Is Rev. A capable of upgrading to Rev. B Through another radio update?
Forgive me if its such a simple question, I'm somewhat time constrained at the moment, and just wanted to ask.
Rev. B looks awfully cool. But it does seem it well require new hardware, as how Rev. B Works is somewhat different.
As quoted from QUALCOMM
"LAS VEGAS, April 7 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- QUALCOMM Incorporated (Nasdaq: QCOM - News), a leading developer and innovator of Code Division Multiple Access (CDMA) and other advanced wireless technologies, today unveiled more of the Company's strategy for driving CDMA2000� 1xEV-DO Revision B to market. Still on schedule for commercialization in 2007, QUALCOMM's chipset solutions for the EVDO Rev. B standard will support unsurpassed wireless data rates to provide the springboard for delivering next-generation wireless data, music, gaming and multimedia entertainment devices.
"Consumers want devices that are smaller, lighter, faster, cheaper, as well as fully featured and with longer battery life," said Dr. Sanjay K. Jha, president of QUALCOMM CDMA Technologies. "We are committed to enabling our customers to meet these market demands, rapidly moving forward in the evolution of CDMA2000 technology to bring unprecedented levels of data throughput and network capacity with EV-DO Rev. B - capabilities that are necessary to support tomorrow's high-performance wireless applications."
Mobile Station Modem(TM) (MSM(TM)) solutions for EVDO Rev B will be highly integrated with advanced functionality, support the operation of up to three simultaneous channels of 1.25 MHz each for higher-speed data rates and deliver significant space-savings for devices that are thinner, smaller and lighter. The EVDO Rev. B standard supports up to 4.9 Mbps in each channel for a combined three-channel data speed of up to 14.7 Mbps on the downlink. With the processing power necessary for true multi-tasking capabilities that support the convergence of multiple consumer electronics features, and the ability to leverage the wireless bandwidth required to deliver these mobile services, QUALCOMM's chipsets for EV-DO Rev. B will deliver advanced functionality in a single compact, fully optimized device. QUALCOMM expects the first commercial EV-DO Rev B products to be data modems available in late 2007, with additional wireless devices available soon thereafter.
EV-DO Rev. B. technology is part of the Company's DO Multicarrier Multilink eXtensions (DMMX(TM)) platform, a set of technology and product innovations announced in November 2005. Enabling applications such as mobile TV or streaming music with a concurrent voice call, or conducting a Voice over Internet Protocol (VoIP) conversation while simultaneously browsing the Internet or transmitting multimedia content over the network, the flexibility of EV-DO Rev. B technology also enables significant network capacity and performance enhancements while leveraging existing network investments and currently deployed devices. Extremely high-performance devices could support forward-link data rates of up to 73.5 Mbps, while lower-cost or pre-existing devices could support 4.9 Mbps. Network operators may reduce their costs by allowing a greater percentage of spectrum to be allocated to IP-based services. The DMMX platform also includes numerous QUALCOMM-developed techniques to further enhance the voice and data performance of EVDO networks."
Very doubtful.
I also have a feeling that any of the handsets out on the market today wouldnt even be powerful enough, processor-wise to take advantage of the faster speeds. You might be able DL something pretty quick, but the phone probably wouldnt be able to keep up in terms of rendering on screen images or web pages.
From this:
Extremely high-performance devices could support forward-link data rates of up to 73.5 Mbps, while lower-cost or pre-existing devices could support 4.9 Mbps.
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I would interpret that to mean current Rev.A modems.
Are any carriers even planning on rolling out a Rev B network? Sprint is going WiMax, Verizon is going LTE. It may be a moot point.
bedoig said:
Are any carriers even planning on rolling out a Rev B network? Sprint is going WiMax, Verizon is going LTE. It may be a moot point.
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I was under the impression that sprint was still in the process of deciding between Rev. B & WiMax.
bedoig said:
Are any carriers even planning on rolling out a Rev B network? Sprint is going WiMax, Verizon is going LTE. It may be a moot point.
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Actually Sprint has formerly abandoned WiMax efforts with Clearwire. Too many problems getting certain aspects of the project working. Spirent which was the supplier of test equipment to Sprint and Nortel for testing WiMax had many issues getting there equipment working properly. I doubt WiMax will ever really take off in the way it was meant too. It is true that some WiMax deployment exists, but it's proprietary and sparse. Sprint is still considering WiMax networks but Rev B would probally be an easier route for them to accomplish as not much changes to the antennae
http://www.news.com/Can-WiMax-make-it-in-the-U.S./2100-1039_3-6217947.html?tag=topicIndex
You have to realize that Rev B (if it happens) is YEARS away from being implemented. I mean, Rev A isnt even fully out for Verizon yet in all markets, and only through hacks can pda phones even use it currently, otherwise its restricted to PC aircards.
All the existing phones out on the market today will long be obsolete by the time the next generation of internet speed (whether its Rev B or whatever it might end up being) is deployed.
rajuabju said:
Very doubtful.
I also have a feeling that any of the handsets out on the market today wouldnt even be powerful enough, processor-wise to take advantage of the faster speeds. You might be able DL something pretty quick, but the phone probably wouldnt be able to keep up in terms of rendering on screen images or web pages.
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Doesn't stop some people to just have it tethered to there PC's were it could be taken advantage of. (id be one of those people) lol
With the lack of a real free market here in the USA and the mass of land we have to cover all of these new techs will continue to be implimented in a horribly ****ty manor and in horrible ****ty time frame. The Federal gov keeps regulating the piss out of wireless and getting in the way.
stevenewjersey said:
With the lack of a real free market here in the USA and the mass of land we have to cover all of these new techs will continue to be implemented in a horribly ****ty manor and in horrible ****ty time frame. The Federal gov keeps regulating the piss out of wireless and getting in the way.
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Sigh... so very true. Its no wonder japan has Everything, People there are already watching there high quality movies on there phones. There country is only SMALLER than the state of California. Insane? yes very.
Well this announcement is about a new chipset which would preclude you from just updating the radio.
and by the time the carriers implement REV B you will have had 3 new phones and more likely to have citywide WiFi if Google has it's way!
