We are starting a movement toward HTC to get them to release their source code on a more timely basis such as samsung. We need as many people as we can get to do this with us because they won't listen if only users of 1 devices complains. i know others devices have been held up by htc so we are reaching out to (or at least trying to) all of the htc device forums we can in order to spread the word and get everyone involved. please take a look at the link below as it has all of the info regarding this.
link: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1821328
PETITON: http://www.change.org/petitions/htc-htc-needs-to-speed-up-kernel-source-releases?share_id=sLjvObpqne
Edit: the thread and the petition have been reworked in a way that will reflect a more professional stance on the issue. please read it and voice your opinions about it so i can make it better if needed.
even thow htc are not following GLP does not mean for us to get mad over this it will come if not then we should boycot htc
I am not signing a petition that uses terms like "B.S." in the letter. If you want HTC to respond, the letter should be done a bit more professionally and not read like it was written by a pre-teen.
Great idea, though. I am sure there is an appropriate letter to be found somewhere on the interwebs.
BTW, I can't believe that, with all the Verizon delays in releasing ICS, HTC does not already have the source ready for release. The OTA was almost exactly the same as the leak we got a month earlier.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
cflo360 said:
even thow htc are not following GLP does not mean for us to get made over this it will come if not then we should boycot htc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Huh? Lol
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using xda premium
jclendineng said:
Huh? Lol
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exact thoughts I had
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using xda premium
WookieFan said:
I am not signing a petition that uses terms like "B.S." in the letter. If you want HTC to respond, the letter should be done a bit more professionally and not read like it was written by a pre-teen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, that's a bit embarrassing. I'm beginning to think this device is mostly owned by people who are teens to early 20's. Between the way petition letter was written and the high school drama on this board over the past several months, I think I may be in the minority owning this phone in my late 30's.
cflo360 said:
even thow htc are not following GLP does not mean for us to get made over this it will come if not then we should boycot htc
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Click to collapse
Let me see if I could translate:
Dear kind sirs,
Even through HTC isn't following the GLP, we shouldn't get our jimmies rustled. If they continue to not give us what we demand, we should boycott the company.
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nolimit78 said:
Let me see if I could translate:
Dear kind sirs,
Even through HTC isn't following the GLP, we shouldn't get our jimmies rustled. If they continue to not give us what we demand, we should boycott the company.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice!
HTC will eventually release the source. I don't think a petition will do anything at all to expedite that. It's not a priority and the very small percentage of Rezound users that want the source is not going to make it so. If you're really up in arms about it and want to do something that has a chance of working, not a guarantee, but a chance, report a GPL violation.
Some things to keep in mind is that GNU can't do anything about it in this case, so don't waste time reporting it to them. They publish the license, but they are not the copyright holder of the kernel source. Only the copyright holders can do anything about license violations. In this case, there are several thousand copyright holders...everyone who has ever had any code merged into the mainline of the Linux kernel is a copyright holder. Their interests are protected by the Linux Foundation at http://www.linuxfoundation.org/. That is where to start if you want to report a violation.
It's fine to have this energy about this, but don't make the mistake of misdirecting in a bad direction.
Sorry, but I can't sign this.
While I fully support HTC complying with the GPL. I support the usage of basic grammar in formal writing even more.
Was the petition machine translated? That would explain a lot.
foggytown said:
Sorry, but I can't sign this.
While I fully support HTC complying with the GPL. I support the usage of basic grammar in formal writing even more.
Was the petition machine translated? That would explain a lot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This.
If you're going to make a petition for something like this, then you need to do it professionally / with well-written grammar, etc. Right now, like previously mentioned, it just sounds like a bunch of teenagers that aren't getting their way. Re-write the petition to make it sound more formal / professional, and you'll get more support.
Not to mention all the other problems with this, I don't really think this is [URGENT]...
Is someone going to kill your dog if they don't release the source or something?
PhxkinMassacre said:
We are starting a movement toward HTC to get them to release their source code on a more timely basis such as samsung. We need as many people as we can get to do this with us because they won't listen if only users of 1 devices complains. i know others devices have been held up by htc so we are reaching out to (or at least trying to) all of the htc device forums we can in order to spread the word and get everyone involved. please take a look at the link below as it has all of the info regarding this.
link: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1821328
PETITON: http://www.change.org/petitions/htc-htc-needs-to-speed-up-kernel-source-releases?share_id=sLjvObpqne
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-_- really?????? come on now. have you read the GPL????
GPL has no specific date or time:
"While this version of the GPL does not place an explicit timeframe upon fulfilment of source distribution under section 3(b), it is the consensus viewpoint of the Linux community that such distribution take place as soon as is practical and certainly no more than 14 days after a request is made."
^ they have a choice to follow what other linux devs do which is 14 days. its only been 6 official days sense launch of ICS on the rez.
Please put down the pitch forks and RELAX already. once the 14 days are up, and you want join Spartacus in his quest to get source, then by all means do so.
Wah. I want my ice cream sandwich! Stomping feet on the way back to my room. Slams door.
I don't get why anyone is taking this thread seriously. If i were HTC and I received some letter from a group of people demanding I release MY WORK earlier than I planned, IF AT ALL, I'd tell them to go buy a a phone from some other manufacturer. Id then sit back and watch my sales drop 1% and continue to enjoy the millions of dollars that continue to come in because we all know HTC makes great phones and a VERY small percentage of consumers would stop buying them even if HTC said they would NEVER release anything.
You guys act like this is some kind of public utility that small children are relying on to survive. HTC owes us nothing outside of what the warranties on their equipment provides for. Grow up already. If you aren't happy, buy another freakin' phone. Jesus.
To Whom it May Concern:
Many owners of one of your devices, the HTC Rezound, appreciate your recent release of the Android 4.0 "Iced Cream Sandwich" operating system. Our collective enthusiasm continues to drive the notions of both innovation and creativity; to that end, we would like to ask that you please consider expediting the schedule you have for releasing the kernel source code for this operating system. While it is true that several previous devices developed by your company (and others) have taken a series of months before release, our community overall asks that you consider accelerating your kernel release schedule so that we may further engage in our community development efforts.
----------------
That is how educated, articulate adults speak and write. I would suggest replacing the existing petition text with something similar to what I wrote above; that way you won't sound like a 15-year old self-entitled douche-canoe, and will have the added bonus of most likely getting more than 142 signatories.
partizan1981 said:
To Whom it May Concern:
Many owners of one of your devices, the HTC Rezound, appreciate your recent release of the Android 4.0 "Iced Cream Sandwich" operating system. Our collective enthusiasm continues to drive the notions of both innovation and creativity; to that end, we would like to ask that you please consider expediting the schedule you have for releasing the kernel source code for this operating system. While it is true that several previous devices developed by your company (and others) have taken a series of months before release, our community overall asks that you consider accelerating your kernel release schedule so that we may further engage in our community development efforts.
