Im looking into the different tab options out there currently. I've used ipad2 extensively at work and the device is very "nice" but so typically apple in its predictive samey apple experience im after something a little more exiciting . (I.e cyanogen on an awesome tablet! )
Im interested to know what members in the Samsung tab section of XDA have to say.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
16GB $389 ($429 - $40 instant rebate) at Costco plus you get a free OEM Samsung Pouch. Just picked one up today.
Buy Galaxy Tab 10.1
Yes! I recommend if you crave for all the excitement of rooting and playing around with the tablet as you mentioned the CM9 developments of the ICS for the GT P7500/7510 are pretty exciting...... Beware though that this can be addicting,, waiting each night for some thing more
SS
If you can wait, wait till the MWC which is happening this month end. As per the rumors Samsung will unveil the new version of this tab. So the current tab will get a price cut or you can opt for the new version.
No
Just say NO to locked hardware.
Don't listen to people who tell you to relax and that you can still do x,y,z,
Samsung won't let you do 1,2,3.
With unlocked hardware you can take risks and recover.
More people willing to take risks means a larger dev community.
A larger dev community is good for you.
With unlocked hardware you can actually own what you paid for.
The same people who will tell you to relax and accept limited ownership will themselves admit that if they sold an unlocked tablet on ebay they would ask for more money and advertise the fact that it's unlocked. This means that when Samsung OTA locked all of those unlocked tablets they actually took something of monetary value -and didn't even try to justify it. Asus customers raised up a storm and at least got a promise. Samsung got a pass...I think a little of that is that people already bought the tab and no one wants to feel like a chump.
My advice is to wait and see on Asus' promise of unlocking the Prime. In the meantime don't encourage bad behavior by buying a Samsung product.
rlarkin said:
Just say NO to locked hardware.
Don't listen to people who tell you to relax and that you can still do x,y,z,
Samsung won't let you do 1,2,3.
With unlocked hardware you can take risks and recover.
More people willing to take risks means a larger dev community.
A larger dev community is good for you.
With unlocked hardware you can actually own what you paid for.
The same people who will tell you to relax and accept limited ownership will themselves admit that if they sold an unlocked tablet on ebay they would ask for more money and advertise the fact that it's unlocked. This means that when Samsung OTA locked all of those unlocked tablets they actually took something of monetary value -and didn't even try to justify it. Asus customers raised up a storm and at least got a promise. Samsung got a pass...I think a little of that is that people already bought the tab and no one wants to feel like a chump.
My advice is to wait and see on Asus' promise of unlocking the Prime. In the meantime don't encourage bad behavior by buying a Samsung product.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
do you mean locked = unrooted or locked = stuck with a provider?
Anyway, rooting the device is pretty easy and, if you can't do it, you should stay away from custom rom (and anything android, for that matter)
When it's rooted, well, the fun starts! Samsung provide very good hardware and the latest price cut is realy apealing! I got mine 2 weeks ago for 399$ can, for all it gives, it's pretty descent! IMHO, the quality to price ratio is pretty much the best!
But if you can wait after the annoucement for the new thing, you should get it for even less!
I also recommend you the Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1, i have mine till 2 weeks and i loooooove it !
Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk
Cm9 kang. OC'ed. Wicked OEM Samsung book cover case. This is no apple.
ninjalandpirate said:
Im looking into the different tab options out there currently. I've used ipad2 extensively at work and the device is very "nice" but so typically apple in its predictive samey apple experience im after something a little more exiciting . (I.e cyanogen on an awesome tablet! )
Im interested to know what members in the Samsung tab section of XDA have to say.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 is what u need
t1mman said:
do you mean locked = unrooted or locked = stuck with a provider?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unbelievable. I mean I don't believe you. You must know I meant neither. Or are you saying you aren't aware that Samsung sold unlocked galaxy tablets then locked them OTA? Or that you don't understand what is meant here?
With unlocked hardware you can take risks and recover.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We've gone from locking down phones to locking down general purpose devices that are analogous to laptops. No one would currently tolerate a laptop that can't flash BIOS or uses encryption to permanently lock you in to an OS, but that is exactly where we will be if people apathetically/sheepishly accept this. Any device with a locked bootloader should be rejected generally, and more specifically buying this tablet rewards unethical behavior (permanently and irrevocably locking people out of their own property months after purchase).
I stand by my recommendation. Wait and see if Asus follows through and delivers an unlock tool and if they do, get a Prime. Myself, I'm dumping this on some chump at ebay and getting a tablet I can own 100% instead of 90%.
rlarkin said:
Unbelievable. I mean I don't believe you. You must know I meant neither. Or are you saying you aren't aware that Samsung sold unlocked galaxy tablets then locked them OTA? Or that you don't understand what is meant here?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand squat from what you're trying to tell here...
What exactly do you mean by "locked"?
Most tablets, PDA's and the likes comes pre-loaded with an OS, even netbook or notebook for that matters, even worst for apple's device, wich are "locked" in more ways than anything.
As for Galaxy's, you can put about everything you want with either Odin or with the SDK tools, how is the device "locked" and how is any other (like Asus') are less locked...
