I'm sure the Evo 3d will be every bit as capable as the Tegra 2 devices. But nvidia has the developers courted in a big way. I'm not a huge gamer, but I do enjoy the 10 or so on my Evo 4g. I'd have to say games on the Evo 4g are underwhelming. So I'm excited about the 3d having the chops for some serious games. But now I'm afraid that the qualcomm processor means it simply won't get the cool games with so many developers committed to Tegra 2. And some of these Tegra 2 games look pretty sweet.
With the rumor of a Tegra 2 device on Sprint, I question if it would be worth waiting for. What do y'all thing? Will qualcomm get the gaming love from developers? Will these cool Tegra games be ported to other capable dual core devices?
Fragmentation...
I was just thinking about this earlier. WTF is nvidia thinking?
THAT is *actual* fragmentation that everyone is talking about. That's not a difference of a simple version number that can be upgraded....things for download in the market that WILL NOT WORK on 90% of all phones? That's terrible. That's selfish. That will. not. help.
Even if they own 90% of the market its still wrong. LEss obvious, but wrong just the same. I hope nvidia fails and goes out of business for that maneuver. There is nothing keeping the game from running on non tegra² GPU's....sure, it probably won't run great....that's fine....but to have it look for a vendorID string and say 'sorry' just cuz you bought the wrong brand? That's insulting. Go ahead, tear the android market in 2 pieces.
...I think they'll fail on that front. What scumbags. Take something that is a legitmate but fringe concern (fragmentation) and turn it into a legitmate and very very real (market leading?) issue.
I'm not a gamer, but, it will suck that there are games I can't play--at any performance level--cuz I'm not wearing the right brand sneakers...or whatever.
fnck nvidia. That's all marketing and branding, lets keep it a strictly performance based game with standards as the rules...
chainfire3d is an app that is currently allowing tegra zone on most 1ghz devices. I'm not worried about the Evo 3D getting games because we can run anything the tegra 2 devices can AND there are 3D games coming very soon (3DS ports).
I feel this tatic of terga exclusive games will either fail by the end of the year or most high end phones on the next generation will have a terga processor including whatever HTCs next line will be. Personally I'm skeptical that this will take off. They do seem to have a developer following and if I was more of a gamer I couldn't see buying a non terga phone. SO maybe I'm wrong.
@daneurysm
Exactly! Forget Froyo vs. GB. This is the fragmentation that really sucks for consumers.
@sprinttouch666
chainfire3d looks pretty sweet. hadn't seen that before. I won't even bother loading that on my Evo cause I'm sure it'll choke with a beefy game. But it looks like we'll have to be quick to get root and S-off for the 3d to see what this app can do for it. But 3ds ports may be quite a job since they'd have to code out the DS part. Not sure how many game devs would bother for 2 or 3 3d capable phones in the whole market.
Check your specs fellas, qualcomm's processors blow the Tegra 2 out of the water... Tegra has dual 1ghz synced cores, Qualcomm has dual 1.2ghz asynchronous cores. Qualcomm's chips also feature the Adreno GPU which is faster and more efficient than the Tegra 2's minimalist GPU. Do some Googling to confirm then rest assured, the EVO 3D IS the droid you're looking for *waves hand like Obi Wan*
dimebagdan65 said:
Check your specs fellas, qualcomm's processors blow the Tegra 2 out of the water... Tegra has dual 1ghz synced cores, Qualcomm has dual 1.2ghz asynchronous cores. Qualcomm's chips also feature the Adreno GPU which is faster and more efficient than the Tegra 2's minimalist GPU. Do some Googling to confirm then rest assured, the EVO 3D IS the droid you're looking for *waves hand like Obi Wan*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So the EVO 3d's chip outperforms these Tegra chips? I thought they were only releasing it for the Tegra chips because they might have been more powerful. Good to know if this isn't the case.
Now what is in the GS2 as I saw a benchmark video and it blew the Sensation out of the water? I know those benchmarks aren't everyhing but will the SG2 be that much more powerful then the Evo 3d?
I think tegra2 is possibly the slowest of the dual core bunch. BUT when games are coded specifically for that chip, will it matter that qualcomm's chip is better? What good is all that power if all the high quality games only run on tegra?
And you can't blame devs for coding to the most popular chip out for android. That chip is in phones, tabs, and more
Don't forget to blame the developers too, nvidia drives a dump truck full of money to their front porch and says "make this game work only on tegra2 devices".
dimebagdan65 said:
Check your specs fellas, qualcomm's processors blow the Tegra 2 out of the water... Tegra has dual 1ghz synced cores, Qualcomm has dual 1.2ghz asynchronous cores. Qualcomm's chips also feature the Adreno GPU which is faster and more efficient than the Tegra 2's minimalist GPU. Do some Googling to confirm then rest assured, the EVO 3D IS the droid you're looking for *waves hand like Obi Wan*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The EVO 3D isn't a droid.
fmedina2 said:
The EVO 3D isn't a droid.
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Click to collapse
That's a matter of interpretation. Anything running android is considered a 'droid' phone by most people. Then there are a few purists that believe only the phones made by motorola with Droid in there name can be considered 'droid'.
Whatever.
SteelH said:
That's a matter of interpretation. Anything running android is considered a 'droid' phone by most people. Then there are a few purists that believe only the phones made by motorola with Droid in there name can be considered 'droid'.
Whatever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
meh droid has always been a abbreviation for android, in all reality an android phone named droid is silly
I don't think I heard a single person refer to Android as "droid" prior to Verizon's marketing campaign...Droid is Verizon's branding, not Moto's or Samsung's or anyone else's...
I wouldn't be picky if it wasn't for the fact that "DROID" is so obvious on all Droid products. You definitely know if your phone is a droid and you definitely know if it isn't.
Benchmarks I've seen all put Exynos/Tegra/MSM8x60 slightly behind the new TI OMAP4. No matter what you choose it's going to be ridiculous. At the level these phones are at you cant go wrong.
Im pretty sure you'll still be able to play the games if you want to but they'll have a version special made for the tegra 2. It wouldn't surprise me if qualcomm started doing something similar but I'm not going to be buying a game that is nerfed even though my phone can handle it just fine.
Everybody's bringing up good (and funny) points, in the long run, once dual core processors are the norm, I think we'll see these "processor specific" games go the way of the dodo
dimebagdan65 said:
Everybody's bringing up good (and funny) points, in the long run, once dual core processors are the norm, I think we'll see these "processor specific" games go the way of the dodo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It reminds me of 3D graphics cards in the late 90's. You had to get a game made for your 3Dfx card to get 3D...or whatever mfgr....but that was the state of the software at the time, we lacked a common API, directX/directdraw was a mere infant at the time and Direct3D was only in beta testing...progress in progress.
Now they are trying to intentionally revert to this horrible horrible situation in the name of branding. They want to enslave you to a market for just their processors and/or supported games.....but it's not an API problem, its a vendorID string problem--and that's just effed up.
So in conclusion we need google to make something like directx???
riptide looks AWESOMEEEE to bad I will not be buying a tegra phone..... all of them suck (atrix has pentile display and blur, optimus 2x has lots of problems, droid x2 same as atrix)
scores87 said:
So in conclusion we need google to make something like directx???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, the companies involved need to just not do this. There are already APIs to cover this.
Game developers are getting bribed, ahem, "courted" to support this chipset. The actual performance difference is likely negligible to keep it compatible all around. Even if it isn't negligible so long as it runs on everything android so be it--they just have a better graphics chip. Competition drives innovation.
But if they are just making it suck on non tegra2 devices by pulling the deviceID string, well, that's just disgusting.
scores87 said:
So in conclusion we need google to make something like directx???
riptide looks AWESOMEEEE to bad I will not be buying a tegra phone..... all of them suck (atrix has pentile display and blur, optimus 2x has lots of problems, droid x2 same as atrix)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it's more a matter of the chip makers purposely trying to fragment, when programming it's always faster to write native code then use APIs (as talking directly to the hardware instead of going through android) but different chip makers are using different commands and incorporating their own customized features directly into the chips.
I would be surprised if google doesn't put their foot down and stop this sooner or later.
Related
.
I have searched everywhere to find exactly what Qualcomm processor is actually inside the flyer because I am confused for three good reasons...
