I don't like the built-in speaker quality and volume. Can I improve the quality with applications like Viper4android or ARISE?
karizma4yazar said:
I don't like the built-in speaker quality and volume. Can I improve the quality with applications like Viper4android or ARISE?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can get a little more volume, but not without the cost of increased distortion. However, you can enable stereo mod, and you will get more bass, because the top speaker has a deeper low end, and of course the total loudness will be increased.
adsubzero said:
You can get a little more volume, but not without the cost of increased distortion. However, you can enable stereo mod, and you will get more bass, because the top speaker has a deeper low end, and of course the total loudness will be increased.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the Galaxy s9.
karizma4yazar said:
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the Galaxy s9.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure, there probably is, but it's nothing magical that you can't do with v4a.
karizma4yazar said:
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the Galaxy s9.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are a host of audio "improvements" if you're rooted with Magisk. Check out the app or the threads here on XDA
karizma4yazar said:
I don't like the built-in speaker quality and volume. Can I improve the quality with applications like Viper4android or ARISE?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Arise is bloated junk. The stuff the Arise team added never worked. UltraM8 proved this himself. The V4A will disable the quad dac.
karizma4yazar said:
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the s9.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most Dolby Atmos ports don't actually work. There was 1 guy who used to be able to port it. Only 1 guy. Also that port did not work 100% either.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
The V4A will disable the quad dac.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe this is untrue, and nevertheless, he wants to use it to tweak the loudspeaker, so it's unrelated to the quad dac.
adsubzero said:
I believe this is untrue, and nevertheless, he wants to use it to tweak the loudspeaker, so it's unrelated to the quad dac.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't believe it, that's your choice. Many threads on XDA that backs this statement up. UltraM8 for instance backs this up. His mod is also not 100% working with the quad dac. He SAID this when I questioned him on this. It's also in his first post.
"he wants to use it to tweak the loudspeaker, so it's unrelated to the quad dac"
This IS related to the quad dac since you can enable it for headphones.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
This IS related to the quad dac since you can enable it for headphones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He did not mention using it for headphones, he wants to tweak the loudspeaker...
The quad DAC in the V30 only gets called into action when there's an output device (headphones/earbuds/IEM/line-out cable/etc) attached to the headphone jack. It's possible using a USB adapter to get the quad DAC output pushed through the USB-C connector as well (from my understanding of it), but the internal speaker(s) in the V30 don't ever get output from that quad DAC.
The internal speaker(s) are powered off the Qualcomm DAC in the 835 SoC so there is going to be a limitation on what you'll be able to do, probably the best anyone can hope for it dropping the mid-range and highs a bit and adding a bit more bass but we're not talking about frequencies lower than about 80 Hz 'cause those little drivers just can't do it.
The internal speaker(s) are what they area, and nothing is really going to improve upon that. I will say my V20 had substantially louder output overall (I don't muck with the audio levels like I used to with edits to the mixer_paths.xml file) and it had a lot more low end aka bass response as well. I have no idea why the V30 is worse in that respect, but for me I use headphones or my Monoprice 9927 IEMs for listening anyway about 98% of the time. Sure I do have my phone on sometimes at home and listen to things but I have a pretty awesome little Omaker Bluetooth speaker I can feed the audio to and get the bass if I want it.
Related
I'm using the tmobile v20 and noticed this morning that my DAC wasn't impacting the sound quality of Google Play Music at ALL. I have been using a v10 for the past year and I could tell that the DAC wasn't working, or it was broken, because my non-DAC listening on the v20 paled in comparison to the v10 with DAC on.
I went ahead and installed the DAC Fix for V10 and it seems to have fixed my issue. In case any of you aren't noticing the DAC working on streaming apps, try this. So far I've had no issues.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/...lgv10.dacfix&rdid=com.phascinate.lgv10.dacfix
http://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v10/themes-apps/dac-fix-hi-fi-dac-everywhere-t3274457
Thanks to: http://forum.xda-developers.com/member.php?u=4723056
Funny, listening to Google Play Music with my leftover Note 7 earbuds I hear a distinct difference when I toggle the HI-FI on and off. I tried installing the V10 fix app and can hear no difference enabling or disabling it. I did see that the settings for Hi-Fi say "The sound has been automatically adjusted to the connected audio device". Could the type of headphones/earbuds determine if it engages?
T-Mobile edition of the V20.
I also hear a big difference on my T-Mobile unit. I'm using a set of Skullcandy earphones, and toggling off/on is immediately noticeable.
I ended up testing some more...I turned off the DAC fix, yet the toggle still worked. So I uninstalled the DAC fix completely and the toggle STILL works. I guess my unit was stuck in the "off" position for some reason, but it's working fine now. Weird. Sounds so much better with the DAC on.
The DAC fix makes no difference on my V10. Once the dolby atmos is turned on and Viper, the sound quality is superior. My V20 is arriving today and I'm sure with my 1More earphones and that 32bit DAC my ears will cry for mercy.
I wasn't able to replicate your problem, but I must say... This audio quality is far superior than any other phone I've ever used, finally something deserving to be used with Denon Urban Raver's.
Soooo is the DAC fix only for streaming apps such as Google play?
This is my main source of music...
Im comparing the headphone DAC on the s7 and the v20 and they almost sound the same, Im activating and turning off the Hi FI on the v20. Im using an audio technika m50x. Should i donwload the app to fix the dac? im using a video from youtube to do the testing. going to use google music songs that i have download to see if there is a difference.
Jooosty said:
Soooo is the DAC fix only for streaming apps such as Google play?
