The Cingular forums are now shutting down discussion re the new ROMS ... nice ... just trying to keep us from helping each other out (you would think it would be to their benefit, so folks don't bug their non-existent customer service)
see here for all the gory details.
This is getting more and more ridiculus by the day
Hallllllo M$ and providers. when we buy a device we ALREDY get a licenced WM, what's your problem???????????????????????????????????????
weinson said:
The Cingular forums are now shutting down discussion re the new ROMS ... nice ... just trying to keep us from helping each other out (you would think it would be to their benefit, so folks don't bug their non-existent customer service)
see here for all the gory details.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the thread has been resurrected for the time being...no idea how long that will last though.
This is just like Cingular, I have been told that this update would be out since Dec. by Cingular sales and it never has. We cannot help it if Cingular is so slow on getting updated services out. If they would put more effort in service and less on what they are going to call them selfs maybe they could supply better service. I have 19 cingular accounts and may move all of them if they don't get there act together.
Steven -
Do what my wife did, she is part of the State of FL gov contract on Cingular and she has a fair bit of power in moving accounts so she basically said if you can't support your gear with updated ROMs maybe she would move accounts somewhere else.
I doubt they care but who knows...
so many dumb-ass flashed their phones w/o reading the instructions, bricked their phones and start to call Cingular/ATT for help/repair/replacement. Next thing we know, MS is trying to remove all ROMs, ATT removing thread about new ROMs....
That's y we should make this community go underground, ban the suckers who don't read, link ROMs to rapidshare or other similar sites instead of this site's FTP server.
It's sad to see we have to remove the ROMs but I wouldn't blame MS or ATT for asking XDA-developers to do so.
Oh, btw, if you guys care go sign the petition, show us some supports even if we dont get what we want.
peace.
It's the War on Common Sense. And since all of us are a minority here, ignorance and misinformation prevail.
The main reason Big Business does this is because the executives are a much older generation that is scared and terribly confused by the Internet. So to them, we're all looking to ruin their business by making their phones work in ways they didn't intend for them to be used. What they don't know is, our solutions are much better than the ones they provide (hence the void we're filling by being here, supporting, and working out their phones for free) and if they were to release even just half of the ROMs the XDA community cooked up, they'd have a much happier customer base.
steven814 said:
This is just like Cingular, I have been told that this update would be out since Dec. by Cingular sales and it never has. We cannot help it if Cingular is so slow on getting updated services out. If they would put more effort in service and less on what they are going to call them selfs maybe they could supply better service. I have 19 cingular accounts and may move all of them if they don't get there act together.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cingular/AT&T is pretty much the only carrier with even a _leaked_ rom... so how are you going to say that they're slow? They're actually ahead of the curve, in my opinion.
The 8525 came out in November. I'm pretty sure that there must have been some miscommunication if you recall someone in December told you the Rom would be out tomorrow (or any specific immediate timeframe). "Soon" is not necessarily "one month" or less. I think sometimes we hear and preceive what we WANT to be the truth based on what we actually _did_ hear. I mean, as far as I can tell, HTC just released the 3.3 rom to carriers a matter of weeks ago. Cingular has been working on things other carriers aren't doing, too (PTT, Cingular Video, etc.) So they're putting more into the rom than most of our European counterparts need to (with the exception of video calling... yet.)
I guess what I'm saying is that we, as enthusiasts, expect more than the average customer. And as for Cingular / AT&T, of course they don't want to be providing support for an unofficial and likely unfinished rom. Honestly, having inexperienced and impatient Cingular customers reading about this leaked rom and trying to put it on their devices prematurely would certainly cause a terrible amount of problems. Again... it's _leaked_ and _unofficial_, so they should not feel like they have to support it.
Just my 2/3 of a nickel.
GliTCH82 said:
It's the War on Common Sense. And since all of us are a minority here, ignorance and misinformation prevail.
The main reason Big Business does this is because the executives are a much older generation that is scared and terribly confused by the Internet. So to them, we're all looking to ruin their business by making their phones work in ways they didn't intend for them to be used. What they don't know is, our solutions are much better than the ones they provide (hence the void we're filling by being here, supporting, and working out their phones for free) and if they were to release even just half of the ROMs the XDA community cooked up, they'd have a much happier customer base.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I disagree. I believe the truth is if they released half the roms on here, they're customers WOULD be confused, scared, and lost because they have no idea what rom they should be running. They'd have no idea why something doesn't work perfectly on one rom and better on another. Or why one radio may or may not be better. Think about how many people on here aren't reading everything they need to and bricking or nearly bricking their devices. And these are the ones SEEKING the information. The average 8525 user on Cingular's network isn't quite as interested in this stuff as we are here.
Knowledge is power, but unstable power is chaos.
Think about it.
Xda-Developers is a great source for those seeking to know more about their devices than just its typical uses. But anyone who really wants the knowledge will seek it out and find it (just as we all did). Throwing an incomplete rom at the average lawyer who needs Microsoft Direct Push and not much more is likely to cause more problems than it's worth for AT&Tingular as well as for us (because we'll be the ones trying to clean up the mess).
I think I should sign off on this before I infuriate some of those out there who just want to vent their frustration. And we all know the company with the dollars is always a great target to do that.
Does't surprise me in the slightest.
I am sure many OEMs and phone companies are sick of people bricking their phones and claiming warranties (of course they never admit to using cooked ROMs or even trying to upgrade them - 'Just woke up one morning and it wouldn't boot up').
I enjoy this forum too but don't tell me it doesn't encourage people to do things they shouldn't, and are not willing to take responsiblity for.
esseff said:
I enjoy this forum too but don't tell me it doesn't encourage people to do things they shouldn't, and are not willing to take responsiblity for.
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I have to disagree with that statement... I wasnt aware that giving warnings to the users that flashing their phone could brick it and that they need to read and make sure they fully understand what they are doing before they do it was encouragement... I know that when i came to this board and saw the warnings about flashing cooked roms it freaked me out.. i was registered for several months before i ever made a post, spent countless hours reading all the threads to make sure i fully understood my device before i did anything to it.. its the people that dont read and brick their phone that want to come back and blame us for their mistake.. This is a developers board and quite frankly alot of us go out of the way of development to help people in need... we especially go above and beyond any kind of help that you would recieve from your provider
My 2c
I have to agree with shogunmark. I know I made very sure I read every last thread and wiki before I attempted anything as rash as upgrading a Radio stack. This was because of my fear of bricking the unit, because so many people warned it could. I was even willing to endure the mass "RTFM" and "RTFW" flaming if i wanted to make sure I understood everything correctly before risking my device.
I believe the largest part of this community are users that gather here in the spirit of sharing the knowledge about the device to encourage greater growth of the community- the more people, the more mods & hacks & cracks and experiences will become part of the knowledge base.
yet im still trying to figure out how "MAY BRICK YOUR DEVICE" warnings are encouraging...
Come on guys!
Sure there are countless warinings but simply the enthusiasm and excitement amongst the experienced crew, when a new possibliity appears (GPS, WM6, AKU this, AKU that) causes less experience people to get caught up in it.
I'm not for one minute discouraging XDA developing, just TAKE RESPONSIBLILITY IF YOU BRICK YOUR DEVICE AND DON'T GO CRYING TO THE OEM OR TELCO FOR WARANTY. Pay for your mistake and buy another.
