Please be gentle with the Noob.... - Android Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting

I haven't any idea where else to post this question. I'm an Army Vet. Massive PTSD and other psychiatric liabilities. I mention that as a preface to saying I don't get out of the house (well, Boat, actually much. However, I am always very intellectually active. I am fascinated and enthralled by my study of Android in particular and computing in general. I've been like a trained monkey on computers since they arrived on the scene. But the last year I am slowly becoming a geek (small 'g', please). I've taught myself rooting and a few other tricks, but in utter isolation. This site is my gold standard for information. The amount of time and energy that the senior and junior members pour into this site is truly amazing. Thanks.
Question - how would one go about finding a local mentor. I would like to find someone to discuss things with in person. This would, I know from my years at various universities, put wings on my otherwise slow learning curve. I've thought about going to the local university (in Portland, Oregon, otherwise known as the coolest, most Hip city on the Left Coast) but, as I say above, this is difficult. So, if anyone can throw me a bone in this regard, my finger will ache from hitting the 'thanks' button repeatedly. Again, to all you contributors, you Dudes are awesome, to say the very least. Your passion for all things Android is showing beneath you skirts .
Jodie

Related

The most elaborate uses you have seen or done with the XDA!

Inspired by another post; I was wondering just what are people using their XDA's to do. I'll go first. This one's not my most productive application nor noble use of the device but it should get the ball rolling :mrgreen:
My friend was obsessed with this girl who wouldn't give him the time of day. So I recorded a conversation her and I had and emailed it to my friend via inbox for his personal collection :shock: (not proud ) but the things we do in the war of love for our friends suffering :roll:
I don't know what's unhealthier that he keeps a personal collection :shock: or that I would participate or encourage such behavior :shock: how old am I :roll: anyways boys will be boys :mrgreen:
(I just know I'm going to get a call from an Attorney tomorrow ....of all the websites she could read it will have to be this one:roll
Anyways I though that would be a good starter I actually pretty much push the device to it's limits in my day to day use of it as a business tool. I've been running a virtual office starting with Psion Devices back in 1991. I hadn't even graduated high school yet :shock: Over the years in the Entertainment Industry from 16 until now I developed a reputation of being the guy with the newest coolest gadgets, but they have always been strictly powerful tools to me giving me an edge on the competition. Sadly before other programs & Outlook became the predominant backup of your digital rolodex cards, I lost YEARS of acquired resources & Hundreds of numbers to a coin-cell battery drain one day . At one point in 1995 a producer, my boss! stole :shock: my latest Psion (he use to joke that the entire entertainment industry was in that little black book of mine), to get the information out of it. I was just a lowly intern :shock:.
At the time there was only really the hard way, by hand. So he denied it for weeks, finally gave up on what a monolithic task it was and it suddenly appeared in my desk drawer again:roll: I hadn't realized what I managed to achieve, something that at the time was unheard of. The paper equivalent couldn't be carried around with you nor the information accessible in a timely manner. It may very well have been the first portable/pocketable database/resource on the entertainment industry created :?: It's a total shame it was lost It would have been nice to show people what extraordinary accomplishments even the earliest of these devices could achieve. People still look at me funny as if all I'm carrying around is a calculator/cellphone combo. These devices still aren't even realized! :| I waited 11+ years for the XDA and I can almost taste the future of what I've been waiting for these devices to be able to do. OK I have to stop salivating now there is a Geek Crown waiting for me somewhere
I am just disappointed that 11 years ago the things I could do with these devices shocked people, as if it was some sort of parlor or unobtainable magic trick. Now 11 years latter companies and individuals still have no clue what they have in there hands or how to apply it. My parents to this day say "What do you want to be if you grow up?", but I refuse to surrendered my fascination with the future, my willingness to work hard to implement constant change and adaptation as an advancement to allow change as a whole to remain a good thing in my life. We have really gotten lazy. Change is only welcome if it is "so" user friendly that it does not require us to change the way we do anything, and only requires the illusion of more efficiency ok where's that geek crown
But seriously, what are the coolest things you've done with your XDA
This is a hotbed of super-geek infestation 8) lets hear the paces you've put this baby through :!:
That's freaking hilarious! Wonder if I know the girl.... I live over in Glendale.... doubt it but it is a small world!!
You live in Glendale?! :shock: She just moved to the valley :shock: ......you're not her attorney...
I'm surprised more people didn't want to share what they use their XDA for Maybe it's there are much worse uses than can be posted :shock: Do tell everyone. I'm a pretty conservative guy so I can only imagine what stories are out there :mrgreen: 8)
Well what to say.. You read my thought aloud

How do you develop stuff?

I've been wondering how the devs develope stuff for phones. How would you go about making a device support a new OS type? Is here a type of code you guys follow? How does it work?
Sent from the best phone in the world Galaxy Note!!!
depends what ypu want to do. otherwise everything deals with a lot of coding
That didn't answer my questions at all...
Sent from the best phone in the world Galaxy Note!!!
Here is google's knowledge base for developing Android software. Not easy to understand if you have never been exposed to software development but hey, it's a start. Plenty of other places on the web.
http://developer.android.com/index.html
software development takes special skills...and time...but if interested the best way is to dive in, start reading and figure it out.
