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So, Thursday started a terrible issue with my 3VO. My 3G speeds have been maxing at 40kbs. On Saturday, I couldn't get over 9kps. I've called Sprint and they had me reset all of the settings, but it didn't help. I purchased an app that looks at apps internet usage and can't find an app that is maxing anything out. I'm not having any issues with Wifi. There isn't any 4G in my area to test.
Is anyone else having this issue? If so, are there any fixes?
Thank you in advance for any help.
LD
What rom are you on?
Did you ask Sprint how their network is there? Tech guy I talked to gave me the info on this area, retention canceled my contract. No ETF for me get to keep the phones.
Yes I too have this issue. Best suggestion is to keep calling Sprint and get everyone you know having similar issues to call in as well so they do something about it.
The infrastructure has become heavily saturated in the past 6 months. A lot of people are having similar issues with this across the country. I get 10-20 kbps, and Sprint told me that's acceptable and nothing is guaranteed, which is true, but they should still maintain some level of service if they expect us to pay hundreds per month.
My 3G is unusable. If I am not on 4G or WiFi I pretty much can't use the internet. Sucks -_-
Did you temp root prior to running the full root program? If so did you delete all of the temp root stuff before full root?
I had the same issue. I believe it had something to do with the root process. If 3g is unusable you should be able to get a warranty replacement from Sprint. That's what I ended up having to do...
I don't know what to say because its the exact opposite for me which is weird because with my OG EVO I would have terrible speeds but with my 3D I seem to top 1Mbps every speed test.
Sent from my Shooter.
My 3g speeds have been horrible too. I get like 20-50kps downtown by my work when I used to get like 300-600. But, by my house I get 300-600 because I'm close to a tower.
I really feel like it started after I rooted, and I never did the temp root.
dustinmatthews87 said:
What rom are you on?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't rooted the phone, so I am stock.
vinterchaos said:
Did you ask Sprint how their network is there? Tech guy I talked to gave me the info on this area, retention canceled my contract. No ETF for me get to keep the phones.
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Click to collapse
Yes. The guy I spoke with checked it out. He said that there were several outages last week, but all of them should be fixed.
ReinMaker said:
Yes I too have this issue. Best suggestion is to keep calling Sprint and get everyone you know having similar issues to call in as well so they do something about it.
The infrastructure has become heavily saturated in the past 6 months. A lot of people are having similar issues with this across the country. I get 10-20 kbps, and Sprint told me that's acceptable and nothing is guaranteed, which is true, but they should still maintain some level of service if they expect us to pay hundreds per month.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They gave me a ticket to return the phone to the store, but warned me that the store may replace it with a refurb.
As for your issue, this guy told me that the poor speed was unacceptable and they would do their best to get it fixed. He also put in tickets to have the network examined. I wouldn't take that from them, so you shouldn't either. I've been with Sprint for 7 years and have had my ups-and-downs. Yet, they have been really good lately. Hell, if you want, I will even call them with you. That is just not right!
fmedina2 said:
My 3G is unusable. If I am not on 4G or WiFi I pretty much can't use the internet. Sucks -_-
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Click to collapse
I am glad that I am not alone, but this isn't good that we are all having this issue.
GadgetMonger said:
Did you temp root prior to running the full root program? If so did you delete all of the temp root stuff before full root?
I had the same issue. I believe it had something to do with the root process. If 3g is unusable you should be able to get a warranty replacement from Sprint. That's what I ended up having to do...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't rooted because I have been having so many issues with the phone. Once I get it replaced with a good one -- is there a good one? -- then I will root. I've been looking at some of the benchmark scores from some of these ROMs being in the 4000+ range and am drooling. MAJOR DROOLING!
DoctorComrade said:
I don't know what to say because its the exact opposite for me which is weird because with my OG EVO I would have terrible speeds but with my 3D I seem to top 1Mbps every speed test.
Sent from my Shooter.
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Click to collapse
Thank you. Glad to hear that some people are having positive upgrades with the EVO3D over the EVO4G.
MILTOWN said:
My 3g speeds have been horrible too. I get like 20-50kps downtown by my work when I used to get like 300-600. But, by my house I get 300-600 because I'm close to a tower.
I really feel like it started after I rooted, and I never did the temp root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, let's keep this thread going and see if we can get some of these issues figured out. Hopefully, we will be able to figure them out.
Oh, one of my biggest issues with the phone is that I sound like I am talking through a tin can to the caller on the other side. Is anyone else having this issue?
LordDavon said:
They gave me a ticket to return the phone to the store, but warned me that the store may replace it with a refurb.
As for your issue, this guy told me that the poor speed was unacceptable and they would do their best to get it fixed. He also put in tickets to have the network examined. I wouldn't take that from them, so you shouldn't either. I've been with Sprint for 7 years and have had my ups-and-downs. Yet, they have been really good lately. Hell, if you want, I will even call them with you. That is just not right!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried to get tickets put in but they kept telling me that the previous ticket is closed (when I had no service, no calls, text and 3g). I tried pleading with several supervisors and the "upper escalation supervisor" said "sorry, speeds are not guaranteed".
I told the guy that at that speed, even if I used it 24/7 for a month straight, I won't hit 2 GB, so why do they advertise unlimited 3G, and he was like "well I'll look into it". I got no response. I've been on the phone with them for the past 3 days, and they just keep telling me, "we're working on it". One person says there are no outages, another says there is. I ask for supervisors, and they just magically "cut off" and I'm not even rude with them. I don't like getting loud and rude over the phone (I have to use an iPhone to call them because how bad service is around here to begin with)
ReinMaker said:
I tried to get tickets put in but they kept telling me that the previous ticket is closed (when I had no service, no calls, text and 3g). I tried pleading with several supervisors and the "upper escalation supervisor" said "sorry, speeds are not guaranteed".
I told the guy that at that speed, even if I used it 24/7 for a month straight, I won't hit 2 GB, so why do they advertise unlimited 3G, and he was like "well I'll look into it". I got no response. I've been on the phone with them for the past 3 days, and they just keep telling me, "we're working on it". One person says there are no outages, another says there is. I ask for supervisors, and they just magically "cut off" and I'm not even rude with them. I don't like getting loud and rude over the phone (I have to use an iPhone to call them because how bad service is around here to begin with)
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Click to collapse
You're not going to get anywhere over the phone. Go in to a Sprint store and talk to someone face to face. The guy I talked to had the OG EVO. I had him set the phones side by side and load the same video from youtube. His og loaded right up while my 3d wouldn't load at all. Also did the same thing downloading an app from the market. OG blew 3D away. I pointed out mine had a dual core processor and he couldn't deny there was a problem with the 3D.... Warranty replacement baby. When it came in we tried the same test and my new 3D loaded up before his og... Not by much, but the difference was obvious.
