I am making a case for suspicious delay in S-OFF. We all know that they could do this right now. The package would be very small and would be low risk.
I am suspecting that the delay is giving them a chance to do the following:
1. Install a special HBOOT which CANNOT be downrev'd (we already know this is the case in old school EVOs that have S-OFF
2. Close current root exploits
3. Prevent, limit, or make difficult the ability to install a recovery ROM
and worse...
4. Give carriers the ability to later enforce S-ON and/or wipe recoveries.
Maybe not all of these will happen... but I am betting that at a minimum, accepting the HTC S-OFF is going to remove the ability to install an ENG bootloader, which would ultimately give us ALL the control.
I am open to being wrong... but please don't waste people's time with flames. If you disagree, then a simple -1 or an intellectual thought would suffice.
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All of this is being discussed in the 5 other threads regarding s-off
Thanks for putting it all in one place?
3D > iClone
My opinion is that they are taking their time in order to release their own "HTC Approved" S-off software, including rom flashing, etc etc. Chances are, they WONT just say, "Bam, S-Off", because they are a big company, and unlocking the bootloader publicly only invites the bottom 10% of stupid people to brick their phones because they don't know what they are doing.
"Well, HTC said it's ok... How was I supposed to know I could ruin my phone!?!?! Buy me a new one!"
They're going to go out of their way to make S-off and flashing new roms a mainstream, polished, clean thing, and not a "Do at your own risk, following some random dude on the internet's instructions" like it is right now.
That's my belief, anyway. I'm not sure what kind of securities and limitations HTC will put in place, but the top 1% of 1% of us will find a way to get past them anyway.
That would be awesome
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
nate420 said:
All of this is being discussed in the 5 other threads regarding s-off
Thanks for putting it all in one place?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really. People are complaining about how long it will take, and there may be an occasional opinion spattered here and there. But I articulated several scenarios which are quite plausible. And the discussion does deserve to be in one place.
So... you're welcome?
edufur said:
I am making a case for suspicious delay in S-OFF. We all know that they could do this right now. The package would be very small and would be low risk.
I am suspecting that the delay is giving them a chance to do the following:
1. Install a special HBOOT which CANNOT be downrev'd (we already know this is the case in old school EVOs that have S-OFF
2. Close current root exploits
3. Prevent, limit, or make difficult the ability to install a recovery ROM
and worse...
4. Give carriers the ability to later enforce S-ON and/or wipe recoveries.
Maybe not all of these will happen... but I am betting that at a minimum, accepting the HTC S-OFF is going to remove the ability to install an ENG bootloader, which would ultimately give us ALL the control.
I am open to being wrong... but please don't waste people's time with flames. If you disagree, then a simple -1 or an intellectual thought would suffice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-1. I don't think they will implement that much control. I'm thinking that it'll be more along the lines of them using a watermark, or something like that. That way, once you unlock it, the system is marked as being unlocked, thus voiding software warranty (I would hope that certain hardware things, such as faulty power button, volume buttons, camera button, 2d/3d switch etc etc would still be covered). Also, I'd bet that they've designed a new hboot all together, which can be unlocked via 'fastboot oem unlock'. As I said, I believe that unlocking it will either 'stain' the system, or perhaps even not be relockable. Maybe they've designed an hboot that once unlocked, it can't be relocked, thus never being able to fully unroot.
I don't think that Sprint really cares too much about it. People always say that tethering has a lot to do with why carriers might not want people to root, but there are plenty of tethering apps that don't require root. ****, we can tether already, even without having S-off.
It's already a given that HTC will eventually close the current root exploit. It is potentially dangerous. Teamwin thought it was potentially dangerous, to the point that they notified HTC about it. Obviously they did that hoping and knowing that HTC would close the exploit. We don't need or want to be susceptible to malware, should developers with malicious intentions decide to write some apps that steal all sorts of personal info. If we have S-off, even if they closed the current exploits, we could still flash a ROM that was already rooted. I really don't see them impeding us from using a custom recovery or anything like that. The backlash they would receive from all of us would be nuts. That would be total deception, if they gave us S-off, but then stopped us from being able to do any of the things that we are looking to do with S-off. They know why we want it. I truly think they are just trying to figure out a way to work out what may happen with the warranty issues, watermarking, or making it so that the bootloader isn't able to be set back to S-on once it's been set to S-off. They are trying to cover themselves somehow.
If they try to pull any shady stuff, and give us a half assed S-off, where we still didn't have full control of our phone, then I'm pretty sure there would be a massive uproar, and they know that. If they did something like that, I would imagine that at that point, a lot of people would really give up on HTC and move on to a manufacturer that isn't so deceptive.
nate420 said:
All of this is being discussed in the 5 other threads regarding s-off
Thanks for putting it all in one place?
3D > iClone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol, you really just can't hit the 'back' button and ignore a thread if you don't agree with it, huh? I find it comical.
HERE WE GO AGAIN
I have never said a negative comment on a thread but c'mon already!! stop cluttering the forum please! Did you really need to start ANOTHER thread on something you could have commented on a thread that was already there?
/endRANT
k2buckley said:
-1. I don't think they will implement that much control. I'm thinking that it'll be more along the lines of them using a watermark, or something like that. That way, once you unlock it, the system is marked as being unlocked, thus voiding software warranty (I would hope that certain hardware things, such as faulty power button, volume buttons, camera button, 2d/3d switch etc etc would still be covered). Also, I'd bet that they've designed a new hboot all together, which can be unlocked via 'fastboot oem unlock'. As I said, I believe that unlocking it will either 'stain' the system, or perhaps even not be relockable. Maybe they've designed an hboot that once unlocked, it can't be relocked, thus never being able to fully unroot.
I don't think that Sprint really cares too much about it. People always say that tethering has a lot to do with why carriers might not want people to root, but there are plenty of tethering apps that don't require root. ****, we can tether already, even without having S-off.
It's already a given that HTC will eventually close the current root exploit. It is potentially dangerous. Teamwin thought it was potentially dangerous, to the point that they notified HTC about it. Obviously they did that hoping and knowing that HTC would close the exploit. We don't need or want to be susceptible to malware, should developers with malicious intentions decide to write some apps that steal all sorts of personal info. If we have S-off, even if they closed the current exploits, we could still flash a ROM that was already rooted. I really don't see them impeding us from using a custom recovery or anything like that. The backlash they would receive from all of us would be nuts. That would be total deception, if they gave us S-off, but then stopped us from being able to do any of the things that we are looking to do with S-off. They know why we want it. I truly think they are just trying to figure out a way to work out what may happen with the warranty issues, watermarking, or making it so that the bootloader isn't able to be set back to S-on once it's been set to S-off. They are trying to cover themselves somehow.
If they try to pull any shady stuff, and give us a half assed S-off, where we still didn't have full control of our phone, then I'm pretty sure there would be a massive uproar, and they know that. If they did something like that, I would imagine that at that point, a lot of people would really give up on HTC and move on to a manufacturer that isn't so deceptive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 this makes more sense then them doing something shady. if they do their fb will blow up like none other i believe lol
@k2buckley
That was a well thought out response. thanks for the non-flame...
