It looks like the screen is actually pressure sensitive at least done with finger or such devices. All you need is to use the right app which provides adjustable curves for pressure control.
Try using Ravioli Paint which lets you change the curvature and start painting drawing with you finger
This might be due to the size of press point as well, in any case it just feels like pressure control to me.
so the screen is "stupid" touch and needs palm recognition to proper write on it?
s01q said:
so the screen is "stupid" touch and needs palm recognition to proper write on it?
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The screen has no palm rejection because the pen is mainly for the keyboard area.
When I say the screen is pressure sensitive I was referring a special use case where the pressure sensitivy of the screen (via touch) can be used to control pen thickness, opacity etc like the pen.
got that. so the "write on screen" as on SP4 is not possible but you need the virtual kbd in tablet mode?
s01q said:
got that. so the "write on screen" as on SP4 is not possible but you need the virtual kbd in tablet mode?
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Yes the screen is not pressure sensitive to the pen, however you can use the pen on screen via "any pen". If you are into drawing the tablet area is far superior to SP4 ntrig, I used to have Surface Book and I hated it. The screen is nice the batter is great but the pen is piece of junk compared to wacom. It has no subtle sensing. I felt like I was drawing with a knife on a glass surface.
thanks. will get mine today. have an XP-Pen here. maybe I will try that for "any pen"
s01q said:
thanks. will get mine today. have an XP-Pen here. maybe I will try that for "any pen"
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Click to collapse
One nice thing about having a separate drawing area and no palm rejection on the screen is that you do not have to move your pen from the surface area to do finger gestures on the screen. WHen there is palm rejection you always have to move the pen away from the screen to use finger gestures or finger touchses since both wont work at the same time.
Related
Ok, probably not. There's gotta be a perfectly valid explanation, but I just noticed this:
When I open Albums on my Hero and look at a single photograph, I can zoom in and out by pinching. Same goes for web pages. We all know this.
But the thing is: if I put my phone down on the table and try to pinch with just one hand (thumb+index finger), it doesn't work!
I only need to touch the phone with one finger on my left hand and it starts working. I have to touch the back or the frame. The chin doesn't react.
I tried it on an iPhone and it works with only one hand. It must be some conductivity issue and the Hero simply has a touch screen that works differently from iPhones.
It isn't really a problem for me: I can hold the phone in both hands while pinching. I just found it slightly interesting...
Yeah I have noticed that as well. Although if you try to calibrate using the g-sensor calibration tool it sometime fixes the issue...
Clue is in the technology? Capacitative touch screen....hit the physics books guys
A good capacitive screen doesn't require the user to complete a circuit with the phone using another hand to hold it, or by touching the bezel with a finger. The problem is either in the circuitry driving the touchscreen or possibly with the algorithms used to establish finger gestures and position.
It's even feasible that the metal bezel interferes with the electrostatic field introduced when your finger is in proximity with the screen. This would explain why the sensitivity is reduced around the edges of the screen.
Spose you need to form a complete circuit for it to work. Interesting point though, I didn't know that capacitive screens needed a second 'plate' to work (i.e. more than just the screen alone).
Makes sense though if you think about it.
Q.I indeed
jayjay said:
Ok, probably not. There's gotta be a perfectly valid explanation, but I just noticed this:
When I open Albums on my Hero and look at a single photograph, I can zoom in and out by pinching. Same goes for web pages. We all know this.
But the thing is: if I put my phone down on the table and try to pinch with just one hand (thumb+index finger), it doesn't work!
I only need to touch the phone with one finger on my left hand and it starts working. I have to touch the back or the frame. The chin doesn't react.
I tried it on an iPhone and it works with only one hand. It must be some conductivity issue and the Hero simply has a touch screen that works differently from iPhones.
It isn't really a problem for me: I can hold the phone in both hands while pinching. I just found it slightly interesting...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The metal bezel actually acts like a ground point between the capacitive circuitry and your finger. When you are touching at the very edges of the capacitive area there simply isn't enough room to get a good grounding point so the driver/controller gets a hard time of locating what points are actually grounded. The bezel helps in this regard.
Switchbitch said:
A good capacitive screen doesn't require the user to complete a circuit with the phone using another hand to hold it, or by touching the bezel with a finger. The problem is either in the circuitry driving the touchscreen or possibly with the algorithms used to establish finger gestures and position.
It's even feasible that the metal bezel interferes with the electrostatic field introduced when your finger is in proximity with the screen. This would explain why the sensitivity is reduced around the edges of the screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...perhaps not then lol
Yeah, well I hate to be the one to ask, but why does it work on the iPhone then? I realize it's a grounding / closed circuit issue, but if another similar phone can do it, then there's obviously a way around it.
And another question: Why doesn't pinching work, but normal one-fingered touching does?
