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Hi all,
What's up with the z2 primary cam? I've got a nexus 5, an lg g2, a galaxy s3 here at home aside from the z2. The camera pics seem to be comparable to the nexus 5 or g2? I was expecting a lot better being all the branding and the megapixels at its disposal... The images seem to be drawn on sandpaper( grainy on zooming) I don't get why... being the hardware is present am I the only one with this issue or is this a software thing that needs to be fixed? Any cam mods that solve this? Cybershot mod or the xposed mod?
Thanks a ton in advance, I'm worried I'm the only one with the grainy images...
mokaigutti said:
Hi all,
What's up with the z2 primary cam? I've got a nexus 5, an lg g2, a galaxy s3 here at home aside from the z2. The camera pics seem to be comparable to the nexus 5 or g2? I was expecting a lot better being all the branding and the megapixels at its disposal... The images seem to be drawn on sandpaper( grainy on zooming) I don't get why... being the hardware is present am I the only one with this issue or is this a software thing that needs to be fixed? Any cam mods that solve this? Cybershot mod or the xposed mod?
Thanks a ton in advance, I'm worried I'm the only one with the grainy images...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was similarly surprised when looking at the photos that I take with my Z2... However, I think it's understandable. In Superior Auto mode, the resolution is only 8MP, so that could be why your images are looking similar to that of the N5 and G2... If you switch to manual mode and up the resolution to the full 20MP, the pictures are quite clearly much higher quality. You can zoom in after taking the photo and not lose much if any clarity. As for the graininess, you have to remember that they're fitting 20700000 pixels into an area of about 1cm^2, so they're going to be tiny pixels. This means not much light will reach them. Hence why HTC have gone for a 4MP main camera, but with much bigger, more light absorbing pixels to focus on getting the minimal amount of grain, whilst sacrificing some resolution (on the M8). So in short, there's nothing wrong with the camera, the reason it's grainy is because it's ultra sensitive to low light conditions. To get amazing high resolution images with the Z2, you'll need a well lit, well balanced environment. It's a good camera, but it is designed for great photos, and that means perfect environments are required. If you leave it on Superior Auto, it will take photos that are just fine and hold up to scrutiny against those of the Nexus 5 and LG G2, they just can't hold up to all the branding and advertising that Sony have been giving, since you are unlikely to get the perfect picture taking environment in every day usage. I suggest putting the camera on Manual mode and fiddling with the in depth settings when lining up a shot. Don't push it all the way up to 20MP as you lose the ability to do HDR or Stabilisation, but at 15MP with the correct exposure and ISO settings, the photos can look incredible.
Hope that cleared things up, and sorry if it answered none of your questions x'D
Most of the time superior auto produces just as good quality as 20mp manual, and no its an insult to compare camera to g2 or nexus5, its way better
Agree with what u said but the superior auto I find takes better snaps than the max resolution in most cases. And the reason why I'm disappointed is that it is indeed comparable to the other two, which indeed is an insult!
So everybody gets the grainy images on zooming then? And is this fixable via a firmware or software update?
Put up some originals so we can see what you mean.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5whd6h9620kemdu/DSC_0036.JPG untouched pic here... Is this the best I can get? ( I have 3 more similar shots, this is the best one of the bunch)
feis said:
Most of the time superior auto produces just as good quality as 20mp manual, and no its an insult to compare camera to g2 or nexus5, its way better
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The G2 with the camera mod available to it produced incredible photos and when I got my z2 I didn't really notice a difference other than the extreme amount of postprocessing that sometimes makes photos look like absolute crap... I just wished there was a way to remove all the processing of the image so we can tweak it ourselves
mokaigutti said:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5whd6h9620kemdu/DSC_0036.JPG untouched pic here... Is this the best I can get? ( I have 3 more similar shots, this is the best one of the bunch)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can try to get slightly better with manual and iso 50, yours was iso 84 but the difference will only show up in zooming.
If you're not zooming in a 3.5MP photo will be sharper still.
---------- Post added at 04:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:40 AM ----------
mokaigutti said:
I've got a nexus 5, an lg g2, a galaxy s3 here at home aside from the z2. The camera pics seem to be comparable to the nexus 5 or g2? I was expecting a lot better being all the branding and the megapixels at its disposal...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you have a similar photo from those cameras. It's best to take a shot of a similar subject, same angle and lighting conditions and let's see what you are comparing with.
s3 & n5 are 8mp so are comparable. The g2 makes 13MP so you should reduce it to the same resolution as what you are comparing with.
mokaigutti said:
The images seem to be drawn on sandpaper( grainy on zooming) I don't get why... being the hardware is present am I the only one with this issue or is this a software thing that needs to be fixed?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see a lot of grain in this picture with iso 84, zoomed in at 100%. Grain starts at 400-800 and beyond.
When the light goes down the others will struggle to keep up. They won't match video of z2 with the s3 coming the closest but stabilisation on the z2 will beat it. Z2 is a general purpose camera.
But those cameras have f2.4 or a half stop smaller apertures so this means more of the background will be in focus behind where you focus with the z2. This is the tradeoff for better bokeh and low light in video. But it only applies if you focus on a subject that is close.
mokaigutti said:
Thanks a ton in advance, I'm worried I'm the only one with the grainy images...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you put up a 20MP photo, try to take it with the on screen button instead of camera button as this reduces camera shake. Let's see how good your lens is.
xperia z1 ad z2 have poor processing algorithms. since the release of xperia z1 sony improved the image quality, but still needs improvements.
the grain in the pictures is NOT because of the tiny pixels, the xperia z2 has 1.175u pixels, larger than the 1.12u pixels in galaxy s5 and s4 for example, and both of them doesnt suffer from that level of grain and noise. if you take into consideration that sony has a bigger pixel, bigger sensor and resolution, wider aperture lens (can capture more light) than any other android smartphone and produces pictures comparable with an iphone 5 or gs4 with 1/3.2 sensor and f2.2 camera its a big shame for sony.
at 20mp you will have even more noise and grain. when shooting at 8Mp, the phone downsample the image utilizing the better pixels to provide a better picture (similar to what nokia does with its pureview lumia 1020 41Mp camera). shooting in manual mode is better for properly adjusting exposure, white balance and ISO, but the processing itself is the same, so apart from those parameters, nothing else will change
you can see the advantages of the big sensor and wide aperture lens in very low light videos for example. it produces much brighter and lower noise videos than others competitors, but the imaging from sony is terribly inconsistent. there is grain, noise and alias everywhere and and blur smeared inconsistently in pictures. and you can easily notice it in any picture taken with z1/z1c/z2. videos also suffers with lots of aliasing
with android L and the new and much improved camera API, lets hope from better camera firmwares from sony, and with DNG support, at least 3rd party camera apps will support it. then maybe we will have good quality pictures without the terrible post processing from sony
I guess the post processing is the problem. If I flash aosp or aokp the Google camera will use the stock processing right? And not sony's? Will that be better?
I'll try with the manual mode enabled and play with the iso as suggested as well.
And the 21mp are marginally worse than the superior auto so there isn't a point in uploading that... Ill upload pics from the 3 phones with a similar subject as suggested by today or tomorrow at the latest!