I would still disagree a little though. I really don't think they would put something out and then say the warranty is void. I am pretty sure there are legal ramifications for that. If they wanted to do it that way, they would just leak the solution and let people toast it and have NO liability.
In addition, HTC has already stated that the solution they will be providing WILL grant S-ON and S-OFF toggling. This leads me to believe that they will release it, and it will shortly thereafter LOCK. They will then tell people to contact their carrier as they are the ones who re-locked it.
I personally think the only way to prevent this will be to NOT take updates and to wait for a hacked S-OFF along with an ENG bootloader... and then never taking an OTA.
edufur said:
Not really. People are complaining about how long it will take, and there may be an occasional opinion spattered here and there. But I articulated several scenarios which are quite plausible. And the discussion does deserve to be in one place.
So... you're welcome?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No ALL of your theories are in the other threads along with a few other conspiracy theories including but not limited to:
The Russians are controlling the updates
Blame Canada?
The T1000 that was "killed" in terminator 2 came back and stole it
Ect. Ect.
k2buckley said:
lol, you really just can't hit the 'back' button and ignore a thread if you don't agree with it, huh? I find it comical.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No I can't not when its the same info in 4 to 9 threads all with "catchy" topic titles
3D > iClone
Zoidpilot said:
HERE WE GO AGAIN
I have never said a negative comment on a thread but c'mon already!! stop cluttering the forum please! Did you really need to start ANOTHER thread on something you could have commented on a thread that was already there?
/endRANT
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is actually YOUR post that is cluttering here. And the large PIC was even more clutter. There isn't a single post or reply that has made the case that I have made. This thread is about the case that I am making. Take your rant somewhere else please. Or go back and edit your post to just -1 (without the PIC clutter... seeing how you are against the clutter)
nate420 said:
No I can't not when its the same info in 4 to 9 threads all with "catchy" topic titles
3D > iClone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have yet to prove that. I am making a specific case. Link those posts here that make the same (thought out) case that I am making.
ckoadiyn said:
+1 this makes more sense then them doing something shady. if they do their fb will blow up like none other i believe lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People couldn't rightfully blow up the HTC wall if Sprint is responsible for a re-lock.
You have to remember... Sprint is more their customer than we are.
edufur said:
People couldn't rightfully blow up the HTC wall if Sprint is responsible for a re-lock.
You have to remember... Sprint is more their customer than we are.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is true but id think if sprint wanted it locked they would have told HTC no don't do that we don't want our customers to be able to unlock it. i mean all the OTA's to my understanding have to be approved by sprint and sprint has to check them first am i wrong here? that's what i understood was when we where all hitting up HTC about the gingerbread update for the
EVO.
edufur said:
You have yet to prove that. I am making a specific case. Link those posts here that make the same (thought out) case that I am making.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have a lot of reading to do...
And "thought out". If you think this is thought out... Then only god know what other thoughts fall out of your brain...
All of your *key* ideas have already been brought up...
Like I said good job putting it all in one page... But a little late to the debate
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1163223
3D > iClone
And who ever said there was a "delay"
Maybe they haven't started it or are trying to deal with the other 40 devices they sell... And all of there problems and complaints
Let alone the bugs in our phones and sensations... Jesus Christ I mean you expect HTC to just whip up a "update" for the bootloader when they have phones that are spazzing out and melting them selfs...
3D > iClone
All this stuff and I point it out...I.recieve a 3 point infraction and the threads removed I call horse sh*t bro. Once again another thread about something written a million times
nate420 said:
And who ever said there was a "delay"
Maybe they haven't started it or are trying to deal with the other 40 devices they sell... And all of there problems and complaints
Let alone the bugs in our phones and sensations... Jesus Christ I mean you expect HTC to just whip up a "update" for the bootloader when they have phones that are spazzing out and melting them selfs...
3D > iClone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
nate420 said:
You have a lot of reading to do...
And "thought out". If you think this is thought out... Then only god know what other thoughts fall out of your brain...
All of your *key* ideas have already been brought up...
Like I said good job putting it all in one page... But a little late to the debate
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1163223
3D > iClone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OMG... You went from "4 to 9" threads to ONE... And it doesn't even come close to covering the case that I am making. Item 1 in my case is PROVABLE.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
nate420 said:
No I can't not when its the same info in 4 to 9 threads all with "catchy" topic titles
3D > iClone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, I hear you. But there's really no way to stop someone from posting what they want to post. There is always some duplicate threads, always. I decided to post in this one, instead of the others. Was I supposed to search all of them, and see which one was posted first, and then reply in the first one? Hell no. This was the first one I saw (although I know there are more, but why would I want to find out which one was posted first, when I could just as easily reply to this one).
So although I agree with you that it can sometimes be annoying to have multiple threads about the same topic, I have pretty much come to accept that that is how it will always be. You can't control what other people are going to post on the internet, no matter how many facepalm pics people post in their threads. I see plenty of threads where I think to myself, "damn, I just ready a 32 page thread about the same topic, do I really need to click on this other one?" nah, I'll just pass it. Surely there isn't any info in this one that I didn't already read in the others. So yea, its just how it is. Especially in this forum, where it seems to be more hectic, hostile, and redundant than any other forum I've frequented, lol.
I think once people can start flashing roms and kernels, things will settle down. It's like a bunch of junkies in here, waiting for their next fix. Everyone is down eachothers throats. Idunno, in other forums, if two or more threads are 'accidentally' created with the same topic, the mods will usually merge the two threads together into one, to keep things more organized. That doesn't happen here. I think instead of everyone flaming and facepalming one another, that everyone should just report to a mod and they should merge the thread, quietly. So people wouldn't even know what happened. But that has never happens here on xda, so everyone just goes crazy flaming a newbie for posting a duplicate thread. Again, I agree..that if people would read up a bit before posting, they'd see that there is already a thread of similar nature for them to post in...but that's expecting a lot Things will eventually settle down.
Related
Hope I don't get flamed since almost every new thread does but I am hoping when HTC decides to allow root that its not like an ota that just makes it nice and easy for everyone to do it.
Maybe I'm selfish but i liked that my EVO 4G was special..and i feel like the "wow" factor will be lost if every Joe schmoe can just root...I'm wondering how HTC will implement the unlock..but i would prefer they just dropped the encryption and let the devs do the rest..99% of phones owners have no clue what rooting or flashing etc is...and i like it that way..
Sorry if this considered a waste of thread space.. bring on the "you mad?" And face palm pics
Nah we got too many threads with the pics I wont bring em. Yea I felt root made my EVO special. People who don't care wont ask for it.
phatmanxxl said:
Nah we got too many threads with the pics I wont bring em. Yea I felt root made my EVO special. People who don't care wont ask for it.