1, even in the official HTC Flyer spec it just states 1.5Ghz processor (no chip number)
2, most reviews I've seen are just copying what they have seen in other reviews stating a 'single-core' Qualcomm Snapdragon processor but this then leads me to item 3.....
3, Qualcomm only make single-core Snapdragon processors to a max speed of 1.4Ghz, the only 1.5Ghz units are the MSM8260 and the MSM8660 which are both dual-core asynchronous CPU's which are more power efficient than a synchronous Tegra2 that cannot shut down the second core when not used.
.
Ref: http://www.qualcomm.com/snapdragon/specs
Any one explain this?
ARM v7 rev.2 (v7l)
HTC flyer has an overclocked 8255 at 1.5 GHZ. which is a second generation snapdragon with adreno 205 CPU. It is found in the HTc Desire HD aka HTC inspire, tmobile g2, and some more.
Sent from my HTC Flyer P512
.
While I welcome your posts guys, please follow my example and post an actual, FACTUAL reference to your comments to show where your information came from, HTC preferable as they sell the darn things, not some dudes blog.
Dont want UK newspaper type gossip stuff.
Anyone got any photos of the actual chip in the Flyer?
It would not suprise me if the print had been physically removed....
.
Even found this, a full open of the Flyer...
http://www.techrepublic.com/photos/cracking-open-the-htc-flyer/6256123
But still no sign of a CPU, only one unknown chip hidden by screening.
Strange....
Farsquidge said:
.
Even found this, a full open of the Flyer...
http://www.techrepublic.com/photos/cracking-open-the-htc-flyer/6256123
But still no sign of a CPU, only one unknown chip hidden by screening.
Strange....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Interesting... Well the breakdown is there for you to follow. Report back when you figure out what's under the metal shielding. . Maybe its the Samsung chip?
The article criicizes the tablet for a smartphone design... Which I disagree with. My thoughts are the device doesn't have the 10" space to NOT stack components on top of each other. And why reinvent the wheel? When youhave successful phones, why not bank on your expertise?
Anyway back to the subject, I'm pretty happy with the device. Not too concerned about what's under the covers, because quite frankly it performs well with the overclocked snapdragon... The device's pen integration and more "openess" of Android is what retired my iPad.
Farsquidge said:
.
While I welcome your posts guys, please follow my example and post an actual, FACTUAL reference to your comments to show where your information came from, HTC preferable as they sell the darn things, not some dudes blog.
Dont want UK newspaper type gossip stuff.
Anyone got any photos of the actual chip in the Flyer?
It would not suprise me if the print had been physically removed....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why your welcome Mr. Rude. Mine came from info off my tab itself. If you want more open yours up and find out for yourself.
T120ted said:
Why your welcome Mr. Rude. Mine came from info off my tab itself. If you want more open yours up and find out for yourself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never seen a Snapdragon processor that quotes an ARM architecture type on its surface!
And childish name calling is not in the spirit of this forum....
All I'm trying to determine here is whether HTC may be using one core of a dual-core chip that may improve Honeycomb.
Farsquidge said:
Never seen a Snapdragon processor that quotes an ARM architecture type on its surface!
And childish name calling is not in the spirit of this forum....
All I'm trying to determine here is whether HTC may be using one core of a dual-core chip that may improve Honeycomb.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Preety sure it is single core. If it was dual core they would certainly advertise it as such as a selling point.
Sent from my HTC Flyer P510e using XDA Premium App
Farsquidge said:
Never seen a Snapdragon processor that quotes an ARM architecture type on its surface!
And childish name calling is not in the spirit of this forum....
All I'm trying to determine here is whether HTC may be using one core of a dual-core chip that may improve Honeycomb.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It makes no sense for HTC to disable one core of a dual core chip.
tommyz2kool said:
It makes no sense for HTC to disable one core of a dual core chip.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unless for some reason they could not get Google certification on Gingerbread unless they did!
This is pure speculation but, what if HTC designed the Flyer to originally use an MSM8260 or 8660 as the Puccini is going to use with Honeycomb, found out that they could not get Sense integrated into Honeycomb in time for distribution, THEN found out that Google would not certify it for Gingerbread unless it was a single-core system?
It just seems strange that they will have (if and when we get HC) two tablets out within a year, both with HC, one 7" one 10" but with different processors.
If if if... for someone who wants hard facts your head sure is in the clouds.
I'd prefer to have a dual core, but my flyer is flying fast enough for me to be happy.
So is it a single or dual???? I'm confused...LOL...
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
trucaliber said:
If if if... for someone who wants hard facts your head sure is in the clouds.
I'd prefer to have a dual core, but my flyer is flying fast enough for me to be happy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So long as everyone identifies fact and speculation, there is no problem is there?
Yes, I would prefer a dual-core myself if we have an update to HC coming.
jimmyusmc said:
So is it a single or dual???? I'm confused...LOL...
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, me too!! That's the whole point of this thread.
The chip was made by Qualcomm. I'm not trying to rain on your parade or be rude. Thinking it is a Sammy chip is a little out there. At the time this was developed Sammy was to busy laying in bed with Apple making chips for their eyepads. If it were a dual core chip let's just say for the fun of it, this would be some hell of a dual core to be clocked at 1.5ghz before the second core gets activated. Not even gonna happen. There's not enough of any kind of heatsink inside this thing to keep that kinda heat down on a regular basis. Just my two cents but heh, everyone has to have some kinda pipe dream. This single core blows the doors off all the duals out there. I'm happy as it is.
Farsquidge said:
This is pure speculation but, what if HTC designed the Flyer to originally use an MSM8260 or 8660 as the Puccini is going to use with Honeycomb, found out that they could not get Sense integrated into Honeycomb in time for distribution, THEN found out that Google would not certify it for Gingerbread unless it was a single-core system?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why wouldn't google certify it? There are plenty of dual core phones with gingerbread..
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA Premium App
joshnichols189 said:
Why wouldn't google certify it? There are plenty of dual core phones with gingerbread..
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure myself but I know it's not a phone and it could be (maybe HTC didn't want to reduce their phone sales, to the chagrin of most of us) so that may change things.... It was only speculation.
Although Archos had the same certification problem with their Gen8 units because they left out phone, GPS and rear camera.
Honeycomb however is specifically targeted at tablets, so Google will certify without phone function leading me to think the Flyer was really designed for that in mind but they never got it skinned in time for release.
T120ted said:
The chip was made by Qualcomm. I'm not trying to rain on your parade or be rude. Thinking it is a Sammy chip is a little out there. At the time this was developed Sammy was to busy laying in bed with Apple making chips for their eyepads. If it were a dual core chip let's just say for the fun of it, this would be some hell of a dual core to be clocked at 1.5ghz before the second core gets activated. Not even gonna happen. There's not enough of any kind of heatsink inside this thing to keep that kinda heat down on a regular basis. Just my two cents but heh, everyone has to have some kinda pipe dream. This single core blows the doors off all the duals out there. I'm happy as it is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are perhaps thinking of standard PC type CPU's not mobile ones.
The new low-power 45nM dual-core Snapdragons ARE asynchronous ( each core has independent clock and voltage supplies) , are 1.5GHZ, and don't need large heatsinks....
Ref: http://www.qualcomm.com/documents/snapdragon-msm8x60-apq8060-product-brief
And yes, I'm also happy with the Flyer as it is, it's overall performance and UI is better than anything else I've tried.
But, as you say, it may be a pipe dream. But (here we go again, sorry) what would owners do at this moment if HTC had announced a dual-core Flyer only using one core? They wouldn't be very happy would they...
And what will people say when suddenly we get Honeycomb with dual-core? They wouldn't complain then...
Yep, I am probably dreaming but wouldn't it be nice if they pull that rabbit out of the hat.
According to Qualcomm it is an MSM8x55. You can find more info here at the same link you posted in the OP:
http://www.qualcomm.com/snapdragon/specs
Scroll down about halfway where it talks about High Performance Smartphones and Tablets and it mentions the Flyer near the bottom of the section.
I own a transformer 101, galaxy tab 10.1, xoom fe and a ipad 2.
Portable gaming has become very big! Alot of people like to game on the go... With that being said the GPU of future tablets should have some impressive portable gaming on the way.
You can find benchmark tests online that show that the SGX543MP2 is more capable than tegra 3s gpu. But how well does the tegra 3 really stack up against it? I would really like to know and compare which will be better for portable gaming.