Thanks a ton for the feedback guys!
pepeo123 said:
xperia z1 ad z2 have poor processing algorithms. since the release of xperia z1 sony improved the image quality, but still needs improvements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
File sizes of z2 are larger than z1 so there is less processing in z2. The numerous complaints i saw with z1 picture quality are very few with z2 largely because auto in z2 does a better job. What does auto do better in z2 ? the same thing people did in manual with z1, use the lowest iso possible.
pepeo123 said:
but the imaging from sony is terribly inconsistent. there is grain, noise and alias everywhere and and blur smeared inconsistently in pictures.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you want consistent then you have to go with manual. No two ways about it.
Then you need to have a pretty good idea of how the sensor works in varying light conditions. You need to take loads of pictures to better understand which settings give the best picture depending on light. This is the same with any camera for that matter, assuming these others even allow some sort of manual intervention to begin with. With the g3 or moto x there is nothing, iphone is only marginally better in allowing exposure setting.
Don't want to do that ? then you will be taking 2 or 3 shots to get it right.
pepeo123 said:
if you take into consideration that sony has a bigger pixel, bigger sensor and resolution, wider aperture lens (can capture more light) than any other android smartphone and produces pictures comparable with an iphone 5 or gs4 with 1/3.2 sensor and f2.2 camera its a big shame for sony.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try comparing a 20MP pic with the smaller resolutions of the others and see how much more you can zoom. There may be more artifiacts in some situations but details will be better preserved. An 8mp iphone 5 cannot have the same details as a 20MP from the z2. In the same way as 13MP from the g2/s4 or 16MP from the s5 will have more detail than a 8mp auto from z2.
---------- Post added at 05:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:43 PM ----------
mokaigutti said:
I guess the post processing is the problem. If I flash aosp or aokp the Google camera will use the stock processing right? And not sony's? Will that be better?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doubtful. Or put it this way. i've yet to see someone make this claim in the z2 photo thread. For the simple reason that 3rd party apps cannot access iso setting in the camera libs. best camera app you can use is stock. The xposed mod allows to take auto in 20mp instead of 8mp. This i've seen to actually work. if you need it.
Whatever complaints people have about processing its better in the z2 than it is in the z1 when it came out. The only time i've seen the z1 do better is when there were lens issues with the reviewer's z2.
mokaigutti said:
And the 21mp are marginally worse than the superior auto so there isn't a point in uploading that...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to check if the lens is ok. I've seen samples where 20MP are not as sharp with some models as others. See the pictures from this post.. Or even from an earlier post here.
Download the pictures from both posts and do a 1:1 compare, there is a subtle but noticeable difference between the two. This is a hardware defect and causes a softer than otherwise photo. You only see it in 20mp, 8mp will mask it.
What is the manufacturing date of your model ? should be in the format 14wxy, you will find it printed on a sticker under the micro-sd tray.
mokaigutti said:
Ill upload pics from the 3 phones with a similar subject as suggested by today or tomorrow at the latest!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah let's see the difference.
bear in mind that doing this sort of comparison on a sample size of a few pictures is tricky at best. Yes, in some instances some photos may be better, but what does it mean. You'd have to take many photos to draw a conclusion that this or that model is better than another, that too only in certain situations. Koreans tend to do more sharpening in their photos & videos which is perceived by some to be better. Debatable.
One Twelve said:
File sizes of z2 are larger than z1 so there is less processing in z2. The numerous complaints i saw with z1 picture quality are very few with z2 largely because auto in z2 does a better job. What does auto do better in z2 ? the same thing people did in manual with z1, use the lowest iso possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes the z2 pics are indeed larger (some are actualy 2x larger) probably mostly because lower compression. there is also processing changes too like you said, but both of them still badly processed. http://blog.gsmarena.com/sony-xperia-z2-vs-z1-camera-comparison/
One Twelve said:
If you want consistent then you have to go with manual. No two ways about it.
Then you need to have a pretty good idea of how the sensor works in varying light conditions. You need to take loads of pictures to better understand which settings give the best picture depending on light. This is the same with any camera for that matter, assuming these others even allow some sort of manual intervention to begin with. With the g3 or moto x there is nothing, iphone is only marginally better in allowing exposure setting.
Don't want to do that ? then you will be taking 2 or 3 shots to get it right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
when i mean inconsistent, i dont mean that the camera is inconsistent trough various pictures(wich is, in superior auto, like you said, but can be solved shooting in manual adjusting correctly the parameters if you have enough knowledge in the equipment you are using, like you said too), i mean inconsistency in the picture itself. the picture is not uniform, it has random blured areas like if the lens was astigmatic or myopic giving the impression of a defocuesed image in some random areas (im not talking about the defective lens gsmarena unit)
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=3&idPhone1=4238&idPhone3=6144&idCamera2=30013
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/ca...ng-Galaxy-S5,LG-G3/phones/8323,8202,8347?st=2
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/camera/Sony-Xperia-Z2,Samsung-Galaxy-S5,LG-G3/phones/8323,8202,8347
One Twelve said:
Try comparing a 20MP pic with the smaller resolutions of the others and see how much more you can zoom. There may be more artifiacts in some situations but details will be better preserved. An 8mp iphone 5 cannot have the same details as a 20MP from the z2. In the same way as 13MP from the g2/s4 or 16MP from the s5 will have more detail than a 8mp auto from z2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes at 20mp you will have much more deatil thanks to the much larger resolution, but when i mean it was a big shame, i mean that at 8mp, the xperia z2 has comparable if not worse pictures in some cases than iphone 5 or lg g3, gs5, etc even with all those hardware advantages of it. and this is again caused by the processing. lots of grain, noise, alias, blur, too high contrast, etc, etc, etc (yes noise can be reduced using lower iso in manual, but when i mean more noise, i mean more noise in the same iso settings as the competitors)
an interesting thing to note is that if you compare raw pictures of the nokia 1020 with the jpeg ones from it for example, there is a HUGE diference between them, and nokia is know from doing really good processing in cameras in general. so this makes me think how much extra performance can be achieved from the z seris with it great hardware
I'm just worried this could be a hardware issue, mine is a 14W21 phone. I'm gonna do some extensive photo sessions and if they don't work out maybe try a replacement
pepeo123 said:
yes the z2 pics are indeed larger (some are actualy 2x larger) probably mostly because lower compression. there is also processing changes too like you said, but both of them still badly processed. http://blog.gsmarena.com/sony-xperia-z2-vs-z1-camera-comparison/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok, i checked the 20MP manual mode shots at 100% and can say the z2 shot is visibly better than the z1 if you look at the balcony railings left of centre and building detail right of centre.
gsmarenas z2's lens does not have any issues that i can notice. I don't know if the z1 lens is ok though.
pepeo123 said:
when i mean inconsistent, i dont mean that the camera is inconsistent trough various pictures(wich is, in superior auto, like you said, but can be solved shooting in manual adjusting correctly the parameters if you have enough knowledge in the equipment you are using, like you said too), i mean inconsistency in the picture itself. the picture is not uniform, it has random blured areas like if the lens was astigmatic or myopic giving the impression of a defocuesed image in some random areas (im not talking about the defective lens gsmarena unit)
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=3&idPhone1=4238&idPhone3=6144&idCamera2=30013
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/ca...ng-Galaxy-S5,LG-G3/phones/8323,8202,8347?st=2
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/camera/Sony-Xperia-Z2,Samsung-Galaxy-S5,LG-G3/phones/8323,8202,8347
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, i see the underlined bit at 20MP with the z2 , but check out the SA of the iso chart from gsmareana (phonearena did not have SA images to compare)
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=1&idPhone1=6033&idPhone3=6144&idCamera2=30013
Much clearer to see the chart in SA than 20MP isn't it. Note that you see same blur with 20MP here too.
