Is it possible that if i use another device charger like blackberry or whatever compatible may give me a better battery life ? I saw on x8 forums a guy claimed using an htc charger and posted a screenshot where it showed up to 6 days of usage !
Thaanks.
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shahkam said:
Is it possible that if i use another device charger like blackberry or whatever compatible may give me a better battery life ? I saw on x8 forums a guy claimed using an htc charger and posted a screenshot where it showed up to 6 days of usage !
Thaanks.
Sent from my X10i using XDA Premium App
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The charger is just a simple 5 volt power supply.
The charging circuits are in fact integrated into the device/phone itself.
You woulnd't be able to affect the battery capacity in any way by using a different charger.
I'd say that claim about improved battery life due to changing the charger is very unlikely. I'd call it a fake.
Perhaps improve charging time, but not improving battery capacity.
SysGhost said:
The charger is just a simple 5 volt power supply.
The charging circuits are in fact integrated into the device/phone itself.
You woulnd't be able to affect the battery capacity in any way by using a different charger.
I'd say that claim about improved battery life due to changing the charger is very unlikely. I'd call it a fake.
Perhaps improve charging time, but not improving battery capacity.
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Click to collapse
oooh thanks because the guy said the other charger was way more powerfull and it overcharged which caused an extreme change in his battery life but thanks anyways
shahkam said:
oooh thanks because the guy said the other charger was way more powerfull and it overcharged which caused an extreme change in his battery life but thanks anyways
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Click to collapse
Overcharging a lipo battery in a device such as the X10 (Lithium Polymer) would end up in either one of these scenarios:
Scenario 1: Phone and battery overheats, thermal protection kicks in and disables charging permanently.
Scenario 2: Phone and battery overheats, frying the internal charging circuits. Permanent damage.
Scenario 3: Phone and battery overheats, causing an explosion. Worst case: exploded battery catches fire.
Battery fires are tricky to put out and can cause major damage, not only to the device, but also to everything around it.
Don't worry tho.
As long as the charger, or whatever power supply you're using, gives 5 volt DC with correct polarisation, you'll be safe.
But as soon you fiddle around with different voltages, specially anything higher than 5 volts, it starts getting dangerous.
There is a common misunderstanding on how volts and currents works.
People tend to believe a charger with higher currents will do better. That is wrong.
It isn't the charger that "pushes" the current. It's the device that "draws" the current needed.
Example: If the device needs 700 miliamps, and the charger can give 5000 milliamps there will be 4300 milliamps left over.
In theory one could connect 7 devices to the same charger: 7x700=4900, and still have 100 milliamps left over.
What would happen if the device draws more than the charger can give? The device wouldn't charge at all, as the charger would "drop out" in one way or another by either shutting down, or lowering it's own voltage below "acceptable level"
SysGhost said:
Overcharging a lipo battery in a device such as the X10 (Lithium Polymer) would end up in either one of these scenarios:
Scenario 1: Phone and battery overheats, thermal protection kicks in and disables charging permanently.
Scenario 2: Phone and battery overheats, frying the internal charging circuits. Permanent damage.
Scenario 3: Phone and battery overheats, causing an explosion. Worst case: exploded battery catches fire.
Battery fires are tricky to put out and can cause major damage, not only to the device, but also to everything around it.
Don't worry tho.
As long as the charger, or whatever power supply you're using, gives 5 volt DC with correct polarisation, you'll be safe.
But as soon you fiddle around with different voltages, specially anything higher than 5 volts, it starts getting dangerous.
There is a common misunderstanding on how volts and currents works.
People tend to believe a charger with higher currents will do better. That is wrong.
It isn't the charger that "pushes" the current. It's the device that "draws" the current needed.
Example: If the device needs 700 miliamps, and the charger can give 5000 milliamps there will be 4300 milliamps left over.
In theory one could connect 7 devices to the same charger: 7x700=4900, and still have 100 milliamps left over.