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Click to collapse
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@op. Most people don't want Su privilege or care to learn how to get it... Most people I talk to in real life only want root for better battery life... Yet don't know how get get root or use it. :/
3D > iClone
Yup same here
I think it would be awesome if everyone jumped on the ability to mod their phones the way we do. It would do wonders for HTC and Android.
Tapa tapa tapa
mlin said:
I think it would be awesome if everyone jumped on the ability to mod their phones the way we do. It would do wonders for HTC and Android.
Tapa tapa tapa
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
All those talented developers that don't even know they have it in them are waiting to be awoke....
3D > iClone
Heck, Palm Pre owners mostly didn't use it, and it CAME rooted, basically... I didn't know a single other person who actually installed patches or used wifi tether...
General public doesn't care.
firmbiz94 said:
Hope I don't get flamed since almost every new thread does but I am hoping when HTC decides to allow root that its not like an ota that just makes it nice and easy for everyone to do it.
Maybe I'm selfish but i liked that my EVO 4G was special..and i feel like the "wow" factor will be lost if every Joe schmoe can just root...I'm wondering how HTC will implement the unlock..but i would prefer they just dropped the encryption and let the devs do the rest..99% of phones owners have no clue what rooting or flashing etc is...and i like it that way..
Sorry if this considered a waste of thread space.. bring on the "you mad?" And face palm pics
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On one hand that sounds like the very honest sentiment of a nerd who doesn't like that his 'special thing' is about to become a lot less special since the plebes will have easy access to something you worked hard at....kinda...
...on one hand, I identify...on the otherhand that is selfish and a tad shallow. "Don't do what I do that makes me special, that's only for me!"....but I'm not insulting you, I'm being honest even though I feel exactly that same as you on the issue.
Now on the the more practical matter: You are correct sir. 99% of all phone owners have no idea what it is--and that will not change. It has not changed...okay, maybe it went from 99% to 98%, but, that's not too bad.
Those 98% have no business flashing roms, radios, modifying their framework, flashing a recovery...In this world people with a 3G phone who want 4G--the "clever ones" anyway--will try flashing a 4G radio to it to "upgrade it", people who want sense on a samsung will try to flash that...XDA will be flooded with idiocy and internet gangsters who start flamewars with us real geeks for being, well, real geeks and not telling them our secrets of how to upgrade an OG droid to a droid3...etc etc etc.
Luckily, most people are completely ignorant of the matter and even if you TRY to tell them more they. simply. don't. give. a. ****...and that's if you are lucky enough to even get them to understand it.
Don't worry OP...I've been a geek hacking at my hardware and software since I got my first computer in 1990 with a 1200 baud modem...and even in this age where the internet is in everybody's pocket (something we used to have to hack into university systems to get back then), where 1.2ghz dual core processors are in everyone's pocket (my first computer was 4.77mhz with 512k of ram and a 20mb hard drive the size of a netbook)....and video game consoles are more powerful than a supercomputer the size of arkansas would have been back them....even amongst this flood of technology EVERYWHERE these people still prefer to remain ignorant, even the ones that aren't complete retards.
Our secrets are safe, unfortunately.
I like our "secret club" even though we are a dis functional family..I used to love when ppl wouldbbe like i have an EVO too and then the saw the POwwA of mine
All the exposure of rooting phones / devices has been great for exposure of the potential of the Android system and has helped grab marketshare......However, if you pop over to the Nook forums you'll see a steady influx of people rooting their Nook Colors, flashing something wrong, then shouting from the rooftops "OMG my Nook is bricked!!!!"....all because they didn't know what they were doing & didn't take the time to read & learn about what they were doing in the first place. I'm afraid that is just the direction we're heading in and there is really no way to stop it.
firmbiz94 said:
I like our "secret club" even though we are a dis functional family..I used to love when ppl wouldbbe like i have an EVO too and then the saw the POwwA of mine
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I wouldn't worry about it. You could advertise it with a non-stop crawl on the bottom of the screen starting before american idol and have it run for 2 days straight, blinking red, advertising the benefits of what we do and we wouldn't even notice a difference around here.
...maybe in other forums, but def not the e3d section.
It is entertaining here. I returned mine a week ago and can't stay away.
hockeyfamily737 said:
All the exposure of rooting phones / devices has been great for exposure of the potential of the Android system and has helped grab marketshare......However, if you pop over to the Nook forums you'll see a steady influx of people rooting their Nook Colors, flashing something wrong, then shouting from the rooftops "OMG my Nook is bricked!!!!"....all because they didn't know what they were doing & didn't take the time to read & learn about what they were doing in the first place. I'm afraid that is just the direction we're heading in and there is really no way to stop it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And that's when I.believe we will run into trouble ..if they "give" us root and ppl f it up..even If they read the disclaimers they will raise unholy Hell to replace their "bricked" device..I think us.flashers are a small %...the amount of us that brick our phones is a small % of that..****..I would of have to actually try harder to brick my 4G than to flash something new..and even If i was successful there's always nandroid. Anyways I just worry I guess..I really enjoyed my experience with the 4G development..I wish it could be that way again..but HTC had to go and f that up.
hockeyfamily737 said:
All the exposure of rooting phones / devices has been great for exposure of the potential of the Android system and has helped grab marketshare......However, if you pop over to the Nook forums you'll see a steady influx of people rooting their Nook Colors, flashing something wrong, then shouting from the rooftops "OMG my Nook is bricked!!!!"....all because they didn't know what they were doing & didn't take the time to read & learn about what they were doing in the first place. I'm afraid that is just the direction we're heading in and there is really no way to stop it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is why you will not see a mass introduction of SU permissions made easy by HTC or Sprint. They know the impact this will make if they give every user out there that wants to flash ROM's or play with Kernel's, that they will end up with a massive payout of returns and loss of profits due to people ****ing up their phones because of their inability to actually learn. You can say your phone bricked itself right now when you flash ROMS and get a new phone without paying a deductible. If we know this, then don't think Sprint or HTC is ignorant enough to know that giving the masses complete control of their phones without some kind of watermark or time-stamp into their product, then they will lose out huge and potentially not be #1 anymore. The only S OFF you will see, is the S OFF were you will be marked like a 666 beast and given a choice to take a red pill or blue pill. It's your choice whether you travel down the rabbit hole.
When will this madness stop?
You guys dont seem to grasp the concept that HTC will NOT root your phone via an OTA. They are going to remove the encryption on the bootloader to allow us to get S-Off on the device and allow system writes to stick. It is not like you will automatically get S-Off and your device will be rooted when they release the OTA. If you do nothing your phone will be exactly the same.
I think everyone pretty much understands that HTC isn't going to magically root everyone's phones, however.......By the very nature of how public the discussion has become and by how very simple the actual rooting process has become SOME people who probably should not be rooting their phones will be. As I've said it's exactly what I've seen with the Nook...."Oh if I burn an SD card, I can have the Android market, cool!?!?"......"Oooops, now I have a blank screen, HELP IT'S BRICKED" Obviously many more people will go on oblivious to our fun, but a handfull who have half a clue will be flashing away without even knowing the risks & rewards of what they are doing.
fmedina2 said:
You guys dont seem to grasp the concept that HTC will NOT root your phone via an OTA. They are going to remove the encryption on the bootloader to allow us to get S-Off on the device and allow system writes to stick. It is not like you will automatically get S-Off and your device will be rooted when they release the OTA. If you do nothing your phone will be exactly the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This.
