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Alright so far this device have been undoubtedly the most perfect for it's price, however it's still has some parts that need upgrading, and one of those sections is the audio recording (and camera, although they made huge advancing from the axon pro and the camera is pretty awesome, but if they started with the right sensor, the axon would be the best cameraphone)
I convinced myself that manufacturers don't even care about audio recording DESPITE THE FACT THAT THEY ADVERTISE THEIR DEVICES AS HIFI DEVICES
I mean only the v20 is doing great on that section, 24 bit 192khz FLAC omni-dimensional audio recording with audio recorder app that has features like audio focus and 24bit 96khz lpcm for videos but at the cost of 700-800 dollars for a new one, it is far from what people like me consider for a smartphone.
As for the rest, it's a disaster, lg v10?? it records 44kbps (YES because that's what hifi sounds like, perfect sampling rate! bravo! ironically it records better with video with a samplingrate of 156kbps max and has audio focus) I don't know about other hifi devices, my axon 7 records 352kbps pcm when you set it to WAV (which is the only available setting there, lol), that's.... just ok, still way behind the v20.
Let's get to the spicypart, video recording, your device can record 352kbps pcm but you choose to put a cheapo codec that doesn't support that, instead it is 96kbps, even worse, when you try cinemafv5 you'll find that it can record 156kbps with AAC-LC, that's fine, but the output would be MONO!!!
Wth was zte thinking when they did this?? seriously? why you give me 156kbps...but make it mono, why??
Please note that I'm not saying axon 7 recording is bad (although some people here who tested htc 10 would say due to bass clipping issues, whatever) but it could've been miles better!
for that price I am still convinced that recording is good, but if ZTE happen to make another Axon, they better take care of that.
NOW let's move on to my most important critic from this post:
there are 2 cases to this situation
Case1:
ALL OF WHAT HAVE BEEN SAID WAS A STORY, AND ZTE ADVERTISING WAS ANOTHER WHOLE STORY! ZTE FALSE-ADVERTISED THE AXON 7!!
As you can see from the picture below Zte advertised their device can record "32 bit depth with 96khz sampling frequency" which is not the 44.1khz sampling frequency and the 16 bit 352kbps sample rate, Just compare it to the upper statements of vidoe and audio, I'd definitely call that false advertising , if there is one thing I hate it is false advertising and it's unforgivable, even for a great quality product like the Axon 7 I am rolling my eyes at what Zte have done, first was the battery capacity (although battery life is great) then this!? Audio?? it's the reason I bought it in the first place, do they realize that they can get sued for false advertising?
Case2:
MAYBE the Axon 7 can actually record like that but lacks the codes to do it, like how it turned out that aptx-hd can be ported in this forum, so can we get a genius dev who can figure it out (for both video and standalone recorder) with a codec or something??! any volunteers?
Let's hope we get a response from ZTE officials to clarify if Axon 7 meets what they advertised or not.
I guess you don't want to hear that the sound output is truncated to 16 bit no matter what you play. I have no idea if that's just the music app which does that (the only app which I know definitely uses the Hi-Fi DAC despite other claims here), or if it's somewhere in the firmware. I contacted PocketNow (since they pointed it out) through several mediums to ask and I never got a response. Real professional.
Cyrus D. said:
I guess you don't want to hear that the sound output is truncated to 16 bit no matter what you play. I have no idea if that's just the music app which does that (the only app which I know definitely uses the Hi-Fi DAC despite other claims here), or if it's somewhere in the firmware. I contacted PocketNow (since they pointed it out) through several mediums to ask and I never got a response. Real professional.
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Click to collapse
Absolutely not, I disagree, there is something called the quantization noise and it would be present for higher bit depth as it is for lower bit depth, secondly, no, it uses the dac on most music players (hence switching between standard and super audio quality gives the same factor on most music players like poweramp, and super audio quality option gives equal output on poweramp to my trained ears, otherwise the difference would be obvious)
Over the past months I've seen a lot of clueless people who claim "my hifi device only uses the dac on the stock music player and snapdragon dac for others" all over xda, and same for the axon 7 we see these people on ztecommunity, just because the v10 did with lollipop the past year, on the v10 people could figure that out due to them instantly observing the difference, but if there is no difference, why you have to create one? maybe because people disliked the device (which is subjective).
EDIT: Ok you're partially right, I figured that ages ago when I used neutron, what they meant is the speaker output, for some reason it is limited to 16 bit 44.1Khz, FOR SOME REASON, yes thanks I wanted to point that out, it is kinda forgivable due to small speakers, we are talking about a smartphone speaker lol
.but with headphones the dac works perfectly
I'm not sure if you misread what I wrote or if I don't understand what you're saying. The first part has nothing to disagree with. It has been tested and for a fact sound output is truncated to 16 bit.
PowerAmp 100% does NOT use the AKM DAC. Selecting 24 bit output on that uses the SD 820's DAC, which contrary to what some people here believe, is not magically missing from the SoC. It's there. Not to mention it sounds distinctly different (worse) than the AKM DAC. You can go to the PowerAmp forum and ask the creator himself and he'll tell you it doesn't make use of the AKM DAC. Or you know, you could use your ears. It clearly sounds different, if you can't tell then you're using poor headphones or have some level of hearing impairment (which is natural with age).
Overall I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say, you need to fix your post, I'm assuming English is not your first language.
Cyrus D. said:
I'm not sure if you misread what I wrote or if I don't understand what you're saying. The first part has nothing to disagree with. It has been tested and for a fact sound output is truncated to 16 bit.
PowerAmp 100% does NOT use the AKM DAC. Selecting 24 bit output on that uses the SD 820's DAC, which contrary to what some people here believe, is not magically missing from the SoC. It's there. Not to mention it sounds distinctly different (worse) than the AKM DAC. You can go to the PowerAmp forum and ask the creator himself and he'll tell you it doesn't make use of the AKM DAC. Or you know, you could use your ears. It clearly sounds different, if you can't tell then you're using poor headphones or have some level of hearing impairment (which is natural with age).
Overall I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say, you need to fix your post, I'm assuming English is not your first language.
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Click to collapse
No offense but I'd like to point out that you're so misinformed about : Axon 7 and audio in general.
I just watched the whole video of Pocketnow, there was no method to confirm that it was truncated, he only showed the frequency spectrum, please read on bit depth here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_bit_depth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_(signal_processing)
the human ears can hear up to 22hz, thus manufacturers cap their headphones lower than 22khz to limit the rest which is noise most of the time, it's called ultrasonic filtering. bit depth has nothing to do with the frequency spectrum, instead it's about data, number of values to be exact, referred as resolution sometimes. infact sampling frequency does effect the frequency response but that's not even what sampling frequency is all about, for example the device can have an ultrasonic filter while still having high resolution audio setup. modern headphones still do it actually. long story short: sampling frequency and bit depth have 0 things to do with the bandwidth/frequency range.