----------------
That is how educated, articulate adults speak and write. I would suggest replacing the existing petition text with something similar to what I wrote above; that way you won't sound like a 15-year old self-entitled douche-canoe, and will have the added bonus of most likely getting more than 142 signatories.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nicely done. Sales 101. Not to sound hypocritical but I'm going to steal the term douche-canoe from you for my personal use
Sorry my English is a little bad lol.
wmaudio said:
I don't get why anyone is taking this thread seriously. If i were HTC and I received some letter from a group of people demanding I release MY WORK earlier than I planned, IF AT ALL, I'd tell them to go buy a a phone from some other manufacturer. Id then sit back and watch my sales drop 1% and continue to enjoy the millions of dollars that continue to come in because we all know HTC makes great phones and a VERY small percentage of consumers would stop buying them even if HTC said they would NEVER release anything.
You guys act like this is some kind of public utility that small children are relying on to survive. HTC owes us nothing outside of what the warranties on their equipment provides for. Grow up already. If you aren't happy, buy another freakin' phone. Jesus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're joking right? You're talking as if HTC is the number one manufacturer when even RIM outsold HTC so far in 2012. That's bad. HTC was doing bad so they had to shake things up, did the One series with Sense 4 then just said "Meh..." to their other devices.
See, that's the thing. You say they owe us nothing when, by the GPL, they do. They're supposed to release the kernel source and haven't. Why? Give me one good reason why they haven't released their source code. They have nothing to gain from this situation other than customers getting pissed off which can be a PR nightmare. Trust me. There are over 25,000 users of ViperROM. HTC's better off to just give us what is rightfully ours before it turns into a giant headache for them.
Chyrux said:
See, that's the thing. You say they owe us nothing when, by the GPL, they do. They're supposed to release the kernel source and haven't. Why? Give me one good reason why they haven't released their source code. They have nothing to gain from this situation other than customers getting pissed off which can be a PR nightmare. Trust me. There are over 25,000 users of ViperROM. HTC's better off to just give us what is rightfully ours before it turns into a giant headache for them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow. Such an entitlement mentality. That is the problem with a lot of people. You owe me.... I deserve it. No!
Related
Alright. The forums are filled with speculation, rumours, facts and a lot of first-adopters under caffeine addiction and patience measurable by a microscope.
For many of you this might be a first 'early adoption' attempt. I've been in a few (most recently with Galaxy Nexus just a month ago), so let me just point out a few things that makes this Prime fiasco not sound like a fiasco at all.
There is no such thing as a world wide launch, or even a US/Europe launch, for a flagship device that does not have supply issues. Every flagship device released has supply issues. We live in times where the demand for flagship devices far outweigh the ability to manufacture. This is why Apple (sometimes) starts production much earlier than others since their demand is -even higher- than any device released by Asus or Samsung. But even they get hit by supply issues and some stores or countries don't get the device for months, if at all. Thus, trust me when I say this, a high demand and problematic supply is a good sign. If you are an early adopter of something that does not have a high demand and supply problems, the product might not be as good as you hope.
If they were to manufacture quicker then the price would go up. There are human resources behind product manufacturing, which are limited. And not only is it limited by human resources, but also by supply of parts from partners that end up in the final device. If you had a choice of 'waiting longer' for a cleaner launch (so they could manufacture more devices by the time of launch) or having Asus release products a little sooner to satisfy early adopter interest, we all know we would rather get it sooner rather than later, even if some of us have to wait longer (we are selfish like that). So it is better that at least some of us, who pre-ordered very early and got lucky with the seller, will get the device this month instead of delayed launch in January or later.
Another reason why companies release products sooner is because it is a race. While they can manufacture only certain amount, if they held back a release to have more devices during launch, they would be a month or even more closer to the time when the device becomes outdated. This is especially true with Android tablets that simply do not carry the word of mouth of an iPad or a content ecosystem of Kindle Fire. Android tablets are a niche device which competes in market dominated not by software, but by specs. It is more beneficial for Asus to get the product out quicker from sales standpoint, even if they are unable to manufacture to meet the early demand.
This issue seems huge and bad for you. But to everyone outside the circle, no one is even aware. You simply think this is the worst launch in the history of tech launches, when in fact this type of launch is more common than the changing of socks. Asus and every other company goes through couple of launches like that every year. This here is nothing special, there's no point trying to make it sound like it is. The reason why tech portals are not full of huge discussions about Asus and Transformer Prime launch is because it is not at all a major issue in tech world.
And companies know this. Both sellers and manufacturers know about the impatience of early adopters who place pre-orders often even before they know what the device is about. Reality is that early adopters are a very small percentage of the people who end up buying the product. Upsetting early adopters at a time when the product is not even widely advertised does not damage Asus sales. They are used to it and in fact so is every other company.
Tech problems are also common with devices. In fact I don't know a flagship device that does not come with a quirk or two. Galaxy Nexus smartphone launch involved the phone not working properly on 2G networks which was a major, major issue. A hardware manufacturing flaw. But it was fixed with a software update so it became a non-issue. You can add Apple's Antennagates and battery issues to this pile too. Small issues get blown out of proportion because of user expectation after paying a lot of money. Companies do their best to fix these problems. If Prime is affected by weaker WiFi signal, well, it simply is not perfect. It is also not as fast in certain aspects compared to iPad 2, so what? If you are really disappointed you should wait for something better, but expecting a device to be flawless is silly since it is just not going to happen.
The reason why customer support does not respond to you with all the details in the world is because the customer support does not know. Product launch and manufacturing is something that involves thousands of people and hundreds of companies. Sellers do their best to get their orders, Asus does their best to meet the demand. And every day you ask about the product, that customer support person has gone through many just like you before you contact them. You, an early adopter, who keeps bombing the customer support every day, are just a drop in the pond. You have no idea how low priority it is for any company to deal with your epic problem that is really just about you getting a product few weeks early.
If you want to cancel your pre-order, go ahead and do it. But do not think that any seller or Asus is affected by your canceling. They will sell their items regardless. Do not cancel the pre-order for wrong reasons. If you really want another device or wait for another device, do it. But don't cancel a pre-order just out of bitterness, you'll regret it a month down the road.
I know that we are all frustrated since we want the product right now. Some of us have already paid the full price, some of us have paid even more (I'm paying 20% extra for customs fees from the product and courier shipping). But this is just a product. Unless your friend is a freak of nature like you are about product launches, you will still get a shiny Transformer Prime before your friends and family to show off and feel great about.
I, for one, am glad to have ordered Prime. I will get it and so will you. Just be a little more patient.
holy wall of text, tldr
can u repeat that i wast really paying attention.......... its the 12th lets hope there was some truth
blaziner18 said:
holy wall of text, tldr
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Click to collapse
LOL!!! I was thinking the same thing!
I actually did read it, and having been through such product launches before (namely, the TF101), I definitely agree.
Everything kristovaher said was right, especially about all these whiners that cancelled their pre-orders because they don't have any patience. So all those above me that are trying to sound cool at the expense of an intelligent, truthful response to all the 'drama', you're not cool. You're not funny.
ask a verizon customer waiting for the Gnex if this is a bad launch !
hbk19 said:
I actually did read it, and having been through such product launches before (namely, the TF101), I definitely agree.
