so, I decided to bust out the Shure se846's and take the quad dac on the new V60, out for a spin tonight, and wow what a disappointment...
issue:
low volume issues with known hires test FLAC tracks...
its almost like its having processing issues and the volume fluctuates...
same track sounds okay with the DAC off, but when I enabled the quad dac, it sounded terrible (should have gotten better)
I tried this with both:
USB Audio Player 5.5.2
Neutron Player 2.13.2
tracks tested:
Arnesen: MAGNIFIC 24bit, 352.8kHz FLAC
output level:
volume set to 20 is where the problem was noticed the most
happens to all my hires FLAC tracks, this track it's noticed from the get go...
DSD Files have the same issue in DSD Direct mode in Neutron...
I tried the test file on External SD and on internal storage...same effect.
...anyone else having issues?
I knew I shouldn't have sold my V30 just yet...
update: the problem does not exist using AptX-HD with Bluetooth (but its not the same as real hardwire sound quality...)
What is impedience of Shure 865?
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
psawjack said:
What is impedance of Shure 865?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry was a typo, they are se846 IEM's at 9ohms.
My issue is with files that are greater than 96khz files
Anything I have that is 24bit 96khz plays just fine...
but the uber high 352.8khz files kills the DAC's quality...
Try this app and let me know what the settings are. I might be able to help from there.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.apptrio.hi_fi_status
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
psawjack said:
Try this app and let me know what the settings are. I might be able to help from there.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.apptrio.hi_fi_status
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have it... doesn't help.
I only tested 24bit 96kHz files before I sold my v30...
This Quad DAC sucks... I can't even find what chip they are using...
No I need to know the settings. It's not supposed to help anything just give information.
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
psawjack said:
No I need to know the settings. It's not supposed to help anything just give information.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
https://i.imgur.com/A71QQ8E.png
https://i.imgur.com/cpweve2.png
...sorry, it won't let me post a screenshot...
So you see normal when shures are plugged in?
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
psawjack said:
So you see normal when shures are plugged in?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, because they only register as 9ohms
...again it only happens with 352.8khz files at low volume
slyguy2000 said:
Yes, because they only register as 9ohms
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay thanks.
Check this out. This may help with your issue. It worked for me. I use hard to drive planers with low impedience.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=77959304
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
...that only triggers the amp, to kick in... doesn't affect quality. I'm Using exact same settings, files, apps, and IEM's my old V30, that sound was amazing...
psawjack said:
Okay thanks.
Check this out. This may help with your issue. It worked for me. I use hard to drive planers with low impedience.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=77959304
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That only triggers the amp to kick in, doesn't affect the quality... on my v60, sounds like, the dac can't keep up with the 352.8khz files... I'll open a ticket with LG...
slyguy2000 said:
That only triggers the amp to kick in, doesn't affect the quality... on my v60, sounds like, the dac can't keep up with the 352.8khz files... I'll open a ticket with LG...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay good luck to you on it. I just tested a dsd file with dac on and off. I didn't have any substandard quality issues.
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
psawjack said:
Okay good luck to you on it. I just tested a dsd file with dac on and off. I didn't have any substandard quality issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ticket opened... maybe they will replace mine... this handset has been nothing but problems, out of the box... thanks for your time and assistance. I'll post the results once an engineer calls me.
slyguy2000 said:
Ticket opened... maybe they will replace mine... this handset has been nothing but problems, out of the box... thanks for your time and assistance. I'll post the results once an engineer calls me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah let us know how it goes.
Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk
AT&T is doing a hardware swap for free... seems isolated to my handset. Should have replacement handset by end of week...
defiantly a problem with the quad dac, and 352.8kHz HiRes FLAC processing at low volume... happens on 2 devices.
slyguy2000 said:
defiantly a problem with the quad dac, and 352.8kHz HiRes FLAC processing at low volume... happens on 2 devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can't hurt to try the fiio player or Onkyo HF player.
Sent from my HD1925 using Tapatalk
psawjack said:
Can't hurt to try the fiio player or Onkyo HF player.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yep, I dusted off the Fiio Q1 MkII, back to the colostomy sound brick...
at least my complaint was documented in a case with LG support.
The LG support tech couldn't even find the specs or anything on the DAC...they couldn't even tell me what one they are using in the V60... sounds shady
I was hoping it was still an ESS Sabre but who knows.
psawjack said:
Okay good luck to you on it. I just tested a dsd file with dac on and off. I didn't have any substandard quality issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
try something in 24bit 352.8kHz FLAC...put the volume really low
the levels are all over the place, and there is a slight almost like a processing problem...hard to explain
with good IEM's its really bad...
no issues at all with lower resolution FLAC audio
dsd does it too for me.
*remember you must turn on the DAC in Settings, with the DAC off, in low res, all my audio plays just fine...