It is the same for any PC's, you need special tools to flash the bios, same as you need Odin to flash a bootloader. You can root the OS and be "unlocked" everywhere on the OS layer, open a terminal emulator and do about anything that can be done to a device running an U/X kernel (or the likes)
So, again, how is the Galaxy Tab locked?
The boot loader is locked, keeping him from doing specific things. That we can put various android ROMs on it while still having the locked boot loader is not the issue.
As I understand it people with locked boot loaders cannot use nvflash and must either odin or cwm flash things; believe it or not that does in fact limit things that you can flash. Specifically what I can't say for certain because it's not something of interest to me and obviously not of interest to you either otherwise you'd have uncovered this limitation as well.
Like me, most people looking to flash custom builds on the tab are looking for android based builds like CM9 which are obviously doable on the otherwise locked tab. Rlarkin's point is valid but based on the amount of activity here in the development forum I'd venture to guess he's in the minority as he has needs that go beyond many of those who purchase the device.
We're all free to voice our opinions, it's up the the OP to decide whether or not the locked boot loader is an issue. For most of us it's not.
t1mman said:
I understand squat from what you're trying to tell here...
What exactly do you mean by "locked"?
Most tablets, PDA's and the likes comes pre-loaded with an OS, even netbook or notebook for that matters, even worst for apple's device, wich are "locked" in more ways than anything.
As for Galaxy's, you can put about everything you want with either Odin or with the SDK tools, how is the device "locked" and how is any other (like Asus') are less locked...
It is the same for any PC's, you need special tools to flash the bios, same as you need Odin to flash a bootloader. You can root the OS and be "unlocked" everywhere on the OS layer, open a terminal emulator and do about anything that can be done to a device running an U/X kernel (or the likes)
So, again, how is the Galaxy Tab locked?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, after reading about your so called "locked", how is it relevant to the OP?
The bootloader lock seems to affect only a small fraction of the users, IE: The one that wants imperatively to use NVFlash instead of Odin. Most of the users will do whatever they want with the stock tab, a fraction of the users will flash custom roms, on that fraction, only another small fraction will use tools like Odin, SDKs and more advanced tools, on that fraction, only another small fraction will "need" NVflash.
To conclude, you shouldn't base your recomendation on what YOU need, but rather on what the person asking the question needs. So, if the OP wants to flash using NvFlash, then he shouldn't buy this device. But if you want custom roms, CM9 or many other things that doesn't require this specific tool, well, IMHO, it's a pretty nice device!
I just got my galaxy tab yesterday after returning my transformer prime and am very happy with it. Already rooted it and have romans build on it it runs amazing.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
With a locked boot loader, if you make the wrong mistake, you . are . done . Brick.
With an unlocked bootloader you can recover. What's that worth to you? How many potential devs don't try something because of the risk involved? What's that mean to you (someone not really interested in development)? It means less cool stuff for you.
With a locked boot loader you can basically achieve "root" and be able to install applications like sshd or anyconnect that *should already work anyway*. By that I mean no one should have to jump through a single hoop to get something so basic as ssh or a vpn client to work on a device like this, this is *not* a phone.
But you can't (way too risky to even think about) repartition, have true dual boot, or experiment with many other things.
So I don't think I'm being selfish in my recommendation. Unlocked bootloaders mean more devs that are able to do more things for *you*. Supporting vendors that sell locked hardware hurts everyone in the end, you included. As I said in my original post, would you buy a laptop that via encryption locks you in solidly to one OS? I don't think anyone would today, but that's where we'll all be eventually if people continue to tolerate this. I mean why should the existence of a touch screen make it okay to lock me out of my own tablet? It shouldn't.
Really a tegra3 + unlocked -GPS vs tegra2 + locked is a no brainer in my opinion. The OP will have more options with the Prime.
I would really not recommend the prime many ppl including me are and were having major problems with it. the wifi is completely screwed up in it, and unless u can solder and take it apart I recommend not wasting ur money I had it 10 days don't get me wrong its a great piece of equipment actually its unbelievable but the wifi, GPS, and Bluetooth drivers and hardware are not there it really is a shame.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
I wouldn't recommend the tab 10.1 for your case
I'm using it now. It feels just langgy.
I love android, I have sgs2 as my phone and the sgs2 is way smoother.
But the same couldn't be said for the tab10.1.
Its actually just a big LG optimus 2x, the same lausy processor.
Lots of games lags.
After I flash to overcome rom, things improved, but still slower and less smooth compared to I pad.
Basic things like the text entry also slow.
At any text entry, the keyboard always takes a small lag to appear. Most obvious in browser.
I still will choose the tab over the ipad2.
But since you are coming from ipad2, recommend you buy galaxy tab 7.7 or 7 plus.
These 2 uses the exynos chip set similar to sgs 2. Very powerful gpu.
If u try tab 10.1 or 8.9, sure you will be frustrated by the occational lag.
Just being honest.
PS: I still love my tab.