I have seen, on this forum people advising others to go back to their supplier with bricked devices and try to get a warranty. It is hard for the supplier to argue with someone who says their device 'Just stopped working', when infact they bricked it, and in the spirit of good customer relations they often replace it. Why wouldn't suppliers be negative toward forums like these when they are placed in this situation.
Sigh... I've been told that HTC's single greatest returned device is the Wizard followed closely by the Hermes. Reason: bricked.
We post the warnings, but plenty of people don't take the time to fully understand then brick their devices anyway (hermes is especially bad in this respect). Then they try to return them.
In many ways, this is the manufacturer fault b/c they are trying to thwart users who try to upgrade or change their devices. Hermes development feels like spy vs. spy sometimes as we crack something and then the next bootloader/radio bootloader comes out. Consequently pre sspl hermes flashing was damn near rocket science. Problems were rampant. Heck, I even saw one poster try to flash the original signed_nbh into the OS area with the 1.01MFG bootloader
They're all gonna try it. There's no minimum IQ required to be a member here.
Ideally, we need to find a way to bring any HTC device back to life from brick status. It's only corrupted memory after all. If the correct bytes are written, the software works. When I did SE phone hacking, there were such devices. Because of this, users with bricked phones could take them to their nearest SE phone center and they would re-flash and un-brick (for a price of course).
This ridiculous swapping of bricked devices is what needs to change. Posters need to take financial responsibility for phones they brick. HTC needs to make their hardware flashing system available to Operators at phone centers.
Unfortunately, this won't be the case. Instead, they'll go after us because they can see an ROI impact in terms of bricks. What they can't see is the intangible increase in sales that we stimulate or the intangible loss of future revenue that shutting us down represents.
Sign the petition. Get your friends to sign it. Get it posted on other forums. Get it into the news. Operators and M$ need to be able to see this intangible.
on the other hand with the hermes and returns... we just got to a point to where we could brick them less than a month ago... most of the returns before then was by manufacturer fault, i know this because i was one of them, i had a ton of bad blocks in the wrong spot....
its to bad we dont have an easy rom kitchen for these.. something that would make it damn near impossible for the person who cant read to brick their device.. i dont know.. im tired and going back to bad, my post isnt making much sense to me right now
but i do agree with you sleuth!
Wow... check out the attitude here...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=294365
Kinda proves my point.
Add a success story here - mainly because I am competent enough to read and ask the right questions when there was vague information.
I am not new to flashing/modding, but the Hermes definately takes it to a new level.
The difference with me, should I ever brick my device - I would just deal with it. I came here with the understanding that the tools available to us come with an increased risk should you not actually understand what you are doing. You need to be aware that you should own up to the possible mistakes and not try to send a bricked device back for warranty....
Two individuals who make this place so great - Pof and Sleuth. Pof has done such a great job with the wiki and his tools - all you need to do is take a few days to read about the device and the steps you need to make. Sleuth brings a different element (and his programs) to the forums and has the patience to point questions to the right areas of the wiki.
My advice - if you plan on unlocking/upgrading take at least a week and read the wiki. Make sure you have all the pieces needed to complete what you want to do. Sync your device and backup all your info - be prepared to hard reset and start from scratch - twice in some cases.
Set aside plenty of time that your phone will be down during this process.
This site is by far the best there is - it's a shame that people rush into things some times.
Sleuth255 said:
Ideally, we need to find a way to bring any HTC device back to life from brick status. It's only corrupted memory after all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC should put JTAG out in its new models
Seriously, it's a big flaw that every official ROM image overwrites th bootloader, even with the same version. The whole firmware history teaches that the bootloader should not be touched by end user.
So, the solution is to make custom ROMs flashable by parts, w/o affecting the bootloader. This should prevent bricking... does not revive existing bricks though...
But your overall point is good: manufacturers get angry because of a lot of returns, and care shell be taken to calm them down.
on another note about the cingular boards... i got banned there was a thread about the lack of good moderation in the HTC board over there, i spoke my piece and got banned... it wasnt even bad, just offered some suggestions.. so much for contructive criticism and free speech..
Related
Hi all,
I read the thread about M$ that wants xda-developers to take the htc roms from ftp. One more time M$ disappoint their customers that just want to take the max from their htc pockets (We paid 500€ more or less for a pocket, I thing is legitimately that we want to take the max from our pocket).
So I think that htc roms must be available in torrents using public trackers and publish in mininova.org, meganova.org or other torrents sites available. If everyone seed some roms they will always be available for public.
What you think about this?
I am down... just don;t know how to package them up or else I would. I get a new pc this week and have though of making my other one a file store...
Hi,
We must build a private network for Forum users, We can use KDX a multi platform peer to peer client/server app, it is like Hotline.
Slimsaturn: BUY A MAC OR USE LINUX BOYCOTT MICROSOFT
Regards,
Taguapire.
boycott microsoft!
i was thinking of upgrading to Vista. now i changed my mind! u dont piss off your customers that supporting u!
Since i have a hermes and i live for xda, I'm backing up the ftp and i'll store it. Possibly setup ftp access for requested users.
I think we should tell M$ to ........................................KISS OUR A$$..............................OUR...................................."ENTIRE......A$$"...............That's what "I" think............................
That being said........ start backing up the ROMS etc...... we'll figure out how to get them out to users.......... if you can download the things from HTC.......why does M$ have their panties in a bunch?????????? Sheeesssshhhhhh what a bunch of CRY BABIES!!!!!!!!
vpu2....OUT!!!!
Why is it that Big corporations treat their customers like dirt!
Its the enthusiast that keeps them making money! I am constantly "selling" the merits of M$ powered PPC's to anyone who will listen, I am in the IT industry and have in the last 3 or so years been responsible for over 50 sales of M$ based devices to customers and friends. Because of XDA Dev I will buy a WM device again and again. But if M$ plays the Bully and forces the demise of XDA Dev I will have no reason to by a WM device again. I will then look into other devices such as Sony etc.
I'm sure you are all the same as me, its the the amazing endless customization options that XDA and WM devices offer you that keeps you coming back, without that its no better than any other device.
But sadly Big Corporations don't care, even if we could get a petition signed by 10 000 users they would just shrug and say "So what, there are millions of other users"
What I would like to know is what possible damage can be done by having M$ roms available to M$ customers. Its not like someone can make his own device and then download a rom here. If you use a rom from XDA Dev then you own a M$ device! and you have paid M$ for the rom, Why then are you not allowed to make it better!
No if/when we can get a working Linux solution we can once and for all "dump" M$.
Maybe HTC will bring out a device running Linux in the near future.
Yours in Hope
Jules
As annoying as it is this is the right thing for MS to do to protect themselves.
If it was a little company would you feel less angry?
The only reason you feel angry is due to them being a multi billion dollar corporation beating down on "the little guys" aka us.
How are they loosing revenue from XDA Dev?
If they were charging users for updated OS versions then I could see their point of view. But I can't see how XDA Dev can have any negative impact on M$. If I am missing something here then please inform me.
Jules
The way I see it, allowing people to down load different ROM's hurts no one. Al they are trying to do is fix up the defective software. If MS spent more time fixing the defects in their software and less time with lawyers people would not need look around for other ROM's. There is prima facie a very powerful case for a class action against MS for the defects in WM5.
We are talking about tracking down a solution to hacking WM6 to run on a Hermese for starters and I know they will charge for that.
ZaJules said:
How are they loosing revenue from XDA Dev?
