum list of 32 half assed roms, and replace it with 10 really good yet unique roms.
If you can't find an existing ROM, a Dev team that has different ideas of what make a ROM good, or there is no ROM that exists that is similar enough to your vision of the product then, and only then should you develop something new.
I realize my views aren't going to match up with everyone else, but I am sure a happy medium could be found that produces a situation better than what we have now. Thanks for letting me rant, and for reading my thoughts!
Sad Panda said:
I have complained about this over and over, and will continue to complain in multiple threads until more people see the point I make and support that. Using someone else's kernel and/or ROM as a base for their "new" ROM isn't all bad all the time. It is analogous to game development on a PC using another developer's graphics/game engine (only with permission and proper credit of course!!). It saves time, and in some cases help that particular engine to advance, but it slows down new technological advancement in the industry as a whole.
Developers need to start honing their skills, start attempting to bring a ROM to the public that they built from the ground up, that includes a kernel build from the ground up too. Doing this eliminates such a large collection of ROMs that are all essentially the same, and because of the open source nature of Android it brings new technological advances to the public faster. It also raises the bar, the standard. The public will begin to expect more out of Android, and this in turn creates more motivation for a newer, better Android.
I think some developers have lost sight of the purpose and nature of open source information and products. Instead of hijacking someone's source code, and using it as a base for a new ROM with a new name, and small amount of new features, development should be done that conforms to the original intent and purpose of open source. Work together with a developer that has created a ROM [from the ground up] that is most similar to the product you want to create. Improve the ROM as a team, make bug fixes and enhancement to the existing ROM. That is what open source was meant to do. This will prevent a forum list of 32 half assed roms, and replace it with 10 really good yet unique roms.
If you can't find an existing ROM, a Dev team that has different ideas of what make a ROM good, or there is no ROM that exists that is similar enough to your vision of the product then, and only then should you develop something new.
I realize my views aren't going to match up with everyone else, but I am sure a happy medium could be found that produces a situation better than what we have now. Thanks for letting me rant, and for reading my thoughts!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Damn. Such a long read. It was good though.
Temari x Shikamaru
knowledge561 said:
Damn. Such a long read. It was good though.
Temari x Shikamaru
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry, I originally had hoped for a much shorter post. I always try to get the thoughts in my head out "on paper" in the shortest, most efficient and least complex manner. This is my vision of a more free, "open source" world though. I think the freedom of information could be applied to many facets of society that would create a better future for all of us, and still preserve the competition that drives a more peaceful, better, cheaper, faster world. Sorry again!
Sad Panda said:
I have complained about this over and over, and will continue to complain in multiple threads until more people see the point I make and support that. Using someone else's kernel and/or ROM as a base for their "new" ROM isn't all bad all the time. It is analogous to game development on a PC using another developer's graphics/game engine (only with permission and proper credit of course!!). It saves time, and in some cases help that particular engine to advance, but it slows down new technological advancement in the industry as a whole.
Developers need to start honing their skills, start attempting to bring a ROM to the public that they built from the ground up, that includes a kernel build from the ground up too. Doing this eliminates such a large collection of ROMs that are all essentially the same, and because of the open source nature of Android it brings new technological advances to the public faster. It also raises the bar, the standard. The public will begin to expect more out of Android, and this in turn creates more motivation for a newer, better Android.
I think some developers have lost sight of the purpose and nature of open source information and products. Instead of hijacking someone's source code, and using it as a base for a new ROM with a new name, and small amount of new features, development should be done that conforms to the original intent and purpose of open source. Work together with a developer that has created a ROM [from the ground up] that is most similar to the product you want to create. Improve the ROM as a team, make bug fixes and enhancement to the existing ROM. That is what open source was meant to do. This will prevent a forum list of 32 half assed roms, and replace it with 10 really good yet unique roms.
If you can't find an existing ROM, a Dev team that has different ideas of what make a ROM good, or there is no ROM that exists that is similar enough to your vision of the product then, and only then should you develop something new.
I realize my views aren't going to match up with everyone else, but I am sure a happy medium could be found that produces a situation better than what we have now. Thanks for letting me rant, and for reading my thoughts!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is that people don't always give credit where credit is due, which is one of the reasons some people don't like sharing stuff. I mean, let's say I made this awesome mod and let everybody use it. Then some kitchen dev comes along, kangs the **** out of it, doesn't mention me in his rom, and slaps a gigantic DONATE button at the bottom of his signature. It's frustrating.
Now I'm all about open source. I won't use a rom that doesn't post the source. That's the exact reason I won't use MIUI.