What would happen if the device draws more than the charger can give? The device wouldn't charge at all, as the charger would "drop out" in one way or another by either shutting down, or lowering it's own voltage below "acceptable level"
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Thanks for the very detailed explication ! I thanked you and i thank you lol
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Im curious. I work for Verizon and when we sell phones we normally recommend customers to unplug there phone once it is fully charged. Im curious to know if anyone has a reference that states this whether or not this is fact or fiction. I've heard and would think that the manufacturers would prevent this from happening, but I am not sure if that is the case. Does anyone have more information regarding this charging process?
I would rather burn my phone up than deal with unplugging it after it is charged. And no, you don't have to.
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Most batteries have built in safety measures to prevent over charging
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NavyKwonMA said:
Most batteries have built in safety measures to prevent over charging
Sent from my ADR6400L using XDA App
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This is why when you unplug it you lose 5% almost instantly. It charges to 100% then lets it die down to 95% and repeats.
Thanks for the replies. The information given was helpful. Im still curious if anyone can provide a legitimate reference to this information though. A link of some sort would be awesome.
Over in the dInc forum someone put together a big set of charts relating to how that phone charges. It's battery technology is identical to the Tbolt so I assume it would apply. In short, no, you cannot overcharge the phone. What's damaging to the phone is being left in a fully, or nearly fully charged state for extended portions of the battery's life. The ideal long-term storage charge for a Lithium polymer battery is basically the charge that it comes with from the factory.
From all that I've read....
Lithium Ion/polymer batteries have top and bottom thresholds for min and max charge. Below a point, the materials become damaged, and above a point, they become damaged as well. This is unlike a car battery where you can basically suck nearly every volt out of it then recharge it like new. A lithium battery yields only about 1/2 to 1/3 of it's total charge before it's technically "dead". And the voltage drop relative to charge state isn't linear either. Over the useful life of the battery, the voltage drop is relatively slight. Once it begins to drop off more sharply, it's displaying characteristics of being "dead". A lithium battery is assumed to be fully charged when one of 2 things happens; the temperature begins to rise under an unchanged charge input, or the voltage/resistance inside the battery begins to rise. The latter is the method HTC devices use because it largely eliminates the environmental variable of temperature which can vary wildly between a purse, a hot car, an ice arena, or an air conditioned home. Additionally, circuitry is installed on the battery itself to prevent an overcharge state and over-temperature state because these two conditions can easily cause the battery to explode. And lithium will react violently to any form of moisture.... like your skin. The internal circuitry also includes a fuse which will destroy the battery by breaking the contact the internal cells have with external circuitry in the even of moisture saturation due to the risk of thermal runaway my means of short circuit.
As users of HTC devices, or any Li-Io devices may notice, unplugging immediately after charging is complete will prevent a sudden drop off in available battery percentage. This is because the charge has stopped and will not begin again until a min threshold has been reached, usually around 95%. This isn't a flaw with the battery, phone or charger. Tiamat kernels come in forms that will prevent this, but will damage the life of the battery in doing so.
ziggy471.com has some good info on these batteries, as does the thread in the dInc forum. Not sure exactly what forum or thread over there, but a quick search should yield it.
And that's pretty much all I can tell you about lithium-polymer batteries!
brizey said:
I would rather burn my phone up than deal with unplugging it after it is charged. And no, you don't have to.
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
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I guess this would be OK if I had money to throw away. Buying batteries can get very expensive. One of my main reasons forvthinking overcharging is very possible was because I have noticed that when my phone is plugged in and I am using it, it tends to get very hot. From my understanding, while the phone is charging the current causes the batteries cells to heat up, which creates the charge. Once the battery is fully charged I assumed the cells were still being heated up which causes the higher temperature. I also assumed thatvthis could burn the cells up in the battery.
loonatik78 said:
Over in the dInc forum someone put together a big set of charts relating to how that phone charges. It's battery technology is identical to the Tbolt so I assume it would apply. In short, no, you cannot overcharge the phone. What's damaging to the phone is being left in a fully, or nearly fully charged state for extended portions of the battery's life. The ideal long-term storage charge for a Lithium polymer battery is basically the charge that it comes with from the factory.
From all that I've read....