Everything kristovaher said was right, especially about all these whiners that cancelled their pre-orders because they don't have any patience. So all those above me that are trying to sound cool at the expense of an intelligent, truthful response to all the 'drama', you're not cool. You're not funny.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and your not cool for caring about peoples whining, i could never imagine giving enough ****s to right/read a sentence about the haters/whiners.
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Thanks for writing that, OP. It's refreshing to see some intelligent and logical posts here. I can see that XDA Developers (unfortunately) deserves its reputation based on some of the posts made in this thread.
ModestMuse23 said:
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Click to collapse
Why do you out yourself as a total dumbass in all publicity?
That is really weird...
I thought those kind of pictures belong to forums were the average user is below 10 years...
irriadin said:
Thanks for writing that, OP. It's refreshing to see some intelligent and logical posts here. I can see that XDA Developers (unfortunately) deserves its reputation based on some of the posts made in this thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What reputation is that? They are generally lauded by the tech media as far as I know. A few kids that post silliness shouldn't warrant a bad reputation. Look at all of the development that happens here. That's where the rep should and does come from, imo.
I read it also. He is right though. This lookin like its going to turn into a flame thread, unfortunately. People just need to chill out. We have exactly one week till release
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
demandarin said:
I read it also. He is right though. This lookin like its going to turn into a flame thread, unfortunately. People just need to chill out. We have exactly one week till release
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly.
And what is more amusing is that Asus has not -lied- to anybody, yet people act as if they have. They came out with as official as possible release date on 1st of December and no one believed them. They said 12/19, which they universally pushed all to 19 because of higher-than-expected demand for Prime. A lot of people shot it down though for the simple reason of it being later than they would like it to be, even going as far as saying that this 19 didn't even come from Asus.
I can understand frustration if majority of November pre-orders are not covered by Christmas, but today is only 12th of December.
Diamondback2010 said:
Why do you out yourself as a total dumbass in all publicity?
That is really weird...
I thought those kind of pictures belong to forums were the average user is below 10 years...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Internet = Serious Business
It's all over folks, no more joking or having fun on the internet, Diamondback's panties might get in a bunch and call you mean and nasty names.
theres a fire a-comin.... so hide yo keeds, hide yo...
ModestMuse23 said:
The Internet = Serious Business
It's all over folks, no more joking or having fun on the internet, Diamondback's panties might get in a bunch and call you mean and nasty names.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Trolls aren't wanted here. Go Away and troll somebody else..
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Anybody else wish that all Transformer Prime discussion was still limited to those three threads on the TF1 forum? At least there would be some level of moderation, that we do not have at all here yet.
skeptikal said:
What reputation is that? They are generally lauded by the tech media as far as I know. A few kids that post silliness shouldn't warrant a bad reputation. Look at all of the development that happens here. That's where the rep should and does come from, imo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On reddit (and a few other sites) there's a consensus that while there is still a lot of great content & good developers on XDA, there's also a lot of immaturity.
irriadin said:
On reddit (and a few other sites) there's a consensus that while there is still a lot of great content & good developers on XDA, there's also a lot of immaturity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Real reason for this is that majority of devices don't have their own forums, which do exist here. So it brings in non-developers even though the forums name is 'xda developers'.
It's not bad, XDA is still a tremendous resource and the development subforums are a great source of quality information, but general threads are populated with repeat questions and rumour-mongering, as is evident in the case of Prime, a device that not many of us have spent any time with.
I've run product marketing/management in many of my positions. To a large extent, what you covered in your missive is true. Launching a new product successfully is a study in project management. There are thousands of tasks that all have to be orchestrated and there are many dependencies and there are some things can only be done sequentially. There's an axiom in product management: you can have it good, fast, or cheap - pick two. My guess is the CEO of Asus who is somewhat of a cowboy demanded "fast" to beat other competitors to market. That pretty much screws the product management team who is forced to make concessions with their carefully created project plan/timeline and forego the quality of the launch for the sake of speed.
There are quite a few clues that something funky is going on with the launch of the Prime.
1) Clearly the types and quantities of product are lower than originally estimated. The fact that some colors/sizes are available in some places and not others is a clue. And the launch date sliding by weeks very close in means they allowed themselves no cushion to deal with issues that inevitably come up with a product launch. That or they miscalculated which is never a good sign. Amazon, who is really good at selling stuff, didn't randomly take pre-orders without some sort of quantity commitment. Something changed and fairly close to launch. The fact that they pulled the product completely probably means they lost confidence in Asus' commitments; at least for the time being.
2) Until the device is in fairly widespread use we won't know if there are potential h/w or s/w issues. The fact than some reviewer units and early units in Taiwan are having Wi-Fi issues may be early production challenges or a potential design issue. The fact that reviewers with problem units sent them back and got units without issues is both good and bad. The fact Asus knew what the problem was and fixed it means that, at a stage very close to launch, they're finding things that are typically identified much earlier in the process.
3) Asus is smaller compared to its peers. Based on last quarter's financials they generate half the revenue of Acer another Taiwanese tech company. The combination of fewer resources, a demanding CEO, set-in-stone deadlines and working with new technology (Teg3 and ICS) isn't a recipe for quality and timeliness. And being smaller, they get less preferential treatment and pricing from vendors supplying the components they use to assemble their products. And the TF1 wasn't a beacon of quality at launch and the Prime is a much more complex device.
4) There's been a lot of discussion about the complexity of fabricating the Teg3 SoC. Other things like the all metal casing are new too. There may be production or supply issues with components being manufactured by third parties for the Prime that are beyond Asus' control. Regardless, you don't typically set a launch date until all those risks are identified and mitigated.
So, the statement that all product launches are challenging is true - in every industry. Asus said they plan to sell a million tablets in 2012 of which I'm assuming the Prime is the majority. The launch will be quickly forgotten. How well Asus did with the Prime will be judged months from now.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
So sad to what this forum has become. This used to be where everyone posted their work sharing or not, so others could benefit from it....closed or enclosed. A place to make our machines the best they can be, to the point where if you mentioned this name or that name or mention this mod or that mod you will get banned. Simply terrible!!!! Now if you read my posts and see I hardly say anything and ive been here for a while. I've gotten to the point that this site is not much fun anymore. Example.... If a bunch of people want to post there home screens on a dev page, let them post it. It's tribute to the dev and no harm is done. Plus others can learn by actually learn by seeing there home screens. I'm just trying to bring back the actualization why we are all here in the first place....to learn... To contribute... To benefit, and make our pieces of machinery the best they cab be.
So in all, this community needs to be best and a top notch better then the rest. Keep pushing mods away and we will become second to none. I got enough off my chest. Good night...... Good fight.
Love all....
Sent from my PG86100 xda app-developers app
Comments withdrawn
I agree it's sad we have to watch what we say and can't share all of our work because of petty drama. But it is what it is. Kinda feels like the Apple/Google patent trolling. Just wish people would be mature and let better things improve our experience for everyone, but I know that's a utopia and won't happen. I also know there's more to it than that. I don't want to add fuel... But yes, I do wish that whole thing played out differently.