SolsticeZero said:
The problem is that people don't always give credit where credit is due, which is one of the reasons some people don't like sharing stuff. I mean, let's say I made this awesome mod and let everybody use it. Then some kitchen dev comes along, kangs the **** out of it, doesn't mention me in his rom, and slaps a gigantic DONATE button at the bottom of his signature. It's frustrating.
Now I'm all about open source. I won't use a rom that doesn't post the source. That's the exact reason I won't use MIUI.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I fully understand your frustration. I am a software engineer too so I know what you are going through. I have not yet begun developing for Android, but will. There is a little bit of a problem here that could easily be solved, and the community has a responsibility to protect the intellectual property rights that you and every other developer like you is entitled to. In fact it is a right that is protected by the integrity of the constitution of the united states, and many other countries and law enforcement around the world. This is a failure that not just developers, mods, and admins have, but a responsibility and failure that every user at xda shares no matter who they are.
First off; not to offend any MIUI developers that may be watching, but if you are developing for Android you need to be using a license that is open, and your source needs to be open too. This is especially true if you are using xda as a distribution medium, but sadly while xda has said they encourage, and want every development to be open source they are not forcing the matter. This is a failure I think. It also makes MIUI look suspicious too, as there isn't a way to verify if their source is uniquely theirs'. I personally believe xda should not allow software that is not open source to be distributed. If google didn't keep the open source principle when they acquired Android roms like MIUI would NOT exist! It is highly unethical to take the base ROM from google because it is open source, and then close the source. That is wrong wrong wrong! It is also illegal! You can not redistribute the Android OS even if you have made changes and then close the source and not maintain the software license google has on place.
Second; I believe as a user of xda it is your duty to maintain the integrity of the principles of xda, and Android. Don't support closed source works, voice your disgust so that xda sees the will of its users, that the over whelming majority wants things to remain open source. Tattle your ass off if someone has broke the copyright law and used someone's work without permission and credit.
It is important to keep both xda and Android running on the same principles it started with. Don't let this keep happening guys! This is very serious, a lot of developers are breaking the law doing what they are doing!
Sad Panda said:
I have complained about this over and over, and will continue to complain in multiple threads until more people see the point I make and support that. Using someone else's kernel and/or ROM as a base for their "new" ROM isn't all bad all the time. It is analogous to game development on a PC using another developer's graphics/game engine (only with permission and proper credit of course!!). It saves time, and in some cases help that particular engine to advance, but it slows down new technological advancement in the industry as a whole.
Developers need to start honing their skills, start attempting to bring a ROM to the public that they built from the ground up, that includes a kernel build from the ground up too. Doing this eliminates such a large collection of ROMs that are all essentially the same, and because of the open source nature of Android it brings new technological advances to the public faster. It also raises the bar, the standard. The public will begin to expect more out of Android, and this in turn creates more motivation for a newer, better Android.
I think some developers have lost sight of the purpose and nature of open source information and products. Instead of hijacking someone's source code, and using it as a base for a new ROM with a new name, and small amount of new features, development should be done that conforms to the original intent and purpose of open source. Work together with a developer that has created a ROM [from the ground up] that is most similar to the product you want to create. Improve the ROM as a team, make bug fixes and enhancement to the existing ROM. That is what open source was meant to do. This will prevent a forum list of 32 half assed roms, and replace it with 10 really good yet unique roms.
If you can't find an existing ROM, a Dev team that has different ideas of what make a ROM good, or there is no ROM that exists that is similar enough to your vision of the product then, and only then should you develop something new.
I realize my views aren't going to match up with everyone else, but I am sure a happy medium could be found that produces a situation better than what we have now. Thanks for letting me rant, and for reading my thoughts!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or learn to code yourself and create roms from the ground up. Most devs do what they do for themselves first, and allow us to ride on their coattails. Not a bad ride if your like me and have no coding skills. Otherwise, I doubt your plea is going to convince a dev to do anything more or less then they do now, unless it interest them personally.
I do agree with you though. I'm coming from Android on the Touch Pro 2 where a small group of devs are building EVERYTHING from scratch. From the modems to the light sensor. It's a huge job done out of love for the hardware, for fun, and a passion for coding.
knowledge561 said:
Link please. Ive been hunting it.
Temari x Shikamaru
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
he links only via twitter posts and in his IRC, send him a tweet. iirc still in beta, but he does some nice ROMs
Serren said:
Or learn to code yourself and create roms from the ground up. Most devs do what they do for themselves first, and allow us to ride on their coattails. Not a bad ride if your like me and have no coding skills. Otherwise, I doubt your plea is going to convince a dev to do anything more or less then they do now, unless it interest them personally.