Related
I've been considering for a while to buy a good headphones and I've decided to buy an audio technica ath-m50. The only thing that is bothering me is the yamaha audio chip. If I buy those headphones, I'll be using them most of the time on my sgs2.
Will the yamaha chip make the ath-m50 sound like a cheap low-end headphone?
If you happen to own an ath-m50 I wold really appreciate it if you could measure the hollow of the earth cups, diagonally and horizontally maybe. I've read that people with large ears may find them uncomfortable. The length of my ears are just below 7cm(I don't care, they are small, my mum told me that)
I've read supercurio's analysis of the audio chip but my question still remains.
Waiting eagerly for any response.
Get an iPod nano- excellent sound quality and a great price. I hate using my GSII for music though Poweramp is a great app
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
WagTwo said:
I've been considering for a while to buy a good headphones and I've decided to buy an audio technica ath-m50. The only thing that is bothering me is the yamaha audio chip. If I buy those headphones, I'll be using them most of the time on my sgs2.
Will the yamaha chip make the ath-m50 sound like a cheap low-end headphone?
If you happen to own an ath-m50 I wold really appreciate it if you could measure the hollow of the earth cups, diagonally and horizontally maybe. I've read that people with large ears may find them uncomfortable. The length of my ears are just below 7cm(I don't care, they are small, my mum told me that)
I've read supercurio's analysis of the audio chip but my question still remains.
Waiting eagerly for any response.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, if you really want to use a pair of high end headphones with the galaxy sII, get a portable amp like i did. I got a fiio e7, and it powers the ath-m50just fine. Listening to them straight out of the GSII audio jack wont let them utilise their full power. And dont get an iPod if you want really high quality audio. :-/ (Just a suggestion )
Sent from my GT-P7500 using XDA App
@OP go head and also look at this http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1405840
Nyssa1104 said:
@OP go head and also look at this http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1405840
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have bought that app even though I rarely use it because for me the s2 is loud enough. I'm more worried about the quality of the sound.
WagTwo said:
I have bought that app even though I rarely use it because for me the s2 is loud enough. I'm more worried about the quality of the sound.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It simple buddy take your handset into a store that sells these headsets and test the thing in house.
From there your should be able to make up your mind.
Nyssa1104 said:
It simple buddy take your handset into a store that sells these headsets and test the thing in house.
From there your should be able to make up your mind.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've thought of this, the only problem is finding a store that sells the audio technica ath-m50. I live in London I'm sure there is plenty of stores.
However this would not be much help because I'm not very experienced with high end headphones, so probably almost anything will sound good to me.
If you want to listen to boom boom music with heavy bass then the SGS2 is inadequate .Expensive headphones are not going to do that much .
However as a user who does not have any boom boom music i find stock player headphones or slightly upmarket low end Sennheiser headphones fine .
Power Amp for me strangely lowers sound output level .
jje
I've the same experience as JJEgan with Power Amp. It seems to boost dynamic range at the sacrifice of overall volume.
For getting the best out of high-end headphones, you could always try Neutron Music Player from Android Market. It claims to use its own "32-bit audio music rendering core", although it's debatable whether this makes a difference, given that uncompressed CDs only have 16-bits per sample. People seem to like it, though.
Just recently I noticed something when listening to music using Poweramp with a headphone.
When you click on something such as the app drawer, the volume of the music that you are listening to increases for fraction of a second then it goes back to normal.
It can be very annoying when you are using the phone while listening.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
Thanks for all the replies.
I've started to change my mind about buying an audio technica ath-m50, maybe I should stick with the headphones from poundland.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
Tephlon said:
I've the same experience as JJEgan with Power Amp. It seems to boost dynamic range at the sacrifice of overall volume.
For getting the best out of high-end headphones, you could always try Neutron Music Player from Android Market. It claims to use its own "32-bit audio music rendering core", although it's debatable whether this makes a difference, given that uncompressed CDs only have 16-bits per sample. People seem to like it, though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tried Neutron at the weekend, and these old ears couldn't see - OK, hear - what the fuss is about. No difference from Poweramp with a very unscientific ABX on my Sennheiser IE8s.
Definitely the worst UI I've seen on any music player though - so hideous that it should win awards.
Get rockbox.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
I use studio beats by dre, they have an amp built into them and they kick bass hard, hi fi quality audio! I work in poundland and trust me their headphones don't work well with the sg2, i hope this helps
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
I'm going to buy AKG K240 mk II.
I will buy a FiiO E6 with the AKG. The last tweaks will be done with DSP.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
Senn HD25-1s and Ety ER4-Ps both sound fine straight out of the headphone socket.
Using poweramp, without any eq or tone control tweaks, just ~30% crossfeed.
I read all the reports of crappy audio on the GS2, so when I got mine and tried it I was very pleasantly suprised.