But I don't think home screen posts should flood a dev thread. It's annoying as it is having to sift through dozens of the same questions that are answered in the op. When I look at a rom or kernel or mod thread, I want to know the progress, the bugs, user experiences, and the direction of development. Not how people are laying out their widgets and apps. Not that so and so is drunk and wants to say what's up, although sometimes those can be entertaining. Not little chit chat of members catching up because they hadn't talked in a while. It's going to happen regardless of what I want... But I can dream. Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting these things be prohibited... Just sharing my views on the matter.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda app-developers app
Just don't contribute here, simple as that.
There are other places with a lot of people you already know.
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
pstevep said:
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
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Click to collapse
Again, what about the ILLEGAL PRL, and WiFi tether? Is that not warez?
Sent from my Kindle Fire using xda premium
Volumes said:
Again, what about the ILLEGAL PRL, and WiFi tether? Is that not warez?
Sent from my Kindle Fire using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We can't control what Prl you flash. It's also not the greatest idea in general. The site has numerous carriers, if you choose to flash something that is not meant for your carrier that's up to you.
All carriers have things in place to stop people from tethering and using other prls. They can stop it if they want. If they hit us with a c&d we would block it all, however wifi tether apps are on the play store. Kernels are governed by a specific law the gpl, we require that is complied with. Technically you can say that rooting your phone shouldn't be allowed since the carriers don't want that either. Wrong battle to fight.
pstevep said:
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just wanted to thank you for this explaination of why they are considered "warez" on XDA. It's not because they are actually "warez" or illegal as some seem unwilling to stop publically claiming, but rather because XDA and he have mutually decided that they are not for XDA. Altough I don't understand why if something is found elsewhere that works for some it cannot be discussed. I understand not linking, but discussing. Altough, I guess it just leads to flame wars and is best not talked about at all. Thanks pstevep!
pstevep said:
We can't control what Prl you flash. It's also not the greatest idea in general. The site has numerous carriers, if you choose to flash something that is not meant for your carrier that's up to you.
All carriers have things in place to stop people from tethering and using other prls. They can stop it if they want. If they hit us with a c&d we would block it all, however wifi tether apps are on the play store. Kernels are governed by a specific law the gpl, we require that is complied with. Technically you can say that rooting your phone shouldn't be allowed since the carriers don't want that either. Wrong battle to fight.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But you can supply it, so its illegal to do drugs but, you supply them?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Volumes said:
But you can supply it, so its illegal to do drugs but, you supply them?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not illegal. The things you mentioned are not illegal.
Yeah without all the drama here I've become bored with this place.
Volumes said:
But you can supply it, so its illegal to do drugs but, you supply them?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Man...there is no LAW that says that rooting your phone or using wireless tether is against the law. GPL is based on copyright law so it is a law that has to be followed.
Rooting your phone and using wireless tether might be against your contract with your carrier but there is NO LAW that says you cannot do it.
I've changed my signature to reflect my feelings on the subject
Save the Drama for your Mama with Tapatalk 2
why can't people just understand:
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what is the point of flaming mods for doing what they need to do to keep order?
Lead by example
I'm sorry, but your definition is incorrect
— n
informal illegally copied computer software which has had its protection codes de-activated (Dictionary DOT com)
You're upsetting people by using terminology that already exists to wrongfully describe someone. You CAN NOT change the dictionary. You CAN NOT say that someone who is black that is actually white
you want this to stop. stop saying things like that. When a cop faces a near rioting crowd, the last thing he should do is beat one with his flashlight to push everyone over the limit and start rioting. your problem may not have started with the mods, but it's being perpetuated by their poor handling. *including this quoted post*
you must conduct yourself in an acceptable manner even in the face of adversity. If you're a moderator, you should be held to a higher standard and people all around the web complain about XDA's moderators the most ~ wonder why.
pstevep said:
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FIR3STARTER said:
I'm sorry, but your definition is incorrect
— n
informal illegally copied computer software which has had its protection codes de-activated (Dictionary DOT com)
You're upsetting people by using terminology that already exists to wrongfully describe someone. You CAN NOT change the dictionary. You CAN NOT say that someone who is black that is actually white
you want this to stop. stop saying things like that. When a cop faces a near rioting crowd, the last thing he should do is beat one with his flashlight to push everyone over the limit and start rioting. your problem may not have started with the mods, but it's being perpetuated by their poor handling. *including this quoted post*
you must conduct yourself in an acceptable manner even in the face of adversity. If you're a moderator, you should be held to a higher standard and people all around the web complain about XDA's moderators the most ~ wonder why.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That almost made a point.
Except.
It states that it's warez, which is slang (as notated in your definition by "informal"). And in this instance means not allowed on this site.
Really? You don't want to argue semantics with me, it's not worth it to either of us.
This site is fine. It's the users ruining it. Not reading rules, not abiding by them or arguing them in inappropriate ways (this thread for example) . I've been to plenty of sub forums in this site where things are fine.
I think everyone is expecting this to be picture perfect when it never will be. There will always be someone doing something they shouldn't and whether people do things they should or should not do in response to it determines how these forums are viewed. :beer:
Sent from my A100 using Tapatalk 2
I really hate to jump into this topic as I have been trying really hard to ignore it but it just keeps popping up. So here is my 2 cents.
XDA-Developers is a PRIVATELY OWNED Site. The rules they have or want to impose on people that use this site are up to them. When they make a decision to enforce a rule, good or bad, It stands.
From all my years of browsing forums, One thing stands out among all comunities.
That people think this little corner of the internet is a Democracy.
It is in fact not, It is more of an Autocracy.
To all you homeowners out there or people that can relate to owning property or personal space, How would you feel if someone marched onto your property and tried to tell you what to do, how to do it, and what rules you should have on YOUR property? That wouldn't fly im sure.
The government tells you what you can or cant do with your property, you make decisions about your property as long as its legal and the government tells you its OK.
Joe Crackhead walking by on the street has no right or ability to tell you what to do with any aspect of your property, nor force his opinion on you on what he "thinks" is the best way.
Bottom line is this is the house of XDA, and the owner says what goes.
So please, for the love of god just follow whatever rules they impose, no matter how stupid you may think they are, and go about your daily business. In all actuality you have absolutely no right to ***** and moan about anything the higher ups have to say about squat.
Let the rants and pissing and moaning stop. If you don't like what is going on take it to the source, feel free to contact the owner of the site or the admins directly with your issues. Hell, start a damn petition. But whatever you do just do it off of their private property that they allow you to use before they revoke that "right" you think you have.
IRL you cant even protest on private property, why does anyone think this is any different?
This isn't aimed at anyone or any group specific, Its just aimed at the general population that thinks this is some kind of public property owned by all.
Leave the MODS out of it as they are just following orders from people that tell them what to do. They are in a lose lose situation as if they don't do what they are told they catch **** from the owner/admins and if they do they catch **** from the community.