"Poweramp does not" I am not sure what poweramp does, what you're referring too was an issue of 701 alpha, if you download this version on a dac-fixed lg v10 (lg v10 lollipop with dac fix app or simply lg v10 running mm) it would show the same thing, that it uses "Variant: 24 bit snapdragon" my friend tested that out himself.
the newer alphas have options for the output showing the sampling frequency only. I don't use poweramp tbh and I don't know why people pick poweramp over Neutron which has freescale EQ.
As for high res support for poweramp, this might be true, I guess.
As a guy who performed abx, yes, the super quality switch still works, meaning the dac is working.
"Overall I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say, you need to fix your post, I'm assuming English is not your first language"
even though I didn't make such crude mistakes as you mentioned, this was very irrelevant considering that you tried to dismantle each point I mentioned, I was just helping. I'd say that was a bit rude.
Sebastian Fox said:
No offense but I'd like to point out that you're so misinformed about : Axon 7 and audio in general.
I just watched the whole video of Pocketnow, there was no method to confirm that it was truncated, he only showed the frequency spectrum, please read on bit depth here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_bit_depth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_(signal_processing)
the human ears can hear up to 22hz, thus manufacturers cap their headphones lower than 22khz to limit the rest which is noise most of the time
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Click to collapse
They quite literally said in that video that it's truncated to 16 bits, their exact words, whether or not they're wrong, and they're not clowns to have the sound output limited by headphones. I seriously doubt they recorded the sound coming out of headphones for the test. Even if they did, most headphones go well past human hearing. And for the record almost no one, except for very few extremely young children, can hear up to 22KHz. Most people by their 20s can't hear past 17-18KHz, less if they've been to concerts which are dangerously loud or worked in loud environments. I've been careful with my hearing and I hear almost nothing past 18KHz.
Sebastian Fox said:
As a guy who performed abx, yes, the super quality switch still works, meaning the dac is working.
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Click to collapse
I don't know what you mean by this. ABX? But PowerAmp, even in the latest alpha, is most definitely not using the AKM DAC. It sounds very different. Are you sure this Neutron player is using the DAC?
Sorry to break in, but I'm pretty sure that the latest beta of Poweramp actually used the DAC on marshmallow. I own an A2017G and I think I could get 192KHz on B05.
Now I'm on 7.0 and i can't get past 48 kHz. Where does it say which DAC is in use? (the Variant: Snapdragon thing)
EDIT: ignore everything said before, after long investigation and flashing, the stock firmware plays HIFI correctly, Using audio_flinger to check, the resolution was correct, however with a custom ROM it gets harder.
As for Pocketnow spectrum analysis, it makes no sense at all since audio_flinger doesn't lie, and all audio players are pointing that our device can play 192khz without downsampling with the Dac patch.
Choose an username... said:
Sorry to break in, but I'm pretty sure that the latest beta of Poweramp actually used the DAC on marshmallow. I own an A2017G and I think I could get 192KHz on B05.
Now I'm on 7.0 and i can't get past 48 kHz. Where does it say which DAC is in use? (the Variant: Snapdragon thing)
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Click to collapse
It wasn't our device, max simply didn't make poweramp support our audio libs.
As for neutron, it's working fine
Same for usb audio player pro
And bothnare imo way better than poweramp.
Ghostface009 said:
It wasn't our device, max simply didn't make poweramp support our audio libs.
As for neutron, it's working fine
Same for usb audio player pro
And bothnare imo way better than poweramp.
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Click to collapse
huge bump lol. Well since the new beta it works with 192KHz and all. (i have to add, proven with media.audio_flinger). And honestly I believe Poweramp's sound engine is way superior to Neutron's, but you know, that's just opinion
Choose an username... said:
huge bump lol. Well since the new beta it works with 192KHz and all. (i have to add, proven with media.audio_flinger). And honestly I believe Poweramp's sound engine is way superior to Neutron's, but you know, that's just opinion
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Click to collapse
Maybe, you need to consider neutron despite it's ugly ui, that thing has freescale eq, low latency settings and amazing dither, with dither neutron sounded better than poweramp and usb audio pro imo.
Ghostface009 said:
Maybe, you need to consider neutron despite it's ugly ui, that thing has freescale eq, low latency settings and amazing dither, with dither neutron sounded better than poweramp and usb audio pro imo.
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Click to collapse
well, you said it: imo.
Well, installed the 6.3 update on my unrooted Shield , showing in the changelog that finally Tidal can stream music in hi-fi res. Nevertheless nothing has changed, in the Tidal app (Android Tv, obtained from the Play Store and registered with my payied account ) in the settings it shows Hi-fi quality, but I get Pcm 48kbps, 2 channel music signal. Nothing more.
At the contrary in my Marantz Avr, the same service active through the Heos App, gives me 320kbps AAC 2channels, at least.
What is the reason for this? Is there a setting I should adapt, to have the same quality as in my Avr on the Shield?
Thanks for your interest
Alessandro
Check this topic: forums.geforce.com/default/topic/1033748/shield-tv/tidal-hifi-native-app-vs-tidal-hifi-airplay-from-iphone/
I am using PLAY-Fi app on Samsung Galaxy 8 phone with TIDAL Hi-Fi to stream music to ANTHEM MRX 720. The sound is nearly flawless.
I tried NVDIA Shield connected using HDMI to ANTHEM MRX 720 with TIDAL on and HiFi streaming and sound was abosulutely terrible. There might be a bug in their software I have no other explaination for this.
Thanks, at least I am not alone! I will try uninstall /reinstall the Tidal app, but want to tell I have made an extensive post on GeForce forum, in the thread regarding the 6.3 update.
I have also asked what quality we do have to expect from Nvidia to Avr.
Tidal app has been released for Google Tv one month ago, so everything is new.
I have seen the article you mentioned, but it is not referred to this update.
Thanks for the heads up to the app on the phone you use, will try with other equipment in the house.
Hope we will sort this out, not a big problem, but as we have support and pay a subscription, I like to have gear working properly. Nvidia has big long term support for this hardware, so I am confident.
Regards
Alessandro
Red better the other thread you mentioned. Similar outcome. I also tried uninstalling and reinstalling the App, no changes. The different audible quality is high. The reply from Nvidia on Geforce is not sufficient.
Do you know if the Shield can pass AAC through its Hdmi output?
Regards
Alessandro
vn800art said:
Well, installed the 6.3 update on my unrooted Shield , showing in the changelog that finally Tidal can stream music in hi-fi res. Nevertheless nothing has changed, in the Tidal app (Android Tv, obtained from the Play Store and registered with my payied account ) in the settings it shows Hi-fi quality, but I get Pcm 48kbps, 2 channel music signal. Nothing more.