Whereabouts in Poweramp settings is crossfeed...Didn't realise Poweramp supported it ?
bejay said:
Senn HD25-1s and Ety ER4-Ps both sound fine straight out of the headphone socket.
Using poweramp, without any eq or tone control tweaks, just ~30% crossfeed.
I read all the reports of crappy audio on the GS2, so when I got mine and tried it I was very pleasantly suprised.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the tone/vol/bal page, next to the volume control. It's labeled stereo x.
Ahhhh. So that's what Poweramp calls crossfeed. Gotcha Yeah I normally have that on around 35% with Brainwavz M3's.
Thanks for that bit of info
Edit to add - Out of thanks for the day, will hit you up later.
bejay said:
On the tone/vol/bal page, next to the volume control. It's labeled stereo x.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problem
I'm using the tmobile v20 and noticed this morning that my DAC wasn't impacting the sound quality of Google Play Music at ALL. I have been using a v10 for the past year and I could tell that the DAC wasn't working, or it was broken, because my non-DAC listening on the v20 paled in comparison to the v10 with DAC on.
I went ahead and installed the DAC Fix for V10 and it seems to have fixed my issue. In case any of you aren't noticing the DAC working on streaming apps, try this. So far I've had no issues.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/...lgv10.dacfix&rdid=com.phascinate.lgv10.dacfix
http://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v10/themes-apps/dac-fix-hi-fi-dac-everywhere-t3274457
Thanks to: http://forum.xda-developers.com/member.php?u=4723056
Funny, listening to Google Play Music with my leftover Note 7 earbuds I hear a distinct difference when I toggle the HI-FI on and off. I tried installing the V10 fix app and can hear no difference enabling or disabling it. I did see that the settings for Hi-Fi say "The sound has been automatically adjusted to the connected audio device". Could the type of headphones/earbuds determine if it engages?
T-Mobile edition of the V20.
I also hear a big difference on my T-Mobile unit. I'm using a set of Skullcandy earphones, and toggling off/on is immediately noticeable.
I ended up testing some more...I turned off the DAC fix, yet the toggle still worked. So I uninstalled the DAC fix completely and the toggle STILL works. I guess my unit was stuck in the "off" position for some reason, but it's working fine now. Weird. Sounds so much better with the DAC on.
The DAC fix makes no difference on my V10. Once the dolby atmos is turned on and Viper, the sound quality is superior. My V20 is arriving today and I'm sure with my 1More earphones and that 32bit DAC my ears will cry for mercy.
I wasn't able to replicate your problem, but I must say... This audio quality is far superior than any other phone I've ever used, finally something deserving to be used with Denon Urban Raver's.
Soooo is the DAC fix only for streaming apps such as Google play?
This is my main source of music...
Im comparing the headphone DAC on the s7 and the v20 and they almost sound the same, Im activating and turning off the Hi FI on the v20. Im using an audio technika m50x. Should i donwload the app to fix the dac? im using a video from youtube to do the testing. going to use google music songs that i have download to see if there is a difference.
Jooosty said:
Soooo is the DAC fix only for streaming apps such as Google play?
This is my main source of music...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Other people's DAC worked fine for streaming apps without the fix. Mine WASN'T working, but now it is. I can't say why. But I'm like you. I use GPM for my daily music.
ocelot4ark said:
Other people's DAC worked fine for streaming apps without the fix. Mine WASN'T working, but now it is. I can't say why. But I'm like you. I use GPM for my daily music.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there is someway of knowing if is working correctly?
efrommel said:
there is someway of knowing if is working correctly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll tell you right now, if you can't notice it, it isn't working. You don't even have to be close to an audiophile to notice, it's just simply 3x better.
trix4rix said:
I'll tell you right now, if you can't notice it, it isn't working. You don't even have to be close to an audiophile to notice, it's just simply 3x better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so mine is not working. is very close to the one on the s7 edge. Should i restore it? I also download the v10 dacfix but still the same. where is the better place to test it out. App wise?
efrommel said:
so mine is not working. is very close to the one on the s7 edge. Should i restore it? I also download the v10 dacfix but still the same. where is the better place to test it out. App wise?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is quite noticeable on every music app I've used. The best way I would say is just listen to some music you like. I wouldn't know how to fix it, mine works perfectly. Try a factory reset?
Edit: I just moved from the S7 edge, and the difference is quite clear. I even think it's much better without the hi-fi turned on, but with it on it's significantly better too.
trix4rix said:
It is quite noticeable on every music app I've used. The best way I would say is just listen to some music you like. I wouldn't know how to fix it, mine works perfectly. Try a factory reset?
