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So I've gotten anywhere between 2.5 to 5.1 MFLOPS using various ROMS and have yet to be able to notice something incredibly different.
710...768...806 - What does it matter? What program other than Linpack shows a sizable difference? Sure, maybe things open quicker? What am I missing here?
I read all this about achieving high MFLOPS and OC Kernels yet I still can't achieve smooth game play on 16 bit emulator on my phone with 5 MFLOPS.
MFLOPS mean jack when there is little way to observe the difference.
Carreno43 said:
So I've gotten anywhere between 2.5 to 5.1 MFLOPS using various ROMS and have yet to be able to notice something incredibly different.
710...768...806 - What does it matter? What program other than Linpack shows a sizable difference? Sure, maybe things open quicker? What am I missing here?
I read all this about achieving high MFLOPS and OC Kernels yet I still can't achieve smooth game play on 16 bit emulator on my phone with 5 MFLOPS.
MFLOPS mean jack when there is little way to observe the difference.
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Linpack MFLOPS - measures the floating point performance of your phone.
710...768...806 - refers to CPU frequencies
increasing the CPU frequency should equate to better general-case performance, including things opening quicker as you mention, but also other types of general snappiness like moving between screens and so forth.
"I read all this about achieving high MFLOPS and OC Kernels yet I still can't achieve smooth game play on 16 bit emulator on my phone with 5 MFLOPS." - This may have less to do with the performance of your phone and more to do with the emulator itself. Emulation is a surprisingly CPU intensive operation, especially if the emulater isn't well written. Rather than looking a ton into overclocking and JIT, etc, maybe you ought to look for a better piece of software.
Yea,
I've tested most emulators. Wish there was an Atari emulator!
Thanks for the response.
Carreno43 said:
Yea,
I've tested most emulators. Wish there was an Atari emulator!
Thanks for the response.
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I have run roms with 5.1 MFLOPS and now am running a rom that gets 3. I can honestly say I see no difference.
Spencer_Moore said:
I have run roms with 5.1 MFLOPS and now am running a rom that gets 3. I can honestly say I see no difference.
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I can see a difference... in battery life! Lolz
g00gl3 said:
I can see a difference... in battery life! Lolz
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Click to collapse
Haha Awesome
it looks like to me that everyone is look at the wrong things.
for example:
I am running a Tom that is getting on a average of 4.9 mflops.
I get smoother screen changes....
streaming videos online is so much faster compared to a 3.0 mflop rom. ...
tubetube and other....... websites.
to me everything I do is faster...
I.don't play game on my phone so I don't know how that is.... but everythng else I do is very much faster.
I love high mflop roms...
I have notice about mflops is that it matters about the kernal that u use.
Isn't it true that the MSM7201 in our phones is already overclocked to get to 528mhz as it is? I see a lot of different places saying Qualcomm chips in general are just not worth overclocking... and since our chip is factory overclocked to begin with... just seems like we're pushing the already-pushed here. But the way this board goes crazy for overclocking... it's contradictory. I don't know what to think, cause I've run Linpack myself and gotten ~4.9 with JIT + OC versus ~2.5 without... but I'm with the OP on this one... only difference I'm seeing is my battery draining faster and my phone getting physically hotter.
xatch said:
Isn't it true that the MSM7201 in our phones is already overclocked to get to 528mhz as it is? I see a lot of different places saying Qualcomm chips in general are just not worth overclocking... and since our chip is factory overclocked to begin with... just seems like we're pushing the already-pushed here. But the way this board goes crazy for overclocking... it's contradictory. I don't know what to think, cause I've run Linpack myself and gotten ~4.9 with JIT + OC versus ~2.5 without... but I'm with the OP on this one... only difference I'm seeing is my battery draining faster and my phone getting physically hotter.
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I have OC and JIT and getting about 5.1 mflops and haven't had worse battery life or a hotter phone. It could be the battery I'm using but meh (got a replacement one that's 2000 mAh) but I got worse battery life on leak 2.1 than with the rom I'm using now that has OC, JIT, LWP, etc. I can go about 8 hours with heavy texting, moderate internet usage and my lwp's running and it only goes to about 65%
so OC and Jit don't make that big of a difference in gameplay?
Sent from my Eris using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
What the OP and all the respondents are noting is frankly quite typical of what happens when performance tuning focuses on a single benchmark: the results obtained are essentially meaningless for different kinds of activities on the same device.
