Related
In the past whenever something's gone wrong with a ROM I've had the failsafe option of going into download mode and flashing stock samsung firmware via odin and (as far as I can tell!) it removes everything and completely wipes all my data and gets the phone back to how it was out of the box (except all the binary counter stuff but I'm not bothered about at the moment) so I can start afresh.
My question is: I'm just wondering that as I get more into flashing (eg custom kernels, dual booting etc) is there anything I can do that will stop this being possible? Will any customisations I make remove download mode, or will it always be there no matter what? Does flashing stock firmware via odin undo *everything* or will there be lingering bits of customisation that I'll have to remove in other ways? (again, other than the binary counter as I don't care about that)
Thanks - hope that makes sense! It's been very nice having odin to fall back on when things go wrong/get confusing and I want to keep it that way!
Download mode is part of the bootloader so flashing an incorrect bootloader or corruption during flash of bootloader could break it
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
read the "return to warranty state" kind of posts.
and no, you can't disable download
Hi, i'm on 4.1.2 and rooted using link2sd and foldermount so I can store apps on the external sd card. If I upgrade to 4.2.2 do I need to unroot first and then root again after flashing the new firmware?
Also i'm assuming i'm going to lose all my game saves etc as I will lose my link2sd and foldermount setups?
My phone is unlocked from the 3 network but still has the 3 network logo on boot up and so I thought if i'm going to have to start afresh I might as well get the stock unbranded S3 rom and get rid of the 3 network branding. I used Galaxsim unlock to unlock the network so i'm assuming I won't lose my network unlock by doing any of the above?
Thanks in advance for any help given.
Sp0oner said:
Hi, i'm on 4.1.2 and rooted using link2sd and foldermount so I can store apps on the external sd card. If I upgrade to 4.2.2 do I need to unroot first and then root again after flashing the new firmware?
Also i'm assuming i'm going to lose all my game saves etc as I will lose my link2sd and foldermount setups?
My phone is unlocked from the 3 network but still has the 3 network logo on boot up and so I thought if i'm going to have to start afresh I might as well get the stock unbranded S3 rom and get rid of the 3 network branding. I used Galaxsim unlock to unlock the network so i'm assuming I won't lose my network unlock by doing any of the above?
Thanks in advance for any help given.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just flash any rooted 4.2.2 ROM via custom recovery. You should take a titanium backup and a nandroid backup first. If it flashes without a wipe, you've lost nothing. If you do have to wipe, you can restore using Titanium. The Nandroid is a full system restore incase nothing works.
rootSU said:
Just flash any rooted 4.2.2 ROM via custom recovery. You should take a titanium backup and a nandroid backup first. If it flashes without a wipe, you've lost nothing. If you do have to wipe, you can restore using Titanium. The Nandroid is a full system restore incase nothing works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. As you can tell i'm not up to speed on android rooting as i'm an ex iphone devotee that was good with jailbreaking but i'm new to android rooting really.
If I take an already rooted rom that surely still overwrites my current data as a rom replaces what is already there doesn't it? Can titanium and nandroid backup to pc via usb cable as my 32gb sd card won't have enough room to backup onto as it's heavily used for foldermount and link2sd.
If I wanted a pre rooted 4.2.2 stock rom for the I9300 is that something I can find on this forum to safely download and try? And if for any reasom i'm not happy with it the nandroid backup will restore the phone back to my original rom and setup as if I hadn't changed roms?
Rom and data are different. Please read the link in my signature "read before reading". It should contain everything you need to know (i'm not just saying this because I wrote it, but its really essential).
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
rootSU said:
Rom and data are different. Please read the link in my signature "read before reading". It should contain everything you need to know (i'm not just saying this because I wrote it, but its really essential).
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you, again. I have read all that this morning and I am in no rush to change anything as one thing i've learnt from jailbreaking when I first got into it was rushing = ending up in a big mess and panicking you've bricked your device.
I rooted my S3 earlier this year and so I expect I still have all the files and the url of the guide I followed so I can check exactly what it was I did. My flash counter won't reset to zero which really bugged me and again another lesson learnt from doing something without fully checking the consequences.
I'm an IT engineer but all windows based so when it comes to android/linux what I think would be logical pretty much seems to go out the window!
Its always good to hold off and understand before moving forward. Read the thread through a few times.
I'm also a wintel IT engineer but I wanted to get into android development so I've been using Linux at home as my daily driver for 2 years.
If there's ever anything in that thread you want me to put into windows analogies or similes,,just ask in that thread. It will help me expand the thread also
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
rootSU said:
Its always good to hold off and understand before moving forward. Read the thread through a few times.
I'm also a wintel IT engineer but I wanted to get into android development so I've been using Linux at home as my daily driver for 2 years.
If there's ever anything in that thread you want me to put into windows analogies or similes,,just ask in that thread. It will help me expand the thread also
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks again. I've been having a play about today and firstly got a titanium backup done for everything and then copied to my laptop. Then got the online version of nandroid backup so no reboot required to take the backup and did a full one of those and copied to my laptop too.
