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I see plenty people talking about ICS on the Prime, why doesn't it ship with ICS etc.
well I've been thinking about that a great deal this week. Of course, whatever it ships with, it ships with, but Samsung have a head start on ICS because of their work on the New Nexus.
On the other hand, everyone else is playing catchup because the source code has only just been released. The prime will ship with whatever it ships with and I'll have that.
but I would rather the Prime ship with a rock solid Honeycomb release with optimised apps and let ICS mature for a while before Asus release ICS for it. Asus do regular releases anyway so I'm not put off by lack of ICS at initial shipping.
I do remember reading (if it is true), that Google actually sent some of their ICS engineers to ASUS to help them set up ICS on the Prime. If that is indeed the case, we should have a top notch version of ICS when it does become available. But I won't be upgrading my Honeycomb until there is Flash support for it.
I don't think Honeycomb will ever be called "rock solid" or "mature". The sooner it gets ICS, the better in my opinion.
Ravynmagi said:
I don't think Honeycomb will ever be called "rock solid" or "mature". The sooner it gets ICS, the better in my opinion.
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Agreed. I have a feeling that Google's been spending the lion's share of their time optimizing ICS rather than fixing issues (particularly low-level optimization) in Honeycomb. As Google has said themselves on numerous occasions, Honeycomb was a stop-gap measure to get _something_ running on tablets. It was meant purely to mark time until ICS is released.
I think the Prime will be very good on Honeycomb. I expect it to be simply awesome on ICS.
You might also note, Nvidia is helping Asus to optimise there Tegra 3 for Ice cream sandwich.
I would rather have Asus, Google and Nvidia working together on the most awesome software available and release it day one on the most awesome hardware rather than have a clucky software made by Asus alone on what could be a tremendous succesfull tablet.
I, personnaly, couldn't care less if the update comes after HC on the Prime, but because I want Android tablet to succeed (more Apps for us in the end) I'm willing to wait a few weeks if that what it takes to give this device all the chances it should have. And I think marketing it with Honeycomb is a really, really, really bad idea cause, even in a shinny box, if when turned on it's the same thing as all other tablet already there but 2-3 times their price that won't appeal much to commun people.
Can be wrong now, but isn't first with ICS that all cores can be used and the Tegra3 power comes to use. Belive that HC can't take advantage of all Tegra3 goodness. Just ICS will give all android devices a good speed boost and the hardware will finally have a software to work "together" with.
For example the scores in Antutu Benchmark from Asus Prime.
HC ~ 6500
ICS ~ 10000+
So would I be Asus I almost don't want to release the Prime with HC. Instead I should wait for ICS so the user performance and feel would be as good as possible and all reviews are being made on the final product and not a product that will gets some updates later on that will make it even better.
For me personally HC or ICS doesn't matter because I now what coming and have used android and several tablets,
but maybe those that are new to Android and tablets will get disappointed to run with HC that isn't so good and have some problems.
Sent from my GT-P7510 using xda premium
So we read blogs/articles/magazines/web sites that absolutely rave about the Transformer Prime and have nothing negative to say then we get real world users that do nothing but complain about everything you could possibly think of so the question is.
A.) Did the company's that reviews these get a souped up turbo charged version of the Prime and everyone else got a dumbed down inferior version?
B.) Are the tech company's and magazine publishers lieing to us
C.) Are the real world forum reviews on XDA anal retentive and will complain about anything and everything regardless of what the product is.
Do we have a gray area here in between any of the above 3 scenarios? Something just does not make sense here.
I choose C
I take the the 50:50 joker!
Hm hard to answer, heavy question...maybe all of them?^^
A) That's ridiculous. Reviewers got units with bad WiFi. So they're certainly not better than what people are buying off the streets. Also, the media would go nuts if they ever found out manufacturers were sending them shill units just to get better results.
B) Reviewers are people too and all have their own biases. There may be a positive or negative slant to a review based on those biases but I'd guess they're 80-90% objective. If they always bias their reviews, people would stop reading them.
C) There are three different types of XDA'rs. 1) Unilateral fanboys that can see no wrong even though it's clear something’s amiss. There were people denying the SGS1 had GPS issues when it was totally clear they all did. 2) Pessimists that always look for the negative and amplify it without basis. Some of them may not even own the device. 3) Normal people who just want to share info, have no motive in their comments, and don't need self-validation though forum exchanges. They are usually attacked by the fanboys and pessimists for not having a stronger position either way.
There's clearly some common issues with the early Prime's and the fanboys are out in force denying them while the pessimists are making them larger then they need to be. Look for posts from normal people and use your own judgement in forming an opinion on any particular issue.
BarryH_GEG said:
A) That's ridiculous. Reviewers got units with bad WiFi. So they're certainly not better than what people are buying off the streets. Also, the media would go nuts if they ever found out manufacturers were sending them shill units just to get better results.
B) Reviewers are people too and all have their own biases. There may be a positive or negative slant to a review based on those biases but I'd guess they're 80-90% objective. If they always bias their reviews, people would stop reading them.