What are your opinions on this? Does it matter to you that the next gen of andorid tablets seems to have a weaker GPU than a year old tablet? Or do you think the GPU in the prime will be great for tablet gaming for the next year?
Sure I game on my PC when im at home but when I am on the go I like to have a nice tablet device that can also play some killer games!
ILl be the first. WHO CARES! plus this is a redundant/repeat thread. Just because you put it in question form doesn't make it any different from the other thread. Members here already see you as trolling. Always talking about how this or that not better than ipad2. You the only one who sole reason for a tablet is gaming. Gaming is fine on the prime and can do way more than just play games. I play them also but not my main concern. Plus this new chipset is overall better than ipad2. The reviews showed it and several other members think so also.
So if you think you can convince members here to believe apple/ipad2 is better than Android, you lost. Talk about something intelligent for once other then friggn gaming. Most people have lives, work jobs. Gaming is only a hobby/pastime. You make it seem like all you do is gaming. Such focus on gaming must mean you are young or probably a teenager.
Project IRON FIST initiated . You are just so obvious at trolling about apple in an Android forum. At least be discreet about it.
jleewong said:
*no trolls please*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I knew your name looked familiar.
This thread is not about chipset.. its about the GPU, if you dont have anything helpful or informative to post then dont post.
We are not interested about how you are butt-hurt about every little negative having to do with the Prime... I am just trying to get a better comparison of last years best tablet (imo) to the new ones coming out.
I suppose your going to delete this thread too but I think people have the right to know about this information and discuss it.
Ipad 2 is the only apple product I have ever owned and I also own multiple android devices. So please stop with the "droid fan boy act" and try to be informative for once and have a open mind.
jleewong said:
This thread is not about chipset.. its about the GPU, if you dont have anything helpful or informative to post then dont post.
We are not interested about how you are butt-hurt about every little negative having to do with the Prime... I am just trying to get a better comparison of last years best tablet (imo) to the new ones coming out.
I suppose your going to delete this thread too but I think people have the right to know about this information and discuss it.
Ipad 2 is the only apple product I have ever owned and I also own multiple android devices. So please stop with the "droid fan boy act" and try to be informative for once and have a open mind.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you gave me a thank for calling you a troll... uh.. mmk. ur just contradicting yourself. but fyi the processor makes a different in the gpu load and performance, everything put together does, ram included
Come on, give it a break already. There are already benchmarks out there. iPad 2 has faster GPU, while the Prime has a faster CPU.
I'm glad you are enjoying your iPad games, but most gamers are too busy playing Skyrim to care.
Oh? zedklind I thought you posted because you wanted a cookie...
You sure didnt have anything informative to say so I figured you just wanted a pat on the back or something, my bad...
Gaming on the Prime still looks very impressive
http://www.slashgear.com/asus-trans...games-bladeslinger-glowball-chidori-06200431/
I see in games that they offer more details in tegra 3 games than in ipad games. So developers of games think that tegra is faster and more capable.
Sent from me...
Thats is what I am hoping for, but i just hope that the android platform doesnt scare alot of developers away...
Being so easy to just download any .apk file and intall it (expecially when any android device can do this right out of the box stock) without having to pay anything for it isnt really going to bring in many top developers. I really hope ICS addresses this issue.
If they do fix the issue i see a birght future for tegra 3 and android, and it will mean lots of new great apps and games for us!
i was the first to make a thread about this but i still think graphics doesn't matter at all on tablets, theres only 1! game on the ipad2 that has graphics worthy of there GPU, and it doesnt sell nearly as well as any of the little crap games.
I hate any game on my ipad that had good graphics, they always figured a pretty picture was good enough. I had a jailbroken ipad so i played all the games, and the best and funnest games are always the well drawn games, the cartoony little games.
unless im missing the point here.
I think the point for me is that I am excited to get this device and I will probably casually play whatever games are developed for it. If those games are developed for this tablet in particular I assume they will work well with the hardware. If they don't, I won't buy them. This tablet will game. That much has been proven. Now let's see if anybody will develop anything for it.
On a lighter note, I personally don't need my tablet to be able to whip out its di..ahem...GPU and be bigger than everybody else's in the room. That said I don't want it to attempt that feat and end up with the tiniest little button peni...um GPU... in the room either. But we already know that isn't going to happen.
All that said I will just be happy to get a firm..ahem...solid...um..definite release date.
I've followed a lot of OP's posts, and you have a lot of the tendencies of a troll.
To answer the thread, yes, absolutely the iPad 2 has a better GPU than the TF Prime. I don't see what the point of this thread is other than to flame-bait because I think most of us already know that.
I have an Xbox 360 to play videogames on. But if I do ever want to play games on a TF Prime, everything that I've seen so far played on it looks like it runs very well. So if your post was meant, as I can well guess, to make me respond in some impassioned way, it didn't go very far because it only pushed my yawn button. You basically just played the sledge hammer game at carnivals where you try to ring the bell at the top and only made the ring of anger go up by 1 section.
The Janitor Mop said:
I've followed a lot of OP's posts, and you have a lot of the tendencies of a troll.
To answer the thread, yes, absolutely the iPad 2 has a better GPU than the TF Prime. I don't see what the point of this thread is other than to flame-bait because I think most of us already know that.
I have an Xbox 360 to play videogames on. But if I do ever want to play games on a TF Prime, everything that I've seen so far played on it looks like it runs very well. So if your post was meant, as I can well guess, to make me respond in some impassioned way, it didn't go very far because it only pushed my yawn button. You basically just played the sledge hammer game at carnivals where you try to ring the bell at the top and only made the ring of anger go up by 1 section.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like I said in the OP, at home i play on my gaming PC or gaming console but while I am at work or out of town I like to play games on my tablet, I would never expect my tablet to be on par with my gaming PC or 360... And lugging around a 360 or gaming PC everywhere I go would be a pain.
I'm talking about portable gaming devices... you know, psp,dsi,vita.
Most people (i assume) are getting the prime because it has the latest Nvidia tegra 3 GPU which is made for gaming, any other tablet can browse the web, watch movies or play music.
So far I am hearing good things about tegra 3 and its future that nvidia is working hard on. Now we just need more game developers and app developers. Nvidia did their part and now its up to google and ICS to make a good home for developers in the future.
And i dont want to show off that my tablet has a bigger dong than someone elses but rather I would like to know it has the latest and most future proof dong currently available. That way i dont have to go out and buy a new dong every year... :x
In fact this whole discussion is absolutely pointless.
You can't tell both GPU's performance only from the benchmarks.
Why do you think Riptide GP looks that much better on Tegra 3 compared to the iPad2? Because the iPad has the better GPU? I doubt this
Synthetic benchmarks will never be useful to compare anything... Especially not on different OS platforms...
People need to get away from all this benchmark thing...
Btw I really doubt that there is a single game out there that maxes the Tegra 2. It's not about Tegra's lack of performance but about missing developers...
The Android world is the wrong world to get into if you want a dong that will be top dong for a full year. The whole tech world moves too fast for anyone to always have the best device and we just have to resign ourselves to that.
That said, I think Tegra 3 is very future proof. Let's shift our focus away from the technical discussion for a moment and over to the real world: Tegra 3 is essentially going to be the Android tablet standard for 2012 and ICS. They have already indicated that Tegra 3 devices will be coming out at least through mid year. At that point there will likely be a few better, newer SoCs, but Tegra 3 will still be sort of considered the baseline to which everything else will be compared, primarily since it is the first ICS quad core platform. When new SoCs come out, people will want to know how much faster they are than Tegra 3.