I've checked what root process I followed and it was one posted on the s3 forums using GalaxyS3root which uses a file via odin called CF-Root-SGS3-v6.1.tar. I won't post the link in case it breaks any rules etc. After reading your other post as advised I get the impression i'm not going to be able to reset my flash counter to zero. I have tried triangle away but it doesn't succeed.
As Android 4.3 is out/due out i'm now thinking pointless moving to 4.2.2 and I should wait and got straight to 4.3. Now what I wanted to ask was the following...
If I took titanium backup and then undid all my link2sd and foldermount links and then unrooted would I be able to flash the stock 4.3 rom when available, root it then reset up link2sd and foldermount and restore the titanium backup and have all my apps back to how they were?
I want to get an unmodified samsung rom that is unbranded so I can get rid of my 3 network branding I currently have on boot up. I also want to know if it is possible in anyway to reset the flash counter so I could in theory if unrooted get ota updates.
First question...
If you wipe and manually set up link2sd - when you then restore via titanium everything should be as it was.
You can reset the counter before unrooting. Theres a return-to-stock guide stuck in the "sticky roll-up thread" that covers it. The counter goes up to 1 on boot so the trick is to prevent the boot...
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
rootSU said:
First question...
If you wipe and manually set up link2sd - when you then restore via titanium everything should be as it was.
You can reset the counter before unrooting. Theres a return-to-stock guide stuck in the "sticky roll-up thread" that covers it. The counter goes up to 1 on boot so the trick is to prevent the boot...
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, so the counter can't be cleared permanently for warranty purposes as a reboot will just put it back to 1. So as I have a custom recovery on the phone that went on with the root will that cause issues if I tried to update via official updates?
It can be prevented with an ics bootloader.
Imho its best to stay away from official updates when rooted
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
rootSU said:
It can be prevented with an ics bootloader.
Imho its best to stay away from official updates when rooted
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. An ics bootloader however will just further invalidate the warranty and also prevent stock updates? What I had been getting at with wanting to do stock updates was to unroot first. However now i've got the custom recovery there that in itself makes stock updates an unwise move even with rooting removed?
So with my current setup what is the best method to go to 4.2.2 without using a custom rom?
They check warranty by looking at the information provided in the bootloader. Your warranty is either void or not void. There is no such thing as further invalidation. Its 0 or 1. There is no 2.
There is no "best way" without using a "custom rom". If you want to flash a stock rom, do it. Theres only one way.
By the way, 4.2.2 hasn't been officially released, so you wont be getting stock updates. You'll have to manually keep flashing release via odin until you get one that is official. Then if your csc is wrong, you have to change it (which requires factory reset) and then you will still only get updates over USB if you're rooted.
Don't get me wrong, but that sounds ridiculous to me. I just don't understand any rooted user wanting to do that
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
rootSU said:
They check warranty by looking at the information provided in the bootloader. Your warranty is either void or not void. There is no such thing as further invalidation. Its 0 or 1. There is no 2.
There is no "best way" without using a "custom rom". If you want to flash a stock rom, do it. Theres only one way.
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
---------- Post added at 10:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:51 PM ----------
By the way, 4.2.2 hasn't been officially released
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the quick reply. I've just read through the link on your thread for returning to stock and unless i've misread it you can actually return to stock even if you have installed a custom recovery/used the auto cf root method of rooting? That's step 16?
Sorry on the invalidating warranty thing, what I meant was that if you use the ics bootloader you fix the triangleaway issue but you are then left with the ics bootloader so your warranty is still invalid.
My mistake on 4.2.2, what's the latest official version as if I plug into kies it tells me there is an update available which i'd wrongly assumed was 4.2.2?
4.1.2 is the latest.
They don't check bootloader version for warranty. They only check download mode.
You can return to stock so long as phone fully boots and usb works. If phone only partially boots, you can't return to stock or reset counter. This is why IMHO its better to have an ics bootloader where counter is always in the reset state
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
rootSU said:
You can return to stock so long as phone fully boots and usb works. If phone only partially boots, you can't return to stock or reset counter. This is why IMHO its better to have an ics bootloader where counter is always in the reset state
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK this has totally lost me now, I need to do some more reading! Also i'm on 4.1.2 yet if I plug into Kies ittells me there is an update available.
Sp0oner said:
OK this has totally lost me now, I need to do some more reading! Also i'm on 4.1.2 yet if I plug into Kies ittells me there is an update available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
An update won't necessarily update the android version. It will update the Samsung build version. Samsung have probably close to 100 updates on 4.1.2 (globally).
Android is just the base OS. It has Samsung GUI on top of that (and frameworks to support Samsung proprietary features). So Samsung take the android code for 4.1.2 and add all their stuff to it. But they will improve on that over a number of builds. Fixing bugs, addressing performance issues etc.
However, Samsung tend to release new features in line with android base updates too. so if Samsung are working on 4.1.2 and decide, "hey this feature would be cool", they would usually wait for the next android version to release it.
Hope that makes sense
Did that address your confusion?
Or is your confusion about returning to stock?