Related
Well as many EVO users know there is a distinct possibility (probability) that Sprint will be getting out of the WiMax game at some point in the next couple of years and joining the LTE bandwagon. Of course, it's a simple switch to make on their end as it only requires a firmware update, however on the phone's end it is not quite that simple.
Has anyone heard anything about the possibility of the 3D having a dual mode chip? I would like to hang on to this next phone for a while and I'm hoping we won't be saddled with only 2.5 ghz spectrum wimax (the spectrum is also something I'm curious about with the former nextel bands' uncertain future).
Can you explain why Wimax is so bad.
toxicfumes22 said:
Can you explain why Wimax is so bad.
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Well it's spectrum isn't effective at structure penetration. Built up cities like NY have a lot of problems with getting signal on one block, then losing it the next "sort of thing". LTE's lower frequency would eliminate some of that issue.
I'm not saying it's bad, and I'm avoiding saying anything about LTE being faster because we need to give it time, once enough people load down the network, itll be a wrap.
Also, Sprint/Clearwire were testing a new format that utilized LTE/WiMax combined with a real world data throughput of somewhere around 70-80Mbs. Why would you not want that?
toxicfumes22 said:
Can you explain why Wimax is so bad.
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That's a very blunt way of phrasing the question but I'll do my best:
WiMax in and of itself is not necessarily "bad", but to sum it up, Clearwire (who Sprint has partnered with in its 4G endeavors) is pretty well tanking, and I believe that LTE is the superior standard if you base it solely on tech specs. Add to this the fact that LTE has become the de-facto standard via its adoption by ATT & VZW.
Other complicating factors are the fact that Sprint's 2.5 Ghz spectrum has well-known issues with building penetration, the fact that the 800Mhz former nextel spectrum would be a good candidate for rolling out LTE and having better service, the fact that LTE (supposedly) lends itself better to carrier control (ie not in favor of net neutrality) and probably some others, and the fact that sprint has itself said it is investigating the possibility of going LTE, it doesnt even really matter if WiMax is "bad" because it's probably going to happen one way or another.
Wimax 2 might hold promise but I honestly am already over my head here and I'm saying I don't want to be stuck with a phone that overtly clashes with Sprint's 4G vision of the future.
nappydj said:
Well it's spectrum isn't effective at structure penetration. Built up cities like NY have a lot of problems with getting signal on one block, then losing it the next "sort of thing". LTE's lower frequency would eliminate some of that issue.
I'm not saying it's bad, and I'm avoiding saying anything about LTE being faster because we need to give it time, once enough people load down the network, itll be a wrap.
Also, Sprint/Clearwire were testing a new format that utilized LTE/WiMax combined with a real world data throughput of somewhere around 70-80Mbs. Why would you not want that?
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Just to clarify, I believe Wimax actually isn't the problem, if it were deployed on a lower spectrum it would have comparable signal penetration.
IF sprint switches to lte (hope not) then it won't be soon enough to worry about with the evo 3d, you will undoubtably upgrade your phone in that time, unless you can withhold the temptation to buy quadcore superphones next year
Project leapfrog is in the works for sprint. Meaning, they're coonverting to LTE by 2013. Which, in theory, means the Evo 3D will NOT have LTE capabilities because it'll be most likely another year or two before you start seeing LTE on Sprints network.
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Wimax is more efficient than LTE, it's the spectrum they are using that is hurting them. I doubt it will be but the Evo was the first 4G phone out so it would make sense. Even if it's unused when the phone is released.
The Evo is ready for Wimax2 (real 4G) and I don't think the standard hasn't even been finalized yet.
Can anyone explain why Sprint is expanding it's Wimax offering if they are going to be changing it in 2 years?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704004004576271523786624948.html
Interesting read sort of gives some insight about what Sprint may be angling for. If the problem with Wimax is the frequency that sprint is using, perhaps their acquiring new frequencies fixes the problem?
lte
Sprint was already testing lte in phoenix . They also dont need to aquire any new frequency as they are getting rid of the iden - nextel really soon and will probably use that as wimax or lte if they choose it . Iden was in the 700 mhz range and will give a much better coverage
I somewhat doubt they'd do 700mhz WiMax. The reason I say that is because WiMax is an IEEE standard, specifically 802.16m, and they specified profiles at 2.3ghz, 2.5ghz, and 3.5ghz.
Clear isn't there just to provide services to sprint, Clear is there to be a broadband provider. That said, they're going to be working with devices that follow the IEEE spec.
It's possible they'd do 700mhz, but unlikely.
Rakeesh_j said:
I somewhat doubt they'd do 700mhz WiMax. The reason I say that is because WiMax is an IEEE standard, specifically 802.16m, and they specified profiles at 2.3ghz, 2.5ghz, and 3.5ghz.
Clear isn't there just to provide services to sprint, Clear is there to be a broadband provider. That said, they're going to be working with devices that follow the IEEE spec.
It's possible they'd do 700mhz, but unlikely.
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Sprint doesn't have anything in the 700MHz area last I checked. They didn't win the auction when it was held.
sprint has 806 MHz to 824 MHz and 851 MHz to 869 MHz bands. http://www.accedian.com/blog/news/sprint-vacated-iden-spectrum/
"There is no uniform global licensed spectrum for WiMAX, however the WiMAX Forum has published three licensed spectrum profiles: 2.3 GHz, 2.5 GHz and 3.5 GHz, in an effort to drive standardisation and decrease cost." -per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WiMAX
Regardless of what they own you are right in that Spring/Clearwire cant just wake up and decide to deploy WiMax on a lower Freq that they own b/c at this point in time its flat out not provisioned for it. However I have no clue as to how hard/easy it would be to get such a provision so anything is possible.
The thing with LTE is its provisioned across all freq bands defined for UMTS, which typically consist of 800MHz, 900MHz, 1800MHz, 1900MHz. per http://www.pixaware.com/LTE and WiMAX Comparison-TejasBhandare.pdf
I personally speculate that they will go the dual route b/c WiMax has its advantages over LTE in its own areas.