Do I think the MODS sometimes should handle things in a different way? YES
But guess what? They DON'T have to, and thats not up to me or you to even have an opinion about.
Believe me the people they are answering to are not the community. They explain things that happen out of courtesy.
Get it out of your heads that any of you have any "rights" on this or any other message board and
please, please, please
LET IT DIE
As for the warez argument, warez is software that is shared without permission.
Im not going to get into the "legal or illegal" argument. See my explanation on this website is Privately owned.
If the government says its not illegal great,
If XDA says its illegal then it is illegal on this board.
Government > XDA > You
that's the decision making process here on XDA, simplified of coarse
XDA says no sharing of that software
whats his name says no sharing of that software on XDA
They agree, why cant you?
This is the first and will be the last time you will hear from me about this topic, It is common sense that you all should know.
Wow somebody ban this guy
I don't say a whole lot on these forums, but I'm in them everyday. I've been on xda far longer than most that post in this, or any other thread. I have to say the flaming has gotten to epic proportions, and it was inevitable that the ban hammer was going to fall sooner or later. Xda used to be the "go-to" site for all devs to show their craft. The adoption rate of android has finally caught up with this place and the maturity has plummeted, thus creating a graveyard of devs in its wake. People complain about the mods in the same manner they complain about the police. Without the police, the "kids" would run this place even worse and drive all the talent away. Posting in here shouldn't be a e-pene measuring contest, it should be for the reason we are all here, to live on the cutting edge of software and squeeze everything we can out of our phones.
Boom goes the dynamite
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Link to the official thread
If you find someone posting in this thread direct them to the official thread. The more threads the folks post in the less time available to focus on the main goals.
ROUND 3:
THE ICS LEAK AND THE THEAD HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM XDA AS WELL AS POSTS MADE BY epinter FOR THE PAST COUPLE DAYS!
The official reason as to why this happened
FBI warns users of mobile malware (Google states Jelly Bean has protection that older versions of Android does not)
Cnet Article: FBI warns users of mobile malware
Support My Moto Campaign has been specifically mentioned in latest Cnet article.
A big thanks goes out to Casey Newton and Roger Cheng for mentioning us here at Support My Moto!
Over forty articles covering Motorola's removal of the ICS update and over ten articles that mention the campaigns
This is the Official Support My Moto Campaign Thread
Support My Moto! at supportmymoto.comA unified campaign backed by developers and you requesting Ice Cream Sandwich & Jellybean updates, source code, and unlocked bootloaders for the owners of Atrix MB860, Atrix MB861, Atrix ME860, Electrify MB853 ,Photon MB855, DROID X2, MB870, XT882, MT870
The main goals of the campaign is to have a unified front in submission of requests for Ice Cream Sandwich & Jellybean updates, source code, and unlocked bootloaders for the owners of Atrix MB860, Atrix MB861, Atrix ME860, Electrify MB853 ,Photon MB855, DROID X2, MB870, XT882, MT870.
What we would like to happen;
Unlock would make JB ROMs available to anybody that wants it.
Updating would cover more moto owners and thereby minimize the impact to Moto's profits and public image.
A clean plan of how the $100 credit is to work as "We're looking into it" type statements are very damaging.
The reason we ask these things is that it gives Motorola room to work with. Once/if Motorola decides to open up a line of communication then specifics could be discussed. Ideally unlock and an update would cover almost all Moto owners. Either way, both solutions would be of benefit to Moto. Even though I'm fronting the campaign I would like to see as many people walk away from it happy, or at least not want to attack each other.
This is achieved by filing Better Business Bureau Complaints, FTC Complaints, emailing The Consumerist and signing the petitions. These things and more can be achieved at the
Support My Moto Website
#supportmymoto Support My Moto IRC chat to discuss issues and tactics
For IRC chat on your phone try AndChat
If your company or employer has decided to remove Motorola from the approved supplier list for cell phones, please contact us. We would love to hear from you.
Please remember to submit Support My Moto to the news sites and tech blogs for coverage.
If you are a developer and would like to sign on, post "Count me in!" and I will add you to the list on the website and here as well.
SIGNATURE PIC TO SHOW SUPPORT IS ATTACHED TO THIS POST
I just sent an email to Consumer Reports and it went like this:
CR did a review on not too long ago and gave high marks to the smartphone known as the Motorola Photon 4G. While I think that your review is fairly accurate, one thing you should mention to fellow consumers is Motorola's unfair business practice. Quite simply, Motorola posted an update schedule for upgrading the Android OS. The schedule stated for a period of a few months that this and a few other of their smartphones would receive an update to Android 4.0.4, also known as Ice Cream Sandwich. Currently, the only update it has been given is a maintenance release that only fixed a handful of issues and one that effectively locked the bootloader. In laymens terms, they closed the possibility for developers to enhance the devices longevity and usefulness. They effectively killed the open source nature of Android and its promise for software update support for the next 18 months, all of which were major selling points for most of their phones. In essence, they have effectively lied to consumers about the way they handle business and I would like for this to be brought to light, so that others may know just what they are getting into when dealing with Motorola Mobility and its affiliates. It is just very frustrating to have such a high-end device (that I worked hard to have) be left in the dark and abandoned by a company that I thought to be one of the leaders of the communications and development industry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It could have been better but it's very late down here. Anyway, before I hit the sack, I just voted for this to be submitted to the xda portal and for all others reading, I urge you all to do the same!
Thanks!. Hey,could you repost in the official thread?
Support My Moto TeamDEVELOPERS
Th3Bill
mof9336
peetr_
zacthespack
Magiman7
upndwn4par
mmontuori
Syl
samcripp
spleef
android-DEP
shabbypenguin
tiger013
k0nane
stevendeb25
epinter
Notorious544d
pinguy1982
italosnt
Contributors
azrienoch of XDA Developer TV
na7q of motosunfire.com
QBKing77 & His Youtube channel Please be sure to send some "Thanks" his way for the video!
Done and done. I didn't know about it until I pressed the the link in the red font. I'm so used to blue hyperlink text. Lol
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
supportmymoto.com
supportmymoto.com
Done... :highfive:
I have requested an Indian Technology News website tech2.in.com to cover this news. Got a reply that they will cover this.
-- UPDATED: Copying this post to the official thread in the Android General forum.
andr0idfreak said:
I have requested an Indian Technology News website tech2.in.com to cover this news. Got a reply that they will cover this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AWESOME andr0idfreak!! Make sure you post their response or coverage here. ;D :good:
By the way, everyone if it is any constellations if you Google search "Motorola forum" then all the negative coverage of the fact Motorola is dropping ICS/JB updates for our devices are high on the results page. Only if we can get the same results to come up higher for a search with "Motorola" by itself.