Majority of developers I know are self-learners and like to explore and figure things out, test, try again, fail, try again, learn, etc.
andrawer said:
software development takes special skills...and time...but if interested the best way is to dive in, start reading and figure it out.
Majority of developers I know are self-learners and like to explore and figure things out, test, try again, fail, try again, learn, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^^^^ Good answer. Most people interested in development roll their sleeves up and get busy. They don't just start a thread and wait for the answer. Oh, and they also don't crap on the first answer that they get, either. But good luck. Maybe we'll see some of your work here some day.
I was going to chime in and explain it as best I could, but after seeing how you replied to the first answer, I decided not to. I'll let you find the answer on your own. If you can't do this, you can't develop.
kimtyson said:
. . . Most people interested in development roll their sleeves up and get busy. They don't just start a thread and wait for the answer. Oh, and they also don't crap on the first answer that they get, either.
. . .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1.
Sent from my Galaxy S II (i777)
andrawer's answer was useful, xavier's answer was useless, and the answers after his sucked donkey balls.
I've been programming since 1986. I've mentored lots of newbies and some need a little handholding at first, some jump in right from the start. andrawer pointed him in the right direction... if 6 months from now he still needs handholding then its time to reconsider. Until then, don't be an asshole.
I decided to get into programming for Android as well. I bought the book, Java A Beginner's Guide. I have no experience on any language but I will get into that book and hopefully learn Java. Should I take classes as well or book will be enough for me to learn and advance in Java?
techntrek said:
andrawer's answer was useful, xavier's answer was useless, and the answers after his sucked donkey balls.
I've been programming since 1986. I've mentored lots of newbies and some need a little handholding at first, some jump in right from the start. andrawer pointed him in the right direction... if 6 months from now he still needs handholding then its time to reconsider. Until then, don't be an asshole.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As a peer who began programming back in the days of Fortran77 and Pascal, I have to interject with somewhat of a different perspective. The original question(s) were vague, a tad confusing, too broad, and above all else, completely off topic to this particular forum.
Granted, the first answer should have been to point him towards educating himself on the various pieces that make a phone operational, but more importantly, to learn design, development, various programming languages and how they're applied to mobile technology.
With that said, the first appearance of name calling was with your post. As senior citizens in the confines of XDA it's really expected that we lead by example. Are there going to be wise-butt remarks, those that are useless, and some that are on the crass side? Sure.. but lets leave that to the kids who aren't quite as experienced and mature.
JoeDV said:
As a peer who began programming back in the days of Fortran77 and Pascal, I have to interject with somewhat of a different perspective. The original question(s) were vague, a tad confusing, too broad, and above all else, completely off topic to this particular forum.
Granted, the first answer should have been to point him towards educating himself on the various pieces that make a phone operational, but more importantly, to learn design, development, various programming languages and how they're applied to mobile technology.
With that said, the first appearance of name calling was with your post. As senior citizens in the confines of XDA it's really expected that we lead by example. Are there going to be wise-butt remarks, those that are useless, and some that are on the crass side? Sure.. but lets leave that to the kids who aren't quite as experienced and mature.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1000
nice call Joe
but man....."senior citizens"? I don't think I've ever been called a senior citizen, pushing 40 here but man....LOL. But I get your analogy
Middle age, yes, senior citizen... not yet. Although relative to 95% of the members of this site, we are probably ancients.
Just irks me when I see someone show the beginnings of an interest in the profession (or hobby) and the responses are snarky and unhelpful. I see it all the time, not just on this thread.
As for off-topic, not really. This forum is all about apps and OSes, all of which start with code. An interest in learning how to code is the first step.

[Q] Connecting to my laptop, removing old drivers

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I have had several go arounds with this problem. I finally got past it by a very odd maneuver. Yes, I am using Win7 (there are more than one version so I want to leap to the conclusion that some versions act differently).
Anyway I followed the second method of getting the drivers to load listed in "tips and tricks" stickey (modify Device Manager so hidden devices/drivers can be seen and deleted, I had over a hundred driver in at least four different locations to delete). When I observed the right type of device show up in Device Manager I pull the USB cable, crashing the install (on my PC the cable was only connected for between 1-2 seconds). Hopefully in the USB driver area there is a new composite device which I believe is needed. I then fired up the root script the instant I reconnect the device. Yes, PnP does take off again but the script is running too and it worked!
I can't say if I ever got the drivers in the nroot directory to load. I must have tried this a hundred times before I stumbled onto the crash the install by pulling the cable move. So in my Device Manager the new Nook had a working driver.
The other thing you need to be sure of is that you set USB debug switch and unselect the automount switch; which must be done everytime the Nook is turn on even if when you check they appear to be set you need to cycle through and reset them. I used the hidden keys application (Play Store), which works and has a built in OTA blocker along with a bunch of other stuff.
Good luck, let us know how it goes!

Outcry to the Community

Hello All,
In recent events we saw our primary kernel developer completely drop his project and leave. This is a sad thing, but it could have been prevented on both sides. It seems that there has lately been a huge misunderstanding of what working with a community means and what open source means, it is tearing the community as a whole apart.