C) There are three different types of XDA'rs. 1) Unilateral fanboys that can see no wrong even though it's clear something’s amiss. There were people denying the SGS1 had GPS issues when it was totally clear they all did. 2) Pessimists that always look for the negative and amplify it without basis. Some of them may not even own the device. 3) Normal people who just want to share info, have no motive in their comments, and don't need self-validation though forum exchanges. They are usually attacked by the fanboys and pessimists for not having a stronger position either way.
There's clearly some common issues with the early Prime's and the fanboys are out in force denying them while the pessimists are making them larger then they need to be. Look for posts from normal people and use your own judgement in forming an opinion on any particular issue.
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Lets just use one example the magazines and blogs that reviewed the prime said the speed and browsing was blazing fast everyone on here says its slow and choppy and not even on par with the iPad 2 so how did we get such a difference of opinion on this perticular topic?
jdbaker82 said:
Lets just use one example the magazines and blogs that reviewed the prime said the speed and browsing was blazing fast everyone on here says its slow and choppy and not even on par with the iPad 2 so how did we get such a difference of opinion on this perticular topic?
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Some reviews are very thorough. AnandTech is one of those. Typically, a reviewer spends between a couple of days and a week with a device. Reviewers of the Prime actually commented on how little time they got to spend with it before writing their reviews.
Using a device casually with few apps on it is going to get a different result then loading it up with stuff that the reviewer uses on their own personal device and then using it as a daily driver. Out of the box, even Teg2 devices perform well. A lot of the reviewers really didn't put the Prime through its paces. Look for the reviewers that did, like AnandTech and GSMArena.
The SoC is just one part of the performance equation. For the Prime, the bottleneck looks to be s/w in some cases. I think that's what's happening in your example. And ICS is going to be a big improvement for GB users but it's foundation is actually HC. There are just some things we're going to have to live with in Android and some lag and hesitation in certain functions seems to be one of them. Maybe through s/w optimization and updates Asus (or any manufacturer) may make it better but it seems to be a fact of life. There was a great article from a Google engineer explaining the lag that I'll try to find. It helps understand the difference between iOS and Android.
you saw how anandtech got a hand picked unit to test. if i were a company id send out the best units to reviewers
what is this nonsense, i see a whole crap load of positive posts about the asus.
the negative ones are mostly people who have simple issues that most tablets come with.
I think as somebody has posted elsewhere - there are probably MANY people at home loving their primes and not bothering to mention it on here whilst people having issues will want to find others with those issues, generally ***** and moan, etc. It's a biased cohort on here for sure.
I tend to believe that a lot of the reviewers give positive raves because they get their crap for free! It's totally different for someone who pays $500.00 for it. Of course we expect more because we paid for top notch!
markimar said:
I tend to believe that a lot of the reviewers give positive raves because they get their crap for free! It's totally different for someone who pays $500.00 for it. Of course we expect more because we paid for top notch!
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They don't keep em. They have to send it back.
Sent from my Galaxy S2
C. except maybe the gps, which isnt working for many (includingthe 3 I've tried personally).
Shelfty said:
there are probably MANY people at home loving their primes
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blaziner18 said:
the negative ones are mostly people who have simple issues that most tablets come with.
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There aren't that many Primes out there. The number of issues being reported from a small sample set and the commonality is something to watch. It's too early to say whether they're just early production teething issues, random QC issues, or a design/manufacturing issue. Not all the people reporting problems are alarmists and say positive things along with the negative.
I love this device and have had a few issues with it as well. It's worrisome that the GPS doesn't work and I have had some browser typing lag and a few other minor issues. The reason you hear so much about the negative stuff is that no one is gathering together to talk about what they should do about their tablet being so fast and smooth.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
Good thing they'll be only coming out in January in my country. They'll come with QWERTZ keyboard so its probably a different batch.
I think its pretty clear they rushed some things especially in the software department to get it out in time for USA launch. Seems to me like the software is just a port from the original transformer with some added tweaks. Every IT device i owned had some problems at first. If I compare the performance of my DesireHD with custom rom and everything to how it was when i first bought it a year ago... OMG about every aspect of the device is better now. And that only through software tweaks.
I think it's all about the big rush to get the review out ASAP. Like somebody else said, they don't put 100 apps on it and use it constantly to figure out that a little glitch that happened that time is actually a bug that happens consistently when you do certain things. Like the diff between motor trend doing initial impressions on a car review vs long term reviews a year later.
BarryH_GEG said:
Some reviews are very thorough. AnandTech is one of those. Typically, a reviewer spends between a couple of days and a week with a device. Reviewers of the Prime actually commented on how little time they got to spend with it before writing their reviews.
Using a device casually with few apps on it is going to get a different result then loading it up with stuff that the reviewer uses on their own personal device and then using it as a daily driver. Out of the box, even Teg2 devices perform well. A lot of the reviewers really didn't put the Prime through its paces. Look for the reviewers that did, like AnandTech and GSMArena.