You return to stock by flashing a full ROM (which includes a bootloader, Android ROM, Recovery, baseband etc) over USB connection to a computer. The phone is put into download mode and flashed. if your USB is faulty, this wont work (obviously).
Before returning to stock, you need to ensure your download mode doesnt show how many times you flashed custom things. You can reset it then flash stock and warranty is fine. However, to reset it, android needs to boot, so if android doesnt boot and counter says more than "0", you've lost warranty, With ICS bootloader, you reset it once and it always says "0", so you are protected if phone doesnt boot.
rootSU said:
An update won't necessarily update the android version. It will update the Samsung build version. Samsung have probably close to 100 updates on 4.1.2 (globally).
Android is just the base OS. It has Samsung GUI on top of that (and frameworks to support Samsung proprietary features). So Samsung take the android code for 4.1.2 and add all their stuff to it. But they will improve on that over a number of builds. Fixing bugs, addressing performance issues etc.
However, Samsung tend to release new features in line with android base updates too. so if Samsung are working on 4.1.2 and decide, "hey this feature would be cool", they would usually wait for the next android version to release it.
Hope that makes sense
Did that address your confusion?
Or is your confusion about returning to stock?
You return to stock by flashing a full ROM (which includes a bootloader, Android ROM, Recovery, baseband etc) over USB connection to a computer. The phone is put into download mode and flashed. if your USB is faulty, this wont work (obviously).
Before returning to stock, you need to ensure your download mode doesnt show how many times you flashed custom things. You can reset it then flash stock and warranty is fine. However, to reset it, android needs to boot, so if android doesnt boot and counter says more than "0", you've lost warranty, With ICS bootloader, you reset it once and it always says "0", so you are protected if phone doesnt boot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for both explanations :good: It was the ics bootloader I was really confused about. I'm in two minds as to change anything, the techy part of me says play with it and learn and understand more about what you've explained but the other side says i've got everything setup perfectly at the moment now I have link2sd and foldermount working and not to risk ruining that setup. I think the only thing i'd notice from 4.2.2 is the access camera from the lock screen feature.
Sp0oner said:
Thanks for both explanations :good: It was the ics bootloader I was really confused about. I'm in two minds as to change anything, the techy part of me says play with it and learn and understand more about what you've explained but the other side says i've got everything setup perfectly at the moment now I have link2sd and foldermount working and not to risk ruining that setup. I think the only thing i'd notice from 4.2.2 is the access camera from the lock screen feature.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you want to continue to use stock.....
1) Backup all your app data with titanium backup (as a precaution)
2) Copy all internal /sdcard data to PC
3) Flash whatever "official" ROM you want via Odin
4) If it doesn't boot, perform factory reset#
5) re root using either cf auto root or framaroot (both do not give custom recovery)
6) Install Titanium backup and restore data.
Its worth noting a factory reset from custom recovery only wipes data and settings. A reset from stock recovery wipes internal /sdcard storage too.
rootSU said:
If you want to continue to use stock.....
1) Backup all your app data with titanium backup (as a precaution)
2) Copy all internal /sdcard data to PC
3) Flash whatever "official" ROM you want via Odin
4) If it doesn't boot, perform factory reset#
5) re root using either cf auto root or framaroot (both do not give custom recovery)
6) Install Titanium backup and restore data.
Its worth noting a factory reset from custom recovery only wipes data and settings. A reset from stock recovery wipes internal /sdcard storage too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks again :good: I have CWM installed and when I open CWM Manager I get a message "this version of CWM Manager should be used with CF-CWM v1.1 or newer. It appears you are running a different recovery. Various features have been disabled."
If I boot into recovery at the top it says "CWM-based recovery v5.5.04 :: CF-v1.3"
What effect does any of that have on the above steps?
Sp0oner said:
Thanks again :good: I have CWM installed and when I open CWM Manager I get a message "this version of CWM Manager should be used with CF-CWM v1.1 or newer. It appears you are running a different recovery. Various features have been disabled."
If I boot into recovery at the top it says "CWM-based recovery v5.5.04 :: CF-v1.3"
What effect does any of that have on the above steps?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CWM manager is an app to manage CWM. Its pretty pointless. I dont think it works on JB ROMs though.
CWM 5 is old and should be replaced by users who want to continue using a custom recovery.
The flashing stock from Odin process will overwrite any bootloader, recovery, ROM and Baseband. Nothing you have can prevent that.
Right so, this is my first post so I'm very new here.
I have a Samsung S2 (I9100) which I rooted using Framaroot. I then flashed CM 10.1.3 on my phone. I also flashed the DorimanX 9.41 kernel. I want to return my phone to stock everything. Basically, as it was when it came out of the box. I want to do this because I might return it to warranty soon. I know the steps to do. However, I need to understand a few things:
Is Triangle Away safe if I use it correctly?
When I flash the stock firmware, will I be able to receive OTA updates or will all of my updates need to be from Odin?
If I want to restore my warranty, does my phone need to have the carrier branded firmware? I am going to get carrier-branded firmware anyway but I am just wondering.