Edit: I just moved from the S7 edge, and the difference is quite clear. I even think it's much better without the hi-fi turned on, but with it on it's significantly better too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
damn and what headphones you are using?
efrommel said:
damn and what headphones you are using?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sennheiser Momentum In-ear, SteelSeries Siberia Elite Prism headset, and both Samsung and apple ear buds that come with phones. There isn't a pair I can't tell the difference on. I even did a blind listen test with my wife, and she confirmed that it sounds better on the samsung ear buds she uses (included with S7 edge).
efrommel said:
there is someway of knowing if is working correctly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I figured out a very easy way to tell. If your phone doesn't mute music for 1/2 a second when you turn it on, it isn't turning on. It should have a 1/2 second mute when enabling or disabling.
It does. So i imagine is better in the clarity or something. Because it doesnt sound louder than the s7.
trix4rix said:
Sennheiser Momentum In-ear, SteelSeries Siberia Elite Prism headset, and both Samsung and apple ear buds that come with phones. There isn't a pair I can't tell the difference on. I even did a blind listen test with my wife, and she confirmed that it sounds better on the samsung ear buds she uses (included with S7 edge).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how you are connecting them? first the cable to the phone and then to the headphones? or just plugging them
This dac fix did nothing for quality for me listening through my Bose QC15's couldn't tell a difference
Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
So mine is confirmed working with google play.
plugged my vmoda crossfade LP2 wire into th3 phone , then into to headphones.
Press the DAC button and it is a slight bump in bass and volume. too bassy imo
Sent from my LG-H918 using XDA-Developers mobile app
Takes that Hi-Fi Audio and Quad DAC to another level... Check out PowerAMP if you have not already tune the Bass and such accordingly but damn 10% Audio for me and I hear everything like it at 35% AMAZING! Plugged into my 5 Speaker Audio System with my SubWoofer AMAZING! TRY THIS APP FOR THE ULTIMATE AUDIO EXPERIENCE ON YOUR V20!
Ive been using poweramp for 4 years. Its pretty much the ONLY good music player app. The only one that comes close to it is player pro. Def worth the 5$ for the pro version.
i bought poweramp like 4 years ago, but i never use it anymore bc of google music. maybe i should just put all my music on my card again and use it. i don't have any headphones that would trigger high impedence mode though
I used to use PowerAmp all the time on my other phones but stopped in the V20 because gapless playback doesn't work for me.
Mikekelso421 said:
Ive been using poweramp for 4 years. Its pretty much the ONLY good music player app. The only one that comes close to it is player pro. Def worth the 5$ for the pro version.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah I downloaded it for like 5 minutes then bought pro LMAO after messing around with the controls for a few minutes A fell in love with it lol
jayochs said:
i bought poweramp like 4 years ago, but i never use it anymore bc of google music. maybe i should just put all my music on my card again and use it. i don't have any headphones that would trigger high impedence mode though
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would I'm loving it!
@TheDantee, what poweramp build are you using and what are your audio settings?
vibrantliker said:
@TheDantee, what poweramp build are you using and what are your audio settings?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The 3.0 beta and a custom one everything maxed really cause I listen to lots of bass and stuff
vibrantliker said:
@TheDantee, what poweramp build are you using and what are your audio settings?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My test song for audio is Cloud City by Headphone Activist really captures bass and audio very well all my audio files are converted to high quality flac here are some images of my settings I'm running
I.bought it and neutron and prefer neutron, try it.
TheDantee said:
My test song for audio is Cloud City by Headphone Activist really captures bass and audio very well all my audio files are converted to high quality flac here are some images of my settings I'm running
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
didn't realize you're using an external DAC.
lgkahn said:
I.bought it and neutron and prefer neutron, try it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll give it a shot!
vibrantliker said:
didn't realize you're using an external DAC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Was connected to my 5 Speaker setup and the Sub I usually use headphones with the same config and it works fine however I recommend no higher than 15% volume or your ears will explode lol
I used the power amp with my 598 se and holy hell its like night and day. If I push the bass to 75 you can feel the air pushing from the drivers. I run at 50 for bass and treble and the sound is awesome. Thanks for suggesting power amp with this phone.
Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
Dark Jedi said:
I used the power amp with my 598 se and holy hell its like night and day. If I push the bass to 75 you can feel the air pushing from the drivers. I run at 50 for bass and treble and the sound is awesome. Thanks for suggesting power amp with this phone.
Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not a Problem just picked it up myself a few days ago after messing with it for a couple of mins I bought it and It has change my Audio Experience with this phone like you would not believe... Makes the V20 feel like a Dream!
my coworker got me this little 5 dollar Bluetooth speaker from 5 below for Xmas and using it with Poweramp, it surprisingly sounds good. EQ to add some bass and it really pumps. pretty cool for a little gift.
Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk
This may be a dumb question, but is there a way to use Poweramp's EQ and audio settings for Spotify? I love the sound of Poweramp but all my tunes are on spotify :/
TheDantee said:
My test song for audio is Cloud City by Headphone Activist really captures bass and audio very well all my audio files are converted to high quality flac here are some images of my settings I'm running
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Christ, that can't sound good. Those EQ settings? Bass all the way up?
shaimedio said:
This may be a dumb question, but is there a way to use Poweramp's EQ and audio settings for Spotify? I love the sound of Poweramp but all my tunes are on spotify :/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't know man just started using it a few days ago
Logantbrown said:
Christ, that can't sound good. Those EQ settings? Bass all the way up?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually sounds surprisingly well on 2 Sets of headphones and my speaker set
I don't like the built-in speaker quality and volume. Can I improve the quality with applications like Viper4android or ARISE?
karizma4yazar said:
I don't like the built-in speaker quality and volume. Can I improve the quality with applications like Viper4android or ARISE?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can get a little more volume, but not without the cost of increased distortion. However, you can enable stereo mod, and you will get more bass, because the top speaker has a deeper low end, and of course the total loudness will be increased.
adsubzero said:
You can get a little more volume, but not without the cost of increased distortion. However, you can enable stereo mod, and you will get more bass, because the top speaker has a deeper low end, and of course the total loudness will be increased.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the Galaxy s9.
karizma4yazar said:
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the Galaxy s9.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure, there probably is, but it's nothing magical that you can't do with v4a.
karizma4yazar said:
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the Galaxy s9.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are a host of audio "improvements" if you're rooted with Magisk. Check out the app or the threads here on XDA
karizma4yazar said:
I don't like the built-in speaker quality and volume. Can I improve the quality with applications like Viper4android or ARISE?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Arise is bloated junk. The stuff the Arise team added never worked. UltraM8 proved this himself. The V4A will disable the quad dac.
karizma4yazar said:
Is there a way to install dolby atmos? Like the s9.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most Dolby Atmos ports don't actually work. There was 1 guy who used to be able to port it. Only 1 guy. Also that port did not work 100% either.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
The V4A will disable the quad dac.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe this is untrue, and nevertheless, he wants to use it to tweak the loudspeaker, so it's unrelated to the quad dac.
adsubzero said:
I believe this is untrue, and nevertheless, he wants to use it to tweak the loudspeaker, so it's unrelated to the quad dac.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't believe it, that's your choice. Many threads on XDA that backs this statement up. UltraM8 for instance backs this up. His mod is also not 100% working with the quad dac. He SAID this when I questioned him on this. It's also in his first post.
"he wants to use it to tweak the loudspeaker, so it's unrelated to the quad dac"
This IS related to the quad dac since you can enable it for headphones.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
This IS related to the quad dac since you can enable it for headphones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He did not mention using it for headphones, he wants to tweak the loudspeaker...
The quad DAC in the V30 only gets called into action when there's an output device (headphones/earbuds/IEM/line-out cable/etc) attached to the headphone jack. It's possible using a USB adapter to get the quad DAC output pushed through the USB-C connector as well (from my understanding of it), but the internal speaker(s) in the V30 don't ever get output from that quad DAC.
The internal speaker(s) are powered off the Qualcomm DAC in the 835 SoC so there is going to be a limitation on what you'll be able to do, probably the best anyone can hope for it dropping the mid-range and highs a bit and adding a bit more bass but we're not talking about frequencies lower than about 80 Hz 'cause those little drivers just can't do it.
The internal speaker(s) are what they area, and nothing is really going to improve upon that. I will say my V20 had substantially louder output overall (I don't muck with the audio levels like I used to with edits to the mixer_paths.xml file) and it had a lot more low end aka bass response as well. I have no idea why the V30 is worse in that respect, but for me I use headphones or my Monoprice 9927 IEMs for listening anyway about 98% of the time. Sure I do have my phone on sometimes at home and listen to things but I have a pretty awesome little Omaker Bluetooth speaker I can feed the audio to and get the bass if I want it.
Poweramp can give 24bit output, but when Viper is activated then it's always 16bit. I have tried 24/32bit .irs files too, but no luck.
DooMLoRD77 said:
Poweramp can give 24bit output, but when Viper is activated then it's always 16bit. I have tried 24/32bit .irs files too, but no luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would you use V4A with LG? Makes no sense. It's 16bit due to the fact you aren't using the quad dac. The drivers for V4A are closed source. While the app may get updated, the drivers never will.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
Why would you use V4A with LG? Makes no sense. It's 16bit due to the fact you aren't using the quad dac. The drivers for V4A are closed source. While the app may get updated, the drivers never will.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right.
With Viper you're making the onboard Snapdragon 835 DAC sound differently, not the already excellent V30 Quad DAC.
BROKEN1981 said:
Why would you use V4A with LG? Makes no sense. It's 16bit due to the fact you aren't using the quad dac. The drivers for V4A are closed source. While the app may get updated, the drivers never will.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
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I would use convolver in Viper which makes my earphones sound more natural. Although It uses the quad dac the same way as Poweramp and it's 16bit because it is the preferred sample rate by Viper. So it's not possible to increase it . Anyway, thank you!