The SoC is just one part of the performance equation. For the Prime, the bottleneck looks to be s/w in some cases. I think that's what's happening in your example. And ICS is going to be a big improvement for GB users but it's foundation is actually HC. There are just some things we're going to have to live with in Android and some lag and hesitation in certain functions seems to be one of them. Maybe through s/w optimization and updates Asus (or any manufacturer) may make it better but it seems to be a fact of life. There was a great article from a Google engineer explaining the lag that I'll try to find. It helps understand the difference between iOS and Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just throwing my two-cents out there but I thought ICS was based on the linux 3.x series kernel and HC was on a 2.6 derivative... That alone makes me feel like ICS is more groud-up built OS as opposed to an OS derived directly from HC. Think revolution, not evolution. Or am I wrong or just blowing this out of proportion?
swallaces said:
Just throwing my two-cents out there but I thought ICS was based on the linux 3.x series kernel and HC was on a 2.6 derivative... That alone makes me feel like ICS is more groud-up built OS as opposed to an OS derived directly from HC. Think revolution, not evolution. Or am I wrong or just blowing this out of proportion?
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Click to collapse
Here's some links. There's a bunch of new APIs for developers to write against but, other than that, the only technical benefit to ICS is h/w acceleration. That already exists in HC. It seems that a lot of stuff the manufacturers added-on are now included natively in the OS. So it seems like a "revolution" for GB but "evolution" for HC. Any developers with more insight chime in.
ICS Features:
http://briefmobile.com/android-4-0-ice-cream-sandwich-announced-feature-list
ICS Developers Discussion:
http://android-developers.blogspot.com/search/label/Android 4.0
HC Developers Discussion:
http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2011/03/android-30-hardware-acceleration.html
Downloaded thumb keyboard. Seems like the best keyboard for tablets. No lag when typing.
I think the consumers will be harsh on the prime because we had to wait for it and there was much hype about the prime. The reviewers from websites didn't spent their hard earned dollars on this piece of equipment.
The way I see it, we have every right to be harsh on judging the prime. We expected something that works. If there were kinks in the software, fine. But seems like we have some real concerns about this device that aren't just kinks.
Hopefully ASUS actually reading these feedbacks and are going to address our concerns soon.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
I dont own a prime but this situation reminds me a lot of when the galaxy s first came out. The reviews were overwelmingly positive but once i got my device it turned out to be nothing like the reviews. It took months and an actual hardware revision before it worked ok.
Never trust early reviews and avoid being an early adopter. I want to see how it performs on ics before buying.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
I would like to start off by saying I tried a search and did not find conclusive results to my question so apologies if I missed a thread on this.
I would also like to say I am not a Apple fan by nature. I was a preorder on the Andoid G1 if that serves any background on me.
So my dilemma.. What sold me on the iPad 2 was trying out a iPad 1 early last year and took to the speed, performance, form etc. So learning the ipad 2 was down the road I waited a few months and walked into the store on launch day and picked one up.
My dilemma - I have not been very happy with Apple in general for many reasons which I won't get into but seeking real feedback if the Prime would compare to the iPad 2 for owners of both.
In desperation to have an Andriod device I recently purchased the Galaxy Tab 10.1 only to be disappointed and returned it. It is nice, don't get me wrong but pales in comparison to the speed in which I am used to. At least out of the box. I am not looking to mod my tablet (already do that with my Evo and Photon).
So, is there anyone here that can provide real feedback to owning both units? I really want to go Android but don't want to feel like I am sacrificing on anything. The browser tests I did with the Galaxy vs the iPad were significant enough for me to be a deal breaker. I know I am giving up flash on the iPad but in reality most of what I do doesn't require it. I would just prefer a Android device that has similar speed in browsing and responsiveness, screen etc..
Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post..
my prime should be here tomorrow so ill post up my results for you. also keep in mind that the ipad 3 should be coming out sometime this year. but you said you wanted an android device so that may not matter.
Thanks.. I did hear the iPad 3 is coming out but it seems like a rumor at the moment? Like you mentioned though I am really looking to get away from the limitations Apple has which is my drive. The IOS 5 update took away my direct print function from email and Safari from an app I paid for which i was told from the developer was intentional and there is nothing they can do about it. I am not unhappy enough with the iPad to just make a change for the sake of change as it does work nice for most of what I do. I wish this was in store to try it out first but I can be patient.
sdynak said:
Thanks.. I did hear the iPad 3 is coming out but it seems like a rumor at the moment? Like you mentioned though I am really looking to get away from the limitations Apple has which is my drive. The IOS 5 update took away my direct print function from email and Safari from an app I paid for which i was told from the developer was intentional and there is nothing they can do about it. I am not unhappy enough with the iPad to just make a change for the sake of change as it does work nice for most of what I do. I wish this was in store to try it out first but I can be patient.
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Ya thats the way i feel, if the prime doesnt preform well ill send it back and wait to see if the ics update fixes it. but have you looked at the galaxy tab 7.7? i heard thats supposed to be pretty nice and if you already have an ipad 2 maybe the smaller size would be good for you. Either way i think you have to wait for the ics update to get a real comparison.
I did see something about the 7.7 but thought it was only avail through Verizon with LTE? The size is actually probably not bad and doable.
