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I recently saw that the HTC Thunderbolt will support simultaneous 1X Voice and EV-DO Data (SVDO 3G). Does anybody know if existing phones such as the Fascinate can support this?
I don't think fascinate does that.
I believe the phone requires special hardware to be able to support SVDO, which the Fascinate probably lacks.
Possibly, but we're likely missing a crap load of software that would be required for it to work, and potentially hardware. Feel free to look into getting it to work on our phones as well. I'm sure many people would like to know how it's done.
Isn't this one of the perks of being on GSM network? Afaik, LTE is a GSM technology, and therefore would support SVDO.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
SVDO means that the phone supports simultaneous 1x voice and EVDO data. Has nothing to do with LTE as far as I know.
papstar said:
Isn't this one of the perks of being on GSM network? Afaik, LTE is a GSM technology, and therefore would support SVDO.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
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No, this is called SVDO, basically it take's two radio's so it can run 1X which is the CDMA2000 voice standard and EVDO which is the CDMA2000's 3G evolution and run both at the same time which previous radio's couldn't. Nothing to do with LTE.
Also LTE isn't GSM, it's an evolution of UMTS. GSM cannot do simultaneous voice and data, only 3G UMTS/HSPA can achieve that.
No, at the moment the thunderbolt is the only phone on verizon capable of SDVO.
Can I unlocked a thunderbolt and put my tmobile g2 sim and used it?
No. The TB doesn't use GSM as a radio and is strictly CDMA for the phone side of things. Also, the LTE radio is different than T-Mobile's 4G radio. I'm sure somebody with a more technical side of why will come in, but that's the basic reason it won't work.
the only carriers verizon phones can switch to is cricket and and sprint (if either carrier is even willing to activate the phone on the network).
T-mobile can only take unlocked GSM phones (which would mean att phones)
I don't know enough about the thunderbolt being used on different carriers cause I don't fully understand exactly what data is being stored on the sim card. If it is only 4g data than theoretically It should be able to work only on sprint/cricket (without 4g, if they are willing to activate it).
Sent from my ADR6400L using XDA App
As above, no, you can't use it on T-Mobile, you could take it over to Cricket/MetroPCS. Metro I know uses 4G LTE, so you'd be able to get everything out of the phone. However, I know roaming with that provider sucks unless you don't travel anywhere.
METDeath said:
As above, no, you can't use it on T-Mobile, you could take it over to Cricket/MetroPCS. Metro I know uses 4G LTE, so you'd be able to get everything out of the phone. However, I know roaming with that provider sucks unless you don't travel anywhere.
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Click to collapse
MetroPCS uses a different frequency band for their 4G LTE (I think they're on 1700, and Verizon is on 700), so the LTE won't work.
METDeath said:
As above, no, you can't use it on T-Mobile, you could take it over to Cricket/MetroPCS. Metro I know uses 4G LTE, so you'd be able to get everything out of the phone. However, I know roaming with that provider sucks unless you don't travel anywhere.
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Click to collapse
No you cannot take it over to Cricket/MetroPCS. The phone does not have a traditional MEID to allow it to work on a traditional CDMA network, and the LTE radio is not compatible with the "LTE" system that MetroPCS runs.
GSM
If you don't know what you're talking about then don't post it. Obviously you don't have a Thunderbolt to say if it can be unlocked or not. HTC Thunderbolt uses GSM network on 4G LTE. It can be unlocked, but haven't figured it out yet.
NO CRICKET OR METROPCS can be run on it.
I took out my sim to see if the phone will work on 3G. And the result is no. No way of putting it on cricket.
alasfar1 said:
If you don't know what you're talking about then don't post it. Obviously you don't have a Thunderbolt to say if it can be unlocked or not. HTC Thunderbolt uses GSM network on 4G LTE. It can be unlocked, but haven't figured it out yet.
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Click to collapse
LTE is not GSM. The Thunderbolt runs on 700 MHz LTE and 850/1900 CDMA. It does NOT support ANY GSM/UMTS/HSPA bands. You CANNOT take it to ANY GSM provider. If you were able to unlock it, you MIGHT be able to take it to another LTE carrier, but ONLY if that carrier also uses 700 MHz for LTE (for example, possibly AT&T once they launch LTE), but even then you'd be able to use it for data ONLY. It is unlikely that you'll be able to use it on another CDMA carrier either (such as Cricket or MetroPCS) because it isn't provisioned in the way all other CDMA phones are.