I added z1 into comparison in phonearena's chart, can you see the difference between z1 & z2.
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/ca...ony-Xperia-Z1/phones/8323,8202,8347,8000?st=2
z1 is less blurred but the compression is much more than z2. If you try to reduce the size of the image in phonearena, the z2 image remains blurred but if you look at the SA, its much more clear as shown in gsmarena.
pepeo123 said:
yes at 20mp you will have much more deatil thanks to the much larger resolution, but when i mean it was a big shame, i mean that at 8mp, the xperia z2 has comparable if not worse pictures in some cases than iphone 5 or lg g3, gs5, etc even with all those hardware advantages of it. and this is again caused by the processing. lots of grain, noise, alias, blur, too high contrast, etc, etc, etc (yes noise can be reduced using lower iso in manual, but when i mean more noise, i mean more noise in the same iso settings as the competitors)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Underlined bit is somewhat true in good light, but not in low light.
Why the pictures look better, requires explanation of what better means. Did you see DxO's tests. compare z1, 5s, s5 & z2 on 7 parameters for still photo. Exposure, ontrast & Noise is very well controlled in the Z2. Artifacts is the only parameter where the Z2 trails the others. To notice that you will have to zoom into edges to see it. Not very apparent without zooming.
Exposure and contrast
---------------------
90 Apple iPhone 5s
88 Sony Xperia Z2
88 Samsung Galaxy S5
85 Sony Xperia Z1
80 LG G2
Colour
------
82 Apple iPhone 5S
82 Samsung Galaxy S5
80 Apple iPhone 5
77 Sony Xperia Z1
76 LG G2
74 Sony Xperia Z2
Autofocus
---------
84 Sony Xperia Z2
81 Apple iPhone 5S
74 LG G2
73 Sony Xperia Z1
69 Samsung Galaxy S5
Texture
-------
83 Sony Xperia Z2
78 Samsung Galaxy S5
69 LG G2
66 Sony Xperia Z1
59 Apple iPhone 5S
Noise
-----
84 Sony Xperia Z2
84 Sony Xperia Z1
83 LG G2
78 Samsung Galaxy S5
70 Apple iPhone 5S
Artifacts
---------
91 Apple iPhone 5S
89 LG G2
83 Samsung Galaxy S5
74 Sony Xperia Z1
68 Sony Xperia Z2
Flash
-----
85 Sony Xperia Z2
84 Sony Xperia Z1
83 Apple iPhone 5S
82 Samsung Galaxy S5
72 LG G2
DxOMark Still Photo (overall rank)
-------------------- -
81 Nokia 808 PureView
81 Sony Xperia Z2
80 Samsung Galaxy S5
78 Apple iPhone 5S
77 Sony Xperia Z1
77 LG G2
These are the differences observed after analysis of over 400 photos.
pepeo123 said:
an interesting thing to note is that if you compare raw pictures of the nokia 1020 with the jpeg ones from it for example, there is a HUGE diference between them, and nokia is know from doing really good processing in cameras in general. so this makes me think how much extra performance can be achieved from the z seris with it great hardware
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is something we will only find out when android L comes out. having said that the oppo find 7a can output raw images from its 13MP sensor, and its a sony one to boot. Lumia 1520 can already output RAW.
The question that remains to be answered is, what is the shot to shot turnaround with RAW in a mobile phone. Without dedicated image processors that specialise in it things will be slow.
---------- Post added at 05:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:06 AM ----------
mokaigutti said:
I'm just worried this could be a hardware issue, mine is a 14W21 phone. I'm gonna do some extensive photo sessions and if they don't work out maybe try a replacement
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So that is not an earlier build. i don't see anything to worry about given what little you have posted so far.
One Twelve said:
ok, i checked the 20MP manual mode shots at 100% and can say the z2 shot is visibly better than the z1 if you look at the balcony railings left of centre and building detail right of centre.
gsmarenas z2's lens does not have any issues that i can notice. I don't know if the z1 lens is ok though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes z2 is superior, i dont know right now since this review was done in older firmware and both z1 and z2 received some firmware upgrades and z1 is even in 4.4.4. the good new for z1 owners is that its possible to port the camera apk. for z1 like they did with the 4k mod, and therefore things will be the same
One Twelve said:
Yes, i see the underlined bit at 20MP with the z2 , but check out the SA of the iso chart from gsmareana (phonearena did not have SA images to compare)
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=1&idPhone1=6033&idPhone3=6144&idCamera2=30013
Much clearer to see the chart in SA than 20MP isn't it. Note that you see same blur with 20MP here too.
I added z1 into comparison in phonearena's chart, can you see the difference between z1 & z2.
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/ca...ony-Xperia-Z1/phones/8323,8202,8347,8000?st=2
z1 is less blurred but the compression is much more than z2. If you try to reduce the size of the image in phonearena, the z2 image remains blurred but if you look at the SA, its much more clear as shown in gsmarena.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
exactly, regarding the blurred areas, SA is better than 20mp downsampled to 8MP, and this could mean 2 things. either sony is using diferent processing, or the downsample algorithm is doing its job right. or maybe both. either way, this shows that sony has work to do
One Twelve said:
Underlined bit is somewhat true in good light, but not in low light.
Why the pictures look better, requires explanation of what better means. Did you see DxO's tests. compare z1, 5s, s5 & z2 on 7 parameters for still photo. Exposure, ontrast & Noise is very well controlled in the Z2. Artifacts is the only parameter where the Z2 trails the others. To notice that you will have to zoom into edges to see it. Not very apparent without zooming.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes in low light the phone really shows its big sensor and wide aperture lens advantage, pictures are brighter and capture more, while others have darker pictures and less detailed, although the focus in low light is terrible, something that is possible to be corrected using manual mode. low light videos z2 crushes its oponents too, other phones look like they are in a darker place lol
One Twelve said:
This is something we will only find out when android L comes out. having said that the oppo find 7a can output raw images from its 13MP sensor, and its a sony one to boot. Lumia 1520 can already output RAW.
The question that remains to be answered is, what is the shot to shot turnaround with RAW in a mobile phone. Without dedicated image processors that specialise in it things will be slow.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, oppo, lumia 1020 and lumia 1520 can output raw and use sony sensors
maybe taking raw pictures is even faster, since it just takes the picture but doesnt process nothing else like it would do with JPEG,or maybe it could take longer because since its a large file, saving would take a little bit longer but? i really have no knowledge in what i am talking about here, so this is purely an speculation made by me
I was being dumb by comparing the images on the respective phone displays... On transferring them to my laptop the z2 has visibly better images overall, especially low light this is the good news... The bad news is the presence of graininess on full zoom. This is normal? (spoilt solid by previous phones, Sony satio, Nokia n8, and the best one n82)
mokaigutti said:
I was being dumb by comparing the images on the respective phone displays... On transferring them to my laptop the z2 has visibly better images overall, especially low light this is the good news... The bad news is the presence of graininess on full zoom. This is normal? (spoilt solid by previous phones, Sony satio, Nokia n8, and the best one n82)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Full zoom graininess? You realize there isn't a single phone that isn't completely grainy at full zoom right? Literally not one.... Because the zoom is digital vs optical.