The update will probably be an OTA, transparent change where a normal end user notices nothing different (except any bug fixes that were expected in the release). The nerdlings or the "community" at XDA then makes it S-OFF, then flashes custom recovery, then custom ROM.
Point being, HTC won't give you an update that has CM with it
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
the evo is already one click rooted.. I don't see how that is so hard. People could root if they could figure it out. Most people won't like the evo 4g.
How many people will take the time out of their day to research what an ota update is for on their new 3vo. Not many.
Sent from my 3vo
I would like to add that most people that have an HTC phone don't visit the HTC Facebook page and/or Twitter page and have no idea about this whole bootloader encryption and what it does. The phone will NOT be rooted by the OTA. All they will do is release an unencrypted bootloader which will probably take a simple fastboot command 'fastboot oem unlock' for it to be unlocked and "s-off". Then install a custom recovery, a rooted Rom and presto you are rooted. This to most people is still too scary to even mess with and risk ****ing up their phone for. For us on here it is a whole different experience. Phones today are pretty much unbrickable unless flashing a radio and pulling the battery or not letting it complete in some way. Most people will give two ****s less about the OTA and we will still be "special".
Yeah, I'm not entering my name anywhere. Thanks anyway, HTC. Besides, AlphaRev and Unrevoked already did your job for you.
Since our last update, many of you have asked how the bootloader unlocking process will actually work, and in particular why HTC's most recently released devices still have a locked bootloader. Rest assured we're making progress toward our goal to roll out the first software updates in August to support unlocking for the global HTC Sensation, followed soon by the HTC Sensation 4G on T-Mobile and the HTC EVO 3D on Sprint. Because unlocking the bootloader provides extensive control over the device and modifications may cause operation, security and experience issues, new devices will continue to ship locked but will support user-initiated unlocking using a new Web-based tool.
So how will this work? The Web tool, which will launch this month, requires that you register an account with a valid e-mail address and accept legal disclaimers that unlocking may void all or parts of your warranty. Then plug in your phone to a computer with the Android SDK loaded to retrieve a device identifier token, which you can then enter into the Web tool to receive a unique unlock key via e-mail. Finally, apply the key to your device and unlocking will be initiated on your phone.
We're excited to bring bootloader unlocking to developers and enthusiasts, and we feel this new Web tool will meet your needs and continue to provide customers with the best experience. Thanks to the community for supporting these efforts!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
https://www.facebook.com/note.php?saved&¬e_id=10150305151453084&id=101063233083
I figured they would want a way to know exactly which phones were unlocked. i'll stick with alpha revs method.
From my mikmikoptimized shooter!
blackroseMD1 said:
Yeah, I'm not entering my name anywhere. Thanks anyway, HTC. Besides, AlphaRev and Unrevoked already did your job for you.
https://www.facebook.com/note.php?saved&¬e_id=10150305151453084&id=101063233083
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow. some actual clarity on what they plan to do.
nice to see an update !
but for the evo3d is a bit late
Lmao,actually according to their explanation,their method sounds just like AlpharevX.It would be hilarious if alpharevX sold their method to HTC.
That blows. They couldn't just ship the damn thing unlocked.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
ktulu909 said:
Lmao,actually according to their explanation,their method sounds just like AlpharevX.It would be hilarious if alpharevX sold their method to HTC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, if he did I hope he didn't sell them the serial numbers of the ones already unlocked jk
I guess it all makes sense (har har).
If it makes the carriers happy, who cares if this is how they do it? I'm sure whenever they release a bootloader unlocker someone on XDA will take it and make it so you can do it without the email/key. We're gonna come out ahead either way.
Well i guess now they will know when we unlock our bootloader and warranty I don't care since I don't use the warranty anyways
If you don't have an Evo3d well you don't have an Evo3d
I'd be curious to know from Google, Sprint and Samsung how many problems they have from the NexusS4G being very easily unlockable...I doubt it's very many...and HTC should suck on that.
I don't know if that's as much of a fair comparison - with the Nexus being near stock I wouldn't expect them to be flashed/bricked nearly as much as with the Evo4G.
The OG Evo gained so much from flashing - features, kernels, whole new versions of sense. And it had so many updates over the life of the phone, making for different rooting methods and having people flash their phones many many times, making it one of if not the most developed phone we have seen.
I'm quite certain the brick count on those were some of the highest anyone's ever seen as well. That's after all the returns from dead pixels, bad charging ports, and what have you. You can understand a carrier/manufacturer's wishing to prevent all that.
By the same token, it feels like HTC benefits greatly from the development community, perhaps using a lot of what they see here in their own updates (maybe even waiting for people to fix their bugs). They definitely see value in unlocking phones, which I guess we should be happy about.
As long as HTC keeps their unlocked policy I will remain a loyal customer.
nhutpham said:
I don't know if that's as much of a fair comparison - with the Nexus being near stock I wouldn't expect them to be flashed/bricked nearly as much as with the Evo4G.
The OG Evo gained so much from flashing - features, kernels, whole new versions of sense. And it had so many updates over the life of the phone, making for different rooting methods and having people flash their phones many many times, making it one of if not the most developed phone we have seen.
I'm quite certain the brick count on those were some of the highest anyone's ever seen as well. That's after all the returns from dead pixels, bad charging ports, and what have you. You can understand a carrier/manufacturer's wishing to prevent all that.
By the same token, it feels like HTC benefits greatly from the development community, perhaps using a lot of what they see here in their own updates (maybe even waiting for people to fix their bugs). They definitely see value in unlocking phones, which I guess we should be happy about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Were there that many bricked E4G's? I don't recall hearing about that many of them in my tenure on the forum...admittedly I barely spent any time in General that year as Development was bustling from before day 1.
...but, per capita I doubt the brick-count was that far off the average for any other popular phone worth rooting. God knows I did horrible things to mine and never even had to fix it via adb/fastboot.... it was a very popular phone even among the average joe.
I know that HTC benefits greatly from the dev community. Where do you think they got the FPS-unlock from? Among other things. That's how open source works and is designed to work. That's also why myself and others were so shocked with the whole 'locking' fiasco.
...now, aside from our own speculation about how high the brick rate may or may not have been why not speculate about something more productive: How LOW the brick rate could be if they utilized eMMC's secure-write technology to make a 'mega-recovery' partition that would be locked and even WE wouldn't want to unlock it....that could be used in a worst case scenario to fully restore a phone to stock...to enable the unlocking that WE want and reduce the (understandable) liability of allowing full control that they want. We get unlock, they get insulation from liability of allowing such a feature (that most people STILL wouldn't know about or care about)....why don't they do that? eMMC makes that trivial to implement (as we found out the hard way)...neglecting the fact that they could have utilized any number of simpler technologies to accomplish the same thing even before eMMC...why not?