On another note, you really don't need to worry about the GPU so much. I already wrote an extensive post elsewhere about how Asus has packed the TF Prime with top of the line specs: rave reviews for the screen, awesome reviews for the form factor/design/build quality, the first good tablet camera and consequently the best, 32 GB starter memory when with most tablets the top of the line model comes with 32 GB, and of course the dock, which is an engineering effort and cost that no other tablet maker has to swallow. Considering it has all these things and comes in at such a fair price, it makes absolute sense that Asus had to cut costs in certain areas. If the GPU is that victim, so be it. Check this out: the new Motorola XyBoard tablet just became official, and the base model of the same screen size comes in at $30 MORE than the TF Prime even though it doesn't have NEARLY the same specs:
http://androidcommunity.com/verizons-motorola-droid-xyboard-gets-official-in-10-1-and-8-2-flavors-20111206/
I have a HTC Sensation. It is most often compared to the Samsung Galaxy SII. The Sensation has a better GPU, while the SGS2 has the better CPU. The SGS2 by far is the faster device (and I'm a Sensation owner, I'm not exaggerating). It is a much smoother experience in essentially every area, including gaming, even though it has the inferior GPU. My point here is that GPU isn't everything. HTC did a poor job of optimizing their drivers, so the GPU isn't even used for its full capabilities. Samsung, meanwhile, took a lesser GPU and managed to make something out of it. And let's not forget the large advantage the CPU has. The SGS2 in that sense is sort of analogous to the TF Prime, with an awesome CPU and a sort of average GPU. But since the overall performance of the device will come down to a confluence of way more factors than just 1 spec, don't pass the device off simply because you dislike 1 spec. Like I said, I can get over 1 unimpressive feature considering how much of the rest of the device blows my mind (again, please compare the TF Prime to the Motorola XyBoard and just TRY to tell me that Asus didn't put a HUGE effort into making the TF Prime the best possible device while still making some kind of money off it).
The iPad 2 is more "futur proof" when it comes to games not because of performance but because of the plateform. There hardly won't be any game worthwhile that will be on Android but not on iOS. But there will be some games only on iOS.
The Tegra 3 is overall at the same level of performance than the A5 in the ipad2 but it doesn't means you can compare the two devices.
Tegra 3 is the most future proof you'll get for Android, nvidia is pushing games for it, you'll have exclusivity and games specifically design for it.
The real question is do you want iOS or Android ?
If your choice is base on games and games only (wich is weird because, honestly, games on mobile plateform aren't worth buying an expensive device only for them) then go for iOS, right now, that's where you'll get the best games.
The Janitor Mop said:
The Android world is the wrong world to get into if you want a dong that will be top dong for a full year. The whole tech world moves too fast for anyone to always have the best device and we just have to resign ourselves to that.
That said, I think Tegra 3 is very future proof. Let's shift our focus away from the technical discussion for a moment and over to the real world: Tegra 3 is essentially going to be the Android tablet standard for 2012 and ICS. They have already indicated that Tegra 3 devices will be coming out at least through mid year. At that point there will likely be a few better, newer SoCs, but Tegra 3 will still be sort of considered the baseline to which everything else will be compared, primarily since it is the first ICS quad core platform. When new SoCs come out, people will want to know how much faster they are than Tegra 3.
On another note, you really don't need to worry about the GPU so much. I already wrote an extensive post elsewhere about how Asus has packed the TF Prime with top of the line specs: rave reviews for the screen, awesome reviews for the form factor/design/build quality, the first good tablet camera and consequently the best, 32 GB starter memory when with most tablets the top of the line model comes with 32 GB, and of course the dock, which is an engineering effort and cost that no other tablet maker has to swallow. Considering it has all these things and comes in at such a fair price, it makes absolute sense that Asus had to cut costs in certain areas. If the GPU is that victim, so be it. Check this out: the new Motorola XyBoard tablet just became official, and the base model of the same screen size comes in at $30 MORE than the TF Prime even though it doesn't have NEARLY the same specs:
http://androidcommunity.com/verizons-motorola-droid-xyboard-gets-official-in-10-1-and-8-2-flavors-20111206/
I have a HTC Sensation. It is most often compared to the Samsung Galaxy SII. The Sensation has a better GPU, while the SGS2 has the better CPU. The SGS2 by far is the faster device (and I'm a Sensation owner, I'm not exaggerating). It is a much smoother experience in essentially every area, including gaming, even though it has the inferior GPU. My point here is that GPU isn't everything. HTC did a poor job of optimizing their drivers, so the GPU isn't even used for its full capabilities. Samsung, meanwhile, took a lesser GPU and managed to make something out of it. And let's not forget the large advantage the CPU has. The SGS2 in that sense is sort of analogous to the TF Prime, with an awesome CPU and a sort of average GPU. But since the overall performance of the device will come down to a confluence of way more factors than just 1 spec, don't pass the device off simply because you dislike 1 spec. Like I said, I can get over 1 unimpressive feature considering how much of the rest of the device blows my mind (again, please compare the TF Prime to the Motorola XyBoard and just TRY to tell me that Asus didn't put a HUGE effort into making the TF Prime the best possible device while still making some kind of money off it).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can't compare Sense device to something else It's not their drivers or what it's just Sense overall...
Sense is the biggest piece of crap code i've ever seen And yet it's so beautiful and I don't want to miss it...
Just have a look at the smali code of for example Rosie... It's absolutely horrible There is not a single reason why this thing shouldn't be slow.
Even with a Tegra 3 (-->HTC Edge) Sense will be laggy
But yes, your point of view is correct. It all comes down to optimisation of the OS...
I hope ASUS put a lot more develoment time in ICS than they did with HC
Diamondback2010 said:
In fact this whole discussion is absolutely pointless.
You can't tell both GPU's performance only from the benchmarks.
Why do you think Riptide GP looks that much better on Tegra 3 compared to the iPad2? Because the iPad has the better GPU? I doubt this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Riptide looks better becuase the developer got help from Nvidia and had specific optimisations for it. Fyi, riptide on the ipad and ipad2 look almost exactly the same despite the ipad2 being up to 9x faster.
thunng8 said:
Riptide looks better becuase the developer got help from Nvidia and had specific optimisations for it. Fyi, riptide on the ipad and ipad2 look almost exactly the same despite the ipad2 being up to 9x faster.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried to make the same point before. There are hardly any ipad 2 optimized games only. They are all identical except for a few. Those few only have very minor upgrades. Nothing night and day different although ipad2 supposed to be 9x faster/more powerful.
I just hope developement for tegra3 picks up alot of support all across the board. We need more tablet only apps and games optimized for tegra3. I just heard ipad is getting microsoft office in feb. 2012. I really hope this comes to android also asap. Tegra3 has tons of potential. I really hope the developers take advantage of it and we see some high grade topnotch software.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
A lot of this is starting to feel connected to the tegra3.
So, my guess is the ones that rebooted needed more voltage and could not deal with switching cpu's on and off.
So now that we have all 4 on all the time, the ones that can't handle that are showing flaws.
To me it seems like this could be a manufacturing issue with the tegra3.
I'm sure some of the issues could be ICS+tegra3 as well.
Is there someplace that has info on the tegra3? Not many devices have it yet.
fenturi said:
A lot of this is starting to feel connected to the tegra3.
So, my guess is the ones that rebooted needed more voltage and could not deal with switching cpu's on and off.
So now that we have all 4 on all the time, the ones that can't handle that are showing flaws.
To me it seems like this could be a manufacturing issue with the tegra3.
I'm sure some of the issues could be ICS+tegra3 as well.
Is there someplace that has info on the tegra3? Not many devices have it yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been saying for at least a month now this is all because of hardware and manufacturing differences with the processor. In other words everyone is screwed because this is not something where software can just magically make all of the Primes play nice which they already proved with the latest update it fixed some Primes with original lockup issue while borking ones that were perfectly fine..... not only that they are degrading our battery life severely trying to get the firmware to play nice with all the Primes this is a losing battle mass recall is the only real fix at this point.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/tegra-superchip.html
http://www.techradar.com/news/mobile-computing/nvidia-tegra-3-what-you-need-to-know-1039584
http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile...-fifth-core-that-helps-increase-battery-life/
I agree completely. Do you see any other Tegra 3 tabs on the market? Nope. The nearest android tablet coming out is the Toshiba Excite X10, which is an older OMAP 4430 dual-core running @ 1.2GHz (which is undeniably stable). But I don't think its Tegra 3 alone.
A lot of the issues we see with lockups/reboots/battery issues could be how ICS and the apps deal with Tegra 3. But I'm speculating...
Do we have any way of knowing if it's falling back to the 5th low power core? Seems like it's staying with the other 4 on at 475mhz, meaning it does not swap to the 5th core.
I found this as well:
"NVIDIA handles all of the core juggling through its own firmware. Depending on the level of performance Android requests, NVIDIA will either enable the companion core or one or more of the four remaining A9s. The transition should be seamless to the OS"
So was this "fix" ASUS or did it come from NVIDIA? If so then something is broken.