Lithium Ion/polymer batteries have top and bottom thresholds for min and max charge. Below a point, the materials become damaged, and above a point, they become damaged as well. This is unlike a car battery where you can basically suck nearly every volt out of it then recharge it like new. A lithium battery yields only about 1/2 to 1/3 of it's total charge before it's technically "dead". And the voltage drop relative to charge state isn't linear either. Over the useful life of the battery, the voltage drop is relatively slight. Once it begins to drop off more sharply, it's displaying characteristics of being "dead". A lithium battery is assumed to be fully charged when one of 2 things happens; the temperature begins to rise under an unchanged charge input, or the voltage/resistance inside the battery begins to rise. The latter is the method HTC devices use because it largely eliminates the environmental variable of temperature which can vary wildly between a purse, a hot car, an ice arena, or an air conditioned home. Additionally, circuitry is installed on the battery itself to prevent an overcharge state and over-temperature state because these two conditions can easily cause the battery to explode. And lithium will react violently to any form of moisture.... like your skin. The internal circuitry also includes a fuse which will destroy the battery by breaking the contact the internal cells have with external circuitry in the even of moisture saturation due to the risk of thermal runaway my means of short circuit.
As users of HTC devices, or any Li-Io devices may notice, unplugging immediately after charging is complete will prevent a sudden drop off in available battery percentage. This is because the charge has stopped and will not begin again until a min threshold has been reached, usually around 95%. This isn't a flaw with the battery, phone or charger. Tiamat kernels come in forms that will prevent this, but will damage the life of the battery in doing so.
ziggy471.com has some good info on these batteries, as does the thread in the dInc forum. Not sure exactly what forum or thread over there, but a quick search should yield it.
And that's pretty much all I can tell you about lithium-polymer batteries!
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Thanks, that was very informational.
_Stomp_ said:
I guess this would be OK if I had money to throw away. Buying batteries can get very expensive. One of my main reasons forvthinking overcharging is very possible was because I have noticed that when my phone is plugged in and I am using it, it tends to get very hot. From my understanding, while the phone is charging the current causes the batteries cells to heat up, which creates the charge. Once the battery is fully charged I assumed the cells were still being heated up which causes the higher temperature. I also assumed thatvthis could burn the cells up in the battery.
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Click to collapse
The device will switch off before damage to the battery is done. I've done it repeated with a couple phones.
Li polymer batteries generate heat as energy is puller from them at a high rate. So if you watch a movie on your phone or have some other program running for extended periods it will get hot. Also if you expose it to oxygen the polymer get high unstable and extremely hot. That's why they tell you not to puncture them. Remember kids in apocalypse time Li ion batteries make great fire starters.
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mcpo117 said:
Li polymer batteries generate heat as energy is puller from them at a high rate. So if you watch a movie on your phone or have some other program running for extended periods it will get hot. Also if you expose it to oxygen the polymer get high unstable and extremely hot. That's why they tell you not to puncture them. Remember kids in apocalypse time Li ion batteries make great fire starters.
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Click to collapse
So do magnesium motorcycle clutch covers!
Can anyone recommend a faster charger? The wall charger still takes upwards of 3-4 hours to charge, was hoping there was something that puts out some more power.
How many amps does the stock charger put out/how much can the phone 'handle'? (Sorry, I've never messed around with circuits and electronics like that, I'm not sure what the correct terms are)...
For example, http://www.amazon.com/Scosche-reVIVE-Dual-Charger-iPad/dp/B003N7NO4Q that car charger has a 2.1a socket, meant to charge the ipad, would that, in theory, charge the sgs2 quicker than a standard car charger, putting out ~1amp?
edit: realized this is better suited for the accessories forum, feel free to move.
I believe the wall charger is the fastest charger that we have available. I could be wrong, but I haven't found anything faster.
If you turn off your phone and throw it on the wall charger, it will charge faster as the phone is not on to use any battery... but thats probably not what you're looking for.
Your best bet would be to buy an extra battery and external charger and just swap the batteries when they are low. Thats what I do, and its much better than keeping your phone plugged in most of the day.
Our phone has an internally set 650 mA charge current limit - adding a beefier charger won't do anything.