I. USERS/TESTERS: (this is the part most of us know about)
This can roughly refer to anyone that is not a developer or submitting code, but it can also refer to developers using ROMs or Kernels produced by other developers. Anyone in this position needs to realize that almost ALL Roms/Kernels/Themes are experimental even if considered "stable". There is a reason that on both Rootzwiki and XDA it is common to see developers stating they are not responsible for any damage done to your device or your data.
Device problems will differ from one device to another due to security implementations or new code/hardware or even something else. It needs to be understood that a kernel/Rom release that has bugs may NOT be due to code written by the dev, but by an inherent flaw in the hardware OR the stock code.
What does this mean to you?
Well, in order to function as effectively as possible a general guideline should be followed.
Be Tactful - Lets face it, there are going to be issues with ROMs and Kernels. There will never be a truly 'stable' release. Try to report issues in a polite and friendly manner. If you disagree with a developer, you can let them know, just be sure to be as tactful as possible, also make sure to provide adequate reports and detail.
Detail, Detail, Detail - Many of the newer folks don't know how to access logfiles, but this shouldn't stop you from being detailed. When an issue is come across, make sure to include as much detail as possible. For clarification, ANYTHING that is changed from stock configuration should be considered. For kernels, it is good to include any and all adjustments you have made. If a log can be pulled, DO IT, it won't hurt and the developer has an easier time figuring it all out.
Try to learn - The development community is a big place. By learning, you verify that you can help other newbies down the line, and that you provide more assistance to developers.
II. Developers: (the part less of us know about)
Ah, developers, without all of you, we wouldn't exist. Someone needs to do the work, and you provide the dedication and time. Most of us can't thank you enough. However, it seems that recently a lot of the developers are developing for the wrong reasons and are doing things against the very ideals we all stand for.
When developing with a community, ALL developers sign a non-verbal social contract. This contract includes many things.
- You are going to deal with some harassment (can be mitigated by mods) - Some people have bad days, others are asshats.
- Younger members will take you for granted
- Younger members will have difficulty providing detail
- The community will expect support for your product(s)
- Other developers (mostly new developers) will not credit you for your work occasionally (can be mitigated by mods)
All these things and more should be expected when working with a community. As a developer, you need to accept ALL of these things in order to contribute to making the community a healthy place.
Eventually, a developer must leave a device and move forward for WHATEVER reason they choose. This is inevitable, but in order to provide a healthy development cycle a developer should ALWAYS provide their source code for a time after development has stopped. This way projects can live on with other developers or be forked entirely.
MY COMMENTS ON TODAY:
DSB9938 - You are a fantastic developer and I urge you not to leave. I do believe you are misguided in pulling all your code and preventing others from forking or continuing your work. It goes against all that open source is about. You signed the social contract and you couldn't handle the terms, you wronged the community by breaking the trust you had developed.
Dr_Drache - Seriously? Kicking me from the AndIRC #droid-dna chat because you don't agree with what I say here? Did I step on your ego much? Stopping your s-off development because of all of this as well? You are whats wrong with the developers side of the community. God forbid someone disagree's with you, you either kick them or pull your project entirely. Go develop for Microsoft or some other proprietary company. You have forgotten about what the community really means and what open source is about.
Everyone else - We can pull through this. I have already started researching to pick up kernel development. It will be slow since DSB refuses to assist, but it can certainly be done.
Mods - We can't afford to lose more developers. We have to stop the harassment.
I agree with your post except the parts directed to DSB and Drache because it is a continuation of the feud. Let's just wipe the slate clean and follow the other parts of your comments because they are good guidelines on how to interact with each other.
th3raid0r said:
Hello All,
In recent events we saw our primary kernel developer completely drop his project and leave. This is a sad thing, but it could have been prevented on both sides. It seems that there has lately been a huge misunderstanding of what working with a community means and what open source means, it is tearing the community as a whole apart.
I. USERS/TESTERS: (this is the part most of us know about)
This can roughly refer to anyone that is not a developer or submitting code, but it can also refer to developers using ROMs or Kernels produced by other developers. Anyone in this position needs to realize that almost ALL Roms/Kernels/Themes are experimental even if considered "stable". There is a reason that on both Rootzwiki and XDA it is common to see developers stating they are not responsible for any damage done to your device or your data.
Device problems will differ from one device to another due to security implementations or new code/hardware or even something else. It needs to be understood that a kernel/Rom release that has bugs may NOT be due to code written by the dev, but by an inherent flaw in the hardware OR the stock code.
What does this mean to you?
Well, in order to function as effectively as possible a general guideline should be followed.
Be Tactful - Lets face it, there are going to be issues with ROMs and Kernels. There will never be a truly 'stable' release. Try to report issues in a polite and friendly manner. If you disagree with a developer, you can let them know, just be sure to be as tactful as possible, also make sure to provide adequate reports and detail.
Detail, Detail, Detail - Many of the newer folks don't know how to access logfiles, but this shouldn't stop you from being detailed. When an issue is come across, make sure to include as much detail as possible. For clarification, ANYTHING that is changed from stock configuration should be considered. For kernels, it is good to include any and all adjustments you have made. If a log can be pulled, DO IT, it won't hurt and the developer has an easier time figuring it all out.