It definitely was nvidia. We wonder why no other tablet is experiencing this problem. Prime is the only one with Tegra 3!
fenturi said:
Do we have any way of knowing if it's falling back to the 5th low power core? Seems like it's staying with the other 4 on at 475mhz, meaning it does not swap to the 5th core.
I found this as well:
"NVIDIA handles all of the core juggling through its own firmware. Depending on the level of performance Android requests, NVIDIA will either enable the companion core or one or more of the four remaining A9s. The transition should be seamless to the OS"
So was this "fix" ASUS or did it come from NVIDIA? If so then something is broken.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was from them both bit nothing to loose sleep over. They will be releasing another update soon to revert back to lower speeds. But this issue wasn't new to latest update. The lowest speeds have been raised since .11 update. The raised lower speeds is not the main contributor to excessive battery drain. Something else is at play and causing excessive CPU use and not allowing prime to stay in deep sleep for extended periods of time. Its being discussed in battery drain thread that has me, lock n load, buthx, and g37 discussing it with hard data to back up some claims.
Well it could be worse... at least the Tegra3 is not in my car!
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/nv...nt-and-digital-instrument-clusters-2012-01-11
Another trogdor thread....
People.... come on... just cause a bunch of people who have issues with their prime assemble on XDA doesn't mean that the entire prime is useless. i'm pretty positive that 80%+ is happy with the prime.
Besides, a lot of people have been experiencing the lock-ups since the new firmware updates. (so doesn't seem like a hardware issue imo)
SexyAndIKnowIt said:
Another trogdor thread....
People.... come on... just cause a bunch of people who have issues with their prime assemble on XDA doesn't mean that the entire prime is useless. i'm pretty positive that 80%+ is happy with the prime.
Besides, a lot of people have been experiencing the lock-ups since the new firmware updates. (so doesn't seem like a hardware issue imo)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually the lockups started with ICS the Primes effected at that time were fixed with 1.13 and now Primes that were perfectly fine are muffed this definitely IS hardware.
What other tab is running ICS? The only ICS/quad core/tegra 3 tablet is the prime. The argument "no other tab is having these problems" is irrelevant. There is no good comparison. Asus promised an update this month and I still expect it.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
I couldnt disagree more! If it was a hardware problem it would have been a problem the whole time even with Honeycomb. I'm sure they will get it right soon. Basicly when Asus updates they need to do a better job of wiping out the old software before the new is programmed in, as a lot us that did 2 or 3 factory reset after the upgrade saw our problems go away. You should also do a factory reset and a cold boot just before upgrading.
The Good
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5072/nvidias-tegra-3-launched-architecture-revealed
The Bad and the Ugly
http://semiaccurate.com/2011/11/09/tegra-3-missed-performance-goals-by-wide-margins/
---------- Post added at 08:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 PM ----------
G37 said:
A lot of the issues we see with lockups/reboots/battery issues could be how ICS and the apps deal with Tegra 3. But I'm speculating...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dianne Hackborn, a Google engineer, has actually commented on the differences between HC and ICS and Google's roll in adapting to different processors. On the former, she said there's no low-level changes between HC and ICS; HC is the base for ICS. On the latter, she said Google doesn't adjust or tune the OS on a per SoC basis. It's up to the manufacturer to create any unique bridge code that's necessary. If you think it would help, Google her and ask her any questions you might have via G+. She's also joined certain threads before.
BarryH_GEG said:
The Good
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5072/nvidias-tegra-3-launched-architecture-revealed
The Bad and the Ugly
http://semiaccurate.com/2011/11/09/tegra-3-missed-performance-goals-by-wide-margins/
---------- Post added at 08:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 PM ----------
Dianne Hackborn, a Google engineer, has actually commented on the differences between HC and ICS and Google's roll in adapting to different processors. On the former, she said there's no low-level changes between HC and ICS; HC is the base for ICS. On the latter, she said Google doesn't adjust or tune the OS on a per SoC basis. It's up to the manufacturer to create any unique bridge code that's necessary. If you think it would help, Google her and ask her any questions you might have via G+. She's also joined certain threads before.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-A quote from the bad n ugly link. Its in the comments that stuck out very loud n clear on Semi-Accurate Anti-Nvidia bias
NeelyCam Nov 9, 2011 at 4:01 pm #
My guess is that Charlie is quite a bit off target (as he tends to be with NVidia, with Bumpgate being THE exception).
“According to numbers shown to SemiAccurate, basically every upcoming competitor beats Tegra 3, most by wide margins.”
Yeah, because they’ll be A15 and on 28nm. The problem is, they are 28nm and they aren’t here yet… 28nm yield issues most certainly don’t speed up the introduction of these chips. “On track” my ass.
Last time with Tegra2, NVidia chip was THE game in town for a really long time before others got their act together, and released their own dual A9 chips. And Charlie is a fool if he’s saying Tegra2 was a failure, when instead it was a huge success.
Now, Tegra3 is out well before others (again) AND it doesn’t take a risk with 28nm process/yield failure. My guess is that it will again be a six-month success story before Krait starts yielding well enough.
Dear readers (and analysts alike) – try to see through Charlie’s incomprehensible anti-NVidia bias.
-Another well put comment:
Max Nov 9, 2011 at 6:17 pm #
Terrible article. Tegra 3 is pretty good. I had a hands on with the Transformer Prime and it was very good. I expect ICS will bring further optimisations and use of the extra cores too. The power gating function means it is rated at 13h battery life, that’s pretty damn good.
You are a one man smear machine Charlie, it’s time for you to stop these hatchet jobs on Nvidia because they killed your dog and ate it rebel style. Give up man. Life is too short to hold these types of grudges, what will you be saying when Kal-El 2 comes out at 28nm and it is super competitive and low power? Same rubbish or new rubbish. Seriously, get some perspective on all of this, you are ruining the website with this rubbish because you can’t get serious news or insight on Nvidia because you have some kind of first option on all Nvidia articles and they are all full of crap.
-This one puts everything into perspective thinkn other companies will have the upper hand..lol;
Noone Nov 14, 2011 at 5:34 pm #
I just don’t think nVidia can come in an supplant the ARM chip makers that have been in this space for 15+ years. Qualacomm has more than a decade experience building chips for this market AND they understand the market from almost every aspect.
Yes, even Silicon Graphics was a monster in graphics market but was blown away by nvidia. You forget that being on the market for 15+ years does not help when you cannot innovate as fast as a new competitor. nvidia came with a dual core ARM 18 months before anyone else. Everyone said it was useless to have 2 cores on phones. Now everyone is making dual core SoCs and try to put them in tablets (which were not existing when Tegra2 was presented, that is even before the iPad). nvidia is now out with a quad core design. Yes, it is on 40nm, but some competitor has still not shown in their roadmap a quadcore SoC. nvidia competitors rely on 3rd party GPUs improvements, made by players that have been relegated into mobile market since they were born. nvidia dominates the professional graphics market and knows how to build really powerful GPUs competitors can just dream. Ask yourself why there’s not a big SGX GPUs as complex as a Fermi/Cypress if their architecture is so much better. Simply because not everyone is able to design so complex architectures even though they have a winning part. When you scale up, you have to know how not to make the chip melt down. SGX MP+ GPUs are great, but they are huge (and really huge) and hot. nvidia final target are not smartphones. Qualcomm and TI may be happy to end in that market segment, seen their limited design capacities. nvidia target are much more powerful SoCs that can be used outside mobile market. They are passing through the mobile market, will leave some product there (that’s why they bought Icera) but they will go on on beyond that. Quad core, eight core, more and more powerful and power angry SoC will be created. Not all them will be able to compete in the mobile market for power consumption. But nvidia is and probably will be the first one to introduce new design in the ARM market pushing it in new markets (mids, netbook, notebooks, low end desktops and up). Competition has nothing to give to producers till 28nm transition is complete, and that will happen in few months. At that point they’ll be happy producing their dual core 28nm SoCs while nvidia will come with quad core Cortex-A15 and a completely new GPU design.
When competition will be able with quad cores, nvidia will be one generation ahead. If you have not understood, or you were too young/sleeping at that time see what happened since Riva128 was presented. A no stop innovation made of small steps every 6 months till the competition died just after the first GeForce was announced: none could keep nvidia innovation pace, neither ATI which was saved by AMD before bankruptcy. That market could sustain a 6 month upgrade rate. The mobile probably a little slower pace. But you can see 15+ years actors in this market have 18-24 months design cycles, which is really too slow, even though they come with great design when they arrive (too late).