My baseband version is I9100XXLPH. My carrier is T-Mobile UK. When I go to SamMobile, I get this:
GT-I9100 United Kingdom (T-Mobile) 2013 June 4.1.2 I9100XWLSY I9100TMULS8
If my baseband version is I9100XXLPH, does this mean that this firmware is not correct for my phone?
Thanks for the help!
1) Well yes, like any flash there's that 0.0000001% something will go wrong. You can't remove that risk regardless of what anyone might tell you. If that frightens you, best not flash anything at all. Ever.
2) If you go back to stock, you should be able to get OTA updates OK, but sometimes it doesn't always work out this way. It's just as easy to flash your stock updates via Odin if you find OTA updates won't happen for whatever reason (flashing a 3 part firmware with CSC when you go back to stock seems to make it more likely OTA updates happen smoothly after).
3) If I was returning a phone for a warranty claim, yes, I'd put the latest stock firmware on for my carrier.
4) Forget basebands (which is your modem & not really relevant to anything) or anything else, choose the latest firmware they have for your carrier, flash that.
Thanks very much. However, when using Triangle Away, is there ANYTHING I can do to increase the chances of a successful reset? Also, will having used Framaroot change anything?
I've never had any problems using it (have used it a number of times/on different devices) & am not aware of anything you can do to try and 'maximise' your chances of it working (it should work for most people/most of the time), other than reading thread devoted to it on here thoroughly if you're genuinely nervous about it; other people's experiences in the thread might yield some useful info.
The root method shouldn't have a great deal of bearing on anything, but I'm not a developer so I'm not familiar with the 'inner workings' of how Framaroot injects Su & Busybox onto the phone/whether it does anything materially different compared to other root methods that might interfere with Triangle Away. I don't believe it does based on I can't remember anyone posting in the two yrs I've been coming here saying 'Triangle Away wouldn't work because I used X root method'.
Put it this way, if worse came to worse, if Triangle Away refused to work/reset the flash counter, you could always go back to Gingerbread stock, reset the flash counter with a jig, then flash the latest stock firmware & sent it in for warranty service.
Triangle Away is quick/simple/works most of the time, but that's not the only option you have if it won't work & you absolutely must reset the flash counter.
Thanks for all the advice. One more question though , is Triangle Away compatible with all ROMs and kernels? And (hopefully) final question, do I only wipe data on recovery or do I also wipe cache?
It's I9100 compatible, so yes, it is.
Sent from the little guy
Eyensteinium said:
And (hopefully) final question, do I only wipe data on recovery or do I also wipe cache?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Could you answer this question?
It doesn't matter, whatever suits you.
Sent from the little guy
gastonw said:
It doesn't matter, whatever suits you.
Sent from the little guy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What does the cache do then?
Stores apps' info and other s#!t.
It's not mandatory to wipe per se, but it might help when going stock from custom and viceversa.
I told you, you're safe from the brick bug as long as you stay away from 4.0.4.
Sent from the little guy
OP - You're starting to overthink/ovecomplicate this. There's no need to. Reset the counter, flash stock, done.
Okay. It's just that the warnings on the Triangle Away app are a bit scary and both times I've flashed with Odin, I've been stuck in a bootloop. Anyway, hopefully, I'll have stock JB up and running before Monday.
Sent from my GT-I9100.
Trust me, you'll be fine (never trust someone who says 'trust me' )
When should I wipe data, before or after flash?
After.
Okay, thanks a lot. Just need to make a note of which apps I have installed so I can reinstall them afterwards. Also, is it possible to backup my messages and call logs?
Yes, titanium back up pro & similar.
Sent from the little guy
But Titanium Backup doesn't work without root. After going back to stock, I'm going to stay unrooted for a while. Also, I don't want to backup apps.
Notice that I included "similar" over there.
You really should hit the threads before you jump onto the flashing field.
Sent from the little guy
Thanks for the reply. Just two more questions:
If I do EVERYTHING correctly, is there any chance of a hard brick.
And, I tried following this guide (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1068193) but the commands it said to back up my efs folder didn't work. Could you recommend an efs backup tool?
Hi Guys
I have read on the internet that Samsung Galaxy S3 can be rooted without wiping the data i.e. without tripping the knox. This thread gave me a heads up on the basics
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2367406
I still have few other questions, I am sorry if these are some silly questions but I don't have much knowledge about the rooting process. I have finally decided to root as I am fed up of Google's crap updates like Play magazine, hangouts etc etc and the fact that Samsung has forgotten its old customers is an icing on the cake. Anyways the questions are-
1. The main question can you please tell me the step by step procedure to root without loosing the data, i.e. without tripping Knox? And what does it mean actually?
2. In the thread mentioned above, it is written that there will be no more over the air(OTA) official updates. So, lets say Samsung releases a Kitkat update for S3(which isn't happening) then the one which I will get will be from the developers and not from Samsung right?