This is my main source of music...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Other people's DAC worked fine for streaming apps without the fix. Mine WASN'T working, but now it is. I can't say why. But I'm like you. I use GPM for my daily music.
ocelot4ark said:
Other people's DAC worked fine for streaming apps without the fix. Mine WASN'T working, but now it is. I can't say why. But I'm like you. I use GPM for my daily music.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there is someway of knowing if is working correctly?
efrommel said:
there is someway of knowing if is working correctly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll tell you right now, if you can't notice it, it isn't working. You don't even have to be close to an audiophile to notice, it's just simply 3x better.
trix4rix said:
I'll tell you right now, if you can't notice it, it isn't working. You don't even have to be close to an audiophile to notice, it's just simply 3x better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so mine is not working. is very close to the one on the s7 edge. Should i restore it? I also download the v10 dacfix but still the same. where is the better place to test it out. App wise?
efrommel said:
so mine is not working. is very close to the one on the s7 edge. Should i restore it? I also download the v10 dacfix but still the same. where is the better place to test it out. App wise?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is quite noticeable on every music app I've used. The best way I would say is just listen to some music you like. I wouldn't know how to fix it, mine works perfectly. Try a factory reset?
Edit: I just moved from the S7 edge, and the difference is quite clear. I even think it's much better without the hi-fi turned on, but with it on it's significantly better too.
trix4rix said:
It is quite noticeable on every music app I've used. The best way I would say is just listen to some music you like. I wouldn't know how to fix it, mine works perfectly. Try a factory reset?
Edit: I just moved from the S7 edge, and the difference is quite clear. I even think it's much better without the hi-fi turned on, but with it on it's significantly better too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
damn and what headphones you are using?
efrommel said:
damn and what headphones you are using?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sennheiser Momentum In-ear, SteelSeries Siberia Elite Prism headset, and both Samsung and apple ear buds that come with phones. There isn't a pair I can't tell the difference on. I even did a blind listen test with my wife, and she confirmed that it sounds better on the samsung ear buds she uses (included with S7 edge).
efrommel said:
there is someway of knowing if is working correctly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I figured out a very easy way to tell. If your phone doesn't mute music for 1/2 a second when you turn it on, it isn't turning on. It should have a 1/2 second mute when enabling or disabling.
It does. So i imagine is better in the clarity or something. Because it doesnt sound louder than the s7.
trix4rix said:
Sennheiser Momentum In-ear, SteelSeries Siberia Elite Prism headset, and both Samsung and apple ear buds that come with phones. There isn't a pair I can't tell the difference on. I even did a blind listen test with my wife, and she confirmed that it sounds better on the samsung ear buds she uses (included with S7 edge).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how you are connecting them? first the cable to the phone and then to the headphones? or just plugging them
This dac fix did nothing for quality for me listening through my Bose QC15's couldn't tell a difference
Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
So mine is confirmed working with google play.
plugged my vmoda crossfade LP2 wire into th3 phone , then into to headphones.
Press the DAC button and it is a slight bump in bass and volume. too bassy imo
Sent from my LG-H918 using XDA-Developers mobile app
I am thinking about doing a volume booster app but will it mess with the DAC's?
The DAC won't be active when using the speakers. They only turn on when using wired earphones.
foundingfathersfan2 said:
I am thinking about doing a volume booster app but will it mess with the DAC's?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To make u feel better my LG V30 speaker are louder and clear than my ex S8, S8 and note 8
Japultra said:
The DAC won't be active when using the speakers. They only turn on when using wired earphones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How about the plug sound quality? And does it need quad driver earphones to get all the sound? I heard the to get the most out of it you need a new audio file called MQA.
foundingfathersfan2 said:
How about the plug sound quality? And does it need quad driver earphones to get all the sound? I heard the to get the most out of it you need a new audio file called MQA.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can tell the difference even with a cheaper pair of earphones.
Japultra said:
You can tell the difference even with a cheaper pair of earphones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm wounding if a volume booster app would interfere with the Quad DAC through the headphones jack.
Anyone try a volume booster like goodev. I installed it and it tries to make sound higher then goes back to normal volume. Wonder if there is a limiter on it as my G5 worked with goodev with no issues.
I don't take any credit for this I just discovered it here https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lg-v20-sound-quality.816024/page-189 and since I've never seen it mentioned at XDA I figured I would share it.
So I was playing around with my build.prop file (VS995) and I came across this line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false". After some googling I came across that page at head-fi.org and learned that if you set "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true" it enables the Hi-Fi DAC to handle 16-bit content natively. By default the V20 is set to do this with 24-bit content only.
I can't speak for all formats but with the lossless flac files that I listen to it made an amazing difference in sound quality.
Tested on my VS995 13A stock rooted rom and on WETA 5.0.7 US99610h rom that I have running with dual boot patcher. It worked on both so chances are this works on all variants.
UPDATE:
I started to get curious about this DAC tweak so I decided to play around with my old V10, VS990 rooted stock rom. The build.prop on my V10 does not have the line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable= (true or false)" so I added the line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true", rebooted and viola. My V10 now sounds even better than before.
So this works on the V10 as well as the V20. Probably the V30 too, assuming root has been achieved.
Update: fixed
I did this and now my viper4android is not processing anymore
---------- Post added at 06:07 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:54 AM ----------
dudeawsome said:
Update: fixed
I did this and now my viper4android is not processing anymore
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay so it works but keep turning off and on
Using Viper4Android on the LG V20 undoes all the magic the ESS DAC performs.. It downsamples the audio to 16-bit/48kHz after the ESS DAC has upsampled everything to 32-bit/192kHz
Viper4Android increases the audio quality on most phones. However it is going to decrease the quality on any device running a dedicated DAC.
beavis5706 said:
Using Viper4Android on the LG V20 undoes all the magic the ESS DAC performs.. It downsamples the audio to 16-bit/48kHz after the ESS DAC has upsampled everything to 32-bit/192kHz
Viper4Android increases the audio quality on most phones. However it is going to decrease the quality on any device running a dedicated DAC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Technically yes but viper4android is still a thing you can't miss with this device, no other playerapp can provide this lossless analog timbre equalizer and much other soundimprovements it can provide.