ChazzMatt said:
Right.
With Viper you're making the onboard Snapdragon 835 DAC sound differently, not the already excellent V30 Quad DAC.
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It actually sounds exactly the same when Viper is active. The specific EQ (convolver) is the only reason I would use it.
DooMLoRD77 said:
Although It uses the quad dac the same way as Poweramp and it's 16bit because it is the preferred sample rate by Viper. So it's not possible to increase it . Anyway, thank you!
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This is not true. V4A DOESN'T use the quad dac. 16bit is NOT the preferred rate. The driver is 16bit and that will never change. The dev of V4A left before any other bit rate became a thing on Android. The dev never responded to request for the code.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
BROKEN1981 said:
This is not true. V4A DOESN'T use the quad dac. 16bit is NOT the preferred rate. The driver is 16bit and that will never change. The dev of V4A left before any other bit rate became a thing on Android. The dev never responded to request for the code.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
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I can't notice any difference with Viper, but OK I get it. So it's bypassing the LG quad dac function. I won't use Viper, I want 24bit to avoid losses from digital volume controlling. Thanks the help!
DooMLoRD77 said:
I can't notice any difference with Viper, but OK I get it. So it's bypassing the LG quad dac function. I won't use Viper, I want 24bit to avoid losses from digital volume controlling. Thanks the help!
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https://forum.xda-developers.com/lg-v30/themes/magisk-bring-24-bit-output-aosp-pie-t3900863
Our ES9218p (Quad DAC) has an integrated amplifier (so-called OpAmp) using Analog Volume Control (AVC). You're not losing any resolution due to digital volume control, as long as you use a player app that knows how to play bit-perfect: Such apps will send all bits straight to the DAC (essentially keeping digital volume at max) and leave volume control to the DAC. When you turn volume up/down with the volume keys (or the Hi-Fi Quad DAC settings page) you're controlling that analog amp.
The moment you add EQ or DTS or other digital processing you already lose bit perfect. But as long as the app doesn't use digital volume control (keeps it at max) at least you will still have the full resolution during and after that processing.
You should be more concerned about the upsamling done by the Android Mixer when playing 16/44 music (anything CD quality, whether compressed or not). See this for details.
All player apps (including LG Music) will suffer this up-sampling unless they specifically work around it. UAPP and Neutron work around it by converting 16/44 to 24/44 on the fly. PowerAmp CAN work around it if you configure it to re-sample 16/44 to 24/44 -- but you then have to change that setting when playing HiRes music (anything 24-bit or higher than 44.1KHz) so it isn't down-sampled to 24/44.
HiRes music generally plays correctly from most apps (not re-sampled) unless they specifically mess it up (which is the case with Qobuz last I heard) or they deliberately re-sample it (like Amazon HD Music which re-samples everything to 48KHz on Android devices).
I never used Viper4Android. I don't see how it can cause audio to bypass the Quad DAC (when Quad DAC is enabled) but I'm not ruling it out. And certainly there is no way Viper4Android can understand or take advantage of the Quad DAC given how old it is.
TheDannemand said:
The moment you add EQ or DTS or other digital processing you already lose bit perfect. But as long as the app doesn't use digital volume control (keeps it at max) at least you will still have the full resolution during and after that processing.
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DTS no longer works in pie for PowerAmp. I don't know why. When I need to unwind, I would sip on vodka straight on the rocks. Put on PowerAmp, turn on DTS wide setting and listen to Pink Floyd.
TheDannemand said:
I never used Viper4Android. I don't see how it can cause audio to bypass the Quad DAC (when Quad DAC is enabled) but I'm not ruling it out. And certainly there is no way Viper4Android can understand or take advantage of the Quad DAC given how old it is.
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Few devs who did audio mods said this back in the V20 days.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
Edit, I'm sure @ChazzMatt can find it. He can find anything. LMFAO
BROKEN1981 said:
DTS no longer works in pie for PowerAmp. I don't know why. When I need to unwind, I would sip on vodka straight on the rocks. Put on PowerAmp, turn on DTS wide setting and listen to Pink Floyd.
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LOL thank you for that image :laugh:
BROKEN1981 said:
Few devs who did audio mods said this back in the V20 days.
Edit, I'm sure @ChazzMatt can find it. He can find anything. LMFAO
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No need, I believe you. I just don't know how it is possible to avoid the Quad DAC when it's enabled. As in *I* don't know how, not that it isn't possible :cyclops:
TheDannemand said:
Our ES9218p (Quad DAC) has an integrated amplifier (so-called OpAmp) using Analog Volume Control (AVC). You're not losing any resolution due to digital volume control, as long as you use a player app that knows how to play bit-perfect: Such apps will send all bits straight to the DAC (essentially keeping digital volume at max) and leave volume control to the DAC. When you turn volume up/down with the volume keys (or the Hi-Fi Quad DAC settings page) you're controlling that analog amp.