I do agree with you though. I'm coming from Android on the Touch Pro 2 where a small group of devs are building EVERYTHING from scratch. From the modems to the light sensor. It's a huge job done out of love for the hardware, for fun, and a passion for coding.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your comment and support. I don't disagree with you. If you steal a loaf of bread to feed yourself, is it any less of a crime than to steal a loaf of bread to feed you and your family and friends? Or is it the same or worse?
I think either way it isn't ethical. People need to think less about themselves I think. I must reiterate and clarify so I am not misunderstood. I don't think it is inherently bad to be using a ROM as your base, but it is wrong to then close the source of a previously open piece of work and/or not maintain the original license, and give credit in every spot it should be given in. That would include its distribution, the license, the source code itself, and any where else that you put your own version, app info, and copyright notice. Am I wrong?
Sad Panda said:
I fully understand your frustration. I am a software engineer too so I know what you are going through. I have not yet begun developing for Android, but will. There is a little bit of a problem here that could easily be solved, and the community has a responsibility to protect the intellectual property rights that you and every other developer like you is entitled to. In fact it is a right that is protected by the integrity of the constitution of the united states, and many other countries and law enforcement around the world. This is a failure that not just developers, mods, and admins have, but a responsibility and failure that every user at xda shares no matter who they are.
First off; not to offend any MIUI developers that may be watching, but if you are developing for Android you need to be using a license that is open, and your source needs to be open too. This is especially true if you are using xda as a distribution medium, but sadly while xda has said they encourage, and want every development to be open source they are not forcing the matter. This is a failure I think. It also makes MIUI look suspicious too, as there isn't a way to verify if their source is uniquely theirs'. I personally believe xda should not allow software that is not open source to be distributed. If google didn't keep the open source principle when they acquired Android roms like MIUI would NOT exist! It is highly unethical to take the base ROM from google because it is open source, and then close the source. That is wrong wrong wrong! It is also illegal! You can not redistribute the Android OS even if you have made changes and then close the source and not maintain the software license google has on place.
Second; I believe as a user of xda it is your duty to maintain the integrity of the principles of xda, and Android. Don't support closed source works, voice your disgust so that xda sees the will of its users, that the over whelming majority wants things to remain open source. Tattle your ass off if someone has broke the copyright law and used someone's work without permission and credit.
It is important to keep both xda and Android running on the same principles it started with. Don't let this keep happening guys! This is very serious, a lot of developers are breaking the law doing what they are doing!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let me preface this by saying that I agree with you..
However android is meant to be open source, the license that they use (Apache) does not require it.. The reason they chose the Apache license was to give people the freedom to choose (their words). So technically people like miui don't have to post source for anything other than kernel (which is GPL).
This link has some good info on it.
http://source.android.com/source/licenses.html
But even CM doesn't have to provide source, which in recent history they haven't while starting builds.. We can't demand source, when the licensing doesn't demand, but that doesn't mean we still can't prove direct kang. The reason I have android over anything else is the freedom it gives and the open nature of it.
Edit: and you should always credit someone if you are using their work, and also have their permission. I was referring to general source from android itself, not from each other.
_______________________
No d3rp left behind - ranger61878
The problem is, nobody wants to start a ROM from the ground up, and the people that do are already involved into team projects (CM/MIUI). It takes a long time to create a ROM from the ground up that utilizes all of a phone's hardware properly. Look how long it took CM to get 4G onto the EVO 4G, and that was a team of highly skilled individuals practically reverse engineering code to do it.
Now imagine all of the copy and paste kitchen users here trying to accomplish that. It just won't happen lol.
That's why we have pretty much the same thing in different colors. It kind of sucks, but hey, HTC did the majority of the work, and if something already works good enough, the average person will be fine with and use that.
Yeah, it does slow down the evolution and innovation of Android as a whole, but you have to put some of the blame on OEMs for pushing out 45 different phones a year. Nobody is going to be encouraged to create something from the ground up for a phone that will be replaced and obsolete by the time they're finished.
The G1 is the prime example of a great phone that got tons of developer support, tons of new things, and tons of unique ROMs. But that was the beginning, and I doubt that's ever going to happen again.
HTC all but pushed this EVO 3D out, and forgot about it. They've released a good 19 phones since then at the rate they're going, most of us will have moved on to the next one in a few months. Sad but true.
That is why I have stuck with and will probably continue to use a Stock ROM, modified to my liking and stripped. There isn't much else you can hope for. 3D has failed to really take off like HTC and the rest of us wanted. There is no motivation for any of the teams out there to focus on reverse engineering their ROMs to use 3D. MIUI to this day hasn't bothered with WiMAX and with good reason. Sprint all about blatantly announced its slow death in favor of LTE. It would have been a waste of time for the MIUI team to implement it. Kudos to Team Win and CM for gracing us with it on the EVO 4G. But, hindsight has probably made people mad that all of their time and energy went into something that's getting canned.