Try to learn - The development community is a big place. By learning, you verify that you can help other newbies down the line, and that you provide more assistance to developers.
II. Developers: (the part less of us know about)
Ah, developers, without all of you, we wouldn't exist. Someone needs to do the work, and you provide the dedication and time. Most of us can't thank you enough. However, it seems that recently a lot of the developers are developing for the wrong reasons and are doing things against the very ideals we all stand for.
When developing with a community, ALL developers sign a non-verbal social contract. This contract includes many things.
- You are going to deal with some harassment (can be mitigated by mods) - Some people have bad days, others are asshats.
- Younger members will take you for granted
- Younger members will have difficulty providing detail
- The community will expect support for your product(s)
- Other developers (mostly new developers) will not credit you for your work occasionally (can be mitigated by mods)
All these things and more should be expected when working with a community. As a developer, you need to accept ALL of these things in order to contribute to making the community a healthy place.
Eventually, a developer must leave a device and move forward for WHATEVER reason they choose. This is inevitable, but in order to provide a healthy development cycle a developer should ALWAYS provide their source code for a time after development has stopped. This way projects can live on with other developers or be forked entirely.
MY COMMENTS ON TODAY:
DSB9938 - You are a fantastic developer and I urge you not to leave. I do believe you are misguided in pulling all your code and preventing others from forking or continuing your work. It goes against all that open source is about. You signed the social contract and you couldn't handle the terms, you wronged the community by breaking the trust you had developed. If you do not return, I can only hope that other, BETTER developers (in skill and ideology) fill your shoes.
Dr_Drache - Seriously? Kicking me from the AndIRC #droid-dna chat because you don't agree with what I say here? Did I step on your ego much? Stopping your s-off development because of all of this as well? You are whats wrong with the developers side of the community. God forbid someone disagree's with you, you either kick them or pull your project entirely. Go develop for Microsoft or some other proprietary company. You have forgotten about what the community really means and what open source is about.
Everyone else - We can pull through this. I have already started researching to pick up kernel development. It will be slow since DSB refuses to assist, but it can certainly be done.
Mods - We can't afford to lose more developers. We have to stop the harassment.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you, "my friend" need to learn when to stop running your mouth. you spent nearly an hour pretending to care, yet saying dsb/devs should give more back, because we have a contract with the community.
you never stepped on my ego, you were banned for being a luke. you want to quote GPL to the devs and expect us to fall down for you.
I agree with your post except the parts directed to DSB and Drache because it is a continuation of the feud. Let's just wipe the slate clean and follow the other parts of your comments because they are good guidelines on how to interact with each other.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do need to get access back to the #Droid-DNA chat, otherwise it is VERY difficult to even begin development.
dr_drache said:
you, "my friend" need to learn when to stop running your mouth. you spent nearly an hour pretending to care, yet saying dsb/devs should give more back, because we have a contract with the community.
you never stepped on my ego, you were banned for being a luke. you want to quote GPL to the devs and expect us to fall down for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, that is your assumption. I never even once demanded for more. I feel that the actions that have been taken are one of the sloppiest examples of open source development. I am trying to be a reasonable voice. I am trying to keep development going despite our recent setbacks.
I think that at the very least, devs should provide the sources so that development may continue after they decide to leave. Otherwise we loose too much progress.
th3raid0r said:
When developing with a community, ALL developers sign a non-verbal social contract. This contract includes many things.
- You are going to deal with some harassment (can be mitigated by mods) - Some people have bad days, others are asshats.
- Younger members will take you for granted
- Younger members will have difficulty providing detail
- The community will expect support for your product(s)
- Other developers (mostly new developers) will not credit you for your work occasionally (can be mitigated by mods)
All these things and more should be expected when working with a community. As a developer, you need to accept ALL of these things in order to contribute to making the community a healthy place.
Eventually, a developer must leave a device and move forward for WHATEVER reason they choose. This is inevitable, but in order to provide a healthy development cycle a developer should ALWAYS provide their source code for a time after development has stopped. This way projects can live on with other developers or be forked entirely.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, no no no no no no. No social contract, this is an at will thing, that most of us are not paid for. Some of us do it for a living, and also do it here for fun. We do this for FUN. We do this for our benefit (having fun). I can not be anymore honest, anything I do here, I do for my benefit (Brain exercise and fun). I enjoy Android. The day I no longer enjoy it, I will either leave for good, or take a break like I have in the past. We can leave the playground and go home at any time. In fact I encourage developers to do this from time to time, It helped me greatly.
We do get some *sshat harassment, no we don't have to deal with it. We can ignore it, take it to a mod, or take our cake and go home. I tend to confront it, bad habit of mine
Younger members will take us for granted, some times you have to turn the power off to wake them up, or let them sit a minute waiting for you to release something they want.
Support should be appreciated, but not expected. We have families, jobs, and some of use have a life outside of Android(not saying I do ).