That's a topic for further speculation (get your tinfoil hats ready), but, why don't they do that? Play both sides of the field. No voided warranties, no brick returns, no pissed off modders....win win win, right? The carrier doesn't want that? Cool, let us know, we'll flock to the carrier that allows it...something tells me Sprint would be that underdog...
ktulu909 said:
Lmao,actually according to their explanation,their method sounds just like AlpharevX.It would be hilarious if alpharevX sold their method to HTC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not at all like what AlphaRevX did. The only reason they had the serial number check was because it was in Beta so they could shut down their serial generator and stop people using their unlock if they found a problem with it.
This HTC method makes sense, and I think it's fair. Their tool only needs to hook up to your phone to get the device identifier token, the unlock actually happens on the phone itself. This way HTC gets a list of unlocked phones so when people go for support you can't lie to them that your phone was unlocked, but people can have day one unlocks on any phone from HTC going forward.
So now HTC wants to know who exactly is unlocking there phones??
Nice try you sneaky basterds
What's wrong with them knowing if you're unlocked? They have to do that... Otherwise insurance companies would get upset. This is legit and it if people screw their phones up due to user error while unlocked then they shouldn't be able to file a claim.
This also let's them see just how many people want to be unlocked so they don't try and take it away from us again
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App
Rippley05 said:
What's wrong with them knowing if you're unlocked? They have to do that... Otherwise insurance companies would get upset. This is legit and it if people screw their phones up due to user error while unlocked then they shouldn't be able to file a claim.
This also let's them see just how many people want to be unlocked so they don't try and take it away from us again
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah....I dunno. They could (relatively) easily make the phones nearly brick-proof (see my above post) yet they do not. Why? I'm almost irritated by all of the altruistic sentiment for 'doing the right thing'....not because of the altruism, I actually find that refreshing and endearing. It's more because they could take steps to nearly eliminate the potential for bricking (and in doing so insulate the insurance company from liability...making that a moot point), but that people are defending a position that needn't exist.
nhutpham said:
i guess it all makes sense (har har).
If it makes the carriers happy, who cares if this is how they do it? I'm sure whenever they release a bootloader unlocker someone on xda will take it and make it so you can do it without the email/key. We're gonna come out ahead either way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1000000000
Haha, sounds exactly how alpharev did it...hmm, maybe they tore it out of alpharevs hands, i dont know, sounds fishy.
daneurysm said:
yeah....I dunno. They could (relatively) easily make the phones nearly brick-proof (see my above post) yet they do not. Why? I'm almost irritated by all of the altruistic sentiment for 'doing the right thing'....not because of the altruism, I actually find that refreshing and endearing. It's more because they could take steps to nearly eliminate the potential for bricking (and in doing so insulate the insurance company from liability...making that a moot point), but that people are defending a position that needn't exist.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You don't know why they're doing it. Maybe they wanna track the people that abuse the crap out of wireless tether... Maybe it's for other reasons. Who cares, they are unlocking it for us and that's all that matters. I have nothing to hide when I root so I care less. If you're upset about it then there are other options.
People are getting exactly what they wanted and they still find a reason to cry... Get over it already
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App
Certain parties are making false claims, which are obvious to anyone with a detailed background. These claims extend far from just their "developments".
Picture of a hboot flashing an RUU is nothing special.
Picture of a hboot showing the CRC screen is nothing special.
These are things anyone can do, and mean squat.
Pulling a system/hboot off a s-off rezound will do nothing, all the ones that showed up had radio s-off already. The eng hboot I acquired as not signed, thus useless without radio. Same with custom patched hboots. Because without radio s-off the hboot gets signature checked, and unsigned/custom ones fail the check.
You can not flash recovery/kernel without s-off, as they will fail the secondary signature check by the hboot.
My advice is simply hold on to your money, DON'T give any donations until there is some actual work is released.
Protip: If a person spouts racial/homophobic slurs, they likely don't know squat about squat.
If you have any questions regarding any of this, or claims made by anyone just ask. (If I don't respond please give me a ping in PM, I often forget about forums).
jcase said:
Certain parties are making false claims, which are obvious to anyone with a detailed background. These claims extend far from just their "developments".
Picture of a hboot flashing an RUU is nothing special.
Picture of a hboot showing the CRC screen is nothing special.
These are things anyone can do, and mean squat.
Pulling a system/hboot off a s-off rezound will do nothing, all the ones that showed up had radio s-off already. The eng hboot I acquired as not signed, thus useless without radio. Same with custom patched hboots. Because without radio s-off the hboot gets signature checked, and unsigned/custom ones fail the check.
You can not flash recovery/kernel without s-off, as they will fail the secondary signature check by the hboot.
My advice is simply hold on to your money, DON'T give any donations until there is some actual work is released.
Protip: If a person spouts racial/homophobic slurs, they likely don't know squat about squat.
If you have any questions regarding any of this, or claims made by anyone just ask. (If I don't respond please give me a ping in PM, I often forget about forums).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I disagree with the majority of your post. I believe these developments are important and things are moving in the right direction. Slurs aren't a good thing, but that doesn't mean that the person saying them is ignorant. Yes, they might be ignorant in the way they present themselves, but not in other, unrelated ways. The things about stuff being signed is true, I agree with that though.
Protip???
What about the possibility that they are just a REALLY smart racist homophobe?
con247 said:
I disagree with the majority of your post. I believe these developments are important and things are moving in the right direction. Slurs aren't a good thing, but that doesn't mean that the person saying them is ignorant. Yes, they might be ignorant in the way they present themselves, but not in other, unrelated ways. The things about stuff being signed is true, I agree with that though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The majority of my post is straight up fact, and not opinion.
Please tell me what you disagree about, and I will explain it in depth.
BBEgo said:
What about the possibility that they are just a REALLY smart racist homophobe?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was taken into consideration, but after in depth conversations it was ruled out.
jcase said:
Certain parties are making false claims, which are obvious to anyone with a detailed background. These claims extend far from just their "developments".
Picture of a hboot flashing an RUU is nothing special.
Picture of a hboot showing the CRC screen is nothing special.
These are things anyone can do, and mean squat.
Pulling a system/hboot off a s-off rezound will do nothing, all the ones that showed up had radio s-off already. The eng hboot I acquired as not signed, thus useless without radio. Same with custom patched hboots. Because without radio s-off the hboot gets signature checked, and unsigned/custom ones fail the check.
You can not flash recovery/kernel without s-off, as they will fail the secondary signature check by the hboot.
My advice is simply hold on to your money, DON'T give any donations until there is some actual work is released.
Protip: If a person spouts racial/homophobic slurs, they likely don't know squat about squat.
If you have any questions regarding any of this, or claims made by anyone just ask. (If I don't respond please give me a ping in PM, I often forget about forums).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 I totally agree with this post.