Poweramp and neutron are way behind what viper4android can do or reach in soundquality terms
I compared the tweak with the default settings its a improvement by a small margin yes (not really magic). but as its not compatible with viper4android this is a no go for me personally and for many other people too i guess
I disagree with your statement that viper4android is decreasing soundquality with this DAC, its a huge improvement in contrary you should try it out yourself dac by default sounds dull and unoptimized
Small tip: use viper4android in combination with neutron player this is where the real magic is.
jody2k said:
Technically yes but viper4android is still a thing you can't miss with this device, no other playerapp can provide this lossless analog timbre equalizer and much other soundimprovements it can provide.
Poweramp and neutron are way behind what viper4android can do or reach in soundquality terms
I compared the tweak with the default settings its a improvement by a small margin yes (not really magic). but as its not compatible with viper4android this is a no go for me personally and for many other people too i guess
I disagree with your statement that viper4android is decreasing soundquality with this DAC, its a huge improvement in contrary you should try it out yourself dac by default sounds dull and unoptimized
Small tip: use viper4android in combination with neutron player this is where the real magic is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very interesting I'm thinking about what your saying how Viper4Android doesn't work with this mod and I think I know why.
When audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false the audio stream is being handled by Android, using Android's src converter and digital volume control. This also allows for Viper4Android functionality. When audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true the audio stream is passed on to the ESS DAC directly, completely bypassing Android's audio processing. This is what I think is causing Viper4Android to lose functionality. Perhaps this is why LG chose to set audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false in their rom. To increase functionality with other apps, albeit at the expense of audio quality.
Personally I like the way it sounds with audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true and I'm gonna keep it that way. I have tried Viper4Android before and I know by my own ears that it did sound as good. At least not as pure which is what I prefer. So to each his own I guess
beavis5706 said:
Very interesting I'm thinking about what your saying how Viper4Android doesn't work with this mod and I think I know why.
When audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false the audio stream is being handled by Android, using Android's src converter and digital volume control. This also allows for Viper4Android functionality. When audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true the audio stream is passed on to the ESS DAC directly, completely bypassing Android's audio processing. This is what I think is causing Viper4Android to lose functionality. Perhaps this is why LG chose to set audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false in their rom. To increase functionality with other apps, albeit at the expense of audio quality.
Personally I like the way it sounds with audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true and I'm gonna keep it that way. I have tried Viper4Android before and I know by my own ears that it did sound as good. At least not as pure which is what I prefer. So to each his own I guess
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
okay it does work with the mod but it cuts in and out
jody2k said:
Technically yes but viper4android is still a thing you can't miss with this device, no other playerapp can provide this lossless analog timbre equalizer and much other soundimprovements it can provide.
Poweramp and neutron are way behind what viper4android can do or reach in soundquality terms
I compared the tweak with the default settings its a improvement by a small margin yes (not really magic). but as its not compatible with viper4android this is a no go for me personally and for many other people too i guess
I disagree with your statement that viper4android is decreasing soundquality with this DAC, its a huge improvement in contrary you should try it out yourself dac by default sounds dull and unoptimized
Small tip: use viper4android in combination with neutron player this is where the real magic is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While you might disagree based on your opinion, the fact is Viper4Android does indeed downsample audio. Go back into that same headfi.org thread he mentions and there will be people who conducted tests that show that. You cannot get bit perfect audio quality out of V4A because the V4A driver downsamples (V4A doesn't support HiFi audio), the audio.
This is why I tend to stay away from V4A. Sure, it makes the audio "sound" better but you're running the audio through so much processing things will get lost. V4A is great for when you have devices without a dedicated DAC. But, if your phone has a dedicated DAC or you have a DAC connected via OTG, it's best to go without V4A
---------- Post added at 01:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:32 PM ----------
beavis5706 said:
I don't take any credit for this I just discovered it here https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lg-v20-sound-quality.816024/page-189 and since I've never seen it mentioned at XDA I figured I would share it.
So I was playing around with my build.prop file (VS995) and I came across this line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false". After some googling I came across that page at head-fi.org and learned that if you set "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true" it enables the Hi-Fi DAC to handle 16-bit content natively. By default the V20 is set to do this with 24-bit content only.
I can't speak for all formats but with the lossless flac files that I listen to it made an amazing difference in sound quality.
Tested on my VS995 13A stock rooted rom and on WETA 5.0.7 US99610h rom that I have running with dual boot patcher. It worked on both so chances are this works on all variants.
UPDATE:
I started to get curious about this DAC tweak so I decided to play around with my old V10, VS990 rooted stock rom. The build.prop on my V10 does not have the line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable= (true or false)" so I added the line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true", rebooted and viola. My V10 now sounds even better than before.
So this works on the V10 as well as the V20. Probably the V30 too, assuming root has been achieved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I have been using this tweak since the 990 got rooted. Works WONDERFULLY. Anything that can be done to et around the Android mixer is worth it to me. Bit perfect audio all the way around with this tweak.
---------- Post added at 01:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:38 PM ----------
beavis5706 said:
I don't take any credit for this I just discovered it here https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lg-v20-sound-quality.816024/page-189 and since I've never seen it mentioned at XDA I figured I would share it.
So I was playing around with my build.prop file (VS995) and I came across this line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=false". After some googling I came across that page at head-fi.org and learned that if you set "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true" it enables the Hi-Fi DAC to handle 16-bit content natively. By default the V20 is set to do this with 24-bit content only.
I can't speak for all formats but with the lossless flac files that I listen to it made an amazing difference in sound quality.