Well, while I was posting earlier, I was on the phone with Sprint. I was just trying to get an update on the ticket they put into the network people. The CSR kept telling me that he couldn't find a ticket from earlier and that he would put on in. I hung up shortly after.
About an hour later, my data rates went from 10kbs to 800kbs down. So, I am thinking that there was something wrong on the Sprint side of things. Now, I am going to wait a few days and see if they stay where they are. If they stay, and there is a fix for the call quality issue, I am rooting it.
This also means that your issue could be on their side also. I agree with the above poster too. Get into the store and talk to them. You shouldn't give in to what they're telling you either. You pay an additional $10 for premium 3G and 4G. Not for 1x speeds.
GadgetMonger said:
You're not going to get anywhere over the phone. Go in to a Sprint store and talk to someone face to face. The guy I talked to had the OG EVO. I had him set the phones side by side and load the same video from youtube. His og loaded right up while my 3d wouldn't load at all. Also did the same thing downloading an app from the market. OG blew 3D away. I pointed out mine had a dual core processor and he couldn't deny there was a problem with the 3D.... Warranty replacement baby. When it came in we tried the same test and my new 3D loaded up before his og... Not by much, but the difference was obvious.
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Well the problem with mine is with all 5 lines, which are the: LG Optimus, EVO 3D, two EVO 4Gs and an EVO Shift. All have the same issues. I too had the EVO4G when the issues started 2 months ago. I brought it into the store back then, and they just kept replacing it. I got I think 3 replacements. I finally gave in an bought the EVO 3D instead. Same issue. It seems for me at least, its the just the general coverage area, and not because of the phone. The only thing this phone does more is drop calls and aside from the network issues, has to do with the placement of the antenna.
Other than that, the 3G speeds are the same on all 5 phones. 10-20, and maybe 50-70 (kbps, not kb, like 56kbps dialup) past midnight.
EDIT: BTW this occurs with everyone's phone around my area, but they're too lazy to call in. Only one of my friends (who is in the zip code over) is also calling in and getting nowhere as well.
UPDATE: So I got through to a supervisor in retentions, he finally said they can't do anything about it. His first offer was a $10 credit, and I'm like seriously? We argued back and forth and after 2 hours he says "Ok fine, your contract ends today for line XXXX and we will waive your ETF, please return your phone to where you purchased it".
So I ask him what about the other lines and he says no only this line. At that point I just gave up because I don't think he got the point that all phones are experiencing the same thing. I mean I'm not gonna switch with just one line and keep the other 4 on Sprint, especially if they all suffer the same dial up speeds. That will be a ****load of money. Then I got another speech about how service is not guaranteed and a bunch of BS, and I told him "Alright good night" and hung up.
Anybody got a current number to the Executive Department? Last number I found rerouted me to retentions. I don't think they'll be fixing anything anytime soon. He even admit two towers are down in my area and then later said it's probably my phones. If they let all of us out, I'm gone.
Sorry for the threadjack OP.
http://newsroom.sprint.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=2125
Wish this was here in Salt Lake.
Man, I can't wait for this in Houston. I should finally get signal in my office when they make this happen near me.
Thats nice and all but what are the speeds like...thats what I wanna know.
SolsticeZero said:
Man, I can't wait for this in Houston. I should finally get signal in my office when they make this happen near me.
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I second this. My signal sucks here by the galleria. I barely get 1-2 bars. SMH!
animal7296 said:
http://newsroom.sprint.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=2125
Wish this was here in Salt Lake.
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Thanks for the contribution, good info. My anger is not directed to the OP, but entirely to sprint. This is such a bunch of BS. Sprint has this network vision crap, which don't get me wrong I am thankful for. It is pathetic it has taken this long to merely star the very much needed [complete] overhaul of their network
They spent millions to renew their sponsorship to Nascar. Which not only doesn't help existing customers, but brings in new customers which makes the network more congested. They should sink more money into the proliferation of better equipment for network enhancement instead. If your network is great it sells itself (I give you the Verizon network) instead of wasting money by sponsoring Nascar.
I see from this article that sprint CONTINUES to make bad decisions! I will give you a perfect real world example to illustrate my point:
Branchburg, NJ:
Population • Total 14,459 • Density 712.3/sq mi (275.4/km 2 )
Mesa, AZ:
Population • Total 439,041 • Density 3,536.6/sq mi (1,365.6/km 2 )
Phoenix, AZ:
Population • City 1,445,632 (6th largest) • Density 3,071.8/sq mi (1,188.4/km 2 )
Salt Lake City, UT:
Population (2010) • City 186,440 (127th in U.S.) • Density 1,666.1/sq mi (643.3/km 2 )
They are doing these network vision upgrades in the most illogical, senseless locations first?! The place they did this upgrade in a city with a population that is almost as low as the city I live in, IN ONE SQUARE MILE! My city doesn't have 4g yet! Your city, my city, and a very large city next to me have 10-100(literal) times the population, and 2-5 times the number of people per square mile than where this upgrade was done. What a terrible business decision, no wonder sprint has almost gone bankrupt. You should always do improvements to service how or where it affects the MOST amount of people in a positive manner. Branchburg, NJ should have been way far down the list. Sprint better start maximizing the number of people that have better servIce, and doing it the way they have been doing certainly won't achieve that! Am I right?
Sad Panda said:
Thanks for the contribution, good info. My anger is not directed to the OP, but entirely to sprint. This is such a bunch of BS. Sprint has this network vision crap, which don't get me wrong I am thankful for. It is pathetic it has taken this long to merely star the very much needed [complete] overhaul of their network
They spent millions to renew their sponsorship to Nascar. Which not only doesn't help existing customers, but brings in new customers which makes the network more congested. They should sink more money into the proliferation of better equipment for network enhancement instead. If your network is great it sells itself (I give you the Verizon network) instead of wasting money by sponsoring Nascar.