I haven't been on the galaxy tab 10.1 long but I know one thing from experience so far that this tablet on Romans rom is just as fast and maybe less laggy than the stock transformer prime which I am shocked by. I am now asking myself why I didn't buy this before when it came out instead of waiting all I can say is wooooooooow
Sent from my GT-P7510 using xda premium
Related
... give us a copy of Bootloader unlocker!
Pleeeeeeeaseeeeeeee
They have a bootloader unlocker? I thought they were just going to system restores and stuff like that. Getting anything they have would be a huge benefit to the community.
To any of you B&N employee's if you don't feel comfortable publicly posting that stuff just pm a dev or really anyone on here you feel like. I'm sure lots of us wouldn't mind being the middle man(myself included).
…if you were work for Barnes & Noble, you're in less of a position to help anyone than we are.
What are you expecting, exactly? Someone to leak a signing key and they lose their job for a $250 tablet?
As a consumer, the best thing you can do is not buy the Nook Tablet. It's the best way to send a message to B&N.
tamasrepus said:
As a consumer, the best thing you can do is not buy the Nook Tablet. It's the best way to send a message to B&N.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YES!
Spot on!
come on! Who doesn't want to participate in a little corporate espionage?
tamasrepus said:
As a consumer, the best thing you can do is not buy the Nook Tablet. It's the best way to send a message to B&N.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah us android geeks not buying the ipad has really helped to make them realize to make their stuff more open and less commie.
By not buying and being silent, how is Barnes and noble going to get the message. Companies are far more likely to listen to paying customers. Remember nowadays XDA is a amazing resource for manufacturers. How many articles have been written about breakthroughs developers made at XDA. Thats free publicity and free development for them.
I am sure Barnes and noble pays somebody to check this forum, and others. That is why I suggested that i somebody wanted to leak something they could anonymously PM somebody on here and get it out that way.
B&N: get the message
I second and third and fourth that. B&N has two markets for their product, and if they purposefully make it very difficult to root the device, they are going to lose one of those markets. I'd buy a Nook tablet tomorrow if I were comfortable with being able to achieve a clean install of a rooted image, but without that, I'll likely go to another device. It would be a shame.
As mentioned before... the XDA crowd is not likely the market for this device due to the fact that the device is most likely lost leading.... It's in no way the interest of BN to provide any of the tools for you to do this.
Don't believe me? Look at the current sideloading situation... People are already on the Android/Amazon markets which technically means money out of BN's coffers...
trippap said:
I second and third and fourth that. B&N has two markets for their product, and if they purposefully make it very difficult to root the device, they are going to lose one of those markets. I'd buy a Nook tablet tomorrow if I were comfortable with being able to achieve a clean install of a rooted image, but without that, I'll likely go to another device. It would be a shame.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In all reality they didn't make it hard to root at all. Root was achieved by modifying usb drivers and using a known exploit. B&N had plenty of time to lock this tablet down way more than it is. Even sideloading is super easy. The bootloader is another matter all together, still I have a feeling somebody will find a simple workaround
>In all reality they didn't make it hard to root at all.
I don't think B&N had much to do with the low-level stuff, just the top-level design. The locked bootloader as has been said was likely for Netflix HD cert, since OMAP4 already had that feature. They didn't need to do anything extra. Otherwise, it's the same custom layer on top of 2.x.
The NT even retained the 1GB user-space which is a carryover from NC. Some modicum of sense would've shown that you don't need 12GB for app space, and would've avoided the bad reviews. Per Occam's Razor, don't attribute malice when incompetence will do.
tamasrepus said:
What are you expecting, exactly? Someone to leak a signing key and they lose their job for a $250 tablet?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quoted for truth. The M-Shield security setup that is locking down the bootloader uses a one-time-programmable e-fuse inside the cpu so that the key it's looking for or the logic to do so can never be reprogrammed. Unless I missing something in their setup I don't see how a bootloader unlocker would be possible. Instead they would have to give use their private key to sign our own files
The more I read about the locked bootloader, the more I regret purchasing the tablet. They have, however, made some promising progress with this tablet, and I haven't heard anyone say definitively that it is not possible to bypass this obstacle.
For the record, is the kindle fire's bootloader locked?
We have three options.. the second being most probable.
One:
I've spent the better part of the last few days trying to figure out how to root this device. I've gotten down to the fact that we can add most .zip files into our recovery and it'll try to run them.
Sadly.. they are all unsigned (except for the asus official ones) as i do not have the private key and i've searched with a hex editor on that zip for ANY clues for many hours.. i have given up hope on that. We need to get an unlocked BL that allows unsigned APKs.. or the key..then i could create an app to just make it so much easier! but alas..
Second Option
Pray the devs at androidroot.mobi want to work on the TP and get NVFLASH working. This is the most probable way..it would allow custom roms to be flashed.. to which we have incorporated root.. then we could throw CWM into the recovery partition and we're golden
Third Option
Someone another hole (like the gingerbreak method) is found in ICS
Anyone else heard anything?
I read the blog at androidroot.mobi, and I am not encouraged.
No one gives me grief if I OC my home PC, no one says anything about any warranty being voided if I install my own software, and that's even on the closed architecture brand names (HP, Compaq, Dell, etc) if I'm stupid enough to buy one.