Alot of good points freeza. These are paragraphs I like to read.
Temari x Shikamaru
I know this is yesterday's news but I felt compelled to post this and get other users input on this topic.
http://www.cyanogenmod.org/blog/releases-11-12-final
What I don't understand is Cyanogen's priorities when it comes to which devices get 11, 12 or 12.1. I completely understand about phasing out CM11/KitKat as that is now a rather "old" version of android. However what I don't understand is why a device as new/old as ours (Aug 2013 is not THAT old) is stuck on CM12 (and now a final Snapshot build as of 6/25)? I mean, the Galaxy S3 is even getting 12.1 builds. I'm wondering if its because that was a far more popular device than the G2 was?
Just wanted to put this out there and see what other people think and find out what they're running currently on their G2 variant. I own the US T-Mobile D801 variant and do NOT want to run stock (LG) Lollipop since my device tends to run extremely HOT on it. I know not everyone was complaining about their G2 overheating on stock LP but I notice a considerable difference running CM12.
So, how do you guys feel about this? Do you even care or what?
t3chn0s1s said:
I know this is yesterday's news but I felt compelled to post this and get other users input on this topic.
http://www.cyanogenmod.org/blog/releases-11-12-final
What I don't understand is Cyanogen's priorities when it comes to which devices get 11, 12 or 12.1. I completely understand about phasing out CM11/KitKat as that is now a rather "old" version of android. However what I don't understand is why a device as new/old as ours (Aug 2013 is not THAT old) is stuck on CM12 (and now a final Snapshot build as of 6/25)? I mean, the Galaxy S3 is even getting 12.1 builds. I'm wondering if its because that was a far more popular device than the G2 was?
Just wanted to put this out there and see what other people think and find out what they're running currently on their G2 variant. I own the US T-Mobile D801 variant and do NOT want to run stock (LG) Lollipop since my device tends to run extremely HOT on it. I know not everyone was complaining about their G2 overheating on stock LP but I notice a considerable difference running CM12.
So, how do you guys feel about this? Do you even care or what?
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We haven't had nightlies for a while now. What you see as nightlies aren't really worthwhile builds, they didn't have any device or kernel fixes for the g2.
A new 11 build is coming probably because half the android userbase relies on kitkat at the moment.
As for the s3, it's not getting CM12 nor 12.1, not the international version at the least. Archi is maintaining an unofficial version, but it still carries the bugs from 10.0/10.1.
Lastly, this is the commit that requires to be merged in order for the builds to even be considered started:
http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/93181/
Without it, nothing CAF related can be merged, and as such, no CM12.1 builds can be had for our device. I believe the reason it's not merged because not all of the variants have a lollipop release, if they ever will get one. Also the whole bootstack/amount of users who don't reed is astonishingly dangerous to handle, so rashed simply preferred to skip building for now.
Finally, it's not that popular of a device. It's a nexus without being a nexus with a locked bootloader, which is a pain in the ass and not too many maintainers have it left (they either went with G3 or skipped LG entirely, as did a whole bunch from the exynos team back in the day).
t3chn0s1s said:
I saw you responded to my post about CM12 nightlies not continuing for the G2. Wanted to ask you (since you didn't mention) what 5.1 (CAF source) ROM you're running? What would you suggest for a stable AOSP ROM that has device/kernel specific updates for our G2s?
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Why not reply to me in this thread then?
I'm running official euphoria builds. Any caf roms run fine. They are all based on the same LG-devs CAF device source + kernel source. Some roms have specific tweaks, but as far as functionality, they all work the same way (ie: if bluetooth deep sleep is broken, it's most likely broken in every rom).
Choristav said:
Why not reply to me in this thread then?
I'm running official euphoria builds. Any caf roms run fine. They are all based on the same LG-devs CAF device source + kernel source. Some roms have specific tweaks, but as far as functionality, they all work the same way (ie: if bluetooth deep sleep is broken, it's most likely broken in every rom).
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Sorry - was on my phone when I saw your replies and it was just easier for me to respond in the other thread.
Anyways.. thanks for the info. I've done some research and I'm a bit more informed about CAF and what it means to device specific sources, ROMs, etc. Are you just using the stock Euphoria kernel or something else?
On this forum @varund7726 builds his rather excellent ResurrectionRom from the latest CM code release. I suggest you use that. For the D803, @zr239 has beaten all odds including LG not releasing CAF code, to build a fully functional pure CM 12.1 ROM that closely tracks official CM repos.