I see from this article that sprint CONTINUES to make bad decisions! I will give you a perfect real world example to illustrate my point:
Branchburg, NJ:
Population • Total 14,459 • Density 712.3/sq mi (275.4/km 2 )
Mesa, AZ:
Population • Total 439,041 • Density 3,536.6/sq mi (1,365.6/km 2 )
Phoenix, AZ:
Population • City 1,445,632 (6th largest) • Density 3,071.8/sq mi (1,188.4/km 2 )
Salt Lake City, UT:
Population (2010) • City 186,440 (127th in U.S.) • Density 1,666.1/sq mi (643.3/km 2 )
They are doing these network vision upgrades in the most illogical, senseless locations first?! The place they did this upgrade in a city with a population that is almost as low as the city I live in, IN ONE SQUARE MILE! My city doesn't have 4g yet! Your city, my city, and a very large city next to me have 10-100(literal) times the population, and 2-5 times the number of people per square mile than where this upgrade was done. What a terrible business decision, no wonder sprint has almost gone bankrupt. You should always do improvements to service how or where it affects the MOST amount of people in a positive manner. Branchburg, NJ should have been way far down the list. Sprint better start maximizing the number of people that have better servIce, and doing it the way they have been doing certainly won't achieve that! Am I right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They're more than likely doing it in an area that has already completely phased out the 800mhz push-to-talk network. Larger and more dense cities will take longer to get people to switch over, so it will take them longer to go multi-node.
SolsticeZero said:
They're more than likely doing it in an area that has already completely phased out the 800mhz push-to-talk network. Larger and more dense cities will take longer to get people to switch over, so it will take them longer to go multi-node.
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Click to collapse
I definitely see your point that larger cities take more money to upgrade, more equipment, and more time. However, that's just three more points to prove my point. Not only do you want more people enhanced the fastest, but you want to do the larger upgrades when the investment money is fresh, the cost and energy savings of the new equipment, the customer satisfaction, and ability for higher capacity means more profit to use to improve the network even faster.
Sad Panda said:
I definitely see your point that larger cities take more money to upgrade, more equipment, and more time. However, that's just three more points to prove my point. Not only do you want more people enhanced the fastest, but you want to do the larger upgrades when the investment money is fresh, the cost and energy savings of the new equipment, the customer satisfaction, and ability for higher capacity means more profit to use to improve the network even faster.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not really saying anything about the cost. Larger markets with a lot of businesses tend to have a lot more push to talk customers. They're not going to go multimode until they have at least 90% of their PTT customers converted. Otherwise, those customers would be **** out of luck and their PTT wouldn't work. Smaller markets had these customers convert quicker, meaning they can go multimode sooner.
SolsticeZero said:
I'm not really saying anything about the cost. Larger markets with a lot of businesses tend to have a lot more push to talk customers. They're not going to go multimode until they have at least 90% of their PTT customers converted. Otherwise, those customers would be **** out of luck and their PTT wouldn't work. Smaller markets had these customers convert quicker, meaning they can go multimode sooner.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok fair enough. So you think the purpose for this was mainly for getting dual spectrum running for Ptt, not really adding in the dual spectrum for future data needs/devices?
Sad Panda said:
Ok fair enough. So you think the purpose for this was mainly for getting dual spectrum running for Ptt, not really adding in the dual spectrum for future data needs/devices?
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Click to collapse
I get what he's saying... smaller cities have fewer business using the OLD 800mhz PTT and can convert those iDEN towers to CDMA. If they did that in a larger city where thousands more people would still be using iDEN, That would be thousands more people whose service gets shut off and forced to upgrade. It's about pleasing current customers, not about money.
clear lake, woodlands all the suburbs of houston have ****ty signal....
its kind of ridiculous actually....
Ya I wish that Wichita KS would get 4g since sprints hq is in overland park ks. I been waiting since the evo4g
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
Damnit sprint needs to put these all over NYC.
thesparky007 said:
clear lake, woodlands all the suburbs of houston have ****ty signal....
its kind of ridiculous actually....
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Click to collapse
Kingwood is spotty at best too, I live up on Northpark by 59 and I get ok 3G but zero 4G which makes me sad as my old apartment in Atascocita got near flawless 3G and 4G.
SolsticeZero said:
I'm not really saying anything about the cost. Larger markets with a lot of businesses tend to have a lot more push to talk customers. They're not going to go multimode until they have at least 90% of their PTT customers converted. Otherwise, those customers would be **** out of luck and their PTT wouldn't work. Smaller markets had these customers convert quicker, meaning they can go multimode sooner.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dunno how true this is. PTT will work everywhere till they shut off iden....which is stated to be supported for awhile nationally while they get their new ptt stuff out, so I doubt ptt is shut off in specific areas.
Think its more long the lines of them picking a place that meets all their test needs and partners too. Wouldn't expect them to be starting in NYC with this kinda overhaul. If somin happens more ppl r SOL. Better to get it up in real world elsewhere first.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
SolsticeZero said:
I'm not really saying anything about the cost. Larger markets with a lot of businesses tend to have a lot more push to talk customers. They're not going to go multimode until they have at least 90% of their PTT customers converted. Otherwise, those customers would be **** out of luck and their PTT wouldn't work. Smaller markets had these customers convert quicker, meaning they can go multimode sooner.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Timing and location also comes down to regulation. Building or even modifying a signal tower can require long approval from various layers of government and residents/businesses, especially in more populated areas.
Sad Panda said:
Thanks for the contribution, good info. My anger is not directed to the OP, but entirely to sprint. This is such a bunch of BS. Sprint has this network vision crap, which don't get me wrong I am thankful for. It is pathetic it has taken this long to merely star the very much needed [complete] overhaul of their network
They spent millions to renew their sponsorship to Nascar. Which not only doesn't help existing customers, but brings in new customers which makes the network more congested. They should sink more money into the proliferation of better equipment for network enhancement instead. If your network is great it sells itself (I give you the Verizon network) instead of wasting money by sponsoring Nascar.