I understand that but I know that clear does what sprint says since they own more than 50% . Sprint will do something with the band width that nextel was using and it looks like the test in phoenix was good. I would not think they would go dual but its only software its easy to go from wimax to lte and so forth but I think it would send the wrong message if they did it . Should be interesting whatever they do . But I bet they use the nextel bandwidth to implement lte
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you said LTE is being adopted by att and verizon...its actually ONLY being taken by verizon. att is hspa+, just like tmobile. and hspa+24 is faster than LTE actually, and that will be rolling out in less than a year. so LTE isnt the best.
I was saying that lte was better than wimax . They tested it in phoenix and got over 70 mbps . But some say wimax 2 is coming and such . It is never ending just like fios and cable . It will always be a search for speed . But right now you can google sprint and lte test in phoenix . may be the way they are going
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darkraiderfan said:
you said LTE is being adopted by att and verizon...its actually ONLY being taken by verizon. att is hspa+, just like tmobile. and hspa+24 is faster than LTE actually, and that will be rolling out in less than a year. so LTE isnt the best.
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Yea but by the time they roll that out, they will probably be working on upgrades to lte. It will be a never ending battle. Someone is always gonna have the upper hand for half a year.
darkraiderfan said:
you said LTE is being adopted by att and verizon...its actually ONLY being taken by verizon. att is hspa+, just like tmobile. and hspa+24 is faster than LTE actually, and that will be rolling out in less than a year. so LTE isnt the best.
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Wrong
http://www.wireless.att.com/learn/why/technology/4g-lte.jsp
http://www.appleinsider.com/article..._accelerated_plans_for_4g_lte_deployment.html
nubsors said:
Can anyone explain why Sprint is expanding it's Wimax offering if they are going to be changing it in 2 years?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704004004576271523786624948.html
Interesting read sort of gives some insight about what Sprint may be angling for. If the problem with Wimax is the frequency that sprint is using, perhaps their acquiring new frequencies fixes the problem?
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Sprint isn't doing anything. They don't have a 4g network. They lease it from clear (they are majority owners).
i agree with what others have said, the problem with clear's wimax network is the 2.5Ghz spectrum it runs on.
Wimax is open source, it's theoretically cheaper to build than LTE, but i haven't heard of clear expanding the coverage fast as verizon and tmobile.
Here's to all of you The EVO 3D might have compatability woe Wimax R2 or the 802e/m which will destroy LTE in speed and No Sprint will not switch over its to much money
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nappydj said:
Well it's spectrum isn't effective at structure penetration. Built up cities like NY have a lot of problems with getting signal on one block, then losing it the next "sort of thing". LTE's lower frequency would eliminate some of that issue.
I'm not saying it's bad, and I'm avoiding saying anything about LTE being faster because we need to give it time, once enough people load down the network, itll be a wrap.
Also, Sprint/Clearwire were testing a new format that utilized LTE/WiMax combined with a real world data throughput of somewhere around 70-80Mbs. Why would you not want that?
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I have LTE, yea and it is as flaky if not more or less than wimax, trust me I was just browsing the 3d forums to see when it will be released or so and the rumors.
AT home I get constant dropouts in LTE, hell I cant even get a constant signal, and walk 100 meters out in the open and I get great LTE coverage. While I have a laptop with built in wimax module and I got free thirty days and I get a constant connection and great coverage. I have never lost connection.
LTE is faster but seriously after 3mb down it all becomes pointless unless you are using your phone for home internet and need a lot of traffic, for a phone a connection at 2-3mb constant is plenty fast.
My wimax module gets me 3-5mb consistently at my house, I have never seen it go below.
http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/07/28/sprint-confirms-4g-lte-deal-with-lightsquared/
They have signed the formal agreement!! Looks like we have some LTE Evo to look forward to!
I don't know why you are so damn happy about this when you own a WiMax phone...
That is great news. Thanks for posting.
DoctorComrade said:
I don't know why you are so damn happy about this when you own a WiMax phone...
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I doubt the OP will keep his phone for the rest of his life and neither are you so who cares if we have wimax phones now. Its called progress and lets face it when was the last time you heard anything about new wimax deployment? It seems like its every week to every other week you hear verizon expanding coverage or adding new cities that now have 4g. Sprint gambled and it didn't quite work out as expected so who cares at this point as long as there is something positive to look forward to in the future.
quietstorm said:
I doubt the OP will keep his phone for the rest of his life and neither are you so who cares if we have wimax phones now. Its called progress and lets face it when was the last time you heard anything about new wimax deployment? It seems like its every week to every other week you hear verizon expanding coverage or adding new cities that now have 4g. Sprint gambled and it didn't quite work out as expected so who cares at this point as long as there is something positive to look forward to in the future.
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^This...
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This means absolutely nothing.( i guess not absolutely nothing but its not the end all solution)
Just b/c they likely get LTE doesn't make it better at all than WiMax.
Those uneducated in the matter should take some time to read up some around here and the web and you'll learn that the reason WiMax in its current state with Sprint/Clearwire is the way it is b/c of a few things, one being the power the units use to get signal(hence wimax modems get better signal b/c they not running on battery like us) and the freq WiMax is placed on.
If they were to take LTE and swap out WiMax on the same freq we would all have the same issues as we do today, end of story.
We really need to understand that its not LTE vs WiMax its more about how the tech is implemented and such. VZ gets better coverage b/c its LTE is sitting on 700MHz channels so the building penetration is much better than the freq sprint/clear use 2.5GHz.
4G will get 10x better in the future once sprints network upgrade is rolled out and they have time to improve it. many options for them wether it be dual LTE/WiMax, or straight WiMax but using wider channel bandwidth and lower frequency. whatever it is it will get better, BUT it wont be just b/c its LTE or WiMax, itll be because of how its implemented.
also its been reported that this deal was done awhile ago. Sprint just reported earnings so its in there too now is all.
Topgun966 said:
http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/07/28/sprint-confirms-4g-lte-deal-with-lightsquared/
They have signed the formal agreement!! Looks like we have some LTE Evo to look forward to!