Jumping on the bandwagon, no.
alasfar1 said:
If you don't know what you're talking about then don't post it. Obviously you don't have a Thunderbolt to say if it can be unlocked or not. HTC Thunderbolt uses GSM network on 4G LTE. It can be unlocked, but haven't figured it out yet.
NO CRICKET OR METROPCS can be run on it.
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Click to collapse
The TB will NEVER work on any other carriers GSM network. Period. End Of Line. It is not a matter of "unlocking" the phones. The LTE standard does not define interoperability with existing the existing GSM standard. The TB cannot operate on a traditional CDMA network (think Cricket/MetroPCS) because it is missing fundamental components required in every CDMA handset (there is no hardware MEID on the TB). Without an MEID the device will not work on a CDMA network, no matter how much unlocking you try. It will not work because the network cannot talk to the phone and there is nothing you or anyone else can do to change that fact.
What VZW has done is create a hybrid system linking their LTE network with their CDMA network. There is a reason dialing *228 does nothing on the TB. There is nothing for the system to update. All of the settings are created on the LTE network and are pushed to the VZW CDMA network on their back end. Your phone number is tied to your SIM card on their network, not your MEID. Want to prove it to yourself, take the sim card out of your TB and put it in another TB. Care to guess what happens? I'll help. The new TB you just put your SIM card into will now have your cell phone number. Now if you have been with VZW for more then 5 seconds you would know that with every phone prior to change your number you had to call customer service and they had to update your MEID and in turn you had to update your phone (*228) so the CDMA system knew what phone belonged to what number.
Tl; dr...: LTE and GSM are not interchangeable terms and technologies. LTE radios cannot function on existing GSM networks. TB is not a true CDMA device and will not work on a traditional CDMA network.
I got my tbolt on launch day, but I don't have lte service in my area so I'm on the ehrpd network 99% of the time.
When I first got the phone I got really impressive ehrpd speeds 2.5 mbps and 1.3 - 1.5 mbps up.
Now after months of lte phones being out I get 1.3 Max and 800 up.
I know that ehrpd is the same as far as maximum speed, but I'm wondering of anyone else has noticed this slowdown in 3g areas, possibly caused by more users on ehrpd
Sent from my ADR6400L using XDA App
movielover76 said:
I got my tbolt on launch day, but I don't have lte service in my area so I'm on the ehrpd network 99% of the time.
When I first got the phone I got really impressive ehrpd speeds 2.5 mbps and 1.3 - 1.5 mbps up.
Now after months of lte phones being out I get 1.3 Max and 800 up.
I know that ehrpd is the same as far as maximum speed, but I'm wondering of anyone else has noticed this slowdown in 3g areas, possibly caused by more users on ehrpd
Sent from my ADR6400L using XDA App
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Click to collapse
EHRPD (evolved high rate packet data) is a protocol subset of cdm2000, which is the network. NOT EHRPD. HRPD is implemented in 1xRTT evolved networks such as EV-DO rev.0 and 1 in order to break from a switch based network to a packet based network. EHRPD is supposed to support hand-over from CDMA networks to LTE networks, however, Verizon hasn't widely implemented EHRPD so far as I can tell. I RARELY see a hand-off of an active data session back or forth from CDMA to LTE.
The only things that would really effect your speeds over a CDMA network would be the backing network of the base station (tower) or user base in the cell. I don't believe Verizon throttles that data. They certainly don't throttle data on LTE.
loonatik78 said:
EHRPD (evolved high rate packet data) is a protocol subset of cdm2000, which is the network. NOT EHRPD. HRPD is implemented in 1xRTT evolved networks such as EV-DO rev.0 and 1 in order to break from a switch based network to a packet based network. EHRPD is supposed to support hand-over from CDMA networks to LTE networks, however, Verizon hasn't widely implemented EHRPD so far as I can tell. I RARELY see a hand-off of an active data session back or forth from CDMA to LTE.
The only things that would really effect your speeds over a CDMA network would be the backing network of the base station (tower) or user base in the cell. I don't believe Verizon throttles that data. They certainly don't throttle data on LTE.
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So are you saying EHRPD towers are similar to LTE towers? Or am I way the hell off?
ghstrdr1985 said:
So are you saying EHRPD towers are similar to LTE towers? Or am I way the hell off?