Tested on my VS995 13A stock rooted rom and on WETA 5.0.7 US99610h rom that I have running with dual boot patcher. It worked on both so chances are this works on all variants.
UPDATE:
I started to get curious about this DAC tweak so I decided to play around with my old V10, VS990 rooted stock rom. The build.prop on my V10 does not have the line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable= (true or false)" so I added the line "audio.offload.pcm.16bit.enable=true", rebooted and viola. My V10 now sounds even better than before.
So this works on the V10 as well as the V20. Probably the V30 too, assuming root has been achieved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I have been using this tweak since the 990 got rooted. Works WONDERFULLY. Anything that can be done to et around the Android mixer is worth it to me. Bit perfect audio all the way around with this tweak.
lyrical1278 said:
While you might disagree based on your opinion, the fact is Viper4Android does indeed downsample audio. Go back into that same headfi.org thread he mentions and there will be people who conducted tests that show that. You cannot get bit perfect audio quality out of V4A because the V4A driver will ALWAYS use the Android mixer which downsamples, or upsamples depending on the file's quality, the audio.
This is why I tend to stay away from V4A. Sure, it makes the audio "sound" better but you're running the audio through so much processing things will get lost. V4A is great for when you have devices without a dedicated DAC. But, if your phone has a dedicated DAC or you have a DAC connected via OTG, it's best to go without V4A
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well we can have a eternal discussion about this,"adiophiles" vs audio equalizer enthosiastics" viper4android is the best thing we have if you're a heavy equalizer user
It doesn't get better than that for android devices atm => Well... maybe with a hardware equalizer directly controlled from the kernel and DAC chip, there were some mods of that in the past with the wolfson dac chip from old android devices
For my personal use I cannot miss viper4android, clean default DAC sound is sounding dull for my "audeze insine 20 inears" for example
Poweramp and neutron does not the job well enough, not by far compared to viper4android
Technical speaking 16bit vs 32 bit rate is an improvement, but only by a small margin for my ears it's not worth letting go V4A
What DID improve the DAC was forcing the dac in high gain mode (other mod on this forum), this was a significant improvement imo, also audible in MP3's not only flac
jody2k said:
Well we can have a eternal discussion about this,"adiophiles" vs audio equalizer enthosiastics" viper4android is the best thing we have if you're a heavy equalizer user
It doesn't get better than that for android devices atm => Well... maybe with a hardware equalizer directly controlled from the kernel and DAC chip, there were some mods of that in the past with the wolfson dac chip from old android devices
For my personal use I cannot miss viper4android, clean default DAC sound is sounding dull for my audeze insine 20 inears for example
Poweramp and neutron does not the job well enough
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here is the thing, you're speaking to opinion. I'm speaking to technical fact. When you use V4A, any audio you use is merely being amplified by the DAC and not being processed by it. Why do you think V4A doesn't work with the mod enabled? It's because Android is being set to run 16 bit audio through the DAC for processing and amplification. Thus, V4A isn't even touching the audio with this mod.
So, if V4A isn't touching 16-bit audio with this mod, then it's not even touching 24-bit audio by default. So it does the only thing it can do, it downsamples (since it downsamples any audio above 16/44 by default anyway, whereas Android's mixer upsamples to the max capability of the DAC). I cannot speak to what you feel is dull and such. That's your truth based on your musical ears.
All I am saying is this, V4A is nothing more but an EQ. A VERY GOOD one at that. If I didn't have the V20 or the Dragonfly Black, I would still be using V4A. But I don't because I have those tools at my disposal. Grab poweramp Alpha or Ainur and you will see the DAC come to life. V4A, and anything after this is my opinion, doesn't do anything close to what an app that lets the DAC do its job can do.
Installing V4A on this phone, again, my opinion is a waste of the full abilities of the DAC.. Using it just turns the DAC into an amplifier instead of allowing it to be the thing that processes audio IN ADDITION TO amplification.
Didn't know I could enjoy music on my phone without viper. All my mp3s/flac sound more lively. To my knowledge Power amp 3 still downsamples. Is the availability of the built-in equalizer a good trade off for the lost sample size?
Edit: Both viper and Dolby are broken with this mod
mookiexl said:
Didn't know I could enjoy music on my phone without viper. All my mp3s/flac sound more lively. To my knowledge Power amp 3 still downsamples. Is the availability of the built-in equalizer a good trade off for the lost sample size?
Edit: Both viper and Dolby are broken with this mod
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could try blackplayer... It doesn't downsample. I use that because it also has an EQ and when I use my VE Monks, I need to tune the bass down
lyrical1278 said:
You could try blackplayer... It doesn't downsample. I use that because it also has an EQ and when I use my VE Monks, I need to tune the bass down
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apparently the equalizer attempts to downsample once activated and you get no sound with this tweak. Oh well I'm good knowing I'm actually getting the most out the DAC at all times.
mookiexl said:
Didn't know I could enjoy music on my phone without viper. All my mp3s/flac sound more lively. To my knowledge Power amp 3 still downsamples. Is the availability of the built-in equalizer a good trade off for the lost sample size?
Edit: Both viper and Dolby are broken with this mod
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While this phone without viper sounds night and day better than any phone I've heard so far, viper still sounds the best with Poweramp imo
jody2k said:
What DID improve the DAC was forcing the dac in high gain mode (other mod on this forum), this was a significant improvement imo, also audible in MP3's not only flac
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Forcing it into High impedance does nothing for music quality.