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If they don't repurpose their iDen 800mHz frequencies to LTE then it really doesn't matter, it'll still suck hard if not harder. I think WiMax is the better protocol... Why not also transmit WiMax on the iDen frequencies instead? That would kick ass.
... Unless it has something to do with Clear.... Patents, licensing, agreements etc.
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DoctorComrade said:
I don't know why you are so damn happy about this when you own a WiMax phone...
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LMAO!!! IF they are going to offer LTE on 5hz stepping its not going to be any better than WiMax... I am waiting for Clearwires 20hz step LTE ... now thats speed to be excited about!
daneurysm said:
If they don't repurpose their iDen 800mHz frequencies to LTE then it really doesn't matter, it'll still suck hard if not harder. I think WiMax is the better protocol... Why not also transmit WiMax on the iDen frequencies instead? That would kick ass.
... Unless it has something to do with Clear.... Patents, licensing, agreements etc.
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WiMax isn't provisioned for the lower freq at this time, unlike LTE. Dunno why this is or how that happened but it would take tests and FCC approval to put it on lower freq from what ive read.
daneurysm said:
I think WiMax is the better protocol... Why not also transmit WiMax on the iDen frequencies instead? That would kick ass.
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WiMax is a simple protocol, basically just like your Wifi Router with Mac Access Control On on a different frequency.... Now there is nothing wrong with the 2496 - 2696 Mhz ban Clear uses except for the way Clear has laid it out, the wattage power Clears Towers are using and limited towers, back in the day the same exact frequency was used for Wireless Cable, MMDS can work from site to site for miles with excellent signal with only one tower center at the World Trade Center. Lots of compnies use LDS/MMDS to broadcast site to site data communications.
Unfortunately all these clear devices/sprint devices have small gain antennas which really hurt its ability to get inside large buildings.. The iDen Public Safety band would be an awesome idea, but I highly doubt you would ever see that happen as the Direct Connect feature is still highly used here in America and also in other countries and they all operate on the same frequency. If Sprint Nextel wasnt in such a $$$$ crunch, you would have seen a huge iDen network across the world. But I agree with you that sprint should use that band for data .. would be very interesting..
ninoriff said:
WiMax is a simple protocol, basically just like your Wifi Router with Mac Access Control On on a different frequency.... Now there is nothing wrong with the 2496 - 2696 Mhz ban Clear uses except for the way Clear has laid it out, the wattage power Clears Towers are using and limited towers, back in the day the same exact frequency was used for Wireless Cable, MMDS can work from site to site for miles with excellent signal with only one tower center at the World Trade Center. Lots of compnies use LDS/MMDS to broadcast site to site data communications.
Unfortunately all these clear devices/sprint devices have small gain antennas which really hurt its ability to get inside large buildings.. The iDen Public Safety band would be an awesome idea, but I highly doubt you would ever see that happen as the Direct Connect feature is still highly used here in America and also in other countries and they all operate on the same frequency. If Sprint Nextel wasnt in such a $$$$ crunch, you would have seen a huge iDen network across the world. But I agree with you that sprint should use that band for data .. would be very interesting..
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already started phasing out iDen btw. part of sprint vision network upgrades. new devices will use the new cdma version and i think nextel subs have till like 2013 or maybe later to move over. think first few phones to support it are due out later this year.
sgt. slaughter said:
WiMax isn't provisioned for the lower freq at this time, unlike LTE. Dunno why this is or how that happened but it would take tests and FCC approval to put it on lower freq from what ive read.
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Apparently its to drive standardization and costs down by using the licensed spectrum profiles. Also, 700mhz bands might be viable in the future.
And as a clarification for my first post: why are you so happy about this when this could be 1-3 years (i'm thinking at least 2.5+) from being in a phone? Also, doesn't litesquared have problems with it interfering with gps?
Edit: fixing first paragraph cuz I was wrong, (which I thought I was)
Sent from my Shooter.
I thought they were gonna use lightsquareds spectrum which is better then what Wimax uses 1500s
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DoctorComrade said:
Apparently its to drive standardization and costs down by using the licensed spectrum profiles. Also, 700mhz bands might be viable in the future.
And as a clarification for my first post: why are you so happy about this when this could be 1-3 years (i'm thinking at least 2.5+) from being in a phone? Also, doesn't litesquared have problems with it interfering with gps?
Edit: fixing first paragraph cuz I was wrong
Sent from my Shooter.
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they did have GPS problems but the deal states that they are allowed to test their LTE on sprints network spectrum which will eliminate their issue evidently. Also allows lightsquare to roam on sprints 3G network and gives sprint the option to buy 50% of lightsquares 4g lte network if they want in the future...
Obviously yall didnt read much when it says CLEARLY its for capacity, and MAYBE future use if needed... smh, you guys think were gonna get off scott free straight to LTE, not a chance... the design goes like this... Agreement between LS and sprint for LS to deploy 4g LTE over "sprint spectrum" with 3g roaming.... Sprint gains access to 4g lte for capacity and possible future deployment if needed with satellite spectrum buying access, if LS decides to sell Lband spectrum. this gives sprint cash (8 bill) and the agreement is like 15 years.... this about sums up that article.
sgt. slaughter said:
they did have GPS problems but the deal states that they are allowed to test their LTE on sprints network spectrum which will eliminate their issue evidently. Also allows lightsquare to roam on sprints 3G network and gives sprint the option to buy 50% of lightsquares spectrum if they want in the future...(guess that last part is if lightsquare can get their gps issues fixed on their spectrum)
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Click to collapse
Ah ok. Thanks for clearing that up.
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ninoriff said:
WiMax is a simple protocol, basically just like your Wifi Router with Mac Access Control On on a different frequency.... Now there is nothing wrong with the 2496 - 2696 Mhz ban Clear uses except for the way Clear has laid it out, the wattage power Clears Towers are using and limited towers, back in the day the same exact frequency was used for Wireless Cable, MMDS can work from site to site for miles with excellent signal with only one tower center at the World Trade Center. Lots of compnies use LDS/MMDS to broadcast site to site data communications.