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Click to collapse
ehrpd resides in the towers with lte and helps with the handoff between going from 4g back to 3g. how many towers currently have it? I do not know, but I'd say not that many.
ghstrdr1985 said:
So are you saying EHRPD towers are similar to LTE towers? Or am I way the hell off?
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Click to collapse
I'm saying there's not such thing as an EHRPD tower. You've got CDMA towers and you've got LTE. These technologies are VERY different. Let me try to break this down. I probably should have explained it better above.
First, for the record, for cost considerations, LTE and CDMA for Verizon come off the same physical towers. There's not much point in erecting different towers for different antennas if they're still physical space on existing towers.
So... from the beginning...
Verizon runs to completely separate networks today. One is based on CDMA technology, one on LTE. Let me start first with CDMA.
CDMA, otherwise known as Code Division Multiple Access, is a method of physically transmitting a signal to and from a device. Verizon implements asynchronous CDMA to avoid issues with doppler shift in the signal frequency and speed of light delay from transmission to reception. CDMA is the radio access technology, NOT the protocol. The protocol is a patented technology known as cdma2000 and uses the CDMA radio access method as it's base layer.
cdma2000 is the protocol and encompasses a number of transmission protocols. Those would include IS-95, 1xRTT, 1xEV-DO, and the 1xEV-DO revisions 0, A, and B. To clarify, 1xEV-DO stands for single channel evolved-data optimized. EHRPD is a subset data transmission protocol of revision A of 1xEV-DO. I believe that Verizon didn't implement EHRPD very widely in it's deployment of EV-DO rev.A because at the point of first introduction their path of evolution was undecided. They very well could have moved on with EV-DO rev. B and attained speeds comparable to WiMax while being able to upgrade many of the existing CDMA handsets with new firmware to utilize the newer revision, just as had been done when rev. A came. One of the issues with cdma2000 is that the protocols aren't compatible. EV-DO used to stand for Evolution-Data Only, because data is all it does. When the devices is used for a voice call, it must switch protocol modes back to IS-95 to interface with the switch-based voice network on the backside of the tower. This is why CDMA devices cannot do data while in call.
LTE is a completely different technology altogether. It's an evolution of GSM, and accordingly, expands upon the basic technology of GSM. The base of GSM is TDMA, Time Division Multiple Access. Each device has a time slot that it's allowed to transmit or receive data on, usually a small fraction of a second. LTE also makes use of FDMA, Frequency Division Multiple Access, meaning that there are many frequencies that can be used to address different devices.
LTE makes uses of protocols, some similar to GSM protocols, to transmit and receive data. These are described in the LTE specification, and as time passes, additional LTE protocol specifications will be added, such as LTE Advance.
The goal of Verizon is to have a pure LTE network in the future. LTE is not simply a data transmission technology, but rather a full blown cellular standard just as GSM is, and as such can carry voice. When it does, voice will be basically VoIP, as LTE is a completely packet based technology and doesn't depend upon network switching (unlike IS-95 and 1xRTT, which is still the voice carrier technology supported by cdma2000). Carriers like this because it makes upgrading and scaling the network easier. The end result will be a more seamless user experience and the ability to integrate native voice features into data features of the device.
Modern LTE devices accomplish voice and data by using 2 different radios. In the Thunderbolt, that would be the CDMA radio built into the MSM8655 Soc processor and the MDM9600 LTE modem chip. Currently, this is the ONLY combination of chips that allows full simultaneous voice and data over the entire network. Unless the LTE chip of the devices handles both CDMA and LTE, AND can interlink with the SoC radio to manage SAR power limits, this will remain the case. Currently, only Qualcomm chipsets accomplish this, making the Thunderbolt the most functionally connected device ever sold on Verizon.
If anyone is interested in knowing more, let me know. I'll write up a bit more in-depth primer on these subjects and post it.
Thanks
Sorry, I did post this in the wrong forum, and as such I deserve some flaming lol.
I've been around here for a little while since jan 2011, it was just a brainfart.
I know I am connected to ehrpd because under about phone it says cdma - ehrpd
I'm just a little south, maybe 6 miles for the LTE market in Northern NJ, I was just wondering if anyone else in a 3G area experienced a similar slowdown.