3. What exactly are toolkits?
4. How much time will rooting take?
Thanks
billubakra said:
Hi Guys
I have read on the internet that Samsung Galaxy S3 can be rooted without wiping the data i.e. without tripping the knox. This thread gave me a heads up on the basics
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2367406
I still have few other questions, I am sorry if these are some silly questions but I don't have much knowledge about the rooting process. I have finally decided to root as I am fed up of Google's crap updates like Play magazine, hangouts etc etc and the fact that Samsung has forgotten its old customers is an icing on the cake. Anyways the questions are-
1. The main question can you please tell me the step by step procedure to root without loosing the data, i.e. without tripping Knox? And what does it mean actually?
2. In the thread mentioned above, it is written that there will be no more over the air(OTA) official updates. So, lets say Samsung releases a Kitkat update for S3(which isn't happening) then the one which I will get will be from the developers and not from Samsung right?
3. What exactly are toolkits?
4. How much time will rooting take?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey there firstly knox is security software built by samsung for some random reason http://www.sammobile.com/2013/02/28/samsung-introduces-samsung-knox/ , knox has a counter which shows if you have flashed your device and therefore void your warranty .... rooting your device will set this counter to custom (but trust me its worth it) here is the link to chainfire autoroot http://download.chainfire.eu/229/CF-Root/CF-Auto-Root/CF-Auto-Root-m0-m0xx-gti9300.zip plug your phone into pc (download mode .... first power off then simultameously press volume dowm and home button and power button) open odin then click pda and choose the zip file CF- auto root that you downloaded. Ensure auto root and f reset time boxes are checked unselect anything else... rooting will probably take about a minute and half and boom you are there. Enjoy your amazing S3!! As for OTA you wont recieve samsung OTA as your devce will now say custom under status but some developers have OTA function but you have to flash their Rom in order to get it, I recommend SPR Rom, has great feautues and no bugs at all. Remember to flash philz recovery after rooting incase anything goes wrong. Good luck!!
johnjohnson250 said:
Hey there firstly knox is security software built by samsung for some random reason http://www.sammobile.com/2013/02/28/samsung-introduces-samsung-knox/ , knox has a counter which shows if you have flashed your device and therefore void your warranty .... rooting your device will set this counter to custom (but trust me its worth it) here is the link to chainfire autoroot http://download.chainfire.eu/229/CF-Root/CF-Auto-Root/CF-Auto-Root-m0-m0xx-gti9300.zip plug your phone into pc (download mode .... first power off then simultameously press volume dowm and home button and power button) open odin then click pda and choose the zip file CF- auto root that you downloaded. Ensure auto root and f reset time boxes are checked unselect anything else... rooting will probably take about a minute and half and boom you are there. Enjoy your amazing S3!! As for OTA you wont recieve samsung OTA as your devce will now say custom under status but some developers have OTA function but you have to flash their Rom in order to get it, I recommend SPR Rom, has great feautues and no bugs at all. Remember to flash philz recovery after rooting incase anything goes wrong. Good luck!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for replying. There is no sign of Knox in my phone. How to check/open it in the phone itself? Is ODIN better than Kies? Will chainfire autoroot wipe off the phone's data? Is there any tutorial video for the same? How should I take backup of the whole data before following the rooting procedure?
billubakra said:
Thank you for replying. There is no sign of Knox in my phone. How to check/open it in the phone itself? Is ODIN better than Kies? Will chainfire autoroot wipe off the phone's data? Is there any tutorial video for the same? How should I take backup of the whole data before following the rooting procedure?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no Knox in Galaxy S III roms...
You can't flash CF-Root and root your phone with Kies...
CF-ROOT doesn't wipe your data and everything still on their places
You cant backup whole rom without root and Clockwork Recovery mode....
There's probably other threads on this somewhere, but how do you root a N3 with 4.4.4, from what I gather the newest updated fixed TowelRoot's crash exploit. Also can someone explain exactly the difference between voiding the warranty and the Knox Counter?
Thanks!
TheNewGuy14 said:
There's probably other threads on this somewhere, but how do you root a N3 with 4.4.4, from what I gather the newest updated fixed TowelRoot's crash exploit. Also can someone explain exactly the difference between voiding the warranty and the Knox Counter?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The sure-fire way of rooting is by using this method. That being said, this will trip your KNOX Counter.
Now, onto Voiding Warranty vs. Tripping KNOX Counter.
Official Samsung Warranty. This document is obviously written in a legalese manner. I am not a lawyer, but have read through the warranty very carefully and feel like I have a grasp on what it covers/doesn't cover.
In my opinion, the most critical part of the warranty (as it applies to our conversation) is the following:
This Limited Warranty does not cover: ...
(g) defects or damage resulting from improper testing, operation, maintenance, installation, service, or adjustment not furnished or approved by SAMSUNG, including but not limited to installation of unauthorized software and unauthorized root access, both of which shall void this limited warranty
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This clearly states that rooting the phone will void your warranty. Please note that this is regardless of whether KNOX is tripped. Using Towelroot (on previous versions) to gain root access technically would void your warranty just as much as using other methods. The issue is whether Samsung knows about it. That's where KNOX comes in.