So I see this as nothing but a power/money grab by this industry. Sure, all other mobile devices have had proprietary, closed source, OSs on them until Android.
But it's not that way any more. And I'm seriously wondering if a class action lawsuit can set this straight.
Screw saying "Mother, may I?" on something I paid $500 or more for. Or paid $10 or less for, for that matter. It's a matter of principle at this point.
They are in a particularly weak position on a wifi tablet; at least they could argue for phones that carriers were subsidising them and wanted control for that reason, but there's little case for it here. The RazorClaw exploit should have been fixed since it could have been used for malware, but flashing new firmware is a pretty deliberate act. I'm sure the objections are that they don't want to support devices bricked by tinkering, but I imagine most would be fine with that being considered to be at your own risk.
HTC show that it's possible for companies to be persuaded to unlock the bootloader, of course, if there's enough pressure... not saying that's necessarily likely with Asus though.
I really hope this can be resolved or these guys are able to find a way around it again. It seems really silly why I can't load whatever I want on it...
I just purchased one of these and if it can't rooted and rom'd, I guess it'll be going back to BestBuy.
we still have to give it time. this product literally just rolled out. also add to the fact that its very hard to get one since in such high demand. have to give developers/hackers time to mess around with this. it hasn't even really been a full 2 weeks since anyone had this in their possession. with a device as powerful as this, we can count on root being available sooner than later. once it does, would be well worth the wait. 4 overclocked cores to 1.8-2Ghz a piece or more oh the joys...lol optimized roms, optimized/increased power on GPU CM9
It's the latest and greatest android device on the market.... if it doesn't get root something is very wrong lol
My SGSII HercuDom needs more w00t. It always needs more w00t!
So this is my first foray into the android tablet scene, but been using android phones for awhile now. Does the TFP have an encrypted bootloader?
Cm9 would/will be sweet but I'd flip for a tab opted miui rom on the prime.
BixBix78 said:
Cm9 would/will be sweet but I'd flip for a tab opted miui rom on the prime.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Initially, my reaction to MIUI was "if I wanted that interface, I'd buy a product with iOS". But then I used it on my phone for a while, and was completely sold. The battery life was astounding on my Thunderbolt. The *huge* amount of themes available for MIUI, all of which change the entire aspect of the interface (not just icons and the dock), really sold me. Plus, it was smoother than any other ROM I had tried to date, including CM7.
I would be absolutely stoked to have MIUI running on the Prime...
Col.Kernel said:
It's a matter of principle at this point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. (I don't know about a class action suit but...)
This is my machine. If I want to change the name of a folder I should be allowed to. I want to see all files. Don't hide them from me. I am an admin of my own devices and I don't appreciate being treated like a luser.
demandarin said:
we still have to give it time. this product literally just rolled out. also add to the fact that its very hard to get one since in such high demand. have to give developers/hackers time to mess around with this. it hasn't even really been a full 2 weeks since anyone had this in their possession. with a device as powerful as this, we can count on root being available sooner than later. once it does, would be well worth the wait. 4 overclocked cores to 1.8-2Ghz a piece or more oh the joys...lol optimized roms, optimized/increased power on GPU CM9
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 cm9 on this device overclocked to 2.0 = mind f**ked
tylermaciaszek said:
+1 cm9 on this device overclocked to 2.0 = mind f**ked
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm drooling over the thought of overclocking this quad-core to 2.0ghz. Will need some way of having a permanant charging cable connected though .
tbns said:
I'm drooling over the thought of overclocking this quad-core to 2.0ghz. Will need some way of having a permanant charging cable connected though .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends how the room is optimized will certainly need battery tweaks and such but yes I'm drooling over it to
i dont know much about the rooting with androod devices but is there anything really different about the prime that qould make it more difficult to root then other devices? And if so has there been any other devices like it before thats been able to get rooted?
BongoBong said:
i dont know much about the rooting with androod devices but is there anything really different about the prime that qould make it more difficult to root then other devices? And if so has there been any other devices like it before thats been able to get rooted?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Secure boot loader which seems to handle all of the writing to system partitions. but there isn't much info about. It's not clear to me what level of escalation is possible at all without finding exploits.
Has anyone tried to root with Razorclaw and then install Voodoo OTA RootKeeper before the update?
phunk311 said:
Has anyone tried to root with Razorclaw and then install Voodoo OTA RootKeeper before the update?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Before the update it was rootable after the update its not
phunk311 said:
Has anyone tried to root with Razorclaw and then install Voodoo OTA RootKeeper before the update?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quite a few posts about this. Been tired, only work son select few Primes that had shipped to reviewers and other lucky few. As far as we know all Primes sold now are shipping with OTA that is not rootable.
On TF101 you could install older update in order to make it rootable. But I suppose if there was none before the (yet) unrootable one, there is no update to try it. I'm not goint to buy a device with Android that is not rootable. Especially now when ICS is open sourced.
we dont have any older updates available for us
the update patched the method it was using to root in the first place
So this may be a stupid question, and I know that the HDX bootloader is essentially a tank, but in other cases I know some devices have gotten lucky by chainloading u-boot to load custom kernels and such. Is this possible in our instance, or am I totally off-base and missing something? I mean I'm assuming I am wrong as noone has mentioned it yet, but I'm just curious as to why.