There are no words Charlie can say about how good/bad Tegra3 is against a no present competition. If you want more power in an ARM SoC you need Tegra3. There are not alternatives up to now and for the next 6-8 months. If you want to stay with the competition, you just can keep using 1 or 2 cores again for a few months. You can make money as well, but you will lose the 15+ market leading position, that is mobile market development and progress will be in the hand of someone else and all you can do is following the trail.
demandarin said:
A quote from the bad n ugly link.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know you hate that article. But if you take off your rose colored glasses, even by eliminating the anti-Nvidia opinion of the author, he explains the architecture, compromises, and risks well. It's ironic that one of the biggest risks he pointed out appears to be happening. That's Nvidia having to tinker with the s/w that controls the various cores to meet both their performance and battery saving goals. You can still love something and admit it has faults. Is your wife or partner faultless? Mine's sure not but I'd make the same decision again.
BarryH_GEG said:
I know you hate that article. But if you take off your rose colored glasses, even by eliminating the anti-Nvidia opinion of the author, he explains the architecture, compromises, and risks well. It's ironic that one of the biggest risks he pointed out appears to be happening. That's Nvidia having to tinker with the s/w that controls the various cores to meet both their performance and battery saving goals. You can still love something and admit it has faults. Is your wife or partner faultless? Mine's sure not but I'd make the same decision again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course it has faults. Just like anything else. But in this business you have to be a risk taker and come with something new and innovating. That's why apple is the monster it is now, for the most part. Apple loved tl make things already created even better but still innovating in alot of aspects. I still it was a good move on Nvidia part. This quad core / 5 core is all brand new. That's why they have patent pending on that software technology nvidia uses that allows the cores to communicate in such a fashion. Its a risk that will yells great results sooner than you think.
demandarin said:
Of course it has faults. Just like anything else. But in this business you have to be a risk taker and come with something new and innovating. That's why apple is the monster it is now, for the most part. Apple loved tl make things already created even better but still innovating in alot of aspects. I still it was a good move on Nvidia part. This quad core / 5 core is all brand new. That's why they have patent pending on that software technology nvidia uses that allows the cores to communicate in such a fashion. Its a risk that will yells great results sooner than you think.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Barry looks like he didn't understand you lol.......
jdbaker82 said:
Barry looks like he didn't understand you lol.......
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^^^^^^This guy^^^^^^^^^
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demandarin said:
-
Yes, even Silicon Graphics was a monster in graphics market but was blown away by nvidia. You forget that being on the market for 15+ years does not help when you cannot innovate as fast as a new competitor. nvidia came with a dual core ARM 18 months before anyone else. Everyone said it was useless to have 2 cores on phones. Now everyone is making dual core SoCs and try to put them in tablets (which were not existing when Tegra2 was presented, that is even before the iPad). nvidia is now out with a quad core design. Yes, it is on 40nm, but some competitor has still not shown in their roadmap a quadcore SoC. nvidia competitors rely on 3rd party GPUs improvements, made by players that have been relegated into mobile market since they were born. nvidia dominates the professional graphics market and knows how to build really powerful GPUs competitors can just dream. Ask yourself why there’s not a big SGX GPUs as complex as a Fermi/Cypress if their architecture is so much better. Simply because not everyone is able to design so complex architectures even though they have a winning part. When you scale up, you have to know how not to make the chip melt down. SGX MP+ GPUs are great, but they are huge (and really huge) and hot. nvidia final target are not smartphones. Qualcomm and TI may be happy to end in that market segment, seen their limited design capacities. nvidia target are much more powerful SoCs that can be used outside mobile market. They are passing through the mobile market, will leave some product there (that’s why they bought Icera) but they will go on on beyond that. Quad core, eight core, more and more powerful and power angry SoC will be created. Not all them will be able to compete in the mobile market for power consumption. But nvidia is and probably will be the first one to introduce new design in the ARM market pushing it in new markets (mids, netbook, notebooks, low end desktops and up). Competition has nothing to give to producers till 28nm transition is complete, and that will happen in few months. At that point they’ll be happy producing their dual core 28nm SoCs while nvidia will come with quad core Cortex-A15 and a completely new GPU design.
When competition will be able with quad cores, nvidia will be one generation ahead. If you have not understood, or you were too young/sleeping at that time see what happened since Riva128 was presented. A no stop innovation made of small steps every 6 months till the competition died just after the first GeForce was announced: none could keep nvidia innovation pace, neither ATI which was saved by AMD before bankruptcy. That market could sustain a 6 month upgrade rate. The mobile probably a little slower pace. But you can see 15+ years actors in this market have 18-24 months design cycles, which is really too slow, even though they come with great design when they arrive (too late).
There are no words Charlie can say about how good/bad Tegra3 is against a no present competition. If you want more power in an ARM SoC you need Tegra3. There are not alternatives up to now and for the next 6-8 months. If you want to stay with the competition, you just can keep using 1 or 2 cores again for a few months. You can make money as well, but you will lose the 15+ market leading position, that is mobile market development and progress will be in the hand of someone else and all you can do is following the trail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you tell me how Nvidia is dominating professional graphics market? Dominating as in RIGHT NOW.. I'm sure AMD/ATI enthusiast will disagree.
Adreno GPU (developed by Qualcomm in-house), and Mali GPU.. (developed in house by Samsung)... Only Apple & TI uses 3rd party GPU from PowerVR (granted.. Samsung recently got some license from PowerVR and Sony uses PowerVR in PS Vita).
And by roadmap.. do you mean plans? I'm sure Krait is quadcore, same with Apple A6...
Or did you mean by roadmap with devices from OEM?? I'm sure we'll find out more in MWC..
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5118/qualcomm-announces-a-bunch-of-krait-based-snapdragon-s4-socs
"I'm not sure how much competition Krait will see until OMAP 5 devices show up in the latter part of 2012, unless Apple decides to put out a Cortex A15 A6 SoC earlier. NVIDIA has already shown its hand with Tegra 3, and Wayne won't show up until late next year as well."
So, we won't see Nvidia's 28nm quad core til later(or possibly next yr)...of which, it might be behind Apple, Qualcomm, TI... or at least in line with Krait & OMAP 5 launch.
And until we see some actual comparison between Qualcomm 28nm dual core & Samsung's A-15 SoC Exynos (which is just around the corner).... I'll hold my judgement on how it compares to Tegra 3.
jdbaker82 said:
Barry looks like he didn't understand you lol.......
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, this is a particularly sensitive issue for him and I get that. I'm not trying to put down Nvidia, they deserve huge credit for the innovation they've applied in the mobile market. But, they've gone 180 degrees in another direction from their competitors with Teg3 and it’s yet to be proven whether that was the right decision. Leaving out NEON in Teg2 was certainly not a great decision and one they made in deference to time to market. It's odd that, as of now (February), there aren't any other Teg3 devices in production or even imminent (next 60 days). Unless there are some big Teg3-based devices announced at MWC it would appear manufactures may be a little skeptical too.
In product management the success (or failure) of a product is measured in years not months. While we all wait eagerly for the "next big thing" manufacturers weigh short-term gains vs. long-term success with $’s trumping all. With everyone having equal access to Teg3, Asus being first may have been a choice intentionally made by their competitors. Like so many things with the Prime, only time will tell.
Anyone else wonder why they released this as the LTE when there really isn't any LTE, and the majority of people won't get LTE for a long time? Just don't get why they didn't bang it out as the quad core version. Then two years from now when LTE actually becomes available to the masses, and they figure out how to make 4 cores and LTE work together....release the mack daddy?
Are you really asking why they didn't hold off on releasing a phone for 2 years? lol I'd never buy stock in your company.
And LTE is already becoming available in some areas.
With that said, people without LTE coverage can still enjoy a pretty badass phone even without LTE. Do you think they'd sell it for less if they removed the LTE antennas, or something?
If you don't like the phone because it has LTE technology that you can't use yet, don't buy it. I hear the iPhone is great for people who have no desire for advanced technology.
Sent from my EVO LTE using Tapatalk 2
Would have made more sense to release the dual core world wide but my guess is the tegra is significantly cheaper.
Also some people already have lte unofficially and millions will have it within a few months based on the roll out schedules.