I recently picked up an ipad 2 while I wait for a replacement Prime to come in. I am by no means an apple guy, in fact I don't like a lot of things they do and have been an android user for years. That being said, I am very quite impressed with it so far. Very fluid ui and browser (great flash support using Photon browser). Games, are significantly ahead of android in quantity and quality. Software in general is polished and compatibility is excellent.
Now, unlike prime with storage and hdmi... With ipad you pay for everything. Hdmi, eternal storage etc. External output is Meh, requires google tv for most things. Peripherals in general are expensive, but will be compatible with most if not all apple things.
That's all I can think of right now... Plus typing on a phone sucks.
Let me know if you have specific questions.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk
sdynak said:
I would like to start off by saying I tried a search and did not find conclusive results to my question so apologies if I missed a thread on this.
I would also like to say I am not a Apple fan by nature. I was a preorder on the Andoid G1 if that serves any background on me.
So my dilemma.. What sold me on the iPad 2 was trying out a iPad 1 early last year and took to the speed, performance, form etc. So learning the ipad 2 was down the road I waited a few months and walked into the store on launch day and picked one up.
My dilemma - I have not been very happy with Apple in general for many reasons which I won't get into but seeking real feedback if the Prime would compare to the iPad 2 for owners of both.
In desperation to have an Andriod device I recently purchased the Galaxy Tab 10.1 only to be disappointed and returned it. It is nice, don't get me wrong but pales in comparison to the speed in which I am used to. At least out of the box. I am not looking to mod my tablet (already do that with my Evo and Photon).
So, is there anyone here that can provide real feedback to owning both units? I really want to go Android but don't want to feel like I am sacrificing on anything. The browser tests I did with the Galaxy vs the iPad were significant enough for me to be a deal breaker. I know I am giving up flash on the iPad but in reality most of what I do doesn't require it. I would just prefer a Android device that has similar speed in browsing and responsiveness, screen etc..
Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post..
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Click to collapse
This is not specific to the TF Prime, but rather all Honeycomb devices (And I guess Gingerbread too). Don't bother with the stock browsers until Chrome is finally introduced to Android, the stock browser is overall much clunkier and less responsive than other solutions that you can find on the market.
I personally use Opera Mobile on both Atrix 4G and Honeycomb Tablet, and I found a HUGE difference in responsiveness and ease of use.
EDIT: The thing about android is that only some stock apps are good (the others are barely adequate at best), however you can find excellent replacements on the market for whatever you need.
littleemp said:
This is not specific to the TF Prime, but rather all Honeycomb devices (And I guess Gingerbread too). Don't bother with the stock browsers until Chrome is finally introduced to Android, the stock browser is overall much clunkier and less responsive than other solutions that you can find on the market.
I personally use Opera Mobile on both Atrix 4G and Honeycomb Tablet, and I found a HUGE difference in responsiveness and ease of use.
EDIT: The thing about android is that only some stock apps are good (the others are barely adequate at best), however you can find excellent replacements on the market for whatever you need.
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Click to collapse
I couldn't agree more. The Honeycomb browser is horrible and I can't even believe it still has not been improved. Opera Mobile is a million times better! The feature to change the user agent to "desktop" alone makes it worth it.
No Honeycomb tablet can compare to the iPad 2 in terms of fluidity and smoothness. I can tell you from personal experience that Ice Cream Sandwich is the first version of Android that can compare to iOS devices in terms of smoothness and fluidity of the UI (yes, it's still not as fast as iOS, but for me it has finally reached the threshold of what I would consider to be smooth). I've used iPads and iPhones before and I know what you're talking about when it comes to responsiveness and smoothness. It's IMO the best part of iOS, and I'm willing to admit that even though I prefer Android. I've also used Android tablets, and nothing running Honeycomb can compare, point blank. Including the Transformer Prime. Anyone who tells you their Transformer Prime has as much UI fluidity, smoothness, and responsiveness right now is either lying, has low standards, or has never used an iPad before.
Wait until ICS to decide for yourself if the Prime is speedy enough. I have a HTC Sensation, and for me my phone has never been up to my standard of what reasonably smooth is until I installed a beta AOSP ICS ROM. Now, I'm not referring to anything other than speed when I say wait for ICS. I'm not going to tell you that ICS will magically fix certain problems the Prime is having like Wifi and GPS issues.
The Janitor Mop said:
No Honeycomb tablet can compare to the iPad 2 in terms of fluidity and smoothness. I can tell you from personal experience that Ice Cream Sandwich is the first version of Android that can compare to iOS devices in terms of smoothness and fluidity of the UI (yes, it's still not as fast as iOS, but for me it has finally reached the threshold of what I would consider to be smooth). I've used iPads and iPhones before and I know what you're talking about when it comes to responsiveness and smoothness. It's IMO the best part of iOS, and I'm willing to admit that even though I prefer Android. I've also used Android tablets, and nothing running Honeycomb can compare, point blank. Including the Transformer Prime. Anyone who tells you their Transformer Prime has as much UI fluidity, smoothness, and responsiveness right now is either lying, has low standards, or has never used an iPad before.