At the contrary in my Marantz Avr, the same service active through the Heos App, gives me 320kbps AAC 2channels, at least.
What is the reason for this? Is there a setting I should adapt, to have the same quality as in my Avr on the Shield?
Thanks for your interest
Alessandro
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know this is an old post, so maybe you've figured this out already? But in case you haven't, the answer is that 48k PCM *is* HiFi.
CD quality is 44.1 k PCM, by comparison.
What's confusing you I think is that 48k PCM does not mean 48k bits/second, it means 48k samples per second, and 16 bit samples at that. Per channel. So the bit rate for CD, for example is 44,100 x 16 bit x 2 = 1,411,200 bps. or 1,411 kbps.
It would be ideal if the Shield output just that, but as I understand it, the Shield upscales to 48k instead of outputting at the native 44.1k So it's outputting at 1,536 kbps!
Compare to the lesser 320 kps AAC to which you refer!
Here I am! Thanks for your interest! Problem is to my ears AAC sounds significantly better than PCM. I asked also if someone could tell me how to avoid this conversion (if it is possible), which at this point looks to me the reason for my disappointment.
Regards
Alessandro
vn800art said:
Here I am! Thanks for your interest! Problem is to my ears AAC sounds significantly better than PCM. I asked also if someone could tell me how to avoid this conversion (if it is possible), which at this point looks to me the reason for my disappointment.
Regards
Alessandro
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Click to collapse
Very strange. You see AAC is a lossy format like MP3, whereas PCM is lossless.
OK 320 kpbs AAC usually sounds pretty good, because that's a high bit rate for a lossy format, but it's lossy all the same. Whereas PCM is the format the source is almost certainly recorded in.
It's unfortunate that the Shield outputs everything at 48 kHz, but even so, the conversion of 44.1 k PCM to 48 k PCM should introduce far less distortion that conversion to 320 k AAC.
Listen, if I get Tidal out of my Marantz, it says it has AAC as input format, 2 channels. What I believe is that Tidal is transmitting AAC indeed, wereas Shield is transcoding this to PCM. This conversion worsen the audio somewhere, so bad that at my non Audiophile earing, it's fairly noticeable. And you must trust me, I often listen to 320kbps Mp3 internet radios, some are good, some are better (depends on encoders and audio processing). When I find some AAC Www radio even at 160kbps, they are significantly the best ones in the lot. Thre aren't not so many.
So, as I usually use Shield for everything streaming related, I would have liked to use it for Tidal also, but this as of today, is not the case.
Regards
Alessandro
vn800art said:
Listen, if I get Tidal out of my Marantz, it says it has AAC as input format, 2 channels. What I believe is that Tidal is transmitting AAC indeed, wereas Shield is transcoding this to PCM. This conversion worsen the audio somewhere, so bad that at my non Audiophile earing, it's fairly noticeable. And you must trust me, I often listen to 320kbps Mp3 internet radios, some are good, some are better (depends on encoders and audio processing). When I find some AAC Www radio even at 160kbps, they are significantly the best ones in the lot. Thre aren't not so many.
So, as I usually use Shield for everything streaming related, I would have liked to use it for Tidal also, but this as of today, is not the case.
Regards
Alessandro
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure, I am not questioning what you are hearing. I just said "very strange".
Android TV app
Hello everyone! Do you know which version of the app is it :
If you know or have the .apk file, I would be grateful !
I'm trying to find it for my android TV box because Play Store installs me the 2.11.3 version which is difficult to use on android tv with only a remote.
Thank you guys !
First and foremost, a note to the mods:
I'm asking a question about V30 accessories, so I wasn't sure where to post this thread. If I chose, wrong, then please forgive me and move it. I'm really sorry!
Now for the question:
I want a good sounding in-ear earbud for my V30. I have a decent set of cans, but they aren't very portable and I want a a good set of earbuds too. I mostly listen to rock and metal and prefer flat sounding headphones (I think... I don't like the bass overpowering the vocals and I don't use any equalizers in my music player app... so, flat?).
I can't afford much, but $150 is the most I'm willing to spend and have narrowed my choices down to two specific headphones based on reviews here on XDA and Amazon.
The problem is, the headphones have a lot of drastically different specs and now I'm super confused on what to buy.
Choice 1 is the SoundMagic E80C
https://soundmagicheadphones.com/products/soundmagic-e80c-in-ear-isolating-earphones-with-mic
(scroll to specifications)
It has- compared to Choice 2- a lower frequency range (15Hz - 22KHz), but a higher sensitivity (102dB) and impedance (64 Ohms).
In fact, I bought them already and like them, but wondering if Choice 2 would be better.
Buyer's remorse combined with confusion of headphone spec meanings. UGH!
Choice 2 is the 1More Quad Driver Headphones
https://usa.1more.com/products/1more-quad-driver-in-ear-headphones
(Again, scroll to Specs)
It has- compared to Choice 1- a higher frequency range (20 - 40,000Hz), but a lower sensitivity (99dB) and impedance (32 Ohms). On top of that, it has 4 drivers and is THX certified (if that means anything with the V30).
Now, here's the reason for my confusion. Everyone here on XDA and many other sites are praising the V30's Quad-Dac, but say that it won't kick in under 50 Ohms. This is making me believe that higher impedance is better, so I need Choice 1 (why I bought it). However, audiophile websites are saying something like (based on my understanding) higher frequency is better and so is sensitivity. This is making me wonder if Choice 2 is actually better for me because the sensitivity is only slightly lower than Choice 1, but the frequency is almost double of Choice 1. They say too that bigger drivers aren't necessarily better, so... Choice 1 again?
So, after hours of research, buyer's remorse (wondering if I made the correct purchase), and my brain frying from confusion, I ask my fellow V30 owners:
Can you help me make a buying decision? Did I make a good decision and should keep the SoundMagic E80C, or should I return them and pay more for the 1More Quad-Drivers?
This decision needs to be based on the music I listen to and I don't want bassy headphones intended for hip-hop, rap, etc.
Thank you, Community and I look forward to seeing what you all have to say.
SOUND MAGIC E80: Superb, for in-ear headphones*. There may be something to the idea that higher impedance headphones have better sound quality by virtue of higher intensity magnetic field produced by more wire turns, e.g. better damping & control, faster response, etc. (E80 has 64 Ohm impedance, relatively high for in-ears and enough to trigger the V30 high impedance mode.)
The "C" suffix means some form of inline controls, there is (or was) also an "S" suffix model denoting inline controls. I got the version without inline controls, the E80.