I really don't see how people are so quick to jump on the devils (dev) wagon. It is already quite apparent that the dev in question totally lied to everyone in this forum from day one. I'll believe it when I see it. Until then, it doesn't mean squat.
So you basically are saying that this individual is a load of crap and just trying to milk it? It's obvious of whom you are referring, but I won't go there because there are so many troll/hate threads already .
zetsumeikuro said:
So you basically are saying that this individual is a load of crap and just trying to milk it? It's obvious of whom you are referring, but I won't go there because there are so many troll/hate threads already .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't name anyone, and while my post was inspired by a couple people (no not just one, and not just on the Rezound), it applies across the board.
jcase said:
I didn't name anyone, and while my post was inspired by a couple people (no not just one, and not just on the Rezound), it applies across the board.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah alight, I just assumed since there has been too much of that lately here. In the end I just hope everyone gets S-Off with as little drama/troll as possible.
Jcase knows more about root,s-off,and h-boot than anyone else I've come across. I came from the Eris forum and have seen jcase and TeamAndIRC's work first had. Just look up some of the development stuff he has done across multiple forums. Then tell him you disagree with him(doesn't know what hes talking about)!
LOL, you all do realize who Jcase is right? You can tell him you disagree with his post, but that doesn't make him incorrect. He knows more about root than you all probably ever will. I'm hopeful for an exploit that will actually work and get it S-OFF as well, but damn if he isn't right.
Haha jcase schooled me on a friendly hacking bet on irc.
I think what jcase is saying is there is no credible evidence that the parties working on this are on to anything. I agree with him.
People have been doing this for a while now. They read a random tweet or a forum post and report here that soff will be achieved in a day or so and then massive disappointment follows. There is nothing wrong with being optimistic but i caution people starting threads announcing success with no evidence to back it up
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Everyone just needs to chill the fawk out. End of story. When we get s-off, we get s-off. Until then, just deal with it or move on.
So far all the "development" I've seen on an S-off method has been a bunch of kids combing through image dumps byte by byte in a hex editor. Anyone in the world who wants to can do this if they have time, and if they know how to extract the data from the raw partitions, as we have temp root.
It honestly doesn't impress me. It's the worst sort of brute force method, it's manual, it's time consuming, and it's frankly old fashioned. I was doing this 25 years ago to crack copy protection on C64 games.
Do we have any real development going on, or is this what we're relying on to reverse engineer the signature keys?
I am guessing this is in response to a certain someone saying that he unlocked the rezound last night.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW using XDA App
So he SAYS. Waiting for a picture that shows - unlocked, s-off, and clockwork recovery mod.
Sent from my Galaxy Tab 10.1
Thanks for the info jcase. Threads like the one posted earlier get me irritated.
"Hey guys we could have S-OFF soon, but don't ask me any questions, don't ask when it's gonna be released, and don't ask any other information regarding who or how. Oh, BTW don't start flaming each other."
A certain someone had stated we would have S-OFF on or shortly after thanksgiving. I'm always skeptical of claims w/o evidence, but I did grant trust tentatively. This time, I'm not gonna believe it until I see it.
Everyone needs to just relax and enjoy the phone as is. If you can't live w/o a rooted phone, I suggest returning it and buying one that already has a root method available.
danutzz said:
Everyone needs to just relax and enjoy the phone as is. If you can't live w/o a rooted phone, I suggest returning it and buying one that already has a root method available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed.
I bought it knowing what I was getting into. Brand new phone, S-Off weeks or months off. Since I'd been running Sense 3.5 on my Incredible I knew I could deal with it un-rooted for a while.
Memories
punman said:
So far all the "development" I've seen on an S-off method has been a bunch of kids combing through image dumps byte by byte in a hex editor. Anyone in the world who wants to can do this if they have time, and if they know how to extract the data from the raw partitions, as we have temp root.
It honestly doesn't impress me. It's the worst sort of brute force method, it's manual, it's time consuming, and it's frankly old fashioned. I was doing this 25 years ago to crack copy protection on C64 games.
Do we have any real development going on, or is this what we're relying on to reverse engineer the signature keys?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Off Topic, but I used to do the same thing with the protection of C64 games, so you brought back some memories .
Then I got a Commodore Plus 4, which used cartridges, and got my first taste of Infocom games. But those were my beginning days of hex editing Thanks for the throw back.
jcase said:
Certain parties are making false claims, which are obvious to anyone with a detailed background. These claims extend far from just their "developments".
Picture of a hboot flashing an RUU is nothing special.
Picture of a hboot showing the CRC screen is nothing special.
These are things anyone can do, and mean squat.
Pulling a system/hboot off a s-off rezound will do nothing, all the ones that showed up had radio s-off already. The eng hboot I acquired as not signed, thus useless without radio. Same with custom patched hboots. Because without radio s-off the hboot gets signature checked, and unsigned/custom ones fail the check.
You can not flash recovery/kernel without s-off, as they will fail the secondary signature check by the hboot.
My advice is simply hold on to your money, DON'T give any donations until there is some actual work is released.
Protip: If a person spouts racial/homophobic slurs, they likely don't know squat about squat.
If you have any questions regarding any of this, or claims made by anyone just ask. (If I don't respond please give me a ping in PM, I often forget about forums).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I can't speak to the technical aspects of your post, as I've told you before in IRC, etc., my thought is that if he does have S-Off/Root, he's 1) Not going to show/tell anyone how he did it until the Method is tested and released to the public so that no one else "steals the ball" and gets to it before him. Any Dev would not rush the release of this to the public because they don't want to be responsible for bricking 1,000's of phones
I wholeheartedly agree that no one should donate until the Root method is released and the Dev/Team responsible proves it.
Let's just let this all play out, and once S-Off is released to the public (no matter who does it), we can take assessment of the situation at that point if you want to, no need to jump the gun and assume that we have S-Off nor should we assume that certain Dev/Teams are full of bull poop.
Honestly, I probably won't give a rat's arse who's telling the truth or whatever... I will be too busy Flashing ROMs on my Rezound!
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
All work and no play makes jack a dull boy.
So sad to what this forum has become. This used to be where everyone posted their work sharing or not, so others could benefit from it....closed or enclosed. A place to make our machines the best they can be, to the point where if you mentioned this name or that name or mention this mod or that mod you will get banned. Simply terrible!!!! Now if you read my posts and see I hardly say anything and ive been here for a while. I've gotten to the point that this site is not much fun anymore. Example.... If a bunch of people want to post there home screens on a dev page, let them post it. It's tribute to the dev and no harm is done. Plus others can learn by actually learn by seeing there home screens. I'm just trying to bring back the actualization why we are all here in the first place....to learn... To contribute... To benefit, and make our pieces of machinery the best they cab be.
So in all, this community needs to be best and a top notch better then the rest. Keep pushing mods away and we will become second to none. I got enough off my chest. Good night...... Good fight.
Love all....