Most people who steal work, are not developers. They are general *sshats, that is all.
th3raid0r said:
MY COMMENTS ON TODAY:
DSB9938 - You are a fantastic developer and I urge you not to leave. I do believe you are misguided in pulling all your code and preventing others from forking or continuing your work. It goes against all that open source is about. You signed the social contract and you couldn't handle the terms, you wronged the community by breaking the trust you had developed. If you do not return, I can only hope that other, BETTER developers (in skill and ideology) fill your shoes.
Dr_Drache - Seriously? Kicking me from the AndIRC #droid-dna chat because you don't agree with what I say here? Did I step on your ego much? Stopping your s-off development because of all of this as well? You are whats wrong with the developers side of the community. God forbid someone disagree's with you, you either kick them or pull your project entirely. Go develop for Microsoft or some other proprietary company. You have forgotten about what the community really means and what open source is about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RE: DSB9939: Sorry but take your social contract somewhere else, it doesn't even make sense. He didn't sign, didn't verbally agree, wasn't paid, rarely got a pat on the back. This is the guy who is the reason you all have root/unlock, and you are breaking his balls. Yeah no Beaups and I are not the reason, we were just the way to a means.
RE: Dr_Drache: AndIRC is not part of XDA, we are separate and really what goes on there doesn't belong here. If you have an issue, take it to me, Zifnab, TheFuzz4 or DougPiston. It is a PRIVATE server, and people are welcome at operator discretion. We are allowed to limit it to like minded people, or even to just be grumpy and randomly remove people if we wish (we don't normally). If you want to talk about it, you know where it is, and how to get ahold of me.
Dude, we don't another thread about this lol. I'm not here to harp on this fact, but I'm glad I dumped my DNA while I still had the chance. For some extremely odd reason, people don't know how to act in HTC threads. I definitely don't miss all of this drama from when I had my Rezound.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium
th3raid0r said:
I do need to get access back to the #Droid-DNA chat, otherwise it is VERY difficult to even begin development.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Requesting the community to be civil and then throwing in some parting shots is not ideal. I don't know what went down with you guys over there but maybe you can speak with the powers that be and work out an amicable solution.
jcase said:
No, no no no no no no. No social contract, this is an at will thing, that most of us are not paid for. Some of us do it for a living, and also do it here for fun. We do this for FUN. We do this for our benefit (having fun). I can not be anymore honest, anything I do here, I do for my benefit (Brain exercise and fun). I enjoy Android. The day I no longer enjoy it, I will either leave for good, or take a break like I have in the past. We can leave the playground and go home at any time. In fact I encourage developers to do this from time to time, It helped me greatly.
We do get some *sshat harassment, no we don't have to deal with it. We can ignore it, take it to a mod, or take our cake and go home. I tend to confront it, bad habit of mine
Younger members will take us for granted, some times you have to turn the power off to wake them up, or let them sit a minute waiting for you to release something they want.
Support should be appreciated, but not expected. We have families, jobs, and some of use have a life outside of Android(not saying I do ).
Most people who steal work, are not developers. They are general *sshats, that is all.
RE: DSB9939: Sorry but take your social contract somewhere else, it doesn't even make sense. He didn't sign, didn't verbally agree, wasn't paid, rarely got a pat on the back. This is the guy who is the reason you all have root/unlock, and you are breaking his balls. Yeah no Beaups and I are not the reason, we were just the way to a means.
RE: Dr_Drache: AndIRC is not part of XDA, we are separate and really what goes on there doesn't belong here. If you have an issue, take it to me, Zifnab, TheFuzz4 or DougPiston. It is a PRIVATE server, and people are welcome at operator discretion. We are allowed to limit it to like minded people, or even to just be grumpy and randomly remove people if we wish (we don't normally). If you want to talk about it, you know where it is, and how to get ahold of me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A social non-verbal contract is never an official thing.
In a most basic form it is the trade of safety/stability for a service when it comes to political science. They apply everywhere.
The reason we are no longer roaming nomads is due to social contracts.
I am not saying that this social contract is why you guys develop. It is the generalized community expectations. They are going to vary from member to member as well.
I understand Support is not expected, on your end, however it is essential to a successful project and furthermore it is essential to reputation. Reputation garners donations and therefore some developers incomes.
Most of my other points also follow this same logic.
A healthy community flourishes when these invisible expectations are met. Look at the GNex development for example and take note at what the successful projects are and how they got there.
I understand that DSB wasn't well appreciated. But the community opinion doesn't get better if he leaves in this way, I would argue that he broke a lot of trust that the community had in him. He could have still taken a break, but there are much more elegant ways to do so.
Sigh.
You want a contract? What does the guy on the other end get out of the contract?
I make the things I make so that I can run my phone how I want to run it. That's the only reason. I do not make them for you, or to look like some smart guy, or for my ego. I am the first to admit that I don't know a damned thing about coding. What I make takes hard hours of trial and error. Basically pounding on things till I slowly figure out how they work and bend them to do what I want.
And I do it for days on end. Till it works well enough for me to run on my phone. And I AM PICKY. I want it to be perfect. However, I also share what I make. I share it so that others who want to have their phone run the way I do, don't have to work so hard to get there.