If they were charging users for updated OS versions then I could see their point of view. But I can't see how XDA Dev can have any negative impact on M$. If I am missing something here then please inform me.
Jules
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Frustrating thing is its not about profit etc... i read that IP (Intellectual Property) law in US states that if you knowingly let ANYONE (not just in US) use your IP without correct license you stand to let anyone do that. Since you have willingly let someone get away with IP infringment you couldnt claim say if the vista source code was used without permission!??
A simple agreement between xda-devs and MS would get passed this but i guess the boffs in the MS law department arent willing to listen. We are possibly the best source of FREE testing and debugging they have!
And may i remind everyone we have ALL paid for a WM license, this is not (as some idiot has said in the "sign the petition" thread) software piracy, it is FREELY available from operators and HTC!
Well, for what I read M$ says that many customers are pissing of their mobile phone providers with roms that are unsupported by that provider.
And for that reason, they say........, roms must not be available here.....
It's fine we can put them elsewhere.
This saves the forum from being shut down or having any legal problems at all. This ensures a long lasting community without having to go underground.
suineg said:
We are talking about tracking down a solution to hacking WM6 to run on a Hermese for starters and I know they will charge for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will pay for an upgrade, but if they don't make it available I have no moral problem of using a hacked version for the Hermes. It's not that M$ will loose any revenue if the product isn't available to buy. Not having VM6 will not make me buy a new phone faster either. As most of us I guess we're stuck with a 2 year contract or so anyhow.
It seems like a really bad thing on MS' side but really its not that bigga deal.
With so many of us here it is easy to build another database at other places and even servers like rapidshare, megaupload etc. They might take them down but they will be back up very quickly. That being said once the network is made all we need to do is get the word around via PM's as to keep it off the boards to keep MS from being able to do anything. Simple
Upload the roms, have in your sig you have links, give out the links in PM's and we are all good to use xda as the great community it always has been
Cheers
vador said:
Hi all,
I read the thread about M$ that wants xda-developers to take the htc roms from ftp. One more time M$ disappoint their customers that just want to take the max from their htc pockets (We paid 500€ more or less for a pocket, I thing is legitimately that we want to take the max from our pocket)....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually; it's HTC we should be mad at... If they would release some decently functioning firmware for our devices in the first place, there would not be any need for a ROM archive so we can cook up our own ROM sets...
And i really supect HTC has also triggered this M$ action, because of the appearance of diverse test-ROM's for Trinity and Hermes among others...
Just like someone said before: why do these multi-billion-dollar-bohemoths of companies piss on their customers like this ??? It's truly shocking how they crank out half-working product and kick them on the market, and forget about them instantly (support for existing customers? what's that ...?).
They should better concentrate to work with us, and create a better user-experience for all their customers... But since we have a thing called "world-economy", don't count on it to happen....it never will...
Makes me sad....
ZaJules said:
Why is it that Big corporations treat their customers like dirt!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not that I like that the ROMs were removed, it was a very helpful service.
But this anti-MS ranting does not help. MS is not the salvation army, and they do (and have to do) what is legally possible to protect their business interests and that of their customers. The free download of one of their OS is not something to can seriously expect them to tolerate in the long run.
Folks:
Wiki's are editable by everybody... especially the place were "links to roms" are.
XDA will fight any m$ attempts to have us remove links to roms. That amounts to web censorship.
Well I had just made an excalibur torrent, but I like hermes better, I should have everything down tomorrow and a torrent ready then, sucks Im not gonna be able to use orb. if you havent I suggest you register at demonoid.com. there are other torrents there you may find interesting.
For months and months since I got my xv6800, I've been asking vzw reps, tech support morons, and WDTS people when OUR RevA/GPS software update will be released. Every time I ask I get the same response.
"Your handset is not EVDO Rev A upgradable"
"Your handset doesn't have GPS in it"
The HTC website never helped either because under specifications it never said anything about RevA capabilities, so I was forced to bite my tongue and just accept Verizon's stupidity.
Well HTC finally added it to their list of specifications. It's been like that for the Mogul and other Titan variants now for a while and now it's there for the xv6800.
http://www.htc.com/us/product.aspx?id=11150
What's Verizon gonna say now when I whip up that website and ask why the MANUFACTURER would list it as a capability if supposedly "my handset is not EVDO RevA upgradable?"
They'll be forced to look me in the eye and tell me the truth. They're too money hungry and lazy to step it up and get the software update going. They're too busy thinking up their next piece of **** application for Get It Now and developing new ways to screw their customers out of more money.
Granted I've had RevA and GPS working since the leak, but still...it's the principle!
/endrant
please let me know what they say when you call. I would love to hear it.
now, if they would only put something that says to some extent "upgradeable to 128mb ram" (one can hope...)
thanks
Please remember, you are talking to some lowly, near minimum wage customer service employee. Even if he wanted to give you a truthful answer, the truth is, he probably just doesnt know jack s***.
Save the effort and frustration, go with a custom ROM and live a happy life.
gcincotta said:
For months and months since I got my xv6800, I've been asking vzw reps, tech support morons, and WDTS people when OUR RevA/GPS software update will be released. Every time I ask I get the same response.
"Your handset is not EVDO Rev A upgradable"
"Your handset doesn't have GPS in it"
The HTC website never helped either because under specifications it never said anything about RevA capabilities, so I was forced to bite my tongue and just accept Verizon's stupidity.
Well HTC finally added it to their list of specifications. It's been like that for the Mogul and other Titan variants now for a while and now it's there for the xv6800.
http://www.htc.com/us/product.aspx?id=11150
What's Verizon gonna say now when I whip up that website and ask why the MANUFACTURER would list it as a capability if supposedly "my handset is not EVDO RevA upgradable?"
They'll be forced to look me in the eye and tell me the truth. They're too money hungry and lazy to step it up and get the software update going. They're too busy thinking up their next piece of **** application for Get It Now and developing new ways to screw their customers out of more money.
Granted I've had RevA and GPS working since the leak, but still...it's the principle!
/endrant
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who gives a ****? We know it's capable and to be perfectly honest, I wouldn't run their bloatware version of WM even if they released an update. Verizon sucks ass, we all know it. So why beat a dead horse?
Who gives a ****? We know it's capable and to be perfectly honest, I wouldn't run their bloatware version of WM even if they released an update. Verizon sucks ass, we all know it. So why beat a dead horse?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ha do you think I would actually run their software update? It's just the mere principle. Don't forget though...if they finally do release an update we may get a new, better radio out of it.
Please remember, you are talking to some lowly, near minimum wage customer service employee. Even if he wanted to give you a truthful answer, the truth is, he probably just doesnt know jack s***.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've spoken with people high up on the food chain before that actually do know a thing or two about this stuff. In fact, one time I spoke with a tier 2 WDTS rep who was intrigued when I informed him that it in fact WAS capable. I stayed on the phone with him as I directed him to these forums while he read all about it. He said it's bs that they're being told to inform customers that it's not capable after reading.
lllboredlll said:
Who gives a ****? We know it's capable and to be perfectly honest, I wouldn't run their bloatware version of WM even if they released an update. Verizon sucks ass, we all know it. So why beat a dead horse?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there are some things i want for vz that i can only get from a vz update.
carriers supporting their products is a good thing, whether you run their firmware or not.
dcd1182 said:
there are some things i want for vz that i can only get from a vz update.
carriers supporting their products is a good thing, whether you run their firmware or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hence the comment "Verizon sucks ass, we all know it"
My point is why complain about something that is already known and established. I don't see you *****ing about Verizon. You know they suck, you wish they would support their hardware more, but you also know there isn't alot you can do about it. There has been so much put into the Titan community lately and yet people still *****. Sorry I just get tired of all the complaining done in these forums. I just think it's stupid to waste data space and a thread in this site to complain. I think everytime I'm unhappy I'm gonna start a thread just so I can ***** about it. This site is for technical data. Not someone's personal conquest to whine.
lllboredlll said:
H..... This site is for technical data. Not someone's personal conquest to whine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's funny, you're doing a lot of *****ing and whining in this thread; just leave it alone.