TechSavvy2 said:
Full zoom graininess? You realize there isn't a single phone that isn't completely grainy at full zoom right? Literally not one.... Because the zoom is digital vs optical.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry I didn't mean zooming in during the shot, I meant after the shot is taken... In the album app. I just feel spoilt after seeing the first page of the"post your z2 snaps here" post.
mokaigutti said:
I was being dumb by comparing the images on the respective phone displays... On transferring them to my laptop the z2 has visibly better images overall, especially low light this is the good news...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The opposite can also apply, photos can look good on the z2 screen and when transferred over to a laptop appear dull or washed out. Simple reason is photo was taken in too much light ie sun light. The wider aperture and bsi sensor means chances of over exposure are more than with other cameras that do not do as well in low light or have narrower apertures. So you will have to use -EV if colours do not appear natural or alternatively take photos in softer light rather than harsh light. You have to understand how light works to get the best photos with any camera.
So ensure bravia engine is switched off in the Z2 otherwise you might think photos are better than they actually are. can always correct things in post but its less work if you get it more or less right at the outset.
mokaigutti said:
The bad news is the presence of graininess on full zoom. This is normal? (spoilt solid by previous phones, Sony satio, Nokia n8, and the best one n82)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What frame of reference are you using to say it is grainy ? What are you comparing it with.
You started this topic on that basis and have yet to substantiate it. So post photos of the same subject from other models.
I'm stuck at work and haven't been home in a while, the moment I am ill post some similar pics to compare with. I say grainy as in the images seem to be oversharpened. I'll upload some pics in a few minutes so it's a little easy to understand
Not sure if something like this has already been posted:
A post on the android subreddit describes improvements to the camera API with specific mention of Sony devices:
Sony
Sony post processing isn't as good as it could be, look at this Xperia Z sample.
If you have a high end Sony phone from the last two years I wouldn't hesitate to say that your photos and video will drastically improve with this new API if implemented well in a good app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The full post is worth a read. There may be hope for the ZU camera after all.
http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/2lr0d2/an_indepth_analysis_of_the_new_android_50_camera/
unidentifier said:
Not sure if something like this has already been posted:
A post on the android subreddit describes improvements to the camera API with specific mention of Sony devices:
The full post is worth a read. There may be hope for the ZU camera after all.
http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/2lr0d2/an_indepth_analysis_of_the_new_android_50_camera/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We were hoping that the API and RAW format was going to arrive in KK as it was rumoured back then. Having access to the RAW data will help, but a noisy sensor is a noisy sensor.
There are some photo comparisons out there of the Nexus 5 running both Kitkat and Lollipop. The improvement in quality is very very noticeable, and I will eat a hat if we don't see some improvement on the Z Ultra too.
I believe it was Forbes that tested the Nexus 5 camera.
i hope this new camera API gets unmolested RAW data from the sensor
the JPGs this thing spits out currently is horrible
Software doesn't make miracles when hardware is at fault, just think that ZU Camera is a tablet Camera and get over it
Sm0L said:
Software doesn't make miracles when hardware is at fault, just think that ZU Camera is a tablet Camera and get over it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not software, but APIs, which grants direct access to the camera hardware. This is a first time on Android. What this means is that regular devs will have access to the camera hardware, and new camera apps can actually claim to take better or different photos. Want to shoot RAW? Sure. No problem. Want to dump Sony's post-processing algorythm? Not an issue.
There's probably not any issues with the sensor and module. Sony makes incredible camera modules, and even the cameras in the iPhones are from Sony. But the iPhone camera is much better than the average flagship Android, isn't it? Yes, and that boils down to the camera software. Not the hardware. So Lollipop will probably, and hopefully make a huge difference on the Ultra's camera. Low-light will still suck though.
---------- Post added at 03:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:51 PM ----------
ShadowVlican said:
i hope this new camera API gets unmolested RAW data from the sensor
the JPGs this thing spits out currently is horrible
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There's already a third party camera app for Lollipop that does this. It shoots RAW. The app itself is crappy (according to most users), but it's more of a proof of concept at this point.
H. E. Pennypacker said:
It's not software, but APIs, which grants direct access to the camera hardware. This is a first time on Android. What this means is that regular devs will have access to the camera hardware, and new camera apps can actually claim to take better or different photos. Want to shoot RAW? Sure. No problem. Want to dump Sony's post-processing algorythm? Not an issue.
There's probably not any issues with the sensor and module. Sony makes incredible camera modules, and even the cameras in the iPhones are from Sony. But the iPhone camera is much better than the average flagship Android, isn't it? Yes, and that boils down to the camera software. Not the hardware. So Lollipop will probably, and hopefully make a huge difference on the Ultra's camera. Low-light will still suck though.
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I don't think you are right, imho the sensor and module of the ZU is a bit of a crap and can't get better with new APIs, but i hope your are right.
Sm0L said:
I don't think you are right, imho the sensor and module of the ZU is a bit of a crap and can't get better with new APIs, but i hope your are right.
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But it might get faster. I think sonys post processing is already pretty good, when you consider the sensor being crap. Especially the video stabilization is impressive, it's doing a better job than some phones with OIS. But we will see when the GPE port arrives.
madphone said:
But it might get faster. I think sonys post processing is already pretty good, when you consider the sensor being crap. Especially the video stabilization is impressive, it's doing a better job than some phones with OIS. But we will see when the GPE port arrives.
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Sony's post-processing is the worst.
Certainly the write-up I posted suggested it's Sony's post-processing. Sony's sensor's are supposed to be best and is what's in most top phones.
Does anyone have any evidence (aside from self-referencing the XZU and Sony phones) that the 8 MP Exnor RS Sensor itself is flawed? Any other products using this sensor that also produce poor photos? Otherwise it's just a matter of opinion (without evidence) that it's sensor vs. the api.
The only other way to know for sure is to wait and see.
unidentifier said:
Certainly the write-up I posted suggested it's Sony's post-processing. Sony's sensor's are supposed to be best and is what's in most top phones.
Does anyone have any evidence (aside from self-referencing the XZU and Sony phones) that the 8 MP Exnor R Sensor itself is flawed? Any other products using this sensor that also produce poor photos? Otherwise it's just a matter of opinion (without evidence) that it's sensor vs. the api.
The only other way to know for sure is to wait and see.
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Yeah, we'll just have to wait i guess No reason to fight over something that doesn't have a right or wrong answer yet.
unidentifier said:
Certainly the write-up I posted suggested it's Sony's post-processing. Sony's sensor's are supposed to be best and is what's in most top phones.
Does anyone have any evidence (aside from self-referencing the XZU and Sony phones) that the 8 MP Exnor RS Sensor itself is flawed? Any other products using this sensor that also produce poor photos? Otherwise it's just a matter of opinion (without evidence) that it's sensor vs. the api.