Unfortunately all these clear devices/sprint devices have small gain antennas which really hurt its ability to get inside large buildings.. The iDen Public Safety band would be an awesome idea, but I highly doubt you would ever see that happen as the Direct Connect feature is still highly used here in America and also in other countries and they all operate on the same frequency. If Sprint Nextel wasnt in such a $$$$ crunch, you would have seen a huge iDen network across the world. But I agree with you that sprint should use that band for data .. would be very interesting..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure Sprint is phasing out Nextel. I work IT for our city and our Public Safety officers all use Nextel phones. Over the past 6 months or so, call quality on these phones has gone to complete ****. We are slowly moving our users over to Sprint phones. Most don't use the Direct Connect feature, but a couple have complained about losing it.
My question is, with this LTE announcement, what will happen with the existing 4G Phones?
A simple OTA will fix this?
When will this start?
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rockypr said:
My question is, with this LTE announcement, what will happen with the existing 4G Phones?
A simple OTA will fix this?
When will this start?
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Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't worry about it until your next upgrade is due...
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rockypr said:
My question is, with this LTE announcement, what will happen with the existing 4G Phones?
A simple OTA will fix this?
When will this start?
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Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Article states roll out in 2014. I don't think WiMax will go anywhere in the meantime.
kinda dissapointed in reading this as I would of really thought they would of released one in Juneish But now pushing that back means ill be holding onto my 3D a little longer i guess....
http://www.engadget.com/2011/12/06/sprint-lte-phones-to-arrive-in-the-second-half-of-2012/
Originally stated that their LTE rollout should be complete in a sense by end of 2013.....
But i guess they really are not starting the LTE rollout till mid 2012 supposedly so putting the phone out after is best....
I came here to post this.
Let the phone rumors begin
Quad core, amoled screen, 4.5" screen (I'm hoping it's only 4.3, or even 4", but I don't see phones getting any smaller, at least not for a sprint first LTE halo phone).
I'd bank on 'HTC EVO LTE' as the flasgship in July 2012
ajs421 said:
I'd bank on 'HTC EVO LTE' as the flasgship in July 2012
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That WOULD of been my guess BUT this guy talks of end qtr3 beg qtr4 as the release date for lte phones. that puts it in the time frame around September....
nice little piece of info.
like you, looks like i will be holding on to my phone for a little longer than i had expected. who knows, maybe i will just simply hold on to it. by then, there will probably be an ICS release for the 3D. the hardware is all there to do it.
EDIT** And I will plan on getting whatever phone my favorite dev’s are getting. lawlz
I wonder if HTC will provide the flagship phone for LTE too.
Lady_Evo said:
I wonder if HTC will provide the flagship phone for LTE too.
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more than likely they will. HTC has been on top of phones lately less your getting a Nexus device....
I'm flabbergasted that people assumed they would have LTE in a mere 6 months. 120 million covered in 2012 yes, but by January, March, June? The first tower ruining on the 800 mhz frequency that LTE will use just went up today. Just one tower. Lol. So with that news you can imagine how unrealistic it is to get an LTE network up an running that covers anywhere close to 120 million people. I don't think I will be buying an LTE right when it comes out, because I can already see based on where they have the best service, and where they are doing the network upgrades first is not based on logic eg: highest population, highest population density, because they are upgrading in very small markets. Despite being the 6th largest and densest city in the country we still have no Wimax.
Thankfully LTE and LTE advanced are backwards and forward compatible so we won't need new devices when that comes, but I'm guessing I won't have the network to use an LTE device on, where I live until mid 2013. If you live in a big market apparently you are screwed.
Sad Panda said:
I'm flabbergasted that people assumed they would have LTE in a mere 6 months. 120 million covered in 2012 yes, but by January, March, June? The first tower ruining on the 800 mhz frequency that LTE will use just went up today. Just one tower. Lol. So with that news you can imagine how unrealistic it is to get an LTE network up an running that covers anywhere close to 120 million people. I don't think I will be buying an LTE right when it comes out, because I can already see based on where they have the best service, and where they are doing the network upgrades first is not based on logic eg: highest population, highest population density, because they are upgrading in very small markets. Despite being the 6th largest and densest city in the country we still have no Wimax.
Thankfully LTE and LTE advanced are backwards and forward compatible so we won't need new devices when that comes, but I'm guessing I won't have the network to use an LTE device on, where I live until mid 2013. If you live in a big market apparently you are screwed.
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Sorry you might wanna go back and read up on the allocation and how they are doing it. LTE is first going on its 1900MHz. 800MHz spectrum isn't going to be allocated to LTE till after IDEN is completely shut down which wont be till after 2013.
And this is totally without the lightsquared rollout too.
If the iPhone 5 is an LTE device as expected, Sprint will suffer if their LTE network is not substantially built by the time the phone is released.
Jayavarman said:
If the iPhone 5 is an LTE device as expected, Sprint will suffer if their LTE network is not substantially built by the time the phone is released.
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no they wont.
sgt. slaughter said:
Sorry you might wanna go back and read up on the allocation and how they are doing it. LTE is first going on its 1900MHz. 800MHz spectrum isn't going to be allocated to LTE till after IDEN is completely shut down which wont be till after 2013.
And this is totally without the lightsquared rollout too.
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I only partially misspoke, as I made it sound like the 800mhz frequency would be used for LTE as the primary frequency. It's actually like what you said 1900mhz is the frequency that is primary, and 800mhz will be used to aid in building penetration, and also to increase coverage for both voice, 3g data, AND 4g data. The idea is that they are going to make their network topologies combined and seamless instead of the current rats nest that it is.
However I think you need to go read about it. They are going to be using 800mhz immediately, but it wont be utilized to its full potential until the iDEN PTT network traffic is moved to the CDMA PTT network. LTE will use 800 and 1900mhz in 2012 though before iDEN is shut down, just not to its full potential.