On the other headphone with quad drivers: I tried a 1More triple driver, and the sound was muddy. My guess is that multiple drivers may introduce problems with intermodulation and also crossovers if those are used. Just a guess. Haven't tried the quad driver version, but after finding the E80, I have no need to.
(* In-ears have their own drawbacks, including effect on audio quality related to placement and seal in the ear, and "microphonics" aka noise conducted to the headphone from mechanical movement of cables. I accept those issues as the trade-off for the advantages of in-ears for use while exercising etc. The cable noise can be reduced by looping the cable over the ear.)
...
I have both and prefer the Soundmagic by far.
Whichever earbuds you get, don't forget to easily root that phone(Magisk necessary), use WhiskeyOmega's mod for utilizing the advanced Dac preset always and installing Viper4Android.
XCaliburX said:
Whichever earbuds you get, don't forget to easily root that phone(Magisk necessary), use WhiskeyOmega's mod for utilizing the advanced Dac preset always and installing Viper4Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not interested in rooting and last I checked, the ATT variant isnt rootable. (See edit) I rooted the V20 and found it to have been a complete waste of my time. It just didnt add anything useful for me.
I also had installed Viper4Android on the V20 and the Play Store kept disabling it because it thought it was malware or something. It was SUPER annoying to deal with on a daily basis and don't want to deal with it on my V30. Plus, I don't need it anyways since I said I don't use equalizer settings and prefer the settings to be flat. It sounds better that way. It sounds like how the bands intended their music to sound. (At least I feel that way)ñ
Edit: I think I'm wrong. I guess all variants except the T-Mobile one have root now? Still not interested though.
Tinkerer_ said:
SOUND MAGIC E80: Superb, for in-ear headphones*. There may be something to the idea that higher impedance headphones have better sound quality by virtue of higher intensity magnetic field produced by more wire turns, e.g. better damping & control, faster response, etc. (E80 has 64 Ohm impedance, relatively high for in-ears and enough to trigger the V30 high impedance mode.)
The "C" suffix means some form of inline controls, there is (or was) also an "S" suffix model denoting inline controls. I got the version without inline controls, the E80.
On the other headphone with quad drivers: I tried a 1More triple driver, and the sound was muddy. My guess is that multiple drivers may introduce problems with intermodulation and also crossovers if those are used. Just a guess. Haven't tried the quad driver version, but after finding the E80, I have no need to.
(* In-ears have their own drawbacks, including effect on audio quality related to placement and seal in the ear, and "microphonics" aka noise conducted to the headphone from mechanical movement of cables. I accept those issues as the trade-off for the advantages of in-ears for use while exercising etc. The cable noise can be reduced by looping the cable over the ear.)
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
bilbo60 said:
I have both and prefer the Soundmagic by far.
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Click to collapse
Thanks you two!
I think I'll keep the Soundmagic E80C's. After thinking about things a bit more (and reading opinions), the E80C's seem to be a better deal. They sound great, but cost less than the 1Mores do. So more bang for the buck I guess.
e80 are not flat, they are quite bright and unbalanced and they lack bass like any other soundmagic E-series out there.
1more quad on the other side are as flat as inear headphones cand be, are balanced and have superb sound stage. they are not harsh on highs (like 1more triple are). they are not muddy or warm or bright, they sound almost like my monitor speakers i have on the desk which i can asure you that they are as flat as any speakers can be.
but if you prefer soundmagic, i think that you might not know what flat sound is...
i tried e10, e50, e80 and decided to spend more money and get something that has more quality because my years really hurt and not even a week on them couldn't get used to the very bright sound they have, which did not happen when i was using 1more quad.
i don't even know how you compare these two because the 1more is almost 4 times more expensive than e80...
if you want something that really sounds good you should also look at Shure SE846
and seach whathifi forum because here, on xda, i had arguments with people saying that there is no difference between bluetooth and wire...
and another mistake you made is that in the audiophile world you cannot speak of "bang for the buck" because you cannot find the best cheap ones out there, it's simply like this: if you want quality, you pay because if you buy something that is cheaper you cannot get the sound of a high quality earphones by using cheapr ones and apply some "tricks" on them, you just have a lower quality sound. (quality can be described in may aspects, some even call themselves audiophile and praise the "extra bass" sticker on some sony boxes)
but many people out there do not understand this.
iRS_ said:
e80 are not flat, they are quite bright and unbalanced and they lack bass like any other soundmagic E-series out there.
1more quad on the other side are as flat as inear headphones cand be, are balanced and have superb sound stage. they are not harsh on highs (like 1more triple are). they are not muddy or warm or bright, they sound almost like my monitor speakers i have on the desk which i can asure you that they are as flat as any speakers can be.
but if you prefer soundmagic, i think that you might not know what flat sound is...
i tried e10, e50, e80 and decided to spend more money and get something that has more quality because my years really hurt and not even a week on them couldn't get used to the very bright sound they have, which did not happen when i was using 1more quad.
i don't even know how you compare these two because the 1more is almost 4 times more expensive than e80...
if you want something that really sounds good you should also look at Shure SE846
and seach whathifi forum because here, on xda, i had arguments with people saying that there is no difference between bluetooth and wire...
and another mistake you made is that in the audiophile world you cannot speak of "bang for the buck" because you cannot find the best cheap ones out there, it's simply like this: if you want quality, you pay because if you buy something that is cheaper you cannot get the sound of a high quality earphones by using cheapr ones and apply some "tricks" on them, you just have a lower quality sound. (quality can be described in may aspects, some even call themselves audiophile and praise the "extra bass" sticker on some sony boxes)
but many people out there do not understand this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As noted, in-ear headphones designed to seal against the outer ear canal are very sensitive to fitment and seal. This is one of their drawbacks, and also produces widely varying opinions about any given headphone model.
I can produce a wide range of response (audio quality) with the E80 and any other headphone of this type simply by adjusting the fit, and also by using different tips. The bass is especially affected.
Even when a good fit and seal is obtained, the fit tends to loosen with use and user movement, one must periodically reseat the headphones to restore the seal.
Also, even if a tip produces a good seal, it may produce inferior audio quality compared to another tip, depending on headphone and individual user ear canal shape. For example, the Comply tips produce inferior sound quality in my ears compared to the base silicone tips of the E80. I suspect because the Complys have a longer and thinner opening "duct" and more absorbent material, which veil more of the driver, constrict airflow more, and absorb more sound energy than the silicone tips.
The E80 produce excellent response across the frequency range for me with the large silicone tips, when firmly seated just-so. If they are not seated just right, the quality suffers, just like all other sealing type in-ears. I'm comparing to two good standalone stereos and also other headphones.
No offense, but the Shure line is typically poor quality audio. They roll off at about 16-18kHz, producing noticeably dull sound compared to decent headphones. They made their name in professional monitors, which are intended for reliablility and durability, for use by performers, not high fidelity.