It doesn't help that Samsung put in a crippled charger chip in our device with nonadjustable current, instead of using the more capable one already present in the MAX8997...
and even if the phone lets it charge faster, you really dont want a charger that charges too fast. I'm pretty sure that will murder the battery.
Thanks for the answers, all.
penguinlogik said:
Your best bet would be to buy an extra battery and external charger and just swap the batteries when they are low. Thats what I do, and its much better than keeping your phone plugged in most of the day.
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This is fine for "emergencies," but swapping batteries will throw off your battery stats.
Rrryan2 said:
This is fine for "emergencies," but swapping batteries will throw off your battery stats.
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How would swapping batteries thow off battery stats? It seems like everything resets once you boot up with the new battery, and isn't battery charge read off the raw voltage?
Lithium Ion batteries require a very particular two-step charging procedure. The battery has to be charged at constant current until the voltage rises to 4.2V, and then it needs to be charged at constant voltage (4.2V) until the charge current drops to about 10% of its starting value.
The amount of current allowed in the CC phase is a function of the battery's chemistry and capacity. It's expressed as some multiple or fraction of "C", the capacity of the battery. A 1C charge rate on a 1000mAh battery is 1A. The large LiPo batteries I use for my RC Heli and Airplane fleet will charge at 5C, for some of them this is better than 10A. But Li-Ion batteries usually can't tolerate more than 1C (and they usually charge at half that rate since this makes them last longer).
The harder you push the charge rate, the faster you wear out the battery and the more likely it is to fail. If you exceed the maximum charge rate, the battery is very likely to fail catastrophically (failure = fire). I charge my big LiPo batteries in a fireproof box for this reason.
My advice is, leave the phone's charging circuit alone unless you know what you're doing.
penguinlogik said:
How would swapping batteries thow off battery stats? It seems like everything resets once you boot up with the new battery, and isn't battery charge read off the raw voltage?
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Sure, it reads raw voltage. But the top end and bottom end worsen as the battery ages, and batterystats.bin doesn't know where those values are for a given battery until it's seen them. The system wasn't really designed to take into account the user swapping in multiple batteries.
Rrryan2 said:
Sure, it reads raw voltage. But the top end and bottom end worsen as the battery ages, and batterystats.bin doesn't know where those values are for a given battery until it's seen them. The system wasn't really designed to take into account the user swapping in multiple batteries.
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Huh... I'll let you know in a year how this battery swapping thing goes then. But wouldn't wear be the same on both batteries if I just swap them daily?
penguinlogik said:
Huh... I'll let you know in a year how this battery swapping thing goes then. But wouldn't wear be the same on both batteries if I just swap them daily?
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I did this with my captivate where I would swap batteries everyday. Much better than charging if you ask me.
Just notice this, just now i see this screen when charging with phone turned off. I try 2/3 different charger from other manufacture still the same, but all charger works when phone On. Any solutions will help. Thanks.
Sent from my Amazon Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
That indicator means the Streak isn't recognizing the cable, so you have one of two possible causes here:
1. The cable is bad
2. The port is dirty or bad
To properly troubleshoot, clean the port with a cotton swab and rubbing alcohol. Let the port dry, which should only take a couple minutes or so. Then plug the cable into the port. If it still doesn't work, try another cable. If it still doesn't work after that, the port is likely your culprit.
will try. thanks.
edit ; but, just found that if connected to the computer when screen off, it's charging properly. So this is maybe charger incompatible issue ? i don't have original Dell Charger, so from the day i hold this lovely device i use random wall charger adapter from my blackberry, LG and iPhone.
Sent from my Amazon Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
you know.. it is quite bad to mix use of wall charger.. since it would affect your battery... try to use just one charger and stick to it... i use samsung galaxy tab original charger with rating 5V 2A by the way...
Ya i think u right. 1 more question if you don't mind, sometimes... i just need to 2-3 hours to perform full charged. But somestimes ( usually in some miui ROM ) i need more time like 4-6 hours to full charged. Whats that ? I try using Battery-Calibrating apps from market or manually deleted batterystat file, its result randomly, sometimes working, sometimes not. Can you please explains more about battery... thanks.