The moment you add EQ or DTS or other digital processing you already lose bit perfect. But as long as the app doesn't use digital volume control (keeps it at max) at least you will still have the full resolution during and after that processing.
You should be more concerned about the upsamling done by the Android Mixer when playing 16/44 music (anything CD quality, whether compressed or not). See this for details.
All player apps (including LG Music) will suffer this up-sampling unless they specifically work around it. UAPP and Neutron work around it by converting 16/44 to 24/44 on the fly. PowerAmp CAN work around it if you configure it to re-sample 16/44 to 24/44 -- but you then have to change that setting when playing HiRes music (anything 24-bit or higher than 44.1KHz) so it isn't down-sampled to 24/44.
HiRes music generally plays correctly from most apps (not re-sampled) unless they specifically mess it up (which is the case with Qobuz last I heard) or they deliberately re-sample it (like Amazon HD Music which re-samples everything to 48KHz on Android devices).
I never used Viper4Android. I don't see how it can cause audio to bypass the Quad DAC (when Quad DAC is enabled) but I'm not ruling it out. And certainly there is no way Viper4Android can understand or take advantage of the Quad DAC given how old it is.
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That's interesting. When I set to 16bit in poweramp then I hear noise at the end of some tracks when the volume slowly decreases in the song. That's happens also with LG music app. But when I choose 24bit in poweramp then the noise disappears and I hear more details. This noise can be noticed at enough low volume. So is this means that poweramp and LG music uses DVC and not letting the DAC to do the job?
As for the interpolation I don't care, I don't have high sensitivity device and poweramp gives fix 24/44.1.
DooMLoRD77 said:
That's interesting. When I set to 16bit in poweramp then I hear noise at the end of some tracks when the volume slowly decreases in the song. That's happens also with LG music app. But when I choose 24bit in poweramp then the noise disappears and I hear more details. This noise can be noticed at enough low volume. So is this means that poweramp and LG music uses DVC and not letting the DAC to do the job?
As for the interpolation I don't care, I don't have high sensitivity device and poweramp gives fix 24/44.1.
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LG Music doesn't use DVC. From what I can tell, it plays everything correctly, including HiRes, so long as you keep effects and EQ disabled. Its only problem is that it doesn't bypass the Mixer on 16/44.
And I can almost guarantee that you DO care about the interpolation: That noise you hear at low amplitude (volume) levels is typical of the upsampling performed by the Android Mixer. Once you configure PowerAmp to output as 24-bit, AudioFlinger will use the DIRECT path instead of the MIXER path, which will bypass the Mixer and send music straight to the DAC, without upsampling. That's why the noise goes away when you select 24-bit, not because of DVC bit-loss at 16-bit.
DooMLoRD77 said:
snip.
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lol no need to quote the entire post
TheDannemand said:
snip.
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This is aimed at you and the op.
From the V20 to the V30 on 7, 8 and now 9.0, people have complained about hissing. I always thought it was audio mods but I'm sure DooM isn't using any.
I don't see how, but maybe a dirty connection? Or possibly the headphones? Damaged speaker?
I've used the stock app with DTS. No hissing. Tho kinda sounds bad. Something really changed with 9.0.
Even with DTS off, no hissing and the music sounds good.
PowerAmp, no hissing, can't use DTS. UAPP, no hissing.
@DooMLoRD77, do you have a different pair of headphones?
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
TheDannemand said:
quote
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I wasn't actually hearing the interpolation noise, however It was because of dithering was turned off by default. When I apply any kind of dithering then noise disappears on 16bit. 24 bit doesn't require dithering as I hear. So I found the solution and it's good to learn new stuffs, thanks. Although I don't get it why it happens. The dithering should add noise to reduce distorsion as I think.
BROKEN1981 said:
quote
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Good I just learned how to reply.
I tested it with my budget MH1C and the hissing was just a very small amount apparently due to turned off dithering as I wrote above. It now sounds fine Plus that DTS seems also bad to me, it's kinda aggressive.
....
DooMLoRD77 said:
I wasn't actually hearing the interpolation noise, however It was because of dithering was turned off by default. When I apply any kind of dithering then noise disappears on 16bit. 24 bit doesn't require dithering as I hear. So I found the solution and it's good to learn new stuffs, thanks. Although I don't get it why it happens. The dithering should add noise to reduce distorsion as I think.
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How do you know it isn't the upsampling that's causing the noise? Your description fits exactly the symptoms of it. Particularly if it goes away when you switch to 24-bit output.
It doesn't make sense that you need to turn on dithering or otherwise process the audio source in order to avoid noise: The ESS DAC has incredibly low noise levels, and as long as the source is left unprocessed and played through the DIRECT path, you should be hearing nothing but black background. Of course assuming a clean recording. (Some of my best recordings are old analog ones, but of course they have noise.)