Sent from my LG V20 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
Forcing it into High impedance does nothing for music quality.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It really depends
Some headphones do like the extra power, headphones with low impedance who are still powerhungry for example. For my audeze isine 20 it made a difference
Some audiophile headphones like the extra voltage, fact they are low impedance doesn't always mean they are easy to drive
mookiexl said:
Apparently the equalizer attempts to downsample once activated and you get no sound with this tweak. Oh well I'm good knowing I'm actually getting the most out the DAC at all times.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you mean V4A becomes broken? Because I am using BlackPlayer right now with the EQ activated (Blackplayer's built in EQ, not V4A) and I am having no issues plus there is no downsampling.
But yes, as I said in an earlier post, V4A will become broken (as will most audio mods) if you use this build.prop mod because the DAC will be handling 16-bit audio processing directly instead of it being bypassed and handled by the audio mods.
---------- Post added at 03:44 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:41 AM ----------
jody2k said:
It really depends
Some headphones do like the extra power, headphones with low impedance who are still powerhungry for example. For my audeze isine 20 it made a difference
Some audiophile headphones like the extra voltage, fact they are low impedance doesn't always mean they are easy to drive
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
High Impedance doesn't affect quality, it affects loudness. Since the amp in the V20 is actually pushing the headphones, the headphones are able to play louder. The quality is affected by the DAC whether h.i. is on or not. The quality doesn't change (unless you're into letting your audio clip), its just able to be louder.
lyrical1278 said:
Do you mean V4A becomes broken? Because I am using BlackPlayer right now with the EQ activated (Blackplayer's built in EQ, not V4A) and I am having no issues plus there is no downsampling.
But yes, as I said in an earlier post, V4A will become broken (as will most audio mods) if you use this build.prop mod because the DAC will be handling 16-bit audio processing directly instead of it being bypassed and handled by the audio mods.
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High Impedance doesn't affect quality, it affects loudness. Since the amp in the V20 is actually pushing the headphones, the headphones are able to play louder. The quality is affected by the DAC whether h.i. is on or not. The quality doesn't change (unless you're into letting your audio clip), its just able to be louder.
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I'm not gona try to learn a donkey maths, i'm not talking about more volume it does more than just that. you clearly don't know what you're talking about and as in contrary you read on hi fi forums you don't know anything about soundquality or how it affects ears/headphones
You're an idiot yes that right I'm gona ignore you from now
jody2k said:
I'm not gona try to learn a donkey maths, i'm not talking about more volume it does more than just that. you clearly don't know what you're talking about and as in contrary you read on hi fi forums you don't know anything about soundquality or how it affects ears/headphones
You're an idiot yes that right I'm gona ignore you from now
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It only makes it louder. Just people say it does more then that on HiFi fourms does not make it true.
Just Google ohms law. It has no effect on audio quality. If you think High impedance makes better audio quality, then you have no clue as to what you are talking about.
Sent from my LG V20 using XDA Labs
jody2k said:
Well we can have a eternal discussion about this,"adiophiles" vs audio equalizer enthosiastics" viper4android is the best thing we have if you're a heavy equalizer user
It doesn't get better than that for android devices atm => Well... maybe with a hardware equalizer directly controlled from the kernel and DAC chip, there were some mods of that in the past with the wolfson dac chip from old android devices
For my personal use I cannot miss viper4android, clean default DAC sound is sounding dull for my "audeze insine 20 inears" for example
Poweramp and neutron does not the job well enough, not by far compared to viper4android
Technical speaking 16bit vs 32 bit rate is an improvement, but only by a small margin for my ears it's not worth letting go V4A
What DID improve the DAC was forcing the dac in high gain mode (other mod on this forum), this was a significant improvement imo, also audible in MP3's not only flac
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i dunno why you praise v4A that much, but here is what i tried. i used v4A on my v20 with Razer adaro DJ, KZ Z26, and puresound 260ohm earbuds. it sounds great until my brother in law bring his cord mojo and Fiio Q1 Mark II dac/amp. no matter setting that i use in V4A i always got "buzzing" on my headphone/iem/earbuds. the bass were enough but i lost the vocal and instrument quality. it get worse when i use fiio as a dac. restore my backup and testing without V4A. and guess what? every noise and buzz gone. fiio as amp really blowing every sound aspect from my v20. more soundstage, neutral sound, etc. so yeah, if you only use v20 and iem v4a might be best for you but once you use external amp or dac it became useless even downgrading sound performance.
alldine345 said:
i dunno why you praise v4A that much, but here is what i tried. i used v4A on my v20 with Razer adaro DJ, KZ Z26, and puresound 260ohm earbuds. it sounds great until my brother in law bring his cord mojo and Fiio Q1 Mark II dac/amp. no matter setting that i use in V4A i always got "buzzing" on my headphone/iem/earbuds. the bass were enough but i lost the vocal and instrument quality. it get worse when i use fiio as a dac. restore my backup and testing without V4A. and guess what? every noise and buzz gone. fiio as amp really blowing every sound aspect from my v20. more soundstage, neutral sound, etc. so yeah, if you only use v20 and iem v4a might be best for you but once you use external amp or dac it became useless even downgrading sound performance.
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Buzzing from your ear buds?? Maybe you did something wrong badly
And you lost vocal and instrument quality yes let me guess what you did: you boosted the bass options without boosting the low mids, mids and high's because you don't know how equalizing works because your that kind of audiophile who strives after pure neutral sound.
Ofcourse the chord mojo is on a other league here it's alot better yes I tried it too but no equalization options soo i was bit dissapointed afterwards, i loved the pure sound it was giving tho and maybe the only dac i could use without EQ but then again there is so much potential lost ... So sad
If the mojo could be paired with a decent EQ then this would be majestic sound i agree
Tried several DAP's from sony the nwzx2 was the one who came closest maybe even better yes but damn the price of that thing
I don't know why you guys try to dishonor v4a it's really good and all about the settings you use
Hello, I was reading something that the V30 only uses the ES9218P DAC Chip when you insert a super high quality ear phone, can some one comment as to whether this is true? And if so, is there a mod or something to force it to use the chip at all times?
googler01 said:
Hello, I was reading something that the V30 only uses the ES9218P DAC Chip when you insert a super high quality ear phone, can some one comment as to whether this is true? And if so, is there a mod or something to force it to use the chip at all times?