Now comes the rub. There are billions of people in the world. And I bet if you put every phone next to every other phone, you would still not find two setup and/or used the same way. Because of that, I cannot test every possibility. When people come to me with something that doesn't work, do I just say no? Of course not. I made it. I feel responsible for it working correctly.
Now, having determined that I am not a coder, what do I do? First I go ask other people who are much smarter than I am. People like jcase, beaups, imoseyon, show-p1984. These are the real coders/android hackers in the world. They look at the code and actually know what it's doing. They don't have to try to arm wrestle with it to figure out what's wrong.
If that doesn't work, I beat on it. I look at logs. When you post those logs in my threads, there's a bunch of people who read them, not just me. And if I can figure it out, with what help is available, I fix it. If not, I say so. Half the time, what's in those logs is of no help, a quarter of the time, it's in there what happened, but it wasn't related. And lets not forget those logs are usually thousands of lines to read through.
Do I claim to be perfect? Hell no. But I do my best. And that's the very limit of what anybody else on the site has any particular right to ask me for. Nothing more. I try to let slide all of the little digs that people use when things don't work right. But over time it gets to you, ya know? And you guys only see the public stuff, in the threads. You don't see the PMs. And see the people who come online to the chat. You have no clue.
Now top that off with people twisting my words to insult me. I basically said that there are other reasons you can have problems with your phone. I did not say it wasn't my kernel, I said it wasn't in the logs. And I have this guy come in and say yeah, mine runs fine on stock. Seems our phones are only crap on your kernel. Now how did you honestly expect me to react?
I have asked this guy more than once to not run my kernel because he has these outbreaks. This was not the first one. And if you go look through his previous postings, you can see his doesn't only disrespect me, he has outright disrespected MODs as well. This makes me wonder why he was still around to bother me in the first place. But that's beside the point.
Now anybody who thinks I'm curt with others, go read the stuff I've had to put up with and see how long you can take it. I have no problems with people posting when they have an issue. And I can tell you right here and right now, my stuff isn't perfect. But when I tell you I can't find it, or fix it, that doesn't give you the right to flip out and go off on me. That means you go back a version and wait till I make a new one, or you go run something else. I even made a simple stock one for those with issues to run so they could have system write if they had issues.
I DO NOT MAKE ANYBODY RUN MY STUFF.
Now, having said all of that. Put yourself in my shoes and see how happy you would be.
D
.
orangechoochoo said:
Requesting the community to be civil and then throwing in some parting shots is not ideal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, hindsight is 20/20.
It's early in the morning but after reading these threads that big bottle of Grey Goose is calling.
dsb9938 said:
You want a contract? What does the guy on the other end get out of the contract?
I make the things I make so that I can run my phone how I want to run it. That's the only reason. I do not make them for you, or to look like some smart guy, or for my ego. I am the first to admit that I don't know a damned thing about coding. What I make takes hard hours of trial and error. Basically pounding on things till I slowly figure out how they work and bend them to do what I want.
And I do it for days on end. Till it works well enough for me to run on my phone. And I AM PICKY. I want it to be perfect. However, I also share what I make. I share it so that others who want to have their phone run the way I do, don't have to work so hard to get there.
Now comes the rub. There are billions of people in the world. And I bet if you put every phone next to every other phone, you would still not find two setup and/or used the same way. Because of that, I cannot test every possibility. When people come to me with something that doesn't work, do I just say no? Of course not. I made it. I feel responsible for it working correctly.
Now, having determined that I am not a coder, what do I do? First I go ask other people who are much smarter than I am. People like jcase, beaups, imoseyon, show-p1984. These are the real coders/android hackers in the world. They look at the code and actually know what it's doing. They don't have to try to arm wrestle with it to figure out what's wrong.
If that doesn't work, I beat on it. I look at logs. When you post those logs in my threads, there's a bunch of people who read them, not just me. And if I can figure it out, with what help is available, I fix it. If not, I say so. Half the time, what's in those logs is of no help, a quarter of the time, it's in there what happened, but it wasn't related. And lets not forget those logs are usually thousands of lines to read through.
Do I claim to be perfect? Hell no. But I do my best. And that's the very limit of what anybody else on the site has any particular right to ask me for. Nothing more. I try to let slide all of the little digs that people use when things don't work right. But over time it gets to you, ya know? And you guys only see the public stuff, in the threads. You don't see the PMs. And see the people who come online to the chat. You have no clue.
Now top that off with people twisting my words to insult me. I basically said that there are other reasons you can have problems with your phone. I did not say it wasn't my kernel, I said it wasn't in the logs. And I have this guy come in and say yeah, mine runs fine on stock. Seems our phones are only crap on your kernel. Now how did you honestly expect me to react?
I have asked this guy more than once to not run my kernel because he has these outbreaks. This was not the first one. And if you go look through his previous postings, you can see his doesn't only disrespect me, he has outright disrespected MODs as well. This makes me wonder why he was still around to bother me in the first place. But that's beside the point.