Also, check this out the latest financial results from Google indicates that Motorola Mobility will be faced with additional layoffs unfortunately. You can go there to read up and post your analysis as to how their future may be affected by losing more potential customers due to their decision to drop ICS/JB for our devices. Let's see how that will resonate outside of the Tech circles when they think of Motorola Mobility and Google ownership. It is unfortunate for the employees who are being let go though. =/
Washington Post - Google broadening Motorola job cuts
Chicago Tribune - Google plans more job cuts at Motorola
Times of India - Google warns of job cuts at Motorola
NDTV - Motorola job cuts in Q3 to cost Google $340 mn; more cuts likely
Here's a screenshot of the mail sent to them along with their reply. They are one of the popular tech news website in India.
I'll post an update here once the news is live. The website is http://tech2.in.com
EDIT: Posting this on official thread too.
I now have a link to the Official supportmymoto petition on the site. I should also have the site cleaned up this eve and add irc chat for better coordination of our efforts.
I'm looking for those that speak Chinese and Russian to get the word out to those forums. PM me if you can help out.
Lokifish Marz said:
I now have a link to the Official supportmymoto petition on the site. I should also have the site cleaned up this eve and add irc chat for better coordination of our efforts.
I'm looking for those that speak Chinese and Russian to get the word out to those forums. PM me if you can help out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you get my PM about the broken link?
Officially Supporting Developers and Contributors List So Far;
Th3Bill
mof9336
peetr_
zacthespack
Magiman7
upndwn4par
mmontuori
motosunfire.com (Michael Phelps)
QBKing77 & His Youtube channel
Done! Good luck to us all! Thanks to the devs and everyone else supporting! :highfive:
andr0idfreak said:
I have requested an Indian Technology News website tech2.in.com to cover this news. Got a reply that they will cover this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By the way, do you think you can contact your connection at Indian Technology News to add a quick note about our campaign at Support/Update My Moto to get more awareness and have others sign the petition? I'm sure we can fill the 2,700+ signatures needed if they join us.
Now we also need someone from South America and possibly China to cover the story too so that it would be a global initiative. :cyclops:
Found this in my inbox from the man himself
azrienoch said:
Well, ****. I'd planned on doing a video about the GPL and Apache License, kicking off a boycott. Looks like that'll have to wait a week. Saw the articles on Techmeme and CNET. Congrats on getting the movement this far. Want to do me an enormous favor and compile a list of links of all the press this has gotten?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the coverage from cnet (and articles that have cropped up because of it) the anger over this issue is getting out.
Lokifish Marz said:
Found this in my inbox from the man himself
With the coverage from cnet (and articles that have cropped up because of it) the anger over this issue is getting out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Time just did a small piece based on the CNET one:
http://techland.time.com/2012/10/06/will-the-android-upgrade-mess-ever-get-fixed/
That's pretty far reaching.
I've been keeping the Main thread updated to what's going one as well as the site
UPDATE:
"Update My Moto" has closed their campaign. Their site now redirects to supportmymoto.com. Even though I felt the leak was not enough, as it only covered a very limited number of devices, I stated that I would support their decision.
With supportmymoto.com (yours truly) attending the Big Android BBQ, please bump the various threads and spread the word.
Yet another reason to spread the word!
FBI warns users of mobile malware
Google is stated as saying the following;
"Google is aware of this and new features on its latest Android mobile OS -- Jelly Bean 4.1 -- aim to beef up the system's security over past OS iterations. With Jelly Bean's design, Google hopes to defend against hacks that install viruses, along with other malware."
Again, the call goes out to supporters to spread the word and I hope to see some of you at the Big Android BBQ!
Joke of the Day!
How do you install the Google Calender App on an 8 month old Tegra2 Moto?
You hit it with a hammer and by a 2 year old HTC Incredible S!
(Out of 44 phones released by major manufacturers in 2011 that have been upgraded to ICS or better, only two are Moto's. This isn't even including the Nexus line. HTC, LG, Samsung and even ZTE, of all people, seem to be able to upgrade their Tegra2 phone to ICS. WTF Moto!)
FTC complaint filed (Moto/Sprint MB855)
If Congress can stop/ban ZTE and Huawei for possible spying charges, etc. Could it be possible they force Motorola to provide updates for our phones to prevent vulnerable security leaks and such as well?
Sent from my Lenovo P700i using xda premium
This [New Approach to get HTC to listen.] thread was OP by hasoon2000, and stickied into Tony Stark's "General sticky."
It is more important now than ever to ask HTC to lend a hand, especially in making some unreleased code available.
Please see the link for the simple instructions.
Thanks,
pbergonzi
pbergonzi said:
This [New Approach to get HTC to listen.] thread was OP by hasoon2000, and stickied into Tony Stark's "General sticky."
It is more important now than ever to ask HTC to lend a hand, especially in making some unreleased code available.
Please see the link for the simple instructions.
Thanks,
pbergonzi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I followed the advice, contacting them, and within 12 hours got this reply, and attempted to provide the requested information:
"Dear (pbergonzi),
Thank you for contacting HTC Technical Support.
(pbergonzi), first of all I would like to thank you for being a member of our family of smart mobile devices. In this case, I want to make sure your request is passed along to our proper department. Remember your thoughts are imperative for us to grow as a community. Our goal is always to provide you with top of the line devices as well as a spectacular HTC experience.
In this case, in order to pass this information to the proper department, I will like to know the following:
• Carrier
• Android version / Software version requesting source code for
• Radio Version Note: This is Baseband version on Android devices
• Serial Number/MEID/ IMEI/ESN
• Software Number
• Full Name
• Email Address
• Contact Number
• Mobile Number
• Preferred Contact Time
• Time Zone
• Carrier
I look forward to your reply with the necessary informaiton. Please do not hesitate to contact us through http://www.htc.com/us/contact/email/ or call us at +1-866-449-8358 from (8 Am – 1 Am) ET, 7 days a week or you can reply to this email by clicking on the link below.
Thank you for being a member of our HTC community and I wish you a good day!
If this answers your comment or question, please click here to complete the process.
To submit another comment, please click here.
Sincerely,
The HTCDev Team
Want to see what others are saying? Have a question to ask other HTCDev fans?
Follow us on Twitter www.twitter.com/htcdev
Explore our development resources www.htcdev.com
We are unable to receive replies to this email account. Please visit us at www.htcdev.com if you have any questions or need further assistance."
I can only imagine what would happen if 5 million more of us contacted them.
pbergonzi said:
I followed the advice, contacting them, and within 12 hours got this reply, and attempted to provide the requested information:
"Dear (pbergonzi),
Thank you for contacting HTC Technical Support.
(pbergonzi), first of all I would like to thank you for being a member of our family of smart mobile devices. In this case, I want to make sure your request is passed along to our proper department. Remember your thoughts are imperative for us to grow as a community. Our goal is always to provide you with top of the line devices as well as a spectacular HTC experience.
In this case, in order to pass this information to the proper department, I will like to know the following:
• Carrier
• Android version / Software version requesting source code for
• Radio Version Note: This is Baseband version on Android devices
• Serial Number/MEID/ IMEI/ESN
• Software Number
• Full Name
• Email Address
• Contact Number
• Mobile Number
• Preferred Contact Time
• Time Zone
• Carrier
I look forward to your reply with the necessary informaiton. Please do not hesitate to contact us through http://www.htc.com/us/contact/email/ or call us at +1-866-449-8358 from (8 Am – 1 Am) ET, 7 days a week or you can reply to this email by clicking on the link below.