Wait until ICS to decide for yourself if the Prime is speedy enough. I have a HTC Sensation, and for me my phone has never been up to my standard of what reasonably smooth is until I installed a beta AOSP ICS ROM. Now, I'm not referring to anything other than speed when I say wait for ICS. I'm not going to tell you that ICS will magically fix certain problems the Prime is having like Wifi and GPS issues.
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I understand that Honeycomb does not take advantage of multiple cores where ICS does. That would explain the difference if correct.
keitht said:
I understand that Honeycomb does not take advantage of multiple cores where ICS does. That would explain the difference if correct.
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That's an extremely simplified explanation, and one that's not necessarily true.
For a while, a popular topic of discussion going around about ICS was that ICS incorporates hardware acceleration and multi-core support, whereas Honeycomb and Gingerbread don't. That was all pretty much dispelled by a well-known post from a Google engineer who explained that that was just a popular misconception, because Honeycomb already offers hardware acceleration and multi-core support.
If you asked me why ICS is faster, I think it boils down to 2 things: 1) it's just an overall cleaned up OS, and 2) it makes better use of the hardware available. It's not that it makes use of hardware which previous versions of Android didn't do at all (as pointed out, Honeycomb did have hardware acceleration and multi-core support), it's that I believe it will make better use of hardware. I'm not a Google engineer and so this is just a conjecture, but I'm fairly sure that you can be confident ICS makes better use of multi-cores. I think it's entirely reasonable to suggest that because Google knows one of the primary advantages of iOS is speed, and also because essentially all high end Android devices today are multi-core. If Google went into the development of ICS with the goal of making it a faster OS in order to close the gap with iOS, and they went into the development with the knowledge that essentially all devices that would use it would be multi-core, then they certainly put some effort into making better use of such hardware.
The Janitor Mop said:
That's an extremely simplified explanation, and one that's not necessarily true.
For a while, a popular topic of discussion going around about ICS was that ICS incorporates hardware acceleration and multi-core support, whereas Honeycomb and Gingerbread don't. That was all pretty much dispelled by a well-known post from a Google engineer who explained that that was just a popular misconception, because Honeycomb already offers hardware acceleration and multi-core support.
If you asked me why ICS is faster, I think it boils down to 2 things: 1) it's just an overall cleaned up OS, and 2) it makes better use of the hardware available. It's not that it makes use of hardware which previous versions of Android didn't do at all (as pointed out, Honeycomb did have hardware acceleration and multi-core support), it's that I believe it will make better use of hardware. I'm not a Google engineer and so this is just a conjecture, but I'm fairly sure that you can be confident ICS makes better use of multi-cores. I think it's entirely reasonable to suggest that because Google knows one of the primary advantages of iOS is speed, and also because essentially all high end Android devices today are multi-core. If Google went into the development of ICS with the goal of making it a faster OS, and they went into the development with the knowledge that essentially all devices that would use it would be multi-core, then they certainly put some effort into making better use of such hardware.
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Click to collapse
Sounds close to the same thing I said except in a paragraph instead of a sentence!
The prime in its current honeycomb state, especially after this most recent update, is right on par with the UI fluidity of ipad1 or 2. as I own one also. I stayed with ipad1 because ipad2 wasn't a big enough jump all around to jusitfy dishing out for a new one. I have used the new ones extensively also though. I am constantly using my devices day n and day out so I have a good scope of how they compare. If you decide to get the Prime, it would be a great choice. there have been some issues that has arised for some people but overall doesn't affect everyone. going from ipad2 to a Prime would be a huge upgrade all around the board. definitely check out the various threads, good ones and bad one, and be the judge. you have my vote for getting the prime though. as an Ipad owner also, ipad1 or 2 can't compare because of the larger number of things and customizations that comes with Prime and Android. Apple puts out some great products but you have to live by their rules in their closed ecosystem. with Android, there is alot more freedom. you have to jail break I devices just to do half the things Android does right out the box. that's what sold me on Android. what sold me on the Prime was its Superior Display, best out of any tablet period, the great battery life, best out of any Android tab and on par with ipad2 battery life, superior specs-more powerful by far than anything out now and more than likely next few months down the road. then you have the perfectly integrated keyboard dock option which even has built in battery and extends battery life eveb further. no other manufacturer has been able to replicate that as good. plus Asus has a proven track record of putting out firmwares the fastest and keeps supporting devices.
good luck on deciding.
I just can't thank everyone enough for their kind and genuine responses..
This type of feedback is exactly what I was looking for.. I hate to admit it but I was not aware of the Opera browser. I tried Dolphin on the G-Tab which is very fast on my Photon and thought maybe it was related to the G-Tab. Now I know..
What I take from the responses is that ICS will certainly be something that will take advantage of the Primes true capabalitites. I am willing to give and take.. not one sided and understand that some things will be better and some not so much but the majority of my use is really plain browsing and e-mail. I don't do gaming at the moment so the real thing I want to maintain is a snappy browser and UI.
Sounds like I need to keep the Prime on the list for sure.. thanks again.. really could not ask for more than the true feedback here and not some bias article on the net.
Cheers & Happy New Year to ALL!!
Stan
ok so my prime came yesterday and I haven't had much time to use it yet so don't take this as a real comparison.