Now anybody who thinks I'm curt with others, go read the stuff I've had to put up with and see how long you can take it. I have no problems with people posting when they have an issue. And I can tell you right here and right now, my stuff isn't perfect. But when I tell you I can't find it, or fix it, that doesn't give you the right to flip out and go off on me. That means you go back a version and wait till I make a new one, or you go run something else. I even made a simple stock one for those with issues to run so they could have system write if they had issues.
I DO NOT MAKE ANYBODY RUN MY STUFF.
Now, having said all of that. Put yourself in my shoes and see how happy you would be.
D
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, I totally understand all of that.
I have made some tweaks myself, but I don't publish them because I know they don't have much application outside of myself.
I do know where you are at, I work at a large legal software company as a QA Analyst. I KNOW the daily grind on this.
The harrasment won't always go away. Hell, i get it here in a large company. It can be mitigated by a few things. For example you can use a smaller community.
You don't have to deal with these things at all, but if you leave on such bad terms without a way for someone to pick up where you left off, it doesn't leave a good impression on the rest of the community.
The fact that you don't know code makes this all the more impressive. You are a fantastic problem solver, it shows, maybe we can find some way to lessen the blow for you and yet continue public development?
th3raid0r said:
A social non-verbal contract is never an official thing.
In a most basic form it is the trade of safety/stability for a service when it comes to political science. They apply everywhere.
The reason we are no longer roaming nomads is due to social contracts.
I am not saying that this social contract is why you guys develop. It is the generalized community expectations. They are going to vary from member to member as well.
I understand Support is not expected, on your end, however it is essential to a successful project and furthermore it is essential to reputation. Reputation garners donations and therefore some developers incomes.
Most of my other points also follow this same logic.
A healthy community flourishes when these invisible expectations are met. Look at the GNex development for example and take note at what the successful projects are and how they got there.
I understand that DSB wasn't well appreciated. But the community opinion doesn't get better if he leaves in this way, I would argue that he broke a lot of trust that the community had in him. He could have still taken a break, but there are much more elegant ways to do so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You keep saying signed social contract. It is non-sense man. What you mean is expectations from non involved individuals.
Most developers get jack for donations, only people who get tons are either A) the attention begging people who release 100000 roms for 1000 devices that are nothing special, or B) ones who release something special, and then the donation spree is short and sweet. We don't do it for donations. DSB is not making much from donations on this device, he does it strictly for fun and people are making it NOT fun for him.
I fell into B) with the DNA. I will say I made ~$800 from donations on the DNA unlock, it is not the rule but an exception. I bought two used phones really cheap to develop on ($200 and $140, gave the $200 one away to another developer for free after I was done. $140 one I will give away as well at some point.), pizza dinner for my kids ($35, my personal reward), sent some for another developer (DSB, for his work and risks) and donated the rest to various charities. This is NOT A normal amount of donations. Don't fool yourself thinking most developers are making an income of any kind doing this.
GNex community flourished due to paid support from Google (AOSP), and open documentation. Two things we did not have.
*PS*
If you haven't been in our shoes, you shouldn't pretend to know, and you shouldn't complain about us.
solutions anyone?
dsb, jcase I have to side with you guys entirely. I love your work and I appreciate it completely. I am grateful for you guys, were it not for you guys and other people like you I would not get to 'OCD' on my droid all hours of the night like I do. I have learned much. I am a machinist in a shipyard, I can understand fine tuning and perfection in your work.
Unfortunately most of today's societal behaviors even in grown adults are dysfunctional at best. I have been on the internet since it's inception to the public eye and all I can say is that arguing and bickering that happens on the internet is absolutely ridiculous. I feel bad for you guys and embarrassed for the "others."
I have to agree with what works though. My daughter, when she was young would throw a temper tantrum and slam her bedroom door, so I removed the door.
orangechoochoo said:
Sigh.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
orangechoochoo said:
It's early in the morning but after reading these threads that big bottle of Grey Goose is calling.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its almost night here, and Jack Daniels is calling me, all after reading all that posts and some chating on IRC... Never ever see such outcome because of some not polite posts. I have degree in International Relations and first thing i 've learned - don't say what you think, say what you need to say and SMILE )))) We all just people. I got my family. Wife, kids... But i spend time here not only because of kernels, ROMs and all that stuff. But because of great community. It looks like that 1 person can spoil all that great atmosphere.... :silly:
jcase said:
You keep saying signed social contract. It is non-sense man. What you mean is expectations from non involved individuals.
Most developers get jack for donations, only people who get tons are either A) the attention begging people who release 100000 roms for 1000 devices that are nothing special, or B) ones who release something special, and then the donation spree is short and sweet. We don't do it for donations. DSB is not making much from donations on this device, he does it strictly for fun and people are making it NOT fun for him.
I fell into B) with the DNA. I will say I made ~$800 from donations on the DNA unlock, it is not the rule but an exception. I bought two used phones really cheap to develop on ($200 and $140, gave the $200 one away to another developer for free after I was done. $140 one I will give away as well at some point.), pizza dinner for my kids ($35, my personal reward), sent some for another developer (DSB, for his work and risks) and donated the rest to various charities. This is NOT A normal amount of donations. Don't fool yourself thinking most developers are making an income of any kind doing this.
GNex community flourished due to paid support from Google (AOSP), and open documentation. Two things we did not have.