Thank you for being a member of our HTC community and I wish you a good day!
If this answers your comment or question, please click here to complete the process.
To submit another comment, please click here.
Sincerely,
The HTCDev Team
Want to see what others are saying? Have a question to ask other HTCDev fans?
Follow us on Twitter www.twitter.com/htcdev
Explore our development resources www.htcdev.com
We are unable to receive replies to this email account. Please visit us at www.htcdev.com if you have any questions or need further assistance."
I can only imagine what would happen if 5 million more of us contacted them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hate to rain on your parade, but you're referencing a nearly two year old post that was made at a time when HTC wasn't unlocking devices or providing source code for them. Tens of thousands did write letters and signed several online petitions, the most famous of which was at change.org. HTC eventually did bow to pressure and provided the means to unlock boot-loaders and released the source code. It's why we and other HTC owners can run different kernels and ROMs now, without jumping through hoops trying crazy hacks and exploits to do so.
The issues are now with the component manufacturers like Texas Instruments and Qualcomm who have yet to release up to date open sourced drivers for newer kernels. Heck, it took petitions and a letter writing campaign just to get them to release the stale sources we have now that were already nearly two years old. Don't hold your breath that they'll be inclined to release any newer ones for a device as old as ours is.
Sorry to give you the bad news but you're jumping in with this pretty late in the game. Our device wasn't a big seller, and was eclipsed by lighter more powerful units within 3 months of its release. All but a handful of devs left for greener pastures long ago. What we have left is a small group of dedicated diehards who are doing the best they can with what they have to work with. Just be thankful that we have them, and that any work is still being done here.
Look at this forum, on a busy day there's maybe 6-7 posts, but on average 2-3. Were lucky that the powers that run this place haven't relegated us to "legacy" status yet. Again, I don't want to down you out, but even if every active reader of this forum were to run out and immediately do as you suggest, we'd be lucky to get a hundred sent in. I'm sorry, but these are the facts. To believe anything else would be at best hopeless optimism, or at worst pure fantasy. Just my opinion.
Ciao
Oh, thanks Odysseus. The history lesson was edifying and poignant. Since the subject was stickied, it still seemed relevant.
Nevertheless, after ravike mentioned just recently about communicating with someone there, I thought communication at the very least wouldn't hurt, and who knows if someone somewhere might just change something. I think that energy spent in changing my mind would be better spent and more psychically rewarding directed toward HTC, even though presumably useless. You for example, are certainly articulate enough that your words might well work a lasting sympathetic response in a developer, and who knows where that will go, even if he doesn't directly reply in kind--he might for example, be kinder to the person who brings his coffee, just as an example.
Granted, 5 million members of xda are not about to contact HTC, however, as the little sparrow, with feet pointed skyward to prevent it from falling, said to the chuckling farmer who doubted him, "One does what one can."
Sorry to Burst Your Bubble
Odysseus1962 said:
I hate to rain on your parade, but you're referencing a nearly two year old post that was made at a time when HTC wasn't unlocking devices or providing source code for them. Tens of thousands did write letters and signed several online petitions, the most famous of which was at change.org. HTC eventually did bow to pressure and provided the means to unlock boot-loaders and released the source code. It's why we and other HTC owners can run different kernels and ROMs now, without jumping through hoops trying crazy hacks and exploits to do so.
The issues are now with the component manufacturers like Texas Instruments and Qualcomm who have yet to release up to date open sourced drivers for newer kernels. Heck, it took petitions and a letter writing campaign just to get them to release the stale sources we have now that were already nearly two years old. Don't hold your breath that they'll be inclined to release any newer ones for a device as old as ours is.
Sorry to give you the bad news but you're jumping in with this pretty late in the game. Our device wasn't a big seller, and was eclipsed by lighter more powerful units within 3 months of its release. All but a handful of devs left for greener pastures long ago. What we have left is a small group of dedicated diehards who are doing the best they can with what they have to work with. Just be thankful that we have them, and that any work is still being done here.
Look at this forum, on a busy day there's maybe 6-7 posts, but on average 2-3. Were lucky that the powers that run this place haven't relegated us to "legacy" status yet. Again, I don't want to down you out, but even if every active reader of this forum were to run out and immediately do as you suggest, we'd be lucky to get a hundred sent in. I'm sorry, but these are the facts. To believe anything else would be at best hopeless optimism, or at worst pure fantasy. Just my opinion.
Ciao
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+1
@pbergonzi I do appreciate that you are trying to help, but the Amaze is LONG dead. If you decide to visit HTC's official website, the Amaze has vanished. They are pretending it never existed. The only things left are old drivers and antiquated software support from HTC (doesn't apply to us anymore). From what I saw, they only released source because they would have been breaking the GPL, thus decreasing their reputation as a smartphone manufacturer.
Also, it's not that HTC doesn't want to support us, it's that they can't. Texas Instruments doesn't support our chipset, and never will because this phone didn't sell. HTC has absolutely no obligation to release source code for less than a dozen hobbyist developers. They have better things to do, like develop for the HTC One. Why would they care about us. That's the ugly unwritten truth about companies.
If they do decide to spontaneously resume support, I will buy 3 goats, paint numbers "1", "2", and "4" on them and release the goats while in school and let them run wild!
pbergonzi said:
Oh, thanks Odysseus. The history lesson was edifying and poignant. Since the subject was stickied, it still seemed relevant.
Nevertheless, after ravike mentioned just recently about communicating with someone there, I thought communication at the very least wouldn't hurt, and who knows if someone somewhere might just change something. I think that energy spent in changing my mind would be better spent and more psychically rewarding directed toward HTC, even though presumably useless. You for example, are certainly articulate enough that your words might well work a lasting sympathetic response in a developer, and who knows where that will go, even if he doesn't directly reply in kind--he might for example, be kinder to the person who brings his coffee, just as an example.
Granted, 5 million members of xda are not about to contact HTC, however, as the little sparrow, with feet pointed skyward to prevent it from falling, said to the chuckling farmer who doubted him, "One does what one can."
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Listen, I hope my comments haven't dampened your enthusiasm. I truly love this device. It's the perfect size for my needs, takes great photos, and connects to the net much faster than the HD2 it replaced. The hardware still holds its own 3 years after release. It was the top of the line when it came out and the build quality that one would expect from a high-end product is evident wherever you look on the device.
The only problem with it is software, in particular an outdated OS. The very software that allows lesser devices to perform better than this, is what's holding it back. Please don't be discouraged, instead learn what you can so that you too can contribute to our small, but loyal community. Together, each in his own way, we can continue to keep the amaze alive.
Maybe it should be "New Approach to get Texas Instuments to listen."