S_transform said:
So this may be a stupid question, and I know that the HDX bootloader is essentially a tank, but in other cases I know some devices have gotten lucky by chainloading u-boot to load custom kernels and such. Is this possible in our instance, or am I totally off-base and missing something? I mean I'm assuming I am wrong as noone has mentioned it yet, but I'm just curious as to why.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, the issue here is, most of the guys that have low level Qualcomm experience are not here. We, aside from maybe Hashcode, are mostly adventurous hackers & tweakers. Don't get me wrong, Cpajuste has made some big strides & I've saved a ton of bricks, but for me it's mostly because I've been around XDA since 2002 or 2003. In fact, I used to have a username for every platform, the last being 2006 when XDA started say only one account per person, which was my new WM6 account.
At any rate, we are limited because of a few reasons, such as the HDX is not really a device available worldwide. That knocks a lot of potential developers out of the equation. The second issue is that it's not mainstream Android. It is a fork viewed as inferior by most, regardless of how much better the hardware is. The HDX is also still a fairly new device, particularly when you consider the LTE models just started shipping mid-December.
So, sure it can & probably will even happen, but just look how long it took to fully unlock the Verizon Note 2 bootloader or especially some of the 2012 Moto devices. Nearly a year? Maybe more for some?
GSLEON3 said:
No, the issue here is, most of the guys that have low level Qualcomm experience are not here. We, aside from maybe Hashcode, are mostly adventurous hackers & tweakers. Don't get me wrong, Cpajuste has made some big strides & I've saved a ton of bricks, but for me it's mostly because I've been around XDA since 2002 or 2003. In fact, I used to have a username for every platform, the last being 2006 when XDA started say only one account per person, which was my new WM6 account.
At any rate, we are limited because of a few reasons, such as the HDX is not really a device available worldwide. That knocks a lot of potential developers out of the equation. The second issue is that it's not mainstream Android. It is a fork viewed as inferior by most, regardless of how much better the hardware is. The HDX is also still a fairly new device, particularly when you consider the LTE models just started shipping mid-December.
So, sure it can & probably will even happen, but just look how long it took to fully unlock the Verizon Note 2 bootloader or especially some of the 2012 Moto devices. Nearly a year? Maybe more for some?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the response, this makes a lot of sense. Its like I understand in my head its probably going to take a long time if ever, I'm just not wired to be particularly patient.
I got in to rooting and flashing when I was on my Samsung Fascinate, it was the device I learned the ropes on. By the time I was ready to upgrade devices, I was already running ICS on my Fascinate. We all know the history of the S3 and it being a flagship device for Samsung......and there were countless ROM builds for it. One of the most stable team builds I've ever been on was AOKP. Coming up through versions of OTA builds, AOKP was always on top....IMO. There were other ROM's that opened different customizations, but in my eyes none were as solid and consistent as AOKP was. Then we all know the hybrid ROM's came about, based on several different builds. There is where I found Rootbox, to this day I don't think I'll ever find a more complete and stable ROM. Its too bad its dev dropped building, but good for him as he was finishing school.
After owning my Note 3 now since it hit the stores, I finally rooted and flashed about a month or better ago. I tried a few ROM's, wasn't impressed with anything.....then a friend recommended HyperDrive. I had been on Release 7 for about a month, and pretty damn happy. Recently I flashed to their Release 8, which is KitKat. Granted, I know development is still early on KK.....but I've just been overwhelmed with the errors and bugs. I am generally a patient person, but this "stable" release is far from my experience with the S3 ROM's. And I do take into consideration these are two very different devices, based on different builds of Android software also.
Am I being too critical? Should I just shut up and wait it out? Where is AOKP? Where are the other teams with their big builds? Are they beyond forums now, and strictly WikiRoot and Gooim? I don't even venture over there, so I may really be missing out all together. A quick glimpse at AOKP's site and I found Note3 nightlies for "Unified Note 3", no specific carrier. Is this for ALL devices Note 3? Am I getting too old for this stuff?
Someone pass me a beer. :laugh:
LXative said:
I got in to rooting and flashing when I was on my Samsung Fascinate, it was the device I learned the ropes on. By the time I was ready to upgrade devices, I was already running ICS on my Fascinate. We all know the history of the S3 and it being a flagship device for Samsung......and there were countless ROM builds for it. One of the most stable team builds I've ever been on was AOKP. Coming up through versions of OTA builds, AOKP was always on top....IMO. There were other ROM's that opened different customizations, but in my eyes none were as solid and consistent as AOKP was. Then we all know the hybrid ROM's came about, based on several different builds. There is where I found Rootbox, to this day I don't think I'll ever find a more complete and stable ROM. Its too bad its dev dropped building, but good for him as he was finishing school.