I see from this article that sprint CONTINUES to make bad decisions! I will give you a perfect real world example to illustrate my point:
Branchburg, NJ:
Population • Total 14,459 • Density 712.3/sq mi (275.4/km 2 )
Mesa, AZ:
Population • Total 439,041 • Density 3,536.6/sq mi (1,365.6/km 2 )
Phoenix, AZ:
Population • City 1,445,632 (6th largest) • Density 3,071.8/sq mi (1,188.4/km 2 )
Salt Lake City, UT:
Population (2010) • City 186,440 (127th in U.S.) • Density 1,666.1/sq mi (643.3/km 2 )
They are doing these network vision upgrades in the most illogical, senseless locations first?! The place they did this upgrade in a city with a population that is almost as low as the city I live in, IN ONE SQUARE MILE! My city doesn't have 4g yet! Your city, my city, and a very large city next to me have 10-100(literal) times the population, and 2-5 times the number of people per square mile than where this upgrade was done. What a terrible business decision, no wonder sprint has almost gone bankrupt. You should always do improvements to service how or where it affects the MOST amount of people in a positive manner. Branchburg, NJ should have been way far down the list. Sprint better start maximizing the number of people that have better servIce, and doing it the way they have been doing certainly won't achieve that! Am I right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also, I think Sprint would rather test a less populated area, and iron out the kinks, than to do this to a large, densely populated area, where people would fill up message boards, make numerous calls to customer service should there be any issues. It's sort of like beta testing software. You release it to a small set of users, and work out the bugs before doing a rollout on a massive scale.
tokuzumi said:
Also, I think Sprint would rather test a less populated area, and iron out the kinks, than to do this to a large, densely populated area, where people would fill up message boards, make numerous calls to customer service should there be any issues. It's sort of like beta testing software. You release it to a small set of users, and work out the bugs before doing a rollout on a massive scale.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is actually a really logical reply, I shamefully hadn't thought of that before. There really is going to be that much testing required for hardware changes though? Seems a bit fruity to think their network engineers need a lot of testing when adding hardware. If this were more software I could easily see it, but the majority of the upgrade is physical changes. Seems silly to me
Sad Panda said:
This is actually a really logical reply, I shamefully hadn't thought of that before. There really is going to be that much testing required for hardware changes though? Seems a bit fruity to think their network engineers need a lot of testing when adding hardware. If this were more software I could easily see it, but the majority of the upgrade is physical changes. Seems silly to me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To be honest, I don't really know if this is sprint's reasoning, but it sounds logical to me. But I can't count the number of times I've messed with my home network/car/home repair, to do things that, on paper, should be just plug and play, but I end up working through some issue hours/days later.
Edit: I do see your frustration, however. In the last 6-8 months, Sprint has had crappy service. Extremely slow "3G" speeds (more like 1X), and dropped calls/not receiving calls/etc. They finally fixed the 3G issue, so my speeds are in the 1.0-2.4 mb/s range, depending on when I run speed tests. But my dropped calls/calls not going through/not receiving calls is still an occasional issue, for both me, and the wife.
Sad Panda said:
This is actually a really logical reply, I shamefully hadn't thought of that before. There really is going to be that much testing required for hardware changes though? Seems a bit fruity to think their network engineers need a lot of testing when adding hardware. If this were more software I could easily see it, but the majority of the upgrade is physical changes. Seems silly to me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is hardware and software. both so yes they do need the testing to make sure stuff is running as intended on both fronts.
They both work together to allow the switching between the freq/spectrum's and make it easier for them to allocate how they see fit int eh future.
Well it seems they are already starting to decommission some of the towers which have IDEN on them it seems.
They are using NO as a test base to then take the results of what happens there to apply nationally starting in April evidently.
This is good news as it shows that they might be willing to move faster than initially stated with the iDEN overhaul as before its always been stated to not start till 2013...This will save them money in the near future and hopefully just hopefully allow them to complete the iDEN transfer sooner than expected and re-purpose the 800MHz spectrum to CDMA(1xAdvance)/LTE...
http://www.engadget.com/2012/02/06/sprint-nextel-iden-shutdown/
http://s4gru.spruz.com/pt/Sprint-un...site-with-Decommissioning-Tower-Maps/blog.htm
that 2nd link is the original source to the engadget article btw. first time ive seen that site, though it has some interesting information in it.
Nice find man lol been reading up on Google about it
reaper24 said:
Nice find man lol been reading up on Google about it
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Click to collapse
yeah its not big news as in it doesnt effect us one bit but the biggest thing MIGHT be that they might be getting the whole spectrum re-purpose done earlier than originally planned.
Looks like Orlando, FL and surrounding areas starts June this year. BALLIN!
sgt. slaughter said:
yeah its not big news as in it doesnt effect us one bit but the biggest thing MIGHT be that they might be getting the whole spectrum re-purpose done earlier than originally planned.
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Click to collapse
Sprint is always slow lmao I still don't have 4G in my area for 3 years none. Tho I think it has been longer than that lol.
thing that got me the most was looking at the map of NO and seeing how many freaking towers they have there. Hell im here in Raleigh and dont even show a 1/10th that many in such a small area. given they have 4x the population we have here thats a ton of towers there imho.
Thanks for the link back to our site. We were the original tech page breaking the story, and almost no one has referenced us except Engadget.
Robert Herron
Sprint 4G Rollout Updates
NMherron said:
Thanks for the link back to our site. We were the original tech page breaking the story, and almost no one has referenced us except Engadget.
Robert Herron
Sprint 4G Rollout Updates
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Click to collapse
Hey anytime. like i said first time I've seen your site personally and ive been with sprint and around for a long time. Deff looks like you have some solid info.
Yey! !!!!
I hope are phone bill goes down as they start pulling out the awfully stupid decision to invest in a DOA technology like iDen....
Sprint should of gotten the hint: not even its creator [Motorola] wanted it!
/sarcasm /rant
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
megabiteg said:
Yey! !!!!
I hope are phone bill goes down as they start pulling out the awfully stupid decision to invest in a DOA technology like iDen....
Sprint should of gotten the hint: not even its creator [Motorola] wanted it!
/sarcasm /rant
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ha whatever it was great if you used it. Had it way back in the day when I was in high school and managing an amusement park. everyone having nextel was great, no need for separate radios and all that. Tons of people use it in all sorts of industries esp construction. just more ppl use reg cells overall so the need for that spectrum is getting bigger.