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If you're on stock firmware the quad DAC is used all the time. However, how many of the quad (four) DAC channels are activated depends on the impedance of your headphones. Usually about 50 ohms for all four.
There are mods (requires root) to force High Impedance Mode (HIM) no matter what headset you're using. That's not always best if you're using low quality headset/earbuds.
I use a version of forced HIM -- using Anxious V30 mod, but she toned it down in later versions of the mod to only half the volume for earbuds with less than 50 ohms which didn't naturally activate "normal" HIM. She called it faux HIM or other names because some audiophiles argued with her terminology.
They'll probably argue with mine also -- but I'm explaining it so it's easily understood.
googler01 said:
Hello, I was reading something that the V30 only uses the ES9218P DAC Chip when you insert a super high quality ear phone, can some one comment as to whether this is true? And if so, is there a mod or something to force it to use the chip at all times?
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The quad dac is activated no matter what.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
I will post a link that has a possible work around. I use it, but not sure that it is needed to enhance your low impedance phones. You can try it and see, I guess. It will be in the first post of the link as a "spoiler".
I also have downloaded an app that let's you know if it is in normal, external DAC (the work around), or HIM mode. The app is, "hi-fi status LG".
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/music-apps-tips-and-tricks-for-the-lg-v30.868978/
Use it or not. It may help or not. I do use the work around with my low impedance head phones.
The impedence modes only bump up the amplification to accommodate power hungry earphones.
There is no impact on sound quality. You should not worry about it, just plug in your erphones and enjoy.
Poweramp can give 24bit output, but when Viper is activated then it's always 16bit. I have tried 24/32bit .irs files too, but no luck.
DooMLoRD77 said:
Poweramp can give 24bit output, but when Viper is activated then it's always 16bit. I have tried 24/32bit .irs files too, but no luck.
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Why would you use V4A with LG? Makes no sense. It's 16bit due to the fact you aren't using the quad dac. The drivers for V4A are closed source. While the app may get updated, the drivers never will.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
Why would you use V4A with LG? Makes no sense. It's 16bit due to the fact you aren't using the quad dac. The drivers for V4A are closed source. While the app may get updated, the drivers never will.
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Right.
With Viper you're making the onboard Snapdragon 835 DAC sound differently, not the already excellent V30 Quad DAC.
BROKEN1981 said:
Why would you use V4A with LG? Makes no sense. It's 16bit due to the fact you aren't using the quad dac. The drivers for V4A are closed source. While the app may get updated, the drivers never will.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
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I would use convolver in Viper which makes my earphones sound more natural. Although It uses the quad dac the same way as Poweramp and it's 16bit because it is the preferred sample rate by Viper. So it's not possible to increase it . Anyway, thank you!
ChazzMatt said:
Right.
With Viper you're making the onboard Snapdragon 835 DAC sound differently, not the already excellent V30 Quad DAC.
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It actually sounds exactly the same when Viper is active. The specific EQ (convolver) is the only reason I would use it.
DooMLoRD77 said:
Although It uses the quad dac the same way as Poweramp and it's 16bit because it is the preferred sample rate by Viper. So it's not possible to increase it . Anyway, thank you!
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This is not true. V4A DOESN'T use the quad dac. 16bit is NOT the preferred rate. The driver is 16bit and that will never change. The dev of V4A left before any other bit rate became a thing on Android. The dev never responded to request for the code.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
This is not true. V4A DOESN'T use the quad dac. 16bit is NOT the preferred rate. The driver is 16bit and that will never change. The dev of V4A left before any other bit rate became a thing on Android. The dev never responded to request for the code.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
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I can't notice any difference with Viper, but OK I get it. So it's bypassing the LG quad dac function. I won't use Viper, I want 24bit to avoid losses from digital volume controlling. Thanks the help!
DooMLoRD77 said:
I can't notice any difference with Viper, but OK I get it. So it's bypassing the LG quad dac function. I won't use Viper, I want 24bit to avoid losses from digital volume controlling. Thanks the help!
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https://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v30/themes/magisk-bring-24-bit-output-aosp-pie-t3900863
Our ES9218p (Quad DAC) has an integrated amplifier (so-called OpAmp) using Analog Volume Control (AVC). You're not losing any resolution due to digital volume control, as long as you use a player app that knows how to play bit-perfect: Such apps will send all bits straight to the DAC (essentially keeping digital volume at max) and leave volume control to the DAC. When you turn volume up/down with the volume keys (or the Hi-Fi Quad DAC settings page) you're controlling that analog amp.
The moment you add EQ or DTS or other digital processing you already lose bit perfect. But as long as the app doesn't use digital volume control (keeps it at max) at least you will still have the full resolution during and after that processing.
You should be more concerned about the upsamling done by the Android Mixer when playing 16/44 music (anything CD quality, whether compressed or not). See this for details.
All player apps (including LG Music) will suffer this up-sampling unless they specifically work around it. UAPP and Neutron work around it by converting 16/44 to 24/44 on the fly. PowerAmp CAN work around it if you configure it to re-sample 16/44 to 24/44 -- but you then have to change that setting when playing HiRes music (anything 24-bit or higher than 44.1KHz) so it isn't down-sampled to 24/44.
HiRes music generally plays correctly from most apps (not re-sampled) unless they specifically mess it up (which is the case with Qobuz last I heard) or they deliberately re-sample it (like Amazon HD Music which re-samples everything to 48KHz on Android devices).