After owning my Note 3 now since it hit the stores, I finally rooted and flashed about a month or better ago. I tried a few ROM's, wasn't impressed with anything.....then a friend recommended HyperDrive. I had been on Release 7 for about a month, and pretty damn happy. Recently I flashed to their Release 8, which is KitKat. Granted, I know development is still early on KK.....but I've just been overwhelmed with the errors and bugs. I am generally a patient person, but this "stable" release is far from my experience with the S3 ROM's. And I do take into consideration these are two very different devices, based on different builds of Android software also.
Am I being too critical? Should I just shut up and wait it out? Where is AOKP? Where are the other teams with their big builds? Are they beyond forums now, and strictly WikiRoot and Gooim? I don't even venture over there, so I may really be missing out all together. A quick glimpse at AOKP's site and I found Note3 nightlies for "Unified Note 3", no specific carrier. Is this for ALL devices Note 3? Am I getting too old for this stuff?
Someone pass me a beer. :laugh:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With a locked boot loader we're currently stuck with TW based ROMs. If you're having that many bugs on HyperDrive give a different ROM a try. I use a few different ones and do not have any issues at all.
Only the developer editions can run AOSP roms...retail devices are stuck with touch wiz because safestrap recvovery limits you to using the stock kernel only. I feel your pain with TW KitKat NC2...it is pretty buggy. Hoping the NC4 update will fix some things. For the mean time I am chillaxin on Beans MJE B.6
I can't believe you just asked that!
Request denied: Imma gonna kick you!!
I came from a Droid RAZR (original) that used Safestrap with a locked bootloader, but it had tons of AOSP and AOKP roms. What makes the Note 3 different?
Sent from my SM-N900V using XDA Free mobile app
Retail Note 3 is locked to the stock kernel, aosp uses a diff one. I think others like Bionic can use kexec to boot which was what they were looking into on NC2 since kernel modules are enabled (and why they told everyone not to take the ota)
Thanks for the replies. I will admit I know how to get rooted and flash ROM's, but don't know a whole lot about the guts of the phone along with these limitations.
So in short, the retail carrier phones are all TouchWhiz forever? I am pulling that correctly out of these replies? Or is this something that some of the cell phone hacking geniuses that bring us this whole side of the cellular world, actually be able to overcome to allow us to run AOSP?
On an additional note, are all devices going to be like this from here on out? I had no clue about a "developer edition" phone, how does one acquire such a device?
Man, I need to catch up on my lingo.
LXative said:
Thanks for the replies. I will admit I know how to get rooted and flash ROM's, but don't know a whole lot about the guts of the phone along with these limitations.
So in short, the retail carrier phones are all TouchWhiz forever? I am pulling that correctly out of these replies? Or is this something that some of the cell phone hacking geniuses that bring us this whole side of the cellular world, actually be able to overcome to allow us to run AOSP?
On an additional note, are all devices going to be like this from here on out? I had no clue about a "developer edition" phone, how does one acquire such a device?
Man, I need to catch up on my lingo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What you are use to no longer exists...Samsung is locking the device so tight these days, root will more then likely be a thing of the past. The VZW S5 has a 12k bounty just for root and nobody has cracked it. The developer editions are going to be the only way to root and flash roms. The downfall is you have to buy the device outright, no warranty, and samsung nor verizon provides updates for the DE. You would think no big deal, I will rely on Devs for updates, but there is a catch.
These days a lot of stuff is hidden in the bootloader partition that allows certain features of the device to work correctly. So If I want to upgrade from MJE to NC2 I need to flash a modified firmware pack. The problem is with DE is we can not flash that firmware pack without locking the bootloader. So we are then left with using a modfified stock kernel which allows us to use kitkat but we have to deal with certain bugs.
On a side note we can run AOSP all day with no issues being it uses its own kernel, but there is very few devs left working on Verizon devices. CM11 is all we have. I believe we can run some T-mobile roms with Apn edits.
The retail edition relies on Root privilidges for safe strap recovery to work. However since kernel modules are disabled on the latest update, kexec or any side load program that installs kernels will not work. Therfore Touchwiz is what all the retail devices can run.
It is really a no win situation at this point with Samsung devices on Verizon. Both Retail and DE have their own limitations.
I will probably continue to purchase Dev edition phones since I buy my device outright to keep unlimited. Also I am guranteed root capability to at the very least and I can mod my own stock rom. And if the retail gets a update down the road that is worthy of taking, I can choose to take it and lock the device. However as slow as verizon releases updates, I will most likely move on to another device before the update has any relevancy.
Your best bet is to move to T-mobile if you want a lot of development...I would but I am not sold on their service around my area.
Awesome, thanks for the break down.......it really helped me understand things a lot better.
Seems like I might just be best to flash back to stock and be happy as possible with the customization features Apex gives me. I REALLY don't understand the logic in locking the devs......no matter what they do, in the least someone is going to try to break into it.......especially if it is a popular device. It wouldn't be so bad on the other hand, if they would give us just some of the customization's that you can find in just about every custom ROM out there. You know they are paying attention to what the developers do on forums like this......but I personally really don't see them doing anything about it.