The only other way to know for sure is to wait and see.
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Wikipedia list the Z Ultra's camera module as the IMX134 and is shared with the Xperia L and the Huawei Ascend G6, I don't know if that's correct or not but it's listed as 1/4in sensor which I can believe as that would account for poor image quality. Comparatively the Z1 and successors use 1/2.3in sensors which are much bigger although in general for cameras, that's still on the small side.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exmor
I don't believe there is any way we're going to see drastic improvements from Android 5.0, I do think Sony's image processing is an issue because they're trying to push a poor sensor too much resulting in noise reduction and sharpening which is far too aggressive. Dealing with noise is difficult, it's unsightly but the more aggressive the noise reduction is the more you lose detail but companies generally favour reducing noise at all cost on small, noisy sensors. Dialling back some of that aggressive processing will probably help the image quality a bit but ultimately it's still a small, noisy sensor and there's not much you can do with that.
John
Interestingly, this review of the Xperia L touts its "fantastic camera", concluding that "we feel that the camera is really something special. For those that want a decent camera phone, but don't want to pay loads, you might want to look at the Xperia L."
Expert Reviews say they "were impressed by the performance of its backside-illuminated camera sensor" and that it "takes some of the best low-light photos we've seen, with far more detail and less than noise than the Samsung Galaxy S4's shots. Daylight photos were acceptable if not spectacular. Contrast was impressive, with no sign of overexposure in lighter areas even on a sunlit day, but details became muddy when we zoomed in, showing the limits of the Xperia L's eight megapixels." Is the Ultra's sensor not backside-illuminated, maybe? The L also has a flash.
On the other hand, CNET is disappointed in its low-light performance. Trusted Reviews agrees, saying "Indoors, the Sony Xperia L camera is affected by yet more issues. While the camera takes balanced, good-looking photos in bright, natural light, in dim indoor lighting the white balance is off, resulting in ugly yellow tinged photos. The inbuilt flash does little to help, either." They say it does have "many positives, including a pleasing colour balance, sharp focus in shots".
PC World is generally happy with the Ascend G6's camera, saying "photo performance is generally strong — especially when you keep the Huawei’s price in mind — but we did encounter signs of flaring and feathering during testing. Image noise is present, but its at a low level, while the on-board HDR mode does a decent job at capturing detail that is otherwise lost."
These do take into consideration the price of the phones, however - they're both much cheaper than the Ultra was at launch.
Edit: All that to say, maybe there is hope in the software department.
Johnmcl7 said:
Wikipedia list the Z Ultra's camera module as the IMX134 and is shared with the Xperia L and the Huawei Ascend G6, I don't know if that's correct or not but it's listed as 1/4in sensor which I can believe as that would account for poor image quality. Comparatively the Z1 and successors use 1/2.3in sensors which are much bigger although in general for cameras, that's still on the small side.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exmor
I don't believe there is any way we're going to see drastic improvements from Android 5.0, I do think Sony's image processing is an issue because they're trying to push a poor sensor too much resulting in noise reduction and sharpening which is far too aggressive. Dealing with noise is difficult, it's unsightly but the more aggressive the noise reduction is the more you lose detail but companies generally favour reducing noise at all cost on small, noisy sensors. Dialling back some of that aggressive processing will probably help the image quality a bit but ultimately it's still a small, noisy sensor and there's not much you can do with that.
John
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Triflot said:
Interestingly, this review of the Xperia L touts its "fantastic camera", concluding that "we feel that the camera is really something special. For those that want a decent camera phone, but don't want to pay loads, you might want to look at the Xperia L."
Expert Reviews say they "were impressed by the performance of its backside-illuminated camera sensor" and that it "takes some of the best low-light photos we've seen, with far more detail and less than noise than the Samsung Galaxy S4's shots. Daylight photos were acceptable if not spectacular. Contrast was impressive, with no sign of overexposure in lighter areas even on a sunlit day, but details became muddy when we zoomed in, showing the limits of the Xperia L's eight megapixels." Is the Ultra's sensor not backside-illuminated, maybe? The L also has a flash.
On the other hand, CNET is disappointed in its low-light performance. Trusted Reviews agrees, saying "Indoors, the Sony Xperia L camera is affected by yet more issues. While the camera takes balanced, good-looking photos in bright, natural light, in dim indoor lighting the white balance is off, resulting in ugly yellow tinged photos. The inbuilt flash does little to help, either." They say it does have "many positives, including a pleasing colour balance, sharp focus in shots".
PC World is generally happy with the Ascend G6's camera, saying "photo performance is generally strong — especially when you keep the Huawei’s price in mind — but we did encounter signs of flaring and feathering during testing. Image noise is present, but its at a low level, while the on-board HDR mode does a decent job at capturing detail that is otherwise lost."
These do take into consideration the price of the phones, however - they're both much cheaper than the Ultra was at launch.
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Solid research John and Triflot. Thank you.
Personally, I will be happy if the camera works at all with unlocked bl.
You want me to put the hammer down?
Deleted
leonbarroso said:
Do as I did - buy a semipro camera on blackfriday
Serious photography with smartphone is bull****
And I am a former Lumia 1020 owner
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Why does it have to be 'serious' photography? I have many dedicated cameras from 1in sensor size up to professional full frame setups but none of those cameras are small enough to keep in my trouser pockets all the time, I tried recently going for one of the smallest dedicated cameras I could find but even that was irritating to carry in my trouser pockets alongside the phone. My phone on the other hand is always in my pocket and always to hand so it's ready to go any time when I want to take a photo unexpectedly plus its online connection means the photo is immediately ready to upload the photo if I want to as well. Some of my dedicated cameras have wifi for transferring photos but it's still a fiddle in comparison.
I don't need an amazing camera but I'm just disappointed how poor the Z ultra camera is, I find I use it like an older camera phone where it was only really handy for capturing serial numbers or information I need to quickly jot down whereas I used the Galaxy Note as a camera a fair bit and while the quality can't match the dedicated cameras it could produce reasonable pictures. I'm seriously considering going for a Note 4 and taking the hit on the screen size to get the better camera, it will be a few months before prices are reasonable so that's time to see if Sony announce anything (which I seriously doubt) or anyone else offers anything interesting with a larger screen.
With regards to the Z Ultra sensor, I'm surprised it is BSI as I thought I'd read initially when considering the phone that Sony had taken an older sensor and rebadged it as Exmor RS which made sense. There's not many sources for the camera module but the few I can find agree with Wikipedia as do sources for the Huawei and the Xperia L, is there any way to verify this in software on a Z Ultra? With regards to photo quality on the Xperia L and the Huawei G6, I am surprised by the positive comments even allowing for them being budget phones and the G6 having a faster lens (F2 rather than F2.4 on the Sony's). Then again some of the reviews of the Z Ultra aren't that hard on the camera either so it's difficult to tell objectively, DXOmark haven't tested it (admittedly I'm not convinced by their testing anyway) nor have I seen any particularly objective testing.
John
Hi,
A camera is a very important factor for me when buying a phone,
I bought my Redmi Note 3 after reading some underwhelming reviews about the camera, thinking "oh well, how bad can the rear camera be?" - well, the camera is really under performing, very soft images, noticeable noise in almost every scenario, very disappointing.