So far the only thing worse about it is that hineycomb has a few hiccups sometimes. It hasn't annoyed me but then again maybe it will down the road. Also I pad 2 has a slightly faster browser but its really not a deal breaker. With opening and closing apps they are pretty much the same.
I'll update as time goes on and when ics comes out.
gregnetz18 said:
ok so my prime came yesterday and I haven't had much time to use it yet so don't take this as a real comparison.
So far the only thing worse about it is that hineycomb has a few hiccups sometimes. It hasn't annoyed me but then again maybe it will down the road. Also I pad 2 has a slightly faster browser but its really not a deal breaker. With opening and closing apps they are pretty much the same.
I'll update as time goes on and when ics comes out.
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Click to collapse
make sure to update device to latest system firmware. 33. it speeds things up and fixes alot of bugs.
The Janitor Mop said:
That's an extremely simplified explanation, and one that's not necessarily true.
For a while, a popular topic of discussion going around about ICS was that ICS incorporates hardware acceleration and multi-core support, whereas Honeycomb and Gingerbread don't. That was all pretty much dispelled by a well-known post from a Google engineer who explained that that was just a popular misconception, because Honeycomb already offers hardware acceleration and multi-core support.
If you asked me why ICS is faster, I think it boils down to 2 things: 1) it's just an overall cleaned up OS, and 2) it makes better use of the hardware available. It's not that it makes use of hardware which previous versions of Android didn't do at all (as pointed out, Honeycomb did have hardware acceleration and multi-core support), it's that I believe it will make better use of hardware. I'm not a Google engineer and so this is just a conjecture, but I'm fairly sure that you can be confident ICS makes better use of multi-cores. I think it's entirely reasonable to suggest that because Google knows one of the primary advantages of iOS is speed, and also because essentially all high end Android devices today are multi-core. If Google went into the development of ICS with the goal of making it a faster OS in order to close the gap with iOS, and they went into the development with the knowledge that essentially all devices that would use it would be multi-core, then they certainly put some effort into making better use of such hardware.
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optimization is the name of the game. so far with most devices that have early builds of ICS on them, everything seems faster, so theoretically the prime should scream.
just a couple weeks and we'll see.
as to the OP's question, i've played with an ipad2 and owned an ipad1, i feel like with a few tweaks (change the launcher, use a different browser) the prime is just as fast if not faster than the ipad2 for most things even on HC.
iOS def has android beat when it comes to the amount of tablet optimized apps and games though, hopefully android will pick up the pace after ICS helps to unify the phone/tablet fragments. i am quite impressed with the tegra3 optimized games quality and fluidity though.
Before we start this discussion, i'd just like to say that the devs are doing a brilliant job of bringing android flavours to the Touchpad and this discussion should in no way be a deterrent to them doing their work.
Is it just me or is the touchpad a neglected device in terms of development compared to other tablets? i.e. asus, samsung, htc.
There are a huge number of devs and a wide variety of custom ROMS, themed ROMS, ported ROMS, Mods the list goes on and on.
As far as I'm aware of the problems (feel free to correct me) the source for half the hardware hasn't been released (such as the webcam) etc etc. so it kind of makes it very very difficult if not impossible to experiment with different ROMS.
Yes some out there can say to me "buy a tablet that was meant to run android next time" fair enough. But is it alot to expect the same level of development as usual android tablets?
webOS is very lovely but it doesn't cut it for me in terms of customisation (even with some of the childish looking themes on preware). CM9 has its issues still with regards to not everything working yet, but even when it's complete i still miss simple conveniences like VPN and connect WiFi using WPS automatically to name a few.
So can we expect that kind of development? or is it too much to ask.
I doubt we'll have Samsung level development, but that's true of any non-Samsung device. Have no idea why they're so popular, but usually the size of their dev communities put others to shame.
As you've pointed out, we don't have all our hardware working right now. Between that and the fact that CM9 itself (as a whole, not just the TP Version) is incomplete, its no wonder there's only two or three roms. Many people make their roms using another as a base, be it a stock firmware (of which the TP obviously does not have) or CM. Since CM9 is in a constant state of flux, there's no solid base for the TP yet.
As it is, we have the CM9 alpha, CM9 weeklies, AOPK, Unofficial Cornerstone kangs, MIUI, Classicnerd, Cherrykang... and that's just ICS based stuff. Add in Gingerbread roms and non-Android OSs like Ubuntu and you'll find we have a quite a good selection already.
my gripe with gingerbread ROMS is not as some people say "phone rom on a tablet" its just the fact that the apps recognize it as a phone and ruins the whole thing.
apart from MIUI, alot of the other ROMS look and feel pretty similar to me and there isn't much that sets them apart. granted cm9 is in its infancy (EVERYWHERE including my evo 3D, google definitely not redeeming itself over this update fiasco). I haven't really sampled Ubuntu to make a judgement on it.