FYI, I too wanted to keep my data plan so I bought my Note 3 out right.....had no real clue about the dev edition though. From the sounds of it, I'm pretty discouraged about the current time and future of customization......especially for those of us who bought our phones out right. Pisses me off.
I've considered T-Mobile too, and it works fine everywhere but where I work. Being I get a stipend, I can't have a cell phone while I am at work.....that doesn't work. Or else I'd be long gone.
droidstyle said:
Only the developer editions can run AOSP roms...retail devices are stuck with touch wiz because safestrap recvovery limits you to using the stock kernel only. I feel your pain with TW KitKat NC2...it is pretty buggy. Hoping the NC4 update will fix some things. For the mean time I am chillaxin on Beans MJE B.6
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This. No need to go away from Beans mje build until I buy a new home...
Actually I was under the impression the leak allowed for an unsigned kernel and there was work on an AOSP rom for the vzw Note 3?
Morkai Almandragon said:
Actually I was under the impression the leak allowed for an unsigned kernel and there was work on an AOSP rom for the vzw Note 3?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The leak allows a "possible" exploit of our bootloader that would allow kernel modification. I'm sure smart people are trying. But what I've heard is that even the smarties will find this hard to do. Plus we don't even know if it will work.
I guarantee you if someone finds a way, it will be supwr noticable where to find that info on the forum.
<Note3>
Not trying to derail the thread, but it sounds like a couple of you bought devices outright "to keep unlimited data." Despite what vzw customer service and tech support may say, that is not true at all. I and many others with unlimited got a subsidized N3 from vzw. If you have a non-unlimited line on your account due for an upgrade, use it to get subsidized N3 on same capped data plan. Activate N3 and make calls on it. Turn off both phones. Go online and transfer lines on myverizon. Change N3 to your unlimited phone number. Take SIM card out of your current unlimited device and put in N3, turn on and call the device activation number just like you had purchased a phone outright from third party. There's another step in there about lUk8dia753 reactivating the original phone back on its original capped line, but I forget when you do it. Google knows. The point is Verizon will subsidize new devices that end up on unlimited data plans. In a circuitous way, it's legally required by the conditions of their purchase of the block c spectrum - the open device rule.
Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
badchorizo said:
Not trying to derail the thread, but it sounds like a couple of you bought devices outright "to keep unlimited data." Despite what vzw customer service and tech support may say, that is not true at all. I and many others with unlimited got a subsidized N3 from vzw. If you have a non-unlimited line on your account due for an upgrade, use it to get subsidized N3 on same capped data plan. Activate N3 and make calls on it. Turn off both phones. Go online and transfer lines on myverizon. Change N3 to your unlimited phone number. Take SIM card out of your current unlimited device and put in N3, turn on and call the device activation number just like you had purchased a phone outright from third party. There's another step in there about lUk8dia753 reactivating the original phone back on its original capped line, but I forget when you do it. Google knows. The point is Verizon will subsidize new devices that end up on unlimited data plans. In a circuitous way, it's legally required by the conditions of their purchase of the block c spectrum - the open device rule.
Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True but that does not work when the other lines on your account already have used their upgrade and are out 2yrs before they can upgrade. So from July 2012- July 2014, I have to buy my device outright to keep unlimited.
Being someone who is trying to learn about rooting etc. I have found this thread very useful. To me if I choose to root a phone the biggest benefits I see would be getting rid of bloat and the UI. I love "plain" Android and Nexus devices, I like things simple, uncluttered, as I believe the way Google intends for it to be.
So if I understand this correctly at this point with a rooted Note3 I can not enjoy the benefits of running a stock JB or KK rom as it was straight from Google? Something about a locked bootloader is preventing these type of roms from running on our devices as of now, and who knows for how long?
mgftp said:
Being someone who is trying to learn about rooting etc. I have found this thread very useful. To me if I choose to root a phone the biggest benefits I see would be getting rid of bloat and the UI. I love "plain" Android and Nexus devices, I like things simple, uncluttered, as I believe the way Google intends for it to be.
So if I understand this correctly at this point with a rooted Note3 I can not enjoy the benefits of running a stock JB or KK rom as it was straight from Google? Something about a locked bootloader is preventing these type of roms from running on our devices as of now, and who knows for how long?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You and I both - I find a huge attraction with the Nexus devices. Problem is, I'm on a carrier that refuses to carry them because they can't load adware on the phone and make a huge profit on what is already a huge profit (Verizon Wireless). I spent most of my youth on T-Mobile so when I got the Droid 1 on Verizon, I was pretty happy - better reception, etc... but the whole concept of adware really ticked me off. Without adware we could get a lot better battery life. These apps were running in the background of a phone I bought and paid money for (or promised $ for 2 years). What gives them the right to load it with adware?
The HTC Thunderbolt on Verizon - I was the first few to get it... The Blockbuster app glitched and was stuck downloading gigs of movie thumbnails. This killed the phone in 5-6 hours - no matter how many times you killed the app, it would start up and go downloading again till your battery ran out. Not only was Verizon forcing adware but the adware apps were so poorly programmed it drove me to Apple. Good job Google/Verizon! So after a few years of Apple (adware less phones) and relative bliss.... I went back to Android with the Moto X and now the Note 3. Sure, freezing Adware is nice... but rooting still provided much better battery life.