I never used Viper4Android. I don't see how it can cause audio to bypass the Quad DAC (when Quad DAC is enabled) but I'm not ruling it out. And certainly there is no way Viper4Android can understand or take advantage of the Quad DAC given how old it is.
TheDannemand said:
The moment you add EQ or DTS or other digital processing you already lose bit perfect. But as long as the app doesn't use digital volume control (keeps it at max) at least you will still have the full resolution during and after that processing.
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DTS no longer works in pie for PowerAmp. I don't know why. When I need to unwind, I would sip on vodka straight on the rocks. Put on PowerAmp, turn on DTS wide setting and listen to Pink Floyd.
TheDannemand said:
I never used Viper4Android. I don't see how it can cause audio to bypass the Quad DAC (when Quad DAC is enabled) but I'm not ruling it out. And certainly there is no way Viper4Android can understand or take advantage of the Quad DAC given how old it is.
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Few devs who did audio mods said this back in the V20 days.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
Edit, I'm sure @ChazzMatt can find it. He can find anything. LMFAO
BROKEN1981 said:
DTS no longer works in pie for PowerAmp. I don't know why. When I need to unwind, I would sip on vodka straight on the rocks. Put on PowerAmp, turn on DTS wide setting and listen to Pink Floyd.
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LOL thank you for that image :laugh:
BROKEN1981 said:
Few devs who did audio mods said this back in the V20 days.
Edit, I'm sure @ChazzMatt can find it. He can find anything. LMFAO
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No need, I believe you. I just don't know how it is possible to avoid the Quad DAC when it's enabled. As in *I* don't know how, not that it isn't possible :cyclops:
TheDannemand said:
Our ES9218p (Quad DAC) has an integrated amplifier (so-called OpAmp) using Analog Volume Control (AVC). You're not losing any resolution due to digital volume control, as long as you use a player app that knows how to play bit-perfect: Such apps will send all bits straight to the DAC (essentially keeping digital volume at max) and leave volume control to the DAC. When you turn volume up/down with the volume keys (or the Hi-Fi Quad DAC settings page) you're controlling that analog amp.
The moment you add EQ or DTS or other digital processing you already lose bit perfect. But as long as the app doesn't use digital volume control (keeps it at max) at least you will still have the full resolution during and after that processing.
You should be more concerned about the upsamling done by the Android Mixer when playing 16/44 music (anything CD quality, whether compressed or not). See this for details.
All player apps (including LG Music) will suffer this up-sampling unless they specifically work around it. UAPP and Neutron work around it by converting 16/44 to 24/44 on the fly. PowerAmp CAN work around it if you configure it to re-sample 16/44 to 24/44 -- but you then have to change that setting when playing HiRes music (anything 24-bit or higher than 44.1KHz) so it isn't down-sampled to 24/44.
HiRes music generally plays correctly from most apps (not re-sampled) unless they specifically mess it up (which is the case with Qobuz last I heard) or they deliberately re-sample it (like Amazon HD Music which re-samples everything to 48KHz on Android devices).
I never used Viper4Android. I don't see how it can cause audio to bypass the Quad DAC (when Quad DAC is enabled) but I'm not ruling it out. And certainly there is no way Viper4Android can understand or take advantage of the Quad DAC given how old it is.
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That's interesting. When I set to 16bit in poweramp then I hear noise at the end of some tracks when the volume slowly decreases in the song. That's happens also with LG music app. But when I choose 24bit in poweramp then the noise disappears and I hear more details. This noise can be noticed at enough low volume. So is this means that poweramp and LG music uses DVC and not letting the DAC to do the job?
As for the interpolation I don't care, I don't have high sensitivity device and poweramp gives fix 24/44.1.
DooMLoRD77 said:
That's interesting. When I set to 16bit in poweramp then I hear noise at the end of some tracks when the volume slowly decreases in the song. That's happens also with LG music app. But when I choose 24bit in poweramp then the noise disappears and I hear more details. This noise can be noticed at enough low volume. So is this means that poweramp and LG music uses DVC and not letting the DAC to do the job?
As for the interpolation I don't care, I don't have high sensitivity device and poweramp gives fix 24/44.1.
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LG Music doesn't use DVC. From what I can tell, it plays everything correctly, including HiRes, so long as you keep effects and EQ disabled. Its only problem is that it doesn't bypass the Mixer on 16/44.
And I can almost guarantee that you DO care about the interpolation: That noise you hear at low amplitude (volume) levels is typical of the upsampling performed by the Android Mixer. Once you configure PowerAmp to output as 24-bit, AudioFlinger will use the DIRECT path instead of the MIXER path, which will bypass the Mixer and send music straight to the DAC, without upsampling. That's why the noise goes away when you select 24-bit, not because of DVC bit-loss at 16-bit.
DooMLoRD77 said:
snip.
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lol no need to quote the entire post
TheDannemand said:
snip.
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This is aimed at you and the op.
From the V20 to the V30 on 7, 8 and now 9.0, people have complained about hissing. I always thought it was audio mods but I'm sure DooM isn't using any.
I don't see how, but maybe a dirty connection? Or possibly the headphones? Damaged speaker?
I've used the stock app with DTS. No hissing. Tho kinda sounds bad. Something really changed with 9.0.
Even with DTS off, no hissing and the music sounds good.
PowerAmp, no hissing, can't use DTS. UAPP, no hissing.
@DooMLoRD77, do you have a different pair of headphones?
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
TheDannemand said:
quote
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I wasn't actually hearing the interpolation noise, however It was because of dithering was turned off by default. When I apply any kind of dithering then noise disappears on 16bit. 24 bit doesn't require dithering as I hear. So I found the solution and it's good to learn new stuffs, thanks. Although I don't get it why it happens. The dithering should add noise to reduce distorsion as I think.
BROKEN1981 said:
quote
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Good I just learned how to reply.