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Tinkerer_ said:
As noted, in-ear headphones designed to seal against the outer ear canal are very sensitive to fitment and seal. This is one of their drawbacks, and also produces widely varying opinions about any given headphone model.
I can produce a wide range of response (audio quality) with the E80 and any other headphone of this type simply by adjusting the fit, and also by using different tips. The bass is especially affected.
Even when a good fit and seal is obtained, the fit tends to loosen with use and user movement, one must periodically reseat the headphones to restore the seal.
Also, even if a tip produces a good seal, it may produce inferior audio quality compared to another tip, depending on headphone and individual user ear canal shape. For example, the Comply tips produce inferior sound quality in my ears compared to the base silicone tips of the E80. I suspect because the Complys have a longer and thinner opening "duct" and more absorbent material, which veil more of the driver, constrict airflow more, and absorb more sound energy than the silicone tips.
The E80 produce excellent response across the frequency range for me with the large silicone tips, when firmly seated just-so. If they are not seated just right, the quality suffers, just like all other sealing type in-ears. I'm comparing to two good standalone stereos and also other headphones.
No offense, but the Shure line is typically poor quality audio. They roll off at about 16-18kHz, producing noticeably dull sound compared to decent headphones. They made their name in professional monitors, which are intended for reliablility and durability, for use by performers, not high fidelity.
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yet you spoke only about the sealing which is important indeed, but i was speaking about the drive capabilities of the earphone itself asuming perfect sealing.
even so... for my ears the 1more quad has the best seal and i never need to refit them even when i am out with my bike or running.
foam tips never give a good seal but they are a little more comfortable over long periods of time (several hours)
if the fit tends to lose it might mean that the e80 are not for your ears and you should try to find some other that do not have fitting problems.
professional studio monitors are not made with reliablility and durability being the first in mind but the sound reproduction to be as flat as possible which helps the sound producer to hear and correct the mistakes he made during composition.
every standalone stereos have colorised sound compared to studio monitors which are flat.
i was trying to make a point in flat sound because that si what op was asking for.
if you are saying that shure se846 are low quality earphones and e80 are superior in terms of sound quality, then... we have a problem.
which, unfortunately, you cannot correct.
it is curious how you say that foam tips produce lower quality sound because of the sealing problems...
what you hear is not lower quality sound because you are using them in a way they were not supposed to. you need that good sealing!
it's not the size of the duct, or the asbsorbing material, it's the sealing.
out of curiosity, what are the speakers you compared to and the other decent headphones?
iRS_ said:
yet you spoke only about the sealing which is important indeed, but i was speaking about the drive capabilities of the earphone itself asuming perfect sealing.
even so... for my ears the 1more quad has the best seal and i never need to refit them even when i am out with my bike or running.
foam tips never give a good seal but they are a little more comfortable over long periods of time (several hours)
if the fit tends to lose it might mean that the e80 are not for your ears and you should try to find some other that do not have fitting problems.
professional studio monitors are not made with reliablility and durability being the first in mind but the sound reproduction to be as flat as possible which helps the sound producer to hear and correct the mistakes he made during composition.
every standalone stereos have colorised sound compared to studio monitors which are flat.
i was trying to make a point in flat sound because that si what op was asking for.
if you are saying that shure se846 are low quality earphones and e80 are superior in terms of sound quality, then... we have a problem.
which, unfortunately, you cannot correct.
it is curious how you say that foam tips produce lower quality sound because of the sealing problems...
what you hear is not lower quality sound because you are using them in a way they were not supposed to. you need that good sealing!
it's not the size of the duct, or the asbsorbing material, it's the sealing.
out of curiosity, what are the speakers you compared to and the other decent headphones?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I refer to professional in-ear monitors used by performers on stage, such as made by Shure. These are quite different than headphones used in a studio for mixing and production, which are made for accurate audio.
I have not tried all Shure in-ears, but the ones I tried performed as one would expect judging by the specs indicating complete rolloff at 16-17 kHz. That is completely missing at least the top 4 kHz of nominal human hearing range, and the sound was pathetic. Dull, lifeless.
I suspect that this may be related to the use of heavier materials (for durability), which lower the upper natural frequency response due to greater inertia of moving parts.
I compare with a standalone system using an NAD receiver with Klipsch RF-3 speakers plus Klipsch 15" sub, and another with NAD preamp, AVA amp, and Infinite Slope speakers (no longer in business).
Headphones are a personal preference matter, the disagreements and debates never end. No doubt, many who find dull headphones e.g. Shure that only extend to 17 kHz to be "good", will say that other headphones that extend to 20 kHz and above (upper hearing frequency ranges) are "too bright", To each their own, I prefer to hear the full range including both upper and lower frequencies, of the music.
Best thing to do is buy a few different headphones to try from sellers with good return policies. Then you can decide for yourself.
...
Tinkerer_ said:
I refer to professional in-ear monitors used by performers on stage, such as made by Shure. These are quite different than headphones used in a studio for mixing and production, which are made for accurate audio.
I have not tried all Shure in-ears, but the ones I tried performed as one would expect judging by the specs indicating complete rolloff at 16-17 kHz. That is completely missing at least the top 4 kHz of nominal human hearing range, and the sound was pathetic. Dull, lifeless.
I suspect that this may be related to the use of heavier materials (for durability), which lower the upper natural frequency response due to greater inertia of moving parts.
I compare with a standalone system using an NAD receiver with Klipsch RF-3 speakers plus Klipsch 15" sub, and another with NAD preamp, AVA amp, and Infinite Slope speakers (no longer in business).
Headphones are a personal preference matter, the disagreements and debates never end. No doubt, many who find dull headphones e.g. Shure that only extend to 17 kHz to be "good", will say that other headphones that extend to 20 kHz and above (upper hearing frequency ranges) are "too bright", To each their own, I prefer to hear the full range including both upper and lower frequencies, of the music.
Best thing to do is buy a few different headphones to try from sellers with good return policies. Then you can decide for yourself.
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, professional in-ear monitors have a different purpose and i never used a pair. i think that nobody compose music only using headphones and everyone has a pair of monitors which sound very different compared to normal speakers which are made to soung 'good'. that's why i felt a big difference between a dac for audition and a audio interface designed for audio composition (burson conductor and audient id4). i liked the audient more becuse it sounds more natural. i always disable all effects from audio players and drivers.
i have tried only these shures (856) and i liked them (yes, they are a bit warm), nut i like more 1morequad and above all the speakers i have (m3-8)
i have done some tests and i cannot hear much above 17khz and even at this frequency it needs to be really amped to hear it clarly (or the source was bad)
brightness of a headphone doesn't mean that they extend to 20khz or above, it means that the hights are way louder than the rest of the range (i think that you already knew this). i think that what you are trying to say is that every headphone has its own signature and not all humans hear the same, but because of this debate never ends.
one fact is clear, after using the soundmagic for a week i had to sell them because they were literally hurting my ears and had to boy something else.
i do not know if you tried the 1more quad but the sound they produce are more clear and bit warmer than soundmagic (maybe because the highs are not that much amplified) and i can use them for a whole day without having any problems. (yes, same volume for both on modded nexus 5x and then high impedance mode for lg v30)
i also prefer to hear the full range but i do not prefer to sacrifice the lows for more highs.
other courious thought i have is that your audio equipment is way above soundmagic e80 yet you say they sound very good...