I bought a 4G handset knowing it might be awhile before i get LTE, because I was concerned about being stuck in a tiered data plan when I upgraded to 4G, turned out not to be an issue, but I'm still happy I got it, it's a great phone
and I do use LTE occasionally like when to school.
Thanks for all the replies, and if theirs any other oddballs in a 3G area most of the time with a thunderbolt, let me know if you've experienced anything similair
loonatik78 said:
I'm saying there's not such thing as an EHRPD tower. You've got CDMA towers and you've got LTE. These technologies are VERY different. Let me try to break this down. I probably should have explained it better above.
First, for the record, for cost considerations, LTE and CDMA for Verizon come off the same physical towers. There's not much point in erecting different towers for different antennas if they're still physical space on existing towers.
So... from the beginning...
Verizon runs to completely separate networks today. One is based on CDMA technology, one on LTE. Let me start first with CDMA.
CDMA, otherwise known as Code Division Multiple Access, is a method of physically transmitting a signal to and from a device. Verizon implements asynchronous CDMA to avoid issues with doppler shift in the signal frequency and speed of light delay from transmission to reception. CDMA is the radio access technology, NOT the protocol. The protocol is a patented technology known as cdma2000 and uses the CDMA radio access method as it's base layer.
cdma2000 is the protocol and encompasses a number of transmission protocols. Those would include IS-95, 1xRTT, 1xEV-DO, and the 1xEV-DO revisions 0, A, and B. To clarify, 1xEV-DO stands for single channel evolved-data optimized. EHRPD is a subset data transmission protocol of revision A of 1xEV-DO. I believe that Verizon didn't implement EHRPD very widely in it's deployment of EV-DO rev.A because at the point of first introduction their path of evolution was undecided. They very well could have moved on with EV-DO rev. B and attained speeds comparable to WiMax while being able to upgrade many of the existing CDMA handsets with new firmware to utilize the newer revision, just as had been done when rev. A came. One of the issues with cdma2000 is that the protocols aren't compatible. EV-DO used to stand for Evolution-Data Only, because data is all it does. When the devices is used for a voice call, it must switch protocol modes back to IS-95 to interface with the switch-based voice network on the backside of the tower. This is why CDMA devices cannot do data while in call.
LTE is a completely different technology altogether. It's an evolution of GSM, and accordingly, expands upon the basic technology of GSM. The base of GSM is TDMA, Time Division Multiple Access. Each device has a time slot that it's allowed to transmit or receive data on, usually a small fraction of a second. LTE also makes use of FDMA, Frequency Division Multiple Access, meaning that there are many frequencies that can be used to address different devices.
LTE makes uses of protocols, some similar to GSM protocols, to transmit and receive data. These are described in the LTE specification, and as time passes, additional LTE protocol specifications will be added, such as LTE Advance.
The goal of Verizon is to have a pure LTE network in the future. LTE is not simply a data transmission technology, but rather a full blown cellular standard just as GSM is, and as such can carry voice. When it does, voice will be basically VoIP, as LTE is a completely packet based technology and doesn't depend upon network switching (unlike IS-95 and 1xRTT, which is still the voice carrier technology supported by cdma2000). Carriers like this because it makes upgrading and scaling the network easier. The end result will be a more seamless user experience and the ability to integrate native voice features into data features of the device.
Modern LTE devices accomplish voice and data by using 2 different radios. In the Thunderbolt, that would be the CDMA radio built into the MSM8655 Soc processor and the MDM9600 LTE modem chip. Currently, this is the ONLY combination of chips that allows full simultaneous voice and data over the entire network. Unless the LTE chip of the devices handles both CDMA and LTE, AND can interlink with the SoC radio to manage SAR power limits, this will remain the case. Currently, only Qualcomm chipsets accomplish this, making the Thunderbolt the most functionally connected device ever sold on Verizon.
If anyone is interested in knowing more, let me know. I'll write up a bit more in-depth primer on these subjects and post it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Man that is a mouthful. However, the Thunderbolt can talk & surf the web in 3G mode, not just LTE. So LTE will be a competition for GSM in the coming years?
Sent from my ADR6400L using xda premium
ghstrdr1985 said:
Man that is a mouthful. However, the Thunderbolt can talk & surf the web in 3G mode, not just LTE. So LTE will be a competition for GSM in the coming years?