My question is that,
Is it really a hardware issue, or just poor camera algorithms coding?
if the former, I will just look for another phone and sell mine,
otherwise, I will (try to) wait patiently until the appropriate software update will come
Thanks
check this out
https://www.reddit.com/r/Xiaomi/comments/5ci866/why_do_people_mock_the_redmi_note_3_camera_it/
Camera is nothing but decent , specially at natural light conditions.it seems great at night condition without flash due to low aperture.miui 8 greatly improved my camera experience.i found alomost zero noise in night shots. Enough for a $200 phone
I think it takes good pictures but I found that any kind of motion will blur the picture (even just walking and snapping a pic), so motion sucks, try taking a picture of a moving dog it will just be a blur, low light also sucks, but if you take still pictures under good lighting pictures look great, I think there is a soft spot for this camera it's just hard to find, also lowering the resolution to 12MP will take 16:9 widescreen photos rather then 4:3 photos in 16MP mode
Part of the problem is it never wants to increase the shutter speed properly in order to keep iso low. It tends to take most pictures at 1/25th or so, which is great for static but not for moving objects where you need a faster shutter speed to freeze motion.
ferez said:
Hi,
A camera is a very important factor for me when buying a phone,
I bought my Redmi Note 3 after reading some underwhelming reviews about the camera, thinking "oh well, how bad can the rear camera be?" - well, the camera is really under performing, very soft images, noticeable noise in almost every scenario, very disappointing.
My question is that,
Is it really a hardware issue, or just poor camera algorithms coding?
if the former, I will just look for another phone and sell mine,
otherwise, I will (try to) wait patiently until the appropriate software update will come
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
low light shots are average.
daytime shots are great.
did you tweak the default settings?
which ROM are you on?....try to be on latest MM dev or china rom
also try using open camera.
at this price range, show me a phone which gives better images?
I tried all the tweaks available including using Open Camera, nothing really helped.
I ended up selling it and buying an Mi4C - the difference in photo quality is unbelievable (at a price of around 90$ new)
Had 7 different smart phones this year, and Redmi Note's camera was the weakest among them, for me it's very noticeable.
At the club, at the bar, or just in your mom's basement, nighttime is when you come out to play. Rate this thread to express how the Xiaomi Mi A1's camera performs when no or low light is present. A higher rating indicates that the camera sensor "sees" lots of light in dim conditions, and that the resulting photos have minimal noise. A higher rating also indicates that when the flash fires, the resulting photo is evenly-lit without any bright spots.
Then, drop a comment if you have anything to add!
Low light need Improvement
Low light is pretty week. Camera app is slow to capture and subjects need to be dead still to produce a usable picture
well overall device is great only weak spot is camera in low light outside in daylight camera performs great but in absence of light there is tons of noise it's like a 3 mp camera image don't know whether a software update can fix that and when mi will provide that or just camera sensor is not capable. i think xiaomi should have asked google to modify camera app also
In low light the cam is more or less unusable.
Yeah, we know the problem. It is not camera itself issue, it is camera app.
Low light performance is just Terrible, no escuses for that.
Low light camera performance is nowhere. Not even low light even in indoor location camera sucks.
Low light photography with the inbuilt Mi-ported camera app is terrible. Pictures clicked had a high amount of noise in manual mode and focusing too was bad. In the HDR mode and with flash, pictures had unrealistic tinge and destroyed the quality. The Portrait Mode works comparatively better however the light entering the photo lens somewhat decreased.
Overall, the app itself needs improvements. The hardware is more or lese fine.
Hardware camera is good for its price. I compared side to side with my old Samsung A710 (f/1.9 vs f/2.2), and the stock camera APP beats the samsung hands down. In low light, Xiaomi pics are darker but with more details. Samsung night mode makes brighter images, but more blurry and with more noise.
Then, if you root (systemless with magisk works great) and use the ported Google Camera then it's a completely different world... Pics become even brighter and more detailed. Different versions could give smoother images or more detailed but noisier ones, up to your choice.
We can't compare vs an Iphone or S8 camera ofc... but in its mid-tier range camera is great for everyday usage.
PS. Using Oreo build, never tried Nougat stock cam.
The Mi camera app considered good enough, though I admit the low light photos are terrible. What's more worst is that the HDR image is really bad compared to non-HDR in quality.
sideport with GCam HDR+ whichever version that suit you.. then have fun with it, if you're not satisfied with the result then it is time to use a DSLR with a 50mm 1.4 or the L series 1.2 for those low light moments.. :angel:
For me, the build is just okay, I'm like holding my OnePlus 3T.
kamrul.auntu said:
Low light camera performance is nowhere. Not even low light even in indoor location camera sucks.
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to me its not that bad , use google camera , lowlight photo seems better than stock camera
But the front camera is really bad whether it's gcam or stock. Most of the time it produces blurry images.
Rakibboss said:
But the front camera is really bad whether it's gcam or stock. Most of the time it produces blurry images.
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from my perspective and experience, the front camera with only a 5 MP resolution, using the GCam resulted in a much much better sharp and crisp image.. especially the portrait mode.. (compared to the stock camera app)
it goes back to HOW we take our photographs, steady hands and a moment (around 2-3 seconds while it process the picture) and I never took only one shot, I took many shots then pick which is the best, delete others..
wawing_b said:
from my perspective and experience, the front camera with only a 5 MP resolution, using the GCam resulted in a much much better sharp and crisp image.. especially the portrait mode.. (compared to the stock camera app)
it goes back to HOW we take our photographs, steady hands and a moment (around 2-3 seconds while it process the picture) and I never took only one shot, I took many shots then pick which is the best, delete others..
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During low light i can't have a good group selfie neither from stock nor from gcam. Most of the time it's blurry.
Rakibboss said:
During low light i can't have a good group selfie neither from stock nor from gcam. Most of the time it's blurry.
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have you tried using the GCam with flash?
if you have, then there's nothing at the moment an option that I could recommend using :angel:
while using the GCam, let the auto focus (the circle thing) do it's work untill it dissapear.. then press the shutter :fingers-crossed:
I really don't understand. The camera module itself is pretty capable, but the software is putting it back. God I hope G Cam supports dual lens.
Is bad, is real bad
Sony Xperia 5 II:
* standard camera, no tinkering
* pro camera, auto mode
* pro camera, P mode with HDR, no other tinkering
Oneplus 6:
* standard camera
* Marco's GCam 6.1 MJL v3.7 Miniflex, day mode, AWB off, no other tinkering
(Sorry for the un-professionality of the shots and the general mess.)
I'm finding the Xperia 5II camera and pro camera... underwhelming to say the least. I'm sure that pro camera, used by people who are used to more complex non-smartphone cameras can give great photos, but to less camera-savvy people like me the results are... terrible. Coming from a great gcam port that basically performed perfectly right out of the box (big kudos to Marco's amazing work), I find it pretty disappointing to see this.
I can only hope that a good gcam port comes out fast.
(The Xperia otherwise is a pretty darn good phone imho, aside from some minor annoying things that hopefully will be improved/fixed in next updates.)