Hello friends i want to buy V30 plus because it has DAC, my doubt is whether i can use 32ohms earphone? will this sound good. Because i could see LG V30 plus supporting only above 50 ohms. is it true? please help. i have 1more quad drive earphones which so great in clarity.
P.K.Shivaram said:
Hello friends i want to buy V30 plus because it has DAC, my doubt is whether i can use 32ohms earphone? will this sound good. Because i could see LG V30 plus supporting only above 50 ohms. is it true? please help. i have 1more quad drive earphones which so great in clarity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It "supports" all earphones. It will adjust to make any earphones sound good.
Without root only those with about 50 ohms or more will get HIM (high impedance mode). Your can artificially trigger that by adding short 3.5mm accessory impedance plug with any earphones or through root.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v30/themes/whiskeyomegas-v30-sound-mods-t3757115
ChazzMatt said:
It "supports" all earphones. It will adjust to make any earphones sound good.
Without root only those with about 50 ohms or more will get HIM ((high impedance mode). Your can artificially trigger that by adding short 3.5mm accessory impedance plug with any earphones or through root.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v30/themes/whiskeyomegas-v30-sound-mods-t3757115
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks dude for the reply.:good:
TinAudio T2. 45$. mind blowing
Personally I think the 1more Triple Drivers are a better value (and sound just as good) as the 1more quads.
Hey everybody! I got my "SoundMAGIC E80S RED Reference Series Flagship Noise Isolating In-Ear Headphones with Microphone and Remote for all Smartphones + Extra eartips" yesterday.
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01N0U9YMM/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
So far I'm VERY pleased with them in comparison to the GGMM C800's I was using before:
https://smile.amazon.com/GGMM-Isola...qid=1536606946&sr=1-1&keywords=GGMM+C800&th=1
I actually felt like I NEEDED to get the new headphones because I was having a weird thing with the GGMM's where I couldn't get the volume loud enough even with the volume all the way up and ViPER4Andoid tweaks. It wasn't always that way but has become a recent issue.
Now with these SoundMAGIC E80S ones the sound is SUPER loud. I don't have the Hi-Fi Quad DAC volume set above like 33 and that's already quite loud. Actually this morning I had to tweak the Hi-Fi Quad DAC and ViPER4Android settings because the highs were so clear that it was actually painful. I was using the Magisk module for ViPER4Android 2.5.0.5 but I removed that and put the unofficial ViPER4Android 2.6.0.5 from "Team_DeWitt" in /system/priv-app instead:
https://labs.xda-developers.com/store/app/com.pittvandewitt.viperfx
So far it's working well except that it sometimes crashes and I have to restart it. The 2.5.0.5 Magisk version had problems where it would frequently go to "Processing: No" and I had to reboot to get it working again. This unofficial 2.6.0.5 version seems to have fixed that, which is awesome! Also on the 2.5.0.5 I was having a problem with some Convolver impulse response files (such as SRS_1-1.irs) where the volume would constantly dip for fractions of a second. It drove me nuts and I THINK so far that this 2.6.0.5 has fixed that too!
So anyway these SoundMAGIC E80S headphones are pretty freaking amazing. I needed to tweak the DAC and V4A but right now my ears are in heaven!
Hello everyone, so I got the V30 in israel with LG earbuds and not the B&O ones, am loving the sound with the Quad Dac but am looking for better sound quality
am more into earbuds than headphones, my question is which are some good quality earbuds to enjoy the V30, my budget is around 100$
Thanks
Lots of discussion here:
Share the current headphones you are using and a link to where you purchased them.
The three that keep being mentioned as great are:
Soundmagic E80
SoundMAGIC E80S (S = microphone)
They both have 64 ohms to trigger High Impedance Mode (need 50 ohms or more).
As well as...
1MORE Triple Driver
1MORE Triple Driver doesn't trigger HIM but still sounds very good.
KZ (Knowledge Zenith) AS10 (?) is supposed to be quite decent for its price (5 balanced armatures per side, BA/balanced armatures only headphones) ordered these but haven't gotten them yet
The Xiaomi Hybrid Pro HD are unfortunately NOT recommendable (excellent headphones, clarity, 2 BA and 1 dynamic driver per side) but they have extreme "random" digital wheezing/noise on the left channel for whatever reason - it's "fixed" in default mode in my kernel but SABRE ("quad") DAC mode is still showing that behavior: https://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v30/help/headphone-static-xiaomi-hybrid-pro-hd-t3876390
so beware !
https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/tinaudio-t2.22715/reviews
TinAudio T2
and
https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/tin-audio-t2-pro.23324/reviews
TinAudio T2 Pro
are "neutral" calibrated/sounding IEMs and seem to be highly recommended ones among audiophiles
1more Triple or Dual headphones are also recommended quality/output wise
IEMs = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In-ear_monitor
got Sony XHB-H3 plugs / at home i use my old battered F1 (12 Ohm only..)
Tip: use a short 4pin-extension cable .. stuck in first (__without__ headphone) to trigger high/infinite-impedance mode . . it stays that way then when you plug in the phone into the cable. of course u have to be carefull with volumen then ..
works the same as in V10 ...but the frontend does not tell you anymore what impedance (low/high/infinte) it detects
I have 1More Quad Drivers, LG branded Beoplay H3, ZeroAudio Carbo Tenore, B&O labeled generic LG earbuds, Sennheiser Momentum in-ears: I must say none of them are a good match wtih my V30 Plus.
I am running the QuadDAC active at all times and have purchased and installed the "Hi-Fi Status (LG) " application and it reports all of these earphones working in normal Hi-Fi mode. When I use the "insert an 3.5 adapter or extender cable" hack, Hi-Fi Status app reports the earphones working in Aux - External Audio Device Mode; not in High Impedence Device mode. The sound quality in Aux mode is definitely worser than High impendence mode when used with in-ear earphones. So, you should not rely on any adapter hack and aim to purchase an ear-phone with 50+ Ohm impedence.
The fact that even 1More Quad Drivers is not a good match is really surprising and annoying - that earphone sound amazingly clear and enjoyable on almost all smartphones.