Mathman85 said:
Are you really asking why they didn't hold off on releasing a phone for 2 years? lol I'd never buy stock in your company.
And LTE is already becoming available in some areas.
With that said, people without LTE coverage can still enjoy a pretty badass phone even without LTE. Do you think they'd sell it for less if they removed the LTE antennas, or something?
If you don't like the phone because it has LTE technology that you can't use yet, don't buy it. I hear the iPhone is great for people who have no desire for advanced technology.
Sent from my EVO LTE using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Settle down, take a breath. No need to get all butt hurt. Its definitely a great phone. But I won't see LTE for a long time. Like quite a lot of others. So a quad core would have been a way bigger hit. Then when LTE was out to MAJORITY of the market and they had time to figure out quad and LTE comparability....bang, they're all dead. Btw I had an iPhone...I know better.
You don't really need it quad core is not well develop yet just like duel core last year suck till ICS, just look at the pocket now review of the GS3, is exynos which is one of the best processor and it seems like Samsung rush it out, but to each their own, I'm happy with this duel core
Sent from my htc_jewel using Tapatalk 2
Good point.^
http://mobilesyrup.com/2012/06/04/samsung-galaxy-s-iii-initial-benchmarks-and-hands-on-impressions/
And
EVO LTE test same thing I've out scored on quadrant highest was 5120 and test on smartbench there is slight difference I just ran it 4 times
Edit: trivial benches don't make or break anything so its just a thought the extra gig is nice though still have no major issues on my EVO LTE so I'm sticking with my UK s3 pre order as well ..
Sent from my EVO using xda premium
I can understand why people would like quad-core, but I'm extremely pleased with our dual cores (coming from the OG) esp when the biggest difference between the two chips is that the nvida chip is based on the older A9 Cortex and being 40nm, compared to our Snap Dragons which are based on the newer A15 Cortex and been reduced down to 28nm!
Essentially its just a smaller and super efficient chip versus and an older and less streamlined one.
Don't get me wrong, the quad would be nice, but after seeing serious heat issues on the HOX international version, I'm sure this older design has something to do with it, so I'm glad we got the cooler (literally) and streamlined chip, which would give us access to Sprints LTE... At somepoint
By some point next year, I wouldn't be surprised to see Qualcomm come out with a quad core based off the 28nm size, and then THAT will be beast!
If you read all of that, you deserve a cookie!
Sent from my EVO using xda premium
Next year? Nah... Its been done already
AJilka89 said:
I can understand why people would like quad-core, but I'm extremely pleased with our dual cores (coming from the OG) esp when the biggest difference between the two chips is that the nvida chip is based on the older A9 Cortex and being 40nm, compared to our Snap Dragons which are based on the newer A15 Cortex and been reduced down to 28nm!
Essentially its just a smaller and super efficient chip versus and an older and less streamlined one.
Don't get me wrong, the quad would be nice, but after seeing serious heat issues on the HOX international version, I'm sure this older design has something to do with it, so I'm glad we got the cooler (literally) and streamlined chip, which would give us access to Sprints LTE... At somepoint
By some point next year, I wouldn't be surprised to see Qualcomm come out with a quad core based off the 28nm size, and then THAT will be beast!
If you read all of that, you deserve a cookie!
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Yeah the MSM8960 3D edition is a quadcore S4 processor with a 3D chip built in... It was announced in February
and thanks to the architecture it runs cool as ice
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9hQD6ddhDw
gokart2 said:
Anyone else wonder why they released this as the LTE when there really isn't any LTE, and the majority of people won't get LTE for a long time? Just don't get why they didn't bang it out as the quad core version. Then two years from now when LTE actually becomes available to the masses, and they figure out how to make 4 cores and LTE work together....release the mack daddy?
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I'll have LTE in the second half of the year, which is coming up soon. Just saying...
Why would they put a WiMax chip in the phone?
The device would have to be thicker to accommodate a radio that is not integrated into the chipset.
WiMax radios are worse on battery than LTE radios.
WiMAx isn't being expanded and will be unsupported by the EOL on the phone. Bringing in another WiMax device would mean they have to maintain the network longer - remember that its not only you that enters a contract, but Sprint as well - they have to maintain their network for use.
You could say QuadCore and 3G only - but really? Come on? A non 4g super phone? that would be insane.
I would also assume that our purchase of the device helps fund the roll out to an extent.
I think you will be surprised how fast you get 4G - if your like me, you probably won't get it while you are on this device because I change to often, but it will come and it will come quickly.
I know I'll have LTE before I'm done with this device, and if this thing is this nice now, when I upgrade again in June next year I'll be blown away!
AJilka89 said:
I can understand why people would like quad-core, but I'm extremely pleased with our dual cores (coming from the OG) esp when the biggest difference between the two chips is that the nvida chip is based on the older A9 Cortex and being 40nm, compared to our Snap Dragons which are based on the newer A15 Cortex and been reduced down to 28nm!
Essentially its just a smaller and super efficient chip versus and an older and less streamlined one.
Don't get me wrong, the quad would be nice, but after seeing serious heat issues on the HOX international version, I'm sure this older design has something to do with it, so I'm glad we got the cooler (literally) and streamlined chip, which would give us access to Sprints LTE... At somepoint
By some point next year, I wouldn't be surprised to see Qualcomm come out with a quad core based off the 28nm size, and then THAT will be beast!
If you read all of that, you deserve a cookie!
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If that's the case my EVO LTE won't get too hot right wrong you push any phone it will get hot infact it gets as hot as the epic touch some points for no good reason as well but besides that point .
Both are good but it seems there's some sort of odd anger still brewing over who's is better faster etc who gives a crap u want a quad get it u want dual get it but these things u speak of are tested via Qualcomm if I remember correctly the e3d adreno 220 on paper beat the sgs2 when qualcomm did the testing we all know what happened after that ..
I'm not choosing quad or dual I may go phone crazy and get both idk but what I do know is they both beat the crap out everything else out there screw tech data I can spew that too real world they both ate great buys great phones
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alchemist316 said:
If that's the case my EVO LTE won't get too hot right wrong you push any phone it will get hot infact it gets as hot as the epic touch some points for no good reason as well but besides that point .
Both are good but it seems there's some sort of odd anger still brewing over who's is better faster etc who gives a crap u want a quad get it u want dual get it but these things u speak of are tested via Qualcomm if I remember correctly the e3d adreno 220 on paper beat the sgs2 when qualcomm did the testing we all know what happened after that ..
I'm not choosing quad or dual I may go phone crazy and get both idk but what I do know is they both beat the crap out everything else out there screw tech data I can spew that too real world they both ate great buys great phones
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Well of course anything you use that's electronic is bound to get hot over an extended time with use.
When I wrote this, I started remembering when the first round of Xbox 360s came around, and the processor was (correct me if I'm wrong) 40nm, and because it got so damn hot, and nothing to help cool it down, the failure rate on the first Xboxes was through the roof. When they later cut the chip down to the 32nm size, and installed some more ventilation, the chip never got nearly as hot, and the failure rate went down.
This isn't saying that are phones are Xbox 360s (give it a few more years, and I'm sure we may be able to play those types of games on here ), but going from a bigger to smaller processor, overall the chip shouldn't get nearly as hot as the quad core.
YMMV of course. This is probably aimed more at the person whose getting around 2 1/2+ days on their phone right now.
Edit: This was to roughly show the difference in the chip by size and design. I love that ours are smaller and more efficient, and I wouldn't care if they did have quad core on here instead. Cause....
This phone is the TRUE SUCCESSOR to our beloved OG and I'm glad we got it in our hands finally! Regardless of what processor we have inside
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AJilka89 said:
Well of course anything you use that's electronic is bound to get hot over an extended time with use.
When I wrote this, I started remembering when the first round of Xbox 360s came around, and the processor was (correct me if I'm wrong) 40nm, and because it got so damn hot, and nothing to help cool it down, the failure rate on the first Xboxes was through the roof. When they later cut the chip down to the 32nm size, and installed some more ventilation, the chip never got nearly as hot, and the failure rate went down.
This isn't saying that are phones are Xbox 360s (give it a few more years, and I'm sure we may be able to play those types of games on here), but going from a bigger to smaller processor, overall the chip shouldn't get nearly as hot as the quad core.
YMMV of course. This is probably aimed more at the person whose getting around 2 1/2+ days on their phone right now.