I'm one of those people who doesn't understand the idea of paying Direct TV/Cable TV $120+/mo for them to make $$$$ off of you via advertisements. If I pay retail for my phone (Verizon Edge plan) - I expect it to be mine.
I'm a sucker for ASOP.... but after owning the Note 3 for awhile (rooted) - I highly recommend you try it out. I'm getting insane battery life, the OS is light and fast, I run a custom launcher (Nova), and there is absolutely no adware/app that runs on my phone that I don't want. My only fear is... after the Note 3 (since the S5 is impossible to root and most likely the Note 4) - what will we have? Google Play Editions??? This mystical expensive Silver editions???
I'll try to keep my Note 3 as long as I can but if Google is getting rid of the Nexus lineup .... either I'll have to go back to T-Mobile - they do pay the ETF. Quite a few of the Verizon Note 3 devs left for T-Mobile.
Back to your post ---- there are quite a few lightweight roms to flashs on the Note 3 even a 600mb one!
droidstyle said:
True but that does not work when the other lines on your account already have used their upgrade and are out 2yrs before they can upgrade. So from July 2012- July 2014, I have to buy my device outright to keep unlimited.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can transfer your upgrade to one of those lines. That's what I did - the capped line I used isn't due for an upgrade for another couple of weeks, but mine was up back in December. So I "gave" that upgrade to the capped line, bought a Note 3, and then swapped sims.
shaw0050 said:
You can transfer your upgrade to one of those lines. That's what I did - the capped line I used isn't due for an upgrade for another couple of weeks, but mine was up back in December. So I "gave" that upgrade to the capped line, bought a Note 3, and then swapped sims.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure how you accomplished that but I tried and was told I would lose unlimited if I transfered my upgrade to another line. Aside from that I will probably continue to purchase developer devices being Samsung retail devices can no longer be rooted.
droidstyle said:
Not sure how you accomplished that but I tried and was told I would lose unlimited if I transfered my upgrade to another line. Aside from that I will probably continue to purchase developer devices being Samsung retail devices can no longer be rooted.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you are interested in a retail device and using your upgrade you can purchase from an online retailer such as best buy and select keep old plan and ship to home. As long as you insert your current sim card before powering it on and discard the new one they send you you will keep your UDP and have your contract extended two years when you power up the new device. The trigger to knock you off UDP is tied to the new sim, nothing else. There are many threads around various forums regarding this but look at android central and slickdeals if you wanna know more.
Slickdeals thread: http://slickdeals.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6964624
i kept unlimited by upgrading a basic phone (with no data plan) on my plan to the note 3, then switching it to my line.
edit: but i dont know how you get 20GB with reqular use. i get about 4-5gb with regular use, and my highest was 18gb in a month by USB tethering to my computer and torrenting a bunch of "linux software distros".
So I've had this phone for a while now and I'm fairly happy with it. Other than the fact it acts a bit weird with the college wifi. I'm pretty sure we didn't buy any warranty for it, so whatever it might of had when I got it about a year ago is probably about to expire. Anyway, I'm knew to the rooting scene and I would like to know if it would be worth it for me personally to root my phone. It is a Samsung Galaxy S4 from Verizon, it says the model number is SCH-I545 and is running on version 5.0.1. At first I kind of just wanted to root the phone just to play modded games on it, stuff without leaderboards mostly. But then I saw somewhere that you could extend the battery life with a different kernel or something, and that is definitely something I could use. So... any words of advice or suggestions for me? I appreciate it.
I would say rooting is worth it especially on an older phone. Rooting is really just getting access to the root directory of the phone. If you want to run custom firmware I recommend this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3132555
Our s4 has a locked bootloader so our options are a little limited but I like this devs work. Remember to do a lot of reading first and welcome to the community!
Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk
OrisX said:
So I've had this phone for a while now and I'm fairly happy with it. Other than the fact it acts a bit weird with the college wifi. I'm pretty sure we didn't buy any warranty for it, so whatever it might of had when I got it about a year ago is probably about to expire. Anyway, I'm knew to the rooting scene and I would like to know if it would be worth it for me personally to root my phone. It is a Samsung Galaxy S4 from Verizon, it says the model number is SCH-I545 and is running on version 5.0.1. At first I kind of just wanted to root the phone just to play modded games on it, stuff without leaderboards mostly. But then I saw somewhere that you could extend the battery life with a different kernel or something, and that is definitely something I could use. So... any words of advice or suggestions for me? I appreciate it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm new as well to rooting... although in the PC world, I've always been an admin. I think that the biggest reason to root is to have control of what you've bought! Deleting the apps you don't want, and getting the updates. I understand that via rooting you can overclock your CPU (which for gaming would probably be a good thing).
I haven't had great luck in a successful root for my Verizon S4 but I'll keep trying. So much of a different 'language' of what you're doing over a PC world. Just takes time.
Best of luck!