If you can spend a bit more, people are going crazy for BGVP DM6 which is around 200 USD on Massdrop etc; it has a much lower impedence, but apparently sound amazing with all kinds of sources.
I know you want an in-ear earphone, but when you decide to go the on-ear headphones; I can recommend "Beyerdymanic DT770 Pro 80 Ohm" - my god, it makes me want to dance no matter what I listen to; I enjoy its sound so much. DT770 Pro has the following versions as far as I know : 16 Ohm/32 Ohm/80 Ohm/250 Ohm - 80 Ohm is the one that triggers High Impendence Mode and you get loud sound around 40/75 loudness; from 50/75 you get enjoyable sound on busses etc. A great headphone match for V30 Plus.
eyupo92 said:
I have 1More Quad Drivers, LG branded Beoplay H3, ZeroAudio Carbo Tenore, B&O labeled generic LG earbuds, Sennheiser Momentum in-ears: I must say none of them are a good match wtih my V30 Plus.
The fact that even 1More Quad Drivers is not a good match is really surprising and annoying - that earphone sound amazingly clear and enjoyable on almost all smartphones..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll copy and paste, because you didn't read. None of these three below are over $100 U.S, and two of them are only $50 U.S.
_________
Lots of discussion here:
Share the current headphones you are using and a link to where you purchased them.
The three that keep being mentioned as great are:
Soundmagic E80
SoundMAGIC E80S (S = microphone)
They both have 64 ohms to trigger High Impedance Mode (need 50 ohms or more).
As well as...
1MORE Triple Driver
1MORE Triple Driver doesn't trigger HIM but still sounds very good.
Have a look at Etymotic Research hf3. Highly recommended if you like analytical sound.
eyupo92 said:
I have 1More Quad Drivers, LG branded Beoplay H3, ZeroAudio Carbo Tenore, B&O labeled generic LG earbuds, Sennheiser Momentum in-ears: I must say none of them are a good match wtih my V30 Plus.
I am running the QuadDAC active at all times and have purchased and installed the "Hi-Fi Status (LG) " application and it reports all of these earphones working in normal Hi-Fi mode. When I use the "insert an 3.5 adapter or extender cable" hack, Hi-Fi Status app reports the earphones working in Aux - External Audio Device Mode; not in High Impedence Device mode. The sound quality in Aux mode is definitely worser than High impendence mode when used with in-ear earphones. So, you should not rely on any adapter hack and aim to purchase an ear-phone with 50+ Ohm impedence.
The fact that even 1More Quad Drivers is not a good match is really surprising and annoying - that earphone sound amazingly clear and enjoyable on almost all smartphones.
If you can spend a bit more, people are going crazy for BGVP DM6 which is around 200 USD on Massdrop etc; it has a much lower impedence, but apparently sound amazing with all kinds of sources.
I know you want an in-ear earphone, but when you decide to go the on-ear headphones; I can recommend "Beyerdymanic DT770 Pro 80 Ohm" - my god, it makes me want to dance no matter what I listen to; I enjoy its sound so much. DT770 Pro has the following versions as far as I know : 16 Ohm/32 Ohm/80 Ohm/250 Ohm - 80 Ohm is the one that triggers High Impendence Mode and you get loud sound around 40/75 loudness; from 50/75 you get enjoyable sound on busses etc. A great headphone match for V30 Plus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does the Beyerdymanic DT770 Pro 80 Ohm support Hi-RES audio which is 44KHZ?
P.K.Shivaram said:
Does the Beyerdymanic DT770 Pro 80 Ohm support Hi-RES audio which is 44KHZ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No idea on that; from what I have seen, it should be able to do that. I don't think the 44KHz stuff is related to headphones, it shoudl be related to the DAC chips capability; the headphones get some electrical signals; that's it.
I have listened to tracks ranging from 128K mp3 to 320K mp3, 256K AAC, 16/44 FLAC, 24/96 FLAC and 24/192 FLAC using LG music app, Poweramp; USB Audio Player Pro; then listened to Tidal FLAC tracks both 16/44 FLAC's to 24/192 MQA formats.
And I wanted to dance in all of these formats; for example I could barely hold myself on tracks like Bob Dylan's Things Have Changed and Bruce Springsteen's Cover Me or Dancing In the Dark to start shaking. It really made the music sound joyful.
---------- Post added at 03:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:37 PM ----------
eyupo92 said:
No idea on that; from what I have seen, it should be able to do that. I don't think the 44KHz stuff is related to headphones, it shoudl be related to the DAC chips capability; the headphones get some electrical signals; that's it.
I have listened to tracks ranging from 128K mp3 to 320K mp3, 256K AAC, 16/44 FLAC, 24/96 FLAC and 24/192 FLAC using LG music app, Poweramp; USB Audio Player Pro; then listened to Tidal FLAC tracks both 16/44 FLAC's to 24/192 MQA formats.
And I wanted to dance in all of these formats; for example I could barely hold myself on tracks like Bob Dylan's Things Have Changed and Bruce Springsteen's Cover Me or Dancing In the Dark to start shaking. It really made the music sound joyful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi-Res Certification from Japan Audio Society requires the headphones to output at least 40,000 Hz to be Hi-Res certified: http://www.jas-audio.or.jp/english/hi-res-logo-en
DT770 Pro Frequencey Response range is 5 Hz - 35,000 Hz; so in that sense DT770 Pro is not Hi-Res certified : https://europe.beyerdynamic.com/dt-770-pro.html
---------- Post added at 03:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:43 PM ----------
eyupo92 said:
No idea on that; from what I have seen, it should be able to do that. I don't think the 44KHz stuff is related to headphones, it shoudl be related to the DAC chips capability; the headphones get some electrical signals; that's it.
I have listened to tracks ranging from 128K mp3 to 320K mp3, 256K AAC, 16/44 FLAC, 24/96 FLAC and 24/192 FLAC using LG music app, Poweramp; USB Audio Player Pro; then listened to Tidal FLAC tracks both 16/44 FLAC's to 24/192 MQA formats.
And I wanted to dance in all of these formats; for example I could barely hold myself on tracks like Bob Dylan's Things Have Changed and Bruce Springsteen's Cover Me or Dancing In the Dark to start shaking. It really made the music sound joyful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi-Res Certification from Japan Audio Society requires the headphones to output at least 40,000 Hz to be Hi-Res certified: http://www.jas-audio.or.jp/english/hi-res-logo-en
DT770 Pro Frequencey Response range is 5 Hz - 35,000 Hz; so in that sense DT770 Pro is not Hi-Res certified : https://europe.beyerdynamic.com/dt-770-pro.html
eyupo92 said:
The sound quality in Aux mode is definitely worser than High impendence mode when used with in-ear earphones. So, you should not rely on any adapter hack and aim to purchase an ear-phone with 50+ Ohm impedence.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that might be . but the sound-quality in Aux-Mode (600 Ohm+) is definitely BETTER than in no-headamp-mode (below 50 OHms whatever)
i listen with my XBAs on the V10 this way (with extension. in aux-mode) for the last 2 years ..