I suppose if one was to put together something original a) it would be so hard people wouldn't bother attempting it cuz it's just too time consuming b) it'd be like making a lovely dish from leftovers....kernel's modified and compiled from things like htc jetstream (and rumor has it the GS2 on AT&T), ROMS put together from 7" android tablets most of which have the same resolution as the touchpad so it'll make life easier with respect to resizing.... again too much effort and time consuming to be worthwhile
I feel the TouchPad has great development. Especially when you consider a vast majority of the devices were sold before android was put on the device. When the fire sales happened the people that bought them didn't know android was going to be put on it. So anyone that wanted to play with android or build ROMs probably got an android tablet.
There will never be a full stock optimized android build. With the Samsung devices they have a solid start point, and a manufacturer that is devoted to the success of the device. HP has washed its hands of the TouchPad more or less. Everything done to get android on the TouchPad had been done by volunteers, without the resources really needed.
Samsung just generally makes things easiest for people to hack it. HTC and Asus ship their devices with locked bootloaders. Samsung doesn't, so they have one less hurdle right from the get go. The other side of that is Samsung makes great hardware, and decent software. This is easier to show in the phones. HTC makes good phones, but there is two or three extra hurdles that don't exist on Samsung phones. LG phones also don't have those hurdles, but their hardware isn't as good, and they are notoriously bad at getting android updates out.
Another thing to consider is the quality of android overall on a tablet. There is minimal tablet apps, and little motivation. Apple bet their company on the success of the iPad, Microsoft is doing the same with Windows 8. If either of them fail at their tablet product their entire company is in jeopardy. But Google wouldn't notice if android tablets fail, and flop. The entire thing to them is like a hobby. I think if android tablets were more popular in general we would see a lot more going on here. The fact that the TouchPad has sold more units than any other android tablet (combined I think) is really sad. Android just isn't taking hold in the tablet market, and won't without a lot of work by Google. But, what's their incentive? 98% of their revenue is from advertising. They still make money when an iPad pulls up an ad served by Google. They don't really have a lot of skin in the game, and it shows. I think the only reason Samsung, HTC, Motorola etc sell android tablets at all is because they don't really have a choice. They can't sell iOS tablets. The real test will be Windows 8 on ARM. If these companies can license W8 from Microsoft, its familiar to them. Its like building a Laptop or Ultrabook, they rely on Microsoft's ability to make compelling software, and enterprise friendly systems. That's really what HP was trying to do with the TouchPad. HP said the TouchPad wasn't their last tablet, but I would bet their next one runs W8. I think the tablet race us destined to be a two pony race, and that android isn't going to be the second pony much longer at the rate things are going. </rant>
Sent from my Galaxy S II (i777)
ace9988 said:
Before we start this discussion, i'd just like to say that the devs are doing a brilliant job of bringing android flavours to the Touchpad and this discussion should in no way be a deterrent to them doing their work.
Is it just me or is the touchpad a neglected device in terms of development compared to other tablets? i.e. asus, samsung, htc. niggles (or problems; you decide) with cm9 has started to
.
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I get so tired of people complaining they don't get the same things from a $200 device as others get from their $600 ones. The reason the TPs are selling at the price they are is that the manufacturer stopped development. But, IMNSHO, the TP users are actually benefiting from that. If HP were still in charge, the TP would not have ICS, Ubuntu or Arch running.
this is my first tablet after all.....and when we're used to the development we see on our (assumed) android phones you can't help but compare, but like i said its only a discussion. and whats Arch?
Doesn't the fact that HP released the android kernel help development? How much does it help
I've had 2 Primes including a very early model that I had to RMA and eventually got an ASUS refund. My 2nd tab I got from BBY in May and recently exchanged for an Infinity. I think the Infinity is ok, but my 2nd Prime was finally just setup right so it was running fine.
For me, it was actually kinda fun tweaking the Prime and playing with the numerous mods that were available. I was enjoying the active community and the challenge of getting the right combination of tweaks to make it scream. Of course, I just got it dialed-in and running great when the Infinity exchange option popped up. I was within days of unlocking to play with Motley kernel and Androwook ROM.
Now the Infinity is a great piece of kit, but the options for mods are very limited (it seems). Other than the screen, there is not very much difference. Now that GPS works, I really find it quite useless. There is not much difference in performance compared to my dialed-in Prime. There is really not very much real world difference in wifi for my daily use. There are very few ROMs to consider, and overall the dev community has not quite ramped up yet. Also consider that several purchased games no longer work - Asphalt 6, Madden, etc.
Oh well, the grass is not always greener. Maybe I will feel better once JB comes out, but things are pretty slow so far.
No - for now I'm not interested in trading for your Prime. I'm gonna hope JB comes out before my return window expires.
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using Tapatalk 2
Well done for sharing that with the group, don't you feel better now for confessing?
I'm really looking forward to jellybean on my prime. Can't wait to see how it improves things. Even as it is, I wouldn't change it for any single tablet out there.
Sent from my Desire S using xda app-developers app
Yeah I gotta say the Tf700 development section is still pretty quiet, this is balanced by many less complaints in the general section. For those less interested in in the fight to perfection the infinity is a better choice, but if you like having to earn that last 10% with research and experimentation, I agree, the prime was better.