Lg G2 has it pretty good !
@Choristav
I wanted to clarify something you said in your initial response to my OP. You said the S3 wasn't going to get CM12 or 12.1 but when I navigate to the CM downloads page for ANY S3 variant - they ALL have CM12.1 nightlies still being generated. What exactly did you mean?
t3chn0s1s said:
@Choristav
I wanted to clarify something you said in your initial response to my OP. You said the S3 wasn't going to get CM12 or 12.1 but when I navigate to the CM downloads page for ANY S3 variant - they ALL have CM12.1 nightlies still being generated. What exactly did you mean?
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I checked, you are right, several of the qualcomm variants have cyanogenmod support. This means that they have active maintainers, but they also don't have to deal with locked bootloader crap, which is why the bump commit is so important for our device.
I only mentioned the international version, which support was dropped because it had a lot of issues thanks to its closed source exynos processor (it requires extra work, and some stuff doesn't end up working anyway).
Not really much to say, the commit is already in CM's gerrit, it's just waiting for review. Maybe it's a CTS-side issue?
Aside from that, being a maintainer doesn't really require much, just effort and presence. It's not an easy task, I'm just saying anyone can apply to be a maintainer and get nighties rolling for a device you might not even have heard of.
@Rashed97 is the man for our G2 when it comes to CM. Dont mind nightlies as long as Rashed is around
Note: he is currently busy with the One M9 but we will hopefully see some cool stuff from him in the future.
Not really a big deal, last I remember those nightlies were still using outdated jellybean components. I wouldn't use them, I would use something on the G2 forums like Rashed97 builds like someone else said.
I don't think that the availability of nightlies has to do with the device itself so much as it has to do with someone maintaining the g2 and building roms, so nightlies could come back at any time if someone steps up and does it.
Ploxorz said:
Not really a big deal, last I remember those nightlies were still using outdated jellybean components. I wouldn't use them, I would use something on the G2 forums like Rashed97 builds like someone else said.
I don't think that the availability of nightlies has to do with the device itself so much as it has to do with someone maintaining the g2 and building roms, so nightlies could come back at any time if someone steps up and does it.
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And it appears you're correct as there is another nightly build up with today's date. I apparently posted this thread prematurely.
Guys I wouldnt worry to much about CM, its not like they are the only (or even best) option in the forums. If you guys want development then dig in and make some for it.
zelendel said:
Guys I wouldnt worry to much about CM, its not like they are the only (or even best) option in the forums. If you guys want development then dig in and make some for it.
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You are absolutely right. I had no idea until I posted this thread that CM nightlies did not contain any device specific updates. I honestly NEVER used to like CM at all. I honestly hated it... until owning a OnePlus One. I originally had the G2 right when it came out in 2013 and sold it off long ago & moved on to better devices - but when my OPO got stolen about 2 months back or so - I had to find a relatively cheap, but decent device and the G2 was the best bang for the buck (5.2" display, quick charge 2.0, 3000 mAh battery) and no other phones in 2013 came close to the specs the G2 had at the time.
So, now that I know CM is basically a sh*t ROM for this device I'll be moving on to a ROM that is compiled using CAF sources. Thanks everyone for your input!
Somehow doesn't look too good so far:
https://jira.cyanogenmod.org/browse/CYAN-6556
But why oh why?
The LG G2 still is such a modern and powerful device. It might be almost two years "old", but it's way better than a lot of other current devices.
I am using AICP on my g2. It is based on CM(5.1.1).
What's the best place to follow updates / changes to the CAF stuff?
I know there's a handful of ROMs based on CAF sources, I'm not too interested in the changelogs of those ROMs, more following the progress of CAF before it eventually all gets merged into CM12.1.
Is this it? https://github.com/lg-devs/android_device_lge_g2-common/commits/cm-12.1-caf
seanp25 said:
What's the best place to follow updates / changes to the CAF stuff?
I know there's a handful of ROMs based on CAF sources, I'm not too interested in the changelogs of those ROMs, more following the progress of CAF before it eventually all gets merged into CM12.1.
Is this it? https://github.com/lg-devs/android_device_lge_g2-common/commits/cm-12.1-caf
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I would watch the Code Aurora forums where CAF comes from.
zelendel said:
I would watch the Code Aurora forums where CAF comes from.
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It's better to watch public activity on Rashed97's github. He is CM maintainer for LG G2 and he brought up CAF sources for our devices.
adamz667 said:
It's better to watch public activity on Rashed97's github. He is CM maintainer for LG G2 and he brought up CAF sources for our devices.
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No. It's far better to watch the main code base. Cm messes too much up by not testing code before merging.
zelendel said:
No. It's far better to watch the main code base. Cm messes too much up by not testing code before merging.