Edit: This was to roughly show the difference in the chip by size and design. I love that ours are smaller and more efficient, and I wouldn't care if they did have quad core on here instead. Cause....
This phone is the TRUE SUCCESSOR to our beloved OG and I'm glad we got it in our hands finally! Regardless of what processor we have inside
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I agree I gotta not smoke when I get up anymore haha they are both great here's my issue .
I don't need a new phone I want one but not on contract I have several on contract now EVO.LTE being one sgs2 the other and my brother's two I pay all of them so I know my sister is getting the sgs3 us I'm leaning international just to give it a shot if I don't like it try to swap it for the us one while she's sleeping or something lol ..
But really I think they all are great none of you or myself are wrong going with any of these things I think as said in other threads android on android hate is hot right now thanks htc and Sammy lol ..
Xbox well I went through two first gen 360s before I gave up for a year and got a great gaming pc
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alchemist316 said:
I agree I gotta not smoke when I get up anymore haha they are both great here's my issue .
I don't need a new phone I want one but not on contract I have several on contract now EVO.LTE being one sgs2 the other and my brother's two I pay all of them so I know my sister is getting the sgs3 us I'm leaning international just to give it a shot if I don't like it try to swap it for the us one while she's sleeping or something lol ..
But really I think they all are great none of you or myself are wrong going with any of these things I think as said in other threads android on android hate is hot right now thanks htc and Sammy lol ..
Xbox well I went through two first gen 360s before I gave up for a year and got a great gaming pc
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Lmao.
Yea I understand. I wasn't picking favorites between the two, I'd be more than happy to have the quad, but then there would be no LTE once Sprint rolls it out. So with LTE in mind, thats why we received the dual core because it works with it. Plus its smaller and just as fast and as long as its a major upgrade from the OG, its money well spent.
I do agree that the Android on Android hate should calm down esp now that we (all of Android) are being shafted by Apple. Hopefully over the next couple of years, Android OEMs will sort of form an alliance to protect themselves from Apple, like the move Google did by giving HTC some patents to use. The more we attack each other, the more divided we will become, and the easier it will be for Apple to sue for stupid crap and ultimately win.
I wish I could get a gaming PC, but its just a lot of money for me, and the plus side of the 360, like most consoles, is that the games will be playable without any hardware upgrades for years. Yea it won't look nearly as good, or play faster, but it works and that's enough for me
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IDK, maybe just skeptical because I never seen any wimax. Crap, my state barely seen it. We have a tiny little spec on the map.
Here is the correct answer to your question. If they had not made the phone LTE capable you would have had an outrage of people complaining that the phone isn't "future proof" and cant run on LTE when it come to their area. "how can it be a flagship phone if it even can't connect to the new networks?" That would have been all over the forums. Also, apps and the system alone doesn't utilize quad core processor efficiently if at all. Just like quad core computers have been around for a looong time, it took even longer for programs to utilize quad cores, and most of the programs you use every day on a pc aren't even touching the other two cores (assuming you have a quad core pc). This is why the benchmarks are equal (if not better) on the S4 vs Exynos quad because the apps/system isn't designed to take advantage.
Having the transformer prime with the Tegra3 I have to say I'm a tad disappointed.
It has been at least somewhat proven that the s4 is superior in many bench mark tests. And this chip is based off of a newer more efficient platform.
Really just do yourself a favor and imagine that the lte has 4 core.
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I don't know why people are so eager to get a quad-core processor in their phone. The software barely takes advantage of two cores so there would be very little gain to adding two more.
http://www.phonedog.com/2012/06/11/...really-detrimental-to-the-android-experience/
merp link isnt working for me so a second link
http://www.pcworld.com/article/257307/dual_core_processors_wasted_on_android_intel_claims.html
according to intels general manager dual cores are not doing us any good. That obviously means quadcores are going to do even less for us.
Just Intel propaganda as they are trying to get into the mobile processor market.
Hmm perhaps but at the same time makes sense. These phones should fly but I also know it has to do with the VM
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ckoadiyn said:
Hmm perhaps but at the same time makes sense. These phones should fly but I also know it has to do with the VM
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The thing we have to realize here is that Android was designed to cater to different hardware configurations vs let's say Apple's direction for mobile, they have control of the hardware so they can customize drivers with their software.It also depends how the application uses the hardware too. Dual-core "I believe" is about right, because these apps are not really going to utilize it.
Intel needs to "put their money where their mouth is." All they need to do is make a single core soc that competes with the s4 and tegra 3 AND within a reasonable budget for me to believe and trust them. Till then its just smack talk.
guy has a point there, and a valid one...I remember when we got the first dual core phone and it wasn't nearly optimized to take full use of it...So in the end it makes sense overall...Esp when you look at it from apps and everything else that doesn't take full advantage of everything available...least thats my thinking on it...
BUT I highly doubt Intel is scared and trying to pull a marketing scheme as some of the things they announced at CES for the future of mobile SoC line for them was amazing...down the the tiny nm processing to the features pushing for...
Also its Intel....their stuff wont be bad in the end of things, once they get solid footing here...
sgt. slaughter said:
guy has a point there, and a valid one...I remember when we got the first dual core phone and it wasn't nearly optimized to take full use of it...So in the end it makes sense overall...Esp when you look at it from apps and everything else that doesn't take full advantage of everything available...least thats my thinking on it...
BUT I highly doubt Intel is scared and trying to pull a marketing scheme as some of the things they announced at CES for the future of mobile SoC line for them was amazing...down the the tiny nm processing to the features pushing for...
Also its Intel....their stuff wont be bad in the end of things, once they get solid footing here...
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Thank you first logical post lol obviously its a marketing scheme not like they don't almost have a monopoly anyways. Lol and I think dual cores this gen anyways is somewhat better then the s3 and I'm sure they are better then the exynos.
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Not the right person to believe. It's like believing Steve jobs when he said people don't want phones larger than 3.5" screen.
Once their stuff is released and a third party with no ties, including advertising, can test it then i will believe.
ckoadiyn said:
Thank you first logical post lol obviously its a marketing scheme not like they don't almost have a monopoly anyways. Lol and I think dual cores this gen anyways is somewhat better then the s3 and I'm sure they are better then the exynos.
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Actually, Intel has maybe a 5% market share in chips. So they don't have a monopoly lol. There's this one company with a super high market share, I forgot the name.
But this is interesting. Reminds of the "S4 is faster because Android isn't made for quad cores!" argument.
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I'd bet that most lower-end dual-core Androids really aren't optimized for it. There are some pretty cheap handsets out there, and the experience with them sucks.
On the other hand, though, the manufacturers who make quality phones (HTC) know what they're doing.
It sounds just like the argument iPhans used to make two years ago - they'd talk about how Android was not a good OS because the phones they tried were laggy, slow, and stuttered... ignoring entirely the fact that they were playing with the cheap Android phones. Put a resource-intensive OS in cheap hardware and the experience will suck.
And to an earlier point, Intel is trying to get into the mobile space... and their mobile processors are single core. It's in their best interest to make people leery of their dual-core competition.
I agree with the article 100%, mostly. For now, all enabling dual cores does is inflate useless benchmarks and kill the battery.
The bad part of the article is trying to compare today's processor arch with old stuff.
My personal opinion... Taylor Martin is a moron. Most of his articles on Phonedog are useless!
Medfield is a single core. Maybe they are just trying to defend their product.
Ragster said:
Actually, Intel has maybe a 5% market share in chips. So they don't have a monopoly lol. There's this one company with a super high market share, I forgot the name.
But this is interesting. Reminds of the "S4 is faster because Android isn't made for quad cores!" argument.
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Even in the pc world? That's what I was referring to I understand mobile wise they don't have much or any... Hence the they don't need a scheme
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This article is about 99.99% right. There is some obvious bias in it, but it holds a lot of truth.
The fact is that Android wasn't built to be "silky smooth". Take a look at WP7 for example, those phones run as smooth as any phone can run and they are all single core processors, yesteryear android specs. The architecture of the OS is 100x more important than processing power and it's sad to say that Google absolutely did not focus on this when they started creating Android. Keep in mine that they started before Apple or Windows in building Android, so they probably just didn't have the foresight.
With that being said, I am as big of an Android fan as any of you and I don't plan on changing any time soon but the fact remains that our operating system will most likely never be as smooth as WP or ios. We win by a milestone though when it comes to functionality.