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usually when we flash rom over another, the previous battery stats would be used... so doing a recalibration would help to get back the actual battery stats...
so.. when you notice the charge length is not correct or it is not like usual... doing recalibration would help..
charge half way... or you charge and then forgot bout it until the next day... something like that would affect the battery stats also...
if you maintain the charge cycle appropriately .. it would help the battery stats maintain the correct value too...
i also sometimes forgot bout the battery.. i mean we charge the battery and then goto sleep... if the charge is only 3 hours but we sleep more than 6 hours the different of 3 hours there would make a difference to the battery stats... where the stats would start to get hayway ..
yes, i do flashing frequently, i quickly got boring with just one rom
and yes, i charge my phone before sleep almost everyday, is that bad ?
right now (with miui rom) for example : when battery indicator show 39% after charhing 4 hours more, disconnect cable, i turn it off, i enter recovery (this weird, it boot in recovery, as i know, we only can enter recovery if we have above 50/60% battery, right?) so i wipe batterystat and reboot... voila.... its show 75% ???
how come ?
in some calibration apps say :
" Its not necessary but recommended to use phone until it shutdown it self, and recharge without a break start with phone off"
since i can't charge with phone off because of my incompatible wall charger adapter, so i never complete this above step. is it really needed to be done?
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deysmacro said:
you know.. it is quite bad to mix use of wall charger.. since it would affect your battery... try to use just one charger and stick to it... i use samsung galaxy tab original charger with rating 5V 2A by the way...
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Click to collapse
This is only partly correct.
The battery would be affected if the output voltage of a replacement charger was different from the stock charger, although it is more likely that the Streak's circuit board would blow a component or two. However, the battery will not be affected by the output amperage of a replacement charger. The only thing that will happen is the amount of time it takes to charge the battery will increase or decrease depending upon the amperage the adapter puts out.
For example, 4.0V, 2A is a bad thing. 6.0V, 2A is definitely a bad thing. Both can do damage to the battery because the voltage is what has changed. However, 5V 1A or 5V 3A won't hurt the battery at all since the only thing that changes is the amperage. As added protection against damage and/or battery explosions, there is a voltage control circuit inside the battery that not only monitors the individual cells that make up the battery but also can measure the incoming voltage. If the voltage is too low or too high, the battery will cut the charge circuit and prevent an explosion. The circuit doesn't measure the amperage because it doesn't need to, and thus the battery will happily charge at both lower and higher amperage than recommended without damage.
Strephon Alkhalikoi said:
This is only partly correct.
The battery would be affected if the output voltage of a replacement charger was different from the stock charger, although it is more likely that the Streak's circuit board would blow a component or two. However, the battery will not be affected by the output amperage of a replacement charger. The only thing that will happen is the amount of time it takes to charge the battery will increase or decrease depending upon the amperage the adapter puts out.
For example, 4.0V, 2A is a bad thing. 6.0V, 2A is definitely a bad thing. Both can do damage to the battery because the voltage is what has changed. However, 5V 1A or 5V 3A won't hurt the battery at all since the only thing that changes is the amperage. As added protection against damage and/or battery explosions, there is a voltage control circuit inside the battery that not only monitors the individual cells that make up the battery but also can measure the incoming voltage. If the voltage is too low or too high, the battery will cut the charge circuit and prevent an explosion. The circuit doesn't measure the amperage because it doesn't need to, and thus the battery will happily charge at both lower and higher amperage than recommended without damage.
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thanks for explaining, so its okay right if i use 5.0V 700mA ?
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It will work, but it will take longer to charge as it's only 700ma versus the Streak's 1A. The charger may become slightly warmer as it has to work longer, but otherwise you should be fine. Had the difference been greater, say using a 500ma charger when a 2A was required, you might damage the charger, but not the battery.
okay thanks, now i know how to charge my battery
Sent from my Dell Streak using Forum Runner
The gs4 doesn't charge at 5.0 V and 2.0mA this new battery app proves it it only charges at 4.1v and 1mA using charger that comes with gs4
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
is it possible the app is wonky or reading the phone incorrectly? mine charges up quickly and just fine. not sure how the samsung charger is fake...