*PS*
If you haven't been in our shoes, you shouldn't pretend to know, and you shouldn't complain about us.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never said you make a living off the income generated from donations. I know it is mostly small, but the funds do help most people. It is also nice to know that you mean something to a few individuals.
Also, I work at a legal software company as a QA Analyst officially, but I do mostly QA Engineering work for no recognition, no additional pay, and the occasional bit of harassment when someone doesn't understand my methods. I really DO get the environment.
The only thing I am complaining about is devs leaving on such bad terms without a way for the community to recover, that's it.
th3raid0r said:
The only thing I am complaining about is devs leaving on such bad terms without a way for the community to recover, that's it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What makes you think anybody owes "the community" a way to recover?
D
.

Question Pixel 6 or Pixel 6 Pro with CalyxOS?

Hello, I am currently a privacy novice trying to learn about different avenues of where I can get help to better protect myself. I see apple devices and I like the fact that they have a closed ecosystem per device, but I don’t like the fact that they are all interconnected with each other; it freaks me out that someone else with an Apple device could very easily connect to mine. That’s why CalyxOS stood out to me, because what it looks like from the outside-in is a decentralized form of android device, without all of the Google strings attached. I’d honestly rather use it than Graphene, because the people over on the graphene forums are kinda toxic to be honest. I have no knowledge of how to install operating systems, however, and I’m afraid that I could easily screw it up. Does Calyx sell any Pixel 6/Pixel 6 Pro models that I could buy to get started?
Welcome. I'm probably a terrible example but oh well. I had time to kill and been stuck on this topic myself since the early 90s.
If you're serious about privacy to the point that you are worried about other devices as you mentioned, I highly suggest (seriously, not trying to be a ****) you take some online courses on the fundamentals of telecommunications, and do some "light" reading on topics likeLinux Kernel, enterprise networking, Signals Intelligence, and Section 215 metadata collection. thats a decent starting point to the state of things. Though it's just a shinny coin on a string to distract while the real work continues. It must always continue. It will never stop.
I'm sorry to tell you.
It's too late. In any practical sense short of finding somewhere to go love in a cave until you starve or die from a infection a 99¢ tube of cream could have prevented.
You can have a privacy focused phone. It can keep certain things safe. Stop some people from doing things. Delay an outcome. You're gonna need to learn about installing an OS though. It gets pretty complex rather quickly.
Nothing is safe. Every lock can be picked or bypassed. There is no such thing as a door only you can use. The last place anything is truly a secret is in your head. When you are the only person in the entire world with the right permissions.
There was a window when we could have made meaningful and lasting choices in how protocols, standards, regulations, and laws were adopted. Back when it was all just a few hundred trunk lines, IXPs and NOC with good intentions, and tragically short sight. Lots of people screaming at the top of their lungs about the potential outcomes. Tinfoil hats were worn. Turns out we were right.
When you wrap your brain around what the "internet" really is...it's similar to getting a small sliver of understanding; grasping ever so lightly; the brain breaking inconceivable scale of the infinite universe and how infinitesimally small we are. The remnants of a dead stars clumped together pondering its own own existence. Connecting wires together and making things beyond our capabilities. The amount of data being exchanged right now ain't ****. It's bonkers, but it won't be next year, or next or the next.
The rate at which machine learning and the race to general AI is going, watch for the casualties along the way. one example is encryption as we know it. Gone. It'll be rendered trivial by 2040 MAYBE. Honestly that's a really high estimate. Likely before.
Post quantum encryption is just about as experimentally verifiable as string theory. Won't be long though before we get a chance to see if itll hold up. The Xbox is older than the time we have left. The Patriot Act as well.
Practice basic OPsec. Best Practices. Trust few, tell fewer. Read. Read some more. Then read the book. Every question you could ever think of likely has a 12 year old thread at a slackexchange site and no shortage of users ready to remind you how tired they are of duplicates. The community at grapheneOS is similar. On that though. Best to just go to the source. He tries to explain things without just speaking in jargon. Daniel Micay himself on the matter of android security.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GrapheneOS/comments/bddq5u
and
https://www.reddit.com/r/GrapheneOS/comments/du23la
There is no shortage of people currently who disagree with him even though they have little to no grasp on the complexity of what it is he actually intended. Ran into one of them myself, on this site, just the other day. Sure, It's hardneded, but what that means from user to user is drastically different.
It's more than some. It'll fit some use cases. But it's just a speck in a cloud. If you attract the attention of a human being with skills and motivation...good luck my dude. Godspeed.
The real thought experiment and one of my favorites to fall asleep to on nights I actually sleep is "what are they going to do with all the encrypted data they hoovered up and have been storing for the last 30-40 years? Once AI turns the encryption algorithms that humanity runs on into a half finished cheap dollar store sudoku." How long does any one reckon that'll be the case before us plebs hear about it. We got a good track record, as a collective species in doing the right thing, right? No way they will actually use what is functionally a rewind button on...well everything. Nah, it'll be fine.
Oh look, Lapsus$ group woke up, posted a new dump... Wonder how much Globant spend on securing their stuff. Probably more than me.
--just a jaded old man

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