Sent from my PG86100 xda app-developers app
Comments withdrawn
I agree it's sad we have to watch what we say and can't share all of our work because of petty drama. But it is what it is. Kinda feels like the Apple/Google patent trolling. Just wish people would be mature and let better things improve our experience for everyone, but I know that's a utopia and won't happen. I also know there's more to it than that. I don't want to add fuel... But yes, I do wish that whole thing played out differently.
But I don't think home screen posts should flood a dev thread. It's annoying as it is having to sift through dozens of the same questions that are answered in the op. When I look at a rom or kernel or mod thread, I want to know the progress, the bugs, user experiences, and the direction of development. Not how people are laying out their widgets and apps. Not that so and so is drunk and wants to say what's up, although sometimes those can be entertaining. Not little chit chat of members catching up because they hadn't talked in a while. It's going to happen regardless of what I want... But I can dream. Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting these things be prohibited... Just sharing my views on the matter.
Sent from my PG86100 using xda app-developers app
Just don't contribute here, simple as that.
There are other places with a lot of people you already know.
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
pstevep said:
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, what about the ILLEGAL PRL, and WiFi tether? Is that not warez?
Sent from my Kindle Fire using xda premium
Volumes said:
Again, what about the ILLEGAL PRL, and WiFi tether? Is that not warez?
Sent from my Kindle Fire using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We can't control what Prl you flash. It's also not the greatest idea in general. The site has numerous carriers, if you choose to flash something that is not meant for your carrier that's up to you.
All carriers have things in place to stop people from tethering and using other prls. They can stop it if they want. If they hit us with a c&d we would block it all, however wifi tether apps are on the play store. Kernels are governed by a specific law the gpl, we require that is complied with. Technically you can say that rooting your phone shouldn't be allowed since the carriers don't want that either. Wrong battle to fight.
pstevep said:
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just wanted to thank you for this explaination of why they are considered "warez" on XDA. It's not because they are actually "warez" or illegal as some seem unwilling to stop publically claiming, but rather because XDA and he have mutually decided that they are not for XDA. Altough I don't understand why if something is found elsewhere that works for some it cannot be discussed. I understand not linking, but discussing. Altough, I guess it just leads to flame wars and is best not talked about at all. Thanks pstevep!
pstevep said:
We can't control what Prl you flash. It's also not the greatest idea in general. The site has numerous carriers, if you choose to flash something that is not meant for your carrier that's up to you.
All carriers have things in place to stop people from tethering and using other prls. They can stop it if they want. If they hit us with a c&d we would block it all, however wifi tether apps are on the play store. Kernels are governed by a specific law the gpl, we require that is complied with. Technically you can say that rooting your phone shouldn't be allowed since the carriers don't want that either. Wrong battle to fight.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But you can supply it, so its illegal to do drugs but, you supply them?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Volumes said:
But you can supply it, so its illegal to do drugs but, you supply them?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not illegal. The things you mentioned are not illegal.
Yeah without all the drama here I've become bored with this place.
Volumes said:
But you can supply it, so its illegal to do drugs but, you supply them?
Sent from my PG86100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Man...there is no LAW that says that rooting your phone or using wireless tether is against the law. GPL is based on copyright law so it is a law that has to be followed.
Rooting your phone and using wireless tether might be against your contract with your carrier but there is NO LAW that says you cannot do it.
I've changed my signature to reflect my feelings on the subject
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why can't people just understand:
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what is the point of flaming mods for doing what they need to do to keep order?
Lead by example
I'm sorry, but your definition is incorrect
— n
informal illegally copied computer software which has had its protection codes de-activated (Dictionary DOT com)
You're upsetting people by using terminology that already exists to wrongfully describe someone. You CAN NOT change the dictionary. You CAN NOT say that someone who is black that is actually white
you want this to stop. stop saying things like that. When a cop faces a near rioting crowd, the last thing he should do is beat one with his flashlight to push everyone over the limit and start rioting. your problem may not have started with the mods, but it's being perpetuated by their poor handling. *including this quoted post*
you must conduct yourself in an acceptable manner even in the face of adversity. If you're a moderator, you should be held to a higher standard and people all around the web complain about XDA's moderators the most ~ wonder why.
pstevep said:
What I love most is the fact that everyone wants to complain about rules, how much drama there is and how much fun they aren't having.
You want to know how much "fun" I've had in the past 8 months? No you don't because you don't really care.
Devs decide how much off topic to allow in their threads. If the dev wants the thread to be strictly development that's where it stands. We have share your home screen threads so you can show off your home screen. Not all developers want to see it.
Drama concerning users that aren't on this site. I personally tried to get everyone cooperating before all of the drama happened. We have rules, just like other sites have rules. This Site and that dev parted ways, and came to an agreement that his stuff was not to be used or linked here and his name was to be erased from the site and not to be mentioned. Because his work is not to be used here and we want no ties with him that makes his kernels warez.
Everything was fine for about a month, but I guess that was before source was released. There are other kernel devs out there but they won't post because the users in this forum bring so much trash into threads. I know at least 2 other people in this forum that are working on kernels, none of which have any threads for their work.
But does it matter? No. Because everyone is stuck on the second coming of a dev that won't/can't come back.
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FIR3STARTER said:
I'm sorry, but your definition is incorrect
— n
informal illegally copied computer software which has had its protection codes de-activated (Dictionary DOT com)
You're upsetting people by using terminology that already exists to wrongfully describe someone. You CAN NOT change the dictionary. You CAN NOT say that someone who is black that is actually white
you want this to stop. stop saying things like that. When a cop faces a near rioting crowd, the last thing he should do is beat one with his flashlight to push everyone over the limit and start rioting. your problem may not have started with the mods, but it's being perpetuated by their poor handling. *including this quoted post*
you must conduct yourself in an acceptable manner even in the face of adversity. If you're a moderator, you should be held to a higher standard and people all around the web complain about XDA's moderators the most ~ wonder why.
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That almost made a point.
Except.
It states that it's warez, which is slang (as notated in your definition by "informal"). And in this instance means not allowed on this site.
Really? You don't want to argue semantics with me, it's not worth it to either of us.
This site is fine. It's the users ruining it. Not reading rules, not abiding by them or arguing them in inappropriate ways (this thread for example) . I've been to plenty of sub forums in this site where things are fine.
I think everyone is expecting this to be picture perfect when it never will be. There will always be someone doing something they shouldn't and whether people do things they should or should not do in response to it determines how these forums are viewed. :beer:
Sent from my A100 using Tapatalk 2
I really hate to jump into this topic as I have been trying really hard to ignore it but it just keeps popping up. So here is my 2 cents.
XDA-Developers is a PRIVATELY OWNED Site. The rules they have or want to impose on people that use this site are up to them. When they make a decision to enforce a rule, good or bad, It stands.
From all my years of browsing forums, One thing stands out among all comunities.
That people think this little corner of the internet is a Democracy.
It is in fact not, It is more of an Autocracy.