I apologize for being pushy about this, but I keep seeing myths surrounding this Quad DAC, and users focusing on things that aren't problems while overlooking the real problems that actually exist.
I'll leave you to it
@BROKEN1981: I want to make sure I understand you correctly: Are you saying you experienced hissing on both V20 and V30, but once you got Pie, it went away?
That's interesting (if I understand you correctly). I wonder if LG fixed the re-sampling in their later Pie releases after all: Long before Pie came out on any LG phones I had a bet with csglinux (over on head-fi) where I optimistically/naively said I had a feeling they might address it in Pie, and he thought they wouldn't. Of course when Pie finally came (to his V40 at first) the problems had turned even worse, now with both up-sampling and down-sampling, and a bunch of other issues too. Took much work by Davy to fix UAPP, and I understand the same with Neutron.
I am now tempted to upgrade my H932 after all just to test this. But first I need confirmation that lafsploit isn't broken when rolling back from Pie (I think you saw this over in the H932 root thread.)
But like you mentioned, most of the reports of hissing in the past seemed to traceable back to audio mods or EQ or other processing by player apps. With a good DAC like ours and decent IEMs, it doesn't take much messing around with a 16/44 stream before you can hear it.
Edit: Have you done an audio_flinger dump during 16/44 playback since updating to Pie?
You really got me thinking, but I have so much work to do, gotta get this out of my head for now :silly:
@TheDannemand
I got confused with this much testing. I believe what you say and I'm already happy with this thing. Sorry for this unimportant problem I don't know about the real issues. :laugh:
DooMLoRD77 said:
@TheDannemand
I got confused with this much testing. I believe what you say and I'm already happy with this thing. Sorry for this unimportant problem I don't know about the real issues. :laugh:
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Fair enough LOL
I didn't mean to be tactless, but I can see how that came across. Actually I DO consider your problem important. Otherwise I wouldn't keep responding to it. And besides, it's your thread!
What I meant was myths such as "you must use 50ohm headphones to activate the DAC", or "music gets better and better as more of the Quad DAC cores are activated", or "up-sampling music to 352KHz in PowerAmp will improve its quality". Just to mention a few.
Truths are (1) the ES9218P is a genuine audiophile DAC which performs the best when NOTHING is done to the source. (2) It CAN drive planars and other hard-to-drive headphones, but sounds blissful too on highly sensitive balanced armatures. (3) It uses multiple DAC units to increase amplification, not to "improve" the music. (4) HIM is NOT required for it to perform optimally.
The "real problem" is the upsampling of 16/44 music, which isn't inherent to the DAC itself, but is a massive oversight in LG's implementation, diminishing sound quality for the vast majority of music played on a phone. While not everybody can hear it (depending on hearing, earphones/headphones used, and the music source) many people CAN, particularly on sensitive IEMs -- including many moderately priced and popular earphones. And since many users don't realize that the hiss/noise they're hearing is re-sampling artifacts, they pursue fixes that further process the music stream, which sometimes may drown out the noise, but also further diminishes sound quality.
This upsampling is by far the biggest problem with LG's Quad DAC from an audiophile perspective.
(I should add that configuring PowerAmp to re-sample to 352KHz actually isn't the worst choice, since it does this without the artifacts of the Android Mixer's 44 > 48KHz upsampling, and it will play the result through the DIRECT path. Of course "re-sampling" 16/44 to 24/44 (just adding the zero bits) is even better, but requires changing every time HiRes music is played to avoid down-sampling it.)
TheDannemand said:
@BROKEN1981: I want to make sure I understand you correctly: Are you saying you experienced hissing on both V20 and V30, but once you got Pie, it went away?
:
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Not me, I'm just saying I've seen people having issues with hissing going all the way back to the V20. Though I don't know what they were doing. I can count on 1 hand of how many times I've seen it posted.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs
---------- Post added at 02:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:23 AM ----------
DooMLoRD77;80574395 [user=832590 said:
@TheDannemand[/user]
I got confused with this much testing. I believe what you say and I'm already happy with this thing. Sorry for this unimportant problem I don't know about the real issues. :laugh:
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Trust me, you aren't bothering anyone man! @TheDannemand is happy to shed some light on the dac. There is a lot of misinformation on it and I partly blame LG.
When the V20 came out, LG said at 50 ohms or more, the sound gets better.
While this may be correct, it's very misleading. If using something more than 50 ohms, you are probably using cans designed for audiophiles.
There aren't many earphones that hit 50 ohms. I bought a pair of audio-technica's that are 50 ohms earphones. Over $100 as well.
I went to Ali Express, bought CCA C10 earphones that are 30 ohms that blow my audio-technica's out of the water.
Do they hold up to cans? NO! Cans will give the best sound experience while being more than 50 ohms.
Sent from my LG-H932 using XDA Labs