gabrielpina4 said:
The gs4 doesn't charge at 5.0 V and 2.0mA this new battery app proves it it only charges at 4.1v and 1mA using charger that comes with gs4
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The app can only tell how much different the battery is, not how much juice is actually flowing into it. Meaning, the possibility exists that you phone is *using* juice while it's charging, lowering the amount of difference the app can see.
gabrielpina4 said:
The gs4 doesn't charge at 5.0 V and 2.0mA this new battery app proves it it only charges at 4.1v and 1mA using charger that comes with gs4
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thread fail. Voltage output, as verified with a Fluke 77 Type IV multimeter, is spot on 5 VDC. Current, which is governed by the phone, has been verified by many to a max of 1900 mA.
I can see just from the screenshots that the app is detailing misinformation. Were your phone actually charging at the rate indicated, it would take approximately 26 days for it to fully charge, assuming no use, from the 76% in the screenshots.
Oftentimes you get what you pay for. Such is the case with Amazon's Free App of the Day sometimes.
najaboy said:
Thread fail. Voltage output, as verified with a Fluke 77 Type IV multimeter, is spot on 5 VDC. Current, which is governed by the phone, has been verified by many to a max of 1900 mA.
I can see just from the screenshots that the app is detailing misinformation. Were your phone actually charging at the rate indicated, it would take approximately 26 days for it to fully charge, assuming no use, from the 76% in the screenshots.
Oftentimes you get what you pay for. Such is the case with Amazon's Free App of the Day sometimes.
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Click to collapse
god among men
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I know this is incorrect but even if I didn't, I still would not believe it was not 2amp. This phone charges scary fast.... so fast that I do actually use a 1amp charger. I don't hate my battery enough to charge it that fast
Sent from my rooted S4 blessed with Cleanrom 1.2
Help a newbie out.
I had an iPhone 5 that charged ridiculously fast compared to older phones.
When I'm charging my new S 4, how do I get the faster charge rate?
I'm currently using the Moto 2 USB wall outlet charger that came with my razr maxx hd. And it seems like it takes way longer then my five and I chalked it up to having twice the battery.
Is there a faster way to charge?
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Rickinsav said:
Help a newbie out.
I had an iPhone 5 that charged ridiculously fast compared to older phones.
When I'm charging my new S 4, how do I get the faster charge rate?
I'm currently using the Moto 2 USB wall outlet charger that came with my razr maxx hd. And it seems like it takes way longer then my five and I chalked it up to having twice the battery.
Is there a faster way to charge?
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Use the charger and cable that came with the phone.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
najaboy said:
Use the charger and cable that came with the phone.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
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Click to collapse
The new charger is amazingly fast, if thats a word. I was going to use my.old charger from the s3 at work but its so slow it barely keeps up with use and can't keep up if I'm running my wifi or playing games. Now I just need to find a car charger thats as fast as the new charger.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
Keep in mind there's more to it then just the wall charger's output ability. There's something in the S4 that recognizes the original sammy charger and turns up the charge rate yet will only allow a trickle charge on other non-sammy 2.1A wall chargers.
It appears that dome people are aware of this and have managed to modify the non-sammy chargers to enable the faster charge. Then there's some semantic confusion between "quick charge" and "fast charge" features that may be enabled in roms or kernels.
All I know is I wish there were more info on this stuff.
A little knowledge of how Li-ion batteries charge is an important thing. Li-ion batteries have special charging requirements.
The part you plug into the wall... thats not a charger... its a power supply. It provides a 5v DC output at up to 2 amps.
The charger is built into the phone, and it determines how to use that available power to charge and power the device.
Li-ion batteries charge in a two stage cycle that is called "constant current/constant voltage". It is also important to know that a battery's voltage drops as it is discharged. (this voltage drop is how the battery meter gets its information, as it is predictable when tested under constant loads... the variable load of a phone is why the meter seems to be inaccurate at times)
During the first phase, "constant current", the battery is fed a constant current at the same voltage as the battery is currently outputting. As the battery takes in energy, the voltage rises but the current is kept constant.