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Okay, but @seanp25 probably want to follow source changes for our device, not common CAF source.
Just saw this:
Çetin ÇÖNE wrote on Jul 26 11:18 AM:
Why there is no nighlies it's really stable. Merge it please
Seth Shelnutt wrote on Jul 26 1:26 PM:
There are no nightlies because SELinux is not enabled. Sensors break with it enabled and I don't have time to address it yet.
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Source:
http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/103673/
Some days after that there came this:
http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/103674/
So maybe there soon will be 12.1 nightlies?
Why is there such alot more development and forum activity on for example the Xiaomi Redmi phones than on this one? The p9000 got excellent hardware for a great price but the community is really small somehow and the software is still buggy? How come? Do you think its still worth to wait for more activity and responses from developers for this phone or is it a "dead cow" already and better to swap to another brand to get support from developers on for example CM or RR?
furchtlos76 said:
Why is there such alot more development and forum activity on for example the Xiaomi Redmi phones than on this one? The p9000 got excellent hardware for a great price but the community is really small somehow and the software is still buggy? How come? Do you think its still worth to wait for more activity and responses from developers for this phone or is it a "dead cow" already and better to swap to another brand to get support from developers on for example CM or RR?
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Development for this device is far from dead, we have a stable device tree for building custom ROM's, CM and RR ROM's already released, a fully source built TWRP and work on custom kernels is just beginning. That's a lot more development already than an awful lot of devices see in their entire lifetime.
I would rather say it has just begun. Development for this MTK chip is not a matter of course and the outcome so far is pretty exciting. This opens the way for other devs who work on other devices with the same chipset. It's just that many devs simply prefer Snapdragon which leads to higher dev count on those devices, faster bug fixing etc. I am pretty excited what the future brings not only for our P9000 but MTK devices in general as far as flashing and development goes.
Development is dead? What gave you that impression? For starter this phone already has a working twrp recovery. That is more then some Chinese phones get in their whole lifetime. Kernels is the area of development next and elephone has been kind to release the source code for the phone. Again more then most developers even bother with.
well, it got twrp,root and xposed working. More than some name brand phones that stop official updates after a year.
But i admit it is easier to update my old nexus 4 with cm downloader. Just click the update notification and latest cm gets installed.
It is also getting nougat in November hopefully
mangoman said:
well, it got twrp,root and xposed working. More than some name brand phones that stop official updates after a year.
But i admit it is easier to update my old nexus 4 with cm downloader. Just click the update notification and latest cm gets installed.
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That's because Nexus 4 is an officially supported device by CM.
It's very difficult for MTK devices in general to get official CM support because we have to patch some things in the framework to make camera, RIL (mobile data) etc working.
The official stance is that these things should be done in device tree as no proprietary code is allowed in CM framework.
Initially when our patches were submitted to CM Gerrit they were rejected because of this, Leskal is working on minimising the patch work needed and getting more of the generic MTK code accepted on Gerrit.
Not helped by the fact that MTK themselves aren't helpful or willing to support developers as it doesn't suit their replace and force upgrade business model. Technically how they operate and their refusal to release official development tools or code is a violation of the open sources nature of Android. But google has yet to do anything serious about it. As far as I know, any code we have is from reverse engineering and leaks.
Android-UK said:
Not helped by the fact that MTK themselves aren't helpful or willing to support developers as it doesn't suit their replace and force upgrade business model. Technically how they operate and their refusal to release official development tools or code is a violation of the open sources nature of Android. But google has yet to do anything serious about it. As far as I know, any code we have is from reverse engineering and leaks.
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Not true, I've met up with MTK engineers at DevCon and they do actually encourage development, they just seem to lately be wanting to protect their HAL's and drivers which as pointed out on the XDA portal article about this is sort of ridiculous. But then again it's proprietary code and not under the GPL so whilst we can say it's stupid we can't really contest it, it's their choice.
The code we have is completely official and not gotten from reverse engineering.
Jonny said:
Not true, I've met up with MTK engineers at DevCon and they do actually encourage development, they just seem to lately be wanting to protect their HAL's and drivers which as pointed out on the XDA portal article about this is sort of ridiculous. But then again it's proprietary code and not under the GPL so whilst we can say it's stupid we can't really contest ot, it's their choice.
The code we have is completely official and not gotten from reverse engineering.
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I have seen many a leak before. But OK they support developing but at the same time they don't help provide any decent tools for troubleshooting or development.
Android-UK said:
I have seen many a leak before. But OK they support developing but at the same time they don't help provide any decent tools for troubleshooting or development.