Just think if Sprint didn't invest in Nextel, they wouldn't even have that 800MHz spectrum and they still likely would of been outbid for the spectrum VZ got in the auction long ago...
sgt. slaughter said:
ha whatever it was great if you used it. Had it way back in the day when I was in high school and managing an amusement park. everyone having nextel was great, no need for separate radios and all that. Tons of people use it in all sorts of industries esp construction. just more ppl use reg cells overall so the need for that spectrum is getting bigger.
Just think if Sprint didn't invest in Nextel, they wouldn't even have that 800MHz spectrum and they still likely would of been outbid for the spectrum VZ got in the auction long ago...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol,
I don't deny it was great, but I sure don't think it was a smart move to purchase the damn thing. I've used it both for work in the military as for personal and those days were fun, I got to admit.
But everyone saw that IDEN was dead weight for sprint because of hosting 2 almost incompatible technologies, they were going to have a single provider (inflation) for network devices and radio equipment and IDEN wasn't being accepted as a world standard and operating in very closed markets; they should of invested in a GSM infrastructure & spectrum and they would of had their money worth something right now.
megabiteg said:
Lol,
I don't deny it was great, but I sure don't think it was a smart move to purchase the damn thing. I've used it both for work in the military as for personal and those days were fun, I got to admit.
But everyone saw that IDEN was dead weight for sprint because of hosting 2 almost incompatible technologies, they were going to have a single provider (inflation) for network devices and radio equipment and IDEN wasn't being accepted as a world standard and operating in very closed markets; they should of invested in a GSM infrastructure & spectrum and they would of had their money worth something right now.
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So they would drop their current cdma spectrum for gsm?....that there is a much bigger turnover. I look at the Nextel buy as getting subs and spectrum. Without that sprint likely bought up by VZ long ago imho...
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sgt. slaughter said:
So they would drop their current cdma spectrum for gsm?....that there is a much bigger turnover. I look at the Nextel buy as getting subs and spectrum. Without that sprint likely bought up by VZ long ago imho...
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I do agree with you, but I do see one big mistake on both Verizon and Sprint. Investing in CDMA technology shouldn't of been their priority. GSM is the global technology which has become the standard world wide. Many countries are starting to migrate completely, e.g.: Latin & South America, EU and more...
It's no secret that the USA is no longer leader in Mobile technology, we have an overall inferior network vs many parts of the world. The US should join the wold in the GSM standard and not resit it.
I've worked in the backbone of CDMA and GSM networks, the cost associated to maintain a CDMA network is higher then the GSM counterpart due to how modular it is and how expensive the interconnection and expansion equipment are.
Just my honest opinion.
megabiteg said:
I do agree with you, but I do see one big mistake on both Verizon and Sprint. Investing in CDMA technology shouldn't of been their priority. GSM is the global technology which has become the standard world wide. Many countries are starting to migrate completely, e.g.: Latin & South America, EU and more...
It's no secret that the USA is no longer leader in Mobile technology, we have an overall inferior network vs many parts of the world. The US should join the wold in the GSM standard and not resit it.
I've worked in the backbone of CDMA and GSM networks, the cost associated to maintain a CDMA network is higher then the GSM counterpart due to how modular it is and how expensive the interconnection and expansion equipment are.
Just my honest opinion.
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Click to collapse
Well the cost also has to do with the fact that b/c of so many people using it, that alone brings down general costs for things. Partially reason Sprint switching to LTE over WiMax is that LTE has become much cheaper to roll out now that so many other providers are on board with it....
when you worked in the backbone of CDMA networks you shoulda given Sprints a nice kick in the arse btw as they need it there.
So I just came across a story that I found interesting. Sanford C. Bernstein analyst says that bankruptcy for Sprint is "a very legitimate risk".
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20120319-707703.html
That's what happens when u spend a billion dollars on iphones
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Doesn't say much really...
Sent Using My HTC Evo 3D, On The Now Network From Sprint!
Perhaps eventually, but they are a long way from the total shutdown type of bankruptcy. At worst, they'll do a restructuring bankruptcy, but I don't even think it will come to that. They have made some bad decisions, but in the very important metrics of customer satisfaction and retention, they are doing quite well. A company can recover from bad technology investments (Lightsquared, ClearWire). When they start hemorrhaging customers, that's when you really have to worry.
animal7296 said:
So I just came across a story that I found interesting. Sanford C. Bernstein analyst says that bankruptcy for Sprint is "a very legitimate risk".
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20120319-707703.html
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It's LightSquared's fault... That, and putting all their eggs into the iPhone basket. But to be honest, it hasn't had a chance to bounce back from it yet.
A lot of people have been thinking about this, but no one has wanted to say it.
Sprint will get bailed out if they were ever forced to close up shop. At&t and verizon are too big to be the only consumer choices.
fpineda101 said:
Sprint will get bailed out if they were ever forced to close up shop. At&t and verizon are too big to be the only consumer choices.
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This is true. Just as the government's been helping banks.
eXplicit815 said:
It's LightSquared's fault... That, and putting all their eggs into the iPhone basket. But to be honest, it hasn't had a chance to bounce back from it yet.
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it has 0 to do with the iPhone...They already stated they were on track for meeting the iPhone goals much much sooner than the deadline. I think over a year sooner than scheduled...
the thing is the analyst is missing some key things when he went on to spout about spectrum as that is NOT a problem for sprint with clearwire and also their own 800MHz LTE with 1900LTE they will be on par with Verizon at the least bit...
The one thing that is a little concerning is the maturities of the debt due in 2015...Doesn't give NetworkVision much time to show its wings and get more customers...Though with any other piece of debt they likely will not have much trouble rolling that amount to a later date paying a lil more premium...
I've been hearing this same tune every few years about Sprint. I've been with Sprint 11 years now, and to be honest I'm considering switching carriers for the first time.
Over the past 2 years my personal experience with their customer service has extremely poor. I've considered VZW but I have to take into account data limits.
xjman said:
I've been hearing this same tune every few years about Sprint. I've been with Sprint 11 years now, and to be honest I'm considering switching carriers for the first time.
Over the past 2 years my personal experience with their customer service has extremely poor. I've considered VZW but I have to take into account data limits.
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If you've stuck around that long like I have then you might as well wait another year and see the effects of NetworkVision rollouts as they have already started and should greatly help most if not all issues like slow speeds and such...
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sgt. slaughter said:
If you've stuck around that long like I have then you might as well wait another year and see the effects of NetworkVision rollouts as they have already started and should greatly help most if not all issues like slow speeds and such...