Hence the comment "Verizon sucks ass, we all know it"
My point is why complain about something that is already known and established. I don't see you *****ing about Verizon. You know they suck, you wish they would support their hardware more, but you also know there isn't alot you can do about it. There has been so much put into the Titan community lately and yet people still *****. Sorry I just get tired of all the complaining done in these forums. I just think it's stupid to waste data space and a thread in this site to complain. I think everytime I'm unhappy I'm gonna start a thread just so I can ***** about it. This site is for technical data. Not someone's personal conquest to whine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You really need to learn to get a clue. In no way was my post "*****ing" or "complaining" about Verizon. I was merely pointing out that the times in the past when I was told certain things have come to an end because certain facts have finally been made public. If you can't see that then you need a lot of help my friend.
This site is for "technical data". What exactly is "technical data"? It's people like you that start the flames in these threads, not me. If you knew anything about this stuff you'd know that with carrier software updates comes updated radio roms, pri updates, driver updates, os updates, and more. Do you think these roms and kitchens just popped up out of nowhere? They magically created themselves? No, they came from official carrier releases and were extracted, cleaned, and tweaked. dcd and I have been looking for a solution for people to refresh their pri in case they accidentally let customizations run. A Verizon software update may contain something very useful in the extended rom that could help us develop it. I bet you didn't know that though right?
You've made it clear to everyone that YOU are the one who likes to "*****" and "complain", not me.
gcincotta said:
You really need to learn to get a clue. In no way was my post "*****ing" or "complaining" about Verizon. I was merely pointing out that the times in the past when I was told certain things have come to an end because certain facts have finally been made public. If you can't see that then you need a lot of help my friend.
This site is for "technical data". What exactly is "technical data"? It's people like you that start the flames in these threads, not me. If you knew anything about this stuff you'd know that with carrier software updates comes updated radio roms, pri updates, driver updates, os updates, and more. Do you think these roms and kitchens just popped up out of nowhere? They magically created themselves? No, they came from official carrier releases and were extracted, cleaned, and tweaked. dcd and I have been looking for a solution for people to refresh their pri in case they accidentally let customizations run. A Verizon software update may contain something very useful in the extended rom that could help us develop it. I bet you didn't know that though right?
You've made it clear to everyone that YOU are the one who likes to "*****" and "complain", not me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
....epic reply....
RE: Rev A and GPS
Both the HTC site and Verizon say nothing of being GPS capable, yet there are people using GPS right now through avaialbe kitchens.
I love verizon. I have gotten nothing but "great" support from them with all 19 of my phones. (Starting with MotoV265 (5) MotoV710(4) MotoE815 (1) MotoQ (4) Treo700wx (3) and finally my XV6800 (2) all in only 3.5 years)
On a serious note though, the reason that they won't release GPS for it is because they can't regulate its use very well on their system. Their other phones use VZNav on the BREW enabled phones but, as far as I know, our phones don't do BREW.
PS. Can I ***** and complain a little too here?
kyxdadeveloper said:
Both the HTC site and Verizon say nothing of being GPS capable, yet there are people using GPS right now through avaialbe kitchens.
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Click to collapse
There is a great difference between not listing a specification to denying its capability.
Keystone said:
There is a great difference between not listing a specification to denying its capability.
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Click to collapse
i just talked to a verizon tech suport rep, she helped me reset my data after messing it up.
but at the end of the call, i asked "i heard about this rev A thing...is our phone capable of that?" and she looked it up and said yes it is.
she also said she wasnt aware of any plans to do any kind of software update that would enable it, and she said she wouldnt know about it until it was released..
then just for $hits and giggles, i asked, what about gps. can this phone do that? and she said like for what? navigation? i said, yeh, for navigation, for google maps, something like that.
she said since google maps is 3rd party software, she wouldnt be able to tell me for sure if it would work. But i asked is our phone capable of gps?
and she said "yes, it is capable, but its not supported"
i guess that means since they dont have any software that could use it, and since they dont support 3rd part software, the can still say its capable, without actually enabling it on a stock rom.
just my experience about 20 min ago
gbenj said:
i just talked to a verizon tech suport rep, she helped me reset my data after messing it up.
but at the end of the call, i asked "i heard about this rev A thing...is our phone capable of that?" and she looked it up and said yes it is.
she also said she wasnt aware of any plans to do any kind of software update that would enable it, and she said she wouldnt know about it until it was released..
then just for $hits and giggles, i asked, what about gps. can this phone do that? and she said like for what? navigation? i said, yeh, for navigation, for google maps, something like that.
she said since google maps is 3rd party software, she wouldnt be able to tell me for sure if it would work. But i asked is our phone capable of gps?
and she said "yes, it is capable, but its not supported"
i guess that means since they dont have any software that could use it, and since they dont support 3rd part software, the can still say its capable, without actually enabling it on a stock rom.
just my experience about 20 min ago
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Click to collapse
You'd all be smart to switch to Sprint with your xv6800s. I think they'll let you do it. you may have to pay $100 to $200 to get out of your contract with Verizon. It will be worth it once your accounts are set up properly. Sprint has the worst customer service, but at least they are trying to get WM6.1 up. The GPS works great on the Mogul. Your xv6800 hardware is identical to the Mogul. You should be able to Hard SPL, flash a Sprint ROM, and then go in and get you phone set up on Sprint. Check this forum carefully for details and follow instructions carefully.
Spr0ckEt said:
I love verizon. I have gotten nothing but "great" support from them with all 19 of my phones. (Starting with MotoV265 (5) MotoV710(4) MotoE815 (1) MotoQ (4) Treo700wx (3) and finally my XV6800 (2) all in only 3.5 years)
On a serious note though, the reason that they won't release GPS for it is because they can't regulate its use very well on their system. Their other phones use VZNav on the BREW enabled phones but, as far as I know, our phones don't do BREW.
PS. Can I ***** and complain a little too here?
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Click to collapse
I agree with you. started with LG VX6000,8000, 8100, 700w 700wx and now this one XV6800...may some day they will tell me the truth and stop and do the right thing
Switch to sprint? Haha, the development community surrounding this phone is so immense that within hours after any carrier releases ANY update, it is ripped, stripped, and rereleased with unicarrier availability. I am running 3.49 on my xv6800, with radio 3.39, so..
Now, Sero is very, very appealing. $30 a month for unlimited Data is heavenly. I have free data due to some technical complications, but my family share plan with 700 minutes for 3 people costs more than 30 times 3.
Lmfao is it really going to make you feel better to take up the time of a rep that can't magically enable the gps function for you? Custom rom is the way to go, it's easy and you don't have to give anyone a headache in the process.