KNOX is primarily Samsungs way of knowing if you've modified the software on the phone (root access or some other tampering). At startup, KNOX checks for custom low-level operating system components (bootloader, recovery, kernal, etc.). If any of these are custom, it'll trip KNOX. TowelRoot had exploited a way to obtain root access without modifying any of those items, but as you mentioned, it no longer works in 4.4.4. As far as I'm aware, all other rooting methods include using ODIN to briefly modify one of the low-level operating system components, which invariably trips KNOX.
Now, back to the main point of your questions: will voiding the warranty (by obtaining root access) screw me over? The answer is: probably not. Samsung has been known to not really care about KNOX being tripped when servicing phones. This especially is true in cases where you are claiming someone not software related. From a common-sense perspective, having root access would in no way affect the performance of the power button, so if you're claiming issues with the power button, having a tripped KNOX shouldn't affect your claim status. Although, legally, they have covered this by saying the warranty is completely voided by having root access (not just the software part of the warranty).
I would recommend, however, that before sending any phone in, that you use ODIN to revert back to the stock android. KNOX will still be tripped, but it won't technically have root access anymore.
I hope this answers your questions.
-Topher
topherk said:
The sure-fire way of rooting is by using this method. That being said, this will trip your KNOX Counter.
Now, onto Voiding Warranty vs. Tripping KNOX Counter.
Official Samsung Warranty. This document is obviously written in a legalese manner. I am not a lawyer, but have read through the warranty very carefully and feel like I have a grasp on what it covers/doesn't cover.
In my opinion, the most critical part of the warranty (as it applies to our conversation) is the following:
This clearly states that rooting the phone will void your warranty. Please note that this is regardless of whether KNOX is tripped. Using Towelroot (on previous versions) to gain root access technically would void your warranty just as much as using other methods. The issue is whether Samsung knows about it. That's where KNOX comes in.
KNOX is primarily Samsungs way of knowing if you've modified the software on the phone (root access or some other tampering). At startup, KNOX checks for custom low-level operating system components (bootloader, recovery, kernal, etc.). If any of these are custom, it'll trip KNOX. TowelRoot had exploited a way to obtain root access without modifying any of those items, but as you mentioned, it no longer works in 4.4.4. As far as I'm aware, all other rooting methods include using ODIN to briefly modify one of the low-level operating system components, which invariably trips KNOX.
Now, back to the main point of your questions: will voiding the warranty (by obtaining root access) screw me over? The answer is: probably not. Samsung has been known to not really care about KNOX being tripped when servicing phones. This especially is true in cases where you are claiming someone not software related. From a common-sense perspective, having root access would in no way affect the performance of the power button, so if you're claiming issues with the power button, having a tripped KNOX shouldn't affect your claim status. Although, legally, they have covered this by saying the warranty is completely voided by having root access (not just the software part of the warranty).
I would recommend, however, that before sending any phone in, that you use ODIN to revert back to the stock android. KNOX will still be tripped, but it won't technically have root access anymore.
I hope this answers your questions.
-Topher
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you! It does, so essentially rooting period will void the warranty (as seen in the legal jargon) whether you trip the counter or not, and you can always restore it to stock if you need to turn it back in. I was wondering the same thing, we took my gf's S4 in yesterday, and all they did was run a Sprint diagnostic and then replace the hardware, not sure if they even checked to see what she was running (although it is stock).
Any other threads you recommend, I'm still fairly new to it, been reading up on it since I had the Transformer that wouldn't update to Froyo ha, but back then there was too much coding involved, I didn't want a bricked phone because I forgot a "/" in the code somewhere. Almost everyone I know uses Cyanogenmod, also what's the deal with Titanium Backup and Safestrap?
TheNewGuy14 said:
Any other threads you recommend, I'm still fairly new to it, been reading up on it since I had the Transformer that wouldn't update to Froyo ha, but back then there was too much coding involved, I didn't want a bricked phone because I forgot a "/" in the code somewhere. Almost everyone I know uses Cyanogenmod, also what's the deal with Titanium Backup and Safestrap?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thankfully, it's not nearly as easy to brick a Note 3 (at least compared to the S3... man it was tough helping people with that phone, so many bricks!).
It's considered bad form to link specific ROMs in a Q&A thread, since each ROM is catered to a different demographic (and some people might get in a huff if you neglect their favorite ROM). What I will do, however, is let you know the steps I've taken whenever I root and install a new ROM.
I'll explain how to install a custom ROM and some common things to think about/check prior to installing anything:
Installing a Custom ROM
Step 1 - Gather Information
First off, you need to know what version of Android your phone currently is running. This is easily done by looking in the Settings Menu -> General -> About Device.