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Well I can say that personally from my experience with the "NetworkVision" rollouts that they have done nothing in my area. They completed 1 data speed upgrade and 3 data capacity upgrades (I live 1 mile from a sprint tower) and they have done NOTHING to help voice/data services. My phone actually defaults to roaming now, so I will just wait for sprint to cancel me.
If sprint wanted to avoid this they should've began their "NetworkVision" rollout before they launched the iphone...Hell they should've done it before they launched the OG Evo 4g. They had NO business having smartphones on their dumb network. Now they are scrambling because people are saying screw it and they are paying an extra $20-$30 a month to go to verizon or at&t.
I really, really hope sprint can make it. But from what i've seen from these tower upgrades they haven't made anything better in my area.
ronartest2005 said:
Well I can say that personally from my experience with the "NetworkVision" rollouts that they have done nothing in my area. They completed 1 data speed upgrade and 3 data capacity upgrades (I live 1 mile from a sprint tower) and they have done NOTHING to help voice/data services. My phone actually defaults to roaming now, so I will just wait for sprint to cancel me.
If sprint wanted to avoid this they should've began their "NetworkVision" rollout before they launched the iphone...Hell they should've done it before they launched the OG Evo 4g. They had NO business having smartphones on their dumb network. Now they are scrambling because people are saying screw it and they are paying an extra $20-$30 a month to go to verizon or at&t.
I really, really hope sprint can make it. But from what i've seen from these tower upgrades they haven't made anything better in my area.
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Those are NOT NetworkVision rollouts that your seeing on that website showing "data capacity upgrade" and such...those are mere lil band aid patches and should not be used in reference to what networkvision rollouts are...the NV rollouts involve a complete revamp of the cabinets and backhaul that will make dramatic differences in most of the troubled areas...
To put in perspective the backhaul changes are all being re-done to fiber or microwave based and the current backhaul is using the ancient bundled T1 based...
S4GRU.com has been putting up the rough rough schedule of the cities being done so far btw...
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xjman said:
I've been hearing this same tune every few years about Sprint. I've been with Sprint 11 years now, and to be honest I'm considering switching carriers for the first time.
Over the past 2 years my personal experience with their customer service has extremely poor. I've considered VZW but I have to take into account data limits.
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Click to collapse
not trying to be rude. just making an observation. the majority of the time i hear of people with bad things to say about sprint's customer service it's from customers that have been with sprint for roughly ten years. i've personally had no problems with sprint at all, but i've only been with them for 2 years. is sprint just not that friendly to it's long time customers?
efan3719 said:
not trying to be rude. just making an observation. the majority of the time i hear of people with bad things to say about sprint's customer service it's from customers that have been with sprint for roughly ten years. i've personally had no problems with sprint at all, but i've only been with them for 2 years. is sprint just not that friendly to it's long time customers?
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no, people just expect more then the average person which is dumb in my opinion, it's like buying a car and expecting it to fill itself up for you, but if the gas pump is crowed then you should be ahead of everyone else just because you want gas -_-, i've been with sprint for 5-6 years now and my parents have been with them for 13+ i've never seen an issue and if there was, either i took care of it or i gave sprint a call for a simple refresh, people that complain about sprint service probably complain about their drinks being too cold at a diner -_-
sgt. slaughter said:
Those are NOT NetworkVision rollouts that your seeing on that website showing "data capacity upgrade" and such...those are mere lil band aid patches and should not be used in reference to what networkvision rollouts are...the NV rollouts involve a complete revamp of the cabinets and backhaul that will make dramatic differences in most of the troubled areas...
To put in perspective the backhaul changes are all being re-done to fiber or microwave based and the current backhaul is using the ancient bundled T1 based...
S4GRU.com has been putting up the rough rough schedule of the cities being done so far btw...
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Ah, I got ya. I just wonder how long (or if) for that matter sprint will do that where I live. Verizon currently has LTE here and it is fast, 20mbs down. But I am not in a large enough city that I think sprint will upgrade their towers within the next couple of years here. I really hope they do. Because I really don't want to leave for verizon. But it get tougher as each day goes by.
ronartest2005 said:
Ah, I got ya. I just wonder how long (or if) for that matter sprint will do that where I live. Verizon currently has LTE here and it is fast, 20mbs down. But I am not in a large enough city that I think sprint will upgrade their towers within the next couple of years here. I really hope they do. Because I really don't want to leave for verizon. But it get tougher as each day goes by.
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In my area VZW has LTE, USC is revamping all towers for LTE rollout, and Sprint still has about 100k download speeds. At the best I see 300k, it's getting old, it's been this slow for almost 2 straight years now. Unlimited....? Sure you can have all the data you can use, it's as slow as a dial up connection, but have at it,lol.
As far as the comment about Sprint meeting the iCrap expectations, yes they are meeting the expectations on selling them, but (and it was posted here somewhere) they are still losing money on the whole iCrap thing and will be for at least 2 years. Just because they're meeting the sales expectations doesn't mean it's making them money.
I was a fan of sprints until i.started consistently getting 70k down the past 15 months, hoping it would get better, hoping....hoping.....never happened. I'm willing to pay the extra dollars for the bandwidth on VZW. What good is unlimited data at a trickle? I'm out when this contracts up. I like sprint, really...but no data speed on a smartphone ain't gonna cut it.
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ronartest2005 said:
Ah, I got ya. I just wonder how long (or if) for that matter sprint will do that where I live. Verizon currently has LTE here and it is fast, 20mbs down. But I am not in a large enough city that I think sprint will upgrade their towers within the next couple of years here. I really hope they do. Because I really don't want to leave for verizon. But it get tougher as each day goes by.
Click to expand...
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Where are ya located?
NetworkVision is going to be complete in a couple years, at least the tower upgrade and backhaul parts with most if not all being complete during next year...
They have already started up in NJ, Chicago, and a bunch others...I wouldn't pay much attention to the network.sprint.com site as the stuff there is nothing releated to the NetworkVision upgrades...
Just for an idea, those areas where you have horrid speed with great signal and its because the tower is over capacity...the backhaul change will make a huge difference.
Each T1 line is capable of about 1.5Mbps and bundles T1 lines is what's used now...microwave based backhaul is capable of over 1Gbps....each is going to microwave or fiber so that's a giant leap in capacity...