I swear, some of you are either illiterate, or just choose not to read certain parts.
gcincotta said:
You really need to learn to get a clue. In no way was my post "*****ing" or "complaining" about Verizon. I was merely pointing out that the times in the past when I was told certain things have come to an end because certain facts have finally been made public. If you can't see that then you need a lot of help my friend.
This site is for "technical data". What exactly is "technical data"? It's people like you that start the flames in these threads, not me. If you knew anything about this stuff you'd know that with carrier software updates comes updated radio roms, pri updates, driver updates, os updates, and more. Do you think these roms and kitchens just popped up out of nowhere? They magically created themselves? No, they came from official carrier releases and were extracted, cleaned, and tweaked. dcd and I have been looking for a solution for people to refresh their pri in case they accidentally let customizations run. A Verizon software update may contain something very useful in the extended rom that could help us develop it. I bet you didn't know that though right?
You've made it clear to everyone that YOU are the one who likes to "*****" and "complain", not me.
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lol.... ya I thought all of the software and drivers just popped out of someone ass My whole point in this ( which you missed totally) is, why start a thread to *****? Either way it really don't matter. Next time I'll keep my personal opinion to myself as I normally do.
The next time you make a thread to ***** maybe you might want to leave out the gay "/endrant" crap. What is a rant, may I ask sir? I'll answer it for you..... It means your *****ing!!!
steb0ne said:
It's funny, you're doing a lot of *****ing and whining in this thread; just leave it alone.
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Click to collapse
lol... I'm sorry about *****ing about him *****ing or whatever he's gonna call it. Next time I'll roll my eyes and continue without commenting.
Ok, so here is my story. I just got a T-Mobile HD2 yesterday. I successfully installed HPSL, and was running Android 2.2 beautifully. Except I had the problem with the distortion during calls. So I started searching...I must have done at least 3hrs of research before I did anything.
So what I was told was that I needed to flash the radio. I read dozens of forums with people talking about trying all different kinds of roms and people even going as far as saying that if you flash one that doesnt work, dont worry just reflash.
Well, I THOUGHT I had narrowed my search down to the rom I needed. I was under the impression that I should use this rom;
(Leo_RADIO_15.28.50.07U_2.05.51.05_2 (from HTC ** 1.48)
But I unintentionally downloaded this one;
Leo_RADIO_15.28.50.07U_2.05.50.11 **(from TMOUS 2.01)
Now My phone wont even come on! Ive heard people talking about un-bricking these phone, but they all start with going to the boot loader. Mine does NOTHING AT ALL....the light doesn't even come on when I plug the charger in
When I flashed it everything went fine, no errors, nothing, I had the htc loading bar on my screen, it hit 100% and it shut off and it wont come back on.
By the way, I flashed it via usb.
I have a bad feeling that I'm screwed. But if anyone can help it would be appreciated. As I received this phone from a friend who switched to the EVO, I don't even have the T-Mobile service yet, I was going to switch at the end of the month. I don't believe I have a way to get it replaced.
OK, so some more research has found that I definately installed the wrong rom...duh. and that this problem is specific to the tmobile phones.
At this point I have been reading about jtag, RIFF box to be specific. I would be willing to pay someone (a reasonable amount) if they could fix my phone. I'm may be willing to purchase my own riff box, if I cant get my hands on a new phone. I just don't want to spend $150 on a piece of equipment that ill only use once.
But if absolutely necessary, is there anyone out there willing to provide me with step by step instructions on how to connect the jtag to the phone, and run the software? I know its going to involve soldering, I have that coverd, But what and where to solder?
relik1989 said:
OK, so some more research has found that I definately installed the wrong rom...duh. and that this problem is specific to the tmobile phones.
At this point I have been reading about jtag, RIFF box to be specific. I would be willing to pay someone (a reasonable amount) if they could fix my phone. I'm may be willing to purchase my own riff box, if I cant get my hands on a new phone. I just don't want to spend $150 on a piece of equipment that ill only use once.
But if absolutely necessary, is there anyone out there willing to provide me with step by step instructions on how to connect the jtag to the phone, and run the software? I know its going to involve soldering, I have that coverd, But what and where to solder?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i hope someone answers and you get this fixed because after you hit a radio brick.. im lost.. thats time for me to call my insurance company..
good news is.. there are enough bricks on here that if you have to buy something that will fix a radio brick.. if you chaged $30 -$50 a phone to fix them you would have more phones in your hands than youd know what to do with and would def get your money back.
there was a thread that samsamuel and some other guy were discussing this. the other guy (forget who it was) can do this...but lives in south america. if you search for it, maybe he can help. yes, a very looooong shot...but an idea...
Well I have some good news, for me anyway, I did some research and found that the phone I had received is still under warranty until March. So I'm hoping that since its a complete brick that they wont be able to tell It was modified, and also I believe the rom I was trying to flash is actually an "official" rom(correct me if im wrong).
I have given serious thought to getting the riff box and selling the service, I could definitely use the money, but I don't know the first thing about how to use it.
Now, this seriously needs to be done!! What rom should the T-Mobile USA users use to flash the radio in there HTC HD2? I know I'm not the first or the last person who will brick there phone. I searched for over 3hrs and kept getting linked back to the same thread,
([REF]The HTC HD2 Radio ROM Thread)
Now while that does seem to be a very complete list of roms, nowhere does it give any info on what one to use for what device. Furthermore, I knew what phone I had, what model, the ram and rom size, all the jazz, but nowhere did anyone tell me that the !!T-Mobile!! HD2 was just "Slightly" different than the others. I didnt find that out until AFTER I bricked the phone, as did ALL of the other users who bricked there devices.
I, and most of the other bricked users would agree, there needs to be a thread(maybe even a sticky) that is solely dedicated to us T-Mobile HD2 users. So lets start here!
The primary and really only issue is this...what is the proper radio rom to use on these phones and what is the proper way to flash them? If this question can be discussed it will make many of us very happy.
BTW. Other than the robotic voices, the HD2 ran android AMAZING props to whoever created FroyoStone_Sense_V3.1. its simply amazing!
re post 1 unfortunately you haven't got your information right. the first one will def kill a tmous because it is a ..51.. radio, and the second one will also kill a tmous because 2.04.50.x and 2.05.50.x are from test roms and don't support the 576ram giving the same effect as a ..51.. radio.
re post 5 the radio thread you mentioned. i suspect you have been only reading the regular hd2 section, (this section) when in fact the tmous has it whole own section, complete with tmous radio thread with all these warnings.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=631
on a plus note loads of people have claimed on warranty, just don't mention flashing.
Thank you! I love to be proven wrong. (No sarcasm intended)
I had no idea there was a tmous thread. anyway this was the original radio thread
httpa:Z//Zforum.xda-developers.Zcom/showthread.Zphp?t=611787
I threw some Z's in the link because I'm still new here so I cant post links yet.
And no way did I tell HTC that I flashed the phone. I just told them that I put it on charge, went to bed, woke up, and it was dead as a doornail. I should have it back in 3 weeks.
When you get it back, stick to the tmous hd2 forums for flashing info. For everything else, though, I find the original hd2 forums we're in now a lot more informative and active. The phone are identical except for rom size and the fact you can't flash certain radios. But you can use the same software, etc.