To all you homeowners out there or people that can relate to owning property or personal space, How would you feel if someone marched onto your property and tried to tell you what to do, how to do it, and what rules you should have on YOUR property? That wouldn't fly im sure.
The government tells you what you can or cant do with your property, you make decisions about your property as long as its legal and the government tells you its OK.
Joe Crackhead walking by on the street has no right or ability to tell you what to do with any aspect of your property, nor force his opinion on you on what he "thinks" is the best way.
Bottom line is this is the house of XDA, and the owner says what goes.
So please, for the love of god just follow whatever rules they impose, no matter how stupid you may think they are, and go about your daily business. In all actuality you have absolutely no right to ***** and moan about anything the higher ups have to say about squat.
Let the rants and pissing and moaning stop. If you don't like what is going on take it to the source, feel free to contact the owner of the site or the admins directly with your issues. Hell, start a damn petition. But whatever you do just do it off of their private property that they allow you to use before they revoke that "right" you think you have.
IRL you cant even protest on private property, why does anyone think this is any different?
This isn't aimed at anyone or any group specific, Its just aimed at the general population that thinks this is some kind of public property owned by all.
Leave the MODS out of it as they are just following orders from people that tell them what to do. They are in a lose lose situation as if they don't do what they are told they catch **** from the owner/admins and if they do they catch **** from the community.
Do I think the MODS sometimes should handle things in a different way? YES
But guess what? They DON'T have to, and thats not up to me or you to even have an opinion about.
Believe me the people they are answering to are not the community. They explain things that happen out of courtesy.
Get it out of your heads that any of you have any "rights" on this or any other message board and
please, please, please
LET IT DIE
As for the warez argument, warez is software that is shared without permission.
Im not going to get into the "legal or illegal" argument. See my explanation on this website is Privately owned.
If the government says its not illegal great,
If XDA says its illegal then it is illegal on this board.
Government > XDA > You
that's the decision making process here on XDA, simplified of coarse
XDA says no sharing of that software
whats his name says no sharing of that software on XDA
They agree, why cant you?
This is the first and will be the last time you will hear from me about this topic, It is common sense that you all should know.
Wow somebody ban this guy
I don't say a whole lot on these forums, but I'm in them everyday. I've been on xda far longer than most that post in this, or any other thread. I have to say the flaming has gotten to epic proportions, and it was inevitable that the ban hammer was going to fall sooner or later. Xda used to be the "go-to" site for all devs to show their craft. The adoption rate of android has finally caught up with this place and the maturity has plummeted, thus creating a graveyard of devs in its wake. People complain about the mods in the same manner they complain about the police. Without the police, the "kids" would run this place even worse and drive all the talent away. Posting in here shouldn't be a e-pene measuring contest, it should be for the reason we are all here, to live on the cutting edge of software and squeeze everything we can out of our phones.
Boom goes the dynamite
I see in the forum that a root solution had been achieved but the root bounty is still unclaimed because the devs think their solution is too difficult. I do not know enough about this to understand the obstacles. Can anyone give an educated guess as to if or when an easy root solution might arise? I personally like to run a stock/rooted ROM.
My answer = tomorrow
When tomorrow comes, answer = tomorrow
Why do people keep asking for etas? It'll come out when it comes out.... Wait patiently
If you want a rootable phone, get a nexus (or the HTC unlocked bootloader phone)
Root will be released when it's released. Not trying to sound like a douche, but that is honestly the best and only answer that can be given.
The thing about root is this...
-Just because it's been achieved, does not mean it will be shared. There is a lot of time and effort that is put into this type of thing. Not to mention the shear amount of risk that is involved as well. A developer may end up going through several devices while trying to gain root access. This can be VERY costly.
-Then there are the annoyances as well... People consistently asking when it will happen or when it will be released. It's not that these people are intentionally being annoying or trying to be... But when you are one of a few who have accomplished something and then have hundreds if not thousands of people asking for it. It's like having that last slice of pizza, no more is coming, ever, and the entire party is asking you to share it. That one slice isn't gonna feed everyone. (Bad analogy, but whatever)
-The bounty hasn't been claimed for 1 main reason that was mentioned... It's not as dummy proof as it can be. (This of course was ad-libed a bit) ... If I had to speculate, I would guess on 2 other reasons as well... 1, the bounty doesn't meet the cost put in. 2, the flood of private messages to the developers just isn't worth it yet. Again, those last 2 are my own speculation.
I'm sorry for the long post, but it was to offer a bit of insight to others that may stop in here as well.
TL;DR - The devs will release it when they are ready...If they are ever ready. This phone is still BRAND NEW, so let them work out some of the kinks in the process to ensure they don't brick hundreds or thousands of devices... It only take on line of bad code to ruin the whole thing. Be patient.
Hi TAG- I am in no hurry and do not mind waiting. Just want to know that it will be done eventually! Thanks.
Sent from my K00C using Tapatalk
Nah. It won't arrive, buy the HTC 10.
nobnut said:
Nah. It won't arrive, buy the HTC 10.
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This is the G5 forums. Please refrain from promoting other devices in these threads. Also please refrain from giving an answer you do not know to be true.
paperWastage said:
My answer = tomorrow
When tomorrow comes, answer = tomorrow
Why do people keep asking for etas? It'll come out when it comes out.... Wait patiently
If you want a rootable phone, get a nexus (or the HTC unlocked bootloader phone)
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I did not ask for an ETA. Initially people were saying there might not be root because of ocked boot loader. Now we kinda have root. As I said I don't know the technicalities of what Id holding it back and therefore do not know how big an problem it is. Just trying to get a handle on the feasibility of it. I have another week to return the phone. Seems like a lot of folks in as a these days just live to criticize and insult. The threads are full of it. Even if you had to object to my post you could have been kinder about it. The purpose of this community is for us to help each other.
marcmarshall said:
I did not ask for an ETA. Initially people were saying there might not be root because I'd locked boot loader. Now we kinda have root. Add I said I don't know the technicalities of what I'd holding it back and therefore do not know how big an problem it is. Just trying to get a handle on it. Send like a lot of folks in as a these days just live to criticize and insult. The threads are full of it. Even if you had to object to my post you could have been kinder about it. The purpose of this community is for us to help each other.
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H850 (UK) is getting BL unlock by the end of April.
That name for the thread and thread itself is prob in top 5 most useless threads created, my dear friend.
marcmarshall said:
I did not ask for an ETA. Initially people were saying there might not be root because I'd locked boot loader. Now we kinda have root. Add I said I don't know the technicalities of what I'd holding it back and therefore do not know how big an problem it is. Just trying to get a handle on it.
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people who know how close we are..... are the people who are working on it
which means you are asking for an ETA
Send like a lot of folks in as a these days just live to criticize and insult. The threads are full of it. Even if you had to object to my post you could have been kinder about it. The purpose of this community is for us to help each other.
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how is my post rude?
as other people have pointed out, these threads are useless...
First I apologize for the errors. I use Swype and auto complete is my worst enema. If you do not understand why I felt insulted you are not thinking very much.