As for the lightsquared deal...don't hold your breath. It is still likely to not be approved by the government. They are worried it will interfere with other services, like GPS. Then we have clearwire who is trying to get LTE started. Sprint will only use clearwire for LTE if they get the funding, the fcc approval, the network rolled out to very specific markets to augment the network. So you just may see in january that this 4g rollout is going to end up just like wimax did.
http://www.dailyfinance.com/2011/12/06/sprints-first-lte-handsets-coming-in-second-half-o/
http://newsroom.sprint.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=2125
http://www.mobiledia.com/news/111367.html
Sad Panda said:
I only partially misspoke, as I made it sound like the 800mhz frequency would be used for LTE as the primary frequency. It's actually like what you said 1900mhz is the frequency that is primary, and 800mhz will be used to aid in building penetration, and also to increase coverage for both voice, 3g data, AND 4g data. The idea is that they are going to make their network topologies combined and seamless instead of the current rats nest that it is.
However I think you need to go read about it. They are going to be using 800mhz immediately, but it wont be utilized to its full potential until the iDEN PTT network traffic is moved to the CDMA PTT network. LTE will use 800 and 1900mhz in 2012 though before iDEN is shut down, just not to its full potential.
As for the lightsquared deal...don't hold your breath. It is still likely to not be approved by the government. They are worried it will interfere with other services, like GPS. Then we have clearwire who is trying to get LTE started. Sprint will only use clearwire for LTE if they get the funding, the fcc approval, the network rolled out to very specific markets to augment the network. So you just may see in january that this 4g rollout is going to end up just like wimax did.
http://www.dailyfinance.com/2011/12/06/sprints-first-lte-handsets-coming-in-second-half-o/
http://newsroom.sprint.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=2125
http://www.mobiledia.com/news/111367.html
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Trust me ive read prolly more than most on this. least the avg person on here. 800MHz will be used but not for LTE to start out with. no lte on 800MHz till 2013 and it will be lte advanced on there.
http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/sprint-will-deploy-lte-advanced-first-half-2013/2011-10-25
http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/sprint-launch-lte-1900-mhz-spectrum-mid-2012/2011-10-07
Sprint also just gave Clearwire money for their funding so all is okay there now in the meantime. http://venturebeat.com/2011/12/01/sprint-bails-out-clearwire-with-1-6b-deal/
As far as lightsquare is concerned they will get approval, no worries. the issue isn't their fault and is manufacturers not heeding the FCC advice long ago about the change coming. they now have partnered up with another company who is fixing the defective gps devices for people in need now also.
sgt. slaughter said:
Trust me ive read prolly more than most on this. least the avg person on here. 800MHz will be used but not for LTE to start out with. no lte on 800MHz till 2013 and it will be lte advanced on there.
http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/sprint-will-deploy-lte-advanced-first-half-2013/2011-10-25
http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/sprint-launch-lte-1900-mhz-spectrum-mid-2012/2011-10-07
Sprint also just gave Clearwire money for their funding so all is okay there now in the meantime. http://venturebeat.com/2011/12/01/sprint-bails-out-clearwire-with-1-6b-deal/
As far as lightsquare is concerned they will get approval, no worries. the issue isn't their fault and is manufacturers not heeding the FCC advice long ago about the change coming. they now have partnered up with another company who is fixing the defective gps devices for people in need now also.
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That's good, hope your optimism is right. Sprint desperately needs such a huge network upgrade, they will go down in flames if the roll out doesn't pan out...
Sad Panda said:
That's good, hope your optimism is right. Sprint desperately needs such a huge network upgrade, they will go down in flames if the roll out doesn't pan out...
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na if it doesn't go as planned they still have their edge as unlimited and cheapest provider out there. Now as you have said if verizon offered the same stuff sprint does at same prices i might jump there given the speed increase. One thing that puts me off is verizon is a little more controlling than sprint as you can see with their latest phone where the world one is unlocked while their verizon one is locked up tight....
price and locked up phones r only draw back with them imho...
sgt. slaughter said:
na if it doesn't go as planned they still have their edge as unlimited and cheapest provider out there. Now as you have said if verizon offered the same stuff sprint does at same prices i might jump there given the speed increase. One thing that puts me off is verizon is a little more controlling than sprint as you can see with their latest phone where the world one is unlocked while their verizon one is locked up tight....
price and locked up phones r only draw back with them imho...
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I can't comment on anything but there 3G and 4g, its the only market I know much about. While they may have a competitive edge network their 3G and 4g is definitely not. If it isn't fixed soon it won't make a difference what else they can offer because it wouldn't take much of a customer loss to sink their whole business. From what I read they have next to know capital of their own. The only reason this network upgrade is able to take place is because they were injected with investment capital. I think you would see a bankruptcy in some form, whether it be chapter 7, or 11, don't know.
In conclusion, I'm trying to say that sprint is bad enough off to go out of business. They already would have but venture capitalists have provided them with the funds to improve their service to keep customers, and create a competitive enough product to start attracting more customers that want service like Verizon but would appreciate the lower pricing.
Sad Panda said:
I can't comment on anything but there 3G and 4g, its the only market I know much about. While they may have a competitive edge network their 3G and 4g is definitely not. If it isn't fixed soon it won't make a difference what else they can offer because it wouldn't take much of a customer loss to sink their whole business. From what I read they have next to know capital of their own. The only reason this network upgrade is able to take place is because they were injected with investment capital. I think you would see a bankruptcy in some form, whether it be chapter 7, or 11, don't know.
In conclusion, I'm trying to say that sprint is bad enough off to go out of business. They already would have but venture capitalists have provided them with the funds to improve their service to keep customers, and create a competitive enough product to start attracting more customers that want service like Verizon but would appreciate the lower pricing.