Good luck returning your phone.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
We'll I should have my phone back within a few weeks. Apparently HTC repair is backed up, its got something to do with the Nexus One. I didnt say a word about it being hacked, so I hope they don't find out. But anyway, I wanted to thank all of you for the positive feed back with my problem, and for linking me to the right forum. I was expecting to be bombarded with people calling me an idiot, and saying things like "use the F'ing search button", but Instead I was given very useful and sympathetic replies, and all the info I need to not make the same mistake twice. Thank all of you, I wish the users of more forums could be this professional, helpful, and quite frankly this grown up.
Thank you.
P.S: Can anyone confirm or deny whether or not HTC will be able to recognize that the phone was hacked?
Okay, so i had android installed on my HD2, and now i tried to go back to an official rom, and i installed this one " 1.66.405.2 "
My phone is TMOUS.
My screen is black, no LED light when plugged in, but my computer still makes the " todoo " sound when i plug it in .. Is there anyway to fix it ?
And btw i tried to go into bootload menu, but screen stays black ..
No, its dead. You have flashed a non-tmous official rom that includes a ..51.. radio, and as has been shown thousands of times, ..51.. radios will always brick a tmous.
Your options are
JTAG
or
warranty.
What's JTAG ?
the same guy this dude sent it to should do the trick.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1019547
Argentinakidd said:
What's JTAG ?
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Click to collapse
basically it attaches to the processor and rewrites the basic low level code that allows teh chip to function. It involves dismantling the phone and isn't that cheap or easy.
Google "ORT JTAG" or 'RiffBox', and there are videos on youtube.
Your best bet would be to find someone local who
1 - has a JTAG box and jig (the jig holds the processor and costs about $20,, each phone/mainboard needs a different jig specifically for that phone... the ORT box and Riffbox cost around $100 or so)
and
2 - has the equipment to safely dismantle your phone
and
3 - knows how to operate a JTAG rig..... start calling local phone repair shops.
samsamuel said:
basically it attaches to the processor and rewrites the basic low level code that allows teh chip to function. It involves dismantling the phone and isn't that cheap or easy.
Google "ORT JTAG" or 'RiffBox', and there are videos on youtube.
Your best bet would be to find someone local who
1 - has a JTAG box and jig (the jig holds the processor and costs about $20,, each phone/mainboard needs a different jig specifically for that phone... the ORT box and Riffbox cost around $100 or so)
and
2 - has the equipment to safely dismantle your phone
and
3 - knows how to operate a JTAG rig..... start calling local phone repair shops.
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Click to collapse
Wow, well that is F***ed up ....
They should have separate threads for TMOUS and other roms ..
Argentinakidd said:
Wow, well that is F***ed up ....
They should have separate threads for TMOUS and other roms ..
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Click to collapse
the best thing to do when going stock is to just to the HTC site and enter your IMEI and it will hook you up with a stock ROM that won't brick your device.
Argentinakidd said:
Wow, well that is F***ed up ....
They should have separate threads for TMOUS and other roms ..
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Click to collapse
yea, , oh wait, , they do
HD2 Windows Mobile 6.5 ROM Development
T-Mobile HD2 Windows Mobile 6.5 Development
samsamuel said:
yea, , oh wait, , they do
HD2 Windows Mobile 6.5 ROM Development
T-Mobile HD2 Windows Mobile 6.5 Development
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You are correct same but we both know not all ROMs featured in the T-Mobile HD2 Windows Mobile 6.5 Development section are safe for TMOUS HD2s. The 2.01 in the "Leo 1.5 T-MOBILE Test & Stock ROMS" thread is not safe for a TMOUS HD2. And even though the " [ROM] Leo Test ROMS (HT97/HT98) (29-AUG-20l10)" thread is in the HD2 Windows Mobile 6.5 Development section. Non of the ROMs featured in that thread are safe for the TMOUS HD2s but there is no warning posted at the top of the thread about this. Now I know people should see it says Test ROMs but if they do not know about the instant brick by the wrong radio, or think all 50 radios are ok then theycare going to flash it. It should because warnning clearly posted in the thread. Then people can truly say that peoplechave no one but thereselfs to blame because it is a clear warning posted.
If I have a dog that will bit people and the local preacher comes by to invite me to church services that Sunday. And my dog bites him, he can Sue me. But if I have beware of a beware of dog sign posted in my yard or on my house he can not Sue me. Do you get my point?
At the OP contact me via PM and I can put you in contactcwith connexion2005 tovget your HD2 JTAGed.
Not wanting a fight, its far too sunny for that. but none of your examples address the fact that he flashed a non tmous stock rom. This isn't a bad choice of radio, or stuck on test spl, or test 50radio brick. I DO see your point, but you can't expect every single potentially damaging thread to carry such warnings. This isn't a pre school, its up to the user to do their research, and correct me if I'm wrong but there must be hundreds if not thousands of posts warning against non tmous stock roms. Its sad, but lack of research is no excuse. I once bricked (well, test spl locked, unflashable un bootable ) an elfin, no warning by the dl link, started reading and hey presto, 20 minutes later it was obvious what id done and why it locked, had I researched properly first it wouldn't have happened, ,,,,, not the posters fault, totally down to me assuming I knew what I was doing, but didn't.
samsamuel said:
Not wanting a fight, its far too sunny for that. but none of your examples address the fact that he flashed a non tmous stock rom. This isn't a bad choice of radio, or stuck on test spl, or test 50radio brick. I DO see your point, but you can't expect every single potentially damaging thread to carry such warnings. This isn't a pre school, its up to the user to do their research, and correct me if I'm wrong but there must be hundreds if not thousands of posts warning against non tmous stock roms. Its sad, but lack of research is no excuse. I once bricked (well, test spl locked, unflashable un bootable ) an elfin, no warning by the dl link, started reading and hey presto, 20 minutes later it was obvious what id done and why it locked, had I researched properly first it wouldn't have happened, ,,,,, not the posters fault, totally down to me assuming I knew what I was doing, but didn't.
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Click to collapse
Oh don't take it as a aggressive come back as my post was not meant like that and I am not trying to fight at all. And the OP did flash a non TMOUS ROM. I was just pointing out that it is not always far to just say it was from lack of research, but in this case yes it was obviously.
No this is not preschool, although not everyone on XDA is an adult. I have seen post of people saying they are only 13, 14, and 15 years old on here. Not all in the HD2 forums, yes I venture off to other forums for friends sometimes to help them hack there device lol. But my point is anyone who posts on here has justcas much responsability to not lead others astray and warn of potential dangers as each indevidual has to research and protect themselves, or more like their device, from harm. I personally am just as concerned for my fellow man as I am for myself. Now I know that is just me and a lot of people do not have that same mind set. But I feel our world would be a much better lace if it was.
One last thing and I will unhyjack this thread. Why do you think companies put warnning and attention stickers and tags all over products now days? It is to release them from any liability if things go bad do to a user/customer not reading the instructions or not using the product properly and they get hurt or break the product. Those tags give the company the right to say "Hey we told you so." Just asca warnning in a thread would give everyone the right to say "Hey we told you so."
Peace to all and have a great day, it is raining bucks at my house today
Xda-"developers", not xda-"handholders". This site was never intended to provide support, it was a place for technical people to hack HTC phones, which back then had few non technical users. Just because in the last year or two there has been a large influx of technically unskilled people and kids, who read 1 post and do whatever it says, doesn't mean people who have been here developing for years are at any fault when said non-readers screw up .
In the case of the tmous stock and test roms thread you are right there should be a warning, but that's about the only example.
Anyway, like you said, thread un hijacked, time for a joint in the last of the sun.