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Im sure Verison is happy...
I was bored, and I had another question they did answer for me, then this happened, and I thought it was pretty funny. This is with VZW chat rep on their website of course.
I also e-mailed their Wireless side CEO concerning this, the unlimited data crap, locked bootloaders (want a GSIII but the bootloader...) and such. I cannot wait for the response.
ryan: so if you are on month 21 of the 24 month contract, what would the ETF be? Do you know?
Kareva: No, as it is different per account for various reasons. Are you looking to upgrade or add a new line today?
ryan: No I am looking to leave your company as you wouldn't move my upgrade forward by a few months, so I could upgrade to the GSIII and keep my unlimited data. Therefor you won't get my service any longer.
Kareva: Great! Would you like to number to customer care to find the ETF amount?
ryan: not now, and I am rather bothered that you are excited to lose customers. What kind of company is this...
Kareva: Well not so much excited, but it is your money and to see you leave because of something that is in a contract that you applied for, I can't be too mad. I hate that you will now have to deal with bad service, but your choice.
Kareva: Can I assist you with anything else?
ryan: lol what? I would rather take bad service from companys that don't lock bootloaders, don't strip unlimited data away from customers just for pure profit. Some people have morals, apparently not your company, or you
Kareva: Well is there anything else I can assist you with tonight?
ryan: oh so you can make accusations like that, but lack the balls to stand behind them?
Kareva: Is there anything else I can do for you today?
ryan: grow a pair and not make comments you won't stand behind. This will be e-mailed to your CEO.
ryan: Terrible customer service
Kareva: Have a great night and please come again. We thank you for being the greatest side of Verizon !
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That's not the first time I've seen their chat reps being very rude. A friend of mine posted her chat with one of their reps and that rep was rude as well. I don't understand how they can get away with being so rude and keep their jobs. If I acted that way at my job I would be out the door.
Wow they really don't care at all anymore. Big red is a giant a-hole
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adavit said:
That's not the first time I've seen their chat reps being very rude. A friend of mine posted her chat with one of their reps and that rep was rude as well. I don't understand how they can get away with being so rude and keep their jobs. If I acted that way at my job I would be out the door.
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Yeah it is terrible, I wrote this as the e-mail to the VZW CEO which also included the full chat between me and the rep. Can't wait for the response.
Hello,
I first off would like to state, that I am one of your customers rather upset by the choices Verizon has made in not letting us grandfather in on unlimited data, and forcing us to a tiered data plan, in what looks to be for nothing but pure extra unneeded profit. I probably will not be a customer for much longer due to this, and the fact that my upgrade is not terribly far away, but instead of moving it forward, and letting me get a galaxy SIII and keep my unlimited data, your company decided it was better to lose me. I am debating between buying a Galaxy SIII that your company has locked down which no other wireless provider has, or just paying the ETF and flat out leaving for another carrier now. I know my service wouldn't be as good as yours, but right now I don't feel as if your company deserves any more of my money, than I need to let you have. In doing so I joined your online chat to ask about the ETF. I wasn't bothered by the answer I got, but more so the excitement in the employees statement about me leaving verizon. I then was more bothered by the next statement made, that the rep then refused to respond too. I admit my responses ended up lacking a mature way of responding, but they were meant as intended. I think the employee realized their screw up as they forced me off the chat at the end. I would have been impressed with an "I am sorry I said that sir," but instead was treated like I ruined their day. I made sure to leave it up, so I can copy it here for you to read. I don't know if these are saved or not, but this is terrible behavior.
Loosing unlimited data, full price for phones, locked down bootloaders, and the way I have been treated by employees, are reason I will never come back or recommend verizon to anyone again. I stand with what I told the rep, I would rather stand behind my morals and have mediocre service, then lose them, and have great service.
I do give you a chance to change my mind, but I somehow don't see that happening.
Thank you for your time. (No my name is not ryan, but I had just ended a chat with my real name, with someone who was helpful, but forgot to ask about the ETF, and felt weird if I had ended up talking to them again.)
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That is hilarious, I guess u got a bad CS rep. I have come across plenty of stupid ones, overly polite ones, or just people who write like they are copying and pasting from a handbook but never one of those.
I'm not defending the chat rep but aren't most of their responses just form responses anyway? I never had anything resembling a "conversation", I just assumed they basically went from a script, much like reading back tech support steps.
mbarry55 said:
I'm not defending the chat rep but aren't most of their responses just form responses anyway? I never had anything resembling a "conversation", I just assumed they basically went from a script, much like reading back tech support steps.
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You really think that second response about other coverage sucking was script?
I know some answers are, but that doesn't feel that way. Which would explain why they wouldn't respond about it.
For the sake of playing devil's advocate I don't see anything too outrageous being said by the chat rep. Your comments come across as a little naive.
ryan: lol what? I would rather take bad service from companys that don't lock bootloaders, don't strip unlimited data away from customers just for pure profit. Some people have morals, apparently not your company, or you
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Click to collapse
I mean at the end of the day they're a company who's primary goal is to, yes, make a profit. As they are honoring their current contractual obligations with you I don't really see this as a lack of morals?
For the record, I'm as unhappy about the changes and the bootloader annoyances and everything but we're kidding ourselves if we think this community represents the majority of wireless consumers. They are going to do whatever they want to do to turn a bigger profit. It's nothing personal, just capitalism...
nosympathy said:
You really think that second response about other coverage sucking was script?
I know some answers are, but that doesn't feel that way. Which would explain why they wouldn't respond about it.
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Click to collapse
I'll say at&t has the greatest customer service, if you have any issues they will do anything to keep you with them. I only went to Verizon to get away from tiered data plans
My contract ends next year, by then I hope at&t has 4g in my area and I'll be switching to them
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usefulidiot127 said:
For the sake of playing devil's advocate I don't see anything too outrageous being said by the chat rep. Your comments come across as a little naive.
I mean at the end of the day they're a company who's primary goal is to, yes, make a profit. As they are honoring their current contractual obligations with you I don't really see this as a lack of morals?
For the record, I'm as unhappy about the changes and the bootloader annoyances and everything but we're kidding ourselves if we think this community represents the majority of wireless consumers. They are going to do whatever they want to do to turn a bigger profit. It's nothing personal, just capitalism...