Only place where I could see this becoming a problem is when you dock your device to some plastic holder in a car and want to pinch to zoom in some navigator software. Letting go of the steering wheel to use two hands on your phone isn't necessarily the safest thing in the world. One would assume though, that the interface in any navigator software wouldn't require complex gestures while operating it...
i confrim, using hero without touch the metal edge result in less responsivity and difficult on multitouch operation
hope new firmware can solve this, too many errors using it like a normal keyboard on a table!
What is the best stylus for the capacitive screen we have? I am looking for something with a fine point, let me know your opinions, thanks in advance!
Not how capacitive screens work
That's not how capacitive screens work. No matter how fine a stylus is, the screen will recognize the same thing. This is because a capacitive screen does not measure based on pressure, it measures based on current (At least, that's what I've been told).
If you wanted a finer tip to do finer things with,I'd go for an active digitizer display or resistive screen based phone (Which are basically obsolete now due to active digitizers and capacitive displays.
Hope that helps a bit.
paravorheim said:
That's not how capacitive screens work. No matter how fine a stylus is, the screen will recognize the same thing. This is because a capacitive screen does not measure based on pressure, it measures based on current (At least, that's what I've been told).
If you wanted a finer tip to do finer things with,I'd go for an active digitizer display or resistive screen based phone (Which are basically obsolete now due to active digitizers and capacitive displays.
Hope that helps a bit.
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Click to collapse
Yes it is true that capacitive detects current instead of touch, that does not mean that it is less accurate when discussing location of touch. The underlying grid determines this, but in todays screens, I would think it is as accurate as a resistive screen.
paravorheim said:
That's not how capacitive screens work. No matter how fine a stylus is, the screen will recognize the same thing. This is because a capacitive screen does not measure based on pressure, it measures based on current (At least, that's what I've been told).
If you wanted a finer tip to do finer things with,I'd go for an active digitizer display or resistive screen based phone (Which are basically obsolete now due to active digitizers and capacitive displays.
Hope that helps a bit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thank you but i am not looking to exchange this phone for a resistive phone, so given this new information, what is the most accurate stylus that isn't too thick
I was looking for the exact same thing, and ended up going with the "Newest Generation Slim Capacitive Stylus" by A Young Life (AYL). Got it off Amazon, but it might be available elsewhere as well. Works great, slides with minor resistance, and has a much narrower tip than other pens I've used.
While point width doesn't make much of a technical difference, it certainly affects usability. All capacitive stylus models I've seen use a round tip, and the point of contact at the bottom of that little semispherical nub is what registers as a touch on the screen. No matter the size, a sphere is going to converge to a single contact point (with a little give due to material and pressure). But, since you can't see through the pen, you have to estimate the center of the nub when touching it to the screen. The smaller the blind spot created by the nub, the smaller the margin of error.
I bought one off Ebay for .99 delivered from China. It's a small cute collapsable pen with a thin point. I haven't tried it yet because while the tip is thin to allow precise pointing, it is also made from a hard material and I'm scared it may scratch the screen. Is that possible?
If the tip is made for capacitive screens, it should not harm the Atrix gorilla glass.
Could anything sold for under a buck from China possibly harm....Anything?
Youbetcha. As Bush and Mao both said "Trust but verify". Even a gen-you-whine Palm stylus could scrtach Palm screens, so why trust the cheapest stuff from a no-name vendor in China to be any better?
Put on a screen protector first, much cheaper than replacing the screen.
creiz said:
If the tip is made for capacitive screens, it should not harm the Atrix gorilla glass.
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I just received the one armathrillo is describing a couple posts back and I've got to say this thing is nice. The tip is actually a soft hollow bubble. You couldn't scratch a screen if you tried. It's nice and heavy but not too heavy. It feels like a nice solid pen. The little lanyard attachment is a nice touch. It detaches from the stylus and plugs into a 3.5mm headphone jack for storage. when you're done with the stylus just clip it on and the pen stays with the phone/tab/pad.
i know this is old, but I just recently heard about the jot stylus which seems to be fine point...
Maybe it's just me, but the inking in the tutorial window is very smooth and the te,t is nearly perfect and readBle. In the Notes app it is much rougher, jagged, and hard to read. Anyone else experience this?
dstrauss said:
Maybe it's just me, but the inking in the tutorial window is very smooth and the te,t is nearly perfect and readBle. In the Notes app it is much rougher, jagged, and hard to read. Anyone else experience this?
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Click to collapse
Same comment, but for the resolution of the scribble compared to the Notes app. The second smallest calligraphy pen on black in the Notes app has some really bad fringe near the edges. These (among other reasons) is why I'm unhappy with HTC's work in designing the pen integration.
Also: try the free Quill app, which renders the pen's stroke using vector graphics so the resolution is scale independent.
TSGM said:
Same comment, ...Also: try the free Quill app, which renders the pen's stroke using vector graphics so the resolution is scale independent.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just tried Quill and the ink quality is much better. Sharing notes is not as transparent, but its the quality of the inking that makes this superior.