The Main things we are looking at on this screen are Software Version, Model Number, Android Version, and Baseband Version. I'll explain these (to the best of my knowledge) below:
Software Version:
This is the "type" of Android that you're running. Rather than quoting the entire name, we typically only refer to the last 3 characters (MJ4, NAB, NC5, etc.). Stock Note 3 devices will (most-likely) be running one of 3 different versions of TouchWiz (TW):
MJ4 - This is the last Jellybean version of TW for the Sprint Note 3NAB - This is the first KitKat TW version for the Sprint Note 3NC5 - This is the second KitKat TW version for the Sprint Note 3NH7 - This is the latest KitKat TW version for the Sprint Note 3
The reason that we are concerned with the Software Version is that between the MJ4 and NAB versions, there were major changes. So if you're running MJ4, you will have to do additional steps before flashing a custom ROM based on a newer version. And if you're on NAB or NC5, you will not be able to go back to MJ4, so beware what you're flashing.
For the most part, if you're on NH7, you can flash either a NH7 or NC5 custom ROM, but just read the ROM's FAQ to see if there are any issues with doing so.
Model Number:
Most people don't worry about this, but I always do when looking at a new ROM. The Sprint Note 3 is different from the Verizon Note 3, which is also different from the International Note 3. It's always best to double-check that the ROM you're trying to install is truly meant for your device. This simple check will prevent a LOT of potential issues you'll get when installing a ROM.
Android Version:
This is just an additional check to the Software Version. Always best to know.
Baseband Version:
The Baseband is, unless I'm mistaken, the "kernal" for the phone's cellular and 4G radios. Sometimes upgrading (or downgrading) the Baseband can help with signal strength and reception. Some users have noted that they got better reception on older Baseband versions. I haven't personally looked into it and the reports from other users seem somewhat anecdotal, but it's good to know which Baseband you're on.
The Baseband is independent from the ROM version, so you can run an older Baseband (MJ4 or NAB) on a newer ROM (NC5), and vice-versa.
The last bit of information you need to know is the Bootloader Version. The way to find this information is to reboot your device. When you see the text on the screen, you should look for the Bootloader Version. It'll be a long string of characters, but you're only looking for the last 3 (MJ4, NAB, or NC5).
Once you have all the above information, you should be ready to start the fun process of preparing your phone to flash your first ROM.
Step 2 - Backup your Media
First thing: Backup all of your media to your computer. If there's pictures/music/videos/recordings you don't want to lose, back them up. It's just good practice. Don't lose all your cat pictures because you flashed something and it somehow erased your internal storage. I tend to keep everything of importance on the External Storage, but there are times where even external storage can be wiped, so it's best to back up everything to a PC.
Step 3 - Upgrade your Phone to the latest Stock ROM (NH7)
This only is a MUST applies if you're running an older version and want to install a NH7 ROM. Most continually-developed ROMs are either NC5 or NH7 now, so the first things first: Update your phone to NH7.
Go over to micmar's thread and download the One-Click File. It will remove Root, but don't worry, because when you install a new ROM, it will automatically include root access.
Follow the instructions in his thread and your phone will now be fully upgraded.
At this point, your "About Device" should show the following:
Software Version: N900PVPUCNH7
Android Version: 4.4.4
Baseband Version: N900PVPUCNH7
Reboot your phone and let it sit for a minute so it can get it's bearings.
Step 4 - Install a Custom Recovery
So far, we've been flashing everything in ODIN. Now, we're going to use ODIN one last time to flash a custom recovery, so that you can flash custom ROMs without the need of a computer.
The most-commonly used Custom Recovery is TWRP (XDA Link). You'll want to use the latest version, 2.8.0.
Flash this in ODIN. You should use the "PDA" or the "AP" Slot.
Reboot your phone to make sure it works correctly.
Step 5 - Make a Nandroid Backup of your device
If you don't know what a Nandroid backup is, don't worry. It's basically just taking your phone as is and making a backup of it. In case you make a mistake or flash a bad download of a ROM, this allows you to restore your system. I always keep my backups on the External Storage (microSD Card), so in case I have to wipe my internal storage, it's not a big deal. You can also copy the files over to your PC, just to be more paranoind about your nandroid backups (rhyming is fun!).
You do this by restarting into Recovery (power down device, hold down home button and volume up while powering on phone).
Once in TWRP, go to "backup." Make sure the storage selected is "external storage." This screen will have various options of what to backup. I typically choose everything except external storage. Typically, backups range from 1-2 Gigs.
For me, backups typically take 5-10 minutes to do. In my opinion, this is totally worth it, since I can always restore a backup with no issues.
Step 6 - Install a Custom ROM
Once you choose your custom ROM from the Development Section, follow the instructions on the original post to install it. I'll give a general outline of what I do whenever installing a new ROM, but sometimes a custom ROM will have specific instructions, so you want to make sure to read the posts carefully.
Generic Instructions for Installing a ROM:
Download ROM and check the md5
Internet being spotty in my area, I always check the md5 to make sure that the file downloaded correctly. You can check the md5 using this windows program or using a file explorer on your phone like ES File Explorer. I always copy the ROM zip file to my external SDcard.
Reboot to Recovery
Wipe Data, System, Cache, and Dalvik Cache
This is called a "Clean Wipe," meaning it will wipe out your installed Apps and the data associated with them. Some people will claim that "Dirty Flashing" (i.e. not wiping the above) is OK, but I've seen too many apps Force Closing (FC-ing) when dirty flashing. Also, if you dirty-flash and encounter an issue with a ROM, the first piece of advice is to do a clean install. Might as well do that initially and hopefully not run into any issues.