The second phase, "constant voltage" starts when the battery reaches its highest voltage. (or more accurately, its highest safe voltage, which is around 90% capacity) During this second phase, the battery is fed a constant voltage, (the max voltage) and the current varies. The battery will draw as much current as it is able, and this rate slows naturally as the battery reaches full capacity. When the current drops lower than a certain set amount, the charger stops the charging process and the battery is said to be fully charged. This second phase is slow compared to the first phase, and that is why it can seem like the last 10% of charge takes longer than any prior 10%.
Some phones use the power supply to both power the device and charge the battery, the battery is electrically isolated during charging... but most charge the battery without isolation. Either way, the power from the power supply is being used to both charge and power the device, and this limits the charging speed.
This also limits the maximum capacity the battery can be charged to while in the device, because the voltage/current measuring is less precise. Unfortunately for these phones, the charging is controlled by software, and not simple hardware circuits that are isolated from the battery power. In fact, even when charging the phone with the power off... the phone is still actually powered up but in a low power background mode. This mode is actually a special screen off recovery mode. CWM recovery has had several instances of bugs, where the phone could not charge if the battery died to the point of powering of the device. Because the phone could never power into the special mode to start charging, due to this special mode being missing from, or bugged in CWM.
Also... these batteries have on average a 2-3 year lifespan, and also limited number of recharge cycles. The 2-3 year life is the same even if the battery is unused. As the battery ages, it looses capacity.
Charging at slower rates is better for battery lifespan than higher rates. Now the batteries in the S4 and especially the Note 2 are larger, and 2A is still considered a fairly slow rate, but of course 1A is even better. If you tend to charge only at night while sleeping, it may be better to use a 1A charger.
Awesome explaination !!! That makes complete sense and explains things. The point made in a prior post, about the phone recognizing the new charger, thus charging faster makes sense as well. The new charger must "turn on " the quicker charging on the S3 as well, because it charges my old S3 as fast as my S4. I didn't try the charger on the older firmware but it definetly works with the latest update.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using xda app-developers app
Hi
Just bought a GT Neo 2 but didn't get the Realme 65W charger. I do have a Samsung EP-'T4510 USB-C Quick Charger 45W + USB-C Cable.
It's obviously not going to charge the phone as fast as an original 65W charger does but it's not charging as fast as I'd expect. Plugged it in earlier at 49% and it was at 91% 40 minutes later.
So what affects charging time?
Charging set up as follows:
1) Using extension lead
2) Using adapter to convert 2 pin EU charger to UK 3 pin
3) Samsung T4510 (45W) and the cable that came with the T4510
Do the extension lead or adapter affect charging time? Also does the cable affect it? Do fast chargers have to be used with a specific type of cable?
The charger/cable has to support the charging protocol of the phone or it will only slow charge.
Best to use a OEM brick/cable no longer than 3 feet.
Battery temperature needs to be high enough at beginning of the charging cycle for fast charging to engage. Minimum 72F, but 82-90F is best.
Fast charging may engage below 72F but Li plating becomes likely. Below about 55F fast charging will likely be disabled.
Above about 103F or about 80% capacity fast charging with be ramped down or disabled.
If screen is on, fast charging is disabled.
A battery fault will also disable it or cause erratic fast charging ie a battery failure.
blackhawk said:
The charger/cable has to support the charging protocol of the phone or it will only slow charge.
Best to use a OEM brick/cable no longer than 3 feet.
Battery temperature needs to be high enough at beginning of the charging cycle for fast charging to engage. Minimum 72F, but 82-90F is best.
Fast charging may engage below 72F but Li plating becomes likely. Below about 55F fast charging will likely be disabled.
Above about 103F or about 80% capacity fast charging with be ramped down or disabled.
If screen is on, fast charging is disabled.
A battery fault will also disable it or cause erratic fast charging ie a battery failure.
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Thanks for that.
G1032 said:
Thanks for that.
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Sorry @blackhawk
One more question if you don't mind. Will charging the GT Neo 2 with the Samsung charger damage or reduce the lifespan of the Realme battery?
G1032 said:
Sorry @blackhawk
One more question if you don't mind. Will charging the GT Neo 2 with the Samsung charger damage or reduce the lifespan of the Realme battery?