I received the below e-mail today. I did not appreciate being contacted out of the blue via e-mail; if you feel the need to contact me, use XDA's tagging feature. With that said, I thought I'd reply in public with my thoughts on the matter, hoping to drive a constructive conversation about Verizon Wireless' restrictions for devices on their network. My initial response is in post 2.
Please, think through your responses before posting. Make sure they ADD to the conversation.
What do you think of having everyone from XDA and the CM community using the DINC 4G LTE file Better Business Bureau complaints against verizon? It made a business decision not to give us updates, and has deliberately removed the DINC 4g from the HTC Unlock program. They shouldn't be allowed to abandon the platform and to remove unlocking ability that was there.
BBB asks them to respond within 14 days. [edit: link removed]
or have you already tried this route?
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I will leave it up to the writer of the e-mail if he/she would like to make himself/herself known here.
Can you point to a single advertisement by either HTC or Verizon that the Droid Incredible 4G LTE would ever be included in HTCDev's unlocked bootloader program? Even HTC's generic advertisements include disclaimers that some devices may not be included due to various restrictions (the most obvious being carrier refusal). HTC can justify the ability to unlock the bootloader pre-public availability as a means to let developers directly related to software development and quality assurance alter the ROM before release. To a handful of end users who get the device in the early days of release, they get to sneak in and use the unlocker under the "Other devices" category of the program. I suspect we owe HTC a thank you for dragging their feet for a week before disabling the unlock ability for this (and several other) device(s). There is no legitimate complaint that can be filed towards Verizon concerning this matter since they never advertised this as an available feature.
On the topic of abandoning the platform, software-wise, the last available software update for the Incredible 4G still works with reasonable stability and all advertised features are enabled. It is natural for technology devices to age and need replacement; a balance has to be struck between user content or disdain and extent of support. Verizon has apparently deemed there will be very little blowback by prematurely ending software updates. Considering the number of users I see in the XDA forum section for this phone, I'd guess they're right. About the only sticking point that could be leveraged to force a software update out of Verizon is if there are security vulnerabilities that are either being actively exploited or pose a real threat of being exploited in the near future.
Succinctly, we are at the mercy of Verizon's "generosity" concerning extended functionality of, and software updates for, the phones on their network. With these thoughts, I believe we can only ask them to help us out... with reason, anger, begging, or whatever tactic you find most influential. I don't think we can force their hand.
Your thoughts XDAers?
I agree with mdmower. Having come from the OG Droid, I had zero expectation for HTC or Verizon to let me unlock the phone. While I did not expect this phone to be the left-handed, red-haired step-child twice removed orphan of Verizon, it is a great phone with a 4" screen. The size is good (still prefer OG Droid) and the processor and internet speeds are great. I personally am quite content with this phone. We have been blessed with some extremely talented developers and supporters who have
Developed a method to unlock despite HTC/Verizon
Developed two methods for s-off:
DirtyRacun - IMHO, unlimited.io did a great job
FacePalm - Haven't tried, but looks great
Two great recoveries:
Official CWM Recovery, Plus PhilZ
TWRP Recovery
Developed an Incredible Rock Solid Sense ROM in ViperLTE
Developed a solid, official CyanogenMod ROM .
There are probably more, but those are just off of the top of my head. I am also still seeing great ongoing development work for ROMs for this phone. Sure, this phone doesn't have the plethora of ROMs that the OG Droid, Dinc2, Rezound, or [insert model here], but what we do have is solid.
I'm not exactly sure what Verizon owes us. We have a great phone with a great 4GLTE network (at least in my area). It should also be noted that Verizon actually put out an OTA for the OG Dinc around 2+ years after its release with "Improvements and fixes". I would expect the same for this phone as well. I too believe that threats, anger, etc. will not do anything more than generate ill will.
Just my $0.03.
P.S. Why do we still care if there is an "official" bootloader unlock? As mentioned above, we have a proved method to unlock bootloader and/or gain s-off. Even HTC's site says that unlocking bootloader through their "official" site may void your warranty.
HTC Dev said:
Please understand that you will not be able to return your device to the original state and going forward your device may not be held covered under the warranty for all claims resulting from the unlocking of the bootloader. HTC bears no responsibility if your device is no longer usable afterwards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only thing to take away from this is to avoid Verizon and HTC. They may not owe us anything more than we received, but they are clearly sub-par companies compared to others. Unfortunately, I can't ditch Verizon just now because I'm on a shared plan, but I will never buy an HTC phone again.
junkmail9 said:
I agree with mdmower. Having come from the OG Droid, I had zero expectation for HTC or Verizon to let me unlock the phone....
P.S. Why do we still care if there is an "official" bootloader unlock?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to clarify, I'm not content with the support Verizon has offered for this phone, I just realize that we cannot expect them to continue support. I am still not sure about the best avenues of communication with Verizon Wireless, so in a feeble attempt to get their attention, I write a short #openletter on G+.
A far as the official bootloader unlock, it is a little important. An example is the recently advertised CM installer (by the way, I do not have any insider knowledge about CM Inc.). The installer will almost surely be available only to devices with legitimate unlock ability. While the fireball is pretty much "a bit"-out-of-luck even if it did get official unlock, due to the inability to flash the boot partition while in recovery, at some point users need to convince Verizon Wireless to allow unlocked bootloaders for phones on their network. This is especially relevant to the many, many users who are wise enough to not tinker with their phones because of lack of knowledge. They deserve the opportunity to safely replace the legacy operating system on their phone, and this will only be possible if the carrier and manufacturer allow it.
The open letter seems pointless, besides maybe allowing other people to see and take note that Verizon ignores certain customers. As far as our phone though, no point really. Anyone you reach through G+, Facebook, Twitter, Verizon's customer service contacts, etc. will have no real power to do anything. They just give the typical "sorry, we're doing our best" garbage. The message never reaches anyone important enough to actually do anything. The only way a message may get to them is if the user base is very large, but even if we all wrote to them everyday it wouldn't help. Not enough people for them to care. As you said, we're at their mercy. Just have to wait.
mdmower said:
A far as the official bootloader unlock, it is a little important. An example is the recently advertised CM installer (by the way, I do not have any insider knowledge about CM Inc.). The installer will almost surely be available only to devices with legitimate unlock ability. While the fireball is pretty much "a bit"-out-of-luck even if it did get official unlock, due to the inability to flash the boot partition while in recovery, at some point users need to convince Verizon Wireless to allow unlocked bootloaders for phones on their network. This is especially relevant to the many, many users who are wise enough to not tinker with their phones because of lack of knowledge. They deserve the opportunity to safely replace the legacy operating system on their phone, and this will only be possible if the carrier and manufacturer allow it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is an excellent point I had not considered. I was not thinking about the larger issue, (nor am I savvy with the upcoming CM installer). Unfortunately, I have run into a few companies that have seriously dummied down their products because, as one tech support person told me, "some users may have a problem with the advanced features so we removed them." While I can try and understand that point, it was really frustrating because some advanced features I had come to rely on were removed in the product upgrade. Simply because some people could not comprehend how to use it properly? Is Verizon trying to protect us from ourselves, dummy down the phones for "the uneducated masses," or simply trying to force their customers to live with Verizon-installed bloatware?
Okay I have My own say to this.!