Install the Custom ROM
Pretty straight-forward on how to do this... just click "Install" and then browse to the place your copied the ROM zip file.
Reboot your phone and run through the typical initial start-up information (google account, etc).
Once you get your phone set up the way you like (apps, accounts, wifi passwords, etc), I'd make another Nandroid backup, just so you have one where it's setup with everything you need. This will make any issues less painful, since you'd restore a backup that's already setup.
Step 7 - Further Considerations
If you ever want to try a new ROM, all you have to do is repeat step 6. Beware, though, people easily become flashaholics when they first figure this stuff out.
If you were paying attention to my "Generic Instructions" when installing a ROM, you'd notice that every time you do a Clean Install of a ROM, you lose all your apps... All of your Angry Birds 3-Star levels are gone!
Well, there are ways to get prevent losing that data... One is by "Dirty Flashing" (Not wiping the "system" or "data" partitions before flashing a ROM in TWRP). This is common practice among users here on XDA, but is typically frowned upon by ROM devs. I've noticed that a good number of issues on ROM threads stem from people Dirty Flashing. It typically causes more problems than it solves.
The other way of backup up and restoring app data (prior to wiping) is by using Titanium Backup. I could write up a long post on how to use Titanium Backup (TiBu), but the main things to remember are the following:
White line items are fine to be restored (both Data and Apps).
Restoring Yellow line items is typically OK (Data only).
Restoring system apps or data (red line items in TiBu) is typically a bad idea.
I've been using TiBu for the past 2-3 years and it's typically worked like a charm. Sometimes, when there's a major Android Update (like from JellyBean to KitKat), it can become broken, but the Developer is really responsive and gets it to work within a few weeks. If you upgrade to PRO, you can schedule automatic app backups (I backup all my user apps every night at 3am). You can also restore apps/data from Nandroid Backups (which is great if you do a Nandroid backup but had forgotten to update your TiBu backups).
In Summary
Whew, that was a lot to write... I'm a Structural Engineer, not a Software Engineer, so I don't know the technical side of things like bootloaders or basebands, but hopefully none of the information I provided was false.
Anyways, let me know if you have any problems with the install. I appreciate any feedback!
Topherk,
Thanks for the reply, and sorry about the bad Juju for mentioning a specific ROM. In other news, I am probably going to re-read your article step by step, and it really puts things in perspective. I have that same build, and I also have Sprint like the video, which I didn't know that the carrier made such a big difference. I'm glad I asked before I started! I will keep you updated on what I decide to do, appreciate the help!
TheNewGuy14
:good:
*new question*
I don't remember where I read this, and I found the option on my phone. If I uninstall KNOX will that eliminate the counter, and other minor issues with KNOX?
TheNewGuy14 said:
I don't remember where I read this, and I found the option on my phone. If I uninstall KNOX will that eliminate the counter, and other minor issues with KNOX?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No worries about the mention of CyanogenMod (I myself am running a ROM based off of it)... I was talking from the perspective of someone giving advice. If I give you advice towards a specific ROM or two (or even a list of ROMs), it could be considered a slight towards the excluded ones.
As far as I'm aware, there are two aspects of KNOX: The low-level trigger and the system app. The low-level trigger works like I described in my previous post. I honestly don't know how the system app works, but I believe it only affects Enterprise users whose corporations require secure phones (and have their own systems in place which interact with KNOX). I beleive it was Samsung's way of trying to secure some of Blackberry's business-class users. I may be way off on this, but that's what I understand about KNOX.
Cheers!
-Topher
I think you're right they want to maintain they are the most secure phone.
Check out their official statement for Towelroot, although I can't post the link because I'm still a n00b quick Google search will bring it up though.
Sent from my SM-N900P using XDA Free mobile app
TheNewGuy14 said:
There's probably other threads on this somewhere, but how do you root a N3 with 4.4.4, from what I gather the newest updated fixed TowelRoot's crash exploit. Also can someone explain exactly the difference between voiding the warranty and the Knox Counter?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, if you root 4.4.4 NH7 at this time with the available rooting formats, you will trip Samsung's KNOX Counter, and void the device's warranty with Samsung. So, are you going to send the device directly back to Samsung ? No, you are going to take it to a sprint service center, or ship it in to sprint. Sprint handles the warranty ? KNOX is a program that creates secure encrypted containerization of DATA so it can be sent to another location. Check this out http://forum.xda-developers.com/note-3-sprint/general/samsung-note-3-rom-flashin-basics-t2896440 Enjoy !!!
TheNewGuy14 said:
There's probably other threads on this somewhere, but how do you root a N3 with 4.4.4, from what I gather the newest updated fixed TowelRoot's crash exploit. Also can someone explain exactly the difference between voiding the warranty and the Knox Counter?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey OP, I have rooted my N3 using CF-Auto Root on NH7 without any problems.
It should be a walk in the park, and yes you will trip knox, but It's all good.
Now proceed with your rooting