Like for example, in the TI Engineer to Engineer community, where ravike14 is trying to get a little satisfaction regarding unreleased code:
http://e2e.ti.com/support/low_power_rf/f/307/p/305896/1089531.aspx#1089531
After seeing two public statements being made that are bold faced lies, I think it would be fair and necessary for the community to make a more coordinated and collaborative effort at voicing the discontent on this situation to Google and other entities that can broaden our ripples. Getting the message to the right people is difficult and can often get lost in the low-middle management level instead of making it to the eyes that matter. Until they understand that you can't play around with a consumer's time and money just because they hold the product that is so widely coveted, then we will not be free of this chaos next year or any year that follows. I urge you to find a way or multiple ways to speak up and respectfully state the specifics on how this entire situation has been mishandled, and what our simple requests are as consumers, loyal fans, and product advocates. Please post your avenues of progress within this thread as you create your own ripples, and may our ripples join together to create waves that reach far enough past the California coastline to smack against the windows of the titans.
My first step is creating a full and detailed report to the Better Business Bureau here: http://www.bbb.org/losangelessilico...ptimization/google-in-mountain-view-ca-214105
Google, Inc. (Headquarters)
Phone: (650) 330-0100 Fax: (650) 618-1499
*Edit for clarification:
Anyone who has been active in or following the Shipping Waiting Room thread would understand. Google is letting orders hang in limbo that have been ordered since day 1 while fulfilling orders for the same color and storage that have been processed only a few days ago. Yesterday they posted on Google+ and Twitter that they are processing orders in the order that they've been placed, which is clearly a lie. This is about asking Google to make an honest statement as to the reasoning behind this, and for them to understand why it pisses off consumers so next year they have their stuff together in a more accurate and fair process. - This has caused a lot of individuals to lose their $50 Play credit in order to get a device as their original order hasn't moved forward well beyond their shipping promise date. Google has also denied to compensate for these credits if we cancel the early orders to buy one that is moving forward.
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huh?
The lack of a clear indication as to what you're so unhappy about doesn't allow us to hear join you. What is your major problem and in what ways has the 'mishandling' occurred to and affected you?
In short, it doesn't make much sense as it is!
You are welcome to a refund if you don't want to wait.
Anyone who has been active in or following the Shipping Waiting Room thread would understand. Google is letting orders hang in limbo that have been ordered since day 1 while fulfilling orders for the same color and storage that have been processed only a few days ago. Yesterday they posted on Google+ and Twitter that they are processing orders in the order that they've been placed, which is clearly a lie. This is about asking Google to make an honest statement as to the reasoning behind this, and for them to understand why it pisses off consumers so next year they have their stuff together in a more accurate and fair process.
I finally got my phone yesterday. They upgraded my shipping to next day air for free. I never even complained or got my panties in a bunch about other phones shipping before mine.
Google Fawkes Day - nice, let's just refrain from the burning, k
LuckyHermit said:
I finally got my phone yesterday. They upgraded my shipping to next day air for free. I never even complained or got my panties in a bunch about other phones shipping before mine.
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It isn't a bad thing to be patient, but it also doesn't hurt to make sure companies understand that the consumers aren't stupid and can recognize a lie.
It's a pre-order device.
Sometimes computer ordering systems have issues.
I ordered 9/29 and my device just shipped yesterday.
It's not a life saving device. It's an eff'n phone.
tech_head said:
It's a pre-order device.
Sometimes computer ordering systems have issues.
I ordered 9/29 and my device just shipped yesterday.
It's not a life saving device. It's an eff'n phone.
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So what you're saying is that if you see a pair of really nice Nike shoes that perfectly fit your needs and Nike says to go ahead and pay for them for a promise to get them to you by X date, and at X date there is no sign of getting the pair you paid for nor have you received any communication from Nike as to why, yet you can see people walking in and buying the same exact pair and getting them the very next day, but Nike says "hey pal, don't worry, we are giving people their shoes in the order they gave us money", that it's ok? If we acted in that same manner in our jobs, we wouldn't be employed. All I would want is for Google to withdraw their false statement and give a true statement owning up to the problem so we can see that they recognize the issue and have the tools to prevent it next year.
Dear Google, I am sorry that I was so impatient to receive my device. I am now very happy though, and I now barely remember the month I had to wait.
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
I called and asked them if there was a problem shipping some of the pre-orders and they said no. Mine was supposed to arrive on the 10th but it was shipped the day after I called. I think demand has them a bit flat-footed.
It's pretty clear that you aren't getting or just don't care about the point. Being patient isn't the issue nor a part of the complaint. Apathy towards big corporations using their power to break their own promises and completely disregard the loyalty of their consumers is the reason we now have attrociously high consumer costs for the minimum to be delivered in quantity and quality.
toratakeri said:
Anyone who has been active in or following the Shipping Waiting Room thread would understand. Google is letting orders hang in limbo that have been ordered since day 1 while fulfilling orders for the same color and storage that have been processed only a few days ago. Yesterday they posted on Google+ and Twitter that they are processing orders in the order that they've been placed, which is clearly a lie. This is about asking Google to make an honest statement as to the reasoning behind this, and for them to understand why it pisses off consumers so next year they have their stuff together in a more accurate and fair process.
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Makes a lot more sense now! I wasn't flaming you, I know the frustrations well.
it sucks I had to order a second phone after being told mine was going to be delayed only to ship on time. But there's a local member whos hasnt shipped yet thats going to take it off my hands so all and all it was a bit sucky.
The fact that people pre ordered a device on Oct 1st and don't have their devices in their hands yet people who ordered this Monday already do should make consumers angry. It's called holding businesses accountable. If every one had the attitude of some posters here *****ing about people being upset then why should businesses care to improve if they know the consumer will willingly take it up the bum?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk
What's with people always demanding a freaking apology these days?
Pre order got screwed up, Google didn't Rob or steal, nor hurt anyone. Get the eff over it.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
bustabo said:
What's with people always demanding a freaking apology these days?
Pre order got screwed up, Google didn't Rob or steal, nor hurt anyone. Get the eff over it.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
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I could say the inverse about people who act the way you are about situations like this. What's with people letting themselves get walked all over by corporations/(insert any other figure of authority here) and believing it is ok to be fed lies while the truth is covered up? "Get the eff over it"? How about grow a pair and not be afraid to speak up and call people out on their lies. If you want to get technical, Google did "rob" people in a figurative manner. Those who pre-ordered paid real cash to secure real items in a specific order of allocation. Google handing out those items to people that placed an order after these folks is essentially robbing both their time and product to satisfy another individual. Brushing the whole situation off as "meh it got screwed up" is an apathetic excuse. A company the size of Google with the amount of resources available to be the world's largest and fastest search engine and database should be able to handle a simple task such as aligning pre-orders based on time of purchase and fulfilling them in ascending order. A few here and there being shipped out ahead of another would be a "meh" situation, but at this volume there is something clearly wrong and would indicate the need for Google to clarify what is happening and why, not easily disproven public statements of "it's ok guys, we're doing it right because we're Google".
I'm not even going to read that wall of text reply.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
bustabo said:
I'm not even going to read that wall of text reply.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
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You mean a paragraph? Thanks for proving my point.