Quill is also great because it does what no other pen app does, and all should - it can ignore hand input, so you can rest your hand comfortably on the tablet surface - which makes it tons more effective than the native app, which keeps sliding out the on-screen keyboard whenever you touch the screen with your skin.
mr_pio said:
Quill is also great because it does what no other pen app does, and all should - it can ignore hand input, so you can rest your hand comfortably on the tablet surface - which makes it tons more effective than the native app, which keeps sliding out the on-screen keyboard whenever you touch the screen with your skin.
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Click to collapse
Indeed.
To me, it's absolutely ridiculous that these issues were not considered by HTC.
mr_pio said:
Quill is also great because it does what no other pen app does, and all should - it can ignore hand input, so you can rest your hand comfortably on the tablet surface - which makes it tons more effective than the native app, which keeps sliding out the on-screen keyboard whenever you touch the screen with your skin.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, it's a function of many active-stylus systems that any touchscreen interactions are turned off when the pen is in close proximity to the screen. The Flyer works in the same way. The awkward bit is that you have to put the stylus close to the screen FIRST, which is unnatural for most people and is probably the source of almost universal confusion about these systems. You can verify the pen turns off the touchscreen by hovering your pen (it doesn't need to actually touch) something less than 1/4" over the screen, and you'll notice you can't do anything with your finger. Lift your pen a little higher and touch turns back on. Palm rejection is really only necessary if you don't have an active stylus system, or perhaps to allay the issue of most people putting their palms on their screens first before the pen has a chance to turn off touch.
bluebear13 said:
...Palm rejection is really only necessary if you don't have an active stylus system, or perhaps to allay the issue of most people putting their palms on their screens first before the pen has a chance to turn off touch.
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I've been using active digitizers for years, and frankly I like having touch turned off while writing. On my HTC, the screen is so sensitive I get a keyboard every time unless using Quill.
dstrauss said:
I've been using active digitizers for years, and frankly I like having touch turned off while writing. On my HTC, the screen is so sensitive I get a keyboard every time unless using Quill.
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Click to collapse
That's what bluebear's post was saying. When the pen is near the screen, touch is deactivated.
HTC could improve on this by allowing the user to adjust the time the screen returns to recognizing touch. Since I print, an increased delay would keep the keyboard from popping up. My current workaround is to touch the spiral bound portion of the screen which doesn't activate the keyboard.
The SPen works great on the screen, but can't be used to activate the four capacitive 'buttons' at the bottom.....not sure why.
bradasmith said:
The SPen works great on the screen, but can't be used to activate the four capacitive 'buttons' at the bottom.....not sure why.
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Click to collapse
Because the part of the screen that contains the "digitizer" that the S-Pen uses doesn't cover the entire front face of the phone....it only covers the screen area.
Remember that the international version doesn't have the touch sensitive 4-buttons across the bottom...only a single mechanical button.
I assume the same screen digitizer was used for both devices.
bradasmith said:
The SPen works great on the screen, but can't be used to activate the four capacitive 'buttons' at the bottom.....not sure why.
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Click to collapse
There are certain movements you can do with the S-pen on the screen while holding the button on the S-pen that wil for example bring you back (in the browser(, show the menu, bring you to your homescreen!
When you're using the S Pen on the screen, it isn't actually using the capacitive capabilities to register the input, it's using the screen digitizer. The pen isn't capable of registering capacitive input.
With the Flyer's stylus you could actually use the other end of the pen as a capacitive stylus, although I'm pretty sure that's just a result of it being solid metal.
CradleRob said:
Because the part of the screen that contains the "digitizer" that the S-Pen uses doesn't cover the entire front face of the phone....it only covers the screen area.
Remember that the international version doesn't have the touch sensitive 4-buttons across the bottom...only a single mechanical button.
I assume the same screen digitizer was used for both devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The international version has a mechanical button (home) and two capacitive buttons (back and menu).
But as everyone said, the S-Pen isn't a capacitive stylus like you might buy to use for a tablet; the note has a proper digitizer, which allows things like pressure sensitivity. It's nowhere near as good as the sensitivity you get with a Wacom input device, but it's a helluva lot better than a normal capacitive stylus.
Find the manual for the s-pen on the market. There are many gestures that allow yô to open menu's and navigate.
Hello I am considering the Ultra as my mobile for extensive note taking and drawing/sketching. Since it does not have palm rejection I was wondering if the screen only detects stylus input while it is in use? If it doesnt are there any other way to make it happen? Happy to root too
The screen detects stylus and finger touches, no palm rejection .
However I've been using Papyrus and you can tell it you have an active pen and it will only register the pen input and not finger. I've been taking notes with it for work and love it.
texaspledge said:
The screen detects stylus and finger touches, no palm rejection .
However I've been using Papyrus and you can tell it you have an active pen and it will only register the pen input and not finger. I've been taking notes with it for work and love it.
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Thats good to know thanks! How do you find writing on the screen? Does it have certain angle that the screen refuse to respond?
raundown said:
Thats good to know thanks! How do you find writing on the screen? Does it have certain angle that the screen refuse to respond?
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Click to collapse
you will want a wide tip pen/pencil or it wont work > 1mm