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Not gonna see em go outa business. too big. they are on the track to right the ship $ wise and getting through the network rollout is a big part of it as it lets them eliminate a ton of towers they currently pay for. there are many more ways to get funds than from a venture capitalist and theyve done it int he past. if need be they will sell some more notes and do it again.
so here it is...LOL... thanks for the heads up... I willl delete that other thread...thanks
mutant13 said:
so here it is...LOL... thanks for the heads up... I willl delete that other thread...thanks
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Ha yeah no worries bud. Lol
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
sgt. slaughter said:
na if it doesn't go as planned they still have their edge as unlimited and cheapest provider out there. Now as you have said if verizon offered the same stuff sprint does at same prices i might jump there given the speed increase. One thing that puts me off is verizon is a little more controlling than sprint as you can see with their latest phone where the world one is unlocked while their verizon one is locked up tight....
price and locked up phones r only draw back with them imho...
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You are TOO optimistic. The unlimited data isnt an edge and neither is the fact that they're the cheapest. They've had both of those "edges" since VZW and AT&T went to tiered data and they both still take Sprint's customers. When are folks going to realize that for the most part people don't care about unlimited data or the cheapest network as much as they do about the BEST network? THAT is why Verizon is still kicking Sprint to sleep and still gaining customers every quarter while Sprint still loses every quarter.. only exception being pre-paid. I think VZW picked up something like 1.4 million customers just off the Iphone 4S. And if it's like that now even with them being tiered and more expensive, imagine what's going to happen when.. and yes I said when.. Sprint goes tiered.
You can be cheaper all you want, but if you don't have a better product it's not going to convince people to buy it. And I can guarantee you with these current data speeds they will post another post paid subscriber loss next quarter. What's really going to be ugly is when all of those folks that bought the first Evo reach the end of their 2 year agreement if the network is still in the shape that it's in now. Sprint better get on the ball, asap.
Pretty awesome, if true:
http://www.androidauthority.com/samsung-galaxy-note-7-4x4-mimo-709040/
Sent from my SM-N920V using XDA-Developers mobile app
Just came here to open a thread about this. What I don't get is all the news sources say that it's found only in the Snapdragon variant but if you look at Samsung's spec sheet for the global variant it also includes MIMO.
Look here under connectivity: http://www.samsung.com/global/galaxy/galaxy-note7/
Ah I see that my reddit post is reaching the larger audience! Check out the original post for a lot more info and ELI5: https://www.reddit.com/r/tmobile/comments/4wtsdy/galaxy_note_7_the_first_4x4_mimo_capable/
But I will also try to explain the benefits here.
- Up until now, all LTE smartphones had 2 Receive antennas in order to match the amount of Transmit antennas at the cell site, which sends up to two independent "spatial streams" in each transmission. In other words, when your signal is good, your phone is able to receive and demodulate both of those streams which provides faster download speeds.
- Over the past several years, T-Mobile begun equipping their LTE cell sites with 4 Transmit (and receive) antennas, which added additional diversity. Think of it as an additional set of "ears" at the cell site, able to "hear" your phone better since our phones transmit power is many times lower than Tx power at the cell site.
- Even though T-Mobile still sends out two spatial streams from the cell site, additional diversity allows operators to transmit data more efficiently, and essentially prepared operators like T-Mobile for the next step, 4x4 MIMO. This also helps with things like VoLTE, as the added antenna diversity improves overall signal resilience.
- In the meantime, there's been an ongoing struggle for OEMs to figure out how to implement 4 LTE Receive antennas in such a small smartphone form factor, and achieve acceptable antenna separation and isolation, and mitigate the interference. At the same time, in order to achieve the highest efficiency gain, signals that are coming into such a small device have to be uncorrelated, leveraging fading and multipath. I won't dive into that today.
- So adding 4 Receive antennas in the smartphone, just like T-Mobile has done at the cell sites, Samsung is effectively adding a set of "ears" and creating that same diversity on the user's end, which benefits not only users, but also operators as they're now delivering data more efficiently, especially to devices that happened to be in poor signal conditions.
- The best part happens when both the operator has 4 Transmit and the smartphone has the matching 4 Receive antennas. When that happens an operator can roll out 4x4 MIMO (Multiple Input Multiple Output) LTE feature, which effectively doubles download speeds, assuming good signal conditions, on top of improved resiliency when in sub-optimal signal conditions.
- So in T-Mobile's or Verizon's case, they typically have 20MHz Band 4 spectrum deployed for their LTE. In the existing 2x2 MIMO use case that yields up to 150Mbps peak downlink data rates, in good signal conditions.
But once they activate 4x4 MIMO, speeds double up to 300Mbps out of the same 20MHz Band spectrum, without operators deploying additional spectrum resources.
- Even in less the optimal signal conditions, in places where you'd see 5Mbps speeds, we should be able to see improved speeds because our phones now have more antennas and are able to maintain that connectivity with the cell site.
It's easy to see that we end up winning on multiple levels now that 4Rx antenna implementation in a smartphone became a reality. I plan on reviewing LTE Performance in Note 7 and other smartphones on my site http://cellularinsights.com so keep an eye on it if interested in this kind of tuff.
What does this mean for sprint users?
milan03, Snapdragon 820 LTE modem is known to support 4x4 MIMO and kudos for Samsung implementing 4 receive antennas in Note7 if it turns out to be true.
But what about the samsungs own integrated modem in Exynos 8890? I have not seen any specs about 4x4 Mimo support about it. International S7/S7 edge already include that modem. So has the existing samsung modem support for 4x4 or has has samsung upgraded their modem in Note7?
iFixit teardown https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Samsung+Galaxy+Note7+Teardown/66389
I was traveling for work today and saw 5G signal. Wanted to see how fast it was, and was a bit surprised. Left me wondering what's so good about it?
Screenshots are of LTE and 5G speed tests.
Lower latency, faster speeds, better spectrum efficiency. It will get faster once the Sprint 5G is added in after the merger.
LLStarks said:
Lower latency, faster speeds, better spectrum efficiency. It will get faster once the Sprint 5G is added in after the merger.
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Interesting. Didn't see any of those benefits.
Benefits? Live faster, die younger. Like anyone asked for it
5G with T-Mobile is taking the opposite approach as Verizon/AT&T. Instead of trying to get INSANE speeds with very short range, they're building a network that has better than LTE speeds with much further range (higher frequencies=lower range, higher speeds, lower frequencies=lower speeds, higher range). Currently, it's not well-optimized since it's pretty new, but will improve within the next year.