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Why do they need to? There's already great tools around for that, I know Qualcomm certainly used to provide a package for debugging the lower system levels but it wasn't widely available as the lower levels of the device booting process are not needed to be modified outside of OEM labs and manufacturing.
The lowest level we need is kernel debugging and the kernel already provides that via last_kmsg and desmsg etc, all other tools are already available as part of ADB, logcat etc. There are also a plethora of other tools readily available.
I would call it pretty dead now Well, if not dead then dying.
Let's hope for a Christmas special
I would really like to see the latest PA ported to the original MiPad. Is anybody up to take up the mantel!?
No go. Some of PA's stuff is closed source, so I'm afraid unless someone in the PA team gets a Mi Pad, we'll probably never see a build.
drakonizer said:
No go. Some of PA's stuff is closed source, so I'm afraid unless someone in the PA team gets a Mi Pad, we'll probably never see a build.
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Thanks for shading light on the topic.
drakonizer said:
No go. Some of PA's stuff is closed source, so I'm afraid unless someone in the PA team gets a Mi Pad, we'll probably never see a build.
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Did you read this https://plus.google.com/+ParanoidAndroidCorner/posts/dcrz5JP1HLg - seems there's hope after all
"Device Maintainers
We are currently looking to expand our roster of supported devices and to do this we would like to recruit some more developers to our team. If you think you have what it takes and have a device (or two) that you’d like to see supported by us we’d like you to get in touch. "
Palm Trees said:
Did you read this https://plus.google.com/+ParanoidAndroidCorner/posts/dcrz5JP1HLg - seems there's hope after all
"Device Maintainers
We are currently looking to expand our roster of supported devices and to do this we would like to recruit some more developers to our team. If you think you have what it takes and have a device (or two) that you’d like to see supported by us we’d like you to get in touch. "
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Not yet unfortunately. They're looking for official maintainers. Our device can't go official for any ROM because in order to get a stable build, the developers patch the Android source itself, which is not possible in official builds built by a server. In addition, if we were to use the new blobs (that don't require said patches), we wouldn't have a working camera, which a custom ROM community like AOSPA would never agree to.
Once camera starts to work with new blobs, we can expect something.
drakonizer said:
Not yet unfortunately. They're looking for official maintainers. Our device can't go official for any ROM because in order to get a stable build, the developers patch the Android source itself, which is not possible in official builds built by a server. In addition, if we were to use the new blobs (that don't require said patches), we wouldn't have a working camera, which a custom ROM community like AOSPA would never agree to.
Once camera starts to work with new blobs, we can expect something.
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Thanks for clarifying that Let's hope for the best.
OnePlus has numerous models (like my Nord N10) that are still waiting for Android 11. Other models have beta versions of Android 12, but OnePlus has wholly and completely botched their rollout of Android 11.
I'm sure that THOUSANDS of OnePlus users would gladly pay for a stable ROM.
Would love to see Pixel Experience or Lineage take the lead on this!
mkeaton1967 said:
OnePlus has numerous models (like my Nord N10) that are still waiting for Android 11. Other models have beta versions of Android 12, but OnePlus has wholly and completely botched their rollout of Android 11.
I'm sure that THOUSANDS of OnePlus users would gladly pay for a stable ROM.
Would love to see Pixel Experience or Lineage take the lead on this!
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No doubt mate, I would definitely pay for a Lineage ROM...
I mean, I even contacted the OP support team showing them how pissed and disappointed I am due to the lack of OxygenOS support for the N10, but they answered with a completely generic and useless email...
However, there's already a Pixel Experience ROM for OP N10: https://download.pixelexperience.org/billie
But I dunno, isn't Pixel Experience way more Google-dependent than OxygenOS? I usually avoid Google stuff.
EDIT: Well yea, I just noticed that ROM was discontinued, my bad.
lbsilva said:
No doubt mate, I would definitely pay for a Lineage ROM...
I mean, I even contacted the OP support team showing them how pissed and disappointed I am due to the lack of OxygenOS support for the N10, but they answered with a completely generic and useless email...
However, there's already a Pixel Experience ROM for OP N10: https://download.pixelexperience.org/billie
But I dunno, isn't Pixel Experience way more Google-dependent than OxygenOS? I usually avoid Google stuff.
EDIT: Well yea, I just noticed that ROM was discontinued, my bad.
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Appreciate your feedback. It’s a chicken or the egg conundrum.
I’ve shared feedback directly with both Lineage and Pixel Exp that there is an opportunity here. Some twerp moderating the Lineage forum (not a developer) sent me a grumpy reply saying “read the forum rules you can’t ask for a ROM for your phone”. I explained to the dummy that I’m not talking about just my phone, rather it is a huge opportunity for nearly every model of OnePlus phones.