*_*
I've found that the D/A on this phone sounds really good - easily comparable to my studio D/A (Allen & Heath) in AB testing. My last phone, a Oneplus 5T, was noticeably harsher. So I decided to do some analysis. I generated white noise at 24bit/96khz, it looks like this in Ableton Live (attachment 1). Note that this sample rate represents 48khz of sound waves.
When running it out and back through my Allen & Heath studio AD/DA there is some drop off from 20khz and upwards, but the low pass filter is nice and steep right before Nyquist (2).
When playing it back from the Sony Xperia 5 II, the signal stays stable all the way up to the low pass, which is a bit softer than on the A&H (3). For a mobile phone, I'd say that's impressive.
While we're at it, let's see what the DSEE Ultimate algorithm does. Here's the noise compressed to a 128kbit MP3, which dutifully cuts off around 15khz (4). With DSEE turned on, there appears to be no difference (5). Since the algorithm is supposedly trained on musical material, I performed the same test on low bitrate Spotify material, but there was no measurable difference: Low bitrate Spotify without DSEE (6). Note how good the frequency response on OGG is, compared to MP3. Spotify with DSEE - level difference is due to dynamic material (7).
Just as a side note, the DSEE Ultimate algorithm seems to low pass everything at 48khz sample rate, even uncompressed 96khz signals (8).
And in what comes as a shock to no one, the frequency analyzer shows that Dolby Atmos applies different EQ curves in the different modes (Dynamic, Film, Music) and also raises the overall sound volume with roughly 1.2 LUFS for dramatic effect ? Atmos also limits the output to 48khz like DSEE. So in conclusion, the D/A is real and the algorithms are marketing gimmicks to my ears. Please comment if you've experienced otherwise, would love to hear what you think!
I have no clue what you said but I think you're right
I think the hardware has great quality, but in terms of software, I'm not a huge fan of Dolby Atmos, only on phone speaker Atmos is fine. For headphones I'd like to use ViperFX but I haven't found out how to install it yet.
(Anyone has an idea how to install it?)
Dolby doesnt have seperate settings for headphones/speakers/bt so I'll have to change it manually each time I switch audio outputs
Also, with D/A, do you mean the DAC?
You're right, I've found myself using Atmos just to get some loudness from the internal speakers when listening to podcasts etc.
Rageplay said:
Also, with D/A, do you mean the DAC?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, maybe D/A is not the most common term :laugh:
woodcarver said:
I've found that the D/A on this phone sounds really good - easily comparable to my studio D/A (Allen & Heath) in AB testing. My last phone, a Oneplus 5T, was noticeably harsher. So I decided to do some analysis. I generated white noise at 24bit/96khz, it looks like this in Ableton Live (attachment 1). Note that this sample rate represents 48khz of sound waves.
When running it out and back through my Allen & Heath studio AD/DA there is some drop off from 20khz and upwards, but the low pass filter is nice and steep right before Nyquist (2).
When playing it back from the Sony Xperia 5 II, the signal stays stable all the way up to the low pass, which is a bit softer than on the A&H (3). For a mobile phone, I'd say that's impressive.
While we're at it, let's see what the DSEE Ultimate algorithm does. Here's the noise compressed to a 128kbit MP3, which dutifully cuts off around 15khz (4). With DSEE turned on, there appears to be no difference (5). Since the algorithm is supposedly trained on musical material, I performed the same test on low bitrate Spotify material, but there was no measurable difference: Low bitrate Spotify without DSEE (6). Note how good the frequency response on OGG is, compared to MP3. Spotify with DSEE - level difference is due to dynamic material (7).
Just as a side note, the DSEE Ultimate algorithm seems to low pass everything at 48khz sample rate, even uncompressed 96khz signals (8).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The DAC/Amp is definitely great on this device so far. I have Dolby Atmos and DSEE Ultimate on and it sounds great with FLACS and extreme quality spotify. It isn't the most powerful Amp though, using my Sennheiser HD 6XX's, its not super loud, even at max volume. The fidelity is fantastic across the whole volume range however. I think it will perform fantastically with a high quality set of IEM's.
Jayram2000 said:
The DAC/Amp is definitely great on this device so far. I have Dolby Atmos and DSEE Ultimate on and it sounds great with FLACS and extreme quality spotify. It isn't the most powerful Amp though, using my Sennheiser HD 6XX's, its not super loud, even at max volume. The fidelity is fantastic across the whole volume range however. I think it will perform fantastically with a high quality set of IEM's.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you set Atmos to Dynamic or music?
woodcarver said:
I've found that the D/A on this phone sounds really good - easily comparable to my studio D/A (Allen & Heath) in AB testing. My last phone, a Oneplus 5T, was noticeably harsher. So I decided to do some analysis. I generated white noise at 24bit/96khz, it looks like this in Ableton Live (attachment 1). Note that this sample rate represents 48khz of sound waves.
When running it out and back through my Allen & Heath studio AD/DA there is some drop off from 20khz and upwards, but the low pass filter is nice and steep right before Nyquist (2).
When playing it back from the Sony Xperia 5 II, the signal stays stable all the way up to the low pass, which is a bit softer than on the A&H (3). For a mobile phone, I'd say that's impressive.
While we're at it, let's see what the DSEE Ultimate algorithm does. Here's the noise compressed to a 128kbit MP3, which dutifully cuts off around 15khz (4). With DSEE turned on, there appears to be no difference (5). Since the algorithm is supposedly trained on musical material, I performed the same test on low bitrate Spotify material, but there was no measurable difference: Low bitrate Spotify without DSEE (6). Note how good the frequency response on OGG is, compared to MP3. Spotify with DSEE - level difference is due to dynamic material (7).
Just as a side note, the DSEE Ultimate algorithm seems to low pass everything at 48khz sample rate, even uncompressed 96khz signals (8).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see any attachments but your analysis of DSEE Ultimate is very good.
woodcarver said:
And in what comes as a shock to no one, the frequency analyzer shows that Dolby Atmos applies different EQ curves in the different modes (Dynamic, Film, Music) and also raises the overall sound volume with roughly 1.2 LUFS for dramatic effect ? Atmos also limits the output to 48khz like DSEE. So in conclusion, the D/A is real and the algorithms are marketing gimmicks to my ears. Please comment if you've experienced otherwise, would love to hear what you think!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a shame that this Dolby was specially tuned and yet involves such simple tweaks...terrible marketing.