That's because there's a whole chain of dependencies that are specific to a given task, any number of which could become the rate-limiting factor; and a different task on the device will have a different set of dependencies and therefore different rate-limiting behaviors.
For instance, let's take writing to an SD card as an example: there's really no way that OC'ing will speed that up in a measurable way - because the CPU isn't the rate limiting factor.
That Linpack benchmark measures floating-point performance using a software library (as the Eris has no hardware FP capability). Most of the apps on the phone do very little FP work at all. But, it's not a bad test of CPU speed, because it performs no I/O. It also may not be very memory bandwidth intensive, either (if the problems it works on stays in the uP cache and there are few page faults).
OTOH, a game emulator needs to write to the graphics display (at a minimum) and possibly also do read I/O from flash.
Different task, different results. Sometimes things can be improved by hardware or firmware; sometimes the software itself needs to be improved.
bftb0
im sorry, but could you just answer in plain english
Sent from my Eris using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
TheSonicEmerald said:
im sorry, but could you just answer in plain english
Sent from my Eris using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
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Lima beans bad.
Pork good.
Slow phone bad.
Fast phone good.
bftb0
Thanks for my laugh of the day on that one.
What I'm trying to get at is -
I should be able to play, at the basic level, Sonic or Mario - Without issues.
At the very least
I prefer roms over market games any day (Sonic, Mario, Zelda, DK-Country) and it cripples the phone, at least in my view, that I cannot enjoy the fruits of old games.
Although, I was able to find some old Atari games - which, thankfully, work without stuttering.
which rom??
none, go read the forum like the rest of us.
Technically, there are no 2.2's with sense even from HTC themselves. That changes on the Desire today or tomorrow.
G
None at the moment, stay tuned for updates!
iamdarren said:
which rom??
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.......... PLEASE POST IN GENERAL or Q&A NEXT TIME. thanx
htc desire will have 2.2 with sense but they wont post it till closer to xmas according to what Ive read.
who knows what will happen though, xda is a pretty smart place.
okay that there's no official 2.2 with Sense, but devs made some Desire 2.2 with Sense, as I see
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=732246
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=720294
Isn't it possible for Hero too?
Hero Froyo AOSP is in its early stages as it is so a sense froyo will take much more time.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/29/evo-4gs-android-2-2-update-starts-trickling-out-tomorrow-loads/
It's coming. August 3rd, 2010.
Didnt people start froyo as a port from the N1? if so then a port from the Desire wont be any harder as its same hardware? i am probably be wrong but nevermind!
There are 2.2 Senese ROMS for us Desire Owners. I think its not possible to port it to the Hero. 2.2 Sense is for Powerful devices
We really need Sense on the Hero, that's the major thing that is lacking on Android 2.2 at the moment.
Oh well if not then Ill have to wait to upgrade my phone to whatever is the next main standard android phone after the Desire.
Would not be so sure about that, most heros can hit 700mhz, not that bad a speed.
My work laptop runs WindowsXP and Ubuntu, with only 800mhz.
Sticky-Micky said:
Would not be so sure about that, most heros can hit 700mhz, not that bad a speed.
My work laptop runs WindowsXP and Ubuntu, with only 800mhz.
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MHz has nothing to do with performance. A Celeron D can run at 3GHz and will still perform more slowly than an underclocked 2GHz i7 series CPU.
In the land of mobile CPU's, our hero is very old. Even if it matched snapdragon in frequency, it would still lag behind.
Guys, are you serious that you prefer sense than launcherpro?
The only thing I missed from sense is the social network sync by contact, no big deal.
Go install Fusion Rom (Froyo) + Launcherpro and be happy!
Its not only the Laucnher. HTC has Skinned ANYTHING! And it looks great.
SpeeDemon said:
In the land of mobile CPU's, our hero is very old. Even if it matched snapdragon in frequency, it would still lag behind.
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The CPU, or in fact the entire setup of my Thinkpad X22 is around 10 years old!
This is what used to piss me off about PC`s, people constantly seam to want bigger and faster, and 9 times out of 10, its not even needed.
It would appear that smart phones are going the same way.
For somebody to say "no you need a more powerfull device" is just pure spoon fed, marketing bollocks.
Remember the good old Amiga, or even Spectrum days, performance increases were done by the code, not like the daft PC way of doing things = "just bolt another cpu in under the bonnet"
Look at something like JIT, huge performance increases, simply by making better code, no need at all for a larger cpu.
The legend will get froyo sense in q3.
We'll port it and it will run pretty flawlessly, except that the camera will have problems like current cm6; has, until someone manages to compile a .33 kernel for the hero, including a fixed camera driver.
Simple question really, is Froyo really worth it on the HTC Hero.
I mean what difference does it really make to are HTC Hero Phones, the main differences I know, is the ability to store apps to the SD card, which if you are rooted you can do anyway.
The ability to properly play flash files, which I don't think the HTC Hero will fully support due to hardware issues.
Meant to be faster. But using the 2.2 roms, we have, I did not notice any increase of speed and if anything, the speed gets much slower after using it a few days. (excluding Fusion rom).
On top of this, some apps wont support Froyo, you lose HTC sence/HTC apps, and there is keyboard problems.
What do you lot think?
[email protected] said:
Simple question really, is Froyo really worth it on the HTC Hero.
I mean what difference does it really make to are HTC Hero Phones, the main differences I know, is the ability to store apps to the SD card, which if you are rooted you can do anyway.
The ability to properly play flash files, which I don't think the HTC Hero will fully support due to hardware issues.
Meant to be faster. But using the 2.2 roms, we have, I did not notice any increase of speed and if anything, the speed gets much slower after using it a few days. (excluding Fusion rom).
On top of this, some apps wont support Froyo, you lose HTC sence/HTC apps, and there is keyboard problems.
What do you lot think?
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From the moment I installed the first development build of FroydVillain, I am never going back to 2.1. It's honestly that good.
The main benefit is having JIT, which speeds up the ROM. We have seen scores of 5.3 mflops in linpack using Froyd1.1.1 with overclock.
Froyo is also the latest version, includes the stock browser with the V8 javascript engine etc. and has automatic market updates amongst other random stuff
Have a look at the new features of froyo, as I've never looked back yet
PS. camera doesn't work properly yet, but IMHO it's a decent compromise for the ROM that has given me the best battery life ever etc.
P
anon2122 said:
From the moment I installed the first development build of FroydVillain, I am never going back to 2.1. It's honestly that good.
The main benefit is having JIT, which speeds up the ROM. We have seen scores of 5.3 mflops in linpack using Froyd1.1.1 with overclock.
Froyo is also the latest version, includes the stock browser with the V8 javascript engine etc. and has automatic market updates amongst other random stuff
Have a look at the new features of froyo, as I've never looked back yet
PS. camera doesn't work properly yet, but IMHO it's a decent compromise for the ROM that has given me the best battery life ever etc.
P
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I did have a very good look at all three Froyos ROMs and then I installed 2.1 again, Android 2.1 is so far 100% better for the HTC Hero, in my opinion.
I don't think I miss much by having to individually update the apps, especially since I don't like being the first to update apps as not all updates are for the best (E.G. Astro (now with adds))
Although the Rom is meant to be faster I found it a lot slower, even though I was using Set CPU, only Fusion Rom was decent (but as other roms still had reliability problems). With 2.1 everything is much faster.
I will probably try Android 2.2 again, but I will probably wait till there is a version with Sense as in my opinion Launcher pro (plus) is so inferior in comparison. Sense is a very important feature in my opinion.
Between Android 1.5 > 2.1 there was a big difference and it was worth updating, here no such difference exist, and the main attraction of 2.2 the ability to play proper flash does not work with the Hero.
Just my opinion, but would it be fair to say that its still a bit early to be drawing comparisons?
Sent from my HTC Hero using XDA App
wayferer said:
Just my opinion, but would it be fair to say that its still a bit early to be drawing comparisons?
Sent from my HTC Hero using XDA App
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Yeah, i'd agree. Wait another week or two, till the issues start to go, then look again
tbh i think it is good that the scene is moving towards 2.2.
sure things dont fully work atm and certain features wont be beneficial on the hero, but at least there are people working on it so that there is an option if it is needed/wanted.
it is better that there are questions as to whether we need 2.2 on the hero, rather than endless questions of "when will 2.2 be ported".
Just my opinion, but would it be fair to say that its still a bit early to be drawing comparisons?
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I just posted (on my two posts) on what we have available at the moment, and what we know about Android 2.2 in relation to flash, app2sd and automatic updates. No matter what rom comes out in the future these problems will persist.
I agree that all the roms we have are just beta-like versions, and that I am hopeful that the roms will be faster in due time. I even mentioned in my 2nd post that I will try Android 2.2 again once someone manages to incorporate HTC sense to it.
it is better that there are questions as to whether we need 2.2 on the hero, rather than endless questions of "when will 2.2 be ported".
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I 100% agree with you, and I fully appreciate all the work that developers make in order to develop these roms. But at this moment in time, I found that upgrading my phone to Android 2.2 felt more of a downgrade (excluding Fusion, to some extent).
To be honest ill be very surprised, if we ever get a good Froyo rom, which is as fast as the 2.1 roms and works properly with flash. But we will have to wait and see.
Hmmm. I see your concern about automatic updates, but they are optional, and need to be actively enabled in my experience.
EXT apps2sd is miles better than the included one, so I think it's a case of "better than original" for that.
Sense should come with time. No idea about flash tbh.
Froyd is looking to be a fair bit faster now
pulser_g2 said:
Hmmm. I see your concern about automatic updates, but they are optional, and need to be actively enabled in my experience.
EXT apps2sd is miles better than the included one, so I think it's a case of "better than original" for that.
Sense should come with time. No idea about flash tbh.
Froyd is looking to be a fair bit faster now
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Any idea if we are talking about weeks, or months for Sense
[email protected] said:
Any idea if we are talking about weeks, or months for Sense
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Click to collapse
I can be even more specific. A few days after HTC does the first Sense Froyo ROM for Slide or Legend. But no idea how good these ROMs will be, as there will be porting needed.
Here
After last weeks DX farce with 2Ghz and 3Ghz Im cautious however these guys seem to have the benchies to back it up. We've long heard the potential for the hummingbird was 1.6. Only sad part is they say no Fascinate development till they get one. Removing the 56fps cap is nice too
I've never heard of these guys before? Legit? Renowned? Anyone know.
I would say all is BS until proven other wise. In my opinion the hardware would burn up at those speeds.
achandler2 said:
I would say all is BS until proven other wise. In my opinion the hardware would burn up at those speeds.
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While not safe, I seriously doubt it would burn up.
adrynalyne said:
While not safe, I seriously doubt it would burn up.
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Agreed. 1.6 has long been discussed as an achieveable speed. Dirrk was tinkering with it weeks ago. Its voltage requirement obviously is high and near the threshold point given the non-active cooling for the cpu. But I would not be surprised this could be achieved. I mean shoot we have 1.25Ghz on less than stock voltage already.
Benchmarks in one hand, stability in the other. When I see a posted kernel with good reviews for a week or so, I'll do more than raise an eyebrow. lol.
It's on the OCLF kernel, which if I remember, is well known for posting high quadrant scores without giving any real performance benefit.
Also, benchmark overclock's in the desktop world are always just for demonstration, not an application. Ever seen that 7GHz overclock benchmark they did on a Pentium 4?
This is no BS. The devs working on this are reputable and put out some of the best Vibrant ROMs out there. They're stable at 1.6ghz and are talking about pushing it to 1.8/2.0.
Kubernetes said:
This is no BS. The devs working on this are reputable and put out some of the best Vibrant ROMs out there. They're stable at 1.6ghz and are talking about pushing it to 1.8/2.0.
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This doesn't suprise me. I could push my Droid to 1.32ghz. That's well over a 100% overclock. Achieving a 60% overclock shouldn't be too hard, especially on newer and much better hardware.
I find it tough to believe that most phones will be stable at a 60% overclock. Granted, Im only speaking from my experience with desktop CPUs... What type of software do people run to test stability?
Kubernetes said:
This is no BS. The devs working on this are reputable and put out some of the best Vibrant ROMs out there. They're stable at 1.6ghz and are talking about pushing it to 1.8/2.0.
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Thats encouraging
Smeed said:
I find it tough to believe that most phones will be stable at a 60% overclock. Granted, Im only speaking from my experience with desktop CPUs... What type of software do people run to test stability?
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What has been your experience with desktop cpu's. I cannot remember the last desktop cpu I have which at least 50% so I dont find 60% outrageously unreasonable. Active cooling obviously makes a difference.
With the battery life Im seeing on Dirrks UV kernels and even what I got on stock voltages pre-OC I would feel confident I could still get a full day off a 1.4-1.5Ghz hummingbird even if the voltage had to be raised to 1400mv.
I'm having trouble with stability with the 1.2 OC kernals...
So I checked out the thread in the vibrant section. This is def for real! Looks awesome! I had trouble with dirrks lv 1200. But every other kernel has ran fine. I'm sure that eventually we'll have everything we can dream on this phone. Good thing its already so great that I don't mind waiting. I hope I don't have to find an excuse to exchange my phone in search of one that can handle more.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
saps said:
Here
After last weeks DX farce with 2Ghz and 3Ghz Im cautious however these guys seem to have the benchies to back it up. We've long heard the potential for the hummingbird was 1.6. Only sad part is they say no Fascinate development till they get one. Removing the 56fps cap is nice too
I've never heard of these guys before? Legit? Renowned? Anyone know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@teamwhiskey is a god send. they have pulled the download though,due to flaws in their kernal. they are in the process of re-vamping it and re-testing. it seems while the kernal did improve performance it is unknown how much because it was also manipulating the internal clock speed.
def legit.
jeremyritzmann said:
@teamwhiskey is a god send. they have pulled the download though,due to flaws in their kernal. they are in the process of re-vamping it and re-testing. it seems while the kernal did improve performance it is unknown how much because it was also manipulating the internal clock speed.
def legit.
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That sounds like what Dirrk ran into at 1.6 as well
Sent from my 1.2Ghz voodoo fascinate
saps said:
That sounds like what Dirrk ran into at 1.6 as well
Sent from my 1.2Ghz voodoo fascinate
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Yea its going to be a pain to get that kink worked out. But from what ive heard theyre making headway. Now if only I could get a.perm root for the g2 lol.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Yes this is for real. I personally run it. Heres quadrant I ran last night. This kernel should be ported to all SGS phones. As long as they get a good dev with this phone to help port.
CPU didnt see near the gain I had hoped it would.
ya the CPU is getting destroyed by the N1. And what is with the ridiculous I/O. Did someone port a PCI express array of SSD's on the Vibrant? Maybe they just developed the GOD file system.
I make jokes, but I want the screen of my Fascinate to say 3439 also haha
I am on a mesmerize niw coming from a vibrant. I used this kernel. There was a timing issue. The io scores come from oclf which cheats quadrant. Those guys have released a pretty stable 1.4 oc that is real. I got 68 fps in neocore. Truth be told guys there is no need for oc in my opinion. With froyo the phone plays flash easily. Only application of oc to me is emulation and bragging rights. A good voodoo kernel works wonders honestly.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
wooow way to bring this one back from the dead
Since all this new hype about the phone being rooted has been coming out. Theres on thing I've been concerned with since I've planned on getting the phone. Will we be able to use Setcpu once root is released, and if so can we immediately clock up to 1.5ghz? Is it in the coding already, or is this kernel just officially set at 1.2?
I figured someone might have an answer since they achieved root through the kernel and have poked around in there
We wont know till we all have root. But I highly doubt it, we will most likely need a custom kernel to enable overclocking. and having root doesnt give us kernel source code.
Bah! That's right, I've been so used to having everything available w/ the Evo 4G that I forgot about source code...
Any thoughts on the actual functionality of Setcpu though? Because I know for some phones/kernels Setcpu does not play well (or even at all sometimes) aka early times w/ Tegra 2's (even though their NAND and source coding were completely different)
I'd stay away from SetCPU for the time being, even if a future kernel supports overclocking. Our CPU has two cores with totally independent core clocks, so an app that is only designed to control a single clock wouldn't even know how to deal with our setup.
If I were you I'd try to let go of the old mindset of "faster, faster" and focus on getting rid of bloatware and generally streamlining the OS. This phone is already so fast that overclocking isn't going to accomplish anything except burn the battery faster and maybe return some slightly higher benchmark scores, but you probably won't notice any improvement in speed, because how can you get any faster than "immediate"??
oldjackbob said:
because how can you get any faster than "immediate"??
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With the flux capacitor they just released of course, dont you read the development forum?
But good point about all the other programs being made for 1 core OCing. We probably wont be able to use anything to overclock with until someone releases a version specifically for this phone.
I prefer to use these programs as a way of undervolting and limiting speed to get better battery life rather than overclocking for more speed.
Well until an optimized ROM and s-off was cracked I just wanted a little more oomph to get sense running a little smoother but I really have no complaints withthe phone. Just wish sense was a little smoother. (Yes twss)
joeyrushlow said:
Well until an optimized ROM and s-off was cracked I just wanted a little more oomph to get sense running a little smoother but I really have no complaints withthe phone. Just wish sense was a little smoother. (Yes twss)
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Once we get custom roms without all the bloat I am sure sense will fly
aimbdd said:
Once we get custom roms without all the bloat I am sure sense will fly
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I completely agree, because it ran decently well on the OG evo =)