We need to help folks at Lineage or Pixel Exp understand that yes these custom ROM projects are things they work on for fun — but that they are also supported thru DONATIONS. So, consider developing ROMs for models where there are known customer dissatisfaction issues. Maybe even require a minimum donation of $15 or $25 if you have published a stable ROM that you are committed to for ongoing support.
mkeaton1967 said:
Appreciate your feedback. It’s a chicken or the egg conundrum.
I’ve shared feedback directly with both Lineage and Pixel Exp that there is an opportunity here. Some twerp moderating the Lineage forum (not a developer) sent me a grumpy reply saying “read the forum rules you can’t ask for a ROM for your phone”. I explained to the dummy that I’m not talking about just my phone, rather it is a huge opportunity for nearly every model of OnePlus phones.
We need to help folks at Lineage or Pixel Exp understand that yes these custom ROM projects are things they work on for fun — but that they are also supported thru DONATIONS. So, consider developing ROMs for models where there are known customer dissatisfaction issues. Maybe even require a minimum donation of $15 or $25 if you have published a stable ROM that you are committed to for ongoing support.
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I think many developers build and develop custom ROMs in order to practice or just to have fun, not for money. What I think you're proposing is turning what is a fun hobby for many of the developers into a sort of job, which I think is a little unreasonable. This is probably the point where most developers would stop having fun and cease development altogether. I think letting developers pick whatever devices they want to develop for would be for the best. The only thing we can do is wait or send a device their way in hopes that they pick up development. Also, there are already Pixel Experience and LineageOS ROMs for the N10(I'm using Pixel Experience right now and it's pretty stable). If you're feeling extra adventurous, there is a guide to flash GSIs from the GitHub Wiki here.
Generic123. said:
I think many developers build and develop custom ROMs in order to practice or just to have fun, not for money. What I think you're proposing is turning what is a fun hobby for many of the developers into a sort of job, which I think is a little unreasonable. This is probably the point where most developers would stop having fun and cease development altogether. I think letting developers pick whatever devices they want to develop for would be for the best. The only thing we can do is wait or send a device their way in hopes that they pick up development. Also, there are already Pixel Experience and LineageOS ROMs for the N10(I'm using Pixel Experience right now and it's pretty stable). If you're feeling extra adventurous, there is a guide to flash GSIs from the GitHub Wiki here.
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Thanks for sharing your point of view. Agreed 100% that these are volunteers who don’t do it for money. Just pointing out that there’s an opportunity for both because of how OnePlus has handled the rollout of Android 11. The OnePlus 9 is part of the Android 12 Beta, but the N10 and other models are still waiting for Android 11.
My goal is just to create awareness of an issue. Given that most custom ROM developers focus on a couple of phone models, they might not be aware of the issues that OnePlus has had. Someone can still be a custom ROM developer on the side for the fun of it, but at the same time pick devices where there is a need. It might increase donations — a way to subsidize the fun.
I held off on installing Pixel or Lineage on my N10 because both mention issues with adaptive brightness — didn’t know if that meant that brightness was randomly changing or if that means it just doesn’t adapt and stays at whatever you have it set on.
mkeaton1967 said:
Thanks for sharing your point of view. Agreed 100% that these are volunteers who don’t do it for money. Just pointing out that there’s an opportunity for both because of how OnePlus has handled the rollout of Android 11. The OnePlus 9 is part of the Android 12 Beta, but the N10 and other models are still waiting for Android 11.
My goal is just to create awareness of an issue. Given that most custom ROM developers focus on a couple of phone models, they might not be aware of the issues that OnePlus has had. Someone can still be a custom ROM developer on the side for the fun of it, but at the same time pick devices where there is a need. It might increase donations — a way to subsidize the fun.
I held off on installing Pixel or Lineage on my N10 because both mention issues with adaptive brightness — didn’t know if that meant that brightness was randomly changing or if that means it just doesn’t adapt and stays at whatever you have it set on.
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Thanks for the calm discussion. From your perspective, I can see how looking at all of these OnePlus devices and their lack of recent updates has created a huge void that could be easily filled with custom ROMs. The N10 is no exception; only 1 major android update and that's it, which is obviously a big bummer. I think some developers are aware, but might just be waiting for the "promised" updates to actually occur, slow as they are. I personally think the slow deveopment progress of the N10 relative to other OnePlus devices is most likely because this phone is on the more boring side, and most people have marked it off as budget garbage. Concerning Pixel and Lineage: auto brightness just doesn't work at all, and other than DT2W , both are pretty stable(as indicated by my last post).
I love you both