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Click to collapse
MOST companies understand that good customer service equals a greater profit, Verizon can get away with this because of their coverage and reliablity, but soon enough they will get bitten in the ass by this and change their ways
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i tried, they completely dodged the questions and ended the chat verizon is seriously the worst
Maddison: Hello. Thank you for visiting our chat service. May I help you with your order today?
bob: Hello I just want to say i am very dissapointed with verizons plans to screw people out of their grandfathered unlimited data or else i would be purchasing a new phone soon but instead im thinking of leaving verzion
Maddison: I will be happy to assist you with your order today.
bob: okay nevermind iguess you guys really dont care about it
Maddison: It has been my pleasure to chat with you today! Please feel free to re-open the chat session if you need further assistance . Thank you and have a great day!
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usefulidiot127 said:
For the sake of playing devil's advocate I don't see anything too outrageous being said by the chat rep. Your comments come across as a little naive.
I mean at the end of the day they're a company who's primary goal is to, yes, make a profit. As they are honoring their current contractual obligations with you I don't really see this as a lack of morals?
For the record, I'm as unhappy about the changes and the bootloader annoyances and everything but we're kidding ourselves if we think this community represents the majority of wireless consumers. They are going to do whatever they want to do to turn a bigger profit. It's nothing personal, just capitalism...
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Click to collapse
regardless of how you feel. Verizon found a loophole to the forced unlocked bootloaders of the 700mhz spectrum. No other company forces you to drop unlimited if you renew. Also, as you said yourself, we make up a small percentage. Yet that small percentage is the percentage they on purpose try and control the most.
Also, yes their statement was bothersome. Should have gone, "I am sorry to hear that sir, but unfortunately there is nothing I can do for you concerning this issue you are having."
Not, Have fun with the competitions crappy service. Specially when they do not know who I am going too, they are making assumptions.
I understand capitalism, but this really isn't it. There is too heavy of an attempted monopoly attitude with these companies. They don't compete to earn your business, they assume you will get their business and you will do whatever they say, because of their phone and service offerings.
nosympathy said:
regardless of how you feel. Verizon found a loophole to the forced unlocked bootloaders of the 700mhz spectrum. No other company forces you to drop unlimited if you renew. Also, as you said yourself, we make up a small percentage. Yet that small percentage is the percentage they on purpose try and control the most.
Also, yes their statement was bothersome. Should have gone, "I am sorry to hear that sir, but unfortunately there is nothing I can do for you concerning this issue you are having."
Not, Have fun with the competitions crappy service. Specially when they do not know who I am going too, they are making assumptions.
I understand capitalism, but this really isn't it. There is too heavy of an attempted monopoly attitude with these companies. They don't compete to earn your business, they assume you will get their business and you will do whatever they say, because of their phone and service offerings.
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Yea alright I'm done playing devil's advocate, I think we're mostly in agreement here.
ijustwantmydock said:
i tried, they completely dodged the questions and ended the chat verizon is seriously the worst
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They used siri
Sent from my iPhone...
ijustwantmydock said:
i tried, they completely dodged the questions and ended the chat verizon is seriously the worst
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Click to collapse
Lololol. Webchat is a joke.
I am not siding with the VZW rep on this but it is competition that makes various businesses update/change policies. VZW cannot be to blame as your requests do not fall under the contract for which you signed. People take things for granted, if you are grandfathered into a unlimited data plan you should be happy with it. If you give someone an inch, they'll take a mile.
The providers all suck, each in their own unique ways. If you find the one that gives you awesome coverage, unlocked stock top-of-the-line cheap phones, provides OS upgrades quickly, no EFTs and unlimited data for great prices- please let me know where I can sign up!
Unlimited data is going away for everyone, just give it enough time. Grandfathers don't live forever.
richii0207 said:
I am not siding with the VZW rep on this but it is competition that makes various businesses update/change policies. VZW cannot be to blame as your requests do not fall under the contract for which you signed. People take things for granted, if you are grandfathered into a unlimited data plan you should be happy with it. If you give someone an inch, they'll take a mile.
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Click to collapse
No what people are mad about is lack of competition.
You have four major wireless companies. A bunch of smaller companies.
The companies all have their little "thing" the other companies don't offer to try and real you in.
What needs to happen, is every carrier gets the same phones. May not be interchangable, but if one company gets phone B, all companies get phone B. All versions of phone B will be exactly identical, minus maybe GSM/CDMA etc. that HAS to be different.
All phones will be UMRP and sold at a subsidized price per the MFG. All your major and minor companies will then only have to focus on a few things. Coverage, plans, speed, and price. They could control the price of the phones too, and things would get better.
At this point, (ignore the fact it was kind of a fail advertising wise using it to prove a point) say the hot new phone comes out, the rezound, and you want it, you can have it on anybodies service. Now all four major companies, and if it applies, minor companies, will have to ACTUALLY compete to get your service. More mins for less money, unlimited data, better customer service. They would never burn you, because they know you won't be back, because they won't have that exclusive that you have to have.
this isn't exactly how it works over seas, but is closer, and from my understanding service over their is DIRT cheap, and look at the amount of phones over seas running cyanogenmod, aokp, MIUI, etc.
nosympathy said:
You really think that second response about other coverage sucking was script?
I know some answers are, but that doesn't feel that way. Which would explain why they wouldn't respond about it.
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Click to collapse
Actually, that is. Granted, it was worded poorly, but it's in their script to talk about how bad service is with other carriers.
I don't have your phone, or Verizon.. but your post is why I don't have that phone, or Verizon. I've always been confused why people pay so much more to be with Verizon.. I pay 64.50 per month with T-Mobile, unlimited minutes and texts with 2gb of data. I could pay 76.40 and have 5gigs of data, do you actually need more??
Everyone has their reasons for choosing the company they do, tho most don't have very well thought out reasons.. these companies let each other use each others service, so technically you don't get better service from one over another.
And to the last guy who was posting about the subsidy situation with the carriers, in almost any other country in the world, phones are not locked into the carrier, and the carrier doesn't have the say so over the phone, which we know simply isn't true here. These companies try to hold on to the way things are, and they aren't going to stop.. simply for all the reasons you named. They are in control. They've made us their *****. We have to deal with it until the majority of consumers here change their buying habits.. but just like so many other issues, I don't see us ever working together to make positive change.
to the open, switch companies and feel good about it. Vzw sucks, you won't miss them.
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