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Fast charging produces more heat therefore will reduce the lifespan somewhat.
On my heavily used Note 10+ I now replace the battery every year or so to help prevent a battery failure, routine maintenance.
The charging curve is controlled by the phone not the charger. The charging curve should be near identical if both bricks supple the required peak voltage/amps and the phone power controller can communicate with the brick.
Thank you kindly. Much appreciated.
G1032 said:
Thank you kindly. Much appreciated.
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You're welcome. Play with it to see how it works.
Start the charge at about the same temperature then time how long it takes to gain 1 or 2% without turning on the main display. Watch when it ramps down during the charge cycle. It will vary but I see 2%@minute sometimes a little faster at the peak fast charging rate on the N10+.
To extent battery life limit discharge to 30% and top charge to 80%. Li's like frequent midrange power cycling; it extents their totals full charge cycles many fold. A 40-67% usage range is near ideal. Limit the current draw; higher current usage stresses the battery more as does back to back discharge/recharge etc cycles with no rest period.
That's one reason it's just easier to replace the battery. When an Li reaches 80% of its original capacity it's considered degraded and has reached the end of its useful service life. It should be replaced. Degraded Li's are more likely to fail which can seriously damage the device.
Any battery swelling is a failure, replace immediately.
blackhawk said:
You're welcome. Play with it to see how it works.
Start the charge at about the same temperature then time how long it takes to gain 1 or 2% without turning on the main display. Watch when it ramps down during the charge cycle. It will vary but I see 2%@minute sometimes a little faster at the peak fast charging rate on the N10+.
To extent battery life limit discharge to 30% and top charge to 80%. Li's like frequent midrange power cycling; it extents their totals full charge cycles many fold. A 40-67% usage range is near ideal. Limit the current draw; higher current usage stresses the battery more as does back to back discharge/recharge etc cycles with no rest period.
That's one reason it's just easier to replace the battery. When an Li reaches 80% of its original capacity it's considered degraded and has reached the end of its useful service life. It should be replaced. Degraded Li's are more likely to fail which can seriously damage the device.
Any battery swelling is a failure, replace immediately.
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That's all very interesting. I have often read about the 30 - 80 range. I used to own a Huawei P9 and always charged to 100 and that battery didn't last more than 2 years. Last phone was an A70 and that'll be 3 years old in June. Started getting random reboots recently and a quick Google said that's most likely down to the beginning of a battery failure. So just got this GT Neo "as new". It was obviously sent back to the online store by original purchaser minus the charger (replaced with a 5V 2.1A charger. Store had no OEM charger listed on site for sale so I agreed to take a the EP-T4510 charger. While it's not ideal that I won't be getting the fast charge of the OEM charger, it's far from a major issue for me, as long as I'm not going to damage the battery with it and I doubt I will. Even less of an issue if all I really need to do is keep it between 30 and 80.
I've read also that a complete discharge every once in a while is recommended but not sure how accurate that advice is.
G1032 said:
That's all very interesting. I have often read about the 30 - 80 range. I used to own a Huawei P9 and always charged to 100 and that battery didn't last more than 2 years. Last phone was an A70 and that'll be 3 years old in June. Started getting random reboots recently and a quick Google said that's most likely down to the beginning of a battery failure. So just got this GT Neo "as new". It was obviously sent back to the online store by original purchaser minus the charger (replaced with a 5V 2.1A charger. Store had no OEM charger listed on site for sale so I agreed to take a the EP-T4510 charger. While it's not ideal that I won't be getting the fast charge of the OEM charger, it's far from a major issue for me, as long as I'm not going to damage the battery with it and I doubt I will. Even less of an issue if all I really need to do is keep it between 30 and 80.
I've read also that a complete discharge every once in a while is recommended but not sure how accurate that advice is.
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Li's are born to die; they start degrading the moment they're assembled. Don't go too nuts, just replace them as needed.
Until I watched someone replace my N10+ battery I was very concerned. However I realized it's relatively easy with the right skillset and tools.
Mind you they say the N10+ is one of the more difficult ones to replace... meh.
Now I don't really think much about it.