Current 5G networks on T-Mobile are exclusive to 5G phones, making existing 5G networks so much less crowded. So while speeds may fluctuate, you're not having to share that network with anyone else basically, and you'll see better speeds in certain rural areas.
In Western VA, where coverage had been historically terrible, I was getting about 80mbs in places where my Pixel 3a XL was barely hitting 2mbs if I was lucky. It all depends on where you live right now.
Crisisx1 said:
I was traveling for work today and saw 5G signal. Wanted to see how fast it was, and was a bit surprised. Left me wondering what's so good about it?
Screenshots are of LTE and 5G speed tests.
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I was getting over 100 in Saint Paul so not terrible.
Currently on the consumer side there are much more negatives than benefits. Higher power consumption, lower coverage, short ranges, higher cost. Otherwise on the consumer side, the benefits of 5G are much higher speeds (although this will drop drastically from the theoritical and current speeds once it gets wide adoption -- just as 4G) and lower latency.
5G is currently mainly still a push on the enterprise side. It allows them to direct the waves of the signal towards the users/devices and in turn provide a better connection. Another huge benefit is being able to connect much more devices at once. In a few years with smart home appliances, and self-driving cars with TVs in them they will be ready to sell you the streaming/bandwidth services you'll want for entertaiment in those devices.
If you never though "gee my 4G is pretty slow, I wish it was faster" (I personally never have), there is no need to get 5G.
---------- Post added at 11:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:08 AM ----------
champ784 said:
5G with T-Mobile is taking the opposite approach as Verizon/AT&T. Instead of trying to get INSANE speeds with very short range, they're building a network that has better than LTE speeds with much further range (higher frequencies=lower range, higher speeds, lower frequencies=lower speeds, higher range). Currently, it's not well-optimized since it's pretty new, but will improve within the next year.
Current 5G networks on T-Mobile are exclusive to 5G phones, making existing 5G networks so much less crowded. So while speeds may fluctuate, you're not having to share that network with anyone else basically, and you'll see better speeds in certain rural areas.
In Western VA, where coverage had been historically terrible, I was getting about 80mbs in places where my Pixel 3a XL was barely hitting 2mbs if I was lucky. It all depends on where you live right now.
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What you're saying is not possible, research how the 5G technology works and you'll see what I mean. By nature, 5G has much higher bandwidth but much shorter range than 4G. Just the same as 5Ghz vs 2.4Ghz in routers. There is nothing T-Mobile or anyone else can do to change this, as it's the physics of the wave-lenght itself. 5G gets stopped by walls and other obstructions very easily.
What service providers are doing (and the only thing they can do with this techonology) is placing a boat-load of antennaes everywhere. And I mean tens if not hundreds times more antenaes than 4G (but much, much smaller ones). As such, it's not a strech to say that for 5G to be adopted outside of populated cities will take a while. Rural areas might never see 5G.
PS: Not sure what counts as "rural" areas in the USA. I assume most roads and especially big ones, even if the area is considered "rural" will be covered. By rural I mean small villages, woods, mountains etc.
The McLaren on T-Mobile uses low band 5G on the 600MHz band. Low spectrum means greater building penetration and long range (T-Mobile claims up to 2 mile range on low band). There's also extremely high band mmWave 5G, which the McLaren doesn't have. mmWave is the type that's super fast (like gigabit speeds) but has exceptionally short range.
pdagal said:
The McLaren on T-Mobile uses low band 5G on the 600MHz band. Low spectrum means greater building penetration and long range (T-Mobile claims up to 2 mile range on low band). There's also extremely high band mmWave 5G, which the McLaren doesn't have. mmWave is the type that's super fast (like gigabit speeds) but has exceptionally short range.
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Oh, I see. It does make a ton of sense to implement a lower spectrum in less densely populated areas. Nonetheless, the 2 mile range is still far off from 4G range capabilities.
siegmour said:
Currently on the consumer side there are much more negatives than benefits. Higher power consumption, lower coverage, short ranges, higher cost. Otherwise on the consumer side, the benefits of 5G are much higher speeds (although this will drop drastically from the theoritical and current speeds once it gets wide adoption -- just as 4G) and lower latency.
5G is currently mainly still a push on the enterprise side. It allows them to direct the waves of the signal towards the users/devices and in turn provide a better connection. Another huge benefit is being able to connect much more devices at once. In a few years with smart home appliances, and self-driving cars with TVs in them they will be ready to sell you the streaming/bandwidth services you'll want for entertaiment in those devices.
If you never though "gee my 4G is pretty slow, I wish it was faster" (I personally never have), there is no need to get 5G.
---------- Post added at 11:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:08 AM ----------
What you're saying is not possible, research how the 5G technology works and you'll see what I mean. By nature, 5G has much higher bandwidth but much shorter range than 4G. Just the same as 5Ghz vs 2.4Ghz in routers. There is nothing T-Mobile or anyone else can do to change this, as it's the physics of the wave-lenght itself. 5G gets stopped by walls and other obstructions very easily.
What service providers are doing (and the only thing they can do with this techonology) is placing a boat-load of antennaes everywhere. And I mean tens if not hundreds times more antenaes than 4G (but much, much smaller ones). As such, it's not a strech to say that for 5G to be adopted outside of populated cities will take a while. Rural areas might never see 5G.
PS: Not sure what counts as "rural" areas in the USA. I assume most roads and especially big ones, even if the area is considered "rural" will be covered. By rural I mean small villages, woods, mountains etc.
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It absolutely is possible. 5G doesn't simply operate on one wavelngth, rather, it refers to the tehcnology that's utlized to deliver more effecient bandwith. Like 4G LTE, there are different wavelenths with different speeds/distances. T-Mobile is running their 5G network on their 600MHz frequency currently which has much slower speeds than gigabit, but still decent ones that tend to perform about as well as a strong LTE signal. In fact, T-Mobile has been putting much focus on certain rural areas starting off, taking the opposite approach as AT&T and Verizon with their mmwave 5G.