(x-posted from my thread on r/SonyXperia)
I don't understand why everyone is praising the xperia cameras. They are just not as good as many other phones. I come from an s10 plus and pictures were just better on the s10, especially in low light. My real issue is that there is NO way to take 16:9 video with manual focus (or even tap to focus) on either the simple camera app or the pro: The simple camera doesn't have manual focus and the pro is locked at 21:9 for some reason... This is simple functionality, yet Sony in their all "camera wisdom" couldn't provide it on any of their apps....
I agree that a good (or at least functional) gcam port is our only hope (as is for any xperia device). Sony is full of marketing BS on every xperia release about their cameras and somehow they always manage to be underwhelming and a few generations behind.
palamosteliaro said:
I don't understand why everyone is praising the xperia cameras. They are just not as good as many other phones. I come from an s10 plus and pictures were just better on the s10, especially in low light. My real issue is that there is NO way to take 16:9 video with manual focus (or even tap to focus) on either the simple camera app or the pro: The simple camera doesn't have manual focus and the pro is locked at 21:9 for some reason... This is simple functionality, yet Sony in their all "camera wisdom" couldn't provide it on any of their apps....
I agree that a good (or at least functional) gcam port is our only hope (as is for any xperia device). Sony is full of marketing BS on every xperia release about their cameras and somehow they always manage to be underwhelming and a few generations behind.
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I like them because the colors are almost accurate and not blown up....
But everyone to their own i guess
yekollu said:
I like them because the colors are almost accurate and not blown up....
But everyone to their own i guess
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I wasn't talking about colors, colors are subjective and everyone has different taste. Noise however, isn't. You can zoom on both pictures and see that the 5 ii has more noise and "blurriness" compared to the oneplus. And this has been a tradition with xperia phones as long as I remember. Always a few generations behind on image clarity. I don't think anyone likes noise on their pictures... Professional reviews are misleading, since they are usually done in good (or even professional) lighting on a stand, so they are not representative of real life. If you are not a ...tourist, most of your pictures will be indoors and/or in random lighting scenarios with auto settings, on your hand, for a fast and easy picture. Xperia phones produce the worst results in those real life scenarios every time. If you want to take pictures on a stand, after tinkering with settings for the best results, you should be using a DSLR not a phone imo.
KiraV said:
Sony Xperia 5 II:
* standard camera, no tinkering
* pro camera, auto mode
* pro camera, P mode with HDR, no other tinkering
Oneplus 6:
* standard camera
* Marco's GCam 6.1 MJL v3.7 Miniflex, day mode, AWB off, no other tinkering
(Sorry for the un-professionality of the shots and the general mess.)
I'm finding the Xperia 5II camera and pro camera... underwhelming to say the least. I'm sure that pro camera, used by people who are used to more complex non-smartphone cameras can give great photos, but to less camera-savvy people like me the results are... terrible. Coming from a great gcam port that basically performed perfectly right out of the box (big kudos to Marco's amazing work), I find it pretty disappointing to see this.
I can only hope that a good gcam port comes out fast.
(The Xperia otherwise is a pretty darn good phone imho, aside from some minor annoying things that hopefully will be improved/fixed in next updates.)
(x-posted from my thread on r/SonyXperia)
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I've just compared both standard photos.
IMHO
* Xperia colors are more natural (more red/blue, OnePlus has more green)
* I can see more noise on OnePlus and more sharp edges, seems a bit artificial
* Xperia photo is less sharp/more soft, especially in the background. Not sure but it may be related with bigger sensor and lower DoF
Are both photos were taken on the same day/the same time ? The posters in background are different
I have both the 7pro and the 5ii and the 5ii is way more satisfying with photos for me, my experience is completely the opposite. I will say the biggest downside is consistency with the sony camera, but when it takes a great shot it is significantly more satisfying than a lucky 7pro shot and it should be since the sensor is better.
palamosteliaro said:
I wasn't talking about colors, colors are subjective and everyone has different taste. Noise however, isn't. You can zoom on both pictures and see that the 5 ii has more noise and "blurriness" compared to the oneplus. And this has been a tradition with xperia phones as long as I remember. Always a few generations behind on image clarity. I don't think anyone likes noise on their pictures... Professional reviews are misleading, since they are usually done in good (or even professional) lighting on a stand, so they are not representative of real life. If you are not a ...tourist, most of your pictures will be indoors and/or in random lighting scenarios with auto settings, on your hand, for a fast and easy picture. Xperia phones produce the worst results in those real life scenarios every time. If you want to take pictures on a stand, after tinkering with settings for the best results, you should be using a DSLR not a phone imo.
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I'm not sure what photos you've been looking at but the Xperia is completely smooth compared to the OnePlus. Yes, the Xperia is also a bit softer because of the shallower DoF and because of less aggressive sharpening which Sony is known to do. But based on those photos I'd take the Sony any day.
I have to say that coming from OnePlus 6 into Sony Xperia 5 II I totally agree that the camera in standard mode the OnePlus performs better.. but the manual mode in the Sony Xperia if you know about photography it definitely out performs the OnePlus 6.. I'll recommend reducing the brightness in the standard mode and you will see a better quality pic in the Sony Xperia.
zwirek75 said:
I've just compared both standard photos.
IMHO
* Xperia colors are more natural (more red/blue, OnePlus has more green)
* I can see more noise on OnePlus and more sharp edges, seems a bit artificial
* Xperia photo is less sharp/more soft, especially in the background. Not sure but it may be related with bigger sensor and lower DoF
Are both photos were taken on the same day/the same time ? The posters in background are different
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Same day, same time, around 10 minutes difference I think? What's the difference you're seeing? The Xperia makes everything much more pink-ish, if that's what you're referring to. Imho from how the light was irl the gcam got the most accurate colours, my room does have a kinda "washed out" light when it's cloudy and the lights are off.
Also why would I lie? I got accused of lying and about the irl colors on the Xperia reddit thread ("do you have green light? " when these were made without turning the light on...), now you're saying the background looks different... What would I even gain by lying, I'm not a pro, I don't get money, I'm not even a reviewer, just a rando posting a simple comparison of what I saw and instead I got insulted and accused of lying... for simply stating my opinion? Wtf. I just wanted to make a comparison before selling my old OP6, that's all. I did the comparison, I sold the op6, I'm happy with the Xperia, I'm just disappointed by the camera. Simple camera app is too simple, the Pro one is too complex and even after days of watching tutorials I can manage to get decent pictures only outdoors with a good light... which might be great for a photographer - but if I was a photographer I would use an actual camera tbh -, but for normal real life situations in which you don't have time to configure everything (especially if you want to take pictures of animals - i.e. my cats) and the light 90% of the times is not perfect... the Xperia performed worse imho.
EDIT: btw here's your proof. Luckily I sent the pics via Bluetooth to the new phone before selling the old one.
luis.manuel.cb said:
I have to say that coming from OnePlus 6 into Sony Xperia 5 II I totally agree that the camera in standard mode the OnePlus performs better.. but the manual mode in the Sony Xperia if you know about photography it definitely out performs the OnePlus 6.. I'll recommend reducing the brightness in the standard mode and you will see a better quality pic in the Sony Xperia.
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I didn't even noticed that I could reduce the brightness in standard mode, now I feel really dumb. Still, I would replace any day standard camera app with Marco's GCam...