Sent from my ADR6400L using xda premium
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Click to collapse
it'll be the 4th generation of GSM (4g).
ghstrdr1985 said:
Man that is a mouthful. However, the Thunderbolt can talk & surf the web in 3G mode, not just LTE. So LTE will be a competition for GSM in the coming years?
Sent from my ADR6400L using xda premium
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Click to collapse
That's what I said. Its because the Tbolt has 2 cdma radios.
loonatik78 said:
That's what I said. Its because the Tbolt has 2 cdma radios.
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This phone has sooo much potential but is inhibited by Verizon.
Sent from my ADR6400L using xda premium
Is there a way to use all 3 networks because 4G is now in my area and it would be nice if i could use that network for better speeds. But it seems that most roms are either GSM and 3G or 4G and Wimax is there any solution?
I don't think you understand the question your asking.
bloodrain954 said:
I don't think you understand the question your asking.
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I think you're right
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
glennd said:
Is there a way to use all 3 networks because 4G is now in my area and it would be nice if i could use that network for better speeds. But it seems that most roms are either GSM and 3G or 4G and Wimax is there any solution?
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Click to collapse
If you have a 4G capable GSM phone in America on a carrier such as T-Mobile or AT&T you can have 3G and 4G
If you have a 4G capable CDMA phone in America on a carrier such as Sprint or Verizon you can have 3G and 4G/LTE
GSM means the phone uses a SIM card.
CDMA phones don't use SIM cards.
私のEVO 3Dから送信される。
dastin1015 said:
If you have a 4G capable GSM phone in America on a carrier such as T-Mobile or AT&T you can have 3G and 4G
If you have a 4G capable CDMA phone in America on a carrier such as Sprint or Verizon you can have 3G and 4G/LTE
GSM means the phone uses a SIM card.
CDMA phones don't use SIM cards.
私のEVO 3Dから送信される。
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In Australia we have Vodafone,Optus, etc that offer 2G (GSM) and 3g (WCDMA).
But Telstra Australia's biggest carrier now has 4G as well. I thought that maybe to access this new network I was restricted by the rom I am using, not the sim card. Because of the two different type of roms ie GSM and CDMA. Or is all controlled via my carrier?
glennd said:
In Australia we have Vodafone,Optus, etc that offer 2G (GSM) and 3g (WCDMA).
But Telstra Australia's biggest carrier now has 4G as well. I thought that maybe to access this new network I was restricted by the rom I am using, not the sim card. Because of the two different type of roms ie GSM and CDMA. Or is all controlled via my carrier?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
your "4G" isn't really 4G, it's 3.5G.
It's still HSPA (WCDMA), just a faster version and your phone already supports taht. It will say either E(edge), 3G or 4G/H+
IF it is LTE that you are talking about Telstra getting, the 3vo does not support that network, there isn't an LTE radio on the device so no possible way for you to access it.
amace04 said:
your "4G" isn't really 4G, it's 3.5G.
It's still HSPA (WCDMA), just a faster version and your phone already supports taht. It will say either E(edge), 3G or 4G/H+
IF it is LTE that you are talking about Telstra getting, the 3vo does not support that network, there isn't an LTE radio on the device so no possible way for you to access it.
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Click to collapse
Thanks very much that was the answer i was looking for cheers.
This is my first time having a 4G T-Mobile device. I managed to turn off the 4g, but is there an option to use 3G on these phones? Are 2G and HSPA+(besides wifi)the only options we have?
Juanito216 said:
This is my first time having a 4G T-Mobile device. I managed to turn off the 4g, but is there an option to use 3G on these phones? Are 2G and HSPA+(besides wifi) are the only options we have?
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Click to collapse
L9 is not 4G (LTE) device. It seems T-Mobile is giving marginally faster 3G (HSDPA) and calling it as 4G (LTE). L9 does not have LTE hardware at all. Check manual by LG, they never call it 4G device. Seems T-Mobile is trolling with its customers since long time with this term though their speed is good.
I never thought it had LTE. From trying a speed test, the speed was comparable to Sprint wimax. I still call it 4G even if it's not "true 4g". Thanks for the clarification, that's understandable.
Sent from my LG-P769 using Tapatalk 2
The sad truth is Sprint's wimax and the currently deployed LTE iterations aren't 4G either. T-Mobile's LTE rel. 10 will be 4G.
Http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4G