When I bought the Prime, I did so knowing full well that the GPS didn't work and the Wifi was spotty, but it's never once been an actual issue for me. Between tethering the GPS from my phone and the dongle I've been fine, but I've actually only ever used the dongle once since I got it. All it's current issues can be fixed with firmware updates, and most likely JB that's coming soon. The Prime really is a great tablet and I personally prefer it over the 300T despite it's IO and gaming issues. A quick reboot has been enough to fix any of the games I wanted to run.
All the hate for the Prime is overblown because no one who's actually happy is going to post, which makes this forum turn into a cesspool of complaints. Everyone who's enjoying their Prime has been long since pushed off the forums by people who just want to raise a stink. The only reason I come here anymore is for updates from Gary, which while infrequent are at least enough to tell me that JB is on the way and our IO problems have been fixed in the kernel that's coming as a part of that.
I always assumed that since the Prime and Infinity were so similar, development would just carry between them- obviously not the case. What a strange situation for everyone having gotten refunds...
you forgot increased Quad Core processor speed.
Working Wifi (as GPS)
HD MP front and back camera that blow the Prime's away.
, although I didn't have major problems with my Prime than the weak Wifi/no GPS. I don't miss it a-bit.
In part because it was easy to back-up all my apps and transition them right into the Infinity without missing a beat.
Think the 300 has the same I/O issues the prime has. 80 seconds for a simple 1000 insert transaction!
Sent from my GT-I9300 using xda premium
I miss my prime too! The infinity looks nice but runs no where near as well as my prime with androwook and tweaks. I feel kinda hand cuffed at the moment with the infinity. Some games dont work, animation isnt as smooth on ones that do, probably because of the resolution. General performance is slower, and it is currently incapable of copying large files to the microSD. Sometimes I think I should have stuck with the prime, it gets a bad rap.
GS_Dan said:
I always assumed that since the Prime and Infinity were so similar, development would just carry between them- obviously not the case. What a strange situation for everyone having gotten refunds...
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Running JB nightly on my prime, and have to say: WOW, its smooth as butter.
Since the install no ANR of FC
Used my Nexus 7 for about 2 weeks until I realised there was nothing I could do with it that the Prime doesn't do
equally good or better (I'm not a gamer). Selling the Prime was never an option, so now it's top dawg again with
the N7 relegated to wife-device.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using xda premium
Love my prime
I'll jump out there and join the folks praising the Prime. I bought the Prime in April and was impressed with what it could do, despite its well documented shortcomings. It was not until I unlocked it and started flashing custom ROMs that I really got into this device. I love tweaking it and discovering new things about Android that I never even knew it could do. Plus, being able to use Google Now on cm10 is pretty slick. Unlocking, flashing, etc. is very straight forward, unlike my HTC Evo 3D which apparently requires nothing short of an act of God to root.
tamaniro said:
I'll jump out there and join the folks praising the Prime. I bought the Prime in April and was impressed with what it could do, despite its well documented shortcomings. It was not until I unlocked it and started flashing custom ROMs that I really got into this device. I love tweaking it and discovering new things about Android that I never even knew it could do. Plus, being able to use Google Now on cm10 is pretty slick. Unlocking, flashing, etc. is very straight forward, unlike my HTC Evo 3D which apparently requires nothing short of an act of God to root.
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The Prime is a fine piece of equipment. And if you're into custom roms, right now is a good time to own one! If you're new, get an infinity now, obviously, but if you have a prime there's little need to upgrade; your options with the Prime to enhance performance are pretty solid.
I enjoy my Prime much for the same reason I enjoy (and still enjoy) my Samsung Galaxy S (i9000). It's just a lot of admittedly geeky fun to experiment and tweak things. It's that constant striving and searching for perfection that has kept me preoccupied and always learning new things.
The SGS is a really old device and yet the development scene is still really active and something I always look forward to checking out everyday. Before the dev scene picked up, there really was a lot of dissatisfaction and complaints surrounding the SGS as well. GPS was awful, lag all over the place, internal storage issues and what not but those mostly are all things of the past. The only issues now just come with the phone's age I guess so it's getting harder for it to keep up with newer games, but then again I'm no hard core gamer though but I haven't encountered much issues with all the games I've tried.
The Prime's development scene isn't as active as I had hoped, but I guess it's better off versus some other newer devices for now. Don't know if that will change soon enough as people start defecting to other devices, but for now I'm happy. Sure, there's a lot still needing to be fixed and I guess with a new kernel coming along with official JB on the Prime sooner or later many issues will probably be resolved. Running JB via TeamEOS's JB ROM has been an excellent experience so far for me except for a few missing features (camera issues)..and that's with it still on an older kernel too!
Of course people like me are actually a minority since a majority of consumers probably just want to use something as is and works well out of the box. Nothing wrong with that, but I guess it really just depends on the user attitude and preferences. Not a lot are willing to or have the time to research and go about doing some admittedly risky things to their expensive devices. I'm a perfectly girly girl btw but I love this geeky side of me.
The Prime could have definitely been a better device than it is, but I love it and the whole experience I've been having with it none the less. If not for development and the constant search for satisfaction, I'm sure my Prime would end up collecting dust somewhere.
Sorry for the long post. Just wanted to share
now that you have confessed your sins welcome to heaven young lad