KiraV said:
Same day, same time, around 10 minutes difference I think? What's the difference you're seeing? The Xperia makes everything much more pink-ish, if that's what you're referring to. Imho from how the light was irl the gcam got the most accurate colours, my room does have a kinda "washed out" light when it's cloudy and the lights are off.
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Apologies, I just took these background pictures as different, but its the same picture presuming different time.
My mistake.
As an avid photographer with a nice collection of bodies and lenses, I will say that I'm pleased with the pictures from the 5 II. I picked one up a few weeks ago to replace my P30 Pro. I definitely get better pictures from the Pro app than the Standard camera app. But, since I have a Sony ILC, I like the familiar interface, and you can learn to get good pictures from it quickly.
KiraV said:
Sony Xperia 5 II:
* standard camera, no tinkering
* pro camera, auto mode
* pro camera, P mode with HDR, no other tinkering
Oneplus 6:
* standard camera
* Marco's GCam 6.1 MJL v3.7 Miniflex, day mode, AWB off, no other tinkering
(Sorry for the un-professionality of the shots and the general mess.)
I'm finding the Xperia 5II camera and pro camera... underwhelming to say the least. I'm sure that pro camera, used by people who are used to more complex non-smartphone cameras can give great photos, but to less camera-savvy people like me the results are... terrible. Coming from a great gcam port that basically performed perfectly right out of the box (big kudos to Marco's amazing work), I find it pretty disappointing to see this.
I can only hope that a good gcam port comes out fast.
(The Xperia otherwise is a pretty darn good phone imho, aside from some minor annoying things that hopefully will be improved/fixed in next updates.)
(x-posted from my thread on r/SonyXperia)
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I'm coming from an OP6 and couldn't agree with you more. The 5ii auto focus on objects less than 6ft away is unbelievably bad. The detail in the 5ii pics are underwhelming compared to the OP6 GCAM.
I've decided to take my OP6 with me when I know I'm going to be taking pics.
Though it's off topic I totally regret getting the 5ii and could happily go back to my OP6. Gonna sell 5ii and get the next OnePlus when it comes out.
cdkg said:
I'm coming from an OP6 and couldn't agree with you more. The 5ii auto focus on objects less than 6ft away is unbelievably bad. The detail in the 5ii pics are underwhelming compared to the OP6 GCAM.
I've decided to take my OP6 with me when I know I'm going to be taking pics.
Though it's off topic I totally regret getting the 5ii and could happily go back to my OP6. Gonna sell 5ii and get the next OnePlus when it comes out.
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Well, you are not pro camera user. If you had any Sony DSLR you would know. Everything is in manual mode, not auto mode. The same situation is on Sony phones. I have XPERIA 1 II and after many updates photos from Camera app auto mode is much better, but still not good as iPhone 12 Pro Max auto mode. When I use Program Auto or Manual Exposure in Photo Pro and adjust setting result is different. Photos are much better taken with XPERIA 1 II. So, why did you buy XPERIA 5 II if you are not pro camera user? Sony philosophy is if you want to take full advantage from sensor and camera, use Photo Pro app : Auto mode for social networks, Program Auto if you are begginer, Shutter Priority for fast moving objects and Manual Exposure if you are camera pro user. Memory Recall is just for most used settings values and modes.
I've actually been pleased with low light photo quality of the standard camera app. Very close to my P30 Pro.
Unfortunately I completely agree that OP somehow delivers better photos than overhyped, much more expensive Xperia 5 II. I've got my Xperia 5 II just few days ago (didn't see the warning "For Pro Photographers only" on the box or anywhere else). Compared to my "old" Pixel 4, I'm disappointed so far. I clearly see that Pixel makes better pictures with zero efforts in all situations regardless of shakeness of my hands and photo skills. Certainly Xperia has focusing issues in some situations. I struggled to focus on objects with Xperia whereas I didn't with Pixel 4 at the same time. Xperia photos look soft / less sharp, blurry in not ideal conditions, hit or miss experience damn to often, horrible selfie camera etc. Going to spend some time with this phone (one month or so), give Xperia a chance to shine and then decide what to do. Thankfully I didn't sell my Pixel 4 yet...
It's all subjective, but to me the Xperia wins here. To my eyes the exposure is better, the white balance is better, the colors are more natural and overall it has a more realistic rendition (not overly sharpened). And the subtle bokeh its larger sensor gets is just icing on the cake.
Sony goes for naturalistic processing which I appreciate. People used to Samsung's bold processing might be let down initially.
u bought a phone has camera,not a camera which calls
A. With the plethora of resources I don't know why anyone would buy a Sony Xperia and be surprised at what they get. I wasn't. I looked at a lot of YouTube videos about Sony Xperias.
B. "U bought a phone has camera, not a camera which calls." I think I understand what you're saying but I'm not sure you're qualified to say what anyone bought except yourself. I was late to phones because I'm quite deaf and don't do phone calls but I'm also old and got tired of toting cameras and lens. I had a Pixel that took great photos and then a Huawei P30 that also took great photos but I was missing taking photos. I'm sure the phone was having fun but I wasn't. Their "pro" mode sucked. For example, in pro mode, their little white icons disappeared when I was taking photos on the white sand of the beach at Huatulco or the white stone pavement in Oaxaca. Now, I enjoy taking photos again with my Xperia.
C. If you want AI to take photos for you, don't get a Sony Xperia. If you actually enjoy photography, you might enjoy having a Sony Xperia. This is a Sony Xperia forum so I don't mind posting my opinion but I am in no way denigrating those who enjoy iPhones or Pixels or Pocos. Choices are great.
patrickt said:
A. With the plethora of resources I don't know why anyone would buy a Sony Xperia and be surprised at what they get. I wasn't. I looked at a lot of YouTube videos about Sony Xperias.
B. "U bought a phone has camera, not a camera which calls." I think I understand what you're saying but I'm not sure you're qualified to say what anyone bought except yourself. I was late to phones because I'm quite deaf and don't do phone calls but I'm also old and got tired of toting cameras and lens. I had a Pixel that took great photos and then a Huawei P30 that also took great photos but I was missing taking photos. I'm sure the phone was having fun but I wasn't. Their "pro" mode sucked. For example, in pro mode, their little white icons disappeared when I was taking photos on the white sand of the beach at Huatulco or the white stone pavement in Oaxaca. Now, I enjoy taking photos again with my Xperia.
C. If you want AI to take photos for you, don't get a Sony Xperia. If you actually enjoy photography, you might enjoy having a Sony Xperia. This is a Sony Xperia forum so I don't mind posting my opinion but I am in no way denigrating those who enjoy iPhones or Pixels or Pocos. Choices are great.
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i was surperised that someone really reply like i offend anyone.However, i am more pro sony than oneplus(even i had oneplus 1). Now i am holding Xperia5ii which i am satisfied the most in any android phone(sizewise Iphone12&13mini is better).
i personally buy this phone for its size which onehand controls fine.But more than that I prefer unlock the bootloader and put aosp roms instead of offical that drains the battery fast and laggy some how. So i may not buy this phone for the photos but can anyone buy this phone for other reasons?i dont think i am qualified to say the reason what anyone buys neither you are. But i think forum is a free place for any ideas and any opinions i assume. Good day with ur xperia although we love xperia for different reasons.