Okay so I left AT&T network when I owned the HTC Inspire 4g and moved on to Verizon because there service was better in my area and I purchased the HTC Droid Incredible 4G LTE as my first phone with Verizon, I came to like the phone because it was fast, snappy, and good on battery....... But I constantly waited for update to jellybean ( Sense 4+ ) which in reality would make the device more efficient and smoother than it was on Ice Cream Sandwich... And finally I heard the news that we were going to get an update to jellybean in the beginning of 2013.. But after so much time of waiting I finally gave up hope and said ***k the device and went back to AT&T...... and bought the HTC One XL because it recieved updates to sense 5. The device is like an older sibling to the inc4g with close to the same specs. I sold the Incredible 4g because I hated the lack of support for this device... The only good thing going for it was CM10 and the amazing sense kernel. This community deserves more than what has been given to them so far... So my question is why Verizon drop support for us.???? If this community received jelly bean j defiantly would sell my XL and come back to this community......
This is my only my concern.
Sincerely,
24ky
Sent from my HTC One XL using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Here is a weird thought. let your money do the talking. leave Verizon. if enough of us leave we dont need to "change their minds". i brought this up in an HTC elevate detection not to long ago ( also how come htc bent over backwards because verizon wanted the bootload unlock for the ONE removed). instead of open letters or angry tweets and emails, just take your money to someone that appreciates you as a customer? put your money into a company that understands the development community and is willing to support you. how do you think verizon got so good? the used to listen to their customers. now that they are self sustaining they dont need to listen to us anymore. but i bet if their wallet was hit the would. they would bring back unlimited data, remove the block of google wallet, ect....
You wouldn't take your car to a mechanic that does great work but also makes you spend $$ money on things that don't need to be fixed.
my $.02
synisterwolf said:
Here is a weird thought. let your money do the talking. leave Verizon. if enough of us leave we dont need to "change their minds" i brought this up in an HTC elevate detection not to long ago. instead of open letters or angry tweets, just take your money to someone that appreciates you as a customer? put your money into a company that understands the development community and is willing to support you.
You wouldn't take your car to a mechanic that does great work but also makes you spend $$ money on things that don't need to be fixed.
my $.02
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This is my point from before. This is the only thing you can really do. I wish I could dump Verizon right now, but I can't. For now I'll just settle for never buying HTC again.
somerandomname1 said:
This is my point from before. This is the only thing you can really do. I wish I could dump Verizon right now, but I can't. For now I'll just settle for never buying HTC again.
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this too. maybe if HTC where to step in and help us it would be different.
OP not trying to troll or anything or start a war. i just wanted to get that out their. we do have an option to take our money somewhere else. or at least when this contract is over. ive said it before, i need unlimited data. i dont have wifi anywhere i work and im barely at home so if i have to give up my data plan i will give up my business too. im going to miss there unbeatable coverage but i cant stand to be hit in the balls over and over again with a smile on their face. :/
mdmower said:
I received the below e-mail today. I did not appreciate being contacted out of the blue via e-mail; if you feel the need to contact me, use XDA's tagging feature. With that said, I thought I'd reply in public with my thoughts on the matter, hoping to drive a constructive conversation about Verizon Wireless' restrictions for devices on their network. My initial response is in post 2.
Please, think through your responses before posting. Make sure they ADD to the conversation.
I will leave it up to the writer of the e-mail if he/she would like to make himself/herself known here.
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My 2 cents on this from bitter experience. You will get zilch. You will waste precious amounts of your life trying hard to convince a rigid management who can care so little they'd be happy to break your phone to pieces and hand you another from their stockpile of dinc4g's just to get rid of them ASAP. I've gone through the whole lot with BBB complaints etc. for the Droid X2 by Motorola. haha, wasted my life there. And the countless pleadings to release the ICS ROM that HTC clearly developed for the Dinc2 (Incredible S, international variant got the ICS update) only to get on the Verizon chopping block and get its head unceremoniously severed, taught me one thing and that is we as consumers have knowingly chosen this path, that will give us limited to no flexibility on customization to stay on VZW and we have to "deal" with it.
With all good intentions, I request all to keep your expectations rock bottom. You have better chances of going to the moon on a future Russian spacecraft than convincing Verizon as to why this may be a good idea.
Sincerely,
A disgruntled Droid™ user.
here has been my android experience. started on og inc oct 2010 first droid phone considered ''high-end'' at the time (8 mp camera saaaaay whaaaat??!) then dinc2 great phone but compared to the galaxy S II and the galaxy nexus at the time it was a ''mid range" phone. now with the inc4g it is very ''mid range'' compared to what is out now. the galaxy notes and s4's and the 50 different htc One(s). if you want many different roms to flash to fix your ''addiction'' go nexus or one of the mainstream phones. you will find 100 different "Unofficial CM10.X" roms with "user tweaks" and "kernel tweaks" that in all actuality are nothing more then a reposync from source. yeah they might have a few different mods but they are usually so similar that you will not/could not tell the difference. like someone mentioned earlier I would rather have a few solid roms. a good sense (viper) or if you're an aosp guy like me there's cm. I think anybody who saw the specs of this phone (incredible 4g) and thought, "hey this is going to be the next BIG THING." I'm sorry to tell you that you were mistaken. xda dev support of a phone is only as good as the devs that own the device, and in our case we have a very small amount of active devs.
So I am the a-hole that emailed mdmower. I apologize profusely. When I saw your first post, I almost slunk away in shame, never to show my face here again. I am not even being a little bit facetious. You do great work for a community of people and I abused (what obviously is) an important rule. And I'm really sorry.
In an attempt to redeem myself just a little bit, let me point out one thing that you might not know:
mdmower said:
Can you point to a single advertisement by either HTC or Verizon that the Droid Incredible 4G LTE would ever be included in HTCDev's unlocked bootloader program? Even HTC's generic advertisements include disclaimers that some devices may not be included due to various restrictions (the most obvious being carrier refusal) [SNIP] There is no legitimate complaint that can be filed towards Verizon concerning this matter since they never advertised this as an available feature.
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Actually, some states may have more favorable law here. First and foremost, many states have an unfair/deceptive business practices law that are distinct from the false advertising law. Example: New York has GBL Section 349 (trade practices), and 350 (Advertising). These are consumer-oriented statutes and so they have some bite.
On this point, while Verizon has never said they would provide us with Jelly Bean, there are some nice facts here like how many people were locked into 2 year contracts on a phone that Verizon stopped updating during their two year period. I've seen suggestions that Verizon is pulling this with older phones in order to force upgrades, and if true, that would be the basis for a claim. But here, I think the HTCDev unlock is actually pretty damning. We should be entitled to take discovery into the real reasons why Verizon forced HTC to remove the phone from the program. Given the repeated warnings about waiver of warranty, and the presence of other VZW phones in the program, it's hard to believe it's a support issue.
Finally -- of note is that the ACLU has filed an FTC complaint on this subject earlier this year. Unfortunately I cannot post the link since I just registered for this post (long time lurker) but it's the 2nd hit for "april FTC complaint android" (see pages 6-9) Their basis is the potential for security flaws which go unfixed. The relief they are requesting is pretty broad. I'm actually surprised that there haven't been follow-on civil suits already.
Anyway, I am really sorry again. I'm going to crawl back under the rock I came from now.
If it's any comfort: my punishment is that my D4INC is a flicker model.
PrimePalaver said:
If it's any comfort: my punishment is that my D4INC is a flicker model.
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Haha burn! Just kidding... it's cool.