I tested it with my budget MH1C and the hissing was just a very small amount apparently due to turned off dithering as I wrote above. It now sounds fine Plus that DTS seems also bad to me, it's kinda aggressive.
....
DooMLoRD77 said:
I wasn't actually hearing the interpolation noise, however It was because of dithering was turned off by default. When I apply any kind of dithering then noise disappears on 16bit. 24 bit doesn't require dithering as I hear. So I found the solution and it's good to learn new stuffs, thanks. Although I don't get it why it happens. The dithering should add noise to reduce distorsion as I think.
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How do you know it isn't the upsampling that's causing the noise? Your description fits exactly the symptoms of it. Particularly if it goes away when you switch to 24-bit output.
It doesn't make sense that you need to turn on dithering or otherwise process the audio source in order to avoid noise: The ESS DAC has incredibly low noise levels, and as long as the source is left unprocessed and played through the DIRECT path, you should be hearing nothing but black background. Of course assuming a clean recording. (Some of my best recordings are old analog ones, but of course they have noise.)
I apologize for being pushy about this, but I keep seeing myths surrounding this Quad DAC, and users focusing on things that aren't problems while overlooking the real problems that actually exist.
I'll leave you to it
@BROKEN1981: I want to make sure I understand you correctly: Are you saying you experienced hissing on both V20 and V30, but once you got Pie, it went away?
That's interesting (if I understand you correctly). I wonder if LG fixed the re-sampling in their later Pie releases after all: Long before Pie came out on any LG phones I had a bet with csglinux (over on head-fi) where I optimistically/naively said I had a feeling they might address it in Pie, and he thought they wouldn't. Of course when Pie finally came (to his V40 at first) the problems had turned even worse, now with both up-sampling and down-sampling, and a bunch of other issues too. Took much work by Davy to fix UAPP, and I understand the same with Neutron.
I am now tempted to upgrade my H932 after all just to test this. But first I need confirmation that lafsploit isn't broken when rolling back from Pie (I think you saw this over in the H932 root thread.)
But like you mentioned, most of the reports of hissing in the past seemed to traceable back to audio mods or EQ or other processing by player apps. With a good DAC like ours and decent IEMs, it doesn't take much messing around with a 16/44 stream before you can hear it.
Edit: Have you done an audio_flinger dump during 16/44 playback since updating to Pie?
You really got me thinking, but I have so much work to do, gotta get this out of my head for now :silly:
@TheDannemand
I got confused with this much testing. I believe what you say and I'm already happy with this thing. Sorry for this unimportant problem I don't know about the real issues. :laugh:
DooMLoRD77 said:
@TheDannemand
I got confused with this much testing. I believe what you say and I'm already happy with this thing. Sorry for this unimportant problem I don't know about the real issues. :laugh:
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Fair enough LOL
I didn't mean to be tactless, but I can see how that came across. Actually I DO consider your problem important. Otherwise I wouldn't keep responding to it. And besides, it's your thread!
What I meant was myths such as "you must use 50ohm headphones to activate the DAC", or "music gets better and better as more of the Quad DAC cores are activated", or "up-sampling music to 352KHz in PowerAmp will improve its quality". Just to mention a few.
Truths are (1) the ES9218P is a genuine audiophile DAC which performs the best when NOTHING is done to the source. (2) It CAN drive planars and other hard-to-drive headphones, but sounds blissful too on highly sensitive balanced armatures. (3) It uses multiple DAC units to increase amplification, not to "improve" the music. (4) HIM is NOT required for it to perform optimally.
The "real problem" is the upsampling of 16/44 music, which isn't inherent to the DAC itself, but is a massive oversight in LG's implementation, diminishing sound quality for the vast majority of music played on a phone. While not everybody can hear it (depending on hearing, earphones/headphones used, and the music source) many people CAN, particularly on sensitive IEMs -- including many moderately priced and popular earphones. And since many users don't realize that the hiss/noise they're hearing is re-sampling artifacts, they pursue fixes that further process the music stream, which sometimes may drown out the noise, but also further diminishes sound quality.
This upsampling is by far the biggest problem with LG's Quad DAC from an audiophile perspective.
(I should add that configuring PowerAmp to re-sample to 352KHz actually isn't the worst choice, since it does this without the artifacts of the Android Mixer's 44 > 48KHz upsampling, and it will play the result through the DIRECT path. Of course "re-sampling" 16/44 to 24/44 (just adding the zero bits) is even better, but requires changing every time HiRes music is played to avoid down-sampling it.)
TheDannemand said:
@BROKEN1981: I want to make sure I understand you correctly: Are you saying you experienced hissing on both V20 and V30, but once you got Pie, it went away?
:
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Not me, I'm just saying I've seen people having issues with hissing going all the way back to the V20. Though I don't know what they were doing. I can count on 1 hand of how many times I've seen it posted.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
---------- Post added at 02:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:23 AM ----------
DooMLoRD77;80574395 [user=832590 said:
@TheDannemand[/user]
I got confused with this much testing. I believe what you say and I'm already happy with this thing. Sorry for this unimportant problem I don't know about the real issues. :laugh:
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Trust me, you aren't bothering anyone man! @TheDannemand is happy to shed some light on the dac. There is a lot of misinformation on it and I partly blame LG.
When the V20 came out, LG said at 50 ohms or more, the sound gets better.
While this may be correct, it's very misleading. If using something more than 50 ohms, you are probably using cans designed for audiophiles.
There aren't many earphones that hit 50 ohms. I bought a pair of audio-technica's that are 50 ohms earphones. Over $100 as well.
I went to Ali Express, bought CCA C10 earphones that are 30 ohms that blow my audio-technica's out of the water.
Do they hold up to cans? NO! Cans will give the